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tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  May 11, 2012 2:00am-3:00am EDT

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i'm chris matthews in washington leading off the pursuit of happiness. the declaration of independence says we're endowed by our creator of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. republican strategist mark mckinnon points out that the pursuit of happiness was exactly what president obama was protecting yesterday when he came out for gay marriage. surely those are fighting words. not everyone agrees. tonight, tony perkins is a researcher that says why he thinks president obama got it all wrong. also, is gay marriage ultimately going to the supreme court? plus a story that's getting a lot of attention. it's about bullying, and a program that mitt romney took part in when he was in boarding school. romney said he apologized but said he didn't remember.
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a man who is likely to become maine's new senator may become the most important person in the senate. why? because he's an independent and the right he chooses could give chances to someone. we have barney frank and tony perkins. tony, thanks for coming on and you've been on many times before. let me read something you said recently. you were asked about this. what would you say if one of your kids said that he was gay? and you said, i doubt that would happen with my children as we are teaching them the right way that they are to interact as human beings. well, what do you mean by that? if your kid is gay, he's gay, right? what would you have to do with whether he's gay or not? >> when you look at the social science research, there is not conclusive evidence that this is genetic or biological.
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it is a complex mix of environmental factors. and when you can control many of those environmental factors, you can teach your kids certain ways, you can protect them from certain experiences and certain things that could happen to them that could lead them down a certain path. >> so parents decide, by the way they raise kids -- >> it is a major fact. what else they suggest is environment that drives a lot of this. not a choice, i said environment. >> that clashes with a lot of thinking. congressman frank, what do you make of that statement? >> let me come to dick cheney's defense here, chris. according to mr. perkins, it's dick cheney's fault that his daughter was a lesbian. first of all, i don't think there's anything wrong with it, and secondly, the notion that cheney parented in an inferior way to mr. perkins is an absurdity. i don't think mr. cheney taught his daughter to act improperly and she became a lesbian.
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i know of no such evidence that the parents have an effect one way or another. i don't know anybody for whom their sexual orientation wasn't involuntary, whether people are straight or gay, but there are a lot of conservative people who have had gay and lesbian children, and for mr. perkins to be blaming the parents, the cheneys, for example, for having a lesbian daughter is another absurdity. >> i never blamed anyone or accused anyone -- >> but you said the way you parent determines your child. >> i said the parents can control a lot of those environmental factors. barney is the one who said it was a problem. >> he's just backing up what he said. he said he taught his children how to interact properly. he's the one that said it's improper. he backs away from what he says. he's on tv now, and he wants to look for civil.
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he clearly said "improperly direct." >> we're going to go back and show what you said. the question was, what would you do if one of your children came to you and said they were gay? here's what you said, it's on tape. let's watch and listen. >> i doubt that would happen with my children as we are teaching them the right ways that they are to interact as human beings. >> so even though there is a number of people who have become gay or believe they're gay from a very early age, you believe it wouldn't happen with you because of what you what? what do you do to make sure anyone would doubt your kid was gay? that is an enormous power you have. >> people have tremendous power in the direction their children go, in what's appropriate, what's not appropriate. i teach my children from the scripture, i teach them biblical
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stories of morality. >> are you saying if you were barney's father, he wouldn't be gay? >> no, i'm not saying that. barney is a lot older than i am. >> i apologize. he said it wasn't right. he said his children would be gay because he would teach them the right way to interact. that would be the wrong way. he also said he would teach them right from wrong. so he clearly was saying that being gay was the wrong way, and once again, apparently the cheneys aren't as smart or biblical or morally righteous as he is, and i think that's nonsense. >> let's go to someone else because this is going -- i'm convinced this is going to get he also said he would teach him right from wrong.
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he clearly was saying that being gay was the wrongs way, and once again, the cheneys are not as smart or biblical or as morally righteous as he is and i think that's nonsense. >> let's listen to somebody else because this is going to be -- i'm convinced this is going to get into the religious area as things go on. here's franklin graham. by the way, the only reason we pay attention to this is a releases this statement. he had a strong reaction to the president's comment about same-sex marriage. >> in changing his position from that of senator/candidate obama, president obama has, in my view, it grieves me that our president should now affirm same-sex marriage, though i believe it grieves god even more. the institution of marriage should not be defined by presidents or polls, governors when we tinker with public policy as it pertains to
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marriage, there are outcomes for that. we've ended up with more children without fathers. that's had consequences from an economic standpoint for our society. so when we talk about the policy aspects of this, it affects children. the reason -- >> so changing the definition of marriage is a bad thing in itself? >> it is. >> what do you think of the mormon religion changing its definition? >> what did it change to? >> it changed from polygamy to monogamy. you just said changing the rules of marriage is bad in itself. >> yeah, they had to change the rules to become a state because -- >> go ahead, your thoughts, mr. frank. >> well, first of all, he says god decided. as i have read in the bible, the old testament, marriage was a contract between one man and one
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now, he kied out the second wife and her child. there was polygamy in the bible, the notion of one man and one woman was not only what god said. secondly, mr. perkins said it has social consequences. no, it does not. there would be a problem for the republican party taking any. but the point is this, we have had same-sex marriage since 2004 in a number of states. many millions of americans and none of the negative consequences people like mr. perkins said have come true. there's been no higher divorce rate.
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again, it is illogical. the notion that because two women are in love it's going to undermine the marriage of a man and woman in love makes no sense. there's been no negative evidence. there hasn't been any. >> okay. let's switch to the new testament for a minute. more familiar territory for you and a lot of our audience. let me ask you this. i am struck, as a straight guy, with these wonderful relationships that have come out. people have been together for 20, 30, 40 years. women, when they come out, they seem like their the most familiar people in the world. they're the most familial people. men come out, share everything together for 20 or 30 years -- you can call that a sin if you want but what do we do when they ask society for recognition? all they want is the love of society and acceptance.
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she says all i want before i die is for society to recognize our love. why is that wrong for them to ask for that? is it wrong for them to ask for it? >> why has society recognized marriage? >> there are many purposes? >> and they are? >> one of the marriages may be gay marriage, different kinds of marriage. >> it's been the place where children are created and then raised in the next generation and what we're talking about here is we make policy based upon the rule, not the exception. you can pick any anecdotal situation, one relationship, this relationship. that's not how we make policy. we make policy based on what is best for society as a whole. the evidence is overwhelming that children do best with a mom and a dad. >> a marriage is not just spawning. it's not just having kids. it's staying together. it's forming a family, forming a family is what we're talking
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about here and honoring a family. if a family -- your thoughts, congressman. you're on. >> again, mr. perkins makes little sense. nothing about letting me marry jim is going to interfere with anybody else's ability and right to have children. first of all, of course, many marriages don't produce children. >> right. >> people beyond the age to have children marry people who are infertile. >> it is the rule. >> yes, but it's one thing to say it's a rule, mr. perkins and another to say it's the purpose. >> i'm saying it's the rule. >> please don't interrupt me. then you back away and that was the purpose of marriage. there were a number of purposes, including promoting love of two people to be together and have somebody to be with when they get older. if letting two men marry has no negative effect and by the way
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-- >> that's not true. >> how do two men getting married affect other people from getting married? if you want to ban adoption by anybody besides a married couple would be terrible for children. >> a new story. congressman, here's something that -- >> everyone knows that if you ban -- if you say adoption only happens with married couples, a lot of children will not get adopted and they will be worse off. >> if we were talking about marriage that would be one thing. but when you change the definition of marriage, the law is an instructor. what we end up finding out is that religious organizations are impacted. >> let me go to adoption. first of all, i think you have to answer the question whether people are infer tile or too old to have children should get married. if your reason the only reason to get merited is to have
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children -- governor romney -- i don't know if you know this congressman frank, has said he doesn't have a problem with states allowing gay couples to adopt children. where are you on that? are you with romney or not? >> no, i am not with romney. >> again, kids do best with a mom and with a dad. >> we as a society take action which we believe strengthens the nation. i happen to believe that the best setting for raising a child is where there's the opportunity for a mom and a dad to be in the home. i know there are many circumstances where that's not possible, through death or divorce. i also know many gay couples are able to adopt children. that's fine. but my preference is that we
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encourage the marriage of a man and a woman and we continue to define marriage as a relationship between a man and a woman. >> congressman, he says it's okay for gay couples, that's fine, he said it there, to have kids. but then they can't get married. that's a strange thing. >> congressman, respond. >> what he says does not mean -- you can believe everything he said and you don't ban marriage. you can encourage but not ban it. even if you believe it's best for a child to be adopted by a married couple, everybody who deals with adoption understands there are not enough married couples, particularly those that have children already, to adopt the children who need adoption. so the choice in most cases is not whether a child is adopted by a man and a woman living as husband and wife but adopted at all. the number of people adopting children born with aids because of the misdeeds of their parents, there was no married couple ready to adopt them. mr. perkins would condemn them to never having loving parents
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because -- >> that's not true. that's absolutely not true. look -- >> i need a news fact here. are you on the side of the governor -- >> children need a mom and a dad. the fact is, there is not an excess of children waiting to be adopted. that's why most people are going out of the country to adopt. >> that's not true. >> yes, it is. the only area where there are children waiting to be adopted are special needs children. most parents are having to go out of the country to adopt. >> mr. perkins, unlike you i don't discount special needs children. >> i don't either. >> you just said, there are only special needs children and children with aids and loving gay couples adopt children who had these problems who couldn't be adopted by other people. >> if we made our adoption laws easier for people to adopt in this country, we'd see a lot more adoption here. >> interesting development.
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congressman frank, please come back again and again. congressman frank and governor romney agree on the goodness of gay couples being allowed to adopt. and you are out on that one. you don't fit with them on that? >> i am for kids getting a mom and a dad. >> but you're not -- to use the governor's words, you're not fine with gay couples adopting? >> no, i'm not. >> interesting you line up opposed to the governor and barney frank is with the governor on this one. coming up, is gay marriage headed to the supreme court? the solicitor general thinks it is and he's coming here in a minute. this is hot and it's "hardball," a place for politics. ♪ [ female announcer ] gross -- i'll tell you what's really gross: used dishcloths. they can have a history that they drag around with them. for a cleaner way to clean try bounty extra soft.
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in this lab demo, one sheet of bounty extra soft leaves this surface 3 times cleaner than a dishcloth. it's super durable too. it's the cleaner way to clean. bring it with bounty extra soft. in the pink pack. and try bounty napkins. new poll numbers and what may be the biggest battlegrounds of the presidential race. let's check the hardball scoreboard. we start in ohio where obama is
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in a tight race with romney. obama 45, romney, 44. senator portman, his running made, it's a tie. obama/biden, 45. that gives them a point. maybe enough. florida, a new suffolk poll has obama at 46 and romney, 45. look at how ahead romney gets if he puts rubio on the ticket. 47. we'll be right back.
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back to "hardball." debate over gay marriage is being played out at the state level, but could this wind up in the supreme court, and what did obama's comments do yesterday to increase those arguments? now with his one-time opponent, david boyce in the bush versus gore fight.
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edward lawson is also an attorney who founded the president's group freedom to marry. let me show you both what the president said in that abc interview about gay marriage today being a state issue. that's what the president says. let's watch him. >> i continue to believe that this is an issue that is going to be worked out at the local level because historically this has not been a federal issue. >> as president, it's not being worked out on the state level. we saw that tuesday in north carolina, the 30th straight, to ban gay marriage. >> what i'm saying is different states are coming to different conclusions. i think it's important to recognize that folks who feel very strongly that marriage should be defined narrowly as between a man and a woman, many of them are not coming at it from a mean-spirited perspective. a bunch of them are friends of mine. >> thank you. we also have evan walsh. it seems there are three ways we
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could a equality of marriage. the supreme court could rule equality as a right, we could have them decide individually, or it could be done by the voters, which they don't seem to want to do. your thoughts, ted? what is the most likely and most expeditious way to get marriage equality? >> when you put constitutional rights to a vote, the minorities lose those battles. that's what's been happening state after state -- >> 30-some states. >> yes, in a row. i heard the previous segment, we were talking about 40 years ago. 40 years ago in 14 states, it was against the law for interracial people, the president struck that down 9-0. many other states, there was a change in the definition of marriage to allow, by the supreme court, to allow persons to marry someone of another race.
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the president's mother and father couldn't have been married in virginia without going to jail because they would have been convicted of a felon in 1977. the president has said 14 times that marriage is a if you understand rental right. it's a right of privacy, it's a matter of liberty, it's a matter of spirituality. it isn't for the purpose of appropriation. it's never been a condition by any state that you had to be able to appropriate to engage in marriage. we have a constitutional right. people in prison have a constitutional right to get married. >> when you're litigating this, you're hoping the supreme court will rule on this. >> a state-by-state basis, how does that help people in alabama? >> you could go by legislation. let me go to evan.
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there are three ways to do this, the states could rule it's a right, the supreme court could make the decision, or voters could make the decision. what do you think should be done, evan? >> well, ted is exactly right, that the constitution affords every american the freedom to marry, and that's the same freedom gay people are invoking, the same as marriage in the past invoked it. but the president is right, that the way we get through is through a patchwork of struggles. some states get there faster, other states fight it, they debate, and it takes the court to encourage it. >> what do you think it will take for this country to vote on equality? >> if we do our work in the next 10 to 20 to 50 years ago.
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ted, who spoke passionately as a president and an american, and thanks to president obama. >> let me ask you about the politics of this. if this becomes a partisan, romney voted against it. if this goes into the ballot box in november, will that advance the cause of state-by-state action or delay it? evan. >> there is going to be state-by-state action also on the ballot. >> this debate we're having between the two presidential candidates? it's expedite when you hope to be the ten years of quality.
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>> that includes the president so powerfully yesterday. that's how we're moving hearts and minds and it's on the ballot in four states in november, and they're all moving forward and it's the interplay that's going to get them there. >> what's your sense in this case? i'm all for you guys, i think it's. what do you think the president's beneficial statement will do? >> i think what the president did was very, very helpful. and he was good to do it. that was something that was very important. the way he said it was very impressive, talking about his family, talking about his daughters, talking about loving couples he books. i think the more people talk about how these polls have shifted.
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equality marriage for same sex what i have found and what david boyce has found, the more we talk about this, the more we realize it's our friends. we want to live together to make a building block out of society with experts talking about the raising of children, children do just as well in same-sex relationships, in same-sex households as they do in a man and a woman household. in some cases much better. the quality of the parenting depends on the quality of the heart of the two parents, not their sexual orientation or identity. the more we talk about this issue, the more people will understand that it's terribly unfair and discriminatory to
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deny happiness and stability to same-sex couples. >> we all have to be reminded in our civics, evan, i think he know it well, if we're not going to get a large quantity by people voting, because people don't vote for rights, as you pointed out. you have to do it through politicians doing it. you're hopeful -- just to bottom line this -- do you believe the politicians of this country will act gradually but inevitably for marriage equality? >> oh, i think it's the interplay and interaction between the people who are going to get us there. they got it wrong before they got it right. i said we need to continue moving more states and moving on. >> ted, david who fought each other over the bush-gore, we're hoping this will be right. thank you, sir, for coming on.
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>> thank you. on sunday, i'll be on "meet the press" with david gregory. this is "hardball," the place for politics. this is delicious okay... is this where we're at now? we just eat whatever tastes good? like these sweet honey clusters... actually there's a half a day's worth of fiber in every ... why stop at cereal? bring on the pork chops and the hot fudge. fantastic.
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the report in today's "washington post" recounts a cruel episode mitt romney took part in during his boarding school days. according to "the washington post" story today, romney picked on a kid, a fellow student who was soft-spoken and was presumed homosexual.
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well, "the washington post" reports romney took offense to the student's looks and led a group of prep school boys, a posse, if you will, to pin him down and forcefully cut his hair as the student cried and screamed for help. romney says he can't remember doing that. the victim clearly did. political analyst and writer of the huffington post media group, and political reporter of the "washington post" which broke this story today. nia, what can you give us in the context? there were five witnesses to it and to deny remembering it, that's the most cruel part. how many people's hair did he cut when he was in school? how many escapades was he involved in that he can't remember this one. it doesn't seem right that he can't remember.
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>> he gave an interview on fox news about an hour ago where he says he can't remember it, but essentially this is the report that's out there and he didn't push back against it, sort of admitting that it happened. but, you're right, this is a campaign that has tried to finesse this all day and i asked them for -- if they had any surrogates to push back against this and they have been trying to find his friends all day to say this didn't happen or mitt romney was really a great guy in high school and just a couple of minutes ago -- >> he didn't cut my hair? is that the defense? he's okay? >> they said to imply that he was a bully is absurd. he was clownish but never mean. this incident certainly does speak to something of a mean streak that he had and you have seen his wife come out and talk about this. you know, he likes to prank and joke around and he's full of jinx and she probably won't say that going forward because this story sort of reveals an uglier
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side. >> for anybody that's got kids, anybody that's been a kid, you know that there are bullies on campus. if he's one of them, he's going to answer to them. on fox an hour ago, this is romney. let's watch. >> well, first of all, i had no idea what that individual's sexual orientation might be. going back to the 1960s, that wasn't something that we all discussed or considered. so that's simply just not accurate. i don't recall the incident myself but i've seen the reports and i'm not going to argue with that. there's no question but that i did some stupid things when i was in high school and obviously if i hurt anyone by virtue of that and sincerely apologize for it. >> doesn't pass the smell test that he can't remember it, howard. it was a bully streak, i got over it, i was cruel, we were tougher on gay kids than we
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should have been, anything that he would have said could have been believable but leading a group to do it, cutting his hair, having him cry and scream for help and not remember doing it? >> well, chris, one reason i'm highly skeptical is i know the school. i know people have been there. it's cranbrook school, it's a very small and nurturing private schools in the country, very highly regarded. something like this happens, it's something that everybody who participated is going to remember and everybody at the school is going to know about. >> this is what you write novels about. >> absolutely. it's a searing thing for everybody. it doesn't pass the smell test. but my take on this is, that mitt romney in a way has to be careful because his whole campaign in the primary was about attack. it wasn't about him. it was about attacking the other people. he's been somewhat receipt sent reticent to talk about his story, doesn't want to talk about the mormon years, et cetera.
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to some extent he's an empty canvas. while it may seem absurd, what he was like at 16 years old to dominate the news, the fact is, more stories like this are going to come out unless he says more about himself. >> update within the last week, richard grinnell was, a gay fellow on his staff he picked out himself, was drummed out of the campaign. he didn't fight to keep him. he could have called the guy and said, i need you and want to keep you. all he had to do was stand up to the creeps leading the campaign. just like in high school, he had the chance to lead. in this case he could have stood up to the bad guys, and he won't do it. here's some news, by the way, on the top story. the vice president's office confirms that joe biden apologized to the president's office by coming out about gay marriage before the president did.
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the conversation took place just before the president's interview with abc news. so there you have a guy acting on his heart causatively getting into a little trouble at the oval office. that's not a big story to me. nia, the story how do you report anything but the candidate for president is afraid of some little white wing preacher from texas somewhere and rather than back his guy, backs the creep out of texas and says you're off the campaign because i can't take the heat for you, brother. >> well, you know, their story is that they very much wanted him to stay, that on the one hand they felt like he should sort of lay low while a lot of this conversation about his sexuality and about these tweets was going down, but they essentially wanted him to say -- i think one of the challenges mitt romney had is he has to fill in the blank of who he is. to do that now, to make people think of him in a certain way, as a prep school kid, as someone
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who is out of touch with normal folks, and he's got to rush to figure out how he's going to present himself. for low information voters, this is the story i think that could really stick around and damage him early on. he's got to try to figure out how to frame himself as a compassionate conservative. >> chris, there's been no soul sister moment on this with mitt >> but it's so easy. he could have stood up to grinnell and been a hero to everybody. it's so easy. >> yes, absolutely. >> he's a conservative, he believes in my foreign policy, i need him, get out of my face. >> i think the measure of the fact that mitt romney is still very tentative and very unsure about his support on the right. >> i think you're so right, howard. nia, thank you for your report. a lot of backup, a lot of reporting there. up next, the man that could end up being the most important member of the united states senate remains angus king. how would you like to have a name like angus king.
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citizenship since she married her husband back in '78. this afternoon she wrote, quote, i wrote a letter requesting withdrawal of my dual citizenship and i took this action because i want to make it perfectly clear, i was born in america and i am a proud american and i maintain committed to the united states constitution. why did she get so bombastic? i'll be right back.
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welcome back to "hardball." an independent candidate leaving the seat to vacated by olympia snowe could become one of the most powerful people in washington.
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right now democrats control the u.s. senate, 53/47. but power could shift in november. seven democratic held seats and three republican held seats are considered toss-ups. and the cook political report puts the gop chance of picking up enough seat to gain a majority at even. well, enter independent candidate angus king. if king wins up in maine, he's got a big decision. welcome, mr. king. you remind me of neru back in the cold war. how do you become -- suppose you wanted to remain an independent, and i mean a complete independent, would you have a seat in the middle aisle and have a chair right there in the aisle? have you ever thought of that as a possibility? >> this is sort of uncharted territory, chris. and what i want to do is remain independent, as independent as i possibly can, for as long as i possibly can. and there's all this business about caucuses and senate rules and parliamentary procedures.
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so it really is something we'll have to figure out. but to the extent i can just call them as i see them on the behalf of the people of maine, that's the direction i want to go in. >> do you think it should be the case that you have to join one of the two major political parties in order to get a committee assignment? >> i don't think so. you know, i carry the constitution around on my iphone. i've got a great app called the usa manual. if you read the constitution, article one talks about congress. the word "caucus" doesn't appear anywhere and neither does the word "party." and i don't see how you can necessarily exclude a dually elected united states senator from maine or anywhere else because they refuse to join one of the other of the party caucuses. i've got to tell you, chris, this is what i think is a big part of the problem with the country, there's more fighting and bickering and blaming than anything else, and the problems of the country, and there are
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significant ones, they just aren't being dealt with. congress is absolutely not working. and until you make the constitution work, that the framers gave us to solve our problems, you're never going to get to the solution to the problems. and it didn't always have to be that. >> i'm a student of the senate, why don't you do something really remarkable. why don't you hold on to that can independence for as long as you can, in other words, forever. go to the united states senate, hope you're the 50th vote for either side, and you simply say, if it works out that way, you can be with the one that the vice president decides things. you'll say, i'm going to stay here in the senate, and when i agree with the majority on this issue, i'll be be with them, and when i don't, i'll be opposed to them. i'll be the decisive vote. i'm staying in the middle aisle i want a seat right in the middle aisle. i refuse to buy any committee assignment. i'm not going to take ranking on any committee or chairmanship. i'll sit here in the middle and decide all the key votes. why don't you do that? >> that is absolutely an option. that is one of the options i'm
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consider. but on the other hand, chris. i don't want to go down just to stand on principle and then be a potted plant. i'm representing the people of maine. >> but you could be the decisive vote on everything. >> well, and if i can be effective on behalf of maine, if i'm fortunate enough to be sent down there, that's absolutely an option. and i'm -- you know, i'm going to look at all of those options, and look at, you know, the parliamentary rules and whether they can constitutionally deny me a committee seat. >> let me do some pandering now, because it's appropriate pandering. i love maine. i worked for senator muskie for three years and i think he's one of the greatest legislators ever. he did clean water, clean air, budget reform, so many good things. and there's something about maine that liked him. what is about maine that likes people for the middle, like olympia snowe, like susan collins, like you. why does maine not come down on the democratic side, but you're somewhere out there in the flinty down east attitude of independents and libertarianism, and the fact that you guys up there on the republican side
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just voted for ron paul for president. what is it about maine? >> it's cultural and practical. who founded maine, fishermen, forresters. those are all solitary pursuits. people who worked together, but they didn't have to rely very much on someone else doing something for them. flinty is a good word. it goes back further. you mentioned senator muskie, one of the greatest senators of the 20th century, but margaret chase smith, a wonderful republican senator from maine. but she was always very independent. nobody knew how she was going to vote until they got to the ss in the alphabet. and she was never a favorite of the good old boys -- >> who are you voting for, for president? >> i'm going to vote for obama. i disagree with him on a lot of matters, i've thought a lot about it. but i think given the hand that he was dealt, he's done a pretty
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good job, and i'm -- you know, you've got to the make a choice. and i've never yet been presented with the perfect candidate. so that's the decision i've made. >> if you have a sudden evolution overnight and join one of the political parties, come on "hardball" and tell us about that. angus king, front runner for senator for maine. when we return, let me finish with the history president obama continues to make.
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let me finish tonight with. barack obama's a man of history. his very life has been an event, his meeting of an american woman from kansas with a student from kenya. his success as leading up to editor of the harvard law review is eventful, extraordinary, really, as he put it in that great speech in boston eight years ago, only in this country is my story possible. he's been our president now for 3 1/2 years and we're already used to something that is extraordinary, an african-american president in the white house. and yesterday he did it again, becoming the president that declared himself for same-sex marriage. years, decades from now, they will not be talking about the circumstances, merely the extraordinary fact. no one else had ever done it. he did it, he, barack obama. and so we move on, perhaps to more history. one thing i've come to believe and it is political in nature, this is what barack obama needs to be doing, making history. the moment he becomes just another president, maintaining the way things are, he will lose himself, his historic himself.
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he is, a much a captive of history as a captor. he needs to be making history over and over again. because if he stops, he stops being what he can be. and the american people surely know it. just think of this, before you think of the politics, if you're black in this country, you know that a black man can be president, because one is. and if you're gay, you know that america at its most idealistic stands for your right to love, because an american president has now declared as much. we live in a powerful time, and as long as barack obama's at the helm, it will continue to be. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "the ed show" with ed schultz starts right now. good evening, americans, and welcome to "the ed show," tonight from new york. mitt romney is facing heat over his days as a prep school bully. tonight, we'll show you how president obama is helping bullied kids. this is "the ed show." let's get to work. >> i did some stupid things when i was in high school. i had no idea what that individual's sexual orientation might be.

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