tv Morning Joe MSNBC September 17, 2012 6:00am-9:00am EDT
let's go. we talked too long. time for one quick e-mail, john, what do you got? >> lorrie, you'll have to explain this one. up to obtain visual confirmation that you indeed survived your chuck e. cheese adventure. >> thank you as always for your tweets. i did go to chuck e. cheese. i tweeted about it. many of you asked if i was there alone at chuck e. cheese. no, i'm not that creepy. i have two small children, but yet we were there waiting outside the doors at 9:00 a.m. for chuck e. cheese in new jersey to open. let me just say, if you've got to go to chuck e. cheese, go at 9:00 in the morning.
you have the run of the place. it was me, my kids and that creepy chuck e. cheese robot. "morning joe" starts right now. ♪ a new poll shows shols that after the democratic national convention, president obama got a four-point bounce in the polls which means he's now only five points behind bill clinton. in a recent promotion, mitt romney is offering donors a chance to win a ride on his campaign plane. but if you know how mitt romney travels, this is one contest you don't want to win. >> good morning. it is monday. wake up, everyone. september 17th. welcome to "morning joe." with us on set, we have msnbc and "time" magazine senior political analyst mark halperin. hello, mark. >> hi. >> national affairs editor for "new york" magazine and msnbc political analyst john heilemann. and in washington, we have nbc chief foreign affairs correspondent and host of "andrea mitchell reports,"
andrea mitchell. good morning, everyone. good to have you on board this morning. a lot to talk about. >> a lot to talk about internationally. a lot to talk about domestically. internationally the chaos continues. "the new york times" has a front-page story. "cultural clash fuels muslims raging at film. devout values conflict with free speech." i don't know if i would use the word "devout" to associate anything that's happened over the past week with the savagery that we've been seeing on our television sets over the past week over a crude film that's been uplinked and is being used as an excuse to kill americans. >> it's not the excuse. >> no. >> just the touchstone. >> the thing is, though, this is the reality that every president faces. and i think we see just how naive every president is that thinks they're going to come in and transform the middle east. if we could just talk to them, they would understand us. and of course, this president talked about the fact that he
was raised in a muslim country would somehow take -- you know, make things better in the middle east. it just doesn't happen. you know why they hate us? i talked to intelligence people all weekend. they hate us because of their religion. they hate us because of their culture, and they hate us because of peer pressure. and you talk to any intelligence person, they will tell you that's the same thing. and all these people that think we're going to go over there and change them and make them hate us less are just naive. think about the savagery, just the sheer, unrestrained savagery that we have seen across the middle east and the arab world over the past week because of a crude film. they know what they're doing. they know it's a crude film. they know it has nothing to do with the united states government. it is an excuse. one intelligence person told me, if you scratch the surface, and if you gave every street vendor from street vendor to prime
minister in that region a chance to throw a rock at the u.s. embassy, they would. so this is their excuse. >> look at what's happening in afghanistan 11 years later. >> and look what's happening in afghanistan. and is it just me? willie, is it just me, or is it -- we have the grave concern about the tragedy that happened to the ambassador and our people that have served so proudly for, you know, for the state department who were killed. and yet this weekend, more u.s. troops in afghanistan gunned down by our supposed allies. this happens every day. this happens every day. and yes, our u.s. ambassador being killed is just absolutely horrific. but every single day, young american men and women are gunned down in afghanistan. >> 51 of them this year on insider attacks. 51 nato troops including many
americans this year. >> nobody's talking about it. >> to your point exactly about the film, after the fact the taliban, on this insider attack, said it was about the film. this was about the film. >> oh, just shut up. >> you don't storm into one of the most heavily fortified bases on the face of the earth and go in and take out nato troops and have people -- intelligence investigating this place based on a spontaneous outrage at a film. this was obviously planned, and then after the fact they went back and blamed the movie. >> the question is, how can we beat the taliban when the taliban can read into the future? because they've been doing this for months now, these insider attacks. the film? give me a break. you know, it's just like oh, you know, they hate us because of waterboarding. no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us. they hate us because of obama's drone attacks. no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us. they hate us because somebody burned a koran. no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us. they hate us because of this
crude film? no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us. and any u.s. politician that thinks they're going to go in and transform the region and stop people from hating us because they hate us are absolute fools. they're absolute fools. so andrea, you know, it continues. look, you look at these protests raging across the middle east, you look also even before this film at how low america's approval rating is, country by country, you know, we had a president who was going to transform america's standing in the world and make us proud to be americans again. the fact is, a poll that was released last week, i think it may have been pew, shows that except for france, they do love us in france now, more than they did when bush was president. but especially across the middle east and these areas that are so key to stability across the world, america's standing is lower now than it's been. it just keeps getting lower. why?
>> well, you know, i think that a number of things. we are perceived not as the liberator, but we are perceived as the other, as different. and these are -- they're different from country to country. let's face it. in libya, there is a lot of pro-american feeling, not only in the government but also among the people. you saw pro-american protests after those horrific deaths. so you still have al qaeda influences. you have large numbers of militias, heavily armed militias in libya. this is a barely post-war, post-civil war environment. egypt is another case. egypt is struggling to find out what its national identity is. and desperately in need of money. the egyptian leadership pleading with the imf, pleading with us for money at the same time as teetering because of its longstanding fundamentalist beliefs, not knowing what it is. that's why the president sent that very strong signal to
president morsi last week saying not an ally, not an enemy. and then what really troubles me is afghanistan. this raid on friday, not only the insider raids over the weekend, but the friday raid on that camp bastion was not only organized, it was three heavily armed units in american army uniforms penetrating that base. >> yeah. >> that is the most troubling of all. >> it is unbelievable. our standing and how things are falling apart internationally. and it's not -- i'm sorry, it's not because of a film. the film is the latest excuse. >> and we're following protests that are breaking out in afghanistan now. crowds are setting fire to police cars all in response, of course, more protests in response to this film. >> to the film. i just can't believe this film, yes. yes, it's the film. and by the way, this film is -- well, let's talk really quickly also about, you know, you have
people now that seem to be rallying in defense of this filmmaker accusing cops that, you know, a lot of people on the fringes of the conservative movement, you know, the same people who have been saying oh, oh, you know, these polls. every poll that has come out since the democratic convention is a farce, right? every poll. suddenly the methodology for polling is a farce. and suddenly los angeles police officers are brown shirts. brown shirts. people calling american law enforcement officers brown shirts simply because they're taking a guy in john heilemann who's on probation already. who's on probation. they have a right to do that under the constitution of the united states of america. they've been so frantic this weekend. they're chasing their tails because mitt romney is an awful candidate. and now even conservatives, eric erickson out this morning, rupert murdoch said it, jack
welch said it, i said it last week and have been absolutely pilloried by the extreme right wing. it's a reality -- he's a horrible candidate. he's got perhaps one of the worst-run presidential campaigns in modern american history. but now it's the pollsters' fault and it's the brown shirts' fault for going after this, quote, christian filmmaker, as matt drudge called him over the weekend, a christian filmmaker. >> yes, there were a couple of prominent conservative bloggers calling for the president's resignation and saying that barack obama is not fit to be president of the united states on the basis of the fact that he had sicked the brown shirts on that filmmaker in question and just, again, raises the unfortunate spector of obama derangement syndrome in some places on the right. >> and unfortunately this one you're specifically talking about, i won't even mention his name on television, is actually usually a pretty level-headed guy. but over the past week, mark halperin, conservatives on the far right in the blogosphere
have lost their head. they've just lost their head. i mean, you know, i don't like talking about myself. and willie, what are the words you'll never hear from him? i told you so, right? i just don't do it. so i'm not going to say i told you so. but it's not like we didn't see this train wreck coming. as my torts professor told me. you should see this next question coming at you like a freight train out of the mist. and it's coming straight -- we saw this coming. we knew romney was a horrible candidate. and now his campaign is just in disarray. eric erickson, rupert murdoch, jack welch, myself, politico, i guess, has an article out this morning talking about just how many conservatives are saying this is an absolute nightmare for an election that republicans should be winning. the romney team's blowing it. >> there's a long list of people who are being critics now. there's also a long list of things that conservatives are being distracted by instead of talking about the economy and
america's role in the world. they're talking about media bias. they're talking about, you know, the arrest -- the guy being taken into custody briefly in los angeles. >> right. the polls. >> the polls. >> every poll. >> every poll biased. every single poll. >> and, you know, governor romney. it's incumbent upon him as the candidate, not the staff, not the bloggers, not the critics, it's incumbent upon him to say i'm going to make the election over the last two months about important things. >> and by the way, bill kristol said it right, peggy noonan said it right, you've said it before. yes, the media is biased. there is a liberal media bias in the national media. guess what? we're in manhattan, new york. we're not in manhattan, kansas. there would be a conservative media bias. but there's a libial media bias. okay, great. now what are you going to do about it? there was a bias in 1980 when ronald reagan won 41 states, in 1984 when ronald reagan won 84
states, i mean 49 states. there was a libial media bias in 1988 when george h.w. bush destroyed michael due caucus, in 2000 and 2004. get over it. >> peggy said it best. you've got to transcend it if you're a republican. >> compared to all of those other elections, there were -- there was nothing like the conservative media counterweight that there is now. >> right. >> so to the extent that there is some degree of liberal bias, in 1980, there was no fox news in 1980. there was no conservative blogosphere. >> talk radio. >> there was no talk radio. >> matt drudge. >> if anything, the world is much more -- if you look at the full spectrum of media, there's much more diversity and conservatives have plenty loud megaphone in our media environment today. >> and look at the conservatives over the past week, week and a half, that have said hey, there's a problem here. i said it on saturday. "the wall street journal" said it last sunday. laura ingram came out on monday, rush on tuesday, was talking -- we're all saying the same thing.
they have decided to run a campaign based on nothing. you said it six months ago. rush limbaugh, willie -- rush limbaugh is saying it on tuesday that this campaign's about nothing. you know, i was saying margaret thatcher would have never taken over the conservative movement in great britain in 1975 or won in 1979. ronald reagan would have never, ever won in 1980 if they had run a nothing campaign. so they've run a nothing campaign, and guess what they've got? nothing. >> that all changes today, though. >> does it change today? >> they say it's all changing today. >> and what's going to happen today? >> some new ads on policy. >> really? >> details. >> a briefing call and a series of speeches from governor romney focusing on his economic plan and the big choices we face as a nation. >> oh, good. >> it all starts by pure coincidence today. >> have they gotten the message? john, have they gotten the message? >> i always hate to say time will tell, but we'll see. we'll see. there are been various times when we've heard things are
about to change and they haven't. we'll see. maybe today they will. maybe they won't. >> what i just don't understand is, if i were running against this guy, barack obama, as a conservative, this would be so easy. this would be so easy to find it. he spent us $5 trillion deeper in debt. we've had auto bailouts. we've had bank bailouts. we have the largest stimulus package ever which nobody in congress read before it was passed. nobody could tell us that democrats still can't tell us what's in the health care bill. most democrats can't tell us what's in the health care bill. big government has run amok over the past four years. trillion-dollar deficits every year. and are we better off today? after all of this historic spend -- no, we're not! one-third of americans think we're going in the right direction. that means two-thirds think we're going in the wrong direction. unemployment is still over 8%. the last jobs report, the number went down. that may be good politically, but the economic reality is, it was just horrific.
you talk to any finance person that's going to decide where this country goes over the next couple years, mark halperin, they're going to tell you, it's not getting better. it's getting worse. and we're probably going to fall off a cliff. i was talking to a guy yesterday who is one of the top people on wall street. he said, i'm scared to death. one of two things are going to happen. we're going to be japan for a decade, or we're going to fall off a cliff and we're going to be california. >> in 1992, everyone remembers the little rock war room had a sign in it that said "it's the economy, stupid." but the sign said two other things. it said, "it's the economy, stupid. change versus more of the same. and don't forget health care." and those are pretty much the same things mitt romney could run on if he had the discipline to run on those three things and not on media bashing and all the other things that they've become distracted by. >> so he's frustrating the very people he might want to get the support of. conservative blogger eric erickson from redstate.com wrote this. "there is time for mitt romney to close the deal, but he can't
close the deal with a schizophrenic campaign message. if he's afraid of being more unliked than he already is, he might as well let paul ryan be the lead because the status quo for team romney is not working. that is just a fact and we might as well accept it instead of screaming at everything else trying not to make eye contact with the fact." and now new details are emerging about what was supposed to be the critical speech of mitt romney's campaign, the one at the republican national convention. he talked about the politico report, citing unnamed sources, says that the romney campaign went through two different sets of speechwriters. using practically nothing from either draft from those speechwriters. according to the article -- >> by the way, one of those, mika, our good friend pete waner. >> yeah, he's good. >> who is as good as it gets. they gave the speech to pete, and he wrote what i'm sure was an extraordinary speech, and then stuart stevens basically tears it up. said no, we're going to start all over.
unbelievable. >> the article says romney and top strategist stuart stevens were forced to cobble together a speech in just days, leaving out a section on afghanistan and references to the troops serving abroad, an oversight, of course, that drew widespread criticism. that was a big, big, big mistake. joining us now, chief white house correspondent for politico, mike allen. mike, i take it these details show that they were scrambling before what was a prepared, in essence, contrived event that was supposed to rally the base and everybody. >> yeah, they really were, mika. and for somebody who sells himself as mr. fix-it, for someone who is a very successful corporate leader, republicans are baffled that mitt romney doesn't have a better organized campaign. and we really saw it with this laurel & hardy routine around the convention speech.
now, the pete waner draft of the convention speech which we have some of on politico right now includes one word that the speech that romney eventually gave did not, and that is afghanistan. he included talk about hotspots in the world that mitt romney later paid such a price for the colossal oversight in his convention speech, not having a salute to the troops, not talking about policy in afghanistan. so as mark halperin mentioned, today they say that they're going to come out with a different approach. the economy, economy, economy idea which, as you guys know, was the fundamental idea of this campaign. back when mitt romney was thinking about whether to run, he knew it was going to have to be about economy, economy, economy. well, now they say they're going to go broader, and now it's going to be status quo versus change. that's going to take in foreign policy. it's going to take in the tone in washington.
it's going to take in the deficit. it's going to take in the economy. >> hey, mike, this piece obviously has zipped around the political world overnight. some republicans saying it's an interesting piece, there's some good reporting in there, but there's some degree of chaos. there's a great degree of dissension in every presidential campaign. is this more, though, than you've seen in all the campaigns you've covered before? >> willie, what republicans are telling us is that it turns out that there was a real design flaw in the romney campaign. and that is that stuart stevens, the chief strategist, is doing three huge jobs. he's the chief ad guy. he's the chief strategist, and he's the chief speechwriter. wound up after they went through the pete waner draft, after they brought in the brilliant bush speechwriters, a pair of bush speechwriters, they threw away their draft, too. it was eventually stuart stevens and romney himself who wrote the speech. some would compare this -- they said it would be as if in the
bush campaign, one person did karl rove's job as the strategist, mike gerson's job in speech writing and mark mckinnon's job making the ads. or if in the obama campaign of 2008, if it were just david axelrod, if he didn't have admakers jim margolis and the speechwriter jon favreau and others helping him. >> so andrea mitchell, a different approach that we're hearing about that we're going to be seeing in the coming week, but same people on the campaign? and if so, given other campaigns you have covered, do they ever make big replacements at this stage of the game? and are you surprised you're not seeing any here, especially on the foreign policy side? >> they make big replacements. we certainly saw that in the reagan campaign in 1980 when there was a wholesale housecleaning after the new hampshire primary, but that was after the new hampshire primary, way, way earlier. >> right. >> not at this stage.
and i think it's way too late -- the bottom line, mike allen and all the rest of you is, mitt romney is in charge of all of this. he is mr. fix-it. so we can talk about whether or not the structure, you know, makes sense, but he's in charge. and one question i would have is, when he makes this speech this week and talks about how he would govern, is he going to talk about the change in foreign policy or how he would do things differently? because that's been the debate in the last five or six days internally as to whether he should give a big foreign policy speech. and it seems now as he's been a focus on the economy. >> all right. go ahead, mike. >> there's not a big foreign policy speech. he's going to speak to the clinton global initiative, but there's going to be -- before the debates -- nothing big. nothing new. and you guys are going to love this. stuart stevens tells me that now we should focus on the national polls, not the state polls. that's contrary to what anyone will tell you about a presidential race. he told me it will be like walking into a department store and seeing 50 scales and
stepping on all of them. so he says tracking polls, track the race, watch the big number, not the states where you'll win the presidency. >> okay. mike allen, thank you very much. coming up, bob woodward joins us for his new book, "the price of politics," where he takes an inside look at the obama white house including the president's rocky relationship with house republicans. also on the show, "the washington post's" david ignatius, "the financial times'" jillian tett, joe klein and chuck todd. and in a few minutes, mad dog, nbc sports' mike florio. but first, here's meteorologist dylan dreyer with a check on the forecast. >> nice across the northeast but we do have rain across louisiana and texas. it's all moving in here for tomorrow. we are going to see theen is continue to shine all across the northeast. a little warm as you head down toward washington where you could see a couple light showers
through the day. and there's that rain moving into western tennessee, also through louisiana, heavy pockets of rain expected. and we are going to see all of that begin to make its way eastward as we head into your tuesday. we could end up with about one to two inches of rain possible as we go into your tomorrow. so we are looking for those thunderstorms to continue to spread along the gulf coast states. they'll make their way into alabama, into mississippi and into the panhandle of florida, and then some of that rain will move basically from south florida all the way up into northern new england as we go into tuesday. it's a short event, though. by wednesday, we're already looking at more sunshine to work back into the area. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. ♪
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♪ it's 27 past the hour. time now to take a look at the "morning papers." "usa today," cushing military suicides is a top priority for defense second leon panetta. panetta told commanders the culture must change. so members of the military are comfortable seeking counseling. in 2001, there were 160 active-duty suicides. in 2011, nearly double that, 301. and in our parade of papers, "the chicago tribune," mayor rahm emanuel is now trying to get a court order. he's having to resort to getting a court order to get the city's students back into the classrooms while the teachers decide to take their strike into their second week. both city officials and union leaders had agreed to a framework for a new teacher contract on friday.
it was a deal that the union leaders called a good contract, but yesterday union delegates voted to continue their strike to keep children, and really some of the poorest, most disadvantaged children in chicago, out of classrooms for another week. "the cleveland plain deal dealer." while president obama campaigns in cincinnati and columbus, the white house will formally protest the world trade organization over china's auto parts export policy. china subsidizes its auto parts and also levys duties on american car imports. a practice the white house says undercut manufacturers and jobs in states like ohio. and "the wall street journal," the treasury department is now resisting a push from general motors to sell off its stake in the company, saying the u.s. government would lose $15 billion if it sold its share right now. the federal government gave gm $50 billion as part of a massive bailout package. according to "the journal," gm officials say it's a drag on the
company's reputation, and some executives are still irked that they can't use their corporate jets. >> that's a look at the "morning papers." >> and willie, i mean, seriously. if you had to, you know, trade in your stake in this company, i mean, you couldn't -- i mean -- why are they not letting you use your corporate jet here either? >> it's no the right. it's not right. they've crossed a bridge, in my view. >> they really have. >> which we may not be able to return. >> this is huey long-style demagoguery. it's un-american. >> like mitt romney, you know hardship. >> that clip was good. wasn't it good to see sudakis back? >> a solid episode. up next, giants' coach tom coughlin rips into tampa bay head coach greg schiano during the post-game handshake. we'll tell you what got him all worked up. up next, the mad dog, chris russo and mike florio here to discuss week two of the nfl. all this week, we're celebrating five years, can you
believe it? five years of "morning joe." >> what? are you serious? >> it only seems like 4 1/2. >> oh, my god. it definitely feels like four decades. >> we're going to take a look back all week at some of the best moments from the show. >> i'm not feeling well. we've got a young up-and-comer, a guy trying to dip his toe into the producing water. let's see who we dialed up here. >> if we can go back to the italian fox network. i want to show that again because i'll add the translation. so that the problem with the tea party members is that right now they're not going to get along. and we ought to all be able to -- i'll kill you right now! you put that on the internet like that, i'm going to kill you! that's not the right story! you can't do that to ann coulter! she's a pretty woman! >> heese you''s hired. >> happy anniversary joe, mika and willie. never has so much said about so much for so long. congratulations. capella university understands businesses are trying to come
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time to dance. >> victor cruz doing the salsa dance over at the meadowlands yesterday. here to break down week two, the mad dog, chris russo on sirius xm and founder of profootballtalk.com, flmike florio. >> how we doing? >> mike, good to see you. >> always good to see you, buddy. >> look at the energy, 6:35. >> great games. >> let's start there with the new york giants. eli throws for 510 in a shootout. what do you think about the giants now two weeks in, 1-1? >> listen, i don't know if they do this on the road, but you know with him in the fourth quarter, mike, he is unbelievable. how many quarterbacks in the nfl, a handful, that could throw three picks, be awful and bring a comeback for kryour team? that's not easy to do. >> that game was a snapshot of
last season and 2007, you're sluggish and you sputter and you find a way to make it happen when it counts. i just watching that game unfold, it's like here go the giants. they're going to lose one at home they should win, but they pull it out. >> mad dog, help me out with what happened. >> they leave the bucs too much time. >> here it is right here. >> kneel-down and then the bucs a little too physical. they should have done a better job on defense earlier in the game than doing this. obviously, bowled over the center, eli falls down, then coughlin gets mad at greg schiano. schiano doesn't know what's going on. all of a sudden there's an issue. coughlin comes back and shakes his hand finally. i like schiano. that was a little rough. >> come on, it's football. >> no. >> are you kidding me? >> not then. >> are you kidding me? it's football. >> he always did that. they never quit until the game is over. >> don't quit. never stop. >> i don't want my guy smoking a cigarette on the last play. go in, bust the center, make them fumble, pick the ball up. i mean, come on. >> but they never fumble in that
spot. it's a kneel-down. they've been doing this for 100 years. it's protocol. they should let it go. >> you're losing. >> they're looking for a miracle. >> yes, they are. >> if you do it enough times, maybe you get lucky. that's the thing. what's going to happen is you'll have players on other teams now looking to cheap shot the buccaneers because the word's going to get out hey, we shouldn't be doing this and they're going to keep doing it. schiano said we're going to keep doing it. >> it's football, man. >> it is but it's an understanding in the nfl. pat each other on the helmet, the game's cover. >> college coach coming in, upsetting a professional. >> you pat each other when the clock's done. if i'm a fan up in the stands, i don't want my guys calling it on the last play. they're big guys. they've got pads. hey, block for your quarterback. >> i didn't know schiano went after him. >> he should. >> he's a two-time super bowl coach going to the hall of fame. shouldn't schiano come out in the midfield a little more tempered in his response? >> i would say a guy going into the hall of fame should probably just walk off the field and say we'll get them next time.
>> even bill belichick calls off the dogs in victory formation. you wonder if they'll have a talk. >> now the opponents of the bucs know on that last play, you've got to keep playing. >> oh, my god, you've got to play for all 60 minutes? what is this? >> you mentioned bill belichick, the patriots, mad dog, at home to the yard naturcardinals. what happened? >> a miracle of all time. they blocked the punt, arizona, and kolb scored on a sneak. this fumble set the patriots up with a chance to win the game, but then belichick got awfully conservati conservative. he took a knee with 40 seconds to go for a 42-yard field goal. mike, it's not a chippy. i know he's a good kicker. >> he didn't even hit the net. you can see the wind was blowing the other way. he really overcompensated. not even close. >> very conservative. they took a knee, centered the kick in that spot. >> willie, can we go to the dog pound now and talk about the two dogs yesterday? the jets and the cowboys. those two teams were horrible. >> terrible. >> the jets, after that
offensive explosion in week one, you say it's working. the master plan worked. he's pushing mark sanchez to be a better quarterback. yesterday sanchez looked like old sanchez. >> you thought it might be different. the steeles don't have troy polamalu. they're a different defense without him. it's hard to win in pittsburgh. i don't care who's injured, who's on the field. to go in there and try to beat the steelers. i belt this coming but not as bad as it was. >> i think that bothers jet fans. they can deal with losing, but it wasn't really competitive. took the good feelings away from the buffalo week. >> makes it feel like it was a fluke. >> so sanchez throws a touchdown pass. first drive. goes another two hours. another two hours before he throws another completion. listen, the guy is below 60% over his career, over the past four years. >> tebow's not the answer. >> i know tebow's not the answer. but mark sanchez's not the answer. you think a guy in his fifth
year after throwing 1500 passes will start throwing over 60%? >> no. >> the jets are not going to win a super bowl with sanchez. >> you can make that argument. he has not developed like they wanted to. he's won some playoff games. i understand he hasn't been great. i know polamalu, i know harrison. >> now the key is how does he respond? having tebow there, the idea is to get him to have that sense of urgency because if he doesn't play well on a consistent basis, then they start giving more reps to tebow. but tebow hasn't looked very good either. the problem he hasn't gotten enough of an opportunity. >> then the cowboys were just awful. >> the best thing for the cowboys is nobody noticed. they got thumped. and nobody really paid any attention to it. >> fumbled this opening kickoff. and then they had a blocked punt so they're down 10-0 on scial teams. but this is why i don't like jason garrett. the cowboys are too inconsistent. one week you think on 12-4, the next week they're buried by seattle. they were never in the game at the end. and that's why they're so up and
down, mike. >> here's the thing. you've got every team in that division, they used to mock the nfc west. they beat teams that were 1-0. >> i totally agree. >> real quick, ravens not happy about their loss to the eagles. >> and not happy about the officiating. it was a great week the first week. they got the officials locked out. last week or yesterday, not so good. you have to wonder, will there be a tipping point where the players say they've got the gets officials back. >> this is the touchdown. before that he had thrown the ball. they rule it had a fumble, but then they overturned it which i thought was a good call. the other call was a pass interference on the ravens in the end zone, offensive, would have given them the win, and they were upset by that. >> the problem is the college officials, they don't have the illegal contact rule at the college level, so there's a lot of stuff going on down on the field. the ravens are upset because they're getting pushed and they're the ones getting flagged. they've got to iron this out. >> speaking of college, who beats alabama this year? >> nobody.
lsu, maybe. >> lsu, maybe. who beats alabama? >> not usc. i'll tell you that. >> oh, my god. they were horrible! >> oh, my god, lane kiffin! >> offensive line. pensacola catholic high has a better offensive line. >> i'm not sure about barkley for the heisman. >> not if you're winning games. >> barkley was terrible. >> it should be noted i said on friday to joe, watch out for that arkansas game. it's a trap game. they won 52-0. on the road. bad job by me. >> that good? >> that's a bad job. chris russo, mike florio, come back every day. mika, we pushed you out. i know you had a question. >> no. stunned. >> the wild card in baseball! >> mika's "must-read opinion pages," that's next. losing weight clicked for us when we realized
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at 46 past the hour, a live look at capitol hill. we still have andrea mitchell and the game-change boys with us. time now for the "must-read opinion pages." we're going to read from nick christoph and "the new york times" sunday section. it's entitled "the foreign relations fumbler." "the essential problem is that every time romney touches foreign policy, he breaks things. he went on a friendly trip to britain, the easiest possible test for a candidate, akin to rolling off a log. and endeared himself by questioning london's readiness to host the olympic games. in the resulting firestorm, one newspaper, "the sun," denounced mitt the twit. christoph goes on to name a few other countries he went to and had problems. then he goes on to say most dangerous of all, romney's policy on iran, which can't be dismissed as an offhand misstatement. as my colleagues note, romney mul
muddled his own position on the nuclear red line for iran. plenty of candidates don't write their own foreign policy position papers, but romney is unusual in that he seems not to have even read his. according to a clarifications from romney's campaign, he apparently would order a military strike before iran even acquired a bomb simply when it was getting close. for anyone who has actually seen a battlefield, that's a blithe, too-light embrace of a path to yet another war. it's emblematic of a candidate who, on foreign policy, appears an empty shell." andrea mitchell, does he need to replace his team? what does he need to do to sort of turn the tide? there were a number of articles like this over the weekend of pieces. >> this is on mitt romney, what i find really inexplicable is that he did not accurately explain the view on iran and israel that he himself had previously articulated and that all of his advisers were laying out. so he aligned himself with president obama's view on the
red lines against iran, not netanyahu's. and that makes absolutely no sense after taking such a stance with netanyahu on his trip to israel. he's got to anythifigure this o. as mike allen has reported, they have decided to revert to the domestic issues where he presumably has more strength because of the poor economy, and that's what he's going to focus on and not try to explain his foreign policy view. >> and then there's the question, mark halperin, as to whether netanyahu is sort of playing these candidates against each other or getting involved indirectly while saying he's not. >> he was pretty skillful yesterday in trying to stay out of the presidential race. >> while being in it. >> if you look at clinton '92, bush 2000, obama 2008, i think successful presidential candidates on foreign policy against incumbents or quasi-incumbents do two things. one is you send signals to elites, people of the council on foreign relations, andrea mitchell, i mean that lovingly, calling her an elite, you send signals so you've got an actual
policy that's different than the incumbent party and that you're going to make some bold changes. and the other is broad strokes to the general public about big issues they care about. i don't think governor romney has pulled off either yet. he's tried on china. he's tried to iran. but i don't think he's pulled either of those off. and that's why the foreign policy stuff has set him back more than given him an advantage. >> andrea? >> well, particularly in china, he tried the populist. it hasn't worked. it hasn't taken. and he's offended so many people. i don't want to define elites, but republicans as well as democrats who care about our relationship with china are very concerned about him saying that he would go against china repeatedly on currency manipulation. you have treasury secretaries in both political parties who say that that would be a huge mistake. and then, you know, there is some risk, though, we should point out for president obama, as these protests spread, if they do spread, the view could
take hold that the world is not a safer place, and that would certainly contradict the president's main argument. >> andrea mitchell, thank you very much. who do you have coming up at 1:00? >> we're going to be talking about all of this, nick burns, of course, the former top state department official and adviser who has been in white houses since ronald reagan and very strongly critical of mitt romney in this case. >> andrea, thank you. up next, "saturday night live" returns with a new impression of president obama. that clip next on "morning joe." [ ow
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have two adorable young daughters and not five creepy adult sons. our campaign has a secret weapon, and that secret weapon is speaking right now in tulsa, oklahoma. let's take a look. >> hello, i'm mitt romney. and i understand the hardships facing ordinary americans. for example, this summer, one of my horses failed to medal at the olympics. so i know hardship. >> so america, i know you're not in love with me anymore, but i want you to know that my heart still beats for you. and i can prove it. ♪ i'm so in love with you that was fun, right? so do you want that or this? ♪ e-i-e-i-o hey, how about that?
that was "old macdonald had a farm." pretty groovy song, huh? sorry i didn't know all the animal noises. >> jay pharoah, a pretty good president obama. it's great to see sudakis back. >> sudakis came back. >> and conservatives showing their great laserlike focus spent a lot of time on twitter attacking "saturday night live" for being biased. >> those liberals. >> got to go somewhere. up next, "the washington post's" bob woodward and david ignatius both join the conversation. "morning joe" comes right back. five -- five [ bleep ] years? wow! happy anniversary. who'd have thunk? that little show way back when has grown to be this monster of success. lots of fun, lots of great memories, many great chapters ahead. happy anniversary. [ female announcer ] the next generation of investing technology
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♪ welcome back to "morning joe." look at that beautiful sunrise. mark halperin and john heilemann are still with us. and here with us now from washington, pulitzer prize-winning associate editor of "the washington post," bob woodward. his new book, "the price of politics," we'll be looking at that book shortly in just a moment. also with us, associate editor
and columnist for "the washington post," david ignatius. gentlemen, thanks for being with us this morning. >> morning. >> we'll start with the headlines. we are looking at violent protests breaking out in afghanistan where protesters have set fire to police vehicles. they also attacked western compounds including those of private security companies. it is the latest in a wave of protests that have swept the muslim world after portions of an anti-islam film which was produced in the u.s. were posted online. elsewhere in afghanistan, taliban insurgents killed two u.s. marines and damaged more than $200 million worth of equipment in a brazen attack on a fortified compound. investigators are now trying to determine if militants who were wearing afghan army uniforms to penetrate the heavily guarded camp bastion in helmand province had help from inside the base. it is the same base where prince harry has been stationed for a tour of duty as a helicopter
pilot. in addition to that raid on friday, at least s coalition service members were killed by afghan security forces in so-called insider attacks. meanwhile, afghan president hamid karzai is denouncing a series of nato air strikes early yesterday that killed at least eight female civilians. on now to israel. israel's prime minister is repeating his calls for the obama administration to set a red line for dealing with iran's nuclear program. in an interview on "meet the press," benjamin netanyahu said tehran is closing in on the ability to build an atomic bomb. >> iran has been placed with some clear red lines on a few matters, and they've avoided crossing them. so i think that as they get closer and closer and closer to the achievement of weapons-grade material, and they're very close. they're six months away from being about 90% of having the enriched uranium for an at tom bomb, i think that you have to place that red line before them
now, before it's too late. they're in the red zone, you know? they're in the last 20 years. and you can't let them cross that goal line. you can't let them score a touchdown because that would have unbelievable consequences, grievous consequences for the peace and security of us all, of the world, really. >> david ignatius, you recently wrote about netanyahu and his push for a red line. in part you write this. "the danger of these months of semi-public israeli debate about going to war is that rather than making tehran tremble, they may lead iranian leaders to doubt resolve. netanyahu is creating a situation where he almost has to attack to save face. obama should help the israeli leader to climb down from his unwise rhetoric. yes, the united states has already drawn a red line. but it's worth restating, publicly, perhaps in a very visible forum such as the u.n. general assembly this month, the united states needs to take control of the deadly con front indication with iran, rather
than being cajoled and buffetted by its smaller, weaker ally. obama needs to own the policy of prevention that he has declared." david, what is the relationship between mitt romney and netanyahu? and is there something at play here as well as netanyahu getting involved politically, even though he says he's not? >> well, we know that mitt romney and prime minister netanyahu are close friends dating back to the days when netanyahu was a consultant for boston consulting group and mitt romney was starting his business career in the boston area. they're sort of friends of longstanding. you'd hate to think that netanyahu is, in these comments over the last few months, seeking to tilt the presidential election, the u.s. toward his friend, i don't have direct evidence of that. but i did write over the weekend in the material that you quoted that these repeated threats and
demands, almost pleas that the united states set a red line, i think are increasingly less productive. the first point to make is that the united states has set a red line. president obama finally was very clear, the u.s. policy is to prevent iran from getting a nuclear weapon. we haven't said, you know, when or precisely what would trigger that. but then a superpower shouldn't. ambiguity about precisely when we'd use force has always been seen as sensible policy. i think this last round probably is going to lead to some more specific u.s. statement before the election. i do think something is likely at the general assembly in new york later in september in which the u.s. won't say anything different. it will just say it maybe louder and to a different audience. >> bob woodward, from iran and the muslim world, chaos
continues to reign. what's your reaction to the anti-americanism that just is sweeping across the globe, especially in the muslim world? so much chaos set loose supposedly over a film that was linked up, but that seems to me to be more of an excuse than anything else. >> i think it is an excuse. and of course, it tells you first that, as you were reporting, the afghanistan war is not over. it's not settled. the issues are still there. of course, the anti-americanism runs very, very deep. and the problem, the intelligence problem and the policy problem for any government is you can have a handful of people in almost any country spring up and seize embassies or kill diplomats or
protest in a way that gets extremely violent. and there's no way to get a handle on that. there are a lot of very angry people in the world. and it's difficult to have a policy for dealing with angry people. what david was saying about the israeli-u.s. relationship is i think exactly right in that you have, for netanyahu, it's obviously a security issue, whether iran gets the bomb. it's a political issue. and for all kinds of understandable reasons, it's become a highly emotional issue for him. and he is trying to push the united states, and as david wrote in that column, you can only push the united states and obama so far. they're not going to turn over american policy to the israelis. >> hey, david, it's willie.
you write in your piece on friday that president obama and the united states need to -- i think you said -- take control of the looming confrontation with iran. what would that look like exactly? because netanyahu has really controlled the stage over the last couple of weeks. what should president obama do to take control? >> well, i think first he has to make the kind of statement i was describing. restating u.s. policy but doing so very forcefully. we have been saying to israel, we've got your back. we're preparing for this. i think the broad pieces of this policy, this policy includes sanctions, this policy includes covert action, which is very aggressive. i don't know that i've ever seen a covert action program quite like this. and then it's got this threat over the horizon of actual military action, but the planning on the ground has already largely been done. there's pre-positioning, there's designation of sites that would be used. so all those pieces have to be
pulled together. and i think the worst thing would be in this situation for the u.s. to be buffeted by a smaller ally in a matter of war and peace. these are decisions that american presidents have to take themselves. they have to hold all the instruments in their hands. i know from discussions that i've had with people in the administration national security group that they're thinking now about how to do this. >> john heilemann. >> bob -- >> it i may just interject here, how to do it is exactly the question. and presidents will look at machines and ultimately ask the key question, will this be effective? will this do the job? and militarily trying to set back the iranian program is possible, but to really destroy it, intelligence has shown they're building all kinds of secret sites. it's not a simple intelligence
problem. and then the -- i think the other issue becomes, you think down the road to the third or fourth bounce after some military action. what's the aftermath? and the great lesson of the iraq war, to a certain extent, the continuing afghan war is how do you deal with it two months later? four months later? a year later? and of course, in iraq, that was the problem year after year. and so with the lessons of what has occurred in afghanistan and iraq, there is -- i think and david knows more about this -- a great pause in the administration. let's see if we can avoid military action almost at any cost. >> david and bob, in that order, there's obviously a lot of reluctance on the part of the u.s. military to get involved in this there. we've seen reporting on this for the last few months where the
pentagon's war gamed this out and thinks it's a very problematic scenario. so the question seems to me, at least in the immediate future, is what is the likelihood that either of you think that israel would go ahead and do this alone in the near term, meaning between now and election day? >> you know, john, that's just guessing. i mean, it's something under 50% in my mind. it's something above 20%, and where precisely that would be, i don't know. i think -- i mean, i hear netanyahu looking for a way to get sufficient u.s. assurance that he can climb down from the position that he's taken. but i may be mishearing that. this is a very delicate process. >> bob? >> yeah. it depends on intelligence. and do you really know what's going on in iran? and i think the answer is have
some good intelligence, but it's never sufficient to give you the data. i mean, look at the back-and-forth for eight months in the obama white house, in the intelligence community finally deciding to go after osama bin laden. when they had the core information for months. there is a lot of hesitancy. there is a lot of debate. and i think for good reason. now, what israel's going to do, they could get what they think is sufficient intelligence and act. but, you know, whether that's something the united states would back up or not, you know, david says between 20% and 50%. that's reasonable, but boy, you could just see the intelligence data coming in and netanyahu saying okay, we have crossed that -- the iranians have crossed that red line ha he has
in his own mind and do something. >> david, mark halperin here. the administration seems to me to have been most effective in the arab spring when it's had support from the arab league or big countries in the region. what has been the reaction from saudi arabia, from others in the region to the recent violence, the anti-americanism, and is the administration doing anything to rally a unified response? >> the arab world, in general, has been running for cover. this is, as the french say, save yourself if you can. this region is being torched. there's a revolution on. and the revolution still spreads from one end of the arab world to the other. the saudis think most about trying to prevent that revolution from exploding in their own eastern province. i think a hopeful sign that emerged as this last week of violence, the terrible killing of our ambassador in libya, as that week ended, the local
governments were being more aggressive in taking control of security. you saw that in egypt. the united states has been pleading for morsi to send out the police, to be aggressive in breaking up the demonstrations, to take action. we've been saying that to all these vt governments, and i'll l you something. u.s. marines are ready to move in to evacuate americans if these governments can't do it. i mean, we're just not going to sit by and watch another incident which a consulate or embassy is overrun. the hopeful sign, and secretary of defense panetta expressed this over the weekend, that the level of violence is diminishing as the governments use greater force. and he said there's going to continue to be a low level of violence for a while. and we have to understand that. but i just would note that that change in the pattern of actions in the last few days. >> david, we're bouncing around on you a little bit, but you're such an expert on all this. we want to ask you about
afghanistan, too, because of these insider attacks. we've been amazed around this set at how little the two presidential candidates have talked about afghanistan, the fact that they're -- >> you should be amazed. >> -- there's a hot war going on and it's not mentioned on the campaign trail. do these reports that we get almost every week now of the very people that were supposed to turn over the situation at the end of 2014 are now turning against us and killing our men and women, does this change the dynamic in afghanistan at all? does it make it more or less likely that we get out in 2014? >> well, it's a certainty that our combat forces are getting out in 2014. indeed they will end their lead combat role,s phrase that's used, in the middle of 2013. i've been to camp bastion where this latest attack took place many times, and i'll tell you, the ability to get in there in waves of attackers wearing u.s. army uniforms and do the kind of damage they did tells you anybody who says that the
taliban is back on its heels, the u.s. uses, the momentum of the taliban has been checked, i'm sorry, if you can penetrate camp bastion in this kind of operation, you still have a strong fighting force. i think the point you started off with is the most important one for us here, not on the scene to make, which is that this is really important. our country is still at war. u.s. soldiers are at risk and getting killed almost every day. and there needs to be more discussion in our presidential campaign about what policies people are adopting. where does president obama want to go with this? what's the real critique that romney has? would he try to keep u.s. troops there? we just don't know. >> david ignatius, thank you very much. you can read david's latest column at thewashingtonpost.com. bob, stay with us. we're going to talk about your new book, "the price of politics: an inside look at the successes and failures of obama's first term." coming up, new warning signs
that the u.s. economy may still be on the decline with "financial times'" jillian tett. a nice day all across the northeast, but it's a different story down in through texas, louisiana where we do have heavier pockets of rain. we are going to see temps all through the northeast in the 70s and 80s. looks real nice. almost a little fall-like. there's that heavy rain moving into louisiana and western tennessee. we could end up with two to three inches of rain in some of those heavier thunderstorms. and those storms are spreading east as we go into tomorrow. so today it's quiet across the east coast, but tomorrow, we could end up with some severe weather, especially as we go into later in the evening on tuesday. but it should all clear out by the time we get into wednesday. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.
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the first time a deal was passed, a predecessor of mine made the case for a balanced approach by saying this. would you rather reduce deficits and interest rates by raising revenue from those who are not now paying their fair share, or would you rather accept larger budget deficits, higher interest rates and higher unemployment? and i think i know your answer. those words were spoken by ronald reagan. but today many republicans in the house refuse to consider this kind of balanced approach. an approach that was pursued not only by president reagan but by the first president bush, by president clinton, by myself, and by many democrats and republicans in the united states senate. >> the sad truth is that the president wanted a blank check six months ago, and he wants a blank check today.
this is just not going to happen. you see, there's no stalemate here in congress. the house passed a bill to raise the debt limit with bipartisan support. and this week, while the senate is struggling to pass a bill filled with phony accounting and washington gimmicks, we're going to pass another bill, one that was developed with the support of the bipartisan leadership of the u.s. senate. >> that was president obama and house speaker john boehner at the height of the debt-limit crisis last summer. and bob woodward has more behind-the-scenes details on that political chess match in his latest book, "the price of politics." and in it he writes, in part, the debt limit crisis was a time of peril for the united states, its economy and its place in the global financial order. when you examine the record in depth, you cannot help but conclude that neither president obama nor speaker boehner handled it particularly well. despite their evolving relationship, neither was able to transcend their fixed partisan convictions and dogmas, rather than fixing the problem,
they postponed it. bob, did one perhaps share more of the blame than the other, or do you say both brought the situation to the bottom? >> well, both did, but the president is the leader, and we turn to presidents. they discuss in the white house if the economy tanks, in the history books it is that this happened in the obama presidency, not the speakership of john boehner. so this is a question in the end about presidential leadership. the quotes you had from obama and boehner went on last year. the grave difficulty is that we're back in the soup again. in a couple of months, congress is going to have to reauthorize the government to go out and borrow money. we're spending $1 trillion each year more than is taken in.
so this is a never-ending crisis, and simple bottom line is, they have not found a way to put the government's financial house in order, and not doing that could generate a problem that would affect everyone in this country. the deadlock continues, unfortunately. >> bob, you know it's fascinating reading this book. you basically turned to conventional wisdom of a lot of people in the mainstream media this is all the republicans' fault on its head. and i go back and i look particularly at a quote from eric cantor early on. and what cantor said early on in the obama presidency is what republicans were whispering when it looked like there was going to be some bipartisanship early on. and cantor's quote here is, "whew, he said after meeting president obama for the first
time promising bipartisanship. he said we may be in this minority for a while." and of course, soon the lines were drawn. the president told him, you have the president famously saying well, i won. i trump you. and basically we're going to do it our way. what happened there? who was pushing the president to take a no-holds-barred approach? >> a lot of this is rahm emanuel who was the white house chief of staff the first two years, and his basic philosophy was, we have the votes. the votes screw you, and they rammed through things that they wanted, that they felt were necessary, and it created an environment of hostility with the republicans. at the same time, the republicans were springloaded to go active on resisting all of
this. and you go through -- and i have the meeting notes and take you to the scenes -- and you see the president is always there saying, we have to meet more. we're going to be accommodating. we're going to listen. give me your ideas. and then in the first two years, they don't get -- they get the ideas from the republicans, but they totally reject them. and so this energizes and galvanizes the republicans and in a great deal accounts for the victory the republicans had in taking over the house in 2010. >> and bob, you talk about this. and you see it time and time again in your book where republicans give ideas, and every idea is rejected outright. i want to focus, though, on a quote. and i've got to admit, just by reading press reports, i didn't know the other side of the mitch mcconnell quote. and i think i, at least, owe him an apology here on the air because we've repeated it a thousand times where mitch mcconnell says, my one priority,
my top priority is preventing a second obama term. but you actually pull out what nobody in the media pulls out, and that's the rest of mitch mcconnell's statement. what is it? >> and where mcconnell says, "i don't want obama to fail, i want him to change." and i agree with you. i think that that's significant. now, there is a brazenness to the first part of the quote, and as you know, mitch mcconnell is -- >> he's tough. >> -- a hard ass on these subjects, to say the least. >> but mcconnell went on to say -- and it's just never been reported -- mcconnell went on to say, but if he changes, i want to work with him, and basically that's the attitude of if the guy will meet us halfway -- and i see john heilemann rolling his eyes around the set, but time and time and time again, republicans offered suggestions, and time and time and time again, the first two years, the president rejected them outright.
>> and if you go back to last year, the famous debt ceiling negotiations for 44 days, it was john boehner, the speaker, who came to obama, not the other way around. the speaker came to obama and said, "we need to work something out here." and he proposed, instead of tax increases, he proposed tax reform. now, tax reform is hard. i call it the great white whale. you can chase it around the ocean, and it will kill you, but in 1986, ronald reagan was able to come through with a tax reform program that actually worked. so it's conceivable. what happens here, though, is there is pressure on the republicans. boehner was under immense pressure from the eric cantors and the tea party wing to, hey, no way should you be negotiating with the president. in fact, when i interviewed the president for this book, he said
there were republicans who came to the oval office and said if we make a deal on this, it will ensure your re-election. so we can't make a deal. on the democratic side, you see in vivid color and detail how nancy pelosi and harry reid are not going to go along with a lot of this. they don't -- they're quite resistant to a deal that will involve any medicare or entitlement cuts. >> bob, there's been a lot of psychoanalysis of the president, a lot of talk about his personality, one that's perhaps not conducive to building relation 147ships ships in wash. a guy who like ronald reagan or bill clinton doesn't enjoy politics. some democrats have come out and said that's sort of a romantic view of history, that reagan and tip o'neill spent every night together. is that important? is personality as important as a lot of people have made it seem?
and how has it impacted what's happened or not happened in washington over the last 3 1/2 years? >> well, relationships are important. and you need to have them. you need to be able to call people. in all of this back-and-forth last year, boehner and obama were developing a relationship, but instead of meeting, they did a lot of this on the phone. and there were monumental miscommunications on the phone where nobody was listening, apparently. to my knowledge, there's no secret tape-recording of it, and you need to have the kind of -- you know, it's not far from the capitol to the white house. you need to have an open channel. you need to know how people are thinking. you know, it really does matter. >> but bob, following up on willie's question, more specifically, is it safe to say
less so than most other presidents in modern political history, this president does not care -- forget about socializing with the other party after hours, even socializing with his own party. >> yes, that's absolutely correct. and larry summers, who was the economics in the white house the first two years is quoted saying the president really doesn't like these people up on the hill. and the president has a group of people he plays poker with. no people connected to the congress or the republican party. a group he plays golf with. a group he plays basketball with. and so there are not these relationships. now -- >> why don't we read the exact quote. >> sure. >> and then let you follow up. mika. >> obama really doesn't have joy of the game. clinton basically loved negotiating with a bunch of other pols, about anything, obama, he really didn't like these guys.
>> and you're exactly right, bob. he doesn't -- whether it's playing cards like clinton did with other people, playing golf. when barack obama goes out and plays golf, bill clinton always used that as an excuse to bend people's arms and become their buddies. the president golfs with his own insular group of people. >> yes. that's just part of the difficulty here. the real substantive difficulty is they never got down to saying okay, what's the tax reform plan? what's the entitlement reform plan? we've got to fix this. tim geithner, the treasury secretary, is in the book repeatedly running around saying, as john boehner says, fire! fire! we can't keep on this spending binge. and we have got a spending addiction. and the conclusion,
unfortunately, here is in all the deal making, last year they pushed all the problems to 2013, after the election. and they're literally, in 3 1/2 years of the obama presidency, no spending cuts, no tax increases. you know, just off to 2013. well, there is an op-ed piece in "the wall street journal" by george schultz and other economists making the point, we are handing the next government, whether it's obama, romney, another treasury secretary, a problem that is literally unmanageable unless the people in congress and the white house are going to get serious about making some painful compromises. >> so to your point, you bring up bill clinton as being so successful at being able to do this, but there are some certainly problems and pitfalls that come with that.
there was a piece -- i won't read it -- but in "the new york times" this sunday about leaders and whether or not the great ones are all gregarious. and it talks about introverted leaders who possession an innate caution that may be more valuable ultimately in the long run than we realize. and it points out bill clinton's problems with gregariousness. >> but you still have to build relationships, whether you're introve introverted, extroverted, you've got to get people over to the white house. john heilemann, for good reason, it's long been called having somebody in the oval office the greatest home field advantage in the world. and you've got to play that game. and of course, we're not just blaming the president. it's the republicans who have been, from day one, out to get him. >> yeah. >> you could say the same thing about democrats and george w. bush, republicans and bill clinton. >> there's nobody who's not a little bit odd and freaked out about being president, and there's no one being incredibly
flattered of being invited to camp david, two tools the president would use. bob, with all your books, a first draft of history, and congratulations on it. i want to you look forward a little bit, though. if president gets elected, and i think if the election were held today, he would get re-elected. on the basis of how he and boehner got on the discussions of the grand bargain, is that a template they can carry forward if obama is re-elected, if boehner is speaker again? from november to january, can they take that deal back out and say okay, we got pretty close last time, let's work forward, or is that so dead and it's caused so much scarring that that will never be used as a template to move forward? >> well, ultimately, that's the question. there's a lot of bad blood here between the president and speaker boehner and the republicans. and in talking to speaker boehner at great length about
this, his problem is -- and he says it quite openly -- he said look, i need this job like a hole in the head. i want to cut spending. and there have been no spending cuts. and the willingness to cut spending on the part of obama is not great. he talks about it. when i interviewed the president, the rhetoric is there. he said, i'd willingly lose an election to fix this problem. intellectually, president obama understands the magnitude of it, and it is a threat to the united states. >> bob, let me cut you off there. i've been hearing this from the president's closest people since january of 2009. in february of 2009, the president warned about the coming social security and medicare crisis. we've heard it time and time again. and yet, you're exactly right. not a single significant
spending cut. not a single move on medicare. medicaid, social security, defense spending. and you even have a presidential debt commission that is thrown under the bus by the president. so if we are to assume that the president means what he says, that he is willing to lose an election to cut spending, what happened? >> what happened is politics. and that's why the book is called "the price of politics." the calculation in the white house is that the politics are on their side in the short run. that the president -- you ran the clip where he said oh, we've got to get the people at the top end to pay their fair share. quite frankly, i think he's exactly right. but there's not enough money in the top end to even begin to solve the problem that we are talking about here.
you need -- and this is where, with all the problems, everyone including myself have with paul ryan, paul ryan is on the right track when he says we've got to solve the problem. and the problem is we have this entitlement spending, medicare, medicaid, social security. in the next ten years, by conservative estimates, is going to double. we can't borrow that much money. >> that's easy to say. but they won't agree to anything. >> what do you mean, what's easy to say? >> that we can't keep kicking the can down the road. thank you for saying that. >> paul ryan has put a budget out, unlike democrats. the democratic senate who's in charge and has the responsibility. how long has it been, bob, since a democratic senate has put a budget out? >> years. there's no question about that. >> it's stunning. >> and look. i mean, this, again, all gets in the politics of it and so forth, but it's clear somebody has got to do something really serious.
what's interesting emotionally and politically last year, both president obama and speaker boehner knew in their gut they didn't have the votes to do anything serious. but they believed that if they as individuals and the leaders -- leaders of their parties agreed and went before the microphones and cameras and said, look, this is serious, no one's going to like it, everyone's going to find something to hate in it, but we have to do this. that the momentum and the unity would carry them over the finish line. now, they never got to that point. but, you know, you guys have been around the country, and you talk to people. and the average person realizes, because they deal with this in their own private budgets and private economies, that you can't keep spending this amount of money. there comes a day of reckoning.
and the day of reckoning, and al simpson in the book hypothesized you can begin on a monday where everything is fine, and then all of a sudden interest rates spike because there's a debt crisis because somehow we can't sell our treasury bonds in the marketplace. and by friday, everyone would be cutting spending. businesses would be cutting back significantly and laying people off. you know, the point here is that we need a serious intervention to fix it. >> we need to agree, too. bob woodward, thank you so much. the book is "the price of politics." we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." now, that's what i call a test drive.
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goldwater all before 6:00 a.m. there was the morning where willie talked about the french and indian war which apparently had not been part of the vanderbilt curriculum like a lot of other things. without joe and mika, there wouldn't be a chance to talk about these things at all. >> congratulations. five years, mika, and you still don't understand a single word i say. [ male announcer ] if you stash tissues
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post their first quarterly decline in earnings since 2009. big picture. >> yeah, that's quite emboldened because what's it's really saying is the growth outside of america over the last couple of years which people have been counting on from places like china and india is actually starting to slow down, and that's quite worrying. i mean, ironically, we've had them suggesting in recentoecd s days america's rate of growth could be faster than the global rate of growth for the coming year and certainly, this kind of boom we have been enjoying, places like china, certainly is -- not coming entirely off the cliff yet but certainly slowing down, that is going to make the election debate that much more highly charged. >> obviously, bad news on the economy, often start a domino effect. i want to ask you though about this other piece in the "new york times" that i noticed yesterday, sunday section, about obama's jobs numbers and a certain splice of those numbers and that would be the pace of
creation of jobs in the private sect sector, during the obama administration is garrett than the pace than other of george w. bush's terms in office. what do you make of that? is that an important thing to point out or is it parsing a bad situation? >> this is so highly charged right now. yes, you can crunch the numbers and say under some measures, the obama job track have been better than earlier periods. the problem is for most ordinary american voters right now what they ♪ unemployment rate is very high by historical standards and that's not going to change soon. you saw this with the decision last week, the degree of attention is it is getting from policymakers. one way to make sense of what the fed did last week, essentially, it was putting foam on the runway in recognition of the fact we may have some more economic bumpy times, bad landings ahead and whether those kind of pressure is going to come from the failure to reach any kind of decision on the fiscal cliff, whether it is
going to be europe, a slow down in places like china, an awful lot of nasty stuff that could come out toward the end of the year the fed is preparing for and that is playing into the jobless debate because a loss of confidence right now is exactly the kind of thing that is going to stop american companies from hiring. >> what are the optimists who look at the world economy now see as the ingredient of possible increase in the grade of economic growth around the world? >> well, the problem is so much is depending on confidence right now and you just haven't got the sense in either europe or the u.s. of confidence in the way policymakers are creating policy. what is a peculiar situation on both sides of the atlantic, the central banks are providing stimulus to the economy, putting you the economy, if you like, on life support, not quite life support, but giving them a just a moment. the same time, not wanting to take away all the pressure from politicians to actually do something to fix the longer term fiscal challenges. those in europe and the u.s., you have got a very dangerous situation where governments are dancing october edge of an abyss, if you like, i mean, the
fiscal cliff in america. you have got all the problems with the eurozone over in europe. and that kind of dancing on the edge, going close to the edge, tipping to back, close to the edge, tiptoeing back, is terrible for confidence and doesn't persuade consumers or confidences to go forward and spend and correct the kind of feel-good recovery and job growth people want to see. >> you mentioned the abyss and used the word terrible. >> if you want to be optimistic you have got a lot of consumers coming through right now in places like china who hopefully will go forth and start buying products, buying ipads, buying cards, buying maybe goods produced in america as well. >> jillian, thank you for that brirkts sunny, optimistic point of view this morning. we will be right back with much more "morning joe."
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up next, a new political piece buzzing around washington overnight about dissension in the romney ranks. >> also conservatives are really, again, really starting to aggressively come out. eric erickson now following jack welch and rupert murdoch, craig shirley, others. >> all speaking out. >> it's tough. >> we will have the details straight ahead on "morning joe."
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andrea mitchell. a lot to talk about. >> boy, i tell you what, a lot to talk about international lakers lot to talk about domestically. internationally, the chaos continues. the wall -- the "new york times" has a front page story, "cultural clash fuels muslims raging at film, deroute is values conflict with free speech." i don't know if i would use the word devout to associate anything that's happened over the past week with the salve rajry that we have been seeing on our television sets over the past week over a crude film that's been uplinked and being used as an excuse to kill americans. >> it is not the excuse, just the touch stone. >> we see how naive every president is toness co-come in and transform the middle east. if we could talk to them, they
would understand us. >> this president talking about the fact he was raised in the muslim country would somehow take -- make things better this middle east. i talked to intelligence people all weekend. they hate us because of their religion, they hate us because of their culture and they hate us because of peer pressure. you talk to any intelligence person it is the same thing. all these people that think we are going to go over there and change them and make them hate us less are justify eve. think about the savagery, just t the sheer unrestrained savagery we have seen in the middle east because of a crude film. they know what they're doing. they know it's a crude film. they know it has nothing to do with the united states government. it is an excuse. one intelligence person told me, just scratched the surface. and if you gave every street vendor from street vender to prime minister in that region a
chance to throw a rock at the u.s. embassy, they would.or to prime minister in that region a chance to throw a rock at the u.s. embassy, they would. >> look what is happening in afghanistan 11 years later. >> it just me, willie, we have the grave concern about the tragedy that happened to the ambassador and our people that have served so proudly for the -- you know, for the state department who were killed and yet this weekend, more u.s. troops in afghanistan gunned down by our supposed allies. this happens every day. this happens every day. and yes, our u.s. ambassador being killed was just absolutely horrific, but every single day, young american men and women are gunned down in afghanistan. >> 51 of them this year on insider attacks, 51 nato
atroops. >> nobody is talking about t. to your point exactly about the film, after the fact, the taliban on this insider attack said it was about the film. this was about the film. >> oh, just shut up. >> you don't storm into one of the most heavily fortified bases on the face of the earth, camp bastion, and go in and take out nato troops and have people -- intelligence investigating this place based on the spontaneous outrage at a film. this was obviously plan and after the fact, went back and blamed -- >> the question is how can we beat the taliban when the taliban can read into the future? because they have been doing this for months now these insider -- the film? game may break. just like, oh, you know, they hate us because of waterboarding. no, they don't, they hate us because they hate us. they hate us because of obamas dra ma. no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us. they hate us because somebody burned a corn. no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us. they hate us because of this
crude film. no, they don't. they hate us because they hate us and any u.s. politician that thinks they are going to go in and transform region and stop people from hating us because they hate rust absolute fool. they are absolute fools. andrea you know, it continues. you look -- you look at these protests raging across the middle east. you look also even before this film at how low america's approval rating is, country by country. you know, we'd president who was going to transform america's standing in the world and make us proud to be americans again. the fact is a poll that was released last week, i think it may have been pew, shows that, except for france, they do love us in france now, more than he did when bush was president, but especially across the middle east and these areas that are so key to stability across the world, america's standing is lower now than it's been. it just keeps getting lower. why?
>> well, you know, i think that a number of things, we are perceived not as the lib rarity but we are perceived as the other, as different. and these are -- they are different from country to country. let's face it, in libya there is a lot of pro-american feeling, in not only the government but also among the people. you saw pro-american protests after those horrific deaths. so, you still have al qaeda influences, you have large numbers of militias, heavily armed militias in libya. this is a barely postwar -- postcism war environment. egypt is another case. egypt is struggling to find out what its national identity is and desperately in need of money. the egyptian leadership pleading with the imf, pleading with us for money. at the same time, teetering because of its long-standing fundamentalist beliefs, that is why the president sent a strong
sig nam to president morsi last week saying not an ally, not an enemy. what happened really troubles me is afghanistan. this raid on friday you not on the insider raids over the weekend, but the friday raid on that camp bastion was not only organized, it was three heavily armed units in american army uniforms penetrating that base. that is the most troubling of all. >> it is unbelievable, our standing and how things are falling apart internationally. and it's not, i'm sorry, not because of the film. the film is the latest excuse. >> following protests breaking in afghanistan now. crowds are setting fire to police cars all in response, of course, more protests in response to this film. >> the film. i just can't believe this film. yes. yes. it's the film. and by the way, this film is -- well, let's talk really quickly also about you know, you have
people now that seem to be rallying in defense of this filmmaker, accusing cops that -- a lot of people on the fringes of the conservative movement, you negotiate the same people who have been saying, oh, you know, these polls, every poll that has come out since the democratic convention is a farce, right? every poll. suddenly, the methodology for polling is a farce. and suddenly, los angeles police officers are brown shirts. brown shirts. people calling american law enforcement officers brown shirts, simply because they are taking a guy, john heilemann, who is on probation already, on probation, they have a right to do that under the constitution of the united states of america. but they have been so frantic this weekend, they are chasing their tails because mitt romney is an awful candidate and now, even conservatives, eric erickson out this morning, rupert murdoch said it, jack
welch said it i said it last week and just absolutely pill y pilloried by the extreme right wing. it is a reality. he is a horrible candidate. he has perhaps one of the worst-run presidential campaigns in modern american history but now it is the pollsters' fault and the brown shirts' fault for going after this "christian filmmaker" as matt drum called him over the weekend, a christian filmmaker. >> yes, there were a couple of prominent conservative bloggers calling for the president's resignation and saying this barack obama is not fit to be president of the united states on the basis of the fact woe sic the brown shirts on the filmmaker in question and rates the unfortunate spector of owe? what derangement syndrome. >> the person you are talking about i won't mention his name on television, usually a pretty level-headed guy. over the past week, mark halperin, conservatives on the
far right in the blogosphere have lost their head. they lost their head. i don't like talking about myself. willy, what are the words you will never hear from me? >> i told you so, right? >> i just don't do it. i'm not gonna say i told you so. but not like we didn't see this reign wreck coming, the torts professor told me, you see the next question come at you like a freight train out of the mist and it's coming straight -- we saw this coming. we knew romney was a horrible candidate and now his campaign is just in disarray. eric erickson, rupert murdoch, jack welch, myself, politico, i guess, he has an article out this morning talking about just how many conservatives are saying this is an absolute nightmare for an election that republicans should be winning. the romney team's blowing it. >> a long list of people being critics now, also a long list of things that conservatives were being distracted by, instead of talking about the economy and america's role in the world, the two big issues in the campaign,
they are talking about meet ya bias. they are talking about, you know, the arrest -- guy being taken into custody brief any los angeles. >> right. the polls. >> the polls. >> every poller. >> and, you know, governor romney, incumbent upon him, as the candidate, not the staff, not the bloggers, not the critics, incumbent upon him to say i'm going to make this election the last two months about important things. if you can't do it -- >> bill crystal said it right it peggy noonan stayed right, you said it before, yes, the immediate gentleman biased there is a liberal media bias in the nation a media. guess what we are in manhattan, new york. we are not in manhattan, kansas. if we were in manhattan, kansas, we would have a conservative bias. there was a bias in 1980 when ronald reagan won 41 states, and in 1984 when ronald reagan won 49 states, a liberal media bias
in 1988 when george h. w. bush destroyed michael dukakis, a liberal media bias in 2000 and 2004, get over t. >> peggy said it best, you got to transcend it if you are a republican. >> any time in those -- compared to all those other elections, there were not -- nothing like the conservative media counterweight there is now. >> right. >> the extent there is in the mainstream media some degree of liberal bias, no fox news in 1980, talk radio. >> drum. >> in anything you can the world much more -- you look at the full spectrum of media, there is much more diversity and conservatives have a megaphone in our media environment. >> look at the conservatives the past week, week and a half, that have said, hey there's a problem here. i said it on saturday. "the wall street journal" said it last sunday. laura ingram came out on monday, rush on tuesday was talking b all saying the same thing, they
have decided to run a campaign based on nothing. you said it six months ago. rush limbaugh, willie, rush limbaugh staying on tuesday that this campaign is about nothing. you know, i was saying margaret thatcher would have never taken over the conservative movement in great britain in 189 ever 975 or won in 1979. ronald reagan would never, ever have won in 1980 if they had run a nothing campaign. they run a nothing campaign and guess what they got nothing. >> that all changes today though. >> do it is change today? >> they stay is all changing today. >> a kwhand is going to happen today? >> new ads on poll say briefing call and a series of speeches from governor romney focussing on his economic plan and the big choices we face as a nation. all starts by pure coincidence today. >> have they got the message? >> hate to say time will tell you about we will see. various times we have heard things are about to change and
they haven't really changed. maybe today they will. >> what i just don't understand is if i were running against this guy, barack obama, as a conservative, this would be so easy. this would be so easy to find him. he spent $5 really deeper in debt exauto bailout, bank bailout, the largest stimulus package ever which nobody in congress read before it was passed, nobody -- nobody could tell us, democrats still can't tell us what's in the health care bill. most democrats can't tell us what is in the health care bill. big government has run amok over the past four years. trillion dollar deficits every year. are we better off today after all this historic spending? no, we are no one-third of americans think we are going in the right direction. that means two-thirds think we are going in the wrong direction. unemployment is still over 8%. the last jobs report, the number went down, that maybe good politically but the economic reality is it was just horrific. you talk to any finance person
that's going to decide where this country goes the next couple of years, mark halperin, they are going to tell you it is not getting better, it is getting worse around we are probably going to fall off a cliff. i was talking to a guy yesterday who is one of the top people on wall street. he said i'm scared to death. one of two things are going to happen, be japan for a decade or we're gonna fall off a cliff and we are going to be california. >> in 1992, enremembers the little rock war room had a sign in it that said, it's the economy, stupid. but the sign said two other things. it said, it's the economy, stupid. it said, change versus more of the same and don't forget health care. and those are pretty much the same things mitt romney could run on if he had the discipline to run on those three things and not on media bashing and all the thing these became distracted by in tomorrow's show, regis philbin is on the show talking about how it feels to be replaced by a 6'5", 200-pound
former defensive end. that is a bad day. joe klein will join the conversation. but first, here is dillon dryer with a check of the forecast. >> things are looking good all across the east coast but we are seeing some rain, especially down across the gulf coast states and we are going to see some of that rain start to move in the east as we go into your tuesday. temperature-wise august little cool up through montana about 16, almost 20 degrees cooler than this time yesterday. what's the reason into? a cold front moving through it is also bringing showers and storms back through minneapolis, but the big story is the heavy rain that's falling across new orleans. lots of lightning with this activity down in that area and that is all going to move in here for tomorrow, especially tomorrow evening and tomorrow night. we could end up with the chance of some severe weather through had the new york city area and through the rest of the east coast. but today, most of those showers and storms down across the southeast and then we are going to see those spread eastward as we go into your tuesday. but all clears out through the middle of the week and the rest of the week looks really nice. you are watching "morning joe,"
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i don't think so, bud? no, you go first. no, no you go first. jinx. >> no script. no set tour dates. no predetermined deals. just american legend clint eastwood performing one half of a conversation with an invisible, irritated and foul-mouthed barack obama. it's the show audiences are giving a sitting ovation. obama isn't the only politician in the hot seat. don't miss clint taking it to jimmy carter. >> nice work on those hostages. that turned out great. >> mayor michael bloomberg. >> just let people eat soda. >> and chris christie. >> i think we're gonna need a bigger chair. >> okay. 22 past the hour. here with us now from washington, nbc's chief white house correspondent and host of "the daily rundown," chuck off. and here on set, political column nist for ti"time" magazi,
joe klein. >> good to see guys. a week ago, i was brig problems upcoming in the romney campaign. "the wall street journal" the next davis talk you can about the same thing, a pre-existi pre-existingipre-existing condition of not standing for anything. laura ingram, rush limbaugh, before that jack welch, rupp. murdoch, craig share lakers a lot of people piling on this terribly run romney campaign. this morning, eric erickson coming on saying it is a terribly run campaign that is very significant. >> jennifer rube innocent "washington post," who has been very apologetic for the romney campaign previously, been sort of very helpful to them, she has -- >> jennifer rube reason one of the romney campaign's biggest apologists, no more. it seems like the wagons have stopped circling. and no longer do you have a lot
of conservatives blaming the pollsters or saying we are losing because the media is liberal. i mean, reagan could have used that one. so, what's going on in camp romney? >> how about let's look at the actual race. yes, the president is ahead, but it's not like it's a landslide, not like he is blowing romney away. so here you have this completely sort of hand-wringing, knife fighting, infighting, i can't believe the stuff that went public to politico, including somebody giving a draft speech excerpt that they wrote for romney and leaking that out. i mean, it just -- it's amazing to me. it felt like reading a campaign obituary, a prebituary, if you will, rather than figure out, okay what does the campaign do next? it's not like the president's at 55. you know exhe is sitting at 49, 50. necessary good shape, not great shape. >> yeah. >> so the idea that they are
throwing in the towel at this point seems odd unless this san -- this unless this is one last shot of trying to get rid of stuart stevens, does seems that is the focus of all of these criticisms comes around to it is about stuart. >> and finally, champion small business, have tax policies, regulation and health care policies that help small business. we put those in place, we will add 12 million new jobs in four
years. >> there is another one swim, h -- this there is another one, right? >> featuring mitt romney on camera, get people comfortable with the notion he was an agent of change. >> i think these are the best two spots we have seen, where were they three weeks ago, a month ago? >> joe klein, the mismanagement of this campaign has been absolutely mind-boggling, from the convention speech. pete wayner, a great writer, pete wayner writes a speech. stuart stevens basically tear it is up and they are scrambling at the last moment to put a convention speech together? >> i don't know about -- i don't know about pete as a speechwriter. i think he has done some good stuff in the past. but for me, i have seen this movie before. this is total deja vu. september 2004.
i mean, stuart stevens in the role of bob shrum. do you remember in 2004, the clinton people stepped into the kerry campaign and took it over. james carville, paul begala, joe lockhart, mike mccurry. and then right around this time, they decided that they had to refocus on the biggest issue of the year that kerry had been smudging, the war in iraq, gave his first really strong anti-iraq speech and he was still six points behind. he made it up in the first debate answered still lost. but we have been here before. we have seen this. >> but we have also seen this with winning campaigns. you can go through dukakis and kerry and mccain and find campaign discord in articles like this you can find campaign discord, clinton '92, obama 2008. you can find it in bush 2000 it is up to the candidate to rise
above the stuff which exists in every campaign, stand for something and finish strong. >> that is a question. how much of this -- falls on romney? >> falls on romney. but the other difference is that unlike the kerry campaign in 2004, nothing's gonna happen this time. stuart stevens is gonna stay in charge, things are going to keep on going along this track. they are trying to folk count economy. but i'm a little bit wary of that everybody says the economy is so ter tin and we focus on jobs figures. you think about the way an average person thinks about the economy what do they think about? they think about my job and not going so well, haven't got the raise i want. my house, my values are coming back up and my 401(k) is booming. >> only one out of three americans think america is going to the right direction, a right track/wrong track that would bury any incumbent.
>> that was the biggest bump the last ten days and single most important thing that happened is it went from a third to 40%, right? that's what we showed in our state polls. >> especially the swing states. >> national poll, ohio, florida. >> that's right. so i think that is something there. but to go to both mark and joe's point about the sort of campaign infighting, it's all true it happen on winning you campaigns but happens on winning campaigns much earlier. as mark points out, the candidate sort of figures it out and calls the shots. i mean, i thought the most damning quote in the politico piece was what the romney campaign most desperately needs is a gay from bain to come in here and help them. and they are right r >> willie, that's the irony of this boy, this -- doesn't this, the irony, write its own chapter and mark halperin and john heilemann's next book, the great irony, i have been believing, mitt romney is a great manager, boy, a great manager as a president. you look at the people he has put around him, you look at the
organization it is absolute disarray trace, is absolute disarray, stuart stichs doing the job of three people. pete wayner wants to write a speech for the con ven eggs, he asks if he can have access. they keep him away. i mean, it seems like -- >> the candidate. >> that was one of the most stunning details i in politico. >> pure chaos. a week out, writ convention speech for mitt romney yet he cannot meet with the candidate himself to talk about his view and his vision. >> see what he sounds like and feels like when you are writing for somebody. don't you have to know them? >> well, all there infighting or perceived infighting, whatever it is only matters how it attempts the campaign and where the campaign is. if they are talking about today sort of a reboot and now we are going to get specific it is remarkable to me we are a month and a half away, on september 17th, they are going to reboot the campaign. now we are we are going to get specifics. >> this happened before? >> it happened before wither canry. all of a sudden in 2004, kerry became the anti-iraq candidate,
yesterday been kind of waffling on it for the -- before he was against it the rest of the year. it's probably too late and the bottom line is we are sitting here talking about what a terrible candidate mitt romney is one name we haven't mentioned the last ten minutes is barack obama. >> we are not sitting here talking about it unfortunately for mitt romney, conservatives. i staurtd. "wall street journal" follows, laura ingram, rush limbaugh, eric erickson. >> his own campaign. someone from that campaign leaking. >> this really does, mika, feel like the sort of spinning you get in late october for a campaign that is going to lose except it is starting in early september. >> feels like they are scrambling, the question how
much can they do now, unless they actually get some other minds in there that really have some power. >> chuck, not going to do that, are they? romney seems to be risk averse. again, this -- >> does it come down to him? >> this guy a turn around expert, he can't turn around his own campaign, he can save others but he can't save himself? >> i think the politico piece correctly points out, he is a loyalist though, which is why the people that work for romney do always love working for him because he doesn't turn on -- he is the last person to turn on people. but i do want to separate something out here. there are parts of the romney campaign being run very well. i think their field organization is light years ahead of where mccain was four years ago, probably better around at least up to par in sophistication of bush '04. so parts of the campaign being run really well but you could argue those are the parts of a campaign that stuart and the candidate aren't as involved in, sort of letting be run by the
guys know how to do it riches beand rick wylie, matt rhodes, doing their thing and leaving them aloechbl the part where they sort of over -- overtinker is he with the candidate and the message. >> here we are on september 17th also. meek cache the thing we have to remember as well, that mccain -- that mccain did not have that romney has, money. >> lots of t. >> and going to be running 30-second ads and they are going to be burying barack obama's campaign message in an avalanche of ads, both their own and third party ads and they are going to go to the swing states and like chuck said, their laser focus, this is more like bush 2004 than mccain 2008 and even running a miserable campaign, they could still end up winning. >> except for one thing. >> yeah. >> there is a diminishing import to political advertising the further you go along in the campaign. the really successful advertising campaigns are the ones that come early, like
bush's against kerry in 2004, obama's against romney this summer. once you get to the fall, people are putting on the mute bunt. they have seen more political ads than -- >> we will see. we have more money this year than ever before. if mitt romney actually starts running good campaign ads, mark halperin, who knows, people may pay attention. >> let's make an original point, doesn't have two months, early voting is starting in a lot of place soon. the president's lead is five points, people are voting early that is a problem. >> right track/wrong track, mika, out of ohio we flashed up that chuck was talking about before, boy, look at that, 45% right track, 50% wrong track. you have got two, three percent undecided. >> who who is about to become the saudi arabia with the rust belt, all that oil and gas. >> the margins shrinking so fast for romney. on the tune sit closing. >> hey, joe, did you ever think i would be alabama's biggest defender on twitter? i saw you retweeted my defense
on that? i bow down -- >> shocked and stunned. >> bough down to the dominance of nick saban and alabama football. shouldn't be a number two in the country. they should get both places. >> you hate to say this because they will lose next week to appalachian state. >> of course they will. >> they are unbeaten right now. against a good arkansas team. they just tore them to shah reads. >> joe klein, thank you h chuck todd, thank you. >> mika cares. >> see you on the daily run down right after "morning joe." up next, the all-important fall fashion week just wrapped up here in new york. what are the hot trends hitting the run ways this limb pact the rest of us over the next year? yes, we are doing a fashion segment. yes we are. you are looking at me quizzically. how designers are influencing next on "morning joe."
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okay. this is exciting. >> big. >> a morning joe fashion segment. >> this is huge. we don't do this but we are doing it now with our friends. >> going to think outside the box. >> 'cause it is fashion week in new york. it. >> s and powerful people need to know how to dress. >> this isn't going to be like one of the morning show segments where you tell people how to turn a table cloth into a smock for the fall or anything. >> not going to have models that walk out? >> no. no. no let's find somebody -- let's do -- find somebody to do one of those branding things a five-minute makeover. >> here with us, owner of the salon at the carlyle hotel inw manhattanwwwwwww
manhattanwwwwwwwwz, eve dar reef. do you want to start with men or women? >> start with women, michelle, a lot of times, you see people walk across the stage at these fashion shows and they are like -- you have these things protruding from them. you will never see it on main street or the board rooms. what's big influence this year for influences? what do they need to be wearing? >> leather. leather. as you can see my dress. there you go. lett sear key trend. you are going to see it everywhere. >> a strong look or -- >> it can be a little -- there is this feeling of urban protection going on, i think the bad economy. so i feel like to soften that look it is better to put it with something classic, maybe a leather pencil skirt with a white shirt. >> i like that. >> just a touch of leather. >> david, what are you seeing coming into the salon? you guys have, like, one of the top salons in new york and the
country? what do you see coming in and what do you expect this fall? >> i see everything coming in because we are in a hotel. but what we are focusing on and what we are doing is looks that empower women. based upon a consultation to echo back what is going to make her comfortable, whether what is going to be chic, whether pum back hair, tremendously dimensional color, hair access source. seeing lots of access source with hair. >> a loft accessers is. eve, mika, people don't remember, five years ago when you started, she had black hair, went down to her belt buckle. >> then you made me cut it all off. >> this hair thing, the mika, was created by you? >> mika had more volume when i first met her. and i was -- you know, i have this big theory of the oval. and when the face is already perfect, basically --
>> you there go. >> you don't need that volume. >> okay. >> that tv -- that hair. doesn't move. >> so, what are women -- >> somebody at home saying i want to follow the latest trends in new york, people watch all across the country, what's the trend? >> you know, if you go to a party, when you go to a party and what do you see? you know, what sticks out? well, going to get the big accessory on it? big accessory, head bands, big bow. sleek, sleek hair. then you get the supernatural woman with big, curly hair, gorgeous. if you want to keep your hair long, it has to be one of your first assets. you don't want to have long hair stringy. >> can't be stringy? >> no, because it is going to take away from your look. i was talking to michelle before and said a gorgeous dress with limp hair, people are going to
look at the hair, not at the dress. so you really want to sleek your look. short air, cropped hair cut, very dropped, short, but super feminine h. >> and so much easier, by the way, so much easier. but michelle, i noticed geometric prints out there and kind of bold shapes on dress, on yours and others i have seen along the way? >> absolutely. geometric prints are very big this season, as well as photo realistic prints created digitally. there has been a big advance in computer technology to print like that and you will see that across the board. >> so david, we are moving toward the fall. we are not in a great economy. and actually, trends change based on the economy. >> yes. >> what have you seen happening and where do you think we're going? >> i think there's a depth to color, just like there's a
depth, a deepness happening, i don't want to use the word darkness to the economy, but i think people are mirroring that in their hair as well. we are seeing rich darkness in hair, even in the blondes, we are untempering them with l lowlights, not just a beachy blonde anymore. >> more subtle? >> yes. i think is picking up on the tenor of the economy a limb bit. >> great to see you guys. we want to do this regularly, a first time we have done it a great job on mika's hair. she has people coming up and asking, who did it? >> it is. >> and michelle, always great to see you. so the two words for the fall fashion, urban protection. i'm going to -- >> i'm wearing leather tomorrow. >> a nose ring. >> tomorrow, i will wear
leather. up next, a fashion icon on wall street, brian sullivan, next on "morning joe." >> he is. he is. >> oh, this will be disturbing. up. a short word that's a tall order. up your game. up the ante. and if you stumble, you get back up. up isn't easy, and we ought to know. we're in the business of up. everyday delta flies a quarter of million people while investing billions improving everything from booking to baggage claim. we're raising the bar on flying and tomorrow we will up it yet again.
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serious investors are choosing fidelity. welcome back to "morning joe." let's get a check on business before the bell with cnbc's brian sul van. he is live at cnbc global headquarters, our fashionplate reporting on the market. there is a political fight right now over china in the u.s. and the chinese actually are taking a complaint to the wto, right? >> you know, it's getting to be kind of a more heated back and forth. good morning, guys. here's the situation. the president is going to campaign in ohio today. if you go up near the toledo
area, very heavy in auto and auto parts manufacturing, according to the "wall street journal," citing administration officials, they wanted to remain anonymous, they didn't want to trump the president, the u.s. may now press a case with the wto against china for what they consider illegal you can subsid dizization of auto parts exporting. obama is trying to say, hey, we are keeping jobs in the united states, we want it to be a fair playing ground between us and china, let the better country win it looks like quo press a case with the wto over what they say could be $1 billion in what they consider illegal subsidies for auto parts manufacturing. >> this in the "wall street journal" this morning, taking its complaint over new u.s. tariff law over the wto. >> it did the tat for tat. >> exactly. hey, what's this interesting story, gm no longer wants to be government motors. they want to pull the ripcord and get the federal government off their backs. what is the likelihood of that
happening? >> not likely at this price, joe, because the government is balking. basically, gm quietly floated a plan to treasury, returns about 5 hunted million gm shares but those slayers below the ipo price, so if the government sold some or all of that stock, they would take about a $15 billion loss. that's not the kind of headline that you want because the republicans would jump all over that, say, look at that, losing money on general motors, we told you so. the treasury says call us when the stock price is above its ipo price and joe, you'r tide, roll tide, unstoppable, end the season now. afrnlt shame we don't have more time, womenly guise pushing the top technology story in the "wall street journal," the return of the winklevoss twins. >> are they back? >> they are back. the winkle vie. the winkle vie are back. they never left.
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welcome back to morning joe, time to talk about what we learned today. what did you learn? >> this five-year anniversary of our great program we sometime got the rain, you can talk about at the beginning of the show afghanistan, you can talk to mad dog about the giants. >> good lord. >> finish it all off with fall fashion. >> absolutely. >> as varied as the "whites a s a -- "white" album.