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tv   Morning Joe  MSNBC  November 8, 2019 3:00am-6:00am PST

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facts this could be purely partisan. >> all right. thank you so much. of course we're going to see you in just a moment on "morning joe." if you're out there, you too can now read the axios sign up -- the newsletter at signup.axios.com. >> all right. that does it for us thop friday morning. i'm yas man alongside ayman. "morning joe" starts right now. i'm going to say it again. we have more in common, our democratic college and our republican college than we don't on certain issues. and i think we would surprise ourselves in what we could achieve if we just tried. >> speaker nancy pelosi is trying to impeach him. i don't mean any disrespect, but it must suck to be that dumb. >> i didn't mean it as
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disrespectful. i didn't mean it as disrespectful at all. >> it must suck to be that dumb. you did not mean that. because i can tell you this, if any of my children or any of your children had said such a thing, let's say even in a student council race or in a high school forum, can you imagine if one of his children came home or one of your children came home and the principal called you and said in the middle of the debate that a teenage boy had said to a teenage girl in front of everybody, it must suck to be that dumb, i'm pretty sure -- i don't know, can't say how senator kennedy raises his family, but i certainly know in most families that i've known, that teenage boy would probably get detention and have a lot of apologizing to do. so thank you, senator kennedy, for setting such a poor example
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not only for your constituents, the children of your constituents, but for constituents all over america and children all over america. it's -- it's another example of how people are willing -- some sow many people are willing to degrade themselves and sink to extraordinary levels that we would not allow our children to sink to, but doing it all for an audience of one. it's depressing. willie, of course, tweeted about this yesterday and, willie, you said, oh, so when you said it must suck to be that dumb you did not mean that disrespectfully? >> yeah, the follow-up was not as disappointing as the original comment, but you would have liked to have heard senator kennedy say i got caught up in the moment, i suck for saying that. ing some something he's done in the past. we've talked about him being on the show, being one of the few
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republicans come on the show, take tough questions, answer them, be fair when it's necessary, but that was certainly a low moment for senator kennedy. as you say if your son or my son did something like that in school -- >> oh my gosh. >> i can't say what i'd do on tv but he'd get a good talking to by you and me and i would say, george, you've got to work on your material. that was lame. if you're going to go for it let's get into the workshop and work on it. very lame. >> i think either one of us would make our sons go over and apps for the young woman he showed such disrespect for. any parent would do that. mika has the morning off. along with willie and me we have donny deutsch, a former aide to the george w. bush white house and state department's elise jordan. guy cecil and senior adviser at movon.org, karine jean-pierre.
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her story of moving forward. in a minute we'll get to the impeachment inquiry and some of the most damning texas yet. it was released yesterday along with reporting that ukraine's president was ready to comply with president trump's demand to publicly announce investigations against the bidens and the clintons and he was willing to go on msnbc to do it. but first, perhaps, because joe biden's been slipping in the polls or maybe it's because elizabeth warren's medicare for all plan has a lot of democrats nervous that she can't win those crucial industrial swing states up north, whatever the reason, yesterday we learned that former new york city mayor michael bloomberg is now actively preparing to enter the democratic presidential primary starting with a first step in alabama. because alabama's deadline is this friday and that's the first deadline pay the long time
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adviser to the billionaire businessman confirmed yesterday adding that bloomberg has yet to micah final decision. according to "the new york times" the once three-term mayor has went to alabama to gather at least 500 signatures that are needed to qualify for the primary deadline there today. bloomberg and his aides reached out to several prominent democrats to signal his attentions to enter the presidential race. the 77-year-old who's donated more than $100 million to congressional and state campaigns has toyed with the idea of running for president over the past year. but now the stakes are different, saying that bloomberg is, quote, increasingly concerned that the current field of candidates is not well positioned to take down president trump in 2020, adding that, quote, he would be able to fight the fight to trump and win. and, you know, willie, people around mayor bloomberg said last
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night that he's not sure can he win this thing, there are a lot of obstacles to him winning this thing, but at the same time with what's been happening with ukraine, with what's been happening across the world, with what's been happening in the united states and you have to look no further than that louisiana rally or kentucky rally, he just couldn't in good conscious sit on the sidelines anymore. >> yeah. and we should underscore that he's not officially in the race yet. he's looking at the race, he's, as you said, the alabama deadline is today so if he was going to get any had to make a move, get some signatures, pay the fee to get on the ballot in the state of alabama. but we said many times that mayor bloomberg is a data-driven guy. he's got a team around him that looks at the numbers and he's always said if he didn't see a path of victory he wouldn't waste his time and money getting into the race. he flirted with it in march, as a lot of people may remember and then announced that he wouldn't get in, thought his resources could be better used other wise helping with ads and activism.
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so the question i guess is what's different now from march? what does he see now that he didn't see them? and guy cecil understands the democratic party as well as anybody. what's your read on what bloomberg sees now sitting here in november? is it the weakness of the field? is it the weakness of the president? why is today different than what march was? >> first it's telling that every time bloomberg said that they were not going to run they cited data. >> right. >> but now in the lead-up to potentially announcing that he will run, they haven't cited the data. i think it's one thing to take on donald trump, it's another thing to take on the democratic primary. and i think he's going to find it incredibly challenging, because especially in the early states it's not really about the money. the fact is, the candidates that are in the race now have the resources to get through the first four or five states. where broomberg's money can make a difference, a super tuesday and beyond. i think he's looked at the apparent weaknesses of other candidates. certainly there's a lot of consternation among
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establishment democrats and among big-money donors, around medicare for all. i think all of this has led him to the place where he's thinking about running. >> who does he affect most in this race? obviously elizabeth warren, bernie sanders are happy to see him in the race. he's the boogieman that they've set up going after billion yirs every d billionaires every day. >> i think this is where a lot of the conventional wisdom is one. there's a focus on transfer of votes between biden and the mayor. despite the fact that people have been projecting a lot on to the biden campaign, the reality is he probably has one of the most diverse coalitions. the question for the mayor is can he break into that coalition? can he appeal to african americans in the south? can he appeal to latinos in california? i really think this is folks like buttigieg and klobuchar and booker who are really attempting to move into that first tier of
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candidates. and it's easy to imagine that bloomberg's interest makes much more difficult to somebody to get 2, 3, 4, 5, 8% to move into that upper tier because he's going to own some of that vote going into the race. the more interesting question is when you self-fund, if it's only self-funding that would preclude you have from being in any presidential debates. so what does a funding tragic look like online when you're being transparent about the fact that you can spend 5, ten, $20 billion running for president? >> so, guy, if the bloomberg campaign went to iowa, new hampshire, south carolina, nevada, wouldn't make a lot of sense, you've had candidates over the past year beat them elves up. i mean, a lot of them got into the race, fought like hell and you are ready out even a couple months away from iowa. but if the theory of bloomberg's case is, and temperatuit just m
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going to let everybody fight it out, maybe mayor pete wins iowa, maybe elizabeth warren wins new hampshire, south carolina is a jump ball because bide sent only person in the race that has some -- significant support from older black voters, but he may not make it to south carolina. then of course a couple of days later it's super tuesday, these candidates are exhausted from that and mike bloomberg has laid down a hundred million dollars in the super tuesday states. that's when 40 percent of the delegates are up on super tuesday. suddenly you're talking about data, that doesn't seem like such a bad strategy, unless, let's say, a mayor pete sweeps the first four states. >> i think that's right. the telling thing from jonathan swann's reporting is the fact that they make it very clear they plan on running a national campaign from day one. and the ability of bloomberg to spread the field. if you think about super sues u tuesday states, you have
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california and texas. so the idea that you could advertise statewide in california and texas, organize in those states, gives you a pretty significant advantage. the weakness that plan is if you have somebody that runs two or three of the first four states, develops momentum, sometimes money can't solve that problem. i think the other question is, does bernie sanders, does elizabeth warren continue to raise money at an increased pace? do both of them stay in the race through super tuesday? my assumption is yes. the other question is, are there others still thinking about getting into the race? there's been reports, obviously, of holder looking at the race. we've seen in multiple public appearances hillary clinton toy with the race. it's certainly possible that we're not done -- it's hard to imagine me saying this out loud, with more candidates getting into this race and comp indicating everything. >> but, you know, donny, the problem with eric holder getting in or somebody that is not worth $50 billion getting in at this late moment, because hollered
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would make sense for me because, again, if biden's not a strong candidate, where is the bill clinton candidate that can win in south carolina, that can win across the deep south with older black voters who are the bedrock of these democratic primary contests? and not just out there. so holder would make sense, or another candidate that could appeal. bill clinton like candidate could appeal. but the problem for eric holder or any other mere mortal is three or four days after south carolina you've got super tuesday. and you've got california. you've got texas. you've got states across the deep south. and there's no way they can keep up with that momentum. so, this -- you know, your first instinct is, okay, wait, this just doesn't make any sense because this guy's going to get killed in iowa, new hampshire, south carolina. but, again, as guy said, if we
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have mayor pete or bernie winning iowa, elizabeth winning new hampshire, somebody else winning south carolina, it's game on on super tuesday and bloomberg's going to be the only person -- with even joe biden running out of money, bloomberg is going to be the only person that can advertise in california, texas, and all these states. >> he will own them. i think that's the strategy. we go back a little bit when he won in new york, he came out of nowhere and just in the new york mayoral race spent a hundred million dollars. i don't want to say won the election in the wrong way because people voted for him and he was a fantastic mayor. but "money talks." $52 billion. 52 billion. he could theoretically spend 25 billion -- we talk about that trump might raise a billion dollars, elizabeth warren raised $25 million in the last quart a quarter and that was kind of big whoop. 52 billion. i can't say that enough. he could take half of his
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fortune and spend 25 "x" what donald trump spends. the other thing that he has, we keep looking for the anti-trump. and the one thing about him that is the ante trump, he's what president trump claims to be. he's done it honestly, he's done it by adding value, he's been incredibly charitable. so the very, very kind of charlotte, you know, trump is the ultimate charlotte ton and fake. he can peel the emperor's clothes off of trump just about better than anybody. i think this is huge, huge news and i think he's an electable candidate. >> nothing would make president trump more angry than seeing the graphic that shows mike bloomberg worth $52 million according to forbes and he's worth $3 billion. $50 billion difference there. >> everything is trump's size and bloomberg has the size where it matters to trump. >> elise, let's talk about mike
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bloomberg's constituency? who is the group of democratic voters who will move to him if he does, in fact, get in the race? we've got the progressive voters supporting elizabeth warren and bernie sanders who certainly will not have any affinity for mike bloomberg. where do his votes come from? >> well, you get some of the moderate voters who are going for joe biden right now and probably some of mayor pete's voters. bury again, but, again, to guy's point, can he pull a diverse coalition? that's the big question given some of his policies as new york city mayor, will that be baggage that will keep him from appealing to a more diverse elect electorate? you have to win over a coalition if you're going to go anywhere in this primary. i don't know if he can do that, but at the same time the country seems to be hungry for somebody who is pragmatic who will get things done. that's certainly the record he had in new york city at the
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time. thought the soda ban was a little much. now today i miss him so much as mayor of new york. >> karine, didn't we just go through this exercise in a different way when howard schultz put his toe in the water. >> yeah. >> a new york guy with a great personal story, started a great american company, a billionaire who was going to be the pragmatic guy who knows how to run things. he got a rude welcome when he toyed with the idea of entering this race. >> i have to tell you, willie, i'm glad that bloomberg is considering running in a democratic primary rather as an independent. th that actually is good news as we saw with howard schultz. this is going to be an uphill battle for bloomberg. you could have all the money in the world. doesn't mean you have a strategy. doesn't mean that's strategic. and when you look at the field and if he does jump in, yeah, he's going to be hurting mayor pete. he's going to be hurting more like an amy klobuchar like guy
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was saying. and he's not going to take votes away from warren. he's not going to take votes away from bernie. and earlier, willie, you were saying back in iowa -- i'm sorry, back in march he was thinking about running, he didn't. well there are was a poll in iowa that came out and it was done by one of the best polsters out there and it showed that he had one of the worst favorability amongst all of the democratic candidates. that was back in march. so i don't know if -- i remember this is a democratic party, it's a democratic base. i don't know if they're pining for another billionaire. >> we shall see very soon. of course, the big news coming out of alabama, willie, will tell you this, is the alabama/lsu game this weekend and whether tua is going to be able to play. that's the big news. >> yes. >> but there's some other news, lesser news. former attorney general jeff sessions has officially entered the alabama senate race and the
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first task on his agenda appeared to be making amends with donald trump. that's right, the guy who unmercifully mocked him, called him stupid, made fun of him being from alabama. well, now president trump can't vote, of course, in alabama, but sessions announced his run for his former senate seat with a campaign ad that clearly targeted an audience of one. >> jeff sessions here, i approve this ad. when i left president trump's cabinet, did i write a tell-all book? no. did i go on cnn and attack the president? nope. have i said a crossword about our president? not one time. and i'll tell you why. first, that would be dishonorable. i was there to serve his agenda, not mine. second, the president's doing a great job for america and alabama. and he has my strong support. >> oh, oh, oh.
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>> so, guy cecil, you know, if -- i've said this before about ted cruz. if somebody attacked my wife, said she was ugly, a political opponent, i would spend the rest of my life just going after them and making sure that they paid for it. whereas ted cruz cannot hug donald trump enough. and if i had been attacked like donald trump attacked jeff sessions, oh, man, it would be ugly. i think most people would respond this way. but you look at jeff sessions like ted cruz and these other republicans and get insulted and trashed and their manhood challenged by donald trump and they just -- they remain qu
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quizlings. i feel like asking the question who are these men? who are these men some who would -- who would -- who would humiliate themselves in front of the president and the country like that? >> well, the answer is most elected republican officials in the united states of america. i mean, this was a hostage take. if you are a political consultant and the you're sitting down here and you're saying, i'm going to launch my campaign for the senate, i'm going to reintroduce myself to the people of alabama and i'm going to do it standing in front of a white screen, looking as bad as i possibly could and basically all i'm going to do is lay down before donald trump and just hope and pray that he doesn't stomp on me again, i mean, this is -- it's pretty remarkable. it's a hostage take pe.
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he's sitting there begging. he was on another network last night literally begging for donald trump not to -- not to endorse him, but just not to say mean things about him. this is not the way -- >> my god. >> but this is the united states senate. all of the talk about, well, behind the scenes republican senators say this and they say that. who cares? they get in front of the camera and they do this. >> yeah. who cares what they say behind the scenes. same with that anonymous book, seriously? who cares. first of all, we know that he's been acting like a crazy man inside the white house. and question is, when are you going to affix your time name t those charges and what are you going to do with it? here's jeff sessions last night playing quiz ling and chief to the commander in chief. >> he has your strong support. do you have his strong support?
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>> i hope so. i was there for the trump agenda every day ways in the senate, no doubt about it. i was the first senator to endorse him. if i return to the senate, i will no senator in the senate will be more effective in advancing president trump's agenda than i would be. >> elise jordan, donald trump said the worst mistake that he ever made was making jeff sessions his attorney general. he said he was stupid because he went to the university of alabama law school. he ridiculed the way he talked, said he was dumb. and jeff sessions says he's going to do whatever donald trump tells him to do? again, i just don't get it. do voters really want somebody that weak representing them in washington? >> joe, it just really blows my mind how so many men, and
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primarily men, because, well, let's face the fact, most national elected republicans these days are men. but they are just willing to bow at the altar of trump. and after all of that, after all the public humiliation, after the nastiness and just the cruelty that donald trump heaped on jeff sessions. and i was never a big jeff sessions fan, but you got to the point where you just. i tid him as a humpitied him wi president of the united states just bullying every single day. i can't imagine a single job in the world that did would be worth it to have to go and bow down to your biggest bully like that. and it also just frankly annoys me that donald trump calls jeff session dumb southerner and this and that. and then donald trump benefits from so much southern support and just the -- and another example of this, the mississippi -- the newly elected
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mississippi governor, the chair of the rnc tweets out, oh, donald trump saved the race. he was down by double digits. seriously? and they just take it. they just roll over. and i don't want to say roll over like dogs because i like dogs. but they just roll over. >> really, i just -- i've never seen anything like it. >> no. >> i mean, man, when i ran, i'm like people like tough leaders. i mean, that's at least what i saw. people liked to have representatives that aren't going to put up with anything, that are going to go to washington, d.c. and are going to be tough and fight for them. not fight for whoever the president is or fight for whoever the speaker of the house is. but fight for their kintz constituen constituents. this is a personality cult. i never once, i never once talked about, oh, i'm going to go up and help so-and-so in their agenda. no. it was about people in my
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district. the people in northwest florida. it wasn't about helping other people. that's why this is so bizarre. i'm going to go up to washington and i'll be the biggest fighter for the guy who said i was a dumb alabama southerner. i don't get it. >> yeah, and remember i think we played the sound bite even yesterday where president trump's mocking jeff sessions' southern accent in the is from bob wood wards' book, fear trump in the white house, the president of the united states first used a derogatory term for jeff sessions mental capacity, which i won't repeat on tv and went on to say, quote, he's this dumb southerner, trump told rob porter the white house staff secretary. he went on to say how in the world was i ever persuaded to pick him for my attorney general? he couldn't even be a one-person country lawyer down in alabama. went ton call him a traitor and said his decision to recuse himself in the russia probe was, quote, the ultimate betrayal. that's what donald trump thinks of the guy who cut the hostage
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tape yesterday seeking his approval. >> and let's be very clear about it. jeff sessions did what any attorney would do in recusing himself. had he no choice under investigation himself for some misstatements he made on russia. he had no choice but to recuse himself. but donald trump doesn't respect the rule of law. he certainly doesn't respect somebody doing what's ethically right. that's exactly what jeff sessions did, and for it he got just absolute blasted, called a traitor, and in return, jeff sessions bows down to donald trump. it's just pretty incredible. >> graveling for his approval. guy cecil, let's forget mike bloomberg for the second, state of the democratic field right now? >> in flux. no doubt about it. i think that there's a lot of concern, not just about individual policy positions or ideology, but whenever you're in the last three or four months leading up to iowa, there will be more change between today and
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the iowa caucus than was beginning of january till today. i think people will shift fast so fasten your seatbelts it's going to be bumpy. >> majority of iowa caucus voters undecided. still ahead on "morning joe," the house intelligence committee has subpoenaed acting white house chief of staff mick mulvaney to appear on capitol hill this morning. the latest details on that next on "morning joe." details on t on "morning joe." the attorney general says i'm going to recuse myself. [ laughter ] >> i'm going to -- and i said, why the hell didn't he tell me that before i put him in? h iim? the ups and downs of frequent mood swings can plunge you into deep, depressive lows. (crying) take you to uncontrollable highs. (muffled arguing) or, make you feel both at once. overwhelmed by bipolar i symptoms? ask about vraylar.
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absolutely, no question about that. but that's it, that's why we held up the money. >> so the demand for an investigation into the democrats was part of the reason that he was withholding funding to ukraine. >> the look back to what happened in 2016 was certainly part of the thing he was worried about with corruption with that nation. that's appropriate. >> withholding the funding? >> yeah. >> let's be clear, what you just described is a quid pro quo. it is funding will not flow unless the investigation into the -- into the democratic server happened as well. >> we do -- we do that all the time with foreign policy. get over it. there's going to be political influence in foreign policy. >> get over it, said the acting white house chief of staff mick mulvaney inside the white house briefing room just last month admitting president trump withheld military aid in order to pressure ukraine to conduct investigations into the bidens and into a 2016 campaign conspiracy theory. mulvaney after hearing from the president later walked back
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those televised comments. we learned overnight that the house intelligence committee has subpoenaed mulvaney to appear on capitol hill and to testify today, this morning, as part of the impeachment probe. mulvaney, like several others in the trump administration, is not expected to show up for that deposition. let's bring in national political reporter for axios, jonathan swann. good morning. we just learned about this subpoena last night. how did the intel committee decide to drop it so late and ask mulvaney to appear at 9:00 this morning which he probably will not do? >> it's not designed to get him in. this is just building a case for adding another article of impeachment around obstruction. and, of course, mick mulvaney is not the first white house official to refuse to come and testify. we've had his own aid rob blair, we've had the national security council lawyers mike achael ell john bolton. it's the exceptions that go and testify like tim morrison over
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the objections of the white house counsel that have been clear about it. i think this is part of adam schiff building an argument, showing the defiance, and then potentially adding another article of impeachment. >> and what would mick mulvaney say when confronted with that videotape? you admitted it on camera, it's not a slip of the tongue. it would be interesting to hear him under sworn testimony explain what he meant by that comment and then later changing it. i was listening to you early this morning, jonathan, talking about how the white house is feeling about the way the impeachment inquiry is proceeding and what might happen when this -- if it gets to the senate to those republican jurors. listening to them one by one make up new excuses and new distractions for the president's behavior, it doesn't look like republicans are going to move off their votes in support of the president. >> they're in a -- i mean, you just have to accept reality for what it is. they're in a very strong position, the white house is. not because of any grand
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strategy or four dimensional chess or war rooms or anything like that, but simply because nothing has budged these senators, nothing has moved them. you did a segment on jeff sessions which kind of says it all. >> yeah. >> and honestly, i think the more -- like we've been talking who could the 20 be that define him? i think a scenario we need to seriously consider is zero. there's not an insignificant chance that zero republican senators defect if nothing new comes out and we've got the current set of facts that we're dealing with. i mean, we interviewed mitt romney and he is supposedly the weakest brick in the red wall. i mean, he's not there yet. i mean, and just based on the interview we did with him, if he's the weakest brick that red wall, it's a pretty strong wall over there in the senate. even though privately and as guy said, who cares, privately they all -- not all of them, but a
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lot them despise the president, say that they -- you know, they wish they could politically get away with replacing him with mike pence. but none of that matters because when it comes down to it and when they have to do things in public and the vote, they step in line. >> you know, willie, it really does come down to and, donny, feel free to chime in here as well, it really does come down to one thing. his approval ratings. his approval ratings among republicans, but also these numbers that we've been showing that were in the 30s, now they're sitting at 50, 51% americans supporting the impeachment and the removal of donald trump. if those numbers go up to 55, 60% that people -- after seeing the public testimony and i'm certainly not saying it is, i'm just saying this is very simple calculation. we can't predict who's going to support him and who's not going to support him. but, i think we can say that if
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at the end of the testimony 60% of the people in colorado and maine and arizona and in some of these states, nebraska and some of these states where candidates in hiding, republican candidates in hiding, if 60% of the people in those states support impeachment and removal, then, of course, you'll probably see a crack in that wall. but as long as we're sitting at the numbers we're sitting at here, it's probably not going to happen. >> no, i don't think so. and as jonathan says, the stories about senators quietly complaining about the president are getting exhausting and becoming thoroughly eye rolling that, donny, they say if you took a secret ballot, 35 republicans would vote for impeachment. but at this point not a single one of them would vote for it public. >> i we'll go back to that manhood thing. it's -- i just -- everything i don't understand about psychology comes up here that how these men look at their families, look at their children. i think the important thing that the democrats have to do going forward in this process, because
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even if some of them to do switch, it's still an insane long shot to think that 20 of them are going to switch. we're going to be left in january where the house impeached him, the senate didn't throw him out and we're back to square one. which is so noorn they've gimpo they've got to frame these hearings where you're left with kitchen table issues. if the whole thing is about extortion or betrayal or criminality, you have to bring that back, okay, and you will extort your healthcare also the or if it's about -- that's the important things that we're left with. this is a halo effect, it's not an isolated thing. it's an indicative thing of how he cheats and steals and betrays you just like he betrayed you on a national security, he'll betray you on healthcare, he'll betray you on wages. you have to set the stage. you can't look at this -- democrats have got to start framing this as an overall branding.
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>> but there's a specific charge here that's not hard to explain, the president used his political power for his own personal again benn fit, that shouldn't be hard to understand. >> abuse of power, that needs to be the message over and over and over because that is very easy to understand. >> that's the type of theme -- >> only part that matters. >> but it's abuse of power and the same way he's going to take 20 million people's health insurance away, abuse of power, it's the same way he's going to do another tax cut for the rich. he betrayed you, he's abusing the office. cit s set the stage. >> we'll dig in the gnnew testimony of george kent the at the tied president trump to a quid pro quo and discussed vladimir putin's influence over the president on matters including ukraine. "morning joe's" back in a moment. g ukraine. "morning joe's" back in a moment.
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and of course, fowler. hey. ♪hey. you must be steven's phone. now you can take control of your home wifi and get a notification the instant someone new joins your network... only with xfinity xfi. download the xfi app today. with all this will staff turnover, according to to someone close to the president, trump feels isolated and has complained that he has no one in whom he can confide.
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oh, no. i'm not sure i'm ready for emo trump. [ laughter ] >> he looks good, actually. he actually looks really good. >> early on, there were staff members around trump who not only tried to temper his worst instincts, they were worried he was spending too much time indoors sulking. as one person said, you've got to get him out of the white house. i could not agree more. >> can't get that photo out of my head, joe, the dog collar and -- >> i know. >> that was something. yesterday the transcript was released from the deposition of senior state department official george kent who oversaw ukraine policy. he tied president trump to a quid pro quo. he highlighted the level of influence vladimir putin holds over the president and explained how president trump's efforts in ukraine actually hindered u.s. attempts to call out corruption in that country. on the quid pro quo, kent
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testified that according to conversations he had with ambassadors gordon sondland and bill taylor, ukraine's president, in order to have military aid released and a visit to the white house, he'd have to signal a willingness to pursue investigations saw tough president trump. kent testified potus wanted nothing less than president zelensky to go to the microphone and say investigations biden and clinton. he also shared an awkward conversation when ambassador kurt volker called out ukraine's president for opening an investigation into former the former president. he told zelensky's top aide he didn't think it was appropriate to investigate a political rival. he said you type in investigations you're pushing for us do in biden and clinton. at that point he testified kurt vo volker did not respond. he also received he believed putin and the leader of hungary shaped the president's view of
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ukraine and its new president saying after talking with the two foreign leaders trump's view went from very positive to negative. so, joe, a case there, if you read through the testimony of george kent, he lays out clearly that vladimir putin made a phone call, had donald trump's ear, and completely shaped his thinking on ukraine to become the russian thinking on ukraine. >> well, this is what nancy pelosi said before, all roads lead back to vladimir putin when it comes to donald trump. you can look at what happens in the middle east where donald trump ceded the middle east to putin and russia. so now you have vladimir putin back in the middle east, first time russia's been there since 1973. it is putin who is now the king maker in that area. and has been given more power than could have ever dreamed of having. and elise jordan, the only thing that matters more to him than that is ukraine. as we said yesterday, without
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ukraine, russia is just russia. with ukraine, in putin's mind, it becomes the soviet union gt again. and the most disturbing thing i've heard, well, that's hard to say the most disturbing thing i've heard because so many things i've heard over the past several weeks are disturbing. but one of the most disturbing things i have heard is donald trump parroting in english, parroting vladimir putin saying that ukraine is not even a real country. that is straight from the mouth of vladimir putin. he is now nothing more than a propagandaous tool for russia sitting inside the white house? >> i just wish donald trump could find a new policy whisperer, foreign leader. ha about boris johnson? even if you're not a brexit fan, boris johnson wouldn't be saying, oh, let's, you know, let putin run wild and be an autocrat. donald trump just has an intense
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affinity for authoritarians and he has shown this consistently throughout his presidency. he's willing to be transactional with them. i can't believe, though, that he is that susceptible that he would just parrot vladimir putin's talking points. >> but, jonathan swann, it's been like this since -- i mean, the first time we saw it was on this show in december of 2015 when he basically said had great affinity for vladimir putin because he was a strong leader. but he kills journalists and political rooils, is that a problem? he said, well, he's a strong leaders he gets things done and we kill a lot of people too, joe. a lot of people saying that. and from that point on he was just wide open. so you do have to keep asking yourself, as nancy pelosi says, why do all roads lead back to vladimir putin? and they do so here again.
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not only the middle east, but most importantly, for vladimir putin his number one geopolitical goal is taking ukraine back. >> it's broader than that, though. he and to elise's point about other authoritarian leaders, he echoes also the language of erdogan, the turkish leader. we've seen that recently. i was in baghdad a couple of weeks ago and i talked to the president of iraq. he is a occurrecurd, one of the prominent kurds in the middle east. and donald trump said that the kurds needed to be cleaned up, cleaned out of that region in northeastern syria. and i asked the president of iraq who say kurd when he heard that he said, look, on if someone that's gone through this ethnic cleansing, it's deeply disturbing, deeply troubling. it's, again, talking to the
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leader and then echoing. it's not just putin, it's actually much, much broader than that. >> but the putin thing is the driver. and i'll go back to what i said about bloomberg, it's about the money. it was interesting earlier in the week the appeals court upheld getting trump's taxes. that's going to be interesting to see when you start to see all these llcs and money coming in from strange places. that, i can't stress that enough and i stay every time on the show, donald trump was bankrupt in the early '90s, he could not borrow money from banks, he is completely beholden to putin financially. putin owns him. he is his -- i'm not going to use the word, there's a certain word there that i won't use early in the morning, and that's what he is to putin. and it's that sufrm. and we talked about manhood. it's so interesting, tough guy trump who at the end of the day is owned by another man, he's owned by him. understand that. >> and, joe, it's important to point out too, "new york times" reporting yesterday how close president trump got to get his
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wish from president zelensky. he wanted zelensky to go on cnn to announce these investigations into the 2016 campaign and into joe biden and his son hunter. the interview was booked for september 13th with fareed zakaria on cnn. then the whistle-blower report comes up, everything blows and you that gets squashed and he does not appear. but the interview was booked, zelensky was ready to do it because he was so desperate to get that money and defend itself against russia. >> that's, again, perhaps that's another reason why donald trump is so angry at the whistle-blower. >> yeah. >> and, of course, republicans on the hill are just babbling like fools when they talk about the whistle-blower. we need to know what he knew and who he is. no, because everything that he said, everything that he said or she said ended up being true. and we actually learned it was actually far worse than what the whistle-blower had suggested. but perhaps donald trump is really angry with the
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whistle-blower because when that information came out, he could no longer do his own bidding and vladimir putin's bidding, he had to release the military defense funds that, of course, congress had already approved and he had killed. >> that's right. the whistle-blower doesn't even matter anymore at this point because of what we're hearing witnesses themselves. for example, like kent, the deposition we saw from him, the transcript that we saw from him yesterday, it lays out in detail, had he detailed notes. one of the things as you guys were talking about putin, he also told the story about how rudy giuliani and the president of the united states, they weren't doing foreign policy for the u.s., for the interest of the u.s., they were doing it for their own personal interests. and so when you think about foreign policy, big or small, that donald trump and that administration has done, it benefits not the u.s., but putin. and one more thing i wanted to
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go back to what you were saying earlier, joe, about where this -- where this impeachment and going and how unpredictable it is. if we go back six months we would have never thought going into iowa caucus we with wououl an impeachment inquiry. and the historical movement of these polls and how fast they're moving before the public hearing. so we are really in unknown territory right now. >> i really agree with you because nobody would have predicted that a fox news poll would show 51% of americans wanted donald trump not only impeached, but removed from office. those numbers will jump from the 30s to the 50s immediately. and jonathan swann, again, if things hold steady and perhaps they will because donald trump has his 40% base of support no
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matter what, he could shoot somebody on fifth avenue and that'd likely stay with him, and mabe many people in the senate said there's nothing he could do to lose their support. but if that 49% goes up to 58, 59%, that's the only way that things could move. but, again, we probably -- we can't really project out what's going to happen in these public hearings. we can't project out even what happens if john bolton, a man beloved by conservatives for decades comes out and lays donald trump and his foreign policy down low. >> i think that's true, except for the fact that when we go into the polls so far we did see a bounce when pelosi announced the impeachment inquiry, but it was largely among democrats and independents. we're just in such a polarized country now and republicans, it's so tribal. i just wanted to pull back one
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thing that i think's really important to underscore in this testimony is just the twha foreig way that foreign policy is being crafted. willie said that george kent oversaw ukraine policy. of course that's technically true, but this reality it's not true at all. i mean, you see a picture of a man trying to figure out what's going on in his portfolio. the same picture that yovanovitch painted, the same picture taylor painted. these are the career politically appointed officials supposedly running this policy and they're trying to figure out what's actually going on because the person doing a lot of the driving with the president was rudy giuliani, his personal attorney. it's quite stark when you see this testimony laid out. >> and they find themselves undercut by giuliani in the shadow foreign poll. >> i they're trying to figure out what's going on in their own portfolio. >> sadly, this is all very
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predictable. we talked about during -- during the transition, the president and his son-in-law both wanted rudy giuliani to be second secretary of state. and when our show and other people said that he was not capable of being secretary of state, that even donald trump said that rudy had lost a lot of steps and not equipped to be secretary of state, they still said, you fknow what? we're going to be running the world from here anyway so we don't need a strong secretary of state. this has been their attitude all along, that these people would just sit as functionaries and pawns but would not have authority. and we see now the disastrous implications of running that sort of foreign policy. >> turns out rudy giuliani did become secretary of state without all those ethical
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complaition kas th comcomplications that come with the job. still ahead on "morning joe," the president appointed gordon sondland as ambassador to the eu, named mick mulvaney his acting chief of staff and hired rudy giuliani as his personal attorney. now there's reporting that house republicans plan to throw all of them under the bus in order to protect the president. we'll dig into that from the "washington post" ahead on "morning joe." t from the "washington post" ahead on "morning joe." can you heal dry skin in a day?
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pr beautiful, sprawling mar-a-lago resort, the winter whitehouse and the president's new permanent address. >> whoa. >> now you can build your own winter white house. >> awesome. >> mara lego. you'll have hours of fun. >> i built a golf course. awe, his hands sore tiny and cute. >> hold a secret summit with
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vladimir putin. >> i love you, vlad. >> hunt flamingos with jared and donald junior. >> nice shot. >> rescue melania from her prison tower. >> help me, i don't want to be here. >> drive the ukrainian president. >> please, stop withholding our military aid. >> then give me some dirt on biden. >> and keep the president out of trouble. >> oh, no. >> no quid pro quo. >> we must find the whistle-blower. >> mar-a-lego from the makers of magna doodle. donald's dream jail sold separately. >> available at walgreens. >> oh, they have that? >> my goodness. >> wow. >> they went into great detail there. we'll come back to "morning joe." mika has the morning off. along with willie and me we have donny deutsch, elise jordan,
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proffer of history at tulane university, and eugene robinson. willie, we have a couple things to talk about this morning, obviously the testimony that we had yesterday, it seems like every day we learn something new and detailed about this very nefarious plot or as john bolton called it this drug deal where donald trump was going actually hold up military funding from a democratic ally that's invaded by vladimir putin. to get dirt dug up on his political opponent. so we'll talk about that in a little bit. but first, let's talk about michael bloomberg talking about entering the race. i think he's 95% there. but entering the race because he's concerned about the weakness of joe biden and also obviously concerned that elizabeth warren and bernie sanders have views that are too
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extreme for middle america and views that will get donald trump re-elected. >> yeah, mayor michael bloomberg, billionaire, former three-term new york city mayor filing papers today in the state of alabama. why is he doing it there? because their deadline is at 5:00 today, so he's got to get in there to get the ballot and he's got to get enough signatures, and also file a fee. so he'll be on the ballot in alabama which most people are viewing as him leaping into the race, although he hasn't officially said that. it looks like he's headed in that direction. gene robinson, we talked earlier that mike bloomberg has flirted with this many times, getting into the race. a man who can self-fund. he's worth $52 billion. but he said this march that he didn't see a path and that he wouldn't get in the race as sort of a vanity exercise. he wanted to get in to win and make sure had he a chance. didn't think he could back in march. what do you think he sees differently this morning? >> well, one thing he sees, i think, is he looks at those --
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the number of undecided voters, democratic voters, for example, in iowa which increased over the summer. eight points higher at the end of the summer than at the beginning. so you could conclude from that just using the iowa sample, that democrats are not sure of this field. they're not sure where they want to go. their potenti there are potential weaknesses with all of the contenders and potential strengths as well. but so i think he may see an opening there. you know, he, i think, believes that the policies of elizabeth warren or bernie sanders are too far to the left for -- for much of the country. i'm sure he thinks they're too far to the left for him. i think he disagrees with them. but i think just the general
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feeling of uncertainty among democrats about the field or among a significant number of democrats about the field are giving, you know, immateripulse somebody like bloomberg or eric holder, people who were thinking about perhaps a late entry. >> you know mayor bloomberg very well. spokesperson for the mayor said last night bloomberg is increasingly concerned the current field of candidates is not well positioned to take down president trump in 2020. he added that bloomberg would be able to take the fight to the trump and win. as i said, you know mayor bloomberg. take us inside his mindset and why he made this decision. >> yeah, let me state out front i'm a member of the bloomberg philanthropy's board, which is a paid job but i get to spend time watching him in action. i think in his mind it's true
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that the field has become weaker. but there's something else important, which is that he feels, i think he's right, that president trump has become more unhinged, more dangerous, that this has become more important than it's ever been. and michael bloomberg, he's not going to go out on a fool's arnd. i thierrand, i think he's think this clearly. but it's good to have a person come in and say i know how to run a government. i know what donald trump is all about. i don't think he's positioning himself in one lane or another. he's just very outspoken about the things he believes in, whether it's guns or climate change or crime or the economy. and he says, okay, i might as well get out there because the field is weak and the president's gotten more problematic. >> joe, alex put up a graphic before, i'd like to kind of ask the producer to put that back up.
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there is nothing that would be more -- is going to get under trump's skin more than that. bloomberg is what trump -- >> hold on, donny. can we just say something? let's keep this up. we know that michael bloomberg's worth at least 52 billion. i think he's probably worth more than 52 billion. i think that's a little low based on everything i know. >> right. >> we don't know if donald trump's even a billionaire. he hasn't released his records. he's been scamming forbes for years on how much he's worth to try to get on the list. i'm not saying this to be cute, we really don't know if donald trump is even a billionaire. so i'm really hesitant to even put -- >> we should put a question mark up there. >> so -- >> i'm serious. i'm hesitant -- you know, this guy may actually be in debt. he may not -- and you look, so let's just pretend it was 3.1 billion. we've heard from david
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fahrenthold that his properties are bleeding money, his doral, not just because it's been infested with bedbugs according this to this lawsuit, but doral is losing money, all of his -- all of his -- i'm itching now thinking about doral's bedbugs. all of his properties are losing a ton of money. so i'm not trying to be clever here, i don't think he's worth $3.1 billion. i don't think he's close to worth that much money. but let's go and put -- you make your point. we're going to put it back up. i wanted to put that caveat on that. >> let's say it's a billion or two. there is nothing that is going to get under trump's skin more than that. what michael bloomberg is, he's smarter than trump. he's 25 times wealthier than trump. he's more respected than trump. and he is -- i always keep saying when looking for the ante trump. other than trump being tallen than him, michael bloomberg is
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bigger, stronger, richer, smarter than donald trump. and he is going to be able to throw molotov cocktails at donald trump like no other. if donald trump is watching this, he's just picked up the phone and started scream agent people. you know him, i know him. this is his achilles heel. >> and one other point about the wealth too, it's not just his assets, it's what he's actually given away to charity. you look at bloomberg philanthropies and the billions of dollars that he's endowed that's separate from even his -- >> as opposed to the trump. >> opposed to donald trump having owed $2 million. >> and we always forget, there's so much with trump. the most offensive thing of all the things, this guy yesterday was ordered by a judge to pay $2 million because he took charitable money, people that gave money to go to firemen, to go to children, and took it for his business's political campaign. do you know what a lowlife you have to be to do that? to your point, a guy who's giving 36 billion away to charity, verses a guy that's
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stolen 2 million from charity. >> well, and of course has been ban from using some of his charitable operations, also, of course, we haven't even -- we are not -- we don't even have time to get into the scams that he ran with trump university and so many other things. but, you know, walter isakson, let's talk about michael bloomberg's prospects, because just from 30,000 feet he doesn't look like he has anymore of a chance of winning the democratic nomination than donald trump had back when he began in june of 2015. trump is very low in the approval. very low approval ratings, very high unfavorables among republicans. but we do find ourselves, we were talking to guy cecil about this. we find ourselves in an interesting place where all the other candidates we've known, the 20, 25 candidates we've seen over the past year have beaten themselves up, have exhausted
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themselves, for the most part bankrupted themselves, many of them began campaigns and ended them and now bloomberg comes in, he doesn't compete in the early states and he has the ability to do what no other candidate has the ability to do on super tuesday when 40% of the delegates are awarded, he can advertise as much as he needs in california, in texas, across the south, across america. it's really hard to count him out regardless of some demographic challenges he may have. or just being a billionaire. >> absolutely. you know, before you handicap a horse race you ought to look at the horses. and if you look at the michael bloomberg as a horse, he's a person who could run this country. he's a person who has run a business in a crisp way, a real business, not a fake business the way donald trump has. he's somebody who has a real
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heart, who has truly been generous and done it based on data, on metrics, but also on caring about people. so he is somebody instead of saying he's got this attribute or that, if you just look at him, he's sincere, he's straight talking, he's honest. he's going to put some people off because they're going to say you should apologize for stop and frisk oar something lir som that. and he'll explain here's what really happened and he's going to defend what he believes in. i think that authenticity, that competence, and that compassion are going to come through and that's why he's going to be a strong candidate. >> gene robinson, there are people last night saying mike bloomberg would be welcome in the race as an outside funder of campaigns and ads and messaging, that he could use that money without himself getting it had the race and further complicating matters. he could dump his money into the
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race and be more helpful that way. i'll let you take a crack at that, by also want to ask you about some of your own reporting. gene tweeted this last night, quote, it gets even more interesting, gene rights, i hear from a good source that eric holder has been consulting strategists about possibly jumping into the democratic presidential race. gene, what more can you tell us about that? >> that's basically all i can tell you about that. >> thanks for being here, gene, have a good weekend. >> but did i hear that and it's a source, obviously, i believe. >> yeah. >> said that that's been going on. and that he's giving it serious consideration. again, it's i think because of perceptions of the field. and, you know, look, the candidates who are in the field now each has their loyal and dedicated supporters, think they would be the great president. but there are a lot of democrats who are undecided and who are nervous who expected -- who
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expected a different joe biden, who expected perhaps kamala harris to catch her campaign to catch fire. who expected -- who didn't expect the sort of uncertain race we have now and who understand the stakes of defeating donald trump. so i think that does create an opening. the interesting thing for bloomberg and for anybody else who's thinking about getting in at the late stage, to me, is that, you know, joe will correct me if i'm wrong, but you actually have -- you have to go out and ask people for their votes. you have to -- you have to connect with people at some point or you're not going to win the nomination. so he's got to connect with democrats. and it would be interesting -- all the money he could spend on super tuesday would certainly make a big difference, but at
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some point he's got to make people feel it in the gut that he's -- that he's their guy. that he represents them and their interests and their ideas and their ideals. and so i think that's his challenge starting late to sort of get out there and make the sale. >> joe, obviously all of this anxiety's borne out of the urgency among democrats to ensure that donald trump doesn't get four more years in the white house. but what's your read as you look at it? is this different than the ritual we have every four years maybe around this time of a presidential campaign where democrats or republicans on aught other side look at the field and say this isn't going the way we expected it to go, we need new names and faces. do you think this is different than that? >> well, i do. but let's go back four years ago and, willie, republicans, rank and file republicans who are now
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bowing down and kissing donald trump's shoes every day were frantically talking behind the scenes, including mike pence about how donald trump was not fit to be president of the united states. lindsey graham was saying that even in january and february of 2016. and they were desperately trying to find a candidate that could run against donald trump. >> right. >> because they believed that trump would lead to disaster for the republican party. obviously nobody foresaw this man becoming president of the united states certainly not within the rank and file of the democratic party. so this does seem to play itself out a good bit. gene will remember in 1992 bill clinton and the candidates that were running were dismissed as the seven drawfs. bill clinton shocked every, got collected as president of the
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united states. you never know how this will play out. donald trump could be re-elected by a couple thousand votes. so we just have to wait and see. michael bloomberg, i do agree with gene also, if michael bloomberg just throws money at advertising agencies and he doesn't connect personally, maybe he gets 5%, 6%, 7% in california, texas, and other super tuesday states and it's a story not much different from tom steyer's story. but if he can get out on the campaign trail and connect in a meaningful way with rank and file democrats, then this could get interesting, especially in a race now that's really, gene, wouldn't you agree, this race right now say four-person race between elizabeth warren, bernie sanders, mayor pete, joe biden, we don't know about the strength of the health of joe's campaign, but those four are in there. so what i found in any political
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race, when you've got four people splitting up the vote four different ways, somebody comes in with $52 billion, if they can connect, then, yes, it is different then what we've seen over the past several years. >> no, i think that's absolutely true. number one, you know, you went back to 1992 when bill clinton kind of came out of nowhere and they were thought of as a seven -- and, you know, the rest is history. so, you know, crazy things happen even back then. now crazy things happen five times a day. impossible things happen in politics five times a day and donald trump is president. so, you know, the past should not be taken as absolute pro log for where we are. i think things are more unsettled than really we've seen ever before and certainly in my lifetime. and those four candidates who
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are leading in the democratic race, you know, you -- democrats can tell themselves the story of how each of them could lose to donald trump. now, the polls say that any of them would beat donald trump right now, but of course these are hypothetical matchup polls way too, you know, national polls way before the blectionel but there's a shadow of a doubt about all four of them justified or not, because they're all good politicians and they all know how to run campaigns. but there's enough to of that, i think, just to create an opening for democrats to look around a little bit more. so -- so there's a possibility there. >> joe, i want to go back to a ward th word that walter use. to me, bloomberg can go at trump more than any other candidates,
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competence. he can go after elizabeth warren and say, look, you're 34 trillion does not make sense. let me explain why. he can clearly go directly at trump with competence. there is a steady hand there, a calming there because of what he's accomplished that i don't think the others provide. you've got buttigieg who's mayor of 100,000 people. bernie who's crazy old bernie. we're not sure if joe biden's competence at 78 has he lost his fastball? the one thing you can't argue about bloomberg in any way is competence way capital "k.c." that is the secret sauce to particularly go against donald trump and he's incompetent in just about every area you can be. i think he is the anti-trump in ways that others are not. >> so, willie, you know how donny has people in little red vests running behind him? >> yes. >> cleaning up the streets when it snows on the upper east side. >> that's of course our job.
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>> that's our job after donny speaks. let me put on my little red vest right now and, willie, say that first of all i don't think that bernie is crazy old bernie. he's very effective and very successful. secondly, i don't think that man splaining, and i think the expect quote was bloomberg could explain to elizabeth warren why her plan doesn't work. perhaps man splaining in the age of trump might be -- >> if anybody was proposing medicaid for all for $34 trillion. my little red vest is coming back at your little red vest and it had nothing to do with man explaining. >> i do want to say this, throw this out for the table. we're looking at elizabeth warren and a lot of people are skeptical of elizabeth warren, why? not because she isn't a great political athlete, not because she can't win the democratic
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nomination, but a lot of people are concerned she's not going to win ws, heisconsin, michigan, florida, arizona, north carolina, she doesn't have the political persona that, you know, people that make up the conventional wisdom who were, of course, wrong all the time, think that she can win those states. so let me then, let's just move forward and say, okay, michael bloomberg comes in, he runs the table on super tuesday, he wins the nomination. does anybody at this table think that michael bloomberg is going to do well, better than let's say elizabeth warren or others in wisconsin among working class whites in michigan, in p pennsylvania, north carolina? i throw that out to the entire table. >> go ahead, walter. >> i think he's authentic and
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says what he feels and his policies are sensible, not threatening i think that you talked about elizabeth warren's weaknesses in some of those states. part of it is because the policies and plans that she proposes don't resonate with a lot of people. taking away private health insurance being the largest of those. if you have somebody who's putting out more sensible policies, in my mind, i think people vote for them. this is why the system is so good. this is why it was great having primaries. in facts, i hope eric holder and others come in, because we still have a chance to actually test all these theories we're talking about on tv and say let's put this person out there and see how many people pull the lever for him or for her. and i think that they're going to look at not only the competence that donny and i were talking about, but the sort of fact that there's a lack of corruption, both in warren and
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in bloomberg, but also a good set of well thought out policies that bloomberg is going to present. >> i'm going to be debbie downer right now and say what i think is the biggest political problem that bloomberg faces. obama was coming for your guns, bloomberg is really coming for your guns. if that was a -- if that was an effective attack line when president obama was running, i think that mayor bloomberg's positions on gun control are going to be a problem with a lot of states that he will frankly need to win if he needs to win the presidency. if he's going to win the presidency. >> you know, willie, we all when people are running they seize on certain things. i always talked about the national helium reserve. we need the national helium reserve. you get something that's very small -- >> do we have one of those? >> we did at least in 1994. >> okay. >> because who didn't? i mean, we've maybe -- the
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behindenberg went badly but maybe at the were going to use it in the '96 war. >> you never know. >> i'd always use that as a p punch line. for michael bloomberg, i don't know that it's going to be guns. two words, soda tax. soda tax. that's going to be a challenge for him if he does get past the primaries. and can you imagine the fun that donald trump would have with michael bloomberg, he wanted to even tax your sodas because he thinks he knows better than you know what your family should eat or even drink i think that's -- those are the sort of things that may have appealed to some people in new york city that certainly would fall on deaf ears across the industrial midwest. >> and, by the way, you're not kidding about that. donald trump knows how to push those culture ral buttoal butto
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still ahead on "morning joe," we'll read from gene's new column entitled enough with the latin. what trump did was bribery. plus, the fall of the berlin wall 30 years later. nbc's tom brokaw was there as it happened three decades ago. and he joins us live for a special look back from berlin. tom brokaw in just a moment on "morning joe." tom brokaw in just a moment on "morning joe." i didn't have to call 911.help. and i didn't have to come get you. because you didn't have another heart attack. not today. you took our conversation about your chronic coronary artery disease to heart. even with a stent procedure, your condition can get worse over time, and keep you at risk of blood clots. so you added xarelto®, to help keep you protected. xarelto®, when taken with low-dose aspirin, is proven to further reduce the risk of blood clots that can cause heart attack, stroke, or cardiovascular death in people with chronic cad. that's because while aspirin can help, it may not be enough to manage your risk of blood clots.
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30 years ago tomorrow, the berlin wall began to come down. and with it both the physical and ideological constraints of the cold war that had divided east and west germany for decades. nbc news senior correspondent tom broke caul waw was there th he gives us a look back. >> it was a night when the world changed right before our eyes. >> good evening, live from the berlin wall on the most historic
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night in this wall's history. >> it was such a fixed part of our lives, and it was such a physically imposing barricade. the it was so much uglier and oppressive than people realized on television. when you went to it personally it was appalling. ronald reagan had gone there. >> mr. gorbachev, tear down this wall. >> john kennedy had gone there. >> it's been -- >> so even with all the turmoil that was going on, it seemed unlikely that that wall which was at once such a solid image of oppression would come down in some fashion. and then in a heartbeat, it did. >> i was the only journalist on the air the night the berlin wall came down. i owned that story. and that was the end of the soviet empire. and weapon got lucky. >> i'd like to tell you that i knew the wall was coming down. unfortunately, i can not.
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i didn't know. but it did come down on my watch and i will never forget it. >> east germany remains a country in turmoil tonight. >> i arrived in berlin two days before the wall game down because there was so much going on on the eastern sector i was able to get into the east for the first time and do some reporting from there. you all represent the best of east germany. >> and then late that afternoon there was that famous news conference in which the propaganda chief screwed up. he was handed a slip of paper at the very end that said all citizens of the gdr can leave the gdr and come back through at any of the transit points. and i looked at my german national cameraman and sound man and i said, did he say what we thought he said? they were astonished. they said, he did. that means you go out of the wall and come back anywhere you want to. the room was abuzz. this man gets up and leaves the
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room. >> i had an interview with him right after that news conference and i went up and i read it back to him. do i understand correctly citizens of the gdr can leave through any checkpoint that they choose for personal reasons? >> it is possible for them to go through the border. >> freedom to travel? >> yes, of course. >> i went downstairs and some of my print colleagues were there and i said, it's over. the wall's open. >> so we got out, i called the office in new york and this is midday back in the states. we started making preparation for going on the air that night and i'm frantically trying to get this broadcast put together. i rushed out there. there were lots of students from the west who come to the top of the wall and the guards were trying to hose them off. and then my heart sank thinking, oh my god, there's not going to be anybody there, i made this big deal about the wall coming down and they've all been cleared off. and then the people got back up
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on the wall. and by the time we came on the air at 6:30, it was chaos. >> stand by. >> a historic moment tonight, the berlin wall can no longer contain the east german people. >> announcer: nbc nightly news with tom brokaw. tonight, from west berlin. >> good evening. >> we had a path on the satellite to get on the air, so that night i came on the air. and we owned the story. no cbs, no abc. it was a worldwide exclusive. what you're watching live on television say historic moment. a moment that will look forever. you're seeing the destruction of the berlin wall. >> we just threw out the script. i had written this whole broadcast. and i said to our producer, stay with me i'm going to have to ad-lib everything. i'm going to have to call on all my experience about what's been going on in the eastern part of not just germany but the soviet union and how is this is the defining moment.
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now, for the first time people will be able to move through freely. >> i couldn't hear myself think. i just kept thinking right before we went on the air i use the old astronauts or cleaned it up some, don't strew this upcre this is a big deal. and as we were standing there somebody said, oh my god, look, they're taking down the wall. it was a guy with a mallett and a chisel beginning to hammer away at the wall. >> the wall effectively has come down. and i mean physically as well. that's a chunk of the berlin wall. >> the party at the brandenberg went on all night long as they chipped away at the wall, as they danced atop of it, as they drank a lot. this is the human story. this is the story of humankind. i mean, political tie rants can only go so far, but in the end it's how people respond to their captivity and how they get out
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of it and how they relate to one another. and i think that's the enduring lesson of everything i've seen in journalism. it's a night to remember. >> wow. and tom joins us now live from berlin 30 years after that broadcast, anniversary is coming up this weekend. tom, as you said in the piece there, you were in berlin having no idea that you were about to be witness in the first reporter there to cover history. what was it like to be there that night? >> well, i just want to say one thing at the outset, i made several references that i did this. but the fact is, it was a real team effort on the part of nbc. we got lucky, our foreign editor said you ought to go to germany, seems to be a lot going on. so i came here and everybody was in place and ready to go. and then when we came out here that night, owning that story, it was an emotional time because we knew it was a historical event on this side. west germans had come to
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encourage people to come across. but they were a little frightened on the other side. and then finally the first guy hopped up on the wall, looked around and couldn't believe where he was. and the great crowd cheered and cheered and that was a historical moment if the was the end of the division of the soviet empire at its most ominous, m.o.ominous location, fall of the wall in berlin. >> tom, joe here. it's hard to describe for those who didn't grow up with the berlin wall really not only defining the divide in berlin, but the divide in europe, the divide across the world. it's hard to really describe the hopefulness that was felt not only in that night, but throughout 1989 and beyond. i got chills just watching those images. it's still hard to believe that it happened as quickly as it did. for younger americans who weren't alive or were too
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dwrou young to remember that moment, try to describe not just what it meant not only for the people of germany, but for free people across the world. >> and it had been an enormous effort on the part of the free world led by the united states and the west to keep the soviet empire in check. and there were talks about nuclear exchanges at one point. and there was a lot of concern about what the future would be in this important part of the world. but as we continue to chisel away at the ugly meaning of communism and especially here in berlin where they were divided east and west, germans on both sides who couldn't even talk to each other, when the wall gacam down all that changed. there was an eruption of freedom and possibilities. it was a very emotional time. and now they're playing out in a new way because there are still people who live in the old
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eastern sector who are older and not really happy about not being able to take advantage of the freedom and especially the prosperity that they have here on the western side. so it's been extraordinary experience but at the same time there's a lot of work still to be done. >> tom, walter isakson is here with a question. walter. >> hey, tom, as you know i was in eastern europe with you then that fall of 1989. and it was a progress that started 40 years earlier, every administration republican and democrat, containing and then pushing back on the soviet union. and you saw it fall from the shipyards to whoa was happening in prague and eventually right after berlin what would happen in romania. but my question to you to tie it into today, is vladimir putin was watching it too as a young person and it changed him forever.
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and he has been driven since then to restore some of the glory of what was then the soviet union. and do you see him doing that now and is that driving the way he is using donald trump as somebody he can help control? >> that's a very important point, walter. and it's a cautionary tail tale as we as well. he was a deliver of putin. he acknowledged the night the wall came down he wept because he saw the collapse of the empire to which he had devoted his life. i was at the infamous prison where they imprisoned people. i saw four miles of files that the east was keeping on german residents of the east. it was a horrendous empire. and of course it had nuclear weapons in its arsenal as well. so the time had come for it to go away, but there still is a
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residue of people, a lot of it's nationalistic pride, especially with putin, about wanting to maintain their place in history. there's a lot of work to be done, walter, as you know, and the united states has always been the leader in the effort to unify the west. and now donald trump seems to have a different kind of vision. and that's troubling to a lot of people. >> nbc's tom brokaw standing this morning about where he stood 30 years ago as a witness to history as the berlin wall came down. tom brokaw, thanks so much. always great to see you. still ahead on "morning joe," our next guest takes a look at the cyberattacks and armed conflict. "morning joe" is coming right back. med conflict. "morning joe" is coming ghrit back. - [spokeswoman] meet the ninja foodi pressure cooker,
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welcome back to "morning joe" on a friday morning. joining us now, senior writer for wired magazine, andy greenberg. he's the author of the new book "and is worm" a new era of cyber war and the hunt for the kremlin's most dangerous hackers. good morning in the is an
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incredible story that i confess i didn't really know about. i don't think most of our viewers know about but it does touch the lives and businesses of americans in this country. explain a little bit if you could, summer of 2017 not hit yet, a russian hacker attack, what was it and what were the targets? >> i can start first with ukraine. >> sure. >> because that's where this story begins in some ways, and ukraine is now in this global conversation all of the sudden because of trump withholding military aid. >> right. >> ukrainian government and pressuring the ukrainian president. but i've been looking at ukraine since 2016, and i've watched this cyber war. the first true cyber war unfold in ukraine where russian hackers, a specific group of russian hackers backed by the kremlin called sand worm, this group, has been launching one precedented cyberattack in ukraine after another that has hit the media, private industry, destroyed hundreds of computers and then kind of climaxed in them turning off the power to hundreds of thousands of
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civilians twice. the first ever blackouts caused by hackers. >> so this is russia turning off the power in ukraine. >> in the midst of this ukrainian war, this invasion of ukraine by russia they've launched a cyber war there. and over these years i and a bunch of cybersecurity researchers who are the characters of -- some of the characters that book, they've been trying to warn that is what is happening in ukraine is russia is using the country, the entire country as a test lab for cyberwar. but what was happening in ukraine would soon spill out, this cyber war would hit us in the west too. and ultimately that is what happens in june of 2017, as you said, this piece of malware released by and is worm, the hackners my book, hit ukraine, devastated the country's internet, took down hundreds of ukrainian companies, hospitals, every government agency, multiple power companies were hit by this as well. but then within hours spread beyond ukraine's borders,
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perhaps as an accident, perhaps collateral damage, but it spread and hits the world's largest shipping firm merck, the pharmaceutical company, fedex, in each case it cost these companies hundreds of millions of dollars. >> what you say hit them, what does that mean? >> it took down every computer in their global network. i'm just talking about carpet bombing their i.t. systems. everything was encrypted essentially, but couldn't be -- it was basically destroying all of their computers, spreading automatically from one to the next until they had no i.t. systems. and for -- for mersk, the staff looked up from their computers in cone hagen and saw a wave of black screens going across the room black, black as every computer in this massive conglomerate was destroyed. at the same time in the port of newark in new jersey, that meant
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that cargo ships carrying tens of thousands of containers are arriving at this terminal and mersk doesn't know what's on them. nobody can unload them. thousands of trucks are lining up miles long and nobody can get in because the checkpoint to that point is paralyzed. >> was the lesson that and is worm learned from its attack on ukraine that it also now could turn off the lights in new york city or at an american company? that it was successful in ukraine and they could export it even further? >> that -- i think that is the first lesson of this book. we saw and is worm experimenting with escalating innovations in attacking equipment. in their second blackout they even seemed to be trying to do an attack that would destroy equipment, that could blow up a transformer inside a transmission station, causing, you know, potentially weeks or a month-long blackout, serious down time. that could be done in the u.s., absolutely. but what i keep telling everyone about this book is it is not a story of what could happen here, it is a story in part about what
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did happen here. merck, the new jersey pharmaceutical company, lost $870 million. it did damage globally on a scale of cyberattack we've never seen anywhere else in the world. it took down hospitals across the united states, paralyzing the medical record systems. i talked to i.t. administrators in hospitals who told me they were looking at child patient's medical records that were missing updates because of this down time, because of the paralysis of the digital systems. they were rushing to fix those records in time for children to have lifesaving procedures or be transferred to different hospitals. we can't say for certain it didn't harm someone's health or cost a human life. >> how susceptible are we in the future from these kind of kind of attacks? have we learned and strengthened our cybersecurity?
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>> i wish i could say it wouldn't happen again, but everyone tells me it likely will happen again and it could be worse the next time. our systems are vulnerable. our governments -- our government, i think two administrations really, have failed us on this. the obama administration failed to talk about the fact there was an escalating series of cyberattacks happening in ukraine, doing things that never should have been allowed in the kind of global community. the obama administration should have said, it is not okay for anybody to turn out the lights for civilians anywhere in the world, even if it is ukraine -- not just ukraine, but outside of nato, outside of our self-interest, but the trump administration failed too because it took eight months for the trump administration to say anything about the worst cyberattack to hit american soil in history. in fact, they also failed to talk about the fact that sand worm, the same group of hangers, attacked the olympics in 2018,
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destroyed the entire i.t. in back of the olympics in the midst of the opening ceremony. it is a largely untold story in the book. >> in south korea. >> and we have not as a country talked about that. the u.s. government has not named russia as the perpetrator of that attack. this is a failure of diplomacy. >> why is that? why don't we hear more from the trump hat about tadministration attacks from russia? >> as you can imagine, the trump administration is not fond of talking about it for obvious reasons. it is something that, in fact, trump is allergic to speaking about. i have heard stories of briefings happening inside the white house, and you try to bring the information to trump and you are sort of told, it is not good timing, we don't really want to speak about the fact that russian hackers, sand worm, tried to destroy a transmission station in the capital of kiev and caused an unprecedented blackout because it just reminds
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him of how he essentially was helped, how he cheated in the 2016 election. >> as you say, sand worm may have its designs set on the united states in bigger terms than it already has hit. the new book is "sandworm, a new era of cyber war and the hunt for the kremlin's most dangerous hackers." thank you for being here and explaining to us. >> thank you for having me. i want to read a bit from your new column in "the washington post". it is entitled, "enough with the latin, what trump did was bribery." you write, enough with all of the latin. quid pro quo is a namby-pamby, wishy-washy way to describe the crime that president trump clearly committed in his dealings with ukraine. the correct term is bribery. read the transcript trump demands on twitter. i did read the rough and incomplete trans script and my conclusion is that it is better skrind as bribery and extortion.
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what trump did with ukraine funding which has been duly approved by congress was clearly a flagrant misuse or abuse of power, but it was also a plain, old fashioned crime. it was bribery. gene continues, it is important that the public understands both the process and its findings. testimony, transcripts are long and dense. the truth can get lost in the weeds unless it is distilled and highlighted in language that everyone can understand. not everybody knows latin. if a traffic cop asks for money to tear up a speeding ticket, that would be criminal and the cop should be fired. what trump did to ukraine was essentially the same thing. no quids or quos about it. he should be impeached and removed. gene -- donnie, let me start with you because it is an argument you have been making for the last few weeks. >> gene, so, so, so important and we have to stop with the quid pro quo. it is bribery, it is extortion, it is criminal behavior, it is betrayal. you set the table for the way you are going at him for the next year.
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gene, kudos, kudos, kudos. >> thank you, donnie. i mean you know and i know, because it is our business, language matters. words matter. i am talking about it in, you know, a language that's been dead for 2,000 years, that people don't speak, that nobody really speaks. quid pro quo, except lawyers. that's not the way -- and, you know, democrats -- not just democrats, people who believe in this country and want to hold this president accountable for all of the things that he has done have -- just have to learn to speak in plain, direct, impactful language, and that's generally not in latin. so think about communicating. communicating is important. >> gene with vicious attacks this morning on the ancient language of latin. how dare you, gene. it is a great column up on "the washington post". thanks so much. still ahead on "morning joe" we
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will talk about the effect a michael bloomberg presidential run would have on the current democratic field. bloomberg says he is testing the waters today, filing in the state of alabama to begin that process. plus, jeff sessions launches a bid for his onsen at sewn senat. his first priority appears to be smoothing things over with president trump. "morning joe" is coming right back. joe" is coming right back - [narrator] meet the ninja foodi air fry oven.
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ma i'm going to say it again. we have more in common, our democratic colleagues and our republican colleagues, that we don't on certain issues. i think we would surprise ourselves at what we could achieve if we just tried. speaker nancy pelosi is trying to impeach him! i don't mean any disrespect, but it must suck to be that dumb.
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>> i didn't mean it as disrespectful. i didn't mean it as disrespectful at all. >> it must suck to be that dumb. you did not mean it to be disrespktful. i can tell you this, if any of my children or any of your children had said such a thing, let's say even in a student council race or in a high school forum, can you imagine if one of his children came home or one of your children came home and a principal called you and said in the middle of the debate that a teenage boy had said to a teenage girl in front of everybody, it must suck to be that dumb, i'm pretty sure -- i don't know. i can't say how senator kennedy raises his family, but i certainly know in most families that i've known that teenage boy would probably get detention and
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have a lot of apologizing to do. so thank you, senator kennedy, for setting such a poor example, not only for your constituents, the children of your constituents, but for constituents all over america and children all over america. it is another example of how people are willing -- so many people are willing to degrade themselves and sink to extraordinary levels that we would not allow our children to sink to, but doing it all for an audience of one. it is depressing. willie, of course, tweeted about this yesterday. willie, you said, oh -- so when you said, "it must suck to be that dumb" you did not mean it disrespectfully? >> yeah, the follow up was not as disappointing. you would like to hear senator
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sen ki to s kennedy saying, i got caught up in the moment. we've seen him come on the show and be fair when it is necessary, but it was certainly a low moment for senator kennedy. as you say, if your son or my son did something like that in school -- >> oh, my gosh. >> -- i don't know what i can say on tv, but he would get a good talking to from you and me and also, by the way, i would say, george, you got to work on your material. if you're going to go for it, let's get in if workshop and rewrite it a little bit. >> i think either one of us would have made our sons go over and apologize. >> for sure. >> to the young woman that he showed such -- any parent would do that. that is what is so baffling. mika has the morning off. along with willie and me we have donny deutsch, former aide to the george w. bush white house and elise jordan, guy cecil and
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senior advisor at move on dot or, karine jean-pierre. her new book is "moving forward." in a minute now we will get to the impeachment inquiry and some of the most damning testimony yesterday. it was released yesterday along with the reporting that ukraine's president was ready to comply with president trump's demand to publicly announce investigations against the bidens and the clintons, and he was willing to go on cnn to do it. first, perhaps because joe biden has been slipping in the polls or maybe it is because elizabeth warren's medicare for all plan has a lot of democrats nervous she can't win the crucial industrial swing states up north, whatever the reason, yesterday we learned that former new york city mayor michael bloomberg is now actively preparing to enter the democratic presidential primary starting with a first step in
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alabama because alabama's deadline is this friday and that's the first deadline. a long-time advisor to the billionaire businessman confirmed it to nbc yesterday, adding that bloomberg has yet to make a final decision. according to "the new york times", the once three-time mayor has dispatched staffers to alabama to gather signatures needed to qualify for the primary deadline there today. bloomberg and his aides reached out to several prominent democrats to share his intentions to enter the presidential race. the 77 year old who has donated more than $100 million to congressional and state legislative campaigns, has toyed with the idea of running for the president over the past year, but now the stakes are different, his spokesperson says, saying that bloomberg is, quote, increasingly concerned that the current field of candidates is not well positioned to take down president trump in 2020, adding that, quote, he would be able to fight the fight to trump and
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win. you know, willie, people around mayor bloomberg said last night that he's not sure he can win this thing. there are a lot of obstacles to him winning this thing, but at the same time with what's been happening with ukraine, with what has been happening across the world, with what's been happening in the united states, and you have to look no further than that louisiana rally or the kentucky ral kentucky rally, he couldn't in good conscience sit on the sidelines anymore. >> yes, and we should underscore he's not officially in the race yet. he is looking at the race. as you said, the alabama deadline is today, so if he was going to get in he had to make a move, get some signatures, pay the fee to get on the ballot in the state of alabama. we said many times that mayor bloomberg is a data-driven guy. he has a team around him that looks at the numbers and he always said if he didn't see a path of victory he wouldn't waste his time and money getting into the race. he flirted with it in march, as a lot of people may remember, and announced he wouldn't get
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in, thought his resources could be better used otherwise helping with ads and activism. i guess the question is what is different now from march. what does he see now he didn't see then? guy cecil understands the democratic party as well as anybody. what is your read on what bloomberg sees now sitting here in november? is it the weakness of the field? is it the weakness of the president? why is today different than march was? >> well, first i think it is telling that every time bloomberg folks said they were not going to run they cited data. >> right. >> but now in the lead-up to potentially announcing that he will run they haven't cited the data that says he can win. i think there's one -- it is one thing to take on donald trump. it is another thing to take on a democratic primary. i think he's going to find it incredibly challenging because, especially in the early states, it is not really about the money. the fact is the candidates that are in the race now have the resources to get through the first four or five states, where bloomberg can make a difference is super tuesday and beyond. i think he has looked at the
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apparent weaknesses of other candidates. certainly there's a lot of consternation among establishment democrats and among big money donors around medicare for all. i think all of this has sort of led him to the place that he is thinking about running. >> so who does he affect most in this race? obviously elizabeth warren, bernie sanders are happy to see him in the race. he's the boogie man they've set up, going after billionaires every day. does he hurt joe biden, mayor pete? how does it impact the race if it does at all? >> i think this is where the conventional wisdom is wrong. there's a one for one transfer of the votes between biden and the mayor and it may not be true, despite the fact that people have projected a lot on the biden campaign, the reality is that he probably has one of the most diverse coalitions. the question for the mayor is can he break into the coalition. can he appeal to african-americans in the south? can he appeal to latinos in california? i think it is folk like
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buttigieg and klobuchar and booker who are attempting to move into that first tier of candidates, and it is easy to imagine that bloomberg's entrance into the race makes it much more difficult for somebody at two, three, five, 8% to move into the upper tier because he is going to own some of the vote going into the race. the more interesting question is when you self-fund, if it is only self-funding it would preclude you from being in any presidential debates. the question is what does the mike bloomberg fundraising strategy online look like when you are being transparent about the fact you can spend 5, 10, $20 billion running for president? >> guy, if the bloomberg campaign went to iowa and new hampshire, south carolina and nevada, it wouldn't make a lot of sense -- you had candidates over the past year beat themselves up. i mean a lot of them got into the race, fought like hell and are already out even a couple of
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months away from iowa. but if the theory of bloomberg's case is -- and it just may be -- i'm going to let everybody fight it out, maybe mayor pete wins iowa, maybe elizabeth warren wins new hampshire. south carolina is a jump ball because biden is the only person in the race that has some significant support from older black voters, but he may not even make it to south carolina. and then, of course, a couple of days later it is super tuesday. these candidates are exhausted from that and mike bloomberg has laid down $100 million in the super tuesday stakes and that's when 40% of the delegates are up on super tuesday. suddenly, you are talking about data, it doesn't sound like a bad strategy unless mayor pete sweeps the first four states. >> i think that's right. the telling thing from jonathan swann's reporting is the fact they made it clear they plan to
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run a national campaign from day one, and the ability of bloomberg to spread the field -- if you think about super tuesday states, first of all, you have california and texas. the idea you could advertise statewide in california and texas, organize in those states, gives you a pretty significant advantage. the weakness in that plan is if you have somebody that runs two or three of the first four states, develops momentum, sometimes money can't solve that problem. i think the other question is does bernie sanders, does elizabeth warren continue to raise money at an increased pace, do both of them stay in the race through super tuesday. my assumption is yes. the other question is are there others still thinking about getting into the race. i mean there's been reports obviously of eric holder looking at the race. we have seen in multiple public appearances hillary clinton toy with the race. it is certainly possible we are not done. it is hard to imagine me saying this out loud -- with more candidates getting into the race and complicating everything. >> but, you know, donny, the
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problem with eric holder getting in or somebody that is not worth $50 billion getting in at this late moment -- because holder would make sense for me because, again, if biden is not a strong candidate, where is the bill clinton candidate that can win in south carolina, that can win across the deep south with older, black voters who are the bed rock of these democratic primary contests and not just out there. so holder would make sense, or another candidate that could appeal, a bill clinton-like candidate that could appeal, but the problem for eric holder or any other mere mortal is three or four days after south carolina you have super tuesday and you have california, you have texas, you have got states across the deep south. there's no way they can keep up with that momentum. so, you know, your first instinct is, okay, wait, this doesn't make any sense because this guy is going to get killed
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in iowa, new hampshire, south carolina. but, again, as guy said, if we have mayor pete or bernie winning iowa, elizabeth winning new hampshire, somebody else winning south carolina, i mean it is game on on super tuesday and bloomberg will be the only person, even with joy biden running out of money, bloomberg will be the only person that can advertise in california, texas and the other states. >> he won't justice, he will own them. i think that's the strategy. if we go back a little bit when he ran in new york, he came out of nowhere and in the new york mayor race spent $100 million. i don't want to say bought the election in the wrong way, because obviously people voted for him and he ended up a fantastic mayor. $52 billion dollars, he could theoretically -- we talk about trump might raise a billion dollars or elizabeth warren raised $25 million in the last quarter and it was a big whoop.
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52 billion. i can't say it enough. he could literally take half of his fortune and spend 25 x what donald trump spends. we keep looking for the anti-trump, and the one thing that is anti-trump is he is the real deal of what trump purports to be. he is probably the most successful businessman in new york, one of the five or ten most successful businessmen in the country. he has done it honestly, by adding value, he has been incredibly charitable. trump is the ultimate charlatan, the ultimate fake. he can peel the emperor's clothes off trump better than anybody. >> nothing will make president trump more angry than seeing the graphic that michael bloomberg is worth $52 billion and he is worth $3 billion. >> everything is trump size and
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bloomberg has the size where it matters. >> yes. still ahead on "morning joe," most political candidates launch campaigns by appealing to voters. jeff sessions has a different target demographic, an audience of one. you are watching "morning joe". we will be right back. ♪ - [spokeswoman] meet the ninja foodi pressure cooker,
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the big news out of alabama, willie, we'll tell you this is the alabama/lsu game this weekend. >> oh, yes. >> and whether tua will be able to play. >> he'll play. >> that's the big news. yeah, but there is -- there's some other news, some lesser news. former attorney general jeff sessions has officially entered the alabama senate race, and the first task on his agenda appeared to be making amends with donald trump. that's right. guy who unmercifully mocked him, called him stupid, made fun of him being from alabama. well, now president trump can't vote, of course, in alabama, but sessions announced his run for
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his former senate seat with a campaign ad that clearly started an audience of one. >> jeff sessions here. i approve this ad. when i left president trump's cabinet, did i write a tell-all book? no. did i go on cnn and attack the president? nope. have i said a cross word about our president? not one time. i'll tell you why. first, that would be diss honorable. i was there to serve his agenda, not mine. second, the president's doing a great job for america and alabama, and he has my strong support. >> oh, oh. >> so, guy cecil, you know, i've said this before about ted cruz. if somebody attacked my wife, said she was ugly, a political
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opponent, i would spend the rest of my life just going after them and making sure that they paid for it, whereas, ted cruz cannot hug donald trump enough. and if i had been attacked like donald trump attacked jeff sessions, oh, man, it would be ugly. i think most people would respond this way. but you look at jeff sessions, like ted cruz and these other republicans that get insulted and trashed and their manhood challenged by donald trump, and they remain quizzlings and i feel like asking the question that the nurse on the stand at the end of the verdict asked, "who are these men, who are these men?" who would -- who would humiliate themselves in front of the
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president and the country like that? >> well, the answer is most elected republican officials in the united states of america. >> oh. >> this was a hostage taking. if you are a political consultant and you are sitting down here and you're saying, i'm going to lunch my campaign for the senate, i'm going to reintroduce myself to the mempee of alabama and i'm going to do it standing in front of a white screen, looking as bad as i possibly could, and basically all i'm going to do is lay down before donald trump and hope and pray he doesn't stomp on me again. i mean this is pretty remarkable. >> hostage taking -- >> he is literally sitting there begging. he was on another network last night literally begging for donald trump not to -- not to endorse him, but just not to say mean things about him. this is not the way -- >> oh, my god. >> but this is the united states senate. you know, all of the talk about, well, behind the scenes
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republican senators say this and say that, who cares? they get in front of the camera -- >> doesn't matter. >> -- and they do this. coming up on "morning joe," mick mulvaney had plenty to say from the white house podium last month when he admitted to a quid pro quo. however, he now seems less willing to talk with congressional investigators who have subpoenaed him to testify this morning. that's next on "morning joe." as a struggling actor, i need all the breaks i can get. line? liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. that's a lot of words. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪
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>> did he also mention to me in the past the corruption related to the dnc server? absolutely. no question about that. but that's it. that's why we held up the money. now, there was a report -- >> reporter: so the demand for an investigation into the democrats was part of the reason that he wanted to withhold funding to ukraine? >> the look back to what happened in 2016 certainly was part of the thing that he was worried about in corruption with that nation, and that is absolutely appropriate. >> withholding the funding? >> yeah. >> but to be clear, what you just described is a quid pro could. it is funding will not flow unless the investigation into the democratic server happened as well. >> we do that all the time with foreign policy. get over it. there's going to be political influence in foreign policy.
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>> get over it, said the acting white house chief of staff mick mulvaney inside the white house briefing room just last month, admitting president trump withheld military aid in order to pressure ukraine to conduct investigations into the bidens and into a 2016 campaign conspiracy theory. mulvaney, after hearing from the president, later walked back those televised comments. we learned overnight that the house intelligence committee has subpoenaed mulvaney to appear on capitol hill and to testify today, this morning, as part of the impeachment probe. mulvaney, like several others in the trump administration, is not expected to show up for that deposition. let's bring in national political reporter for "axios", jonathan swann. jonathan, good morning. we just learned about this subpoena last night. how did the intel committee decide to drop it so late and ask mulvaney to appear at 9:00 this morning, which he probably will not do? >> well, it is not designed to get him in. >> right. >> this is just building a case for adding another article of impeachment around obstruction.
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of course, mick mulvaney is not the first white house official to refuse to come and testify. we've had his own aide, rob blair, john eisenberg, michael ellis, we have had michael bolton. so it is the exceptions that go and testify like tim morrison, over the objection of the white house counsel, they've been clear about that. i see it as part of adam schiff building an argument, showing the defiance and potentially adding another article of impeachment. >> what would mick mulvaney say when confronted with that videotape, you admitted it on camera, it is not a slip of the tongue? it would be interesting to hear him under sworn testimony explain what he meant by the comment and later changing it. i was listening to you earlier this morning, jonathan, talking about how the white house is feeling about the way the impeachment inquiry is proceeding and what might happen if it gets to the senate to the
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republican jurors. listening to them one by one make up new excuses and new distractions for the president's behavior, it doesn't look like republicans are going to move off their votes in support of the president. >> they're in a -- i mean you just have to accept reality for what it is. they're in a very strong position, the white house is. not because of any grand strategy or four-dimensional chess or war rooms or anything like that, but simply because nothing has budged these senators, nothing has moved them. you did a session on jeff sessions earlier that says it all. we have been told, you know, who could the 20 be that defy, who could the five be? i think the scenario we need to seriously consider is zero. there's a not insignificant chance that zero republican senators defect if nothing new comes out and we have the current set of facts we are dealing with. i mean we interviewed mitt romney and he is supposedly the
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weakest brick in the red wall. i mean he's not there yet. i mean just based on the interview we did with him, if he's the weakest brick in that red wall, it is a pretty strong wall over there in the senate. even though privately and as guy said, who cares, privately they all -- you know, not all, but a lot of them despise the president, say that they -- you know, they wish that they could politically get away with replacing him with mike pence, but none of that matters. because when it comes down to it and when they have to do things in public and the vote, they step in line. >> jonathan swan, thanks so much. we will be reading your reporting in "axios" as we always do. coming up, what is driving the day on wall street. we will check in with cnbc for business before the bell. "morning joe" is back in a moment. moment
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welcome back to "morning joe." you know, it may have been my favorite interview i have done in my 16 years here at msnbc. i sat down with ringo starr for
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a wide-ranging talk about his new book, his new album and his life at a beatle. we will bring you that full conversation on monday. here is a sneak peek on what it was like for him in the beatle's heyday. >> we didn't know it would be so big, but, you know, the decision you made was that we wore bombarded day and night and very little space. so john and i went on holiday, paul and i went, you know, we all did holidays. we weren't recognized then and so we could have a good time. the pressure did start to hit, and if you look at ron howard's documentary on us, you can see us getting grayer, just, you know, we are getting gray and we're like, you know. >> suffocating. >> it was getting harsh so we stopped touring. >> right. >> and we did some really good things in the studio, but the other thing we had to say or i had to say -- i can't speak to
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them -- is that i'm going to the movies. i'm going out. we're going to a restaurant. you know, whatever, and that's how it is. >> you do it. >> you just got to do it, yeah. >> you can't hide. you know, there's always stories about the white album being so hard and at times you left and all of the fighting and that "abby road" was somehow this wonderful, magical, happy moment, but it had to still be tough for you guys, right? >> there were discussions, you know, meaningful discussions. i mean the white album, my response was, well, i left the band. i didn't feel i was playing -- everybody knows the story. i went over to john. i knocked on his door. he was in an apartment i owned but with yoko. i said, you know, i feel i'm not really playing that great and you three are so close. he goes, i thought it was you three. >> i love this story. >> yeah. and so i go to paul. knock, knock, because that's what i'm like. >> yeah. >> i say, you know, i'm not
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playing great and you three seem so close. he said, i thought it was you three. i'm like, i'm out. >> okay. so we're going to run the full ringo interview on monday morning. looking forward to that. now something i'm really looking forward to and we're going to bring in now the president of the reagan legacy foundation, michael reagan. he is here to share the foundation's latest project, the walkway to victory. it is a really exciting project and it is in honor of veteran's day on monday. michael, thank you for being with us. you know, before we talk about the great heroes of world war ii, tom brokaw was on earlier this morning. we are celebrating the anniversary of the fall of the berlin wall, and your dad was so instrumental, along with so many other people leading up to 1989. what are your thoughts and what are your thoughts going to be this weekend as we commemorate
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that extraordinary moment where the wall came down? >> i was watching tom brokaw, and ten years ago right now my wife and i were in berlin to celebrate the 20th anniversary of the fall of berlin wall and actually open up a ronald reagan center at check point charlie museum. of course, the next day a big celebration of the fall of the wall. i will never forget the 20th anniversary and excited about the 30th anniversary. in fact, i believe it is going to be tomorrow that they're going to put up a statue of my father there at the embassy in berlin commemorating what he did with that speech back on june 12th, 1987, the fall of the wall on november 9th. so, yeah, i'm excited to celebrate once again. i won't be there this time, but i was there, you know, on the 20th anniversary and i will never forget it. >> you know, michael, your dad was obviously the first person
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that really celebrated, brought to the forefront the celebration of d-day. of course, ike had visited there but it also had been a little more quiet on june 6th on those anniversaries. your dad went there on the 40th anniversary, gave a famous speech about the boys of pontahawk and every d-day forward it seems americans have paid greater and greater attention to it. you have set up the walkway to victory, which victory in what is a village with an extraordinary connection to those remarkable days in june of 1944. tell us about the walkway to victory and the veterans that it honors. >> well, it was the first town freed by america on the morning of d-day. it is the 181st and 182nd
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airborne's gettysburg, if you will. we have been working with the museum there for a couple of exciting issues, but a couple of years ago we decided to start what we called the walkway of victory, where we started the walkway to all of the different buildings there with the names of those that served in the european theater in the second world war. this last d-day, if you will, we in fact gave susan eisenhower the bridge with her grandfather's name on it, ike eisenhower. so we're excited about that. what people can do, they can go online. the walkwaytovictory.com, purchase a brick, and the brick will be put there at the airborne museum, in the ground for people to see for all time. we are really excited about it, and the excitement overflows really into those who have bricks in their names and they're able to see them. they're 98, 99, 100 years old. these kids were 17 years old when they landed, you know, in france back in the 1940s.
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god, i just love being with them, talking to them, speaking to them, to be able to do something to commemorate and remember what they did that literally saved the world. >> uh-huh, they did. they literally saved the world. i can't think of a place -- i'm sure there are some -- but on earth where you get chills quicker than you do standing on that beach. i have been there, lucky enough to visit, and looking out at that water and trying to imagine what was happening that day and the sacrifices teenage kids from the united states came over to make. what is it like to walk across those bricks with those guys and what is their reaction when they see their names? >> it is amazing. we have a couple of pictures of them sitting and looking at the bricks. but to see -- for them to see their names -- and what we've done also is a lot of people don't know the names of people who served, so what they do is they send a check to legacy foundation and we go find the names. we put the names in there for them. so everybody can do it. it is such a wonderful, warm
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feeling to meet these guys, these heroes of that era, and to be able to speak with them and talk with them. and when they see a brick with their name on it, they go -- they're remembered, because we're losing them every single day. you know, we used to celebrate this every ten years. now it is every five years because there's just not enough of those heroes left. people forget, my father was the first president to actually visit, you know, normandy on d-day. >> yes. >> now, of course, every president is doing that. >> i had that same feeling on the 75th, this jean. i was looking at some of the faces on stage, you start doing the math in your head and you say it is not going to be long before we don't have any of these guys with us anymore. >> one of those that we, in fact, supported -- because we do support some of them going back also who don't have the money. >> yeah. >> and one of them parachuted over omaha beach on d-day, went out tandem. he lands on the beach and a
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member of the media runs up to him and says, "how was it?" he says, "better than last time." >> a little smoother ride, wasn't it? >> good for yyes. >> good for you for doing this. if you would like to honor a hero of world war ii, the people we've been talking about this morning you can visit walkwaytovictory.com. michael reagan, good for you for taking on this initiative. >> thank you for having me. time for business before the bell with cnbc's dominic chu. what are you looking at over there. >> good morning to you. we are watching disney stock this morning up big today. this is after the media giant reported better than expected financial rultsd aftesults afte yesterday's closing bell but a lot of attention is looking ahead to tuesday, because that's when disney plus, the streaming video service for disney, hitz the market. it is the latest entrant in the big, heated streaming war. disney ceo bob iger says disney is ready to go and the test
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markets indicate a far broader appeal than expected. disney plus will be available on amazon fire tv devices as well as android and apple products and samsung and lg smart tvs as well. the stock of gap stores tumbling after they announced that ceo art peck stepped down immediately, replaced by the current knock executive chairman of the board robert fisher. it cut its forecast for how much it will make this full year. gap has been struggling to jump start sales in each of its key brands, gap, banana republic, old navy. earlier this year peck announced plans to split the company into two different ones, one focused only on old navy and the other company focused on all of the other brands including gap and banana republic as well as their yo yoga wear line. koeng coca-cola is launching the first new drink brand in over a day. they unveiled ah-ha, a line of
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sparkling waters that will replace dasani sparkling water. for those looking for extra kick in the seltzer, two will feature caffeine added, perhaps a feeling that some of us like us that work early morning news hours, right, guys? >> we're going to need it. taking on la croix or however you pronounce it. >> or perrier. >> that one is perrier, i can pronounce it with confidence. >> we're not talking about the spiked seltzer stuff. >> cnbc's dominic chu giving us a good look at the economy this morning. thank so much. let's do a big picture on the economy where we are, not the spiked seltzer so much more broadly the economy, how it fits into the election. >> there's two economies. there's the stock market and this year it is up 20% and which 50% of the country has not participated in, only 1% i think own 90% of the stock. it is the rest of the country
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where particularly when you look at a lot of signs, inverted yield curve, when you look at farming, manufacturing, consumer confidence, some dark clouds coming. it is a tale of two economies. >> that's the economy that ee lizza ber -- elizabeth warren and bernie sanders are talking about. a lot of people are not touched by the success of the dow. >> no, but you look at the unemployment rate. it will be strong for donald trump to be able to say this is where the unemployment rate is now, this is where the unemployment rate is for hispanics, for black americans, for a lot of different people, lower than it has been in a very long time. in some cases, historically low. there may be two economies, but the question is -- and it is going to be that ronald reagan question back in 1980, are you better off today than you were four years ago. pundits aren't going to answer that question and politicians aren't going to answer that question. americans will answer that
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question. so we will see. i will still say though, there are a heck of a lot of countries across the world that would trade positions with the united states of america's economy. >> sure. >> right now. i mean we're stronger than just about every other economy in the world. >> no question about it. coming up next, something entirely different. what we get wrong when we talk to people we don't know. best-selling author malcolm gladwell joins us with his new book on why we're so bad with understanding those people. he joins us next. keep it on "morning joe." business before the bell is sponsored by -- before the bell sponsored by - ♪
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that's the power of edge-to-edge intelligence. joining us now is malcolm gl gladwell. he examines miscommunications throughout history. he looks at bernie madoff's ponzi scheme. the case of jerry sandusky. it is good to to ye, i'm always fascinated by the topics that you choose to tackle. what did you see that led you to this topic. >> they all have a common element. they involve two people trying to communicate and failing on a fundamental level, right? the people that saw jerry
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sandusky did not understand who he was. a chapter on bernie bernie mado. they thought he was a brilliant invest investor, but they were duped by him for so long. why it would be so difficult to understand someone that we're in such an interact with. >> so the prescription is to talk to the strangers and try to understand them before it gets to the point of the ponzi scheme or jerry sandusky. >> i try to understand what are the specific strategies that are leading us astray. i also come down that we have to accept that our -- that our inability to make sense of strangers sometimes is a necessary price we pay for a trusting society. and i am very anxious that we not do away with the good part
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to deal with the occasional deceptions. >> a couple of questions. one, how did you select the people you spoke to in this book, but the second overriding question, in terms of talking to strangers or doing in anyone, we're doing something that is losing value, eye contact. how does that add to the lack of communication between people, but first, how did you select people? >> the book was really inspeire by the tragic death of sandra bland. it grew out of my own anger and frustration with that string of high profile cases involving
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african-americans and law enforcement. and our inability to understand why the cases were happening and to prevent future ones. the cases kept going on and on year after year after year. i want today come to a more complete understanding of why -- let's get beyond the surface rhetoric. is there something going on between law officers and young african-americans that explains why time after time these cases have tragic consequences. so i began and the book begins and ends with sandra bland. the middle i chose cases because i thought they would reflect well on trying to understand these particular instances of miscommunication. >> let me bring you back to sandra bland, i was very interested when you started and ended there. is it that when we're talking to strangers and using bland, but the whole study you've done
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here, do we bring our preconceived biases and notions into the conversation, do we bring what we bring in and see what we want to see instead of what we see. >> when you break down, i spend a lot of time breaking down the specifics moment by moment of the encounter between the police officer and sandra bland. and what is happening is that he is, the police officer, for a whole series of reasons, his training, clearly his biases, racial reasons, he is not stopping her if she is a 60-year-old white woman driving a cadillac. he is jumping to a set of conclusions. she is distressed and he thinks she is dangerous.
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she is trying to deescalate and he thinks she is escalating it. my point is we have to restructure law enforcement strategies to minimize the danger of those kinds of miscommunications. because they -- it is impossible to do away with that miscommunication entirely. we can only act for it, train the police officers so that when they're in those situations if is the smallest number of times. >> so you talk about the people who didn't know. how could they not have known. how could they not have seen. how do you grapple with the people who probably did know? people with coaches at penn state. they knew there was something about him being in the shower with a kid.
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that is not not knowing. >> i make a difference between the mississippi state case involving larry nasser. i think the administration was presented repeatedly with pretty clear evidence that something was profoundly wrong with the behavior of a member of their own faculty. i come away being profoundly simple shet sympathetic to the administration there. i think what they were, what they did was something that almost all of us would have done in that situation. they were presented with extraordinarily murky little bits of evidence, and they, the phrase i use in the book, is they defaulted to truth. that is a fundamental human desire. when faced with someone uncertain and kind of out of step with our expectation. our impulse is to accept the
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status quo. to believe that the communication we're having is honest. that is something baked into our genes, and it is very add large, and i do not fault -- >> and with tragic consequences. >> so what you said is very interesting. human nature is endlessly fascinating but quite often inexplicable. so you get to maddoff, you get to sandusky, what do you do when you talk to strangers and those strangers are really, really good at convincing you -- >> in the case of maddoff, don't give all of your money to someone that can'tics plain his trading strategy. the problem with the police officer in the sandra bland case is that he doesn't give her the benefit of the doubt. he is not trusting of that communication, he doesn't enter that interaction with an open mind. so the last thing i want to do,
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i don't want the presidents of major institutions to be as paranoid and suspicious of the officer involved with sandra bland, i want people to believe in the truthfulness and honesty of others and let's deal with the bad actors when they come along to try to minimize their damage. >> so t is so great, malcolm gets all of the way back to the aztec empire. and malcolm's podcast, broken brother is back. including the black keys, norah jones, and more, malcolm, great to have you with us. that does it for us this morning, chris jansing picks up the coverage right now. >> good morning, it is friday, november 8th here is what is happening. this morning the 2020 democratic race as

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