tv The News Hour With Jim Lehrer PBS November 10, 2009 7:00pm-8:00pm EST
captning sponsored by macneil/lehrer productions >> lehrer: good eveng. i'jim lehrer. on t newshour this tuesday, the lead story-- e memorial rvice at fort hood. kwame holman has our coverae. >>your loved ones dure though the life of our nation. their mery will be honored in the pces they lved and by the people they toucd. >> lehrer: then, aftethe other news of the day, gweifill updates thinvestigation into the shootgs;
jeffr kaye reports on iraqi refugees settlg in california; judy woodruff gettwo views on wheth health care reform will slowhe rise in costs; and jfrey brown has a "big picture" look at kis television sesame street celebrates a birthday. >> at's a huge number. ajor funding for the newshour with jim lehrer is providedy: >> what t world needs now is energy. the energy to gethe economy humming again. thenergy to tacklehallenges like clima change. what is that energy came fr an ergy company? every day, chevron iests $62 million in people, in ias-- seeking, tehing, building. fuelg growth around the world to move us all ahea this is the poweof human energy. chevron.
>> what makeus an engine for e economy? plas across america. nearly 200,000 jobs creed. we see beyond cars. monsanto. producg more. conserving more. improving fmers' lives. that sustainable agriculture. more producemoreconseemore.com. intel. suprting coverage of innovation and the economy. >> and by wes fargo advisors. together, we'll go far. bnsf railway. and by the alfred psloan undation. supporting scnce, technology, and improved economi performance and financia literacy in the21st century.
and with the ongoing suppo of thesinstitutions and undations. and... this program was made ssible by t corporation for public badcasting. and by contbutions to your pbs station from viewers like u. thank you. >> lehrer: president obam honored the vicms of the fort hod massacre today. he led theourners at an oudoor memorial service on the large army post icentral texas. nehour correspondent kwame holman has our lead sty report. ♪ >reporter: thousands of famy members, friends,nd fellow soldiers came from acrs the country today for theomber ceremonie they paitribute to the lives and servi of the 13 people killed and 29 woundelast thursday. some of the wounded wereble to
attend the serce, others remaihospitalized. in memo of the dead, 13 pairs of cbat boots were placed below the stage, each wh an invted rifle topped with a helmet. a picture ofach victim was dilayed below. the post commanng officer, lieunant general robert cone: fort hood is home to onef the largest conntrations of soiers and families in our army. we will never be acstomed to loing one of our own. but we canore easily accept it wh it's on foreign soil. never did we expe to pay such a high pricat home, where soldiers feel secur even so, soldrs take care of
each other in time of need. at the incident scene, ere were many acts of courage. were it not for theiremarkable abilities, thiincident could have been far worse. >> reporter: army chief ostaff neral george casey said the shootings,nd the losses, were hard to conceive of. >> the men and women kied had more than century of service. theleft behind 19 children, spouses, parents, a untold loved os. what hpened last thursday will impa families, the army, and ft. hood for a long te to come. >> reporter: theresident and first lady michelle obama tended under heavy security, after consoling victs' families in a ivate meeting. then, the president offed words of mpathy and a promise to remember. >>his is a time of war.
d yet, these americans did t die on a foreign field battle. they were kied here, on amerin soil, in the heart of this great state and the art of this great american mmunity. it is this fact tt makes the tragedy evemore painful and even more incomehensible. but here ishat you must also know-- your ved ones endure rough the life of our nation their memory will bhonored in the plac they lived and by the people they touched. their lifs work is our securi, and the freedom that we too often take for grant. reporter: mr. obama did not me the alleged gunman, major nidal has. but he insistedustice would be one. >> it may be hard to corehend the twisted logic that led this tragedy.
but this much we do know-no faith justifies these murders and craven act no just and lovingod looks upon them with for. for what heas done, we know that the killer wi be met with justice, in thiworld and the net. >> rerter: the president spoke in turn about each of those killed. and later, t crowd stood silently as, by traditio the unit's roll was called, including the names of the 1 six the dead worked in the medic field, as did major hasan, an army psychirist. 62-year-old tired chief warrant officer michael hill was assisting wi physical exams en he was shot.
and 51-year-d cuss he ll seiger specializing in post traumatic stres disoer. a psychiatric nurse out to o to iraq for a yearand eutenant colonel and eutenant colonel juanita warman was also headedo iraq. she s a military physician's assistant, 55 yearsld. six others were preparinfor combat tours, including staf sergeant jusn decrow, age 32, due to deploy to iraq. a specialist jason hunt, age 22, preparing for his seco deployment to ir. speclist frederick greene, 29 years old,as set to leave for afghanistan in januay. so was private first css kham xiong, preparing for hifirst- ever deoyment, at the age of 23. and 19-year-old privatfirst class aon nemelka. he had joinethe army straight out of high school.
private first class michael pearson, age2 - was on notice to deploy to iraq oafghanistan in nuary. and one soldi, 21-year-old private francheska velezwas returng home from iraq because she was three monthpregnant. as the memorial service end, the ctims received a final twenty-one gun salute. (gunfire) and for longoments afterward, victims' familiesjoined by the president and mrs. obama, fed past the individual splays honoring ch of the dead. >> lehrer: we'lhave an update on thinvestigation into the fort ho killings later in the program. in her news today, white house officls insisted president obama has nodecided how many more troops to send to afghanistan.
they diuted reports he'll add four combat brigades, pl suppt units, totaling close to 40,000 troops. in ghanistan, an american soldieras killed today by a roadside bomb. and to said troops in kandahar seed 250 tons of ammonium nitrate fertilizer osunday, enough to make hundreds of bombs. meanwhileal-jazeera television showed insurgents with s. ammunition anmines. they said they found t material at abandoned outpos in the east. a suicide car bombern pakistan killeat least 24 people at a crowded market today. it wentoff just outside peshawar, capital of the northwest frontier ovince. police id 90 pounds of explives were stuffed into a van. the powerful blasleft more than people wounded. the bombinwas the area's third in thredays. north a south korea fought a duel at sea day for the first time in sevenears.
t happened in the yellow sea long the disputed maritime border between the two untries. south kea said a patrol boat fr the north crossed the line an was heavily damaged before retreating. north korea accused e south of violating its tertory. a push for a powerful new financi regulator began in the senate today. banking committee cirman democrat chris dodintroduced the pn today. iwould strip the federal resee of its authority over banks. >when they took on coumer protection respoibilities and regulaon of bank holding compies it was an absmal failure. so thedea thate're going go back and pand those rolesnd functions at the expense of losing the vality inthe core functions tha they're designeto perform i think is going inthe wrong direction. >> lehrer: und dodd's bill, thnew agency would have oversight of home loans and
credit cards. democrats generly support the idea, but republicans have objected to creing another bureaucracy. a similar movis underway in the house. it was a calmer day wall street afr the big gains of late. the dow jones industal average added points to close near 10,247. the nasdaq fell three ints to close a2,151. the gulf coast escaped mosly unscathed tay when tropical storm ida came asho in alabama. the storm brought heavrain and high surf around mobe bay. but it quickly peteredut, and no jor damage was reported. ida's approach ao led to the shutdown onearly one-third of oil and gas production the gulf. former astronaut lisa nowak pleaded guty today to attacki another woman in 2007. they habeen dating the same man, a fmer space shuttle pit. nowak, a na captain, drove from texas to florida, d assaulted the won with pepper say.
she also carried a sel mallet, a knifend other articles. uer a plea bargain, nowak was sentced to one year's probation. d still to come on the nehour tonight: finding refuge; health care cost cutng; and watching "sesame strt." that follows the latest othe fort od investigation. gwen ifill has our sty. >> ifill: as military d civilian leaderwere paying the respects at fort hood tod, army major nidal malik hasan continued to recuperae in a texas hospital. he remains thsole suspect in last week's shootin, and nvestigators there and in shington are stepping up the iniry into his background and possible motives. joining us fomore on that investigation e dana priest, military affairseporter for "thwashington post;" and josh meyer, o covers the departme of justice at "he los aeles times."
welcome to you bo. joh meyer, it turns outhat nil hasan has been investigated befor tell us abouthat. >> well,he f.b.i.s part of a joi terrori task force ate last year and earlyhis year-- actual he'll it's multiagency, theynd the milary-- were looking into his eail contacts th dical islamist clair i can in yemenho has bn under the radar of the f.b.i. a aer other agenciesfor many many year they we trying to determine if he w plotting terrorist attacks or the character of thesemails. they decided they didn't rise to the level suspicion that would prompt a fu investigation and e matter was dropped. >>ifill: so we know that he wrote to this am. we know thate responded. but we dn't kw yet exactly what the ctent was that investigators at the time d not think was particularl serious. >>no. authorities are sayg that the...t the time they appear to be mostl inocuous. i think the wor mundaneas used. about to 20 emailsnd the ye ma'am responded to several
of them. they saw notng in there was alarmist that would allow them to establishhe criminal predicate thecould use to start an ongoing vestigation. in hdsight now they say that you ght interpret some of thoseemails in a different way but at the tme they had no reason to believ that anythinwas afoot. >> ifill: let's talk abou hindsight a littl bit, da priest. what do w know abt him based n the six yea he spent at walter reed medical centehere in washington. >> well he was ver quiet, a lone people who worked with him sad he didn't really want to have manfriendsch. he was not very pructive. he was alreadyvery religious and he prayed many times duringhe day. sometimes wouldn't show up. they counseled him for tt. he really was odd. i mean that is really the wo that kept comingack. talked to some patiets that he treated. prescribed mnly medication forhem. it wasn't like deep routne
daily therapy or anything like that. >> ifill: he wroten today's "washington po" about the power point presentation that he made. you wrote that. i guess that was in 2007. tell us about tha >> he wasour years there as a student. at t end of the four years every student was supposed t ke a presentationbout some edical issue of their chosing. he chose not aedical sue actually but to lk about ism and its implicions for the u.s. mility. it's a 50-page presention. he stood up in font of his supeiseors in a rom full of other physicians and mental health staff and read them his research whic amounted to not a moderate view of islam and the koran but a quite radical view of islam a the koran. with warnings throughout that muslims will not be able come to grips with this conflict thathey will have within th if they are asked to fight and kill her
mlims. and that this could eate adverse effectsf the army did not first identify tm, talk to th and then allow them to leavethe service as conscientios objectors if it came to that. >> ill: josh meyer, another thing which came o today, it turns out tha nidal hasan bought a gun somew it didn't raise any regularlags. a ivate weapon. >> well, y know, that's o of theconcerns of authoriti is that they don't kw exact what he was doing, who he was talking to onli and at he was purasing and so forth. some of the guns he did buy did show up. you kow, that's one of the problems with soany loophol in the gun laws acrding to critics is tat you might not have trk of that kind of thin but they're alsooncerned that he did buy a g earlier this year, you know, andhat the database not you know, th that somehow didn'traise a red fla as well. i think there's mny outanding issues in the vestigation that they're trying to cme to gips with
right now. >> ill: a ranking republican on the house intelligence commiee was quotedtoday as saying that th system just broke down. is tt what the system, at is, the f.b.i., the c.i.a. the intelligenceagencies who are investiting this now, i that what they're coping with rying to get to the bottom of wheth that is true. >> it is. i think there's ncerns that itmight have brokenown on several levels one which is, you know,f these jot terrorism task forces id investigate hasan a decided there was not enough informati to proceed, did they hand off that iormation to the military for tm to use it? id they properly, you know, ground all of the allegations and see ifhere wasore that they could investate. did the army itself adequaty investigate all the complaints hat now seem to b coming forwardbout major hasan. you know, there's a lot of as they said yesterday an today there's a lot questions that need toe answered aate low of the swers may come in his computer andhe emai and the websit that he viewed
there as well too. there's aot of work to do. >> ifill: da, one of the things that came out in this pow point presentation was his concern or thelags that he wasaising about whher musms should be allowed.. ho felt that they were cflicted, shouldbe sent to war. against other musms. to we know whether he himlf tried getut of the military, filed a status at conscitious objector or sothing like that. the initial reports areno, he didnt. he didn't fil for conscientious objector status. as seone in the militar point out, he w a physician so he wouldn't he been in e line of fire. he wouldn't have been aed to kill or ha or capture fello muslims. so i on't think that's the case. you know, the other iss is even thoug going bac to wh sh was saying about the investigation, one the tricky parts hereis you have to have some reason tart to look at someone' computer orntercept their emails or intercept their phon calls.
in this case thou,hey didn't even seem t ask someone like other chaplain or something togo talk tohim, to say, what is this abt? in fact wh he made this presentation there's no indication that ybody was just more than miffed at him for having not de the assignment corctly, that theyidn't turnround and call in the counterintellence people thathe army has many many of th looking precely for what they call insider threat. >> ifill: was this bakdown the mental hlth system? >i thin it'smental health but is more the army in general. they didn't notice tese dities. when began to speak out a radical type of islam that someone should have taken him aside and said you know, well, how do you feel about this? and talk to him just like that rather than launching some jor investigation. perhaps they coulhave come up wi more information like that. initially.
>> ifi: josh meyer, this now falls in the hand ofhe military lel system or is this going tobe tried cilly? >> it willbe tryed in the military system. the f.b.i. is stll assisting in t investigaon but the army criminal investigave command is the lead agency i this. together, they're both doi a lot of the fonsic work-up. one the things that they said today that they're very conceed about is whether he was radicalized by people online, you know, ev if he didn have specif contt wi them just by viewing thir websites and so forth, including by alackeys to see if that spurred him into tion in some way. >> ifill:osh meyer of t losngeles time, dana priest the "washington post," thank you both very muc >> thanks. >> lehrer: now, therowing numbers of iraqi regees arring in the u.s. special correspondent jeffr kaye reports from cafornia.
>> reporter: for this person, the simple j of baking paste res wit her daughter hand then... with her husband sharing them with nghbors in lifornia seems a wor apart from the life the couple knew in baghdad. her husnd was a journalist and a blic affair officer with the u.s. embassy in iraq. becse of his association with the u.s. gernment, he faced reats and then violence. >> ty hit me with their b sword. it cut my ob doughen from up to down. and the same week when i was lying in theospital, my son also, tey stoppedhim and they tred to kidnap him from baghda to fallujah. >> reporter: theamily fled to egypthere theylived for thr years waiting to come to
the u.s. they have lived here in cafornia where they have relativesor nine months. they re among nearly 32,000 iraqi refees to have arrived in the u.s. mostly in califora and michigan over the past three years. the influx compar to only hundre who were allowed to come in the three previous years. moreraqi have come to this place near san diego than y otr city. wit signs in arabic and famiar products onstore elves, main seet offers a taste of home. unlike this family who are muslims most of t new arrivals a catholic, an irqi minority that faces persecution in teir home county. and whi they now feel safe in e united states, me ar that i their fes are shown on tv, relatives back homeay fac repsals.
>> you cnot live as a christian there. it's difficult. have always toe worried, to be careful. >> report: like other efugees, these two who gave just their first names are thankful to have found sanuary even if economic security appears elive. >> youknow, living he is exnsive. especially we n't have a job. all e time it's hard or difficult. >>reporter: that's a common story among new rivals. vernment funded resettleme agencies o contract with the u.s. state depament are inding themselves overwhelm by the rge numbers of refugees. theovernment prodes medical re a cash assistance for the fir eight mont. afterwards refugees can apply for welfar t the support is lling sht of the need. >> without the green card. >> reporter: michaelckay
head of the catholic charitie office inan diego, says in this economy entry-level jobs that i the past were ailable for refugees d't exst. housing cots are hh. and milies are crowdingnto shareapartments. >> they end up relying on their own family members largely becae of the community that is strong and they ha come together and planned thi they' assisting very much working withhe resettlent agencies. that is why i have yet to hea of any iraqi who is on the street w is holess although i fearhat those who e lnerable for that could end up tt way. >> reporter:many iraqi men spend their days hanging out at a clu frustrat at thei inability to find nearbyork. raey owned luor store in baghdad. itas bombe and he had to leave the count. >> no jobs.
>> repter: no jobs? joseph, a lebanese immigrant, who owned a produce store offering avariety of ethnic foods is seone new iraq arrivs often tu to for work but he'salready hired more people than he needs s he has to tu away most job seers who return reptedly to plead for wor >> we are looking r a job. we need to have it that gies us one day, two days. even that. i feel very sorryometime. i hire somebody, the one he makes me feel really... i tell him, okay, iive you a few hours or something. >> rorter: this family who also haven't beenble to find jobare living on borrowed ney. >> we hav been supportedy e catholic charities eight months. and theudget was cut from us.
i manage to borrow some money from my friends wen i got a job owork i will turnit back to them. >> equal oppounity in education. r any person whether it be wom, men, ung or ol >> reportr: at seminars held in the chuh hall this family joined her iraqis leaing about american society an how to nd work. >> one ishospitality. > reporterfor many refugees who, li this famy, worked asrofessionals inraq, the transition can be jring. >> much of the population is quite edated and quite well nnected in iraq. thy're starting over so to spe. which they're willing t do as well except theycan't find that tread, that pathway yet partly because of theconomy, ptly because ofultural differences.
>> she has experience as a teacher in iraqor 23 years. >> my certificate is in chemistry. >> reporter: aft the session, she ask the priest about using her experience to fnd rk. he was reassuring. >> maybe can help you with your resu. at the same time improve ur english. i tnk there will be a job opeto you here. >>eporter: although man spent years seekg to come to the united stes to find refuge, blk prpects here have led some iraqis to reconsider tir decision. at the men's social club, patrons told mehat some iraqis inthis city are dissuang relatives from comingto the u.s. in addition, they say handful of iraqi families have packed up a return back to the middl east. not to iraq but syria and jorda they coul't afford to rent housing according to this man,
aarpenter at the club. >> o or three months and that was it. how lo did they stay? we ared all of you us, you know, gave them someoats and some chairs and merchandise for thei home. >> reporter: wasn't enou? >> it wast enough >> reporter:7-year-old shahad, a hig school senior, worries herarents will ma the same decision. i'm scared because i d't want.... >> reporter: you're raid at you may have to go back. > yes. >> reporter: to egypt or somewhere. >> to iraq. >> reporter:o iraq. >> i can't live in egy anymore. >> reporter: why t? >> becse no jobs there. >> reporter: ther's no jobs the. yeah. >> report: is that a possibility, gog back iraq? >> actually it's jt like we
were dreaming abt the american dream, to come here. thlife here it's hrd witho mon. >> reporter: are you siously tnking about goingack? >> well, if there isn't any choice or any option. i couldn't find a job here. >> reporter: at the sta department, the main government agency rponsible for refugees,fficials say the administration planso provide mre assistance. ericwartz heads the bureau of population rfugees and migration. >> we will indeed next year in 2010, we wil increase e ount of money we provide for initial resettlement, for reception andlacement. we're working on just how much more we can prode. but'm committed to finding funds to do thateven in very diicult circumstances. >> reporter: in this town, this family greeted new neibors, recent arrivals from iraq. despite all the difficulties, they keep comi.
at the airport in niego d elsewhere, there's a steady stam of iraqis reuniting with faly members in america. government ofcials say they are hopeful that as time sses,most will settle in a so many refugees have in the past. >> lehrer: next night is the push for health careeform cutting costs as wel as changing e system. judy woruff gets two sets of answers. >> odruff: first, we turn to the president's point personon costs, budget dictor peter orsza thank you for jning us. >> thks for having me. >> woodruff: een after this big success getting a bill thrgh the house of epresentatives, you still have peopleut there, republicans and democrats, who ar saying they seriously oubt whether any legislation that mes through congress is gng to put a dent in spendingn health care.
what you say to that? >> well, i think weave to be clear. we have saidhe legislaon s to be deficit neutral over the next decade. t senate and house are bo meetinghat task. we'relooking fort to be tter than that inthe second deck... dec said. the senate and the house are meeting tt test also. we also want significant rerms to delivery system moving towar things like buled payments, accountae care organations, inceives to reduce readmission rat that are unnecessary high at hospitals legislation includes a variety of those changes to there are an importt s of move towards a hher quality/lower-st system over time. >> woouff: let me ask you first about the deficit point becau the "washington post" has editorialized in the last few ds that essentially what you're going to havein the nextten years is much greate outflow from the feder government than you are going to have inow. it will result in a ga that is ultimatelygoing to be need
be reconciled by more taxes or severe cuts on peopleho can least afford i >> let's separate totwoings. one is the underlyg budget problem we do have fa a $9 trillion ficit over the ne decade. the second quesion is, what ishealth reform doing to that underlying deficit i again, take th senate legislation. theris a reduction that ten-yeareficit of almost $100 billion ming from the senateinance legislation a then peaps just as importantly much larger effects that ar growing over time in the seco decade and thereafte so theris an underlying fiscal oblem. we do need to addss that. but the health legislation is not exacerbating that problem. it's making it better. >> woodruffyou mentioned that there are number of reforms in this legislati. but pple like the head o the mayo clic saythat these plans don't really adequately tackle the so-called fee-foservice system that pays doctors essentially
piecemeal for the work that they do. >> if you take the senate finance lgislation as an example. it includes not only movements towardalue-basedurchasing for hospitals and paying octors for quality rather than quantity but it also includes a medicare commsion which will be a flexible way of moving towardshat fee-for-value rher than fee-for-seice system over time. i've had ts of discussions about den co 'tis. respect him a lot. up or dwn senat finance bill he'd take it perhaps, you know sitting in athink tank or soewhere else you could always do more. in terms of a real piece of gislation this is moving in an important way towards delive system reform. >> woodruff: anoth criticism one hears, ter orzag, is that frankly the dealhat the white house that you al cut with the hospital indury to i think, limit hpital payment reductins to about $1 billion over ten yrs
also puts a cmp in howuch savings there reall is going to be in health care cost >> ll, still that's siificant amount of money more an $150 llion. there are not only improvements in the hoital side of things but al in the insurancindustry and other componen of the medil sector ttcan help finance expansion and coverae. that what this legislation does. >> woodruff: and on other point o hears is that there, you know you said yourself there are a series o suggeed reforms t what i'm hearing from critics is that ese are just inentives, that they'renot ally hard, mandated requirements that spending go dn. >>ell, there's a combination of hard mdated requements th spending go down. fo example, with regard to reducingverpayments to medice advantage plan. he private insurancelans that cover some medicare beneficiars. the yeah, some incentiv to move towards a higher
quality/low-cost sysm. one othe issues theres part because we hen't taken is sort of conceeriously enough in the past, we don't know exactly whato do and exactly how to dign a bundl paymentor example where you pay a doctoror treating a diseasrather th for each individual procedure that is done to treat that disease. we need to mo in that direction but the exact pareters need to be tested out and en moved to scale quickly. but ey still need to b tested out. that's what this legislation is doing. woodruff: final quick question do you believe tt private insurance premiums are going to go down? >> yes. privatensurance companies... i'm sorry, premiu i believe will gdown. individualsill now have access to a health exchge where the won't fce the sam nd of section efcts that can driveup costs that currently exist in individual markets. >> woodruf: petorzag, dget advisor to the presidet. thanks very mh. >> thks for having me.
>> woodruff: now, a diffent view on the issues. it mes from health economist gail lensky of the project hope foundation. she's a former dictor of medicare and mediid in the first bush administration, and has chaired congress'edicare payment visory commission. thank you for being with us >> thank you foraving me. >> woodruff: peter orzag says, yes, ese plans are gng to cuealth care snding in this country >> we, peter knows these issues aut as well as anyone from his days a the congressional budget office director. what he said was it won't add to the dicit. that's true. sort of. the amount of fancing will make sure that you don't add to the dicit. one of the big problems is the physician paymenfix is outside ofealth care reform. it's abo 10 billi over the next ten years. you can say, that's gog to fix the way medicare pys
physicians anyway. that's ue. of cour physicins are really key to changingow health care iselivered. while we go spend a trillion dollars,ore or less, on health care reform, we bter ke sure that we've got anotr $200-pl billion to fix this yment probl. >> woodruf: you're not saying that's n part of what you see moving through congres >> th is not includ in the nate bill that he's talked about and how muchit would reduce payments eier in the firsten years or the second ten yes. it's a very big issue. >> woodru: what else, gail wilens, do you think ought to be inthis legislation tat isn't the to get the ovell amnt that is snt on health care down. >> two tngs i would put on my wish lit. the fst has to do with changing theax treatment of health surance provided by employs. there's a version of it in the senate bill. it's the tax on cadillac plans. excise tax onhe insur if he plan costsoo much money. i he i is maintained in
what comes out of the sene andhen out of the onference. it's where in the house bill this wl drive so behaviorhange. it's a lile umsy as a way to do it. it' normally thoughtf as being dictly on the employee. b it's good enough. but the second part has to do with all of t pilots that we heard discussed. >> woodrff: plot programs >>t's absolutelyrue. we don't know h to get from a systemhere most phycians are paid on a fee-for-service basis, each individualservice that's provided to payi for taking ca of somebody with abetes or to pay all the physicians that take care sobody who is having a by-pass procedure or a hip replacement. that's called a bundled payment. we need to experimentow to do it. but o history with pots is that if there is nothe autrity up front to mplement the pilots thawork, th're not likely to actuly find their way in action.
tht's a big problem. >> woodruff: this is a thority that i beeve you ink should ride in the officof the secretary of health and human services. >> ablutely. >> woruff: and my question though on th is that many on the republicanide of the ledger say that'soo much government control. this argument that you need somebody with authori who repsents the federal governmentlies in the face of the argument fro republins you've already g oo much government contro >>edicare is alrea paying howospitals are paid, how physicianare paid. the qution is canwe pay marter? we have incentives torovide the health care that peoe need. have it be idence based but ot just pay for more and more compx if that's not the most dically appropriate. we kw what we have w doesn't work. we can see that by ou unsustainae spending and our poor value. the question is whene figure out whaworks, how do we get that actually into actn? the sectary is
acountable person. accountable to themerican public. the secretary c be diissed if the person gets completely out of line that's the bettr way to mind rather than medicare mmission which once appointed is not accountable to anybody. we ne to find a way to get the pilot programshat show we can improve quity and redce spend actually into action. the's a long history of pilots that nevero awhere. >>woodruff: there are so ma threads to allof this. we d't have time right now to get into all tat. but what about coming down to the way many peopleelate to the healthare system. thats through the premiums that they pay for their insurance. we heard pter orzag s he thinks those will go wn. how do yousee that? >> for some peop who haven't been able to get insurance or only very expenve insurance because ty're uninsureable, thei premiums may go down but for a lot of peoe th actually y go up. it will dend exactly w many of th 50% of the
population without insurace mes in. one of the troublesome parts is tat if you guarantee you can come in wnever you want, you can't be pelized if you have a pre-existing condition, can'te deniedinsurance, some people may wait til they're sick. if that happens, i very many of those people wait uil they're sicko get insance it will actually drive up costs forll of us. it's alittle of what happen new york. >> woruff: bottom line, gail wilensky, you're concerned tht this leglation doesn't do eugh to address t rising cost o health care. >> absolutely. do a goodjob in reforming insurance. that is cost contnment light at best. >> woodruff: gailwilensky. thank you verymuch. >> tha you. >> lehrer: finally tonight, milestone for bigird and the world of children'television. ffrey brown has our story.
>> ♪sunny days, sweeping the clouds away. ♪ >> brown: this mning's "sesame strt" program was brought to you by the number 40... >>that's a huge number! >> brown: ... as thshow celebrat its 40th anniversary with the help of michel obama... >> hi, everyone. >> brown: ...who, as it hpens, ishe first first lady to have grown up watching the pgram. >> if you eat all these heahy foods, you areoing to grow up to be biand strong, just like me. >> and me! ell, i'm still growing. brown: when "sesame street preered back in 1969, with s urban street setting, its cast of adult and young actors, and of course, its muppets creed by jim henson, it was immediately hailed aa breakthrough ieducational telesion for children. several generations ofoung people have now grown watching, as "sesame strt" taught the alphabet, couing, and much mor and at times to on tough subject from the death of one
beloved cast member to t current fluandemic. >> first thing you have to to stay healthy wash your hands. >> brown: ong the way, celebrities ha regularly mixed in with the diverse ct of character- politicians, actor musicians, even our own robert macneil, w in 1988 rerted on "cookiegate". >> why didyou eat the cookies? >> well, mglad you asked that question, mr. clehrer. >> macneil. >> whatever. >> brown: the program lso became a worldwide phenomen; it now appes in more than 140 countries, incorporating cal characters and themes. in south afra, for example, an h.i.v.-positive mupp was troduced in 2002. at e same time, the program's success spawned new children' educaonal programming, and 40 ars later, the world of children's tv has changevastly on public television... ♪
... and on cable and commercl networks. >> come on, vaman. >> brown: at e same time, concerns about t impact of so mh programming have continued a recentielsen study reported that, on average, ildren from two to fivspend nearly 25 houra week watching tv, the hiest figure on record, and seven me hours watching dvds or sitting in front of computer. children's advocy groups have so raised alarms over the commercialization of ogramming, most recently ove a deal tween discovery and toy maker hasbro to fo a children's network. amid all thcompetition, sesame street's viewersip has fallen; it recently ranked th among chiren's tv sws. to attract more viewe, the show's producers havgreatly expandeits web presence with charaer bios, postcards to nd, and games. >> take it from a fg-- always look beforyou leap! >> brown: and, 40 years late the muppets still dance, si,
and teach, and thehow very ch still goes on. >> this is murrey sang, "see ya next time on the seet. peace!" now moren big bird and bond in children's tv. garynell is presidentnd ceo of sesame workshop, a nprofit educational organization that produces sesame reet. sa guernsey isirector of the early educationnitiative at the new america foundation and author of "intothe minds of baes: how scre time fects children from birth t ag5." welcome to both of you gary, how much and what ways has the program changed particully inight of a the larger changes in television? >> the show in 1969 was really revolutionary. he founders had seen that commercials were teachi kids and the.. they triedo make messes now instead about sugared cerealbout letters and numbers. it took the world by storm. now 140 countri laternd in
many many differt parts of media, sesame stree has grown and it has had to chae with the times. over0 years. >> brown: how do youtay reel advantage? we just saw michelebama alking today about vegetable there's anssue of the day. how do you stay relevant? is it still based on resech that y have? >> it is. sesamstreet is the only children's show that is producedevery single year. we've proded 26 hou of u. programming every year and some 300 episodes around the world. every yeare call this the 40th experimental sason of same street. we actually bring in rriculumadvisors who can teach us about the relevant sues. imay be childhood obese obsity. this season is about children in nure and healthy eating habits. every year there's a different curriculume focus on and keep current in that wa >> brn: we're talkingabout this vastly different wld of children's tevision programming, lisa how dyou seet in terms of ality? for exple, how much ucation is there today in educational programming?
>> there's a very long spectrum. there's still not anywhere ar enough educatnal progrming. along thatpectrum. hen sesame street go started 40 years ago, tre were maybe one or two other shows that were really aed at kids. not even saying they were good for children. toay we're seei doe dozens of programs aed at the 2-5 e range. thr quality is just all over the place. sesame street has set the stanrd in terms how to research a proam and really how kind of di in to what are kids understaing from it? are th actually capturing and cognitivel understanding what we're lking about? unfortunately we have t seen that manof the other programs doing the sam thg. >> brn: you have to fight your wayhrough a vastly changed.... >> as lisaaid, there were o pre-schoo shows in 1988, mr. rogers neighborhood a sesa street. today there are 54 pre-school shows so doesn'tatter how great you are,our market
share is gng to go wn so to speak we have had to make sure that e are relevant. we do aot of targeted outreach programs and tr to stay in the ne with ctural icons li michelle obama who can deliverort of a co-viewing appealith parents which has made big difference as wel >> brown: other issue, quality issue, as i mentione in t set-up there, the number o hours that young kids watc tv. >> yeah. it' pretty high. the 25 hours week numr doesn't shk me hestly. i'm a mothe of a five and a seven-year-old. i've been watchin the landscape f many years now. what see is that parents and families are really nd of stretched. they're lookin for opportities where they can say i need a brea have to go unload the dishwasher. i have to make this phone call. i have to hassle wi my insurce company. i'm going to put the kids in front of the tv for a little bit. thre's so many programs ov 24 hours of the dayow that kids can have access to. and so thers pressures tat
are at work here. thers also the quantity of programming. i wouldn't say that... we still do't know exacy how much worse it is than the earliestays of tv. >> brown: how much more do we know about the impactthese days? the impact on kids. now we're still talking 2to 5 at this point. >> wt we're seeing actually is from used to be a real distinctionetween background television and foreground tv. the is some real evidence of negative ipact of background tv. that means showshat are just pying around them. they any be ruing up and the dostairs but not actually watchinghem. what we're finding is and reearchers at many universities have beenlooking at this kind question but articularly at the univeity of massachutts, they're finding th children's play patterns are disrupt and the way they interact with tir peers and parentsis disrupted. parents need be thinking much more about, okay, when i put the t on for a purpose i ne to understand that let's
look at theontent. it educationa are there momen that kids caget something out of it? canwe turn it off instead of keeping it on as a background almt wallpaper for children >> brown: u took some heat wheyou created sme programs for underaged kids. he american academ of pediatrics hasong said that children under two should not watch any television. >> we'v never really designed a showp unti recent for any kids under the a of 2 because ofhat. t we know tough the kaiser family foundation thattwo out of three kids under the age of twore watching tv every singlday. one ou of three have a tv in their own bedroom. what we looked at what cou we create something at w dechltedally aropriateor kids t at six months but kids were slightly uder two wi parentingkills built in make something o of it. it wasn experiment. some of it rely worked. soe of it didn't work. 're trying to address the fact that moms and dads are putting their kids in front of tv at a very,ery young age. >> brown: lete ask you
lastlabout the commercialization issue. is it... has it cre up and gotten worse in a sensehere kids appear t be being targeted to buy procts through the programs? that's always beenwith us in some sense. i remember from my own youth. >> whate're seeing is kind of a blurring. it used to behat we would see, you know, first of allt was complete no-noaccording to some. in the cable world to actually kind , quot, sell a toy withinv program for kids. but the commercia around that pgram rely kind of, you ow, it's anyone's guess what they ght be trying to get kids to nag the parents about. today it is not s much that. it's that the cracters thin the programs become so engaging t children. i man i've seen this in my own kids. they become attached tohem. they want to buy every sngle product they ever seeith that character emblazonedupon
it. it can be tough for parents to say we're t going to buy this toda can't we t a luch box that is a nice green laun box witho a character? it takes a lot of disciple on thepart of parents today. >> brown: our last minute. how do y walk this fine line becausyou have lots of, you know, erybody wants an elmo. you also took criticism when you had the sponsorship from macdonald's at a ti when one of ur themes was healthy eating. >> the tickle me elmo actually payed for the research and producon that we do. we ry to have a circle with hose revenues paying for e programming. 's important that we do not market to kids. that's where we do drawhe ne. draw the line as a diinction between other coanies that really do at them. we do not vertise to pre-schoolers. you will not see our characters promoting any sponsors' products. we'rreally out there trying tmake a distinctn here and not exploit very young children ich is what we've got to be careul of. >> brown: all right. we will leav it there.
40 years sesame street and otherissues. gary nell and lisa guernsey, thank yo both very much. >> thank you. >> lehrer: we have aehind the scenelook at how children's televisi is produced, and how it makes b ideas easy for toddlers to undersnd. that's part of ainterview with "sesame street'smaria, actress sonia manzano, anit's on our web site, newshour.pbs.org. again the major developments of the day: president oba and some 15,000 mourners honored t victims of the fort od massacre in an outdoor memorial service; a white house officials disputed reports thathe presidenhas decided to send up to 40,000 more trps to afghanisn. on newshour.pbs.org,n online- only feature tonight we have a chart comping house an senate proposals for financial relation, and a look
at the debate over thfederal reserve's role in proteing consums. we' see you online, and again here tomorrow eveni. i'm jim lehrer. ank you and good night. maj funding for the newshour with jim leer is provided by: >> this is the engi that nnects abundant grain from t american heartland to haran' best selling who wheat, while keeping 60 billion pnds of carbonut of the atmosphere every year. bnf, the engine that connects us. >> and wells fargo advisors. together, we'll go far.
monsant and by tota. >> and bthe bill and melinda gates foundation. dedicated to the idea thatll people deservehe chance to live healthy productive life. d with the ongoing support these institutio and foundatns. and... this proam was made possible by the corporation for public badcasting. and by contributns to your pbs stationrom viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrer pructions caption by media acces group at wgbh ccess.wgbh.org