tv MSNBC Live With Craig Melvin MSNBC October 1, 2019 8:00am-9:00am PDT
hands of my colleague craig melvin in new york. >> good to see you, hallie. thank you so much. craig melvin here, msnbc headquarters in new york city. a new set of leads for congress and new scrutiny for some of the president's closest allies. the latest developments on the heels of that bombshell whistle-blower complaint. among them, a subpoena for the president's tv lawyer and reports secretary of state mike pompeo knew more than he let on. plus serious questions about attorney general bill barr. the report detailing his private meetings overseas with foreign officials. was this nation's top law enforcement officer trying to discredit the russia investigation? and civil war and treason. those are some of the phrases that the president is invoking in his own scorched earth defense. republicans are reportedly asking for more comprehensive strategy than defense by tweet. we'll dig into that in just a moment. we start with the new developments in this fast-moving
impeachment saga. let's break it down with nbc's hans nichols at the white house, geoff bennett is on capitol hill once again. also with us, nbc news justice correspondent pete williams. thank you all for being me. house democrats leading this impeachment inquiry have issued the subpoena to rudy giuliani, the president's personal lawyer. what do we know about what they're looking for from mr. giulia giuliani? >> since the theory of the case that democrats are building against president trump is that he used the office of the president for personal gain by leaning on ukrainian counterpart to dig up discredited dirt on former vp joe biden and also used rudy giuliani, his personal attorney, as the intermediary, house democrats say they now want to know everything that rudy giuliani knows about this entire ukrainian gambit. they issued a subpoena to him and three business associates to turn over any and all
documentation related to his communications with ukraine. interestingly enough, a lot of this evidence is evidence that giuliani has already acknowledged that he has. in the course of his colorful tv appearances just on fox news the other day, in fact, he held up an ipad and proceeded to read from it some of the texts that he's received. you see the former mayor of new york city showing how deeply embedded he is or was in this ukrainian controversy. democrats want all of that evidence. giuliani told our colleague kristen welker overnight he hasn't made up his mind yet about whether he'll comply or to what degree he'll comply. here is plor of the former mayor in his own words. take a look. >> i'm weighing the alternatives. i'll go through it, get all my evidence together, i'll get my charts. i don't know if they'd let me use videotapes and tape-recordings that i have, if they let me get some of the evidence that i gathered. i gathered all this evidence
before the mueller probe ended. so it was clearly under my responsibility as the lawyer for the president of the united states. >> so rudy giuliani says he's weighing the alternatives. house democrats say they're not really giving him alternatives to weigh. they set a deadline, october 15th. before you had house democrats saying we'll see you in court. now they're saying we don't really have time to deal with the courts. what they're saying now is any obstruction, any stonewalling, additional stonewalling from this white house could be grounds for a new article of impeachment which would be congressional obstruction, craig. >> all right, hans nichols let me turn to you. geoff, thank you. the president, no public appearances on his schedule today, but he is doing what he has been inclined today, especially over the last few days, as this unfolds, he's tweeting. once again, hans, it looks like he's going after adam schiff,
the chairman of the intel committee in the house. >> reporter: the president suggesting on twitter that charges should be brought against adam schiff for, in the president's term, fraudulently making up statements that the president made. this is the president's longstanding allegation against schiff, his complaint is that schiff misquoted the president and said something -- put words in his mouth on the house floor. they've been going after that. to be clear, adam schiff did portend to paraphrase the president and did not accurately quote him. he was trying to be rhetorical. he was asked about this and didn't really answer what his motivations were for that. he was maybe attempting to be dramatic. this is atmospherics. perhaps the more significant development is the letter from mike pompeo, the secretary of state, writing to the congressional democrats strong indicating he will not have his state department employees comply with those requests to be
deposed by the house democrats, in this case the foreign affairs committee. he doesn't come outright and say never. but he says they don't have enough time to produce these documents, they want counsel present and there are a lot of other concerns the state department has with these five individuals appearing before a congressional committee. ultimately he says there's no reason or no authority to compel state department officials to be deposed. you can potentially call people as witnesses, but actually deposing them privately, pompeo is questioning that authority. that seems to be the big development today and the start of a legal standoff on what documents and what documents can and cannot be produced and what capitol hill will be able to get their hands on. >> the secretary of state overseas. he's in italy. he also apparently accused democrats in the house of trying to intimidate and bully the state department as well. mr. williams, we learned late yesterday that the president in
a phone call apparently asked the prime minister of australia to help investigate the origins of the mueller probe. what more do we know about that? >> reporter: yes, that's right. the justice department has made no secret of the fact that the attorney general asked the president to make this in treaty. they say this happened in a number of cases. remember the attorney general said back in may he was appointing the u.s. attorney in connecticut, john durham, to look into what the intelligence agencies were doing when they opened an investigation into the trump campaign. barr has said he wants to know whether any laws were broken, any authorities were violated, any steps were missed when the justice department and other agencies looked into the trump campaign. so that's been his focus, and he said that some of these countries want to hear from his personally, to introduce durham, to open that avenue of communications and in some cases the justice department has asked the president to take the first
step at a head-of-state to head-of-state level. craig, they're eager to point out this is a separate mission from whatever rudy giuliani is doing. when i asked are they overlapping, one official said, well, it's hard to know because we're not really sure what giuliani is doing. they're saying barr made his intention clear all along. one official told me today this is not an effort to undercut the mueller report. one official said today, we don't doubt the conclusion that russia meddled in the investigation. there's a separate question, though, of how u.s. intelligence agencies conducted themselves in the early stages of the investigation. that's what barr is interested in looking into. >> pete williams, thank you. geoff bennett, thank you. hans nichols there at the white house. please keep us posted. let me bring in felipe reines former deputy assistant secretary of state and former hillary clinton spokesman. kimberly atkins, washington news correspondent for wbr, also an
msnbc contributor oop. kimberly, rudy giuliani, what are your sources telling you? is the white house in any universe want rudy giuliani to testify? >> no. it's for obvious reasons, we've seen him in his performances on television, and he raises a great deal of concern there, but the issue is, it's hard to see how he doesn't. as you've pointed out, the investigation has changed now where stonewalling and trying to put up various defenses of attorney-client privilege or executive privilege just for the sake of dragging this out will no longer work anymore. there will be a swift and very real consequence to that which will be an article of impeachment. so having him, rudy giuliani, who is at the center of this entire ukrainian question, it
would be very difficult to see how he does not produce the documents so far being asked for. so far it's documents, not his actual testimony. that will come. it will be unavoidable for him to do that. >> felipe, one of the things that continues to boggle the mind is why administration officials or the president himself, why they continue to apparently encourage rudy giuliani to go on television and speak on behalf of the president and the administration. he doesn't seem to do very much good when he does it. >> well, i have to disagree with both of you a bit. i think people in the white house who have anything resembling common sense think and they watch rudy and think, oh, god, this is not helpful. i don't think donald trump looks at it that way. i think the way to imagine it, imagine being in a library trying to get reading done and there's a guy on the other side of the room with an air horn who just keeps blowing it. out can't focus on what you're doing. now, that guy is a jerk, but
he's actually accomplishing something. donald trump does not want us to have peace and quiet to focus on these transcripts, on these complaints, on these reports. so while it's ugly, i hate to say it, i think rudy has been incredibly effective for donald trump going back to -- one of the things that donald trump skated on never sitting down for an interview with ruble. part of the reason he didn't was because rudy was very effective and just absolutely shellacking bob mueller every chance he got, not only on fox but every other channel. mueller's numbers were shaky and they called mueller's bluff and he never sat down. i think net-net rudy is driving up sales of tylenol in the white house, but he's doing some good. >> an effective distraction. >> yeah. >> felipe, one of the new revelations in this onslaught of really good new reporting, secretary of state mike pompeo on that july phone call between
president trump and president of ukraine, secretary pompeo had amp opportunity to disclose he heard the call. he was asked about the whistle-blower complaint during an interview on september 22nd, more than a week ago. this is part of that conversation. >> the "wall street journal" is reporting that president trump pressed the president of ukraine eight times to work with rudy giuliani to investigate joe biden's son. what do you know about those conversations? >> so you just gave me a report about a whistle-blower complaint, none of which i've seen. i can tell you about this administration's policies with ukraine. >> now, felipe, the secretary of state didn't lie technically, but i mean -- >> he lied. by the way, it wasn't subtle. i don't think we have to look at this with a benefit of hindsight to see that guy was not telling
the truth. mike pompeo before he was in this administration was a house republican. while maybe not much of a household name as jim jordan or trey gowdy, he was of that click. a rabid house republican who beat his chest about benghazi. that's who our secretary of state is. he's not acting like the secretary of state, he's acting like rnc chairman. the person acting like secretary of state is rudy giuliani. not only is he not qualified, but he's making a mess of it. think of it this way, if rudy were to call up one of our nato allies and say this is general giuliani, ignore what he said, you would be what are you talking about? this guy shouldn't be anywhere near it. that's what he's doing with our diplomatic core. he's basically -- they have either shunted them aside or they have drafted them into this on going political conspiracy of using them to achieve donald
trump's end game which is to punish his enemies to save himself. >> meanwhile, kimberly, we watched and listened to republicans. it would seem as if trying to find their message on how to best respond to these questions about this impeachment inquiry, both "the washington post," politico reporting that many of these republicans are upset that there's not apparently a war room at the white house yet to help deal with this. we saw kevin mccarthy on 60 minutes on sunday night, a number of republicans on the sunday morning shows. do you see any signs of that republican firewall in the senate starting to crack? >> i don't think it was fully formed in the first place on the ukraine question. i don't think that firewall ever fully existed. you have a small number of people including congressman jordan and others going on television who were simply amplifying this conspiracy theory about joe biden's son, but even they aren't really defending what the president
did. because even if something nefarious did happen with the bidens, which there's no evidence that it did, that would still not exonerate the president from what he is alleged to have done. that firewall really hasn't existed, and it's exacerbated and made more difficult by rudy giuliani. i'm going to disagree with my friend a little bit in that rudy giuliani isn't just making a political problem for the president and making it more difficult for republicans to defend him, he's making it legally more difficult because he's consistently going out and saying that he went to the ukraine, he's doing these things on behalf of his client, which he represents the president personally. the charge against the president is that he was doing these things for personal gain, that he was contacting the ukrainian government for a personal political gain. rudy giuliani is essentially making the case for impeachment, not defending him from it, in a legal perspective. so it's a big mess and it's
really hard for republicans to full-throatedly back the president on this. >> kimberly, thank you. felipe, a big thanks to both of you. we're going to go to the ukraine in just a moment to take a look at what precisely rudy giuliani was doing in ukraine. meanwhile, threats of prison, invokin invoking treason, warning of civil war. as president trump lashes out, it's raising a new alarm even within his own party. have we reached a dangerous new stage? also, attorney general bill bar now facing even more serious questions about his activities overseas, meetings that he's reportedly been having with foreign officials about the origins of the russia investigation. >> has the president or anyone at the white house ever asked or suggested that you open an investigation of anyone? yes or no, please, sir. >> the president or anybody else. >> seems you'd remember
something like that and be able to tell us. >> yeah, but i'm trying to grapple with the word suggest. i was diagnosed with parkinson's. i had to retire from law enforcement. it was devastating. one of my medications is three thousand dollars per month. prescription drugs do not work if you cannot afford them. for sixty years, aarp has been fighting for people like larry. and we won't stop. join us in fighting for what's right.
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2016. we should note nbc news has not matched all this reporting, but joining me now, one of the reporters who broke that story for t"the washington post," als former florida republican conversation david jol any. david no longer affiliated with the gop. tell us about your reporting on the attorney general's behind the scenes mission, if you will. what did you uncover? >> so we knew that bill barr had directed this kind of special prosecutor john durham, a u.s. attorney in connecticut to look into the origins of the russia probe. what we reported last night and in today's paper is that bill barr has been personally engaged in that investigation, traveling to other countries, the uk and italy are the two we've reported on and pressing his foreign counterparts to aid in john durham's probe. this comes at the same time "the new york times" and we reported
that president trump called his counterpart in australia and pressed him to aid in this probe. so it's pretty unusual because the attorney general generally is not going to be hands-on in an investigation like this, let alone be taking trips abroad to press forward this investigation. so that's what we're learning about bill barr's personal involvement in this investigation of the investigators on the russia case. >> david jolly, it says using department of justice resources to investigate foreign and personal matters related to president trump. what's your take on these communications as we understand them to be so far according to "the washington post"? >> it sounds a lot like betrayal by bill barr and donald trump of the u.s. intelligence community. there's no other explanation. our u.s. intelligence community, all 15 or 16 agencies and sub agencies that have concluded in lockstep that russia interfered with the election. that's conclusions have been made based on years of hard work
by the men and women of the u.s. intelligence community. some of the finest experts in the world. yet donald trump and bill barr refuse to accept that because it's a political liability for the president. so the president clearly has dispatched bill barr to try to come up with a counternarrative. i think one of the disturbing aspects of the reporting is that truly some intelligence officials fear that bill barr will be giving credibility and amplifying conspiracy theories that the president sometimes gives credibility to himself. the question is what to do about it. was there anything untoward? we know bill barr's handling of the report was deliberately obfuscating, and i think this warrants a closer look by the congress. >> you write, matt, current and former intelligence and law enforcement officials expressed frustration and alarm monday that the head of the justice department was taking such a
direct role in re-examining what they view as conspiracy theories and baseless allegations of misconduct, to congressman jolly's point there. what do we know, matt, about the kind of threat to our national security that this could potentially pose? >> i talked to one of these people, david love man who was a counterintelligence official involved in the early days of the russia probe. he told me, look, it's one thing to have john durham, a respected prosecutor going over their work and making sure everything was aboveboard. but when you have bill barr who is developing a reputation as being donald trump's personal protector rather than the head of an independent law enforcement agency, that is alarming. it's suggesting that a conclusion has already been reached, like there was something wrong with the origin of the russia probe. that is what is so alarming here. to the congressman's point, too,
this is irksome to our intelligence community. here you have the attorney general going around and raising questions about their work, particularly the fbi's work. so that's irksome to the men and women who work in the intelligence community and feel like they didn't do anything wrong. >> congressman, back in may the attorney general testified before the senate judiciary committee, senator kamala harris, she asked if the president or anyone at the white house asked about opening an investigation into someone. i want to play this exchange for our viewers and our listeners on sirius satellite radio and then we'll talk about it. here is how it went down. >> has the president or anyone at the white house ever asked or suggested that you open an investigation of anyone? yes or no, please, sir. >> um, the president or anybody else. >> seems you'd remember something like that and be able to tell us. >> yeah, but i'm trying to grapple with the word suggest. there have been discussions of matters out there that -- they
have not asked me to open an investigation. >> perhaps they've suggested? >> i wouldn't say suggest. >> hinted? >> i don't know. >> well, now, you look back at that exchange now, knowing what we know and you think, what, david jolly? >> i think the answer is yes from bill barr. he just couldn't bring himself to say it. here is very contemporary evidence of that, craig. we know from the release of the sin synopsis of the transcript of the president's call with the ukraine just last week that the president told the president of ukraine work with bill barr and rudy giuliani. but he said work with bill barr. it's unfathomable that the president would say that to the president of the ukraine and not also have said to bill barr, i want you to go down the road of this investigation and i'm going to have the ukraine help you. it is why, craig, i've made the case, i think there needs to be a formal impeachment resolution on the floor authorizing this
investigation. they're kruntly undergoing in the house, for a specific reason of broadening the scope. named as target of the investigations, the president, the vice president, attorney general, omb director and the secretary of state. that doesn't mean you arrive at impeachment charges on all of them. it is clear from bill barr's behavior from the very beginning, he's obstructing the work of the congress and he may be aiding the president's impeachable behavior. >> why should the vice president also be included? >> because of his proximity to all of this, i think he has to be investigated. i think all those principals have to be investigated, particularly on the ukraine matter. they all have touched it in one form or another. the vice president simply has to be included in any investigation of the west wing. >> david jolly, thank you. matt sab tao ski, thank you. president trump's latest scorched earth tweets invoking treason, civil war, not the first time he's raised alarm on both sides of the aisle. next i'll take to someone who
makes the case for why it should not be ignored. what exactly what rudy giuliani up to in ukraine? what was he doing there? we'll go to kiev as nbc news digs into the backgrounds of three of his associates who congress is also looking into. you're sensitive. yet some say it isn't real milk. i guess those cows must actually be big dogs. sit! i said sit!
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trz ratcheting up his rhetoric, quoting a top supporter who said impeachment could create is civil war-like fracture, also called for the what he deemed fake whistle-blower to be revealed. he also openly questioned whether house intelligence committee chairman adam schiff leading the impeachment inquiry should be arrested for treason. joining me now with more on the impact of this rhetoric is eugene scott from the plig"the washington post"'s the fix and also jim, author of the book "impeachment.
peter baker and jon meacham wrote that book with him. you wrote about the civil war rhetoric in "the washington post" and point out trends in his rhetoric. what did you notice? >> craig, we noticed this is not the first time the president suggested that if things don't go the way he likes, if he's not allowed to govern or lead as he sees fit, there could be an uprising. his words infer that it could be led by his supporters. there's been some concern about that because this has been interpreted as perhaps the president affirming or encouraging those who feel victimized and disrespected to rise up and act out and push back even if violently by any means necessary to protest what they believe is injust. >> jeffrey, as a historian, what goes through your mind when you hear phrases like civil war and treason invoked by a president of the united states not in war
times? >> two things in particular. i think the first thing is we don't really like to associate anything with the civil war. though there are some similarities building to be honest in the sense before the civil war, 1859, 1860, congress ceased to function. that was one of the telltale times the country was coming apart at the seams over the issue of slavery, but really over the fact that people couldn't work across the aisle. the second thing is the incitement to violence that upped lies much of what the president says. we're in the 30th anniversary of tiananmen square, a moment -- we're seeing replayed out on the streets today when the government cracked down on people protesting. i'm concerned personally, if the president continues this rhetoric, it might start drawing people to washington, heavily armed people to the national mall to protect their president, to protect their interest. that's a recipe for disaster. >> you think some of this president's rhetoric could be seen as a call to action, a call
to arms even? >> i think most definitely. the constitution is remarkably clear as these things go on how to impeach a president and ultimately how to remove him from office. it's entirely silent, however, on how to remove him from the white house, from his bedroom, if you will. i think it's entirely possible, and we're way down the road from this, from any kind of conclusion, entirely possible to think of a scenario where president trump simply refuses to accept the lot of the senator the electorate in 2020 and begins to ask his supporters to come rally to his side. >> that's a scary thought on a number of eugene, largely republicans raising concerns about this lack of strategy. your paper reporting there's no war roam. lawyer jay sekulow says the president will be the chief messenger in the response effort. from the rhetoric we've seen so far, is that a winning strategy
to cut through the democrats' argument for impeachment? >> it doesn't seem to be so far. we've seen preliminary polling support that the number of americans including republicans, specifically republicans under 50 and moderate and more left leaning republicans are increasing their support for an impeachment inquiry, and it's worth noting that that doesn't mean support for impeachment, but certainly looking into whether or not anything was done that was inappropriate. i think the president's rhetoric is not helping him, for many people, including those who would be more likely to support him, his behavior and words suggest that something could have happened that needs more investigation. so the strategy he's currently employed is not working out in his benefit. >> jeffrey engel, based on history at this moment in time, knowing what we know, also being acutely aware of how much we don't know, if you were to take a guess, how does this all end
for president trump? >> i think the odds of his impeachment are remarkably high, upwards of 85, 90%. i think the odds are increasingly o growing that the odds are towards conviction. we haven't seen a lot of republicans defending this president. history suggests, at least with richard nixon's case that strong support for a president can evaporate almost overnight once new evidence comes out, and certainly the point of all inquiries is to find new evidence. i would suggest the president is much, much more in danger than he was ten days ago. >> it is important to note at this particular point that, while you do have a number of senate republicans who have spoken out for the president so far, there's been a lot of silence on the hill as well. jeffrey engel, thank you. eugene scott, thank you as well, sir. filling in the blanks.
as democrats expand their investigation into rudy giuliani, we go to the ukraine where we're learning more about three of mr. giuliani's associates. ates with a round brush head. go pro with oral-b. oral-b's gentle rounded brush head removes more plaque along the gum line. for cleaner teeth and healthier gums. and unlike sonicare, oral-b is the first electric toothbrush brand accepted by the ada for its effectiveness and safety. what an amazing clean! i'll only use an oral-b! oral-b. brush like a pro.
memory support brand. you can find it in the vitamin aisle in stores everywhere. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. right now house democrats are digging up everything they can on the people in ukraine tied to the president's personal lawyer, rudy giuliani. nbc foreign correspondent matt bradley made his way to the ukrainian capital kiev. good to see you, my friend.
what can you tell us about this three ukrainian associates listed from the subpoena for rudy giuliani. what do we know about them and what do we know about how the ukrainian government is handling this entire ordeal? >> reporter: it's an intriguing set of three new names here that we're going to be hearing a lot about in the coming weeks before they go about congress. the first two, they're both ukrainian americans, and dev furman, they're based in the united states. they were born in the soviet union but florida-based businessmen in the u.s., both in the gas business, trying to sell gas to the ukraine. they have enough contacts here in the ukraine that they were of interest to rudy giuliani and made introductions for him to three different former prosecutors here in kyiv. that third men, kiss lynn, he
has major ties with the ukrainian american mafia. while it's not entirely clear what role he played in giuliani's visits here to the ukraine and meetings, he's definitely going to be called before the committee. he's one of the more suspicious characters here. as for how ukrainians are reacting, my colleague richard engel spoke yesterday to a former foreign minister here. take a listen to that. >> as foreign minister, did you know about giuliani's mission to find information? >> i never met giuliani, and nobody from the foreign ministry ever met giuliani, but, of course, i heard about different kind of meetings, about his attempts and his efforts to reach out to people here in ukraine. i would say it was seen with quite suspicion here. >> when you say suspicion, what were you suspicious of? >> in the sense of what is the
sense of this mission. why giuliani? why not someone else? what is the mission? what is the goal? >> do you think vice president biden took any action to protect his son while his son -- >> no, to my best knowledge, definitely not. >> so you don't think biden was intervening, putting his hand on the scales of justice here to protect his son? >> not at all. not at all. >> reporter: i should tell you, craig, it's clear for the ukrainian government, a lot of ukrainians, thissishi issue is perplexing as the americans. >> matt bradley for us in kyiv. thank you. back here, today marks two years since a gunman opened fire on a crowd of concert goers in las vegas. as we mark that anniversary, it is also putting a spotlight on how little has changed in our country with regards to gun
violence and laws related on how to stop it. coming up i'll speak to a lawmaker who represents that area and has been personally affected by gun violence. before we get to that, we have a verdict in the amber guyger case there in texas. hearing now a jury after almost two days has come back with a guilty verdict. the officer, of course, this is an officer who was off duty at the time who managed to walk into a neighbor's home and shoot him dead. a jury coming back with a guilty verdict. there's amber guyger there in the courtroom as that verdict is being read. nbc's gabe gutierrez has been covering this trial from the very beginning. he's standing by outside the courthouse. gabe, what more do we know at this point? >> reporter: hi there, craig. that verdict was read just a few seconds ago. there was a small out burst in
the courtroom presumably from the family of botham jean. he would have turned 28 years old on sunday. but the unanimous verdict coming from that jury of eight women and four men, guilty on murder. in the distance here, just down the hallway you can hear applause as the victim's family is leaving right now. craig, this has been an extremely dramatic trial that has unfolded over the last several days. this went to the jury just yesterday. after six hours of deliberation came the unanimous guilty verdict. the jury could have considered or did consider also the lesser charge of manslaughter. earlier today we heard from the attorneys for the victim's family, botham jean. they said the jury asked at least two questions, one on manslaughter. the other on the so-called castle doctrine which is texas's version of the stand your ground defense. during closing arguments, the
defense brought up the castle doctrine, in essence arguing that amor geiger was justified in shooting botham jean because she believed he was an intruder. the castle doctrine says you're allowed to shoot someone in self-defense if that person is intruding in your own home. of course, the prosecution said that theory was absurd because amber guyger went into botham jean's apartment. this has drawn national attention, ever since this shooting happened in september of last year at a dallas apartment complex. amber guyger, the former dallas police officer, she was charged with murder. initially she had not been charged with murder. several weeks after a grand jury returned that indictment. now, at this point she faces up to 99 years in prison after this conviction. the next step many this case is the penalty phase which might get started in the next day or two. we're looking at the live video from inside the courtroom.
you can see amber guyger there, the back of her head. unclear what her reaction was as the verdict was read. but again, there was a bit of a small out burst of the family of botham jean. this is the verdict they had wanted i. looks like, yes, a guilty verdict for amber guyger, the former dallas police officer charged in the shooting death of botham jean. she argued all along she went to the wrong apartment mistakenly, that she did not mean to shoot botham jean, that she feared for her life when he charged at her as she entered the apartment. in the end the jury says she is guilty of murder in this case, craig. >> gabe gutierrez for us there in dallas. gabe, thank you. again, amber guyger, guilty of murder there in texas. we will be right back. ill be ri. and...whatever this was. because we make our meat with the good of the deli and no artificial preservatives.
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vegas. he also lost his father to gun violence. congressman, how is everyone in and around las vegas doing today? >> good morning, craig. i just left a sunrise remembrance service with the sheriff, governor, county and city officials, where we paid tribute and remembrance for the 58 innocent lives that were lost when a thousand gunshots rang out in less than 15 minutes, causing the devastation that affected our city to our core including the more than 800 survivors from that tragic event. and it's why today, i'm angry. i'm angry that the senate still has not taken action on the house-passed hr 8 legislation. in just nine months this year we've had 312 mass shootings. over 11,000 deaths at the hands of gun violence.
and more than 22,000 gun injuries. so enough is enough. the house has done its job, actually. we have passed legislation. and i'm looking at leader mcconnell and the senate republicans and calling on them to pass this legislation. 90% of americans support it, so we can make our communities and families safer. >> congressman, correct me if i'm wrong, it's not necessarily clear that any of the proposed measures the senate has not taken up, it's not clear that would have prevented this particular shooting in las vegas. one thing that might have prevented it, a mandatory buyback aimed at assault weapons, something that beto o'rourke has called for, this mandatory buyback. do you agree with that, do you support a mandatory buyback of support weapons? >> what i support is a comprehensive approach that includes universal background checks, hr 8, making sure we ban
assault weapons in this country, military style weapons that do not belong in the streets or the hands of civilians, closing the gun show loophole, eliminating high capacity magazine clips, and making sure we have the resources in our communities to build resiliency, to provide for mental wellness, not just mental health care in this country, because every one of our children deserve to go to school safe. families deserve to go to churches, synagogues, and mosques and not be threatened. i have seen the impact of what gun violence does to families and communities. >> congressman, i'll see you tomorrow in las vegas for this forum. i'll see you then. some of the democratic candidates will join me for that forum in las vegas.
they've all made their plans to stop mass shootings and school shootings specifically a central part of their campaigns, as you know. our next guest says a conversation about gun violence in urban areas is largely missing from the narrative. reverend michael mcbride works on gun violence legislation through his organization, live free. reverend, what has gun violence done to your community? why have you made preventing it a central part of your life? >> i live in a community, the city of oakland, that for the last 30 years averaged 600 shootings per year and about 130 gun-related homicide ps per yea. that created such compounded trauma in many of our families that it forced many of us, clergy, faith leaders, formerly incarcerated people, public
health officials, law enforcement officials, to pull together strategies that do not criminalize our communities but create more safe communities without sending more of our young folks to jail. we were able to drop gun-related homicides by 50%. we have strategies that work. but we need the conversation to be much more broadened. that is what we hope the forum tomorrow will do, broaden the conversation. our presidential candidates will speak to these lifesaving strategies. >> let's talk about some of those strategies. we'll do that of course tomorrow, but let's do it right now. how have you guys been able to reduce gun violence in oakland by 50%? >> we know across the country, including oakland and richmond, less than 1%, actually half of
1% of the population can drive 60 to 70% of the violence. our strategy allows us to connect with those individuals and redirect them from their violent conflicts. hospital interventions, going into hospital rooms and literally inserting oneself in a conflict so there is no retaliation. launching violence prevention in the cities, not to hire more cops, rather we would hire interrupters, stipends for those driving violence. these strategies all together can reduce violence, listen, within literally 18 to 24 months without having to change one law. these strategies work. but we need these strategies to be amplified and scaled up with
it c technical assistance and resources. this is a way forward that we hope more folks across the country can indeed learn about and advocate in their local communities. >> reverend, quickly here, if you had the opportunity to ask one question of the ten democratic presidential candidates who are going to be in las vegas tomorrow, what would that question be, what would you ask? >> that's a great question. i would ask the candidate, how do you plan to structure healing and peacemaking in our communities with the same rigor that we have structured punishment and incarceration when it comes to the issues of violence in urban america? how do you plan to ensure that the whole country sees the problems of black america, urban america, brown america, as problems for all of us to solve? these are questions candidates must answer if they are to become nominee for president of
the united states of america. >> that's a great question, reverend, i may steal it tomorrow. >> just quote me. >> i will give youproper arbitration. i'll be moderating the gun safety forum. all ten candidates will be joining me there in las vegas. it will stream live on msnbc news now, msnbc.com, and special coverage across this network as well, msnbc. that's going to wrap up this hour of "msnbc live." i'll see you tomorrow from las vegas all day. "andrea mitchell reports" starts right now. >> thank you, craig melvin, we look forward to that tomorrow. right now on "andrea mitchell reports," obstructing. while visiting italy today mike pompeo sends a letter saying
state department diplomats will not testify tomorrow after he himself failed to admit listening in on the ukraine call when asked about it last week. >> i haven't had, uh, a chance to read the whistle-blower complaint yet. uh, i read the first couple of paragraphs and then got busy today. secret agent man? reports that attorney general bill barr has been flying to meetings with foreign leaders, investigating how the mueller probe got started. >> we really don't know what the predicate to this is. there hasn't been a credible allegation of wrongdoing surrounding how that investigation was opened. and secret identity. from the oval office, the president tries to discredit and expose the identity of the whistle-blower. >> we have a whistle-blower that reports things that were incorrect. i made a call. the call was perfect.