tv The Dylan Ratigan Show MSNBC January 7, 2011 4:00pm-5:00pm EST
[ record scratches ] ...and over [ record scratches ] probably isn't giving results you want. discover neosporin® lip health™. shown to restore visibly healthier lips in just 3 days. neosporin® lip health™. rethink your lip care. good afternoon. today, the truth behind the numbers. the jobless rate falling to 9.4%. unfortunately, for all the wrong reasons. it's hard to celebrate when we've stopped counting a quarter million out of work americans. plus, a little back to the future at the white house as yet more old clinton hands join the
obama administration. how can we really move forward if we're always looking at the past? also, you've heard of money laundering. how about honey laundering? show starts right now. if you were just reading the headlines, today's job report sounds promising. unemployment dropping to 9.4. >> the trend is clear. we saw 12 straight months of private sector job growth. that's the first time that's been true since 2006. >> well, the trend in the right direction, yes. but not nearly enough and for all the wrong reasons. the 103,000 jobs added last month, far below what had been forecast. in fact, about a third of what we would need to be adding each
month to recover all the jobs lost in the great recession caused by all the shaknry we've discussed. couple that with the americans who have given up looking for work because they have been unemployed so long, they've literally dropped out of the workforce and are no longer being counted as unemployed by the labor department. heck, even our head money printer, ben bernanke, can't ignore the writing on the wall. >> if we continue at this pace, we're not going to see sustained declines in the unemployment rate. it could take four to five more years tort job market to normalize fully. >> except there are a number of steps that we could take to get people back to work much sooner. for instance, we could end the strangle hold that the giant banks have on the american people and implement policies that incentivise them to start lending again and stop exporting
that money or using it for short-term speculation or lending it back to our own deficit layden government. we could also reform with china. we could end the days when it's more profitable for multinational corporations to take the money they do have overseas than it is for them to invest it in our own country. let's talk to a couple of folks who helped with the tour in seneca falls, new york. peter mauricey and right here in new york, chrystia freeland, global editor at large. also, author of this piece. it's nice to see both of you. >> great to be here. happy new year. >> peter, explain to us how they count joblessness because the number is capable of going up and down for reasons that may not actually have anything to do with creating jobs. >> well, what they do is call people up on the phone and ask
them, are you an adult? do you have a job? if you don't have a job, are you looking? if you're not looking and don't have a job, they don't count you. if you have a home-based business and lose your job and work a couple of hours a week, they count you as employed. and today, with so many being so fearful of admitting they're unemployed, professionals are not admitting they're up empl employed. we have 250,000 that weren't koubted and many others who said they are who are not. >> i was just nodding particularly about peter's point on the marginal home based businesses. what we're leading into is the
dyi economy. the jobs aren't there right now. we're going to have to add 7 million jobs to get back to where we were before the recession. >> 350,000 a month, which we're nowhere near it. >> huge. so, people are having to or trying to cobble together sort of an economy in their own lives. it's really, really hard. what i think is particularly scary is america is not built for people to be working like that. for people sort of building a dyi income for themselves is a huge problem tnd only going to get bigger. >> if you were to look at the statistics, looks fairly good. if you were to look at charac r characterizations of economic growth, don't look that bad and yet the labor side of the equation continues to look miserable, terrible or pretty bad. how do you reconcile an economic model where you're not
employeeing people? >> it's the two-speed economy. today, "the wall street journal," which is hardly sort of -- crazed lefty organ, had a really great column. what they pointed out was it's a two-speed economy. the argument they made was you're seeing in the luxury goods retail sector doing incredibly well, but the discounters are not doing well. >> there's a couple of things to consider. first of all, you can grow at 3% and not do much about unemployment. we have 2% productivity growth and 1% population growth. yet a lot of that growth is on wall street thanks to the bailout provided by the government and zero interest loans from the fed. they're paying out $150 billion in bonuses. profits in 2009 were 300 billion on wall street. the second thing is that american companies earn so much manufacturing in china that they get profits.
50% of the standard & poor's 500 profits are made abroad. so, outsourcing pays for stock prices, pays on wall street, but not on main street. >> there's a cartoon circulating today of a couple of cartoon bears. i think it's the same bears that explained ben bernanke's quantitative easing. also explaining trade with china. i want to give you a little sample of this. >> u.s. commerce department says every billion dollar of trade deficit worth 6,000 jobs. you do the math. our currency intervention, the single most protection policy at world. >> do you like "jersey shore"? >> is that a fair characterization of the threat china poses and is it a fair characterization of the american response? >> absolutely. barack obama has declared unilateral disarmament nmt war
with china. china is mugging america's middle west, stealing its jobs and barack obama has decided, well, if they won't stop because we ask them, we're going to do nothing about it. instead, we're going to negotiate free trade with south korea and that's going to solve our problems. t a joke. >> if you were to look to the last, go back to history. huge rate of change, 1890. 1900. 1910. industrial revolution. the robbers, the pop lists out of nebraska leading to the muckrakers and ultimately, the rise of teddy roosevelt who broke up jpmorgan, the railroads. are the parallels as direct as they appear to be now as they were, to what was going on then? >> yeah, i think the parallels g are very, very strong. also, i think we shouldn't lose sight of the fact that part of what is going on now as it was
in the 19th century, is incredibly important and terrific dynamic processes. that was the building of the railroads. i'm happy to live in a world where those things happened. likewise right now, a lot of the stuff we're seeing is tremendous. look at the facebook deal. we're seeing now companies created out of nothing in five years, but that does create i think a very difficult political dynamic. where you have the people who are successfully surfing these waves doing really well and as they do really well, they amask political power. >> there's the good and the bad. the bad is these big banks in new york and barack obama is helping them consolidate u power and monopolize finance. instead of roosevelt. we have the anti teddy roosevelt. >> is there any politician that either of you see that appears to be even remotely capable of
channelling what teddy roosevelt was capable of relative to ending the subsidies? peter? >> among the principle republican candidates, no. >> i think the problem is there isn't right now among sort of the political players in washington, a clear idea of what you need to do for america to work in a global economy. i think the problem is there's actually -- there's no game plan. >> that's right. and the difference is wish and a goal. a plan. we can all sit here wishing all day. always nice to see you. this of course as i just mentioned, not the first time that a group of industries particularly those threatened industries, have controlled our government for their own benefit and ultimately to the debtriment of the people of this country. with the last time this happened, it took a courageous and at the time, it took a
leader to step up and change that. he took on the biggest financial giant there was at the time. jpmorgan, the man himself, and he won. roosevelt's understolying premi if you're too powerful and profiting at the expense of the american people, then you are an enemy of this country and the government must break you up. here, we find ourselves in a similar situation. where six different industries have various degrees of a strangle hold over washington, d.c. and in the process, the draining out of our current and future wealth continues as the media and political class not only tolerate this rhetoric, but spread the phrase. our politicians continue to take money from a variety of corporations to subsidize them in a rigged marketplace that only cares about protecting the incumbent profit structure of those in control at the time.
at the same time, the american people are drowning in a red sea of debt caused by perpetuating, banking, trade, health care, energy and defense systems that are expensive, ineffective and too often protected from real competition. so i have a challenge for those free market republicans who road a wave of voter discontent in washington, d.c. i challenge you to end the massive corporate subsidiesubsi end the massive tax loopholes and to end the trade with china and release the power how ever disruptive it may be, to those who line your pockets. this may no longer be a talking point because this broken system is in the only costs americans their jobs, it is costing this country the very prosperities
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we're back to mix it up. a little back to the future at the obama white house and new signs today that the politics of the deficit debate, oh, yes, they've cut not only both ways, every which way anybody in that room may be standing, from what i can tell, but we start with another big staff announcement. president obama naming gene sperling as director of the economic counsel this after adding bill daley to the chief of staff. both announcements giving us a
major sense of deja vu. >> gene sperling, who i've appoint -- >> today, i'm pleased to -- >> bill daley to serve as my chief of staff. >> today, i am pleased to nominate bill daley of chicago as the new secretary of commerce. >> who knew the way forward was to go backwards? how can this white house take the country forward if it keeps pulling its top economic officials from the administrations of the past, let i loan the ones that created the broken economic structure that led to the crisis. again sperling was larry summer's chief negotiator at the treasury and the creation of a law that had absolutely no regulation on yes, the credit default swap.
good to know those guys are back in the chair. let's mix it up with ari, tim carney. tim, the traditional rhetoric around anything like this is well, it's good we've got people who know what they're doing back in the job. >> i think it's funny people complained, oh, barack obama has no real private sector folks around him. these men are political fixtures. ba bill daley. is he a great finance expert or a guy who knows how to pull leverage? just like rahm emanuel who made $16 million to two years pulling political levers to make things happen. then sperling with his goldman sachs money. it's the same thing. it's the guys who work at that tawdry intersection. >> ari, i want you to channel if
white house for a second. we're no longer the minority. there's a loud cory russ of people saying the industrial political complex is strangling america and the nexus of that interface is between finance, which provides the vast majority of political funding two both parties, barack obama receiving more money than any presidential candidate in history. at the same time, he runs on change and says he's for america and jobs cht if you're in the white house, what are they thinking? >> you're hitting it right on the head. there's not a tea party or rally in this country -- i agree this is part of the tawdry intersection to quote our colleague. now, the problem is, they're not tuning into the tea parties. they're own base.
they're tuning into this broken, bipartisan washington consensus that says these kinds of folks know what they're doing. yeah, they know what they're doing. what they were doing was deregulating and a lot of people feel that was the problem. so, they can do it again. they have that experience. >> if you were to look particularly at the culture of tradition, tim, going back to cave days when you asked your grandfather which berries you should eat so you didn't end up dead, yeah, grandpa told me don't eat the red ones. when we're in a situation where the rate of change in our economy is so high, the way things get done today, the way information travels today is so much different than two or five years ago let alone when bill clinton was bringing in these same two men. how dangerous is it to harken back to people from a decade or 15 years ago that were dangerous then and not even understanding of the amount of change and the
premium that exists on adaptability and ability to adopt when a man keeps on bringing people in who can't adapt. >> it's a great point you make. i call it pinstripe protection is. we should have said maybe the way the stock market worked in the past, it's not going to work in the future. what they say is we want to make sure the economy keeps working the way it was before because we were making lots of money. the fact we still have the same guys at the head of citigroup is a shame. much less the guys atop the administrations of 12 years ago. >> if nothing else, it continues to break the cognitive disdense for those who voted for change with barack obama and perhaps has been in denial that he has
been one what has -- i do give him props for raising the bar for health care. i want to turn to the republicans. obviously, they are thick as theens everywhere you look. republicans drawing a line in the sand over the national debt ceiling, saying any vote to raise it must come with spending cuts, but when pressed by brian williams, the new speaker of the house couldn't come up with much. >> nim a program right now that we could do without. >> i don't think i have one off the top of my head. but there's no part of this government that should be sacred. >> well, without raising the debt ceiling, the u.s. could default by the end of march. which the white house says would be catastrophic. that's not necessarily unfair characterization, but the absurdity of using the debt ceiling as a political prop is
something that we probably can't carry on too much about. >> this is really important. these debt threats as i call them, the idea that we are going to play chicken around something that will hurt the entire count country, but most importantly, in terms of my political philosophy, hurt the people that have been hurting the most. this is an insanity and i would distinguish it from the government shutdown of '94. but it was a legitimate debate where the government stopped running, people dealt with it and then it began running again. this is not that. this is insanity. because of the default of the united states as we've seen will be the first time this history and over what? over nothing. no reason. and the idea we're even talking about it, that we have to give time to it is crazy.
>> tim, what do you think about the new speaker of the house? >> i wish he had some better policy briefers? i think he could have opened up the federal budget to any random page and found programs. >> can you take the test? do you have a program? >> i'll start with every dime of agriculture subsidies. ethanol subsidies that are spending and tax credits. i think our defense budget probably 50% larger than it should be. i would eliminate the department of interior, i could go on for this entire segment. there is lots of spending. >> do you want to be speaker of the house? >> i do not. >> why not? you would have been able to give brian a better answer. finish your thought. >> i was looking back at some congressional races and even these new freshmen, their
criticism of obama was how to cut medicare spending, so i have not been confident that republicans are going to give up to their rhetoric of cutting spending. i hope they will. i hope the more passionate tea party guys will told them to it, but what boehner has shown us is he doesn't start off. >> tim, a pleasure. ari, always a pleasure. well done to both and way to take the brian williams quiz there. to get more analysis of today's jobs report and for the real meaning of free market as opposed to the fraud being perpetrated by both parties, do check out my blog this afternoon. coming up on monday's show, my own personal spiritual adviser. at least i'd like to think so.
deepak chopra back with us he helping us through the absurdity that plagues our lives. up next, the newest threat from china. it's not trade this time. it's honey laundering. i said that right? honey laundering. pumpkin pie! gingerbread men! egg nog! [ female announcer ] grab a box of multigrain cheerios. get a code to... ...a 7 day plan to get going on that new years weight loss. get the box. get the code. get started!
we talk about the china trade threat, the currency, but here's a new angle on it. a massive global honey laundering scheme. u.s. honey makers now stinging back against the illegal trade. local companies swarming to defend their trade. demanding the country of orgin and purity be marked. china routing millions of
dollars worth of honey through other asian countries, laund laundering it in effect, in order the avoid tear i haves. chinese companies also accused of undercutting prices and tainted product ft add to that billions of mysterious bee deaths that not only threaten production, but food pr duction. the bees pollinate the fruit, trees, everything in the air. you get a very sticky situation. americans by the way, consume 350 million pounds of honey each year and the producers make less than half of that. it's down 12% since barack obama took office. so, this one's for the beekeepers here at home. we hope our story generates a little buzz for your cause. thank you for indulge my puns this afternoon. when we continue, a real
story of david versus golliath. meet the struggling homeowner who took on america's biggest bank and won. plus, a new view of america's war from the "time" magazine writer who just returned from the afghanistan battlefields. the perfect balance of crunchy flakes and clusters, with a kiss of golden honey. delicious. and the same calories per serving as special k original. so, try honey roasted, honey bunches of oats! heck try 'em all. until the combination of three good probiotics in phillips' colon health defended against the bad gas, diarrhea and constipation. ...and? it helped balance her colon. oh, now that's the best part. i love your work. [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health.
the little guy takes on the big bank and wins? a true david versus goliath victory. in fact, the home owner's name is dave. it started when he started to change on the loan modification program. it was the last ditch effort to save his home. for an 18-month trial period, he made reduced payments on his mortgage only to find he wasn't going to be considered eligible for the modification that he had been paying the first year and a half.
as a result, his credit score was wrecked because they retracted the modification, but dave fought back and at the least, won a little money. 7500 bucks, which is the max the judge could give him in small claims court. dave joins us now along with the man who helped him with his case. think of him as a mortgage csi character -- dave, in the context of that comment from bank of america, did you not provide all the necessary documentation and what did happen from your perspective? >> well, dylan, we did comply
with their requests for documentation. probably about three times during this 18-month process. if there was something still missing, i was not made aware of it. in fact, i had actually asked the representative i talked to each month while making my payments, if there was anything necessary to be sent and they always told me no, there was not. they didn't show anything. >> allen, you say that bank of america uses the promise of this type of a modification basically as a way to milk more money out of someone whose house they know they're going to fore close on any way. they say, give us the modification, you get the money then they say thanks for the money, we're taking your house. >> that's true. they knew within 90 days of this process that dave didn't qualify for this loan, so they kept on taking the money for additional
18 months after this 90 days. they used the money in escrow account that pays for taxes and insurance. it's like subsidizing the bank's inventory so they doept have to pay insurance or taxes on the property. >> dave, did they tell you within 90 days you weren't going to eququalify? >> no, sir, they kept me making these payments for 18 months before they told me that i would have to make up that back money or lose my home. and at that point, little further investigation, i found out that supposedly, they had sent note to me that i did not qualify three months prior to that, of course, i never got that notice and their response to me when i questioned them,
was, we did our part. it's not our responsibility if you didn't get it. >> if the banks own the vast majority of the houses in america america, which they do, fand they don't have any money, which they do not because they get it by the trillion from the federal government and the taxpayer, and you have this unholy alliance, then the profits used to fund the politicians in order to get the politicians to continue giving the banks the money. what recourse do any of us have in the context of a theoretical democracy if the federal government and megabanks are in this unholy alliance, allen? >> it's -- it's just dismal and what we try to do, at least what my organization tries to do, is we get the homeowner to go ahead and realize that the house especially on this hamp program, is going to be lost.
they really have you pegged as being foreclosed in the future, so let's try to attract two issues. get you a little cash and try to get your credit repaired with the positive judgment and that's what dave's going to be faced with because those are the two major issues. i want to start over again. i want to get off that crazy train i'm on and i want my life to go on. so, they have the take the responsibility to go ahead and go after the banks. they have to say i've had enough of this type of sham of a loaning program. i want to start my life over. i want my credit repaired. >> and dave, why do you think the judge ruled in your favor on this case? >> well, we were able to produce the evidence necessary to prove that they had prior knowledge that i was not going to qualify. that they had promised me things
they could not and were not going to deliver. it was a pretty clear cut case that they had done wrong. >> alan, is this the start of a trend? you got a judge in california here ruling in the little guy's favor in the face of what sounds like overwhelming evidence. another ruling in massachusetts today against the banks. is the court, are the judges the last line of defense here and are they potentially starting to wake up and actually smell the coffee as it were? >> yes, they are. again, what we're able to do is to have the small claims venue, is to have the homeowner with the tools i'm able to provide. go in and say look, i'm a victim of fraud in california. it's under specific codes and here's the evidence. as an expert witness, i give them the tools to do this.
in dave's case, they were covering up information. the bank of america was, before during this period of time and they also had undo influence to take advantage of dave so that he would make some decisions. all this was done without contracts. they did it over the phone and the judge was appalled with that. i meeb, that's was the main thing and this happens to millions nationwide. >> thank you both for sharing your story with us and kudos to both of you for again, turning your wishes into a goal, making a plan and executing it in a way that was able to at least resolve this with a little justice. coming up here, the end game in afghanistan. joe klein just back from the war zone with insights for all of us about whether there is a real plan to bring our troops home. [ male announcer ] this is charlie whose morning flight
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additional boots on the ground will help the u.s. keep the momentum going against the taliban. of course, more troops may not be the answer. nato sources say the taliban is just as strong as they were a year ago before president obama's surge with 25,000 fighters facing allied troops. joe klein just returned from afghanistan. his new article appears in "time"'s most recent issue. >> we're going to have most troops out u by 2012. no doubt about ut. they measure things in afghanistan in terms of fighting seasons, which begin when the opium crop is harvested and end when the marijuana crop is harvested. >> what does that have to do with it? >> the taliban are farmers, but it's also the good weather
period. there's consensus that david petraeus is going to get another whole fighting season next year, then in 2012, we'll start drawing down dramatically, leaving a small force similar to the one in iraq now. >> what, if this is estimatable, what will be the distwings between an american withdrawal that started now,in six months from now a year or two after we left. >> two years from now is too far down the road. last fighting season was probably the best since 2001. we pushed them out this past six months. that where i go. to the 80% taliban areas. there were places we couldn't
go. when i went this december, we had pushed them out. they're gone. they're going to come back. >> doesn't that speak to the futility? >> maybe. the hope is that the difference between my first and second trip is that you had afghan national army troops there the second time. they're there. the people seem to trust them and were building them. in fact, it's a real army. what we used to call the northern alliance. these guys have been fighting the taliban for hundreds and hundreds of years. they know what they're doing. they love fighting. there's a chance we can keep the tall dan ban out out of those a. >> but to my question, does it matter when we go home? >> yeah, i think that we need another year to really do the clearing and to train up the
afghans. after that, it's going to be their problem. but we have a huge national security issue in that region. pakistan. the biggest national security threat the country faces. they have upwards of 80 nuclear weapons. a history of military coupes including ones held by islamists. you could have a coupe in afghanistan led by elements that that were sympathetic. nobody has a clear since because they play a double game. on the one hand, they're kind of our allies. on the one, they're funding the taliban. we're giving them economic aide. they've allowed bin laden to live there. >> so, the good news is that to the extent the strategy is to clear some valleys, they have
done that. the best since 2 e. i'm not suggesting that you are. >> but i am less mess mystic than i was before. once again, the quality of our troops on the ground is similar. the best possible way with the smallest amount of violence. the captains out there are going to the the next great leaders in this country. these are kids who have to be the mayor of the town in which they go. they have to deal with the local council. their going to come back here and take this country. >> we would welcome that sort of trained leadership. you mentioned the troops between your trips to afghanistan, you
spent time on american bases here. one of the aspects of the way we have run this war that doesn't get nearly enough attention is the fact we send the same soldiers, the same troops, over and over and over and over and over again. five or six. it's incomprehensible. what is the psychological state of the american troops as you see it? >> well, i followed up on the kids who protected me when i was there. the kids i embedded with are at ft. carson, colorado. and the level of felonies and misdemeanors among american troops returning home has doubled. the levels of post-traumatic stress disorder, of brain trauma, are up. what i'm hearing is that the va isn't doing nearly the job it should be. >> last thing, you say we're
spending a million dollars per soldier per year, that is not being spent on mental health or home ownership assistance. >> we spend more on machinery than on the kids and the mind o and soul of the soldier is the most important piece of machinery we have. >> and of that million dollars, what percentage gets spent on equipment -- >> i don't know the breakdown, but it's far greater than the amount that goes to the kids. >> i can't thank you enough for your efforts and reporting on this. and informing the rest of us who don't have the opportunity to spend time the way that you have in that part of the world. >> thanks. it's what we're supposed to be doing. >> thank you very much. joe klein. check it out. coming up here on "hardball," pennsylvania governor ed rendell on the gop's fight to repeal the obama health
care plan. another political charade by all measures, but first, just call me inspector gadget. we will end this week if it kills us, on a fun note. but we take you live to the consumer electronics show in las vegas. brian cooly with some fun gad t gadgets after this. she felt lost... until the combination of three good probiotics in phillips' colon health defended against the bad gas, diarrhea and constipation. ...and? it helped balance her colon. oh, now that's the best part. i love your work. [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health.
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ipad? brian cooley joins us with more on that. how are those that would want to take down apple looking? >> there are mountains to climb. we're seeing a lot och tech -- the last number i heard, 90 new table tablets. i wouldn't have believed it until a couple of days went by. we're seeing a lot of tablets -- but the tablets. one of the examples i want to show you, this is the samsung tab. this is a very different kind of a size and that allows you to put to put into a coat pocket. running on a 4g high speed network. >> is that just -- the same
thing an ipad would do, just smaller? >> doesn't -- does the same things, but different, you do have to decide, do i have a bigger investment in the apple or not? that's your first decision when you go shopping. not too giant, but a good size. the ten-inch, watch this. when i lift up, this guy turns into a sort of a little mobile. it's got a keyboard under the screen. a tablet to me is more about consumption than creation. i'll type off a short e-mail on it, but then get fed up with the touch screen keyboard. this is a nice trend we'd like to see and we've seen a number of machines with this slim
keyboard. >> what's the difference between that and a laptop. >> laptops have a windows operating system. all the programs that go on that. tablets are running aps. you've got a different family of things you can install on it. that said, apple just, two days ago, announced their mcintosh ap stores. we're starting to see leakage. >> one more? >> i got one more. this is from motorola. this is the zoom. it's one of the most highly regarded here at the show. it's very ipad-like in its shape, but inside is the dual core processor, which is kind of like high horsepower stuff that normally, only a computer would have. you've got two cameras, which