tv The Dylan Ratigan Show MSNBC May 4, 2012 4:00pm-5:00pm EDT
so let us listen to the political spin, shall we? >> after the worst economic crisis since the great depression, our businesses have now created more than 4.2 million new jobs over the last 26 months. more than 1 million jobs in the last six months alone. >> i've also seen over the last number of years a number of people who are really suffering under the obama economy. it hasn't gotten better at the rate of speed they have been told it was going to get better. >> well, in order to understand what this political nonsense means, you have to understand the scale of the problem. there are well over 300 million of us, and we need at least 300,000 folks to be getting new work in order to actually alter the tens of millions we are in need of. as a regular viewer also knows, we hear from the dynamic duo. to review these numbers, i think of peter as a restructuralist. he wants us to engage with
trade, engage with banking. similar to myself quite honestly, jared is sympathetic to the restructurist view doesn't dispute the merit but would argue we have intermediate steps we could be more appreciative of, perhaps, and more aggressive with in the short-term. we all looked at the same report. i won't offer any more audience bias than i already have. jared, your thoughts, then peter, go ahead. >> sure. i think that this report was clearly disappointing and it's the second one in a row. the last month i was careful to say, you know, one disappointing month does not a trend make. well now we've got two, and the concern here is that there's been a deceleration of growth in the job market. we had a gdp number in the first quarter that was 2%. that's below trend. and so it shouldn't be unexpected that we just don't have the labor demand out there to generate the job growth that we need. and it's -- to me it's a policy problem that is amenable to
actions that congress refuses to take. i can say more about what those are, maybe you share some of those ideas, maybe you don't. but the president and the american jobs act articulated good ideas that would make a difference, particularly on the public sector side which we've been hemorrhaging jobs month after month. >> peter, obviously where i would disagree with jared and i suspect you would, as well, is just that the merit of a lot of those ideas is a flea on a dog's behind in the scope of the opposition. and that's probably too extreme of character saization on my pa jared. but at the end of the day, can we get anywhere where we need to get in terms of prosperity in this country. and in your view, peter, absent of calling china a currency manipulator, engaging in real reform and health and energy reform so that we have the reversal of this extraction? >> well, it's much larger than more deficit spending can
handle. since the unemployment rate peaked at 10% in october 2009, it's come down to 8.1%. 80% of that reduction has been from fewer americans looking for work. the adult participation rate going down month after month after month. as relentlessly people become discouraged in this economy. we can turn this around and it does require congressional and presidential action. for example, let's start drilling for oil. we can increase oil production in the united states by $4 milli 4 million barrels a day. it won't be done in places like nigeria. and we need to do more than label china a currency manipulator. we need to take absolute firm action that generates results. >> yep. so here's what's frustrated me which you two will appreciate over three years of doing this every day through various iterations and climates. my newest opinion, if you will, jared, is this.
that the way that we talk about solving our problems, meaning the way that our government takes an inventory of what the problem is, plans to address the problem, executes the plan to problem and reviews what that plan was to adapt its future deployment is basically nonexistent. that our culture, not just nobody's fault -- our culture has prevailed by secrecy and two sets of rules at every layer and that naturally creates a dysfunctional structure. and until we repair that, that our capacity to solve these other issues is heavily impaired. no the that we shouldn't do it, but that our capacity to address them is impaired by our failure to adapt our culture. >> i don't -- i don't disagree. i myself in my public speaking have emphasized that we are at a really somewhat unique and scary place where our ability to diagnose and prescribe and therefore to self-correct is more compromised than i've ever
seen it. so i think we're saying the same thing. >> for sure. >> now, one thing, let me say, just to get down in the weeds for a second because peter brought up some issues i wanted to argue. but your point is the fundamental one. >> if you would indulge me by virtue of the limited real estate. listen, we all have great ideas. >> china has been appreciating, we've been doing a little better on manufacturing. let me get that out of the way. but here's to your point. here's to your point. look, as long as you've got 98% of the republicans in the house who have signed a pledge that they will not, for example, entertain new revenues as part of the deal. as long as you have, you know, people going around signing pledges, lobbyists, money, you know, determined -- money -- >> we got it. >> you understand. >> and the only thing in place where i would disagree with you is while the republicans are offensive beyond comprehension
in my opinion, i don't disagree with your assessment, i believe the moral assertion from the democrats' wallet is vastly superior in some of its sort of moral aspirations to feed people and educate people and i'm with them and i appreciate it. but at the end of the day, peter, when you look at the decision-making, trading, banking, energy management, they're just as corrupted -- i guess where i'm getting, peter, is corruption of the system, meaning two sets of rules and secrecy in the super pacs and all the conversations we could have until we're blue in the face -- >> it's really big. let's get away from energy and currency and focus on banking and health care. you know, if we have such a superior health care system because we have a market-driven health care system, why does it cost twice as much for health care in the united states than it does in germany? the answer is, the system is absolutely busted. the republicans pretend by giving old people vouchers that
some sort of additional competition will bring down costs. that's absurd. like wise, the democrats think by raising more taxes on interest and dividends and subsidizing the system more, that will fix the system. on banking, does anyone honestly understand what mitt romney has to say when he says he'll do dodd/frank better. that's as bad as what obama's doing. >> you guys are very good. this sounds more critical than i mean it. you're very good at pointing out what's wrong. i'd really like to hear what's right. >> well, i mean, for me. i'll tell you -- if i aggregate the book, in a nutshell, what is clearly right is there's a unifying transition of what i would say people with expanded awareness or more awake. there's basically two people in this country, contracted awareness and afraid or expanded awareness. and you're asking questions. if you have contracted awareness, you're looking for a fight. and the number of people that are more awake and asking more
questions and 30 million jobs, guests on this show, subway in new york, all over the place, applying unprecedented -- my best example is this. i believe it should be considered administrative malpractice to address any health care unit. if you can't tell me first who the 5% of the people on that network are that are spending 50% of the money. the first question for any health care network which is being answered by the union, because they have to deal with the problem, the government's not going to do it. it's being answered by the hospitals in new jersey. they need health care. they're saying who are the 5% spending the money on this network? and how do we help those people? and i would argue it's malpractice not to know that information. and that is what is happening away from new york and washington to answer your question, jared. as one example that ultimately i think new york and washington will follow because they cannot lead us there. >> you know, i've noted the same thing. and when i've gone around to the
states, that's where the laboratory of innovation is right now. you've got governors who can't get up on soap boxes and say here's my ideology. >> and they can't print money. >> they have infrastructure systems to manage. and a bridge goes down, it's their problem. i think at a time like this with dysfunctional federal government, it makes sense to look at the states. >> and that's honestly why as much as i can get myself off the cliff in terms of dysfunction and corruption, i'm tremendously optimistic because spatial network theory and all the stuff going on away from these two cities is happening. and you just -- our job is to help them. anyway, it's great to see you guys. thank you, peter, thank you, jared. up next here quite a week to be the president of this country from the jobs report today to the diplomatic crisis in china. telling everybody ten more years in afghanistan? how did you like the president's job? the megapanel to tell us how they think he did.
plus, making your iphone -- like manufacturing it to talking into it and publishing web videos. our specialist with the end of cheap china. but first, who said being a kid was easy? we'll take you to the world's first resort for stressed out toddlers. if you're one of those folks who gets heartburn and then treats day after day... well, shoot, that's like checking on your burgers after they're burnt! [ male announcer ] treat your frequent heartburn by blocking the acid with prilosec otc. and don't get heartburn in the first place! [ malennouncer ] one pill a day. 24 hours. zero heartburn. you know who you are. you can part a crowd, without saying a word. you have yet to master the quiet sneeze. you stash tissues like a squirrel stashes nuts. well, muddlers, muddle no more. try zyrtec®. it gives you powerful allergy relief. and zyrtec® is different than claritin® because zyrtec® starts working at hour 1 on the first day you take it. claritin® doesn't start working until hour 3.
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well, political momentum is a funny thing. it comes, it goes, you create it, it goes away for reasons that have nothing to do with you. i want you to imagine for a moment that you are the president of the united states of america this week. and that you were expected to acknowledge the anniversary of
osama bin laden's death that would seem to be good for the poll numbers considering you were the president when it happened. then, however, as president, you would have to tell war wary americans you were planning to stay there for another ten years. that could be well spun as some sort of necessary evil to get out without creating chaos. you could navigate that. but not to mention, then, after you sort of get through that frailty, yet another weak jobs report because quite honestly this president, the president before, and the president before by my view as you know continue to supervise a system, trade, taxes, and banking that doesn't invest in our country. what do you think is going to happen? if you don't have money coming in, you're not going to have people hiring. and then if that doesn't get you enough irritated, there was a diplomatic crisis, secretary clinton, geithner in china. what a week to discuss. i'm glad i wasn't the president this week.
how do you think the president did with some assets that were opportunities for him and ones that i'm sure he would rather and anybody who was the president would rather didn't happen? >> we're extremely early in the race at this point -- >> i'm not making -- there's no conclusion. >> absolutely. images matter so much. and the image i take away from the week is the president in afghanistan standing strong saying, hey, we're here for peace. >> your mind, that overrides -- >> not even the bin laden killing victory lap, whatever that thing is. but i'm standing here in bagram saying we're going to be here -- >> his presidentialness was overshadowing. >> yes, i am a global leader. i'm here in afghanistan. that's what i remember. >> if i'm sitting in the oval office i'm thinking -- i like what he's saying, we can work with this, we're doing great leadership on this front. and then everywhere i look, the jobs report, just terrible.
and some guy at the chinese embassy -- the whole thing's off the rails in china. i'm grateful my opponent's mitt romney, i'll put it that way. >> heck ya. since we're talking china. remember when richard nixon was asked about how the french revolution amounted to a foreign policy practice. and he said it's too early to tell even though it was several hundred years later. if you take the long view or what some call the eastern view or associated with eastern society. with don't know yet. i think i agree with toure, the images are very powerful. and this is a president who did run in some ways on scaling down our troop presence in iraq and has done that. >> he said he's going to stay for ten more years. >> but in many ways has been a national security president and doing things that may help him politically, but we're going to have to pay the consequences for. >> crystal, last word. >> yeah, i think we've talked a lot about how the economy is
going to be the central defining issue of this campaign, which i think is likely to be. but this week reminds us that that narrative can shift on a dime. something big, something unexpected happens and suddenly the campaign is about something completely different. >> so we'll say we call it, you know, a dead heat-ish with a huge bias for the president because he's the incumbent and the incumbent always has the advantage. shall we say that? what do we know? we'll find out what's going to happen. what we do know is that regardless of the grandiose battle for the presidency of the united states that our children are simply growing up too fast. >> oh, no. i can't do that. no, i'm not doing that. i'm sorry. you are driving me nuts. oh, my god. >> mackenzie. >> leave me alone, people. i don't have any! i don't want it! >> stop it.
>> i'm getting mad. >> makes you ask questions, yes? anyway, she needs to check out this place in germany. the toddler you're looking at there. it's a resort for stressed out toddlers. they get massages, foot baths, even allowed to walk through wet grass barefoot. what could be more soothing at the age of 3? a couple of parents of toddlers here. i imagine there's some stress that emerges in your toddlers' lives. krystal, ari, and toure, you didn't know? >> no, it's actually true. it's easy for us to say, oh, these kids have easy lives. >> what happened to the world where the kids worked for the adults? go clean the house. >> but they have stresses of their own, namely they don't have any control over their lives. they have one or two -- >> along with every child in the world. >> that is a stressor when you are a young child. >> not when you go to work for
your parents to help them and then you shut up. >> that was worse in the past than it is now is irrelevant. all these children know is i live basically in a police state where there are two people there all the time or one person generally there to make me happy but sometimes they say i have to eat, i have to go -- >> we all -- >> i have to do that, i don't want to do that. so their lives are constantly stressful. >> you are validating the resort? >> there is great stress -- >> you're not answering my question. >> yes, absolutely, yes. >> i don't think -- well, i sort of agree with toure, but i don't think the real solution to those problems is giving our kids a massage. why don't we think about what it is creating such a stressful overwhelming situation for these kids and address the root of the problem. i don't have a problem -- >> but as you know, krystal -- >> one at a time -- >> but there could be more effective -- >> some of the stress -- >> one at a time. >> i thought she was done, sorry. remote. krystal, you know, some of the stress our children deal with is
beyond hour control and that they're dealing with a bunch of other young people their age who are also for lack of a better term insane. my son, your daughter goes to school, they get bit by another kid because they touched their toy. we can't modulate that, we can't control that. >> put me to work -- >> they need a massage. >> my therapy, krystal, they made me go to work. >> you never worked. >> that worked for you? well, i will tell you i was very disturbed the other night. my daughter was delaying her bedtime by asking me about her voting rights. and she found it very unjust that kids were not able to vote. she's 4 years old. >> i love your daughter. >> that concerned me as a parent. >> i love that. >> i think that speaks to the issue, though, right? which is krystal's daughter talking about issues that krystal talks about. and we have children who want to model themselves after their parents. and if their parents are responsible, we think of that as a good thing. the other part of this, though, we have a world where adolescence has been shrunk down
by the internet, people working more. >> chemicals in the food. >> failure to put the children to work at a younger age. so -- >> so even with or without the child labor dynamic there, i do think that what you have are kids that are less protected from a lot of the things that in previous generations they just didn't have all of these adult stimuli -- >> all overexposed and the overexposure to the young people is a -- you know, we've got to call the tiger mom -- >> don't call it a tiger mom. call it the french mom who is bring up bebe whose kids are relaxed and chill and obedient. >> yeah, we'll call her. you know her? >> no, but it's the "d.r. show." make a call, anyone comes. >> did you want to say something? >> i was going to say with your child labor thing. i was wondering if you were a newt gingrich supporter? >> you're putting words in my mouth. i never said child labor. >> he did. you just said child labor.
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when an established power and a rising power meet. >> that, of course, our secretary of state hillary clinton on the second day of strategic talks with china underscoring the need for both nations to work together at a time when they are both interdependent and capable of damaging each other greatly and ultimately we may need them as much as they need us. america as we all know has long benefitted not only from an endless supply of cheap stuff, but also cheap financing from the chinese for us to buy the cheap stuff which in exchange gave china a reliable employment market. but our specialist today is putting all of us on notice that the old deal may be losing its attractiveness especially to the chinese people. he warns big changes in the labor force in that country threaten to fundamentally change
the way the government deal with their policies and how american lives relate to chinese lives. joining us now is the founder and managing director of the china market research group and the author of "end of cheap china." economic and cultural trends that will disrupt the world. but the picture on this is chinese used to make your iphone at a factory and now using your iphone in china. >> if you take a look in the first segment of your show, dylan, you talk about how it's hard for americans to find jobs right now. people aren't able to find anything. in china, the exact opposite is happening. it's easy to get a good job. what you've seen is the chinese government -- >> isn't currency rigging fun? >> part of it is currency rigging, they increased by 22% last year because you're seeing american firms like starbucks, apple are making billions of dollars a year. apple now, it's the second largest market in the world, quadrupled sales last year.
what that's doing is creating millions upon millions of jobs. right now the hardest thing for multinationals to do is hire and recruit talent. the net result for consumers is inflation. instead of being able to hire chinese workers for low slave-like wages, they now have to pay them a real living wage and that's going to cause inflation. >> so the biggest consequence. let us presume that whatever the progression this holds continues. wages go up in china, china's consumer market gets more developed, let's assume there's some sort of trade changes that occur over the next ten years, whatever those may be. the implications for american workers of whatever's -- your interpretation of what's going on in china and the implication to american consumers like the four of us. >> so i think for the first thing for american consumers is it's going to get more expensive when you shop in walmart. if you look, the average import price into the united states from china last year went up 3.6%, the highest on record. the second thing is chinese are gobbling up everything.
so they're drinking starbucks coffees, buying more clothes -- >> you can sell them stuff. >> exactly, commodity prices will continue to go up. starbucks has the highest margins in the world in china -- >> i would imagine this would be good for local producers in america. >> it is. the agriculture sector here is being saved by china because chinese are eating more meat, buying more soybeans, pistachios, almonds. >> i want to ask you if china will become the economic superpower of the world as we've been hearing for a long time. chapter 5 is very interesting to me. why chinese consider kentucky fried chicken healthful. are they out of their mind? >> are you scared of the made in china label? >> no. >> chinese are. i love china, i've been living in china for 12 years now. my firm interviewed 5,000 consumers in 15 cities last year, their number one concern in life ahead of being able to pay for medical care costs and
education costs for their children was food and product safety. when we interview consumers they say we like kfc, not because of the price or the taste, but because it's healthy. chinese know that kfc is not healthy from a fried food and from oil standpoint -- >> healthy in the sense that the security of the food chain, the food chain is protected. maybe it's not good for your vascular health, but it's not going to kill you. >> exactly. they trust kfc is going to use nonswell cooking oil. like mcdonald's produces their own potatoes. there's trust -- >> healthy is in the eye of the beholder, and if it's not going to kill you, it's healthy. >> to that point, that's a failure of the government's ability to provide a trusting and safe regulatory system. and we've also been watching what's been unfolding with mr. chen this week. how stable the the government? and how much are they threatened by these sorts of protests? is that a potential threat to the chinese economy going forward? >> actually, if you take a look,
the pew center found that 86% of chinese agree with the direction the central government is taking the country, krystal. most chinese like what the central government is doing. you know, jobs are getting a lot better. we're not anywhere near an arab spring like john mccain is running around talking about. but there is a concern more at the local government level. there's a lot of corruption there. and so i think the everyday chinese people differentiate between the central government and what's happening maybe at the vice mayor level where there is far too much corruption. people generally like what's happening with the country. i think the biggest concern in my mind that could disrupt china from becoming an economic super power would be pollution and food safety. because people don't care if they like the government, if they have jobs if it's going to poison their children. and that's why you see one of the biggest parts of the black market right now is not drugs but baby formula. a lot of parents are rushing into hong kong and and the united states and buying formula and sending it across the
border. when my son was born five years ago, my wife made me travel to the united states to get baby formula. >> to smuggle in -- >> not to sell it, but to -- >> and you wonder why the toddlers are stressed out. talk to dad about the baby food smuggling. >> you also talk about there being more billionaires in china than the united states. for those concerned about wealth inequality, can you have too many billionaires? does that say something problematic about the economy? >> sure, china's reaching that mid income gap. hits about $6,000 u.s. richer get rich and the poorer get poorer. and you could end up like a mexico or thailand where you've had economic stagnation. and the government's pushing minimum wage hikes and enforcement of labor law. right now you cannot cheat your employees. you don't have those sweat shops anymore because the government is making it very clear if you don't treat someone well, the employee can sue you and win. >> this is the interesting thing.
super offici superficially looks like china's screwing over the united states, and then you look a little closer and hey, maybe they're not. maybe we made a deal with the devil where they forgive us cheap debt and everybody's kind of in on this. it's not one or the other and then you dig even deeper and you're like, hang on a second, it's american multi-nationals in the united states are the ones who are the strongest advocates for the rigged trade with china because they are the ones who are invested in the very profits. it's not even the chinese -- not the american people want this. it's the profitability to u.s. multi-nationals to have that rigged trade is immensely beneficial to them at the expense of the people of america and to the people of china. is that fair? >> i'm not sure i would call it a rigged trade, but i would call the multi-nationals are benefitting because they get bigger profits, the american people are benefitting because china's been a deflationary
force. >> we're also losing jobs too. >> not really. americans don't want to work in factories anymore working on -- >> i don't think it's for us to say that. >> some people want to work in factories. >> you don't know that. >> when you take a look, there are about 1 million jobs that have been unfilled in the agriculture in china and the united states and more things because a lot of americans -- >> that's a conversation for a different -- out of 350 million people in this country for one person whether it's you or anybody else to say what americans do and don't want -- is -- >> multi-nationals right now don't want to say they're too pro-china trade because they're worried about people like you criticizing them in public. for me, you can criticize me, i don't think. they're worried about the share prices getting hit. >> and they keep the prices up by keeping wages low in china. as long as it's bad for the people, it's good for the multi-nationals. nice to see you, "end of china's" the book. the reason you might not be
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lock your doors and find yourself some silver bullets. super moon coming into your life this weekend. this saturday around midnight, tomorrow, the moon will not only be a full moon but as close to the planet earth as it will get this entire year. the closest moon of the year a mere 222,000 miles out. think of it as a full moon on steroids. imax if you will. you know what that means? things about to get a little loony around the house and around town. and the words lunacy and lunatic come from the roman goddess luna. they believed our brains were affected by the tides. while it is true that a high tide might, in fact, be a bit higher this weekend and a low
tide will indeed be somewhat lower. but will those same forces of the water in our bodies cause people to run into the streets screaming wildly? not exactly. researchers claiming there is zero correlation, in fact, between full moons and human behavior. they say it is not true that hospitals see an uptick in patients. they say it is not true that crime goes up and, no, they say people never change into blood-thirsty animals to stalk unknowing victims. as such, the only werewolves and vampires this weekend will be on your television. coming up here, president obama trying to pump up his young base. we'll talk to an entrepreneur who is putting them to work in the way we know we can with start-ups. [ groans ] [ marge ] psst. constipated? phillips' caplets use magnesium, an ingredient that works more naturally with your colon than stimulant laxatives, for effective relief of constipation without cramps. thanks. good morning, students. today we're gonna continue...
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that's good morning, veggie style. hmmm. for half the calories plus veggie nutrition. could've had a v8. i'm trying to give back through programs like susan to help people learn how to build a great company, create more jobs. >> not the complex goal, but one that requires an awful lot of work. starting new businesses, and enrolling others in that culture in an effort to create jobs in this country. we met the ceo of a start-up on our 30 million jobs tour. you just heard him. well, a new report shows in 2010, start-ups as we've been discussing for some time were responsible for more than 2 million jobs while the private sector overall lost as many jobs
as mature businesses frequently make more money firing people than they do hiring them. new businesses must hire to have a chance. and john duffy knows that well and he's still hiring. why is it that new businesses are so much more inclined to hire and old businesses are inclined to fire? >> man, you know, it's about scale. right? we have an opportunity to grow a business, expand our margins. and you cannot build a great company without great people. you can maintain a business, right? it's very different to create one that requires talent and humans. >> when you hear the statistics, we talk about the foundation, these other places that say 2/3 of all new jobs or 3/4 of new jobs. does it surprise you that start-ups are where jobs are created? >> no, but i'll divide that a little bit. we have hired 50 people in our business in the past year. we build a platform that helps our consumers connect with our clients, right? on their mobile device. we hire great people that are already well employed.
so it's not 50 brand new jobs, right? we're creating an opportunity for people to join a really cool company. and they want that, right? what really excites me is career creation, right? hiring a recent college graduate, teaching them how to build a business, perform well, measure their performance and have fun along the way, create a career. >> so you said you've hired 50 people. are you still hiring? >> yes, we have 12 open positions right now. >> and do you believe -- how much of your prosperity right now and need to continue hiring is a function of being in the right business, which is expanding wireless, expanding wireless connectivity activity, and how much do you think is an economic indication? how much of it do you think is the very specific thing you're doing? >> it's a great question. we believe the people are everything. so we will not be successful if we don't continue to add great people to the team. we're in a big market. mobile communications, we're solving a painful problem. we're helping our clients connect with their consumers and vice versa. we have a good plan. good, successful entrepreneurs,
we know how to boot strap the business and create value for our shareholders. that's what running a great start-up is about. >> how much of that culture do you think is -- do you believe that culture is expanding or contracting? >> absolutely expanding. absolutely expanding. it's everywhere, you can get a masters degree in entrepreneurism at three universities in south florida. >> and for those who -- there there's -- some people feel very comfortable with this. other people, the thought of having to deal with starting a business and investing -- it's never going to happen. but their desire and ability to contribute is still substantial. they just don't want to have to -- just because you don't want to be the guy dealing with all this mess -- >> right. >> -- doesn't mean you don't want it to work.
how do you -- >> i think you're asking me do people just want to join a start-up? and i would say no, they want to join a good one. right? our company will recognize -- >> meaning a good idea. >> a good idea and a good team, right? good people attract good people. we're hiring the best and brightest and we're helping make them successful. best part of my day right now is working with the people that this is their first job and they've been employed less than a year. >> how much of your experience as a small business start-up entrepreneur understanding what you're describing to us and understanding how related that is to job creation, the culture of investment, available investment, small levels, $20,000, $30,000, $50,000, $200,000, $2 million, not $400 million, $4 billion, but these relatively low demand investments that create all sorts of possibility -- how much of that whole dynamic do you feel is represented in the national political debate in this country. by anybody? >> well, i think politicians by
their nature are not great entrepreneurs. and i don't know they're really qualified to talk about what it takes to start a business the way -- >> but they love to talk about jobs and love to talk about the innovative country and they are in charge of our money, our tax code, and our trade policy -- >> yes. >> which dictates everybody's access to money. so they are -- whether they're good at it or not, they are -- they having the biggest influence over our educational policies, health care policies, all of which affect entrepreneurs. >> when i got my first job, my manager told me that his responsibility was to put me in an environment to be successful. i think about politicians as they should do that same thing. create an ecosystem environment where i'm safe, where people get educated, we have access to health care and fire departments and all -- >> access to investment. >> yeah, right, a structure and ecosystem that allows me to do what i do and be successful and create jobs. >> and do you get the sense that that responsibility for that ecosystem is -- is it even
relevant -- >> right, i understand. >> i'm interested in whether you feel that what your expectations of the ecosystem in exchange for your tax money and the culture and whatever that is are being met and where the most acute benefitted deficiency might be. >> if i was a politician, i guess i'd be focused on the macro and that's where they belong. i live in the micro, right? i have to drive value today, make the right hiring decision today, i have to do the right work for my customer today. i'm very micro oriented, so our paths don't cross very often. what i'm doing is not necessarily affected day-to-day by the political environment. >> which is likely to your benefit. >> yeah, absolutely. >> pleasure. >> absolutely. thanks for having me. this is fantastic. >> thanks for coming back, john. he's hiring if you're looking in the wireless field. 3c interactive is the business. next coming up on "hardball," talking about the jobs numbers and billionaires buying
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toure turning the tables, thanks to the graciousness of dylan, and i want to explore where america's going and what's driving it there. and to get answers, i'm going to one of the smartest people i know, the aforementioned dylan ratigan. i want to talk about america and what's driving this country. let's talk about what's driving us back ward, what's being detrimental and what's driving us forward. what is the number one problem in america right now? >> you think i have the answer
to that question? >> i think you have an answer. >> oh, an answer. well, i would believe the number one problem in this country is that what i would call alpha power, those who have -- and disproportionate amount of influence because of their age, gender, social position -- >> money. >> money, happens on purpose, happens on accident. any society, any culture in the world, the egyptians, samurai, london, there's always some percentage of the population with disproportion of influence. if the purpose is to seek domination at all costs, which i believe is what our country has done with this culture. i'm rich, i'm powerful, get out of my way, i own this, i bought this. as long as that alpha power seeks to dominate at all costs which i believe is the current culture in this country. i believe you will always have these exploitation. >> is that america right now that we have a group of alpha men that want to control and dominate to the exclusion of
other people? >> look at the dark ages, you can go back through the history of mankind. alpha power almost always seeks dominance in every culture, which is why most cultures tend not to have a lot of equality, which is why america at its concept as a government a few years ago was a novel concept which is what do you say we try to balance that distorting influence with the constitution? >> so we've got a slew of problems, joblessness, gridlock -- >> symptommatic with decision making. >> symptommatic of the alpha attempt to dominate. >> right. >> what is the thing that's going to get america out of that? >> well, if you look at history, look at the -- in any situation, the one i like the most is if you look at the dark ages and there's two arguments. one, you can get people out of this dominant culture by either changing rules and changing money. if you -- people think that will
make everything better. the civil rights movement changed a lot of rules on race, but it doesn't ultimately change -- >> hearts. >> the way people treated people of different races. that along with the russian revolution when they went from the oligarchs to the communists. rich people still work with the government to screw everyone over. that makes me believe it's the mythology of the culture that dictates what happens. and if the mythology represents dominance at all cost, the culture is doomed. the way you fix it is switch the mythology of that power to nobility. >> so we have to get away from trying to be alpha men and get into more serving our community. >> no, because that's suggests there's a diminishment to your alpha state or alpha. alpha men, alpha women -- it's not a gender thing. alpha power exists in every culture of every society ever in the history of the world. doesn't matter. and the cultures where alpha power is expected to serve, john
kennedy represented -- >> an opportunity to do better. >> all those cultures will do better. any culture where alpha power seeks to dominate at all costs, those cultures will fail and we are trending in the wrong direction. >> well, one thing that's happening is a gender flip that more women are becoming heads of households, making more money, having more education -- >> wielding more alpha power. >> yeah, but they tend to wield alpha power differently in less of an attempt to dominate society the way that men do. so in a society where women are gaining economic power, class power, social power, are we still going to have that same alpha problem of alpha trying to dominate everything? >> i have no idea. >> is the alpha trying to share? >> i have no idea. i would argue that gender is irrelevant. that the only thing that matters for whether it dominates or is noble is the awareness of the individual. so if you have contracted awareness, deepak was here the other day talking about this.
if you have contracted awareness, you're in a fear state, i don't want to lose my stuff, then you're going to get dominating behavior in response for that. if you have expanded awareness which is that we have all of these new answers, new relationships, all these other people, i haven't even met who know things i don't know that can do things i don't know how to do that can teach me those things, that my relationship with the community when i have more of an expanded awareness is vastly more productive, vastly more healthy. and i actually think there are an increasingly large number of people on the planet earth who are more aware, have a more expanded awareness, and i believe that will continue over the next 100 years because we know more because we can learn more. >> the contracted awareness versus expanded awareness is your main thesis here that -- >> that's the switch. >> that being selfish and it's all about me and i have to protect me and my stuff is the most important -- is the most detrimental thing. and being a servant of the community -- >> being noble. i'm not suggesting you want to submit. i'm not trying to --
>> using your power to help other people rather than accumulate power. >> the question -- if the question of the powerful is how can i help, if they do that with enough humility to listen, you need food, you need school, you need this. i don't know what you need, but i know i might be able to help you. what do you need? and then if you listen, and if you engage the internet and engage not just the internet and networking in general. high visibility, high-integrity networks with the confidence how to ask how to help. and with the caution to not be too arrogant about it. i think that's the whole country -- >> as we talked about the lack of civility in the country is making it hard to have the expanded awareness. let me do one more thing. one more thing, throw it to chris matthews, "hardball" is up right now. not enough jobs, let's play "hardball."