tv Inside Story Al Jazeera May 27, 2015 2:00am-2:31am EDT
donates to the foundation and for the family itself. >> good discussion, david. thank you for joining me. he's a senior editor at the international business tiemdz. that's our show for today. i'll ali velshi. daily life is getting worse. in the thousands they leave places where they are neglect today places they are not welcome. for them, the risk are starving or drowning on boats packed with desperate migrants is better than the intense suffering they face at home. but the countries to which people are fleeing are far from figuring out what to do next and for now provide reluctant mercy.
desperate journeys is tonight's "inside story" ." ♪ ♪ welcome to "inside story." i am ray suarez. in southeast asia, in east africa's great lakes region, and on north africa's mediterranean coast. people in the 10s of thousands are trying to escape homelands rav i believed by extreme poverty. and violence. they have an ill defined but simple dream. the hope of a better life. but for many, running away from trouble brings new dangers. people smugglers, soak them, neglect them. abuse them and, in some case these pay with their lives. the. >> i am looking for a safe place to live. because our country is so dangerous. and there
is -- there is -- there is a war. >> from africa, asia, and the middle east, they risk their lives hoping for a better future. fleeing conflicts in search of safety. paying top dollar to smugglers who often abuse aura ban done them. >> the captain left us with the boat and ran away and, left us alone . >> he ran away with another boat to turk any. >> i don't know. maybe. i think so, he has this small you beer boat, you know this rubber boat for rescuing, he got in and just like run,. >> and he left you alone? >> yes. >> hundreds of thousands left their homes often setting owl in ramshackle boats, men, well, and children, waving dangerous seas on the mediterranean hoping to lands on european soil. the international organization for migration said more than 1700 people have been killed between january and april of this year, trying to make the journey from north africa to
europe. our stefanie dekker spoke with some of the lucky ones last month. >> we know that if we take the risk, we could die or we could live. so basically our life is in our hand. so if you ask why did you take that risk? it is obviously because we are not safe in eritrea. >> eritrea, an east african nation struggling with poverty and oppression is just one major source of migrants arriving in europe. others from syria, libya and subsaharan africa, forced to make a perilous journey or face parisian cushion in their native lands, even though they are destine today other parts of the world most wiped up in one place, italy. >> most of us, we don't have intention to his stay here. like i want to go to the u.k. and some of my other friends they want to go to germany holland, norway. so if they stay here, that means that they are not going to be able to go outside. >> europe may be on the
frontline, but it's not alone. malaysia is also dealing with a catastrophic migration crisis. many of the immigrants are muslims trying to escape religious persecution in myanmar. others from bang los angeles deck are looking for work in malaysia. smugglers using the jungles of high ty land as a super highway for human trafficking. hundreds, if not thousands of victims landing in unmarked graves as the malaysian government tries to seal its borders . joining from me from rome has been covering the refugees exodus, what countries have born the brunt of in human flow so far? rescued the most, settled the largest number of people? when it comes to rescue certainly italy has been leading the charge not only this year but also last year with the program they had called. [ inaudible ]. then the two countries that
followed that are malta and greece. basically southern europe.he rescue operations about, it comes to resettle think of these migrants, it is northern europe that carries the brunt on that. most of the migrants i spoke to last year who are disembarking in sicily and even the ones i met in libya a short while ago always say that they want to go to northern europe because that's where there are job opportunities and that's where they are the best social programs too help them reset and start a new life. >> is there any sign that the terrible loss of life that the horrifying suffering of this refugees, are making its way back? that the news is making it's a way back to senegal, eritrea syria, so that fewer people might be setting out in those boats because they know what awaits them? >> reporter: i was in libya a few weeks ago, just at the time where those about 800 people had drowned in the mediterranean and
i kept on asking migrants there about the dangers of crossing the sea, and a lot of them had told me they didn't care. that what happened to those people was sad, that that was their fate, but they wanted to take their own chances. there were many more people that actually make it to europe that those who drowned in the sea. these people come from very difficult places. they are born in to turmoil income to war in, to poverty and they have suffered a great deal to reach the shores of libya. so for them at that stage, well, there is no other choice, than to cross the mediterranean, most of the people i spoke to say going back home is simply not an option at this stage. >> you know, hoda, there are a lot of nongovernmental organizations that work specifically on the problems of migrants, a lot of international organizations and governmental groups, working in that same area.
has the world's response to this crisis, been coordinated, been anyway equal to the size of the challenge? >> reporter: i think the short answer to that is no. these organizations you are talking about operate mainly in italy, greece, europe. when i was in libya, i didn't see any of them on the ground. because of the chaos of the country, because of the civil war and dangers for these rocker organization to his operate in countries like that. but, you know, you have to take the problem much further south in to the desert. i think the main -- if you want to stop this flow of migration of people risking their lives and crossing the sea and bringing with them their problems here to europe, you'll have to go to the south, to africa and try to stop that flow there. it's going to be extremely difficult for international organizations to do that. simply because the network of smuggling and trafficking are
very shadowy, they rely on local militias, they rely on local war lords, and they operate in a terrain that they know very, very well. i think at this stage really the only way that you are going to be able to stop it in the long run would be to try to improve the quality of life and solve the problem in the home countries of these migrants, but as long as these problems exist they will continue to flee because no matter how we see it, and how they see the dangers they brave, many of them told me over and over again that it was still better than being back home. and i think that's the crux of the problem back home there is nothing for them. whereas traveling and braving those dangers brings them a bit of hope. >> al jazerra hoda on a rainy roof top in rome. hoda, thanks a lot. an estimated 1700 refugees have died in the mediterranean alone, that hasn't stopped, as you heard, new groups of desperate people from setting
out on long and dangerous journeys. the world has been slow to respond. we'll talk about why. stay with us, it's "inside story." >> guardianship imposed by the state >> they lose more rights than someone who goes to prison... >> what's being done to protect liberties in texas? >> i'm just a citizen trying to get some justice for an old man... >> an america tonight investigation only on al jazeera america
>> "compass" will challenge the way you look at the world. talking about big subjects. telling human stories. >> there's a tidal wave. >> we all have a problem. >> could you have seen that coming? welcome book to "inside story." tonight on the program refugees around the world making desperate journeys and the world's response to the growing crisis. today it's being reported the european union member states have reached an agreement to share the burdens of new migrant arrives more broadly in an effort to take the pressure off greece and italy. but the details are far from
nailed down, we are joined now by ambassador and visiting scholar at carnegie europe and also a former european union ambassador to turkey. thanks for being with us. can this continue to be a problem that the e.u., that the world handles boat by boat? >> well, we have reached a stage where we have a massive search in the recent past. these migrations have been on for a long time. i myself have been working on the libyan track for already 12 years ago, but now with the cop junction of conflict, somalia, boko haram, syria, you have a sudden surge, and of course the situation in libya, with the government in the west and alternative government in the east and some in the middle it doesn't stop. it increases the migrations through that channel. then, of course, the issue you
as always is to sort out who is an economy migrant and who is an an asylum seeker. there are criteria. but in the middle of such chaos it's very difficult to do the sorting out to. apply the high commissioner for refugees criteria, so this is what explains the current situation. >> i know the law is fixed around those two different designations, but it's kind of hard sometimes to tease out the difference between an economic and other sort of migrant, which in many of the same countries where people's personal danger is most acute, those are the places with cratering economies too. they are not too separate phenomenon . absolutely. it's becoming more and more difficult to isolate one from the other. in any case, as we have heard on your show, people are so desperate.
whatever the reason, they are so desperate they think they have nothing to lose. this is why they are spending staggering at of money in relation to their income or saving. people spends anywhere between 2,010,000 euros to get from somewhere in africa or the middle east to europe. so these traffickers networks are making huge amounts of money. of course, at the same time, as you ever shown, italy, malta greece, bear the brunt of first arrival. and then the countries in northern europe are the best performing asylum seekers so the proposal. e.u. commission which is is the executive in brussels which is across the street from me is trying to provide a comprehensive answer to all of these. many aspects, aspects within the even u., asylum policy, little agreements so far, the uk is an
exception. but also they are trying to address the issue you in the countries of origin and transits transits. and niger, for example, there is going to be a test case, a pilot case where people will be handled in cams, and hopefully avoid these fortunate russ journeys through the libyan desert and through the sea if they do not qualify for asylum. >> you noted at the outset one of the reasons the world is having these problems is all these crises are happening at the same time. there is no time horizon that i can see where syria will be involved, and eritrea will be solved and somalia will be solved and southern sudan will be solved. all at the same time. so you can handle your crises one by one. doesn't the world need a more
comprehensive view of no problem? >> ideally, yes. but of course the reasons you are mentioning are the same reasons for people to start the journey whatever the dangers and for people in european countries to become increasingly reluctant to welcome unlimited numbers of people. so the approximated eu proposal which is being discussed in two different tracks, one is e.u. and france and the other is interior ministers is just trying to put some order in to this. it is extremely difficult obviously. but one of the missions that they have assigned themselves is one to stop the traffickers making money out of these desperate people. and two to organize things better in the countries of departure, so that people, one understand the dangers and two
find better opportunities locally. at least in the countries where there is no conflict. >> i don't know if you have seen it yet, but there is a very sobering cartoon in this week's economist. i will show it to the audience now by the celebrated cartoonist cal. showing a modern ship bristling with communications equipment and military hardware and it's labeled even u. even you feel the boat is announcing to a bunch of floating migrants we hate to see your terrible pain and suffering at sea so we plan to disrupt the smuggling networks and stop the boats before they depart and then finally your terrible pain and suffering would be safely hidden a abroad. stopping departures will are won't change the conditions of these people, will it? >> i have seen these cartoon. it is a terrible, but very realistic summary of the situation.
now, this being said, europe is remaining open to asylum seekers and this is what is the subject of discussion, a better repetition of the asylum seekers between the south, center and north of europe. that will bring some measure of improvement. i myself do not believe in military operations to stop the traffickers' network. for the very simple reason that these people handle not thousands but millions of dollars or hundreds of millions of dollars in traffickers' money in migrants' money, so they have all the means needed to replace boats, even if they are destroyed. so the solution is not a military one. but military ships will be able to do better hopefully than is the case now, is simply search and rescue. but once you have rescued people at sea, you have to bring them to europe. there is no escape.
this is international law. what is now under discussion with countries like niger and others is whether people can hopefully be convinced to remain in their country and contribute to the development of their country, with even u. funding or with international funding. >> am the ambassador it a visiting scholar at carnegie our oven. thanks for being with us. of all the people fleeing conflict and hardship, perhaps the most vulnerable are children. we'll look at the particular prove aces they face and what kind of help they need desperate journeys is tonight's "inside story."
whether a family from myanmar's muslim my or at this decides it can no longer bare to stay or a woman and children are left with no means of support after a husband and father is killed by a barrel bomb in syria vulnerable people around the globe are being forced to make terrible choices in an effort to survive swear looking at the growing refugees crisis. francine joins us on us now, she is with save the children. welcome back to "inside story." as you look over the globe where are the real challenges now with so many people on the move in so many places? >> i think one of the challenges was what i was just seeing in italy. where we had people coming not from one or two countries affected by conflict, but we were seeing entire families who some hart made it to italy from sear isyria, we were talking to teens that had fled from eritrea and nigeria and somalia. so unfortunately, you know, the
number of refugees and migrants is at the highest point now in he can days. >> you know, where luke at a map and today on the wires there was an item mentioning that senegalese were being sent back in libya after attempting to make it to southern europe through libya boy, sen gal a long way from libya. you have to think not only about embarking from a place lie triply but the overlapped overland journey these families are making. it must be very dangerous for all involved? a absolutely. a lot of attention recent any in the drownings as we would there should be, but what is not commonly seen these people have traveled across two or three countries, in dez certificates think i spoke with a somali teen that had been on a long journey and seeing people dieing of
dehydration and extorted by traffic ears long the way. for many get on the ground that boat to cross the med mediterranean as dangerous as it sounds if you look at the journey they have been on for weeks, months, sometimes years that they have been on from their country you see the risk that somebody puts their five-year-old on a flinch see boat. one of the fathers i spoke to shoulder me stab marks on his arm and his five-year-old son, he said this is why we made journey they knew they couldn't stay in libya longer even though they had been there two years. >> you mentioned people being extorted and beaten in the journey. do some of the families and individual have his to pay several times each time they crosson international border or get hand odd from a different set of smugglers to another? >> yeah, unfortunately, paying a smuggler is not as simple as it sounds, this is not a business transaction where somebody is may go and they are get something kind of safe crossing
. they may be taken and held. teens have told thousands they were held in sort i've makeshift prison and their family members were contacted and told if you don't pay this amount of money you know, your son or cousin somebody near and dear to you will be here. once that money is paid there is no guarantee of making it much further third journey. so people are really not only risking their lives, but every last dime they have to try to pay was essentially a series of points where they can be ex-extorted and exploited along the way. and that can apply to teenagers travel on the ground their own and held in child lake or situations or teenage girls that have told us about being sexually abused along the way. >> are women traveling without men or traveling with children more vulnerable than somebody traveling with an intact family? >> absolutely. what we are focusing on is the
number of children traveling alone. granted the number of teenage boys is higher, but we do see teenage girls who are landing in italy as women. children are especially vulnerable not only to the physical dangers of being in heat and being, you know, not fed and facing mall malnutrition or of okay a flimsy boat, of being thrown overboard in the waves and all the kind of upheaval of the journey, but also because they are vulnerable to those who are praying on the weak. people are being, you know, held like i said in libya. i had one teenager tell me that he was held there no months, and essentially when he saw a boat he made a run for it. because he knew that was his only chance to get out of libya and to leave after he was being held there. so, again, they face a lot of dangers, not just get to this mediterranean after they crossed when they are in europe, trying to reach, you know, out to relatives or go to another country within europe, they can be, you know, in the hands of traffickers again, so really at every step along the way, we have a certainty in rome where
we are seeing teens from as far as afghanistan, so you can imagine a 12, 13, 14-year-old who doesn't have a parent or sibling or anyone with them, crossing that many international boundaries alone, it's really mind boggling. >> after natural disasters, offensive spoken to representatives from n.g.o.s like your organization and they talk about coordinating with governments or working with the leadership in these various regions. what about places where there is no leadership. or the leadership just happens to be whoever has the most guns. can save the children go to places like that and work something out? can they really protection people who are in such constant danger? >> it's a case by daze basis some countries are very complex and dangerous that we can work a local level. but as you have seen, they have been dangerous for aid workers no longer are they seen as sort
of neutral, third party, you know, there to help innocent people in a humanitarian sense they can be targeted as well so unfortunately those dangers, you know, that ply to aid organization, make it more difficult to reach the more vulnerable children and so you are talking about a population that's already been affected by war and conflict, you look at a place lie syria, obviously very difficult to operate not only to work with those who have left syria but inside the country itself. >> francine with save the children, good to talk to you again. >> thank you. and thanks for joining the program. we'll have to have you back as this continues to unwinds. i'll have some final thoughts in a minute on a tightening world that makes yesterday's nomads today's refugees. if you would like to share your thoughts follow us on the twitter @ajinsidestorya march. i can also visit our facebook page and tell us about your own experiences.
had a lot more give. across the centuries, people just picked up from one place, and walked to another. now it's a world of countries, and capitals, and governments and currencies and leaders. good ones and some really terrible ones. but the world doesn't have that same give anymore. it's a more ridge i had place. so people can't just pick up when a place isn't working out for them. and go someplace else. that same world can usually handle one melt down more or less, sends in fresh without, he lad the peacekeepers, help prop up a new government but the list of properties failing their people in 2015 is long and, as we have seen in recent months, there is no off the shelf set of rapid responses to help the most run ran people in the world. after bosnia, rwanda, haiti, honduras, somalia, darfur, congo and on and on, maybe it's time the world came up with one. i am ray war vice, that's tonight's "inside