tv The Ed Show MSNBC June 27, 2012 3:00am-4:00am EDT
>> the president has our back, so it's time to let him know we have his. >> good to have you with us tonight. thanks for watching. tonight, i'm going to start with the focus on the middle of the country, not the east or the west coast. but the middle of the country because last night on this program, i said that we are losing america. well, you need an explanation to that. we really losing america ed? tonight, i'm going to show you exactly why i think we are in serious trouble moving forward in this country. when the supreme court made yet another ruling to let unlimited corporate money influence elections, you might be wondering, okay, who benefits? well, i'll show you who benefits. harold hamm. there's harold right there. looks like a regular guy. looks like he is a regular american. middle of the country kind of guy. he is, he's from oklahoma. doing a lot of work in the dakotas and montana right now. you might not know who harold hamm is because he's not a media figure, and he's not in the news all the time.
but i can guarantee you, mitt romney is tell you exact lee who harold hamm is. >> met a guy named harold hamm. harold hamm is a truck driver for ten years. saves his money driving trucks, to get a college degree. goes back toollege. gets a college degree. takes geology as a subject. happened to lose across the country and i said i bet there's energy, oil, and gas in the hills of north dakota. he went up there and started drilling holes. now it's estimated in this range, there are about 20 billion barrels of oil. harold is doing just fine, by the way. >> oh, yeah, harold hamm is doing quite well for himself. mitt romney makes it sound like harold hamm was some random truck driver who he bumped into on the campaign trail. in fact, he's the 36th richest man in america. he has a net worth of more than $11 billion. good for him. that's according to forbes magazine, by the way. but here's the most important
thing that mitt romney did not mention about harold hamm. you see on march 1st, good old harold was named energy adviser to the romney campaign. just one month later, harold hamm became a mega donor to the pro romney super pac, restore our future. that's right. interesting turn of events. thanks to citizens united, harold hamm was able to give $985,000 to the cause of defeating president obama. now, i haven't seen harold hamm talk in public. but i have a few friends up on the prairie that says they have told me he's just a barn burner when he goes to the podium railing on president obama. i wonder why. obama has been pretty good to him. harold hamm's million dollars has put him into a pretty good position, don't you think? two weeks ago, he was on capitol hill advocating for oil and gas company tax breaks. >> i'll be speaking on my own behalf, not as representative of
resources, nor am i here on behalf of the romney campaign, for which i serve as an energy adviser. >> it's funny how hamm can say she's speaking for himself when his interests match up directly with the romney campaign and interests of the energy company in which he is the ceo. >> harold hamm, this is what it's all about. this is the balkan shale. they discovered all this in the dakotas and it goes to montana. you see these corporate interests are going to start affecting elections in this state. they are pumping more oil here than anywhere else in the country except texas. and they have found some more oil that goes down here along the north dakota/south dakota border, and they think that could be even bigger thanl the bakken shale. it's where harold hamm is making, i don't know, millions, billions, drilling oil, fracking.
business week called him the man who bought north dakota. i didn't know that there was somebody out there buying a state, did you? now, harold hamm wants to make billions more by fracking for natural gas in this area. did you know that his company is one of the largest fracking companies in america? earlier this year, the obama administration, you know what they did? they tite tightened regulations on oil and gas industries requiring drillers to capture emissions of certain air pollutants. seems reasonable, doesn't it? harold hamm only cares about making more money. he didn't like that. >> a lot of the things the obama administration has done haven't been helpful to our industry. there are a lot of obstacles. our energy policy in america today is one of energy deprivation. how little energy we can use. that's what third world countries, what the poor countries do. >> my god, i didn't realize that harold hamm was living in a
third world country, did you? he's got it so rough right now, he can't live without the bush tax cuts again. to harold hamm, president obama is the guy standing in the way of him moving up on the forbes 400 list. you see, hamm could get to the top ten if he could just get around all these environmental regulations that the obama administration is throwing out there. of course, there obama administration, we should probably point out, has enforced fewer regulations than the bush administration. president obama has approved 613 new rules. president bush approved 643 in his first three years. these facts don't matter to guys like harold hamm because citizens united opened the door for billionaires like him to affect politics at every level of government. yes, in montana and north dakota. now, this is what former massy energy ceo don blankenchip did. i'm going to give you an example.
the coal guy, that's him. blankenship, he spent $3 million back in 2004 to defeat a west virginia supreme court justice. yeah, montana governor brian swieter warned us about this on "the ed show" last night when they struck down a 100 year law. they were taking away the people's ability to protect themselves from the rich and the powerful in the corporate interests. >> over 100 years ago, it was two copper kings who owns mont. they were both guzl airs and they owned all of the politics in montana. they owned every one of the legislatures. when they sent the senator to washington, d.c., he bribed his way in and they couldn't seat him. >> could history be repeating itself. let's look at north dakota and montana one more time. i wonder if they have any judges out there. i wondfer they have any county commissioners.
i wanter if they have anybody on the local level that might take some of that citizens united money so they could win. and they might know where the money is coming from and they might give a favorable vote to those who just want to gut the environment and go do whatever the hell they want to do and don't have anybody stop them, and oh, by the way, this crowd that's doing all that, they want the taxes lowered in north dakota, too. they think they're paying too much for this oil extraction tax. 100 years ago, laws were presented to prevent our laws from being corrupted. today, they're being struck down by a right wing court to sell our politics to the highest bidder. president obama ocknowledged this today. >> you're going to have more money spent in this election than ever before. by the other side on negative ads. and because times are tough and
because they're spending these ungodly sums, it's going to be close. >> ungodly sums. and the campaign e-mails its supporters today, the president wrote, we can be outspent and still win, but we can't be outspent 10 to 1 and still win. it sounds like i'm exaggerating when i say our democracy is at stake, but it really is. just look at some dictionary definitions and tell me if you agree with me. oligarchy, it's a government in which all power is vested in a few persons or a dominant class. could there be an oligarchy on a local level. oh, yes wrrk plutocracy, here is the choice in this election. i think we really want to be here, don't we? democracy? when we could easily fall down to here and here depending on
what part of the country you're coming from. there's only one way to reverse this. we need to break the right wing strangle hold on the supreme court. nothing, nothing will change unless this court right here is shaken up and progressives have fair-minded people sitting on this court and not idelogs. we're going to find out on thursday with the health care debate if this guy right here, chief justice roberts is an idelog or not. there's a few surveys i'll show you with to show you how right wing the court is. i spoke with ej dionne's class at georgetown and told them i thought geor bush was one of the best conservative presidents this country ever had, that's right, george w. bush because he gave two rounds of tax cuts to the wealthiest americans and put two idelogs on the supreme court which turned the court to where we are today, and we not only
have citizens united on a national level, but all the way down to the state level where they're going to go to montana and said for 100 years you screwed it up and it's going to open up the doors for guys like harold hamm to go in and cash whip judges the way that blankenship dude did in west virginia. when i said i thought we lost a piece of america and democracy is being threatened, this is what i'm talking about. get your cell phones out. want to know what you think. tonight's question, does the citizens united decision mean the end of democracy in america. text a for yes, text b for no. you can go to our blog. we'll bring you the results later in the show. joining me tonight is senator bernie sanders of vermont. senator, you have the floor. what is the scariest thing about what i have just said about citizens united at the local
level? >> you know what the scariest thing is? you're right, ed. i think people back home are thinking, well, he's exaggerating. throwing around words like oligarchy, throwing around words like plutocracy, but that's what's happening now. two trends, number one, in ter of distribution of wealth and income, you have a situation now where the top 1% owns 40% of the wealth. the bottom 60% owns 2% of the wealth. and the gap between the very, very rich d everybody else is growing wider. you got the walton family of walmart alone owning more wealth than the bottom 30% of americans. that's one trend. rich are getting richer. everybody else is getting poorer. now with the citizens united decision, what the supreme court said to all of these billionaires, go for it.
you're tired of buying coal companies and gambling casinos. you know what you can buy now? you can buy the united states government. so if you are the koch brothers and you're worth $50 billion, you're sheldon adelson, you're worth $20 billion plus, why would you hesitate one minute to spend $1 billion, $2 billion. that's pretty good. you could own the government, various states, county commissioners, you could own governors. pretty good deal. so that's where we're heading right now. now, immediately, what we have got to do is we have got to do everything we can to overturn this disastrous citizens united decision. some of us have brought forth constitutional amendments, short-term, and i think within the next couple weeks, we're going to bring legislation to the floor of the senate called the disclose act. disclose act does two things. number one, if you're putting money into campaigns, you got to
tell the world immediately who you are. no more anonymity. number two, perhaps equally important, you want to put ads on television, you're going to have to have your pretty face right up there on the tv screen if you're the ceo of the corporation doing the advertising and you have to say i approve this message. >> you think republicans will go along with that, senator? >> no, i don't. i talked to republicans, ed, and in their hearts, some of them know that this is what is happening now is outrageous. but what they also know is it's working to their advantage. >> how can somebody like harold hamm be a major donor and openly serve as an adviser on energy policy, and how can this not be a signal to the american people that if romney gets elected, it's going to be guys like this that are going to be calling the shots? >> absolutely. and it's hamm and it's energy. it is the koch brothers and energy. what do these guys want? you know what really gets me,
ed, you know, if you were a billionaire, you know, how much more do you need? these guys are worth billions of dollars. >> they claim they're going to take this wealth and create jobs. we haven't seen that. what they're going to do is buy more government to make sure they can concentrate the wealth and make sure they can have america exactly the way they want it. that's what i believe and i don't have any reason not to believe that the way things are going. i want to ask you, will mitt romney have to pay the mega donors back if he's president? >> of course, he will. but it's not even paying them back. that's who he is. what does romney talk about? he talks about to wall street, he's going to deregulate wall street, the entity that caused this horrendous recession in which so many people are suffering. he's talking about more tax breaks for the wealthiest people in this country. at a time when we have lost millions of decent paying jobs because of outsourcing, mr. romney will take his outsourcing
experience and make it even more prevalent. so it's not that he will give them what they want. they're in the same boat together. they believe the same thing. more for the rich, and less for the middle class and working families. and by the way, ed, these guys if they get the power to do it, they're going to go after social security, medicare, medicaid, educational students. they are working day and night to create the oligarchy you talked about. >> they're going to run the table, they' going to get the new deal if this keeps up. vermont senator bernie sanders, great to have you with us. thank you, bernie. remember to answer tonight's question at the bottom of the screen. share you thoughts on twitter. we want to know what you think. >> congressman darrell issa is on the war path again, sending a letter to president obama suggesting a cover up on fast and furious just one day after he told fox news that there was no cover up. sam stein with me for the information and the discussion next. stay with us.
administration's part in fast and furious. sam stein joins me next. >> and marc anthony joins me to discuss the impact of the latino vote this november. and why he's supporting president obama. share your thoughts on twitter. we're coming right back. [ female announcer ] so how long have you been living flake-free with head & shoulders? since before jeans were this skinny... since us three got a haircut. since my first twenty-ninth birthday. [ female announcer ] head & shoulders. live flake free.
has a facebook page these days. but where's the relationship status? well, esurance is now in a relationship...with allstate. and it looks pretty serious. esurance. click or call. welcome back to "the ed show." republicans are still skraeting a lot of nonsense in their war against president obama and the fast and furious standoff. congressman darrell issa has sent a letter to the president of the united states challenging the president's xergz of executive privilege.
your privilege assertion means one of two things, mr. president. either you or most of your senior advisers were involved in managing operation fast and furious and the fallout from it or you are asserting a presidential power that you know to be unjustified solely for the purpose of further obstructing a congressional investigation. funny how darrell issa wasn't alleging a coverup just two days ago. >> do you have any evidence that white house officials were involved in these decisions, that they knowingly misled congress and are involved in a coverup? >> no, we don't, and what we're seeking are documents we know to exist february 4th to december that are in fact about brieing terry's murder, who knew, and why people were lying about it. >> i just want to be clear, we have to get out. no evidence at this point that the white house is involved in a cover up. >> and i hope they don't get involved. >> they love to do this stuff, stir the pot as often as they can with outright lies.
jon kyl took it a step farther, the bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bill i helped draft in 2007 was killed in part by then senator obama. then senator obama voted in favor of bush's 2007 immigration plan and kyl was part of the filibuster against it. now he's tossed out the impeachment word in talking about the president's immigration policy. >> if the president insists on continuing to ignore parts of the law that he doesn't like and simply not enforce that law, the primary remedy for that is political. and you have it two ways. one, oversight through the congress to demonstrate what they're doing wrong, and the other part of it is the people need to react through the ballot box to turn out of office those people who are not doing their duty.
if it's bad enough and if there are shenanigans involved in it, of course, impeachment is a possibility. i don't think at this point anybody is talking about that. >> you are, senator. you're doing it on right-wing radio in america. who listens to that ininthe head nodding crowd. they're going to impeach obama. let's turn to sam stein. good to have you with us. that's just how they turn in those circles, if you know what i mean. >> impeachment, did you mention? >> i thought i would ask if you heard anything on the hill? the contempt vote on holder is going to be in the house on thursday. and congressman issa is doing his whes to whip this up, even though he admitted on fox he has no everyday of a coverup? >> it's a presumptn of guilt with a recognition of innocence. they acknowledge they have no evidence that shows that the
administration was involved in this, but they're searching for evidence that it was there. the thing they're willfully ignoring or seems they're ignoring is that the attorney general cannot exercise the right of executive privilege. he must request that right from the president himself. and so when the president exercised that right, it was part of the process. it wasn't some sort of malicious or sinister attempt to cover it up, at least according to the white house. that's an important thing to actually know when you're looking at this because there's no way to exercise executive privilege without bringing the president into the matter, to then turn around and say it's part of the president's coverup is to willfully misconstrue the process of exercising executive privilege. >> we have heard congressman issa say he thinks he's going to have bipartisan support for the contempt vote. what democrats are in the halls of congress saying, you know what, we have to reel in the attorney general? he's in contempt? >> it's a bit more complicated because the national rifle association has decided they're going to score the vote, and
that, of course, is putting a lot of pressure on the democrats who live in moderate or conservative leaning districts with a lot of passionate gun right owners to cast a vote. we have one report out this afternoon that jim matheson of utah is leaning towards doing, voting yes on a contempt vote because of this. >> the nra, the folks that scare the heck out of wisconsinites that tom barrett was going to take their firearm, they're back in it on the contempt vote. john mccain has suggested a special prosecutor for security leaks. are they concerned about that? >> they have denied they would leak this intentionally. they point it out it's a "new york times" reporter that could have good sources and uncovered the information on his own. this is going to play out over time and we'll see what is happening here. but of course, leaking this type of stuff is a problem if it was done with the intent of bolstering up the president's credentials, but we have seenone evidence to suggest that was the
case except for assertions that it maybe was the case. >> sam, great to have you with us on "the ed show." i think there's going to be a real political fallout for the republicans if they go down the road of the vote of contempt. >> coming up, a major american city is burning to the ground, but toon, there's hope. and grammy award winning artist marc anthony is performing at a fund-raiser for president obama tonight. later, he joins me to talk about politics and the power of the latino vote this year.
welcome back to "the ed show." let me give you good news and there was really good news coming out of the housing market today. home prices are actually rising. they're on the move up in major u.s. cities. 19 of the 20 biggest cities in this country saw their average home price go up from march to april. that's good. the only city that went backwards was detroit where home prices actually fell 3.6%. the big reason why is because detroit keeps sliding backwards is because, hell, it's on fire most of the time. no kidding. as msnbc.com reports, last year alone, the detroit fire department fielded 30,000 fire calls. the city of 714,000 sees 30 structure fires a day. in contrast, los angeles, a city of nearly 4 million faces just 11 structure fires a day. now, detroit is always -- almost
always burning at least somewhere. as one firefighter put it in a recent documentary, "burn" detroit is like katrina without the hurricane. detroit's finances are also in a disaster. the city has a $200 million budget shortfall and $13 billion in structural debt. the mayor announced layoffs of 164 firefighters beginning in july. is that going to help? the siation in detroit could go from bad to worse. >> i started smelling the smoke. >> the announcement comes within hours of an east side arson spree. 11 fires deliberately set. one fire buckled the aluminum siding on this woman's house. >> my neighbor starts yelling, the one behind you is burning. >> the detroit firefighter's association said the layoffs would mean 16 fewer engine or ladder companies. they call the job cuts disastrous. >> this is not going to work in the city of detroit.
>> tracy is still worried. last night, firefighters had to spray water on the house where she lives with her four kids. >> our lives are in jeopardy. it's sad. >> but the federal government could step in. the mayor is applying for a federal safer grant that will allow him to rehire two thirds of the fired firefighters. they have been awarded since the recession began. the grants have kept firefighters on the job across the country from nnewark, new jersey, to sacramento. unless you're mitt romney, it's clear, government is the answer in detroit. >> instead, he wants to add more to government. he wants another stimulus. he wants to hire more government workers. he says we need more firemen, more policemen, more teachers. the american people got the message, it's time to cut back on government and lepthe american people. >> mitt romney says hiring more firefighters is a problem.
there's no doubt in my mind that guy who said let detroit go bankrupt would let detroit burn to the ground. there's a lot more coming up in the next half hour of "the ed show." stay tuned. we're right back. voter id, which is going to allow governor romney to win the state of pennsylvania. done. >> a pennsylvaa lawmaker says voter id laws are going to deliver his state to mitt romney. the big panel weighs in. latinos are a force that can and will help decide this election. >> and singer marc anthony has something to say about the president's immigration policy.
half of them passed voter id laws including the swing state of pennsylvania. on saturday, a pennsylvania republican let the cat out of the bag on his state's voter i dirksz law. he gave them the play book republicans are using around the country to take back the white house. >> we are focused on making sure that we meet our obligations that we talked about for years. pro second amendment. first pro life legislation, abortion facility regulations in 22 years, done. voter i dirksz, which is going to allow governor romney to win the state of pennsylvania, done. >> does that prove what we have known all along? voter id laws are nothing but a republican plot to suppress democratic votes to gain power? let's bring in alyse and ari, susan who is happy i didn't
identify her as a democratic strategist as i did the last time. alyse, republicans claim that voter id is to prevent fraud, and it has been proven it's just not widespread. there are just sprinklings of these events that take place. does what he just said really put a hole in his entire argument? >> absolutely. it puts a hole, but it doesn't put the absolute hole. what we have to understand is that the republican party, susan's republican party, actually not only wants to help romney win this election but fundamentally they're in opposition to thomas jefferson's declaration of unless where all men are created equally. in texas, the platform advocates repealing the voter's rights act. this is a group of people that fundamentally believe not all americans have the right to vote. >> what about that? >> it's not true. firsof all, there's a lot of republicans that believe that everyone should have the right to vote. i don't know what this man was
doing when he said that. frankly, it was thought the wisest thing he could do politically. it's almost as ridiculous as the conspiracy theory that pelosi said the reason issa is going after fast and furious is it's about identity. there's a lot of states out there who are saying there's wrong with requiring i dirksz. you have to have id to take out a library book. the idea of a photo id that has to be current or have an expiration goes too far. >> the big issue here and the reason it's bigger than a political gaffe is when the supreme court said it was okay in 2008, they said it was only okay if the main goal was not partisan. it was only okay -- >> does that sound bite violate the law? >> it gives people who want to challenge the laws another hook.
that was about indiana, and even though it was a party line vote, they said it looked like there were many reasons and it would be okay if partisanship were but one. when you have a leader of a party saying that's to elect their party member, that's a legal problem now. >> and you have michigan on the precipice of passing a similar law which would dissen fran choice hundreds of thousands of voters. the ends justify the leads. this is positively anti-american. >> 7 of 20 voter suppression states happen to be swing states. coincidence? >> there's -- clearly, there are politics and politics in the decision that ari just mentioned. it goes throughout. but at the end of the day, things need to be, i agree, more reasonable. but at the same time, there's nothing wrong with having that. >> are you saying the republicans have gone too far? >> in certain circumstances, yes, they have. the expiration date on photo ids
is going too far, or where the republicans made their biggest mistake was not doing a sample or an audit to show there's cause for concern and then implementing this. >> if i could briefly say, the supreme court which upheld the voter id law said they had no evidence of voter fraud in indiana. think about that. all this work, all this -- >> has tre been evidence of voter fraud in pennsylvania? >> no. >> absolutely not. actually, one of the things you have to understand is this man can say this and get away with it because there's been no penalty. americans for prosperity, koch fronted fund group. absolutely proven to be provided misinformation to voters about when they're supposed to show up to the polls. they're acting like a legitimate political group. >> eric holder looking at a contempt vote in the house on thursday. is it all about voter suppression or is it all about fast and furious? >> i think it's that they see him as one of the few people who
can uphold the law and supportive american voters won't stop him. >> i don't see a link to voter suppression, but i don't see a real case if you look at the history here. i don't see a case for trying to get the documents that were only about responding to congress. they're on really thin ice and they're in danger. >> it is about fast and furious. >> it is about fast and furious? >> absolutely. >> will democrats support the contempt vote? >> they're very concerned. that's why they started negotiating today. up to 30 democrats are going to vote for that. that will be damning for the democrats. >> that may tell you something about gun politics. it would go to the d.c. courts, it would take longer than the election to get resolved. this is theater. >> to have to be deemed bipartisan is huged in this political charged environment. if you can say there's a contempt charge against the attorney general politically, i understand, i'm not a lawyer. i don't play one on tv, but i can tell you that politically, this would be a mistake. >> i will tell you i worked on
the hill, everyone knows when the nra says jump, there are bipartisan answers. that doesn't solve anything. >> great to have you with us tonight. coming up, he's one of the most influential performing artists of our time. next, singer marc anthony will join me and sblan why he's supporting president obama. stay tuned.
tonight, i asked does the citizens united decision mean the end of democracy in america. 93% of you said yes. 7% of you said no. up next, grammy award winner marc anthony on why he's supporting president obama. and what it means to have the latino vote on your side. stay tuned. and no one's around , does it make a sound? [ meows ] or if a tree falls on your car and no one's around to answer your call, do you make a sound? the answer is probably "yes" [ growling ] and "like a howler monkey." unless you're calling esurance.
the opportunity of responsible young people to allow them to stay here and prosper here and get educated here. just because they're the children of undocumented immigrants, they are americans through and through, except for their papers. i believe it was the right thing to do. >> the president needs to support of the latino community all across the country. singer marc anthony, a president obama supporter is helping mobilize latino voters. he performed at the president's fund-raiser tonight. earlier, i spoke with the grammy award winning artist and entertainer. he starts his 15-city tour in miami on august 2nd. here's part of our conversation. if you could give us a sense of the enthusiasm in the latino community for president obama is it real? >> it is absolutely real, and i think that, you know, my support is real.
i have been representing the latino community all my life, being a puerto rican descent, and to think about what he's been able to accomplish in the past -- during his administration is just unbelievable. and to me, he is us. you know, i think there are a lot of -- there are a lot of similarities, we have a lot in common as a community. there's a lot he understands. and what he's been able to accomplish, you think about sonya sote omyer as a justice, what he's been able to do as far as iraq is concerned. the face of america is finally being recognized, especially after the last census, knowing we have almost 60 million latinos here. we see him as one of us. if you think of it, the son of
immigrants coming with a dream, and educated himself. like i said before, if you think about some of the greatest success stories here in america, they have been the sons and daughtersf imgrnlts and all they had was a dream and education, which is very important to me. i lived it, so i'm a product of that. we support him because we understand his story. we understand what he's been able to accomplish considering what he stepped into. >> marc, how important is the latino vote going to be in november? >> i think the latino vote is going to make all the difference. i think that we're a community that, we sort of feel like we're being recognized for the first time in many ways. and you know, once you activate them, i think 60 million is a big number to contend with. you know, so we get it. i'm here to support him wholeheartedly, and speaking to
him personally, he has assured me and reassured me of how important it is. he lises more than he speaks because he wants to learn as much as he can. and i have always walked away with a sense that it is extremely important to him, and so i think we can make all the difference in the world. i'm here to support him and in any way, shape, or form i can. and it's an honor to. i'll be with him in a little bit, and i just hope that he practices the salsa. >> he does sing pretty well. marc anthony, thanks for your time. i appreciate it so much. >> coming up, the dilemma over natural disasters. two states need help right now. but mitt romney says they're on their own. find out why next.
> to the big finish tonight. thousands of firefighters will spend another night trying to contain the wildfires just scorching colorado's high country. the weather is dry and the wind is still gusting. more than 10,000 people have evacuated their homes. the fires have blackened at least 90,000 acres. but so far, no one has been hurt. amazing. the number of firefighters and the amount of equipment required to fight the fires is staggering. colorado simply could not do it alone.
the military brought in four specialized c-130 aircraft. 1400 forest service workers battling the flames in shifts. the department of the interior sent another 500 firefighters. that's on top of colorado's local resources. then there's the money. fema is releasing grants to pay 75% of the state's firefightering costs. at the same time, florida is getting soaked by tropical storm debby. the storm has already dumped more than 20 inches of rain in parts of the state. forecasters expect another 10 inches of rain when debby crosses the punens law. >> 58 years, i have never seen it this high. even with the hurricane. a real hurricane. >> people who lived here all their lives have never seen the water across the road right here. >> debby is going to cost big bucks. the storm has already shut down 18% of the gulf's oil output. the national guard is on standby. governor rick scott thinks every
county in his state will be effected. but mitt romney thinks the states should deal with these disasters on their own. he's proposing deep cuts to fema. >> every time you have an occasion that takes something from the federal government and send it back to the states, that's the right direction. >> by the way, both colorado and florida have republican governors, both of them are coordinating with fema to help the people of their states tonight. joining us tonight is harold with the international association of firefighters, the president of that organization. good to have you with us tonight. >> glad to be with you. >> you bet, we have a couple examples about how federal funding is vital. how important do you think federal funding is for fire departments across the country? >> well, it's critical, ed. it's critical in two different ways. first of all, as you mentioned these wildfires, hurricanes, floods, katrina, all of the natural disasters which really
require extraordinary resources and response, part of the federal government's responsibility is to secure our homeland. and so it's not just a local government responsibility. it's part of the whole network of providing protection and response to our citizens in times of natural or manmade disasters. on the other hapd, it is also as your earlier segment shows the federal government's responsibility in deep economic troubled times to insure that the government is able to provide the essential services that our founding government is really based on. keep our streets safe, respond to people in their most difficult of times. as well as educate our children. it's a government responsibility. and the federal government has a role in terrible economic times to help assure that we keep enough firefighters on the line to respond to what is increased incidence in difficult economic times. >> if we take mitt romney at his
word, we're going to be cutting spending to fema at the worst possible time? >> first of all, he made that clear. he also made it very clear that he thinks the safer grants, which you referred to earlier, which has been able to put thousands of firefighters back on the line, which is there to help cities like detroit, which is right now on the verge of losing 164 firefighters, philadelphia, 160 firefighters down, eight companies lost. places like camden, new jersey, and falls river, massachusetts. muncie, indiana. cities all across the country where they have been losing firefighters, putting our citizens at risk, our neighborhoods at risk, and our federal government is there to help shore that up. to bridge these economic difficult times, and mitt romney says no, the federal government has no role or responsibility in providing resources and help to our localities, which is exactly what he did when he was the governor of massachusetts. he cut local aid every year for
four years and put scores of communities into deep, deep trouble. places like lawrence, massachusetts, and springfield, massachusetts, and places that were unable to maintain the essential services that a community and the citizens expect and deserve. >> you mentioned detroit as we covered earlier in this broadcast tonight. what's the solution there? >> well, first of all, the solution is understanding that the basic responsibility of government is to keep their citizens safe. and even in these difficult economic times, is to look for ways and look for the programs that are there to assist the city and in fact, that's what we're doing through the safer program. $1.3 billion, 13,000 firefighters. >> great to have you with us tonight. thanks. >> always good to be with you. >> we want to mike a quick correction. we misidentified governor hickenlooper of colorado as a republican.
we know he's a democrat in good standing, and we appalljudge for that error. i should have caught that. that's "the ed show." the "rachel maddow show" show starts right now. good evening. i'm trying to be perfect, but i'm not there t. >> the on-air correction is an underappreciated art. >> how come newspapers get to put it in the corner but we have to come out here and do all this. >> we can mumble, and that makes it into fine print. "rachel maddow show" starts right now. thank you, ed. thanks. and thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. big news day. last week when bloomberg news reported that the mitt romney for president campaign had asked the governor of florida to please stop talking about the economy getting better in florida. sighting two sources, they said the romney campaign asked florida governor rick scott to tone down his statements heraldingiment provements in the state's economy because they