tv The Dylan Ratigan Show MSNBC January 20, 2011 4:00pm-5:00pm EST
eric alderman here to talk about how our political system is rigged against progressive change,ow it's not obama's fault, and what we can do about it. also, disorganized crimes. one of the biggest mob busts shows how the code of silence exists mainly in the movies. the show starts right now. well, today the growing military rivalry between china and the united states. china flexing its muscles with several provocative ads designed to get the world's attention and gain a little bit of respect. they made a test flight of their fighter jet. that's why defense secretary robert gates was visited beijing. they insisted it was entirely
coincide coincidental. there's the so-called carrier killer. it's a missile designed to take out american aircraft carriers, that missile a fulfillment of a threat made back in 1986 when a chinese military officer told the u.s. embassy official said, quote, we're going to sink your carriers with ballistic missiles. there's the missile. we can't forget how much their're interest in cyber fare has been growing. to what end, surely only the chinese know. so where do we stand today? is the u.s. on the brink of a new arms race in a cold war? china's president today saying no. >> translator: we do not engage in arms race or pose a military threat to any country. china will never seek to hit germany or pursue an expansionist policy.
>> joining us now, bill gurts, a china expert. also with us hue tent colonel anthony schaefer, senior fellow with the senior for advanced studies. it's a pleasure to have you both with us. tony, how are you? bill, how do you assess the threat? >> i think it's the most significant military threat facing the country over the long term. obviously islamic terror is the long-term threat. china's is large scale and across the board. you didn't mention they're also building up their nuclear force ts and developed an antisatellite missile which can knock out our satellites and if you do that, you're basically going to shut down the pentagon and its guided weapons and communications. >> do you agree with that assessment? >> i do. they have not stopped what they have planned to do for years. i was doing countersurveillance operations against these guys looking at their technology 20 years ago.
they're very persistent. they're learning our system very quickly. they send their kids to educate themselves and how we work. they're doing a full spectrum of operations zbunts uagainst us, y do business. they use those companies not only for intelligence collection plus operations. they don't have the restrictions on their methodology as we do. therefore they use everything they can in an interest of driving their cause forward. >> in the cause of this, bill, how do you find the extremely benevolent language of the sort of fatting at the state dinner and the cooperation of the military assessment you two offered up at the same time as this massive job rigging is sucking money out of our country? >> it's a huge problem because one of the problems i've been writing about and speaking about for years is the fact that our intelligence agencies have missed all of these developments.
i think you mentioned the new stealth jet that was tested last week. defense secretary gates cannes sled our jet. here they've already conducted a flight test. so my concern is that we're missing these developments and at the same time the chinese have a very sophisticated propaganda effort to play down any kind of menacing activities. >> if you were to look at why the united states government, the united states treasury, the united states commerce department, the pentagon, and the white house have assumed such a conciliatory posture with china, what is your best explanation for that? >> well, dylan, a think of lot of that is we tend to project our own values on those of other countries. this is where i talk about afghanistan and pakistan. we think that they will act on the interests we think are important to them. that may not necessarily be true
and we continue to miss that. we've been sew focused on afghanistan and iraq, we're not looking at anything else. >> bill, how much credence is there to those that argue that china's using the reagan strategy from the '80s that america used against the soviet union that in effect they're allowing the cheap labor and the profits won by very few people in the country that are exploiting the rig relationship with china that in the process we're selling our own future down the road to line the pockets of a few special interests here in america? >> absolutely. the argument has been if we just trade with china it will become a normal nation. that hasn't worked. we've been doing that for 20 years. their human rights record is getting worse. they're continuing to sell goods and equipment to iran and
receive syria. clearly i think that the chinese have figured out a way to try and undermine and weaken the united states. >> if you were to look at what is the logic behind the american diplomatic approach, though, i still -- i -- i hear you, i hear you, bill, i can bring guest after guest through here, talk to ceos of major american corporations. everybody says the same thing. listen, you've got a corrupt trade policy, you've got an ambitious military policy, and then i turn on my television and i see the first lady in a red dress raising a glass to the chinese president and i'm confused. >> well, i think the problem has been clearly that we have tended to not be able to put forward the best elements of our defense and influence operations against them. we have to be smarter. one of the things that they've done under our nose is they've
started looking for other sources of gnarl resources. there's a huge competition regarding fuel and gnarl resources. they're ahead of us. they're going into africa right now. they're trying to figure out how to get ahead of us. they've opened a large copper mine in afghanistan. we've worked with them on these economic issues but fail to understand ultimately their objectives are along ourselves. >> he had a very sinful assertion. he said the difference between america and china is this. china has a coherent strategy, private, public cohesive ambition, economic military and they are strategically step by step walking down that path. simultaneously american government is reminisce ept of a kindergarten class where all we do is play the blame game as who did what to who to who and who's the bigger jerk than the other person and in the process the things that actually matter like a strategic trade policy, like a
rational and well thought out intelligence policy never happens because we're too busy playing lefty, righty, and finger-pointing. do you agree with that assessment? >> not really because, you know, there's a big difference between a nuclear armed come is in tick dictatorship and the u.s. democracy. as you stated those are two different systems. they have a mono electricityic system. they have a strategy that's been put in place for years. we're at a disadvantage because we're a democracy. that's a real battle there. i think what we really need to do is understand more clearly the nature of the communist system over there. it's given up marxist ek nomices but it's basically a military system. we've got to be able to understand it better. >> we've got to look at how we won the cold war. the soviets had a similar tag
but they didn't develop the economic piece of this. we have to look at how we worked with the soviets to thwart how they have all these capabilities and at the same time preserve peace. >> thanks for the conversation, gentlemen. tone in shaffer, bill gertz. thanks, guys. later on in the show, the economic side of this. we'll have a conversation with, yes, the secretary of commerce. i ask him directly multiple times why it is that america refuses to use its leverage, which is the giant marketplace we are for china against the chinese and whether, in fact, that's because it's so profitable for caterpillar, cummings engine, apple and others to exploit the current rig system and whether that's having an dune influence on our national policy. but coming hup owner the balance of the program, a big step back on gitmo for the obama administration. new charges and new tribunals mean the prison may be open for years to come. so who says there's not a third
class of prisoner in this country? there is. also, are republicans focusing too much on health care and not enough on jobs? i thought that was the democrats' problem. we'll mix it up. start at the gu. that's why there's crest pro-health clinical gum protection toothpaste. it helps eliminate plaque at the gumline, helping prevent gingivitis. and it's been clinically proven to help reverse it in just four weeks. new crest pro-health clinical toothpaste. until the combination of three good probiotics in phillips' colon health defended against the bad gas, diarrhea and constipation. ...and? it helped balance her colon. oh, now that's the best part. i love your work. [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health. i'm friend, secret-keeper and playmate. do you think i'd let osteoporosis slow me down? so i asked my doctor about reclast because i heard it's the only once-a-year iv osteoporosis treatment. he told me all about it and i said that's the one for nana.
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welcome back. time to mix it up with some of the other headlines of the day. new signs that gitmo is here to stay, and republicans launching their new blitz against the president's health care law, not quite clear what they're for. but we start with a reversal on gitmo from the obama administration. "the new york times" announcing
that the pentagon will lift the ban for new charges on detainees. in his first days of office the president promised he would close gitmo and eliminate this sort of never-tire -- never approved third class of prisoner where you don't require any sort of process, we can grab you, throw you on an island, and leave you there. two years later they're not only open for business but looking to scale it up. >> i think he's found it necessary to be more sympathetic to the kinds of things we did. i think he's learned that what we did was far more appropriate than he ever gave us credit for while he was a candidate. >> and let's mix it up with david sur rhoda along with mark cap sa, editor at the washington examiner. david, at the end of the day, does this kind of make all the democrats for the entire bush
administration were harping about, oh, it's unjust, you can't randomly prison people. you've got a military system, a civil system. you can't disgrace a third class of system randomly and start torturing people, all this nonsense, only to watch the king of the democrats basically say, actually, no, you can. pretty much makes the whole thing seem silly, no? >> well, the obama administration is obviously undermining that case and this is the danger is that every time the obama administration and specifically obama violates his own campaign rhetoric against the bush administration he creates bipartisan credibility for the radical policies of the obama administration. the danger here is the chief democrat of the country is, again, adding the democratic party's name to a policy that is a quite radical policy and putting bipartisan credibility
onto it, effective will i taking it off the table as a point of policy debate. >> yeah. mark tapscott, you've got to kind of chuckle at the criticisms of the public policies, in fact, ran a presidential candidate on criticism of republican defense policies and security policies only to watch them flip to the cheney/bush terror architecture as soon as they got the job. >> well, actually, dylan, i'm not surprised to see this, and here's why. i have a column in the washington examiner today about how president obama's executive order on regulatory reform is a washington wink wink. thigh say they're going to do one thing but they're really going to do the exact opposite of it. and it's interesting that folks on the left now with gitmo and the other aspects of national security policy here are beginning to experience the washington wink wink from obama on those -- on that spectrum of
issues. you opened your show today by noting that our system seems to oppose progressive change. i think i would simply say our system opposes change, period. >> i don't necessarily disagree with that, mark, as you know. would you consider this? basically that? in other words, whaer the incumbent -- whatever is the status quo, whether it's gitmo, the giant banking system, the current trade structure with china, a list of things, some that i like, some that i don't, whatever they are, you can't change much of anything without i don't know what? >> we are the aircraft carrier enterprise and turning the enterprise takes a long time. >> yeah. do you agree with that david? >> i absolutely agree with that. i think that's exactly right. and, again, i go back on this set of policies. these policies put in place by the bush administration dealing with gitmo and the civil litigations and the like, these were radical changes. the one thing i would say is
after 9/11 in that immediate political moment after 9/11, there was a series of truly radical changes but i think you're right. we've sort of resorted back to the status quo being sort of impossible to change. >> which goes back to ramie man yell who says you never let a good crises go to waste. obviously the financial crisis was used by the financial industry to make the banks bigger than ever and guarantee permanent bailouts on a multitrillion-dollar scale so they wouldn't have to go through a mess to have hank paulson suck the money out. now they can do it through the federal reserve. so you've got to figure that somebody's good at manipulating the crises. next, the gop blueprint as a follow-up, the republicans today launching a full court press on health care. take a listen. >> if you believe as i do that health care law will ruin the best health care delivery system in the world and if you believe
as i do that it will also bankrupt the federal government, you can understand why doing everything that we can do to make sure it's never implemented, it's our goal. >> all right. everything they can do to make sure it's never implemented. six separate committees to force a senate vote on repeal, but after riding an economy of midterm shellacking and months of blasting the president for tackling health care instead of job, our republicans now making same mistake. do you think they go into this health care debate while leaving unemployment as an ignored concept at the same peril the democrats did? >> i think the republicans are very confident that having reached an acceptable settlement on the tax cut issue a couple of weeks ago that that gives them a little running room, if you will, to take up the issue that in their judgment and i think accurately was the number one thing that was on the voter's
mind and that is to repeal this thing. we're now going to have the kind of debate that we should have had for the last two years leading up to the passage of obama care, and we'll have a real debate that really looks at alternatives rather than having something that was written behind closed doors in harry reid and nancy pelosi's office. >> do you believe that, david? that we'll have a real debate addressing the health care insurance and the monopolies and the back room deals that obama did with the drug companies and a lot of these characteristics or do you think that's a lot of nonsense? >> well, look, i certainly wish we would have the debate but i don't think we're going to, part of the reason being they're so skewed. you notice the democrats are saying the republicans are trying to go back to the situations where the insurance companies are between you and the doctor. say what you will about the health insurance bill, whether
you like it or not, it's strengthened the companies. this is a control takeover of health care, in many cases subsidized by the government. and i wish that this repeal debate -- although i don't support repeal -- i wish the debate was how to make the bill better as opposed to simply saying let's repeal this thing and that will solve our problems. we still have an underlying health care crisis in our country with this bill and certain will i without this bill. >> do you agree with that, mark? >> that's not what they're saying. they're saying we have to repeal this and replace it with something like, for example, empower everybody who needs to get insurance to buy it through some kind of a voucher for example as one approach and that would break exactly this corporate government partnership if you will that controls the health care -- >> it would subsidize the health
care industry. it's not a way to get the private health irsnurchs industry out of it. it's giving people government taxpayer money to subsidize further the health insurance. the debate is getting health insurance companies out from between the people and their doctors. >> we're going to wrap this on time but do you guys actually think we're going to have a legitimate health care debate this year or are we going to see more nonsense? mark, yes or no? >> i think we'll definitely have a real debate. >> what do you think, david? >> absolutely not. the terms of debate are totally dishonest. >> pleasure to see both of you. just ahead here, is america a kabuki dmoms? we'll talk to eric alderman about how they keep real interests from coming to the country no matter who's in charge. on the show tomorrow, a new
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efforts in guantanamo. on the eve of the state of the union as obama will likely cast himself as a fiscal conservative, the democratic establishment is searching for an answer to the question, what happened to hope and change? joining us now is eric alterman, column nift for the nation and author of "kabuki democracy." if it were not for the system, barack obama would do it differently. >> i think that's the case. i want to say he'd do it completely differently. but i think obama ran an honest presidential campaign. i think he meant what he said. i think he intended to make good on the promises he made, the promises he hasn't been able to make good on. i think what happened was -- a couple things happened. one thing that happened was when he got there he found the economic crisis was somewhat
scarier than he anticipated that he didn't have the luxury of transforming the system and he had to try to make it work overnight. >> it had to do with the money printing. >> it wasn't the money printing it was the deal doing. the second thing is i think obama has been successful through his life as a creature of his environment. he was a really good college student, he was a really good harvard law review editor, he was a really good community organizer and now he's a really good president in terms of making system work. it's a corrupt system, it's a bad system, but he's making it work, and this is what it's capable of producing, this and no more. >> again, let's look at the statistics. 2.7 million jobs lost in america since his presidency began. corporate profits, an absolute record. never has there been more money made in the corporate sector. the trade deficit with china is
atrocious. the housing remedies are entirely ineffective. are you suggesting that, you know, the president did pick tim geithner out of the near federal reserve who was the chosen supervisor of the financial system who allowed to led us off the cliff in the first place and larry summers who was one in the room in the late '90s that created for us the credit default swap? in other words are you saying that somebody's forcing him to pick these people to do these things? >> not somethibody but somethin >> what's the something? >> it's the power of the market, the ideology of the market, the power of the financial industry to shape our politics, and the power of the media's guys which is driven largely by fox news, i'm afraid. look it. everything you said is true. i don't like it any more than you do, but obama is considered
a socialist or communist in much of the media. wall street hates him. >> and yet they're his biggest donor. how do you explain wall street hating a man where goldman is his biggest donor. lloyd blankfein was at dinner tonight? >> the market is doing wonderfully. what are these people complaining about. and yet still in the entire media -- and not just fox. they have a spillover effect. the entire media, he's got to appoint bill daley to be chief of business. he's got nothing but to shore up the business, the banks. the financial reform had a few good measures in it but 90% of it is stuff the banks wanted in the first place. we're not breaking up too big to fail. we're still going to be on the hook next time this happens. and yet -- and they won't stop whining. >> it's a brilliant strategy. >> there's a quote in the
book -- dick durbin -- frankly, they own the place. >> sure. >> one of their most effective measures is to act as if they're the victims when in fact they've got their foot on the neck. >> one of the things you say in the book you say we can all be forgiven for losing ourselves in the romance of focusing our political time, money, and energies making this man america's 44th president. it almost sounds like you're trying to -- it's explaining why, you know, the dream may not have worked out to be the dream, but, you know, it's okay. >> you know, first of all, i'm indebting myself in that respect. i love this guy. >> cognitive dissidence hurts. >> the fact of the matter is great presidents lead great movements. president roosevelt was a great
president in 1932. he talked about economic royalism and welcoming the banks there was a man force birthday i a social movement. this this country we've got a different kind of social movement bushi ipushing obama i different direction. >> the six synergies, i know. i got it. >> it's tough. it's tough. >> whatever get use to sleep. >> no. that's why i wrote a book about the system. >> i understand. but at the end of the day, let's look at my favorite president in the context of what we're going through now, teddy roosevelt, who was obviously up against a hugely corrupt and bought system, the banks, the railroads and the oil companies, completely oppressing, distracting, and depriving the country, the small businesses, the farmers, 18990s, 1900, teddy roosevelt didn't get things done by being friendly with the banks and the railroads and the oil companies. teddy roosevelt understood that he had to be a charismatic and
powerful lead were the support of the people and have the communication with the people. you mentioned fdr. fdr connected with the people in a way. why has this president not gone around the system to the people. >> where are the people? where are the people? i mean you've got hundreds and hundreds of lobbyists on cap and trade. how do the people get involved with that? >> goldman sachs hired the staff director of the house banking committee while the -- barney frank's guy. when did they start paying him is what i want to know. everybody thinks it's fine. nobody complains about it. we live in a completely different culture. >> you think it's a cultural problem. >> i think it's a largely cultural problem. i think the people have given up -- they turn out every four years. you know, it was very exciting, and i was moved to tears in denver that night, but the banks, the pharmaceutical industry, the insurance industry. >> military -- >> they're there every day. >> right. >> the rules of the financial
regulation is being written now. nobody's paying attention. >> i know. >> that's the system. >> at the end of the day, i feel like a president with the audacity -- which was a name used around this president -- to go to the people and say fight -- people understand unfairness. >> this is what gets you to sleep at night. >> listen, we've all got our thing. pleasure to see you, eric. the book is "kabuki democracy." do check it out. still to come, is patienting the chinese way the path to raising successful kids? tony drops by with some per s k speck expect active. first the mafia crime. what happened to the code of silence, people. be right back. >> boy: go down, down, down. down. straight. go straight. no, to the right. to the right. >> go to the right, go to the right. >> whoa! >> whoa! >> what is that? >> man: well, that's a, uh...
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at least in the history of new york. that's what the fbi are calling it. over a hundred were pinched today including new york's fabled five families. this comes as a result of multiple probes and federal investigations from targets including strip club bookkeepers. it runs from gambling to murder. it's sparked by their reckless necessary as much as their brutality. >> in one instance one individual was shot and killed during a botched robbery attempt and two others were allegedly shot in a public bar because of a dispute over a spilled drink. >> well, most of the arrests made possible with the cooperation of former mob members. so much for the legendary code of silence. must be facebook or something. how big -- the big question we have is who will ray play in the
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segment whether we're starting a new arms race. the reason china's developing a stealth fighter and antiaircraft missiles is because we invade everybody. else. i don't know about everybody else but we do an awful lot of invading. we do want to hear what you have to say. log on. you can find me@dylanratigan. any minute now chinese president hu jintao lands in chicago where mayor richard daley will have another fancy dinner this evening. also along for the trip is congressman gary locke. we had a few moments with the secretary before he took off for chicago, the windy city. >> we need to export more to
china, and, in fact, in the last year, exports to china have been twice the rate of exports to the troeft country, exports to china grew by 34% last year, and the sale of our goods and services to china exceeds $100 billion, up dramatically from the year before. and, again, that creates jobs for the people at home. we're also making sure that china is opening its markets to provide even more opportunities if for u.s. companies to sell its made-in-america goods in china. you're seeing the wages in china. it's taking away from other companies around the world that have had with china low cost manufacturing and you're already beginning to see some of the manufacturing coming back to the united states. why is it for instance bmw has opened up a facility in south carolina, building their 300 series automobiles, and a good chunk of those automobiles are
to be exported to other places around the world. with all the emphasis on just-in-time delivery, concerns about transportation costs and supply chain, you're seeing a lot of companies now focusing manufacturing and bringing some of that manufacturing back to the united states. >> two very specific questions for you. the chinese tariff on exports. the american imports to our country is 2.5%. why is that? >> well, that's why we're -- you know, america has always been open for goods and services coming from other parts of the world, and that's why, for instance, on korea, the trade 'agreement with korea makes sure that korea is lowering their tariffs and barriers to, for instance, u.s. automobiles and american beef and a whole host of goods and services because america is really one of the most open countries for products and services coming in.
that's why we're demanding reciprocity from other countries including china. >> and how is that reciprocity when we allow them to tax us ten time as what we tax them? >> that's why we're lowering the barriers, getting chinese to back away or not mike forward on some of their previously proposed policies of requiring that u.s. companies if they want to do business in china not only have to produce some of these things in china but also have to innovate and do the r & d in china and have the patents in china, especially in some of the new technologies like wind and energy and clean energy. so we've been successful in getting chinese to back off on many of these proposals. at the same time raszing our concerns to the wto on some of their policies that we think are blatantly unfair and
discriminatory. and we've had success in getting a lot of these policies nullified. it's going to take constant vigilance, and that's what the president and the administration has been focusing on, making sure that we have this level playing field, that their tariffs are not high in relationship to the tariffs and duties that the united states imposes. >> you say making sure but yet they are high. in other words, it's one thing to say that the we're making sure but i think a lot fous have to see yet using the massive market and threatening to raise our tariff until there is reciprocity. steve ballmer according to the president saying only one out of ten every pieces of microsoft software is purchased in china which means nine out of ten are pira pirated. i appreciate the language but i'm curious where the action is. >> that's why we're monitoring this very, very closely and, in fact, the chinese have made a
very -- a high priority with the advice premier leading the charge on cracking down on violations of intellectual property, especially as it relates to software installed on computers purchased by the government. but we've made it very clear that these pronouncements are not enough, that we're going to monitor, and, in fact, the chinese have invited the u.s. companies and government to help them and participate and be a partner with them in this crackdown on illegal software. it's something that microsoft wants very much. of course we want viable results and we're going to monitor this and keep their feet to the fire. >> how are you going to keep their feet to the fire if you're not willing to threaten denied access to u.s. markets and threaten to raise our own tariffs if they, in fact door not comply with demands on intellectual property fairness and trade reciprocity. >> how is that? >> actually as i've indicated we have many more cases against the
chinese companies for engaging in improper trade practices, selling their products here in the united states at less than market value, improper government subsidies, and we have not been at all reluctant to actually use the full force of the law at our disposal to raise prices and duty on those goods to really send a clear signal to the chinese to insist that they play by the international rules. we've taken them to the wto. the wto has ruled in our favor in nine separate cases in the last nine years. we're not adversed at all of using the force of law and rules of international trade at our disposal to make shoor sure the chinese comply. we'll continue to do that with respect to intellectual property rights violations as well as other trade barriers. >> last question for you. what's the purpose of the trip to chicago? >> again, we're going to be show casing the opportunities for u.s. companies to sell their products and services in to
china, made in the usa, goods and services that will result in more jobs here. there's also a great interest for the chinese to bring their facilities and operations here to the united states, to invest in the united states and to open up manufacturing facilities here in the united states. so it's an opportunity to really encourage more of the chinese to bring their operations here, set up their operations here, of hiring americans, but also enabling u.s. companies to meet with the chinese officials so the chinese understand the concerns, the priorities of american companies that want to sell their made-in-u.s. goods and services into china. >> well, we thank secretarilock for him time today and we'll continue to track what if anything this state visit has on the clearly unbalanced relationship between the united states and china. and be sure to check out my new blog today on "the huffington post."
@dylanratigan.com. how they're working to send american jobs overseas to ensure wider profit margins for the banks here at home. meantime coming up on hardball, chris examines in tim path of his words all these years later. and still ahead in this hour, forget rigged currency and unfair trade. is china going to start telling us how to raise our kids? thursdays with tony coming up. o really save you 15% or more on car insurance?
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journal" called "why chinese mothers are superior. she called one of her children garbage. after receiving death threats and poignant feedback she appeared on the "today" show. >> i don't think it's about achievement. i think it's about helping your children be the best that they can be which is usually better than they think. >> well, our thursday regular tony schwartz is here with thoughts on achievement and what it takes to get there. he's, of course, the author of "be excellent at anything." >> you know, it's one of those things. reminds me of a yoke, hey, i hear you're a great wit and the person writes back, it's half true. that's a little tough. that's a lit tough. she's got half the story or 40% of the story right. so let me start with what she's got wrong. she's opened up a national conversation. look, i know this isn't "oprah."
so i'm not here to talk with you about parenting. i'm here to talk about excellence. she's opening up a conversation about excellence which is how do you get people to achieve excellence. you know what? she had pretty abusive ways to have her daughters become quite superb, one on the piano, one on the violin. there are a couple of things she said -- >> she says if a chinese child gets a b, which would never happen, there would first be a screaming hair-tearing explosion for a b. she says the solution to substandard performance is always to excoriate, punish, and shame the child. she goes on to say, nothing is -- >> let me hold you back there. that's the part that is unbelievably dimwitted and is obviously abusive. she herself says in the book it's poebls legally actionable which she does. the reason it opens up
particularly western people it touches something inside of us that we sense is true. let me hear the other one. >> nothing is fun until you're good at it tochl get good at anything, you have to work. this often requires fortitude on the part of the parents because the child will resist. i thinks are always hardest at the beginning, which is where western parents tend to give up. >> and i'm going to substitute western people and say we tent to give up and we tend to give up on the people that work for us. we're so willing to indulge because we don't want to push past that point of resistance. here's the idea. excellence does indeed as she says require a kind of deliberate practice, and we have lost that capacity to an unprecedented degree in the face of all the distractions we face, the kind of trivial distractions we face in everyday life. >> and you can make money by printing it so, why would you work? when you're printing money. bull go on. the point is being good at something is hard to do and there's a lot of resistance to
do it. >> it's fiercely hard. >> and western people have lost the guts and stamina to do it. >> that's right. and to saying okay, discomfort is actually something that is necessary. stress is a critical element in pushing past your comfort zone and expanding your functional capacity, in getting excellent. the part she misses is that equally important is renewal. so on the one hand the place we're missing it is we're not willing to push hard enough for intense periods of time. on the other hand, what we're not willing to do is to -- is to really learn that it is critical to stop. and we know from science -- about every 90 minutes and renew. we have no respect for renewal. what we think is great work is somebody who hanks in there for 12 hours consecutively. the fact is that's not the best way to excellence. the best way of excellence is super focus with no interruption. no interruption. that is a huge change from a way
in which most people operate. and then take a break. huge intense focus followed by real renewal. that's an absolute simple formula for great, great improvement and for success. >> but is the best way to get somebody to let's say take 90 minutes, work with ten times focus and then take a break and renew by screaming at them that they're a piece of garbage, she's a bunch of scum that should be hit in the head? that's what i use with my staff. mixed results. >> and you're planning that when you become a parent. >> and they love it. no. >> if you're a prison guard and have a stun gun and point it at the prisoner and say will you get back in the cell? yes, he will. having said that, if you said that, that prisoner is going to come back after you. >> which explains the bruises, but, yes. >> one of this woman's two kids completely, you know, revolted against her insistence. i think every piece of evidence suggests that you are trying to