einhorn is trying to offset those losses hedging oil and national gas -- natural gas. let's start with what went wrong here. >> it's kind of a perfect storm, actually. -- a natural gas and coal company. we joke at the desk and say he handles a lot of pain this year. now it's about how far can the pain go. he is hedging his that's. he's been taking small derivative positions in oil and natural gas to hedge against anything he feels. this year energy is down about 73%. his derivative positions says at 10% fall in natural gas would be a $2.4 million gain in his portfolio. billionut a $1.1 portfolio at greenlight. betty: what does that tell you? his find isyou that down 17% this year. his main fund. how low can you go before you need to start showing a little bit of relief in some of these positions? he is holding onto these but he is -- we don't know what it means long-term. it's not the way he feels about gold. he believes the central bank stimulus will increase the value. we will see how that plays out. has he said anything recently about the performance of the reinsure

are: coming up, losses mounting for david einhorn. he is revisiting page one of his hedge fund playbook to turn things around. that's coming up next. ♪ alix: welcome back. i'm alix steel. scarlet: and i've scarlet fu. david einhorn of greenlight capital battling his worst year since the financial crisis and is now trying to offset some of his losses by hedging oil. alix: according to a new filing, he added derivative positions that will protect against lower natural gas prices and a gain in crude. joins us now with more. what was the problem child and why did he need to counter the hedges? every quarter he seems to have a problem child. this court's holdings. it is starting a hedge against natural -- and coal producers. 10% decline in natural gas would be a $2.4 million gain. the issue is that natural gas has been oversupplied and that there would be this huge supply got and that would have underlying equities. sonali: it is like all year that he bore a a lot of pain, but it only goes so far. he is getting closer to hedging his bets

managed by david einhorn, dan lobe were down 3% and 5% in september according to a new report. einhorn's biggest losers included fund itson down 31%, consol down 35% and micron which dropped 9% in september. rosen rosenstein's bets failed to pay off for partners. valeant fell 12%. lost positions on amgen in september and allergan which fell 13%. the question is whether the smart money will buy the dips in these beaten-down names or get out of the positions before they fall even further. back to you. >> thank you, saema. >> would you buy bargain basement names? which look interesting? >> amgen looks interesting. a lot of what we are talking about large cap, pharma in general, there is not a whole heck of a lot of volatility. they are growing sales at mid single digits here. this is a relatively cheap stock. 2.2% dividend yield. of all those lists and the ones beaten up amgen looks the most interesting here. $120 would be a great entry. >> it's qualcomm. talk about the guys with so much bad news priced in. we were surprised it didn't hold $72 and here it is $53. qualcomm is a pla

. >> david einhorn and dan loeb on the list, all men lost money last month amid the market turmoil. green light capital fund dropped nearly 4% in september. now the firm is now off officially 17% year to date. green lights fund is 92% long and 66% short. as of now he is on pace to report his first down year since the financial crisis in 2008. also loeb dropped almost 5% in december while jana partners lost 4%. unless they get the gains back and that's representative of what's going on across the board. bonus season is not going to look as good. >> let's check out the markets. closing the last day with a bit of a bang but it's a different story when you look at the quarter as a whole. what lies ahead as we enter this last quarter of 2015. joining us is steve reese. he is global head of he equity strategy at jp morgan private bank and drew who is deputy chief u.s. economists at ubs. we been talking about the quarter and this is not just lousy returns for the quarter it's so bad it wiped you out all the way back to where we were in 2013. what do you tell clients? >> it's been a tough q

i think that is a much more dangerous position to have. >> einhorns problem some industry worst numbers, wets an rationale energy a problem, and also, micron technology was a big loser for him. maria: your take on this video you guys russian billionaire brooklynnets owner teaching team basketball drills duke university dribbling a ball in one hand a volleyball off the wall one hand off the pole with the other keep up with billionaire. >> multitasking, multifactors where macroanalysis is going to multifactor you've got to be able to do two things at the same time. >> i love it. >> what you are doing is bouncing one hand navel gaigz at dow you are probably coming the wrong thing. >> we will talk about markets ahead of -- >> [laughter] >> we will sit down with washington wisdom arzards owner kennedy for the look at racing industry keep it right here fox business network. which allergy? eees. bees? eese. trees? eese. xerox helps hospitals use electronic health records so doctors provide more personalized care. cheese? cheese! patient care can work better. with xerox. that's it. how was your

david einhorn telling investors it is taking new positions in uil holdings. a that's the latest, kelly. back to you. >> and michael coors popping up 2% on that news. seema, thank you. kate? >> those numbers are astonishingly bad for one of the most respected long short managers. their continuation of what we've been but they are a continuation of what we've been seeing. micron, sun edison and these are the things that have dominated him all year. he is a short investor as well and he's made a number of seminole presentations about authority these he's. he saw the bubble. >> -- bubble markets but that is one thing that surprised me about his performance here. you can see what happened on the long side if you look at the stocks he hold but on the short side i thought he would have a more balanced result because of his strong views and the fundamental work he does. >> and kors having a difficult year. so perhaps more detail still needed on that position. >>> you tube making a change to the business model. we'll tell you those when we come right back here on the

it was a rough month for david einhorn. greenlight's main hedge fund fell in september, it is down 17% for the year. he has said that the market has become unfavorable. agreedft and google have to end their long-running battle gaming.nes and they are dropping about 20 lawsuits. google had been demanding royalties from the xbox gaming system. no financial terms were disclosed. know --t you need to pimco. his recent analysis is a core theory, which we all forget, including me, which is ask equals i. savings must equal investment. without that, it is out of wok. what is a savings glut? >> that describes the situation we are in. to save more,s for old age or other reasons, but hardly any company wants to invest. so desired savings exceeds desired investment. why is the key reason interest rates are so low. it is not the federal bank. what is so important about , it is the yield compression back 30 years has a part of it being savings glut and part of it being inequality. but nobody talks about the massive glut. the money is jus

a portfolio run by david einhorn lost --, that is the third straight quarter of losses. that is a thing that happens in investment. taking greeneen lights premier and and and putting them to use. this is a conjugated story but it is a very important one. we have with us sonali basak. so we have traditional major reinsert hours -- reinsurers. then you have a whole different class of people. there are a lot of money managers entering the space now. you have returns that aren't correlated with the market because it is volatile area it is related to weather. so we have third point entering and what is happening is that you have third point that is taking massive losses. so third point as well as green light. so they have a completely different investment strategy? you can also take private equity bets if you wanted to, it is very different from the traditional treasury bets. stephanie: what's your take on this? jeffrey: i think that is right. i think whether it is warren buffett, but now you are taking it to the next degree. you have concentrated portfolios and equity and al

cooperman and einhorn are saying at omega. >> we agree. if we look at jobs growth going forward between 150,000, 250,000 a month we'll have a 4 3/4 unemployment rate. we have a structurally low interest rate and a strong consumer, and low interest rates versus equities. it's going provide a much favorable outlook for equity investing. >> how big is the runway between now and the end of the year? >> probably 4% to 6% more. >> absolutely. >> storm clouds are in the environment, so it's going to be very volatile. >> let me give lee husband due. >> if he is seeing value out there, he is the ultimate value investor. i think you have to pay attention. >> all right. our next guest so impressed by amazon's earnings, in fact, he raised his price target on that stock to a now street high $800. gene munster joins us from minneapolis. welcome back. >> hello. >> we were just talking about runways. you see a bigger one for this one. >> yeah. if you look at the total percentage that's bought on-line in the u.s., it's 9% that the stuff is bought on-line.

it's einhorn, abbingman, lobe, steve wynn and jim clark. bain capital and so forth. they have technology to level the playing field for the regular investors. that's why they're growing so fast. they're giving away an awful lot of money today for als research. >> they're developing the block trades and benefitting als research. >> you're helping them do it today? >> i am. >> i hear you're doing trading of your own today as well? >> did a little trading as well. perhaps i'll do some of those block trades through iex, judge. i sold out of qualcomm today because it had a nice -- i think it was up 11% or 12% to when we got in, and we put the money to work today and goldman sachs and in fire eye. goldman because of up side call buying at the 185 strike. i bought a lot of goldman today. fire eye because it dipped and then made a pretty marvelous comeback, and i was buying both october and november calls. october calls only have one more day to trade, but i was buying the note 32s as well. put both of those in the portfolio, judge. >> good stuff. we will see you back here a

because david einhorn green horn capital, one of the worst according to hsbc that puts report. and they are known for being long on the short-term and long side and they have gotten hurt on energy plays. you mentioned valiant. that is a well know pershing square stock and they had a rough go of it as well. dan lobes, i think is slightly down. not as bad off as some of the other ones i just mentioned but it is a struggle for everybody. now tech and health care according to the indices is one of the few strategies that is a couple of points in the black. there are other pockets of strength. but up until the recent report shorting was one of the only successful strategies. it is tough to know how to play it at this point. >> kate, thank you. kate kelly, joining us with that. tim you are a heblg fund manager ande before. >> think about the consensus rate and look at the dixie. closing at 94 and change. well below levels people thought they would be. and i think the volatility in the other asset classes. two to flat i think good for them. especially the way they are trading in the m

david einhorn green light down by 17%. dan loeb's 30-pound, 4% for the year so far. what are the take-aways gary in your view? >> i call it the word liquidity. on the way down there was hardly any liquidity. that is why you had such vicious drops to the downside. interestingly it feels no liquidity as we rally up. i think market is trading thin and that's what these people were caught in. most are very invested and not diversified and they were caught up but if the market continues to rally they will make a bunch back. deirdre: brad, your longer term strategies. they're meant not to be even quarter to quarter. they're meant to be year holds. >> i think it says a couple of things. first of all, many of these investors are invested in some of the same opportunities. so, it argues to me, perhaps they're running out after large number of opportunities. if they're focusing on a couple of different plays, maybe there is not a ton of opportunities out there. second of all, they don't want volatility like this. they're willing to accept it, maybe forced to take bigger chance

but it looks like david einhorn sees opportunity, we are seeing rally of 2% after hours on the report. >> and karen, i go straight to you on this one. >> yes. normally a david eye horn, taking a position, it would be great. i love david. i think he is excellent. this year hasn't been a good one for sure. but the kors story is a ridiculous valuation. so much different than kate and ralph and a great balance sheet. i'm long. >> i agree. i like the stock at these levels. seeing a massive, massive selling pressure and i think it has gotten to the appreciate where you have to step in and buy it. >> still ahead, some of the biggest names in tech reporting tomorrow. amazon, google and microsoft. we're going to be busy. we have the most important thing the street is watching for later on. >>> and it is "back to the future" day and guy didn't want to miss out on any of the action. take a look. >> i'm guy. i'm out here in the street. i've got my man matt, so stay tuned folks, this is going to get crazy. this bale of hay cannot be controlled. when a wildfire raged through elkhorn ranch, the sudd

chatting with somebody yesterday, they said yesterday's pop was a nice exit for somebody like a david einhorn that got buried in the name. >> it is true. a lot of the names, i can't figure out how to trade. you remember when we said there was no correlation to the price of crude. and when you look athe chart, there is it. and then you could trade off of tax subsidies. so i think you are in the deep end of the pool when you trade these names. i would rather be a buyer of energy at this point, regular oil. the pxd, eog or downstream names. even valero and tesoro versus playing solar names. >> today the trade was exacerbated by solar city results and guide down for 2015 and 2016 last night. and you contrast that with what we got for solar and sun power which was a beat and raise. so we are seeing a differentation of the stocks. >> quality. people are gravitateing to the quality and staying away from the residential. there is too much risk there. and the quality players and the more industrial plays with less exposure to the residential side, you stick with and those will win. we talked about the

value driven activists, like a bill ackman, you could put david einhorn in that, though he is not as public as ackman. ackman is far from being alone. carl icahn said -- betty: he is had a good year. erik: he is very loud as well. betty: that is what i mean. does not holdhe three-hour conference calls, but he is not shy about letting you know what he thinks. betty: he knows how to use twitter. erik: he knows how to use twitter very well. right.ng is that ken is you cannot take one stock, and emphasize what appears to be a bad call now, and judge a money manager on the strength or weakness at that one investment. you have to look at a career. betty: we don't know yet about herbalife. say, this isu can investors and hedge funds. the model tends to result in a lot of volatility. bill ackman had a phenomenal year at last year. he is having a terrible year this year. his problem is that some of his investors have short-term money in his funds. he raised long-term capital with his amsterdam fund and that insulates him from redemption requests. most of the investors in bill long andwand are

people like david einhorn getting creamed. he may not be the long-term investor you like to see behind that stock but if the investor loses faith in the promise of solar power, what happens to the industry? tom: is no question that individual companies and individual timing may be different. being early is as bad as being wrong. i'm looking at something on an industrywide basis. the fact that we are moving to , therent energy generation electric car industry, tesla -- we are seeing things that have to happen. how that's going to happen company by company is the job of people looking at stocks. stephanie: they are also happening in a rich person's world. when you look at the income inequality and the prices we are facing, how can you get people to say this needs to be my number one issue when you have people making minimum wage you can't feed their own family? tom: there's a very simple answer -- this is the job engine of the future. good paying jobs. that's the future. we will push to prevent climate disaster, but only if it p

greenlight capital, david einhorn sperm. words, an incredibly high number of hedge funds. see all these companies listed on the less -- left. these are the companies that have been clobbered as we have seen. the company shares go down sharply. betty: julie hyman at the bloomberg markets desk. stocks and commodities rallying around the world. -- mightsee the fed not see the fed raise rates anytime soon. the courage to act this week is already taking a victory lap, saying the fed saved the economy. bernanke said quote with full employment insight, further economic growth will have to come from the supply side, primarily from increases in productivity. much more about the market and the chief global strategist david calley. kind of funny. ben bernanke saying i did my job, i did a good job. i think ben bernanke did a very good job around the financial crisis. i think as an emergency room doctor, you did very well. courageous.s words, >> i think the federal reserve stepped in as a vendor of last resort in many ways and help to deal with the financial crisis. i think using quant

people like robert einhorn who was one of the u.s. negotiators in the early stages of this and now is back in the think tank community here. i do think -- i'll say that one thing which i think is quite important is that we notary's this to a partisan question. the question given iran's record of supporting terrorism is probably the most serious national security issue that we face. we can have our debate as to whether this was a good deal or bad deal. it is very important we approach this in a bipartisan way of how to address any flaws in the deal? is the deal going to be sustainable? how do we reinforce the norms globally so we.net face this type of problem again in the future? host: couple of comments on twitter. yesterday was when the adopt day kicked in. the white house tweeted today mark an important moil stone toward preventing iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. they write the snap back has dismissed as not a real option. one more call here from john on the democrats line. caller: good morning. thanks for your time. it is --

davidight capital, einhorn's firm, is the top holder of this company with nearly 8% stake. management,ital pine capital, a lot of hedge funds have gotten involved in they have not done well this year. i mentioned the drop from the high, send more than 50% for the year. >> a veritable who's who of hedge fund managers. >> not so hot this year, at least this is one of the reasons why. may bei shareholders wishing the young spinoff in 1997 never happened. ever since that split off, yum shares have trashed pepsi shares. reportererg news leslie patton joins us from chicago with a preview. let's take a stroll down memory lane and talk about pepsico's original spin off of its restaurant chain which took place in 1987. what was the motivation? >> they are two totally different businesses. restaurants are more cyclical and prone to economic swings than making soda and chips which is pretty inelastic. >> it also speaks of their business model. young with aggressive, expanding overseas, especially in china. pepsi took a different approach. yum was on a first restaurant brands to really