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tv   Afternoon Live  BBC News  November 28, 2019 2:00pm-5:01pm GMT

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hello, you're watching afternoon live. i'm simon mccoy. today at 2pm... they don't add up — conservatives and labour are both accused of not presenting credible spending plans, by a leading economic research group. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years, driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. every household in britain bought an average 5a bags for life last year. environmental campaigners say they should be much more expensive, to curb plastic use. coming up on afternoon live, all the sport with katie shanahan. we will have the news that uk athletics have commissioned an independent review into its dealings
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with alberto salazar, who was banned forfour with alberto salazar, who was banned for four years with alberto salazar, who was banned forfour years for doping allegations. thanks, katie. also, the weather with thomasz shafernaker. at the moment, it is grey and rainy. but we can all look forward to some sunshine over the weekend. thanks, thomasz. also coming up. we have a special report about the damage being done to the black sea — long used as a dumping ground for plastic and chemical waste. hello, everyone. this is afternoon live. neither the conservatives nor labour are being honest about spending, in the run—up to next month's election — according to the independent institute for fiscal studies. the research group has examined both parties‘ economic plans and say they're not credible — because the tories would end up
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spending more than their manifesto pledge, and that labour would struggle to deliver the spending increases it has promised. the details come from our economics correspondent andy verity. the institute for fiscal studies is look to for objective analysis and its objective view is neither major party is being honest. labour pretends huge increases in spending can be financed only by corporations and the rich, and the conservatives continue to pretend taxis will not have to rise to get decent public services. we know the conservatives over the last two electoral cycles have ended up spending and borrowing a lot more than they said it would in their manifestos, i think that will happen again because they are suggesting essentially nothing in this way of additional spending this time beyond what is announced. labour has vast spending increases and tax increases which probably can't be delivered within a single parliament. the conservatives have promised no rise in taxis, but with
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extra spending already pledged, they are likely to break their own rules on borrowing. we welcome the scrutiny. if anyone has a look, they will see that alongside our manifesto we have published the most detailed costings document any party has published in any general election. the lib dems are promising big increases to tax and spending, helping public services but needing tax rises of £36 billion. the acknowledge they will have to rise income tax by a penny to pay for it. there are a lot of significant investments that lib dems will be making. the imf has recognised that isa making. the imf has recognised that is a pretty radical manifesto to sit out. it is one we can deliver as well. labour is planning the biggest increase in public spending in peacetime. the imf have said —— the
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ifa s has said public spending would still be lower than germany. but the seat would involve everyone, not just corporations and the rich. seat would involve everyone, not just corporations and the richlj think manifesto was bold, ambitious and no other party has produced a costed manifesto and put himself up to that type of scrutiny. the ifa has warned all plans could be thrown into disarray by brexit. the final trade deal was supposed to get done by the end of next year. labour's plans would require borrowing to rise. if under the conservatives britain were to leave the eu without a full trade deal, borrowing would have to rise by even more. andy verity is with me. let's talk about the conservatives, first of all. their pledges are
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overshadowed by brexit, trade talks and what might happen. one of the things they highlighted was the fact the conservative manifesto doesn't contain much. they say they will not raise vat or income tax, but the ifa says casting doubt on that. especially if brexit gets on the way. we have been talking about a departure dealfor way. we have been talking about a departure deal for years. way. we have been talking about a departure dealfor years. we haven't got down to kneeling down the terms oi’ got down to kneeling down the terms or starting to map out the main trade deal that has to be done within a year. the ifa says seeing under labour's extraordinary spending plans, borrowing would have to rise. but it would go up more without a trade deal in place. the criticism for labour is the numbers and they are so big. it is the biggest rise in spending in
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peacetime. £18 billion of extra day—to—day spending. the focus is not so much on the credibility of could be raise the taxes to pay for that, in fact that level of spending would still be below the level of public spending of countries such as germany. it would take it up to a germany. it would take it up to a german kind of level of publics ending. but what on? if there are not enough shovel ready projects to invest in, that money will take to spend. we saw pauljohnson in your report. he says a labour manifesto pledge was not achievable. lots of the pledges are not realistic, he is saying. the lib dems are talking about extra spending of £36 billion. that would require tax rises beyond
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the 1p that they are mentioning. they have saying they will have to rise in personal taxes. the politics are obvious. it is unpopular to talk about rising taxis, but the reality is that that is what will happen. look back at 2010. it was obvious the government was good to have to get more revenue in after the financial crisis. all the economists predicted vat would increase to 20%. and none of the parties were talking about it. you mean that they have that before! recently, there's been a demand for it to be more rigorous. they have done their costings and it is accurate, but whether or not it is accurate, but whether or not it is accurate, but whether or not it is accurate in the light of economic developments is a different question. andy verity, thank you
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very much. with two weeks to polling day, labour is changing its election strategy in areas which supported brexit in an attempt to widen the party's appeal. members of the shadow cabinet who back an eu withdrawal deal will be given a higher profile, while more activists are going to be sent to leave constituencies. jonathan blake is in southampton. simon, jeremy corbyn when he spoke of this morning about labour's environment plans didn't address specifically any shift in the pa rty‘s specifically any shift in the party's campaign specifically any shift in the pa rty‘s campaign strategy, specifically any shift in the party's campaign strategy, but he did take time after the speech in the question and answer session to set out in some detail labour‘s policy, try to make it as clear as possible, that is, that they would try to negotiate a new deal with the eu within three months and then put it to eu within three months and then put ittoa eu within three months and then put it to a public vote within six months. he was asked of he now had a different message to voters who voted to leave the european union in key parts of the uk, but he said his message was the same as it was in
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2016. the party needs to come together over brexit. no explicit acknowledgement labour is changing tack at this point in the campaign, but i think we will see in the days and couple of weeks left in the campaign to go a bit of a shift and more of an attempt by labour and certainly those key figures who support leaving the european union with a new deal within the labour party popping up and campaigning on key parts of the uk and this year in southampton is one of those because it did vote as a majority to leave the eu. two of the three seats your are held by conservative mps, one on are held by conservative mps, one on a knife edge at the last election. something labour will have their sights set on. jeremy corbyn, while focusing on the environment today and saying that close cooperation would be key, did acknowledge it was something they had to get across
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more clearly. the unite union boss len mccluskey has said the party needs to explain their policy more to working—class voters who voted to leave. jonathan, thank you. you can find out what each party is promising to do on the issues that matter to you by using our general election policy guide — which let's you easilycompare the parties‘ policies. find that at bbc.co.uk/news or on the bbc news app. throughout this election campaign we've been reporting from some key battle ground constituencies — let's go to my colleague martine croxall who is in cheltenham for us today. throughout the campaign, bbc news will be looking closely at the places where the election could be won and lost. we will be visiting 10 parts of the uk where seats will be closely contested.
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today, we re in cheltenham, which is in gloucestershire. this seat has been held by the conservatives since 2015 — and is bordered by two other constituencies, also belonging to the tories. the conservatives took cheltenham four years ago with a swing of 10% from the liberal democrats, who had held the seat for 23 years. but the liberal democrats will be hoping to regain the seat this year — the conservatives have a majority ofjust over 2,500. more than a quarter of people here are aged between 20—39. and the local authority area of cheltenham voted 56% to remain in the eu. 0ur correspondent fiona lamdin has this report on the liberal democrats bid to win back cheltenham. now, she doesn't. just to test me, whilst i am out of my comfort zone! how much of an issue is brexit for voters here? i'm told it is one of
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the biggest issues on the doorstep. boris johnson's the biggest issues on the doorstep. borisjohnson‘s message the biggest issues on the doorstep. boris johnson's message of the biggest issues on the doorstep. borisjohnson‘s message of getting brexit done is unlikely to go down well in cheltenham because the town voted strongly to remain. 56% of people voted to remain. the lib dems will really be trying to utilise this. they have already increased their majority in local council elections, they came up top on the european elections. they will be hoping to win cheltenham this time around. there is a local issue regarding the accident and emergency department. the nhs is a big issue nationally. there is a big local issue as well, to do with the a&e department. essentially, gloucestershire has two a&e departments, but campaigners fear the one in cheltenham could cause. in the last few years, services have been downgraded. for example, there are no a&e services at night. if it causes completely, it would mean
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people would have to travel eight miles to gloucester instead. the nhs locally have said that will not be the case. it is a big issue on the doorstep and an issue that all parties are campaigning on. just to reiterate that, the chief executive of gloucestershire hospital nhs foundation trust has said there is no proposal to close the a&e department and its not even in the consultation. they are being very emphatic. there is another local issue and really isn't a westminster issue and really isn't a westminster issue at all. what is boots corner? it is trying to find a solution to the traffic congestion corner. it is the traffic congestion corner. it is the road that goes through cheltenham and it splits the pedestrianised high street. the lib dem run council has launched this
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trial closure of the road. the aim is to improve air quality and to make it a nicer environment for shoppers to walk up and down. but it has not gone 100% smoothly, there have been thousands of fines handed out to drivers who have been unable to navigate the diversion routes, businesses have complained that delivery drops cannot get to shops and some have said it is putting shoppers from coming into the town. because of those issues and the fact it was a decision be made by the lib dems, it means the conservatives are jumping on that as an electioneering issue this time around. a local issue this time around. a local issue that could have an effect on the westminster seat. healy mortimer, political reporterfor the westminster seat. healy mortimer, political reporter for bbc your gloucestershire, thank you very much. you will have noticed we are in this beautiful regency building. it was where people used to come to ta ke it was where people used to come to take the medicinal waters, which you can still taste. there is a little pump around the corner. we sampled
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at this morning. very refreshing it is to. cheltenham is a spa town. and it also is a tone of sanctuary, offering safety to people who flee violence. we arejoined by bill flynn. what does your organisation do? cheltenham welcomes refugees, we work alongside the local charity who have responsibility from the home office to resettle vulnerable syrian families who are resettled from places where they have freed into cheltenham. how many syrian families do you have making their homes here? in cheltenham, about 30. they are settling in very well. obviously, there are things that they need to
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engage with and learn, and be welcomed into. when they arrive, they are resettled into properties that the local council have found for them. which are not under pressure from local people. they are two properties, maisonettes, not on the ground floor, without garden, normally. that local people are not too concerned about having. when the arrive, they are given facilities for learning english, connect with local schools for the children, doctors and all other infrastructure. you mentioned the importance of offering the right sort of accommodation that doesn't cause strain on the local population. we know that housing is a problem for some people in cheltenham. property prices are above average. so how important is it to address the housing needs of the town? very important, as it is
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all over the country. but particularly in this area for first—time buyers and people don't have the deposit to pay for their home. what would you say to people who are concerned about having people who do come from another part of the world, with their lives were very different, their cultures were very different, their cultures were very different, their cultures were very different, and bringing them into a tone like cheltenham.” very different, and bringing them into a tone like cheltenham. i can understand that. but there are 30 families out of a population of 45,000 or so. very briefly, what are the party is offering that is of interest to you? for me, the local lib dem council have been very organised and disciplined about focusing on offering properties not under pressure to local people, making people who are escaping war torn areas, fleeing from persecution, making them welcome in cheltenham. and i think that is a
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very good thing to do. bill flynn, from cheltenham welcomes refugees, thank you for being with us this afternoon. simon, i mentioned you can still take the medicinal waters. i think can still take the medicinal waters. ithinki can still take the medicinal waters. i think i will bring you a bottle back as it will do you good! check the label first! thank you, maxine. we have some breaking news from the metropolitan police. they say that injuly 2015, metropolitan police. they say that in july 2015, the metropolitan police had received an allegation againstjeffrey epstein and british women. it related to events outside the uk is an allegation to trafficking into london. the metropolitan police say they take
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concerns about exploitation seriously. officers interviewed the complainant. following that, it was clear that any investigation would be largely focused on activities and relationships outside the united kingdom. we therefore concluded the metropolitan police was not the appropriate authority to conduct inquiries in these circumstances and in november 2016, decision was made that this matter would not proceed toa that this matter would not proceed to a full criminal investigation. the statement says, in august 2019, following the death ofjeffrey epstein, there was a review and the position remains unchanged. it says the metropolitan police service has liaised with other law enforcement organisations and has not received a formal request asking for assistance regarding this allegation. so this allegation goes back to 2015. the
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metropolitan police are saying it is out with their remit. we will bring you more on that later. you're watching afternoon live, these are our headlines. a leading economic research group says spending plans for both the conservatives and labour don't add up, accusing them of presenting numbers that are not credible. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years — driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. tensions escalate between china and the us — after president trump signs a bill supporting hong kong's pro—democracy protesters. and coming up, breaking away black friday — the communities encouraging people to buy less to stop them turning to loan sharks in the run—up to christmas. in sport, the europa league take
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centre stage with all eyes on the arsenal manager as they are without a victory in six. and just but there is an injury doubt for england. i will be back with more of the stories in ten minutes. net migration has fallen to its lowest level in nearly six years. in the year tojune, 212,000 more people moved to the uk than left. the office for national statistics says the figures are largely due to a fall in the number of people coming here from the eu to work. our home affairs correspondent danny shaw is here. i suppose we shouldn't be hugely surprised. let's talk about the eu numbers first. they are striking. they are showing the net figure, so the difference between the number of people coming to live in the uk and eu citizens who are leaving britain to go back home. that has fallen to
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48,000. that is the lowest number since 2003. why is that date significant? well, that was the year before that you expanded, with countries such as poland, the czech republic and hungary joining. countries such as poland, the czech republic and hungaryjoining. and of course they all had the rights to come and live in britain, freedom of movement rules very controversial at the time and that led to the number of eu migrants increasing. so we are back to the net figure before 2004. outside the eu, figures are going 7 outside the eu, figures are going es, outside the eu, figures are going so outside the eu, figures are going up? yes, so whilst we are seeing a fall from within the eu, outside of europe it is going up. largely driven by an increase in people coming from china and india to work, people looking for work in the uk, who have work visas. and also by foreign students from outside europe as well. those numbers are growing up as well. those numbers are growing up is that you numbers are falling.
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we should see that eu migration are still a positive effect in terms of there are more coming than going. but in terms of the numbers leaving from eu countries —— to go back to you countries, it is at a record number. never before have we seen so many eu citizens leaving our shores. clearly a huge issue. what else has caught your eye? these figures suggest there is some kind of brexit effect going on here. whether it's because some people, eu citizens living in the eu thought this is not the country i want to be in, i'm going back home, or whether it has deterred people coming from eu countries that felt that after brexit things are going to be very uncertain, so they are not going to come, those are possible factors. the weakness of the pound is clearly something which has been cited as
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well. it doesn't make economic sense for some people to come to the uk and work here. what's interesting is that in a way the immigration system is sort of balancing out. if companies and services don't find they have eu migrants, then perhaps they have eu migrants, then perhaps they are coming in from outside the eu. there are some shortages in key sectors, as we are aware. danny shaw, thank you very much. let's go back to cheltenham and join my colleague martine croxall. well, why not! how much is too much, frankly? thank you, simon. cheltenham is a seat currently held by the conservatives with a majority of 2500. the lib dems held the seat for 23 years up until the election of 2015. they are hoping to steal it back. we arejoined by darren
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sherborne. and it executive emma logan. to be honest, i don't feel i can trust either of the main parties. it feels as if it is the incompetent against the dishonest. how likely is it that the liberal democrats will get your vote? i struggle with that as well. with the absence of the green party in cheltenham, that might be the way i have to vote. emma, you are stood in council elections but are no longer a party member. how likely is it that the conservatives will get your vote? 100%. our fantastic local mp has done so much for cheltenham. he stopped our emd being closed down, he has brought a cyber unit to cheltenham. creating employment as faras cheltenham. creating employment as far as you
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cheltenham. creating employment as faras you can cheltenham. creating employment as far as you can everywhere. why wouldn't i support an mp doing so much for the economy? i have to say, i have major issues with the liberal democrats locally. you spoke about the closure of boots corner, which i know sounds trivial. there are other options, of course. the liberal democrats are champing at the bit. it isa democrats are champing at the bit. it is a remain constituency in the brexit referendum. how concerned are you, like darren said, about the trust issue? we know there is relu cta nce trust issue? we know there is reluctance on the part of the prime minister to take part in certain television debates. i trust the prime minister, personally. ithink you will be a fantastic prime minister. no problems with him. darren, what are the local issues that are of concern to you here? in general elections, sometimes people vote on national matters and also
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local issues. i think, for me, vote on national matters and also local issues. ithink, for me, i would vote on the national issues normally. as far as local issues are concerned, led by my clients‘ businesses that i‘m involved in. free movement in terms of labour and goods is very important, and the nhs. how did you vote in the referendum? i voted out. nhs. how did you vote in the referendum? ivoted out. it nhs. how did you vote in the referendum? i voted out. it was never really made clear to me, at least not in my opinion, that free movement was going to be an issue. nobody talked about no—deal brexit. nobody talked about no—deal brexit. nobody talked about the consequences of that. how important is it for you, emma, someone who voted to leave the european union that there will be a deal? we all want a deal. i think most brexiteers want a deal. tory supporting brexiteers too. we wa nt tory supporting brexiteers too. we want to keep our ties. but
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cheltenham, it's very much a local election, i have to say, when people vote here. emma logan and darren sherborne, thank you very much for joining us at the pittville pump rooms. you can check out for all of the candidates for the seat on the bbc website. there you see the full list of candidates running here in that election on 12 december. if you are in another part of the country and you want to find out who is standing, you can also find that out on our website. martin, thank you. time for a look at the weather... what about thanksgiving in the united states? will it be white? there will be some snow in some parts of the uk, but this is the us
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in the last couple of hours. iowa is looking beautiful. thanksgiving, end of november, it snows in the us anyway. at the amount of snow some parts of the us have had in the last couple of days has been quite phenomenal. they recorded 33 entries m, phenomenal. they recorded 33 entries in, for example, denver. that is an awful lot of snow. and, you know how here we tend to define what constitutes as a white christmas. you mean a flake of snow on regent street! exactly. but in the us, you have to have at least an inch of snow lying on the ground or you need a full on blizzard. so, these conditions here in the uk, we would grow to a halt! but they need to see the sort of amount of snow before they constitute it as a white thanksgiving. this is not even a ski
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resort, it‘s right in the middle of denver. so, yeah, very wintry. there you go. lovely! tell us what is happening here. it will turn colder we might have a bit of snow over the mirrors in the hills of scotland, but that‘s pretty much it. the next few days, turning cold and sunny, not the whole story because there is a little bit of rain heading away to southern parts of the uk, but i‘ll get onto that in a second. the overall picture is that cold air is coming in all the way from the arctic, so things are turning colder and this process has already begun over northern parts of the uk, five or 6 degrees. here, we still have the remnants of mild air, andi still have the remnants of mild air, and i know it doesn‘t feel mild outside, but relative compared to what‘s coming away. cold enough tonight for some ice. wintry showers
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in the north. icy patches. you can see early on friday morning temperatures are barely above freezing across the northern half of the uk. now, the morning, could be cloudy. eventually, the northerly winds from the norwegian sea will winds from the norwegian sea will win and we are in that cold, crisp and clearairfrom win and we are in that cold, crisp and clear air from the win and we are in that cold, crisp and clear airfrom the northern climes. single figures pretty much across the board. a couple of showers here and there. perhaps some wintry ones over the hills. friday night, look at the frost. but something is happening here. south—western parts of england 8 degrees, yet it has —1 not! million miles away. so that‘s the thing i mentioned earlier. low pressure. everything north of the high pressure is very cold. at this high pressure is very cold. at this high pressure is very cold. at this high pressure is just nibbling pressure is very cold. at this high pressure isjust nibbling into parts
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of the uk. that means cornwall and devon could be quite re—, with rain. that could be some snow over the mirrors. the vast majority of the uk is sparkling. the same goals on sunday. we say goodbye to the area of low pressure. high pressure builds in. that means a fine sunday on the way. we keep that relatively chilly weather into next week. beyond tuesday, a bit more uncertain. i think we will be pleased to hear that for the vast majority of the uk, the weekend is looking cold, sunny and crisp. a busy weekend for many of us on the way!
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this is bbc news — our latest headlines: they don‘t add up — conservatives and labour are both accused of not presenting credible spending plans by a leading economic research group. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years — driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. every household in britain bought an average 54 "bags for life" last year — environmental campaigners say they should be much more expensive, to curb plastic use. sport now on afternoon live with katie shanahan — and news on the banned athletics coach alberto salazar — what‘s the latest? we‘ve found out today that uk athletics have commissioned an independent review into it‘s dealing with alberto salazar and his nike oregon project. salazar used to coach mo farah, britain‘s four—time olympic champion.
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last month, salazar was has been banned for four years after being found guilty of doping violations. since his ban, nike have said that it would close down the project. but, salazar says he is appealing. now, there‘s going to a review into the panel that was appointed by uk athletics back in 2015, who said that there was "no reason" to remove british athletes from salazar‘s programme. that‘s despite claims that the american had broken anti—doping rules. it is something that will certainly rumble on. let‘s look to football, huge pressure on arsenal and their manager. arsenal need a draw at home against eintracht frankfurt to qualify from their group. but, arsenal are now six games without a win, leaving the fans frustrated with the club‘s situation and so lots of eyes on unai emery tonight. he has even said that tonight is the "perfect chance to reconnect with supporters".
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arsenal have only one of all 13 premier league games this season so it is not looking good. at games going on, celtic, rangers and manchester united and wolves are all in action. the club is supporting me. the club is responsible in that area, backing me and! is responsible in that area, backing me and i appreciate it a lot. ifeel strong with that support and i know my responsibility to come back, to change the situation. i know we good connection with our supporters and i need to be strong in my consistency. the owners of manchester city have agreed to buy a majority stake in the indian super league club mumbai city fc. that increases their interest to eight clubs around the world.
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mumbai were founded in 2014 and have previously been managed by manchester city greats peter reid and nicola anelka. indian football expert russell osman thinks it‘s a good move. to be honest, absolutely brilliant that manchester city seem fit that they should take on someone like mumbai city fc and promote them as much as they can. it will do wonders for youth football over here as well. with the access that manchester city will give the academy of mumbai city, help with the players, the education, the administration, how a club should be run successfully administration, how a club should be ru n successfully a nd administration, how a club should be run successfully and i can only see everybody benefiting in a massive way. the second test against new zealand starts tonight, and england wicket keeper jos buttler could miss out with a back problem. ollie pope is ready to keep wicket in his absence — he last took the gloves in february, playing for the england lions. kent batsman zak crawley
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could make his debut should buttler have to sit out the match. england lost heavily in the first test and questions have been asked about the quality of their batting. in terms of when we say bat a long, doesn‘t mean we have to block it for three days and hope that that means we will get to a big score. it means reading the situation and making good decisions for long periods of time which allows you to bat long. the way i do that will be different to dom. everyone has their own way of doing it. it isjust to dom. everyone has their own way of doing it. it is just finding that fit around the situation. there‘s live commentary from hamilton on radio five live sports extra tonight — play starts at ten o‘clock — and there‘s full text commentary on the bbc sport website. that‘s all the sport for now. all throughout the election period radio 1‘s newsbeat have been touring the country in their election campervan.
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they‘re also in cheltenham today, so let‘s speak to steffan powell and find out where they‘ve parked up. iam i am always amazed it gets anywhere. i have seen it. i'm surprised it is still running as well. this time we have parked at cheltenham town fc, home of the robins. we can see there, close to the pitch as we physically can. on saturday they are playing port vale in the fa cup but first, some politics to talk about. joining us in the camper van we have madeline, lauren and taylor. they all work in the tech industry and they arejoining us all work in the tech industry and they are joining us to talk about they are joining us to talk about the things they really care about in this election. madeline, let‘s start with you. something i have learned since being in cheltenham is that some people say that cheltenham is the silicon valley of the uk. absolutely. you are right with that. why is the tech injury such a big
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pa rt why is the tech injury such a big part of life in cheltenham? we have gchq which is a massive employer but stemmed from that we have some amazing global and local tech and cyber industries that are clustering around cheltenham. the ncsc one their cyber schools which has focused on promoting schools tojoin in cyber activities, getting more girls into tech and channelling that growth of the region and making it the silicon valley of the uk for tech. lauren, you are a software engineer, so you are very clever. tech. lauren, you are a software engineer, so you are very cleverlj ama engineer, so you are very cleverlj am a software engineer and we focus on researching and designing new technologies in the area of cyber security. what is it about the tech industry that drew you in? what made you want to work in that? there are many challenges. new things coming along, new threats, the world is always changing, it is a digital age so always changing, it is a digital age so trying to protect people and making the what a secure place.
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taylor, you are an apprentice. but you have such a passion for cyber security that you are going out to schools to teach others about cybersecurity. what makes you love it so much? coming from school, it was a home from home to me because i get to be with people from my angel range. going from school to a full—time job is a baptism of fire. but it is nice to feel like i am back there. you got into tech because you are helping fix issues with your family around the house, is that right? i was the computer person into the house and that got more interested in that and found out how it worked. we are here talking about one of the big issues in this election and it is something audiences have been telling us they really care about, it comes up time and time again and we had that story today about the plastic bag charges.
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the environment and climate issues. madeline, that is important to you. it is really important that all the parties look at tech, how they can enable solving the climate change problem. in cheltenham we have amazing cyber change workspaces. they have 30 companies all being heated in one building and there is that innovation and collaboration that innovation and collaboration that comes out of that, so using the tech sector and all of those people to solve those issues, it is really important. there is a link then between the tech industry and a green future, is that what you are saying? the engineers are the ones that will solve these problems of the future and putting more investment in bringing more people into the industry will drive more perspectives, drive innovation and lead to the solutions of the problems we are seeing at the moment. when it comes to this election, will you be looking at the
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green policies of the parties when it comes to making your choice?” would say so. taylor, what do you think about the issue of green? is it important to you? i would like to say it is important to me, yes, but theissue say it is important to me, yes, but the issue is we are not educated enough on it. we see loads of things on the news about it but we don't actually know the core details and the key specifications of it, where if we were taught that both in schools and outside, people would be able to make a much better... assumption. just wrapping up to finish off, madeline, do you think it is the role of individuals to make a big change or is it up to businesses to try and solve our green future? it is a bit of both. by green future? it is a bit of both. by enabling businesses to have free recycling bins, giving people the option to go out litter picking as pa rt of option to go out litter picking as
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part of their corporate social responsibility, but also it comes down to the individuals wanting to change but for businesses to enable that change, they need to give them choices and has to be a movement within the organisation across the country and that individual basis. thank you very much all of you for coming into the camper van. it is starting to rain out there. the groundsman is busy doing his thing. getting chapman fc ready for their match. for now, from a very christmassy camper van, back to you, simon. what on earth is going on? it is still november. you say it is november and you are right, but cheltenham has a lovely christmas market. the lights are up there, in the hotel the christmas trees were up the hotel the christmas trees were up and we felt we needed to get into the christmas spirit. we thought we‘d make the most of it. we will continue adding decorations as we go but we felt we needed to start as we need to go on for the rest of this
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month and december. you are driving us to the christmas spirit! thank you very much. first a look at the headlines on afternoon live: a leading economic research group says spending plans for both the conservatives and labour don‘t add up, accusing them of presenting numbers that are not credible. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years — driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. tensions escalate between china and the us — after president trump signs a bill supporting hong kong‘s pro—democracy protesters. well, let‘s head back to cheltenham and speak to our business presenter, susannah streeter, who‘s at hesters way community resource centre. we have ducked out of the ring to ta ke we have ducked out of the ring to take shelter here in the resource centre. no christmas trees here but there is certainly a really good
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spirit of optimism that the future for this area in particular is one of the largest areas of social housing in the whole of gloucestershire, and in this hub there is a lot of support for the local people, from the doctor‘s surgery, hairdresser, there is a cafe but also there is a lot of business support as well for those entrepreneurs who need that extra support to push ahead in their ideas. let‘s have a chat now to one person who helped propel one idea to fruition. welcome to the programme, megan. tell me, you are a student when you first came up with the idea. what has happened since?” started two years ago working for create on the square and we wanted to do some projects that would help encourage new people into the area. we set up an escape room which is a game, you come with a group of friends and you get locked into a room for an hour and you had to solve puzzles and find clues to
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figure out how to escape. we just tested the idea. we set up three escape rooms in the centre, getting people to know about it and testing the idea and now two years on, we offer fully fledged company. the idea and now two years on, we offerfully fledged company. it the idea and now two years on, we offer fully fledged company. it is great to be part of a now thriving community. also, offer really interesting jobs for local people. definitely. we have been able to provide multiplejob definitely. we have been able to provide multiple job opportunities for locals and hopefully something people really enjoy and get a lot of benefit out of and feel part of a family when they are working with us. thank you very much. a real success for first job out us. thank you very much. a real success for firstjob out of uni. let‘s chat to lizzie george who sets out the create on the square project. tell me what it has achieved so far. when we took over the unit, half the units on the shopping centre where vacant and we took on a unit that had not been used in ten years, totally dilapidated, refurbished it, breathe
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life back into it and we started to engage with the local community. we live in the area, work in the area, engage with people to see what ideas and how we can encourage creative enterprise. this area has been described as deprived. do you think, how do you think this area should be perceived? i don't like the term deprived. and branding with those negative labels. it makes people think of this as a homogenous area, everybody has got problems, needs and instead of thinking of people with gifts and talents and something to bring to the table, you know, we are not an area that needs fixing. we have been neglected but there is a lot of potential here. what do you wa nt to a lot of potential here. what do you want to see from the next government to help propel schemes like yours forward ? to help propel schemes like yours forward? personally i would like three things. reduction in the corporation tax rate for very micro
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companies, an increase in the employers national insurance allowa nce employers national insurance allowance and that would enable us to employ more salaried people, and then an increase in the vat registration threshold. briefly, housing is also crucial in this area. anecdotally, how have you experienced this? having children, they have been able to move out but having somewhere of their own if thatis having somewhere of their own if that is what they wanted, affordable housing would be so important. it would be lovely to see. thank you. talking about this project create on the square, a real example of how with the right support, businesses can thrive. in the next hour we will talk about the jobs market here and also the skills shortage which is a real issue as well in this area, but for now, simon, back to you. borisjohnson has said he is committed to the "biggest drive" of female member, activist and candidate recruitment.
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during a visit to devon today, the prime minister said it is his ambition that half of tory candidates on the party‘s list for future parliamentary elections are women. he told reporters, "talent and brilliance is equally distributed, but opportunity is not. i will make sure that women are supported to take up the opportunities that politics present." let‘s speak to our political correspondent ben wright who‘s travelling with the prime minister. we have just left plymouth where the prime minister was at the unveiling ofa prime minister was at the unveiling of a new statue to lady astor who was the first female mp to take her seatin was the first female mp to take her seat in the house of commons. precisely 100 years ago today and the statue was unveiled by theresa may and boris johnson turned the statue was unveiled by theresa may and borisjohnson turned up an hour later and stood in front of it. now we are heading off somewhere else in devon. it is a couple of daysin else in devon. it is a couple of days in the south—west, cornwall yesterday and devon today. we will
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leave it there because we have a slight problem with this signal. we will be back with ben later on. environmental campaigners are calling for charges on supermarket "bags for life" to be raised to 70 pence. it comes as research shows use of the plastic bags has risen again this year to one—and a—half—billion — that‘s a total of 54 for every household in the uk per year. it has been hailed as a huge success, the law requiring supermarkets to charge for every single—use plastic bag. but are we just swapping one bad habit for another? environmental groups would like to see the ice for a back to life raised to at least 70 p. i only personally use it if i‘ve forgotten my bag. i don‘t know how much an increase in the price would change behaviour. there's so many cotton and jute bags out there, nobody needs to be using plastic ones and if they are going to get thrown away anyhow, let's produce less of them and use other alternatives.
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currently we don't reuse them because they are only ten p. however, if there were increased to 70p, then we would definitely be reusing them more. sainsbury ‘s recently doubled their charge for durable bags to 20p and got stick from a lot of customers for that. a bag for life is a good thing if it is used for light but our figures thing if it is used for light but ourfigures show thing if it is used for light but our figures show these are just being used for a week if that by a lot of customers. the low price means there is not the incentive for people to reuse and there is also issues with biodegradable plastics. they don‘t always break down in a natural environment so they can cause just as natural environment so they can causejust as much harm as natural environment so they can cause just as much harm as a conventional plastic bag. environmental groups say bags for life are usually bigger and contain more plastic. it is part of the reason why overall plastic used in place supermarkets is actually growing. but the supermarkets say they are aware of the problem and
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are doing their best to tackle it. people are not using them for life, they are using them for a week and they are using them for a week and the weight of these bags is three times more so in some cases we triple the amount of plastic in circulation and it is an unintended consequence and that is why we have tried the uk‘s first plastic bag free supermarket where we are only selling paperbacks. that trial has done really well and is something we are looking to roll—out next year. liddell is stopping selling bags for life in its welsh stores and will do so in the rest of the uk if the experiment works. let‘s speak now to dr cathrine jansson—boyd — a consumer psychologist from anglia ruskin university who specialises in environmentally friendly consumption. first of all, would putting up the price be the trigger that will change people‘s habits on something like this? well, we did see a change
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in behaviour when they actually added a charge for the plastic bags in the first sort of run for it. it will probably put some people off, however it is not likely to put eve ryo ne however it is not likely to put everyone off because we still see consumers purchasing plastic bags when they go shopping, especially when they go shopping, especially when they go shopping, especially when they forget. not everyone has got into the habit of bringing one with them and what we have seen and seems to work really well is that in retail environments where they don‘t put the bags out at all, there were no backs to buy, you have to ask for them as they are still on sale, it seems to trigger a bit of an embarrassment which is quite a strong emotional response for consumers. we do know from a lot of studies that if they experience high levels of emotions, they won‘t repeat that particular behaviour again. if you charge a fiver for every bag, they will not be passing
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on. no, probably odd. especially not the quality of the bags that is currently there because they are not really reasonable. in an ideal world we will pack them up and take them with us, unless you bags for life which are a bit more expensive. consumers don‘t seem to hang on to them so increasing the cost would reduce the number of people using them but there are other strategies that can be implemented to try and deter consumers. like i said, don‘t put them out in the first place, make sure people had to ask for them and they are much less likely to continue to use them. people's attitudes are certainly changing about their behaviour doesn‘t necessarily go hand in hand with that. yes, this is a common problem that. yes, this is a common problem that we have. we do find from studies that somewhere in the region of 60, 60 5% say, no, i am very environmental, i want to do the
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right thing. this is really good to increase prices. but then when we look at their behaviours, especially the purchase behaviours, we find it is only 20% of these people who reportedly have high environment to attitudes that actually purchase things that are good for the environment and this is a problem. we have been persuaded by all these media attention that we need to be more environmentally aware and we buy into it, but we are creatures of habit. we like to do what we usually do and if it is too much of an inconvenience, people simply won‘t go there. therefore we need to change it for them and one strategy could be indeed to put the prices up or take the bags away, make them feel awkward so that it is an effort to actually using them. there is also the issue of packaging itself, what you put in the bags. some supermarket change are doing the
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paperback model and that seems to be relatively popular but if you just put that out everywhere, that will change habits quite fast. it would change habits quite fast. it would change habits quite fast. it would change habits quite fast. the problem that we have of course again is the paper bags are not that robust and we need to be careful what we are implementing because if everybody continues to use paper all the time, that will also have an impact on the environment. it is about getting the right kind of balancing act which can be quite difficult to do. the best thing would be if consumers have a very strong conviction that they need to be environmental because we know the strongly held attitudes are more closely aligned with behaviour results. then we might start seeing people engage in a different kind of purchase strategy. very good of you tojoin us. purchase strategy. very good of you to join us. thank purchase strategy. very good of you tojoin us. thank you so much for your time.
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time for a look at the weather now. pretty grey and rainy out there for some of us this afternoon but there are changes on the way. in fact the changes have already started to take place across scotland and colder weather is on the way. not desperately cold but certainly something a little bit more different to what we have been experiencing in the last few days. you can see the cold current of air coming out of the arctic, christina regency, and by the time we get to tomorrow, that colder air will reach southern parts of britain. in the short term with outbreaks of rain across the midlands, the south, some wintry showers in the north. 5 degrees at 5pm there in the lowlands of scotland. you can see the change in the wind direction, coming straight out of the north, bringing wintry showers to scotland and even overnight, patches of ice developing
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across rural areas of northern england. with those temperatures close to freezing. but the far south still holding on to 6 degrees, so i don‘t think there will be a foster first thing. friday first thing, a bit of cloud and then we are in that fresher air from bit of cloud and then we are in that fresher airfrom the bit of cloud and then we are in that fresher air from the north. bit of cloud and then we are in that fresher airfrom the north. it will feel quite chilly, particularly on the north sea coast. quite strong winds, a real wind—chill if you are in newcastle, hull or norwich but in the midlands, tonnes of sunshine on the midlands, tonnes of sunshine on the way, 6 degrees, a beautiful end of the working week. friday night, with that colder air stream, we see a widespread frost developing apart from the south—west of the country, it is8 from the south—west of the country, it is 8 degrees here early on saturday morning and that is because there is a little fly in the ointment heading our way this weekend. yes it will be sunny for many of us, apart from temporarily at least the south—west of the country, so the thinking is the weather front associated with this slope will clip the far south—west
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of the uk and then shoot off into france and spain so it doesn‘t look as if cornwall, devon, possibly as far north as cardiff and bristol could see some rain and more maybe even some sleet across the moors. but let no pressure is that weather front but let no pressure is that weather fro nt m oves but let no pressure is that weather front moves into that continent, spreads itself across the whole of the uk so by sunday, back into the fine weather. not necessarily glorious sunshine all the time but the weather is looking dry, settled with morning frost expected in the coming days and then some time later next week, perhaps it will turn just that little bit milder. that is it for me, you are up to date.
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hello, you‘re watching afternoon live. i‘m simon mccoy. these are the headlines at 3 pm: they don‘t add up — conservatives and labour are both accused of not presenting credible spending plans, by a leading economic research group. both risk end up borrowing a lot more than they are saying, either because we end up with the economy doing much worse or in the case of labour because they don‘t get anywhere near as much tax in as they are suggesting. or, for the conservatives, they have to spend more than they are seeing. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years — driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. every household in britain bought an average 54 bags for life last year. environmental campaigners say they should be much more expensive, to curb plastic use. coming up on afternoon live, all the sport...
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uk athletics has commissioned an independent review into its dealing with alberto sala—zar and his nike oregon project. last month, was banned for four years for doping violations. thanks. and now thomasz shafernaker has all the weather. quite grey in the short term. by the weekend, chilly, sunny with some autumn weather. thanks, thomasz. also coming up, we have a special report about the damage being done to the black sea — long used as a dumping ground for plastic and chemical waste. hello, everyone. this is afternoon live. i‘m simon mccoy.
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neither the conservatives nor labour are being honest about spending, in the run—up to next month‘s election — according to the independent institute for fiscal studies. the research group has examined both parties‘ economic plans and say they‘re not credible because the tories would end up spending more than their manifesto pledge, and that labour would struggle to deliver the spending increases it has promised. the details come from our economics correspondent andy verity. the institute for fiscal studies is looked to for objective analysis and its objective view is neither major party is being honest. labour pretends huge increases in spending can be financed only by corporations and the rich, and the conservatives continue to pretend taxis will not have to rise to get decent public services. we know the conservatives over the last two electoral cycles have ended up spending and borrowing a lot more than they said it would in their manifestos, i think that will happen again because they are suggesting essentially nothing in this way of additional spending this time beyond what is announced. labour has vast spending increases and tax increases
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which probably can‘t be delivered within a single parliament. the conservatives have promised no rise in taxes, but with extra spending already pledged, they are likely to break their own rules on keeping borrowing down. ifa if a trade deal was not finalised soon, it will jump. we welcome the scrutiny. if anyone has a look, they will see that alongside our manifesto we have published the most detailed costings document any party has published in any general election. the lib dems are promising big increases to tax and spending, helping public services but needing tax rises of £36 billion. they acknowledge they will have to rise income tax by a penny to pay for it. there are a lot of significant investments that lib dems will be making. the ifs has recognised that is a pretty radical manifesto to set out.
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it is one we know we can deliver as well. labour is planning the biggest increase in public spending in peacetime. the ifs has said public spending would still be lower than germany. but they say it would involve everyone, notjust corporations and the rich. i think our manifesto is bold, ambitious and no other party has produced a costed manifesto and put themselves up to that type of scrutiny. the ifs has warned all plans could be thrown into disarray by brexit. the final trade deal was supposed to get done by the end of next year. labour‘s plans would require borrowing to rise. if under the conservatives britain were to leave the eu without a full trade deal, borrowing would have to rise by even more.
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well, i also spoke to andy verity earlier , who gave us his analysis of the ifs‘s findings. one of the things they highlighted was the fact the conservative manifesto doesn‘t contain much. they say they will not raise vat or income tax, but the ifs is casting doubt on that. especially if brexit gets on the way. —— especially if brexit gets in the way. we have been talking about a departure deal for years. we haven‘t got down to nailing down the terms or starting to map out the main trade deal that has to be done within a year. the ifs is saying under labour‘s extraordinary spending plans, borrowing would have to rise. but it would go up more without a trade deal in place. the criticism for labour is the numbers and they are so big. it is the biggest rise in spending in peacetime.
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£18 billion of extra day—to—day spending. the focus is not so much on the credibility of could they raise the taxes to pay for that, in fact that level of spending would still be below the level of public spending of countries such as germany. it would take it up to a german kind of level of public spending. you want to spend money, but what on? if there are not enough shovel—ready projects to invest in, that money will take to spend. we saw pauljohnson in your report. he says a labour manifesto pledge was not achievable. it is pretty strong criticism. lots of the pledges are not realistic, he is saying. the lib dems are talking about extra
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spending of £36 billion. that would require tax rises beyond the 1p that they are mentioning. they have saying they will have to raise personal taxes. the politics are obvious. it is unpopular to talk about rising taxes, but the reality is that that is what will happen. look back at 2010. it was obvious the government was going to have to get more revenue in after the financial crisis. all the economists predicted vat would increase to 20%. and none of the parties were talking about it. you mean that they have fibbed before! well, it looks like it! recently, there‘s been a demand for it to be more rigorous. they have done their costings and it is accurate, but whether or not it is accurate in the light of economic developments is a different question.
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with two weeks to polling day, labour is changing its election strategy in areas which supported brexit in an attempt to widen the party‘s appeal. members of the shadow cabinet who back an eu withdrawal deal will be given a higher profile, while more activists are going to be sent to leave constituencies. jonathan blake has been following the labour leader in southampton. jeremy corbyn when he spoke of this morning about labour‘s environment plans didn‘t address specifically any shift in the party‘s campaign strategy, but he did take time after the speech the question and answer session to set out in some detail labour‘s policy, to try to make it as clear as possible, that is, that they would try to negotiate a new deal with the eu within three months and then put it to a public vote within six months. he was asked if he now had a different message to voters who voted to leave the european union in key parts of the uk, but he said his
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message was the same wherever he went, as he said in 2016. the party needs to come together over brexit. no explicit acknowledgement labour is changing tack at this point in the campaign, but i think we will see in the days and couple of weeks left in the campaign to go, a bit of a shift and more of an attempt by labour and certainly those key figures who support leaving the european union with a new deal within the labour party popping up and campaigning in key parts of the uk and this year southampton is one of those because it did vote as a majority to leave the eu. two of the three seats here are held by conservative mps, one on a knife edge at the last election. something labour will have their sights set on. jeremy corbyn, while focusing on the environment today and saying that close cooperation would be key, did acknowledge it was something they had to get across more clearly.
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the unite union boss len mccluskey has said the party needs to explain their policy more to working—class voters who voted to leave. the dup launched its manifesto today, saying it is united in opposition to a customs border in the irish sea after brexit. the leader arlene foster said that the number of democratic unionists elected would determine the future shape and direction of the united kingdom, and they would continue to try to change the prime minister‘s brexit deal if borisjohnson remains in number ten. the deal obviously that is there at the moment is not acceptable. and everyone across northern ireland knows the reasons for that. certainly unionism, as nigel has said, is united in relation to our rejection of the boris deal and therefore it needs to be changed. you can find out what each party is promising to do on the issues that matter to you by using our general election policy guide — which lets you easilycompare the parties‘ policies. find that at bbc.co.uk/news
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or on the bbc news app. throughout the campaign, bbc news will be looking closely at the places where the election could be won and lost. we will be visiting ten parts of the uk where seats will be closely contested. today we‘re in cheltenham in gloucestershire, a tory—held seat. but the liberal demorats are pushing to win back the constituency, as fiona lamdin reports. # you see, cinderella, you don't need an indication.# it‘s dress rehearsal here for cheltenham‘s christmas panto. but this is not the only event in town. currently, the seat is held by the conservatives, but it‘s predicted to be one of the closest battles as the liberal democrats fight to take it back. good afternoon, everyman theatre box office. and aside from opening night here, backstage, it‘s all the theatre are talking about. so at home at the moment, there‘s a huge conversation i‘m having with my partner about tactical voting. i‘m just persuaded them to vote
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for lib dem this time because i feel a vote for another party would be a wasted vote. there's a lot of signs up from people who are clearly supporting the lib dems. i think there's a lot of passion and a lot of feeling that it would be nice to go back to being a lib dem constituency. and last night we saw this first—hand. i'm calling for the local liberal democrats. you are, you're going to vote lib dem? anything to keep the tories out. right, yes, get the tories out. it was cold and wet, but the lib dem effort was out in force. i‘m building during the days. so at night when i come home, it‘s either canvassing, folding leaflets, delivering them, just busy all of the time. and i‘m not alone. you know, there‘s a whole crew and we‘re well organised. it does feel like we‘ve got a chance. the real worry is it‘s going to be really tight. actually unseating an incumbent mp is no mean task. you know, we need to work our socks off to get over the line and win this seat. well, the pressure is certainly on here. cheltenham is a lib dem target seat.
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it‘s number six on their list. a few streets away, the cheltenham skittles league are in play tonight. i've always voted conservative and i've seen nothing that's going to prompt me to vote anything different this year. 57% of this town voted to remain in the eu. so will the lib dem promise to revoke article 50 persuade conservative voters? all the parties, they can't decide amongst themselves. so i don't feel strongly enough to vote lib dem only because i want to stay in europe. so i'm still going to vote for the party i normally vote for. do you you feel that they‘re working quite hard here in cheltenham? yeah, i can see that they're working hard over the country, i think. but they‘re not going to persuade you? no, not me. not me personally. with two weeks to go, the whole town is poised to see who will be left standing. fiona lamdin, bbc news.
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and for a full list of the candidates standing in the cheltenham constituency,go to the bbc news website. some breaking news from the electoral commission. donations over £7,500 are up. labour received the most. the conservatives in second and the brexit party in third. the
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single biggest donation was £3 million from the unite union to labour, followed by £2 million from brexit party backer christopher harper. and some more breaking news. three teenage boys have admitted threatening two women on a bus. the women were on the upper deck of a double—decker bus in camden in north london, when confronted by youths in the early hours of 30 may. the teenagers appeared in court, after previously denying charges of harassment. the highbury corner youth court heard the two women were surrounded by the boys, hit with
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coins after refusing to perform a six act. —— six word act. we will be hearing from a correspondence later. you‘re watching afternoon live, these are our headlines. a leading economic research group says spending plans for both the conservatives and labour don‘t add up, accusing them of presenting numbers that are not credible. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years, driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. tensions escalate between china and the us, after president trump signs a bill supporting hong kong‘s pro—democracy protesters.
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uk athletics has commissioned an independent review into its dealing with alberto sala—zar and his nikey oregon project. last month, was banned for four years for doping violations. all eyes are on arsenal after not winning a game in six matches. and jos buttler is an injury doubt. i will be back with more on those stories in ten minutes. net migration has fallen to its lowest level in nearly six years. in the year tojune, 212,000 more people moved to the uk than left. the office for national statistics says the figures are largely due to a fall in the number of people coming here from the eu to work. earlier i spoke to our home affairs correspondent danny shaw about the figures. they are showing the net figure,
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so the difference between the number of people coming to live in the uk and eu citizens who are leaving britain to go back home. that has fallen to 48,000. that is the lowest number since 2003. why is that date significant? well, that was the year before the eu expanded, with countries such as poland, the czech republic and hungary joining. and of course they all had the rights to come and live in britain, freedom of movement rules etc very controversial at the time and that led to the number of eu migrants increasing. so we are back to the net figure before 2004. outside the eu, figures are going up? yes, so whilst we are seeing a fall from within the eu, outside of europe it is going up. largely driven by an increase in people coming from china and india to work, people looking for work in the uk, who have work visas. and also by foreign students from outside europe as well.
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those numbers are going up as the eu numbers are falling. we should see that eu migration are still a positive effect in terms of there are more coming than going. but in terms of the numbers leaving to go back to eu countries, it is at a record number. 121,000 in the year tojune. never before have we seen so many eu citizens leaving our shores. clearly a huge issue. what else has caught your eye? these figures suggest there is some kind of brexit effect going on here. whether it‘s because some people, eu citizens living in the eu thought this is not the country i want to be in, i‘m going back home, or whether it has deterred people coming from eu countries that felt that after brexit things are going to be very uncertain, so they are not going to come, those are possible factors. the weakness of the pound is clearly something which has been cited as well. it doesn‘t make economic sense
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for some people to come to the uk and work here. what‘s interesting is that in a way the immigration system is sort of balancing out. if companies and services don‘t find they have eu migrants, then perhaps they are coming in from outside the eu. there are some shortages in key sectors, as we are aware. the metropolitan police have defended their decision not to investigate allegations that the american woman — who says she had sex with prince andrew as a teenager — was trafficked to the uk by the disgraced financier, jeffrey epstein. scotland yard said it was not the appropriate authority to look into the claims made by virginia roberts, as they largely focused on activities outside britain. prince andrew has strongly denied any wrongdoing. epstein took his own life in august. our royal correspondentjonny dymond is with us in the studio. so, why now? what is this about?
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well, i think the presumption is that this comes as a result of investigations that have been made by bbc panorama, going on here next monday. with what we understand to be an interview with virginia roberts, where she makes a series of allegations, a number of which one sun have been made before by virginia roberts both in the us and in australia. allegations which the palace has denied, that she slept with prince andrew in the uk in 2001, but that she was being effectively trafficked by the billionaire businessman jeffrey epstein in 2001 and therefore did not effectively give consent. panorama have made a series of questions to the metropolitan police, and that is why the other issue the statement now, as to why they did not follow up the complaints that were made by
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virginia roberts in 2015. basically, what you‘re seeing is it didn‘t happen in this country and therefore it is not in the remit. they are saying the trafficking is organised outside of british territory, jeffrey epstein is dead and as far as they are concerned, there is no case to answer. now, there are a host of allegations and questions around this, and there are a number of people who think that because there was the allegation that royalty was involved that this may or may not have affected the metropolitan police‘s investigation. the met say it has nothing to do with that and this is a question of territoriality, where a question —— crime may or may not have occurred. in an extensive interview, the
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prince has denied it and given reasons as to why it could not have been him on the night. we will have to wait and see what virginia roberts says in this interview, but at the moment the met police are saying this is the reason why they did not investigate the complaint. johnny, thank you very much. china has accused the united states of sinister intentions and has threatened counter measures after president trump signed into a law a bill which supports pro—democracy protesters in hong kong. it requires american officials to assess whether the territory has enough autonomy from china to justify special trading terms with the us. nick beake reports. this university campus has been the battle ground for one of the fiercest fights in the struggle for hong kong. and their primitive weapons kept the police at bay. today, though, officers moved in and began the clear up. well, all morning the police have been gathering up the unused molotov cocktails the protesters left behind.
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and at the same time, china has been accusing president trump of throwing in his own petrol bomb into the situation in hong kong. i hereby grant you a full and complete pardon. as well as granting pardons, the president has just signed off a new law which could scrap the special trading status the us gives hong kong. that is if china isjudged to have eroded hong kongers‘ freedoms. the move provoked fury in beijing, where officials said america had taken the side of violent criminals. translation: the chinese government will oppose any external forces interfering in hong kong's affairs. we advise the united states not to act arbitrarily, otherwise china will take firm countermeasures. all consequences of this must be borne by the united states. but back in hong kong, the pro—democracy movement, which has just triumphed in local elections, thanked president trump for a second victory inside one week. one prominent activist
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called on other countries to follow the us‘ lead. for a us president to sign on the hong kong human rights and democracy act, that is the remarkable achievement of all the hong kongers. it just encourages world leaders around the world and politicians to be aware that it is time for them to stand with hong kong. but, at the trashed university, the beijing—backed police are collecting evidence against protesters, which it hopes will stand up in court. all this in a city in crisis, that is provoking increasing tension between the world‘s two superpowers. nick beake, bbc news, hong kong. the pollsters called the brexit referendum wrong and the 2015 and 2017 elections each led to inquiries. while some may say polling is broken, the 2017 election had one notable success — a constituency level model that correctly called the hung parliament ten days before polling.
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today, the times has the 2019 version, which suggests if the election was held now the conservatives would win a comfortable house of commons majority. so, is the result a done deal? here to discuss is our head of statistics, robert cuffe. is there any point then to the next two weeks — or can we all pack up and go home? well, conservatives might want to, as you say. a majority in the 605. that can be anything between a landslide under 5lim margin. it is co nsi5te nt landslide under 5lim margin. it is consistent with a poll lead of about 11 points and that is what we have been seeing in the national polling. if it goes below, if it goes to around seven, they might start to get nervous. so if we take a look at what we have seen in the polls of the last few months, you see some reasons for them perhaps to be a bit careful. the tories kind of took off ahead of labour in the middle of the summerand
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ahead of labour in the middle of the summer and have been zooming off up ahead. but ever since the election was cold in november, we see labour creeping up behind them. recent poll5 creeping up behind them. recent polls are starting to suggest that maybe the conservatives are topping out and the gap between the two parties is narrowing. good news yesterday, but with the potential for things to change, they might be tempted to go with yesterday. the national polling takes about 1000 people and you asked them who they are going to vote for. it is difficult to turn that into a seat share, which is what the model in the times newspaper gave us today. they have taken the national trends regarding groups of people and have applied them to local 5eat5. it will
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mess truly local things such as a former conservative running as an independent and they have name recognition, but it does allow you to get into the detail at a constituency level. can that tells a different picture? i think it does. in scotland, the snp have been picking up more 5eat5 in scotland, the snp have been picking up more seats in this model at the expense of labour and the tories. in england and wales, it‘5 largely a swing towards the conservatives from labour. that 5tronger conservatives from labour. that stronger in brexit — heavy 5eat5. this is a bit more helpful than tactical voting 5ugge5tion5 this is a bit more helpful than tactical voting suggestions and leaflet5 through doors. tactical voting suggestions and leaflets through doors. thank you for that.
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you are watching afternoon live. the family of harry dunn, who was killed when he was knocked off his motorbike, has begun legal proceedings against the foreign office. harry‘s parent5 allege granting diplomatic immunity to the main suspect, in the 19—year—old‘s death, was wrong in law. the foreign office has said it would oppose and seek costs for anyjudicial review. the first funerals have been held in vietnam for some of the 39 people found dead in a refrigerated lorry in essex last month. families of 16 of the victims have held service5. the bodies of the other people who died are expected to be returned to vietnam from the uk this weekend. the family of the celebrity chef gary rhodes have confirmed that he died from a head injury. rhodes, who died aged 59, collapsed at his home in dubai with a subdural hematoma, which is usually associated with a brain injury.
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time for a look at the weather. the us is blanketed with snow in some parts. that is from iowa. the5e scenes widely acro55 part5 some parts. that is from iowa. the5e scenes widely acro55 parts of the us. in the last couple of days, some areas have had 33 inches. we get snow in parts of the northern region, but to get to almost blizzard conditions in minneapolis and denver... my watch is telling me that there is no snow in the forecast! it was obviously listening to what i was saying! apologies, that was not part of the plan. hang on, there is snow in your forecast.
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ye5, forecast. yes, but it doesn‘t know where i am talking about. i should have taken it off! anyway... this is the picture from denver. it looks like this could be a ski resort. for it to bea this could be a ski resort. for it to be a white thanksgiving, there mu5t to be a white thanksgiving, there must be at least an inch of snow on the ground. it is very different to a white the ground. it is very different to a white christmas in the uk which is just, what? i don‘t know. one flake of snow on regent street or whatever. .. i don‘t know. one flake of snow on regent street or whatever... put your watch back in your pocket and tell us what the forecasters! the next few days. cold and sunny from around about tomorrow onwards and the cold air stream coming in from the norwegian sea. you can see these cold winds moving into scotland, the north of england. by
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tomorrow‘s dawn, we will see that colder air reaching southern parts of the uk. at the moment it is still relatively mild across the south, 10 degrees, cloudy, outbreaks of rain but the skies are starting to play in the north. cold air using in an called enough even for some ice to form here and there. temperatures down to freezing, particularly in rural spots first thing on friday. what does that mean for friday? it means that with this colder air coming in from the north it will be a crisp autumn day. a real chill in the airon the a crisp autumn day. a real chill in the air on the north sea coast with that when planning out of the north. some showers possibly wintry ones across the hills as well and temperatures of 5 degrees in newcastle, hull, at the wind it will feel really cutting. in the south, winds will be lighter, 8 degrees but feeling pleasant and then tomorrow
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night, into saturday, look at the temperatures, even in some of the cities we will see temperatures below freezing but not in the south—west. it is 8 degrees in cornwall and that is because despite the cold air having arrived by this stage, there is this sneaky low pressure that has decided to brush the south—west of the uk on saturday. that means that penzance, plymouth may be bristol, maybe cardiff could just about get into the rain so we could be a raw, grey, unpleasant day in plymouth whereas the rest of us, sparkling sunshine, temperatures of around 4 degrees. then that low that‘s not in, sneaked into the mediterranean to upset the weather and high pressure pulse back into the uk. it will turn colder, sunnier, the best day sunday, the next week, the computer is suggesting there is a trend for the temperature is to recover a bit, but
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lets look forward to the sunshine this weekend. a lot of us may be out and about this weekend so the last thing we want is lashings of rain, we could do with some nice crisp sunshine. this is bbc news — our latest headlines: a leading economic research group says spending plans for both the conservatives and labour don‘t add up, accusing them of presenting numbers that are not credible. net migration falls
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to its lowest level for nearly 6 years — driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. three teenage boys have admitted using threatening and abusive behaviour against a lesbian couple on a bus. every household in britain bought an average 54 "bags for life" last year — environmental campaigners say they should be much more expensive, to curb plastic use. sport now on afternoon live with katie sha na han, and news on the banned athletics coach alberto salazar — what‘s the latest? we‘ve found out today that uk athletics have launched an independent review into it‘s dealing with alberto salazar and his nikey oregon project. last month, he was banned for four years after being found guilty of doping violations. salazar used to coach mo farah, britain‘s four—time olympic champion, who has always strongly denied any wrong—doing and has never failed a drugs test. since salazar‘s ban, nike have said that it would close down the project —
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but he‘s launched an appeal. now, there‘s going to a review into the panel that was appointed by uk athletics back in 2015, who said that there was "no reason" to remove british athletes from salazar‘s programme, despite claims that the american had broken anti—doping rules. so, as you can see, simon, a story that i‘m sure is going to rumble on for quite some time. lets look at the football. big game tonight for arsenal, a lot of pressure on the manager. yes, all eyes will be on unai emery. could this be one of his last matches in charge of arsenal? they are now six games without a win, eight points from the top four, and they need at least a draw at home against eintracht frankfurt to go through to the last 32. unai emery has even said that this game is the "perfect chance to reconnect with supporters". arsenal have only won four of 13 premier league games this season, leaving the fans frustrated with the club‘s situation. the club is supporting me.
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the club is responsible in that area, backing me and i appreciate it a lot. i feel strong with that support and i know my responsibility to come back, to change the situation. i know we need a good connection with our supporters and i need to be strong in my consistency. that‘s one of five games in the europa league tonight, with manchester united, celtic, rangers and wolves all in action. and, simon, the wolves‘ manager, nuno esprito santo is one of the front runners to replace unai emery. the owners of manchester city have agreed to buy a majority stake in the indian super league club mumbai city. that increases their interest to eight clubs around the world. mumbai were founded in 2014 and have previously been managed
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by manchester city greats peter reid and nicola anelka. indian football expert russell osman thinks it‘s a good move. to be honest, absolutely brilliant that manchester city seem fit that they should take on someone like mumbai city fc and promote them as much as they can. it will do wonders for youth football over here as well. with the access that manchester city will give the academy of mumbai city, help with the players, the education, the administration, how a club should be run successfully and i can only see everybody benefiting in a massive way. the second test against new zealand starts tonight, and england wicket keeper jos buttler could miss out with a back problem. ollie pope is ready to keep wicket in his absence — he last took the gloves in february, playing for the england lions. kent batsman zak crawley could make his debut should buttler
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have to sit out the match. england lost heavily in the first test and questions have been asked about the quality of their batting. in terms of when we say bat a long, doesn‘t mean we have to block it for three days and hope that that means we will get to a big score. it means reading the situation and making good decisions for long periods of time which allows you to bat long. the way i do that will be different to dom. everyone has their own way of doing it. it is just finding that fit around the situation. that‘s all the sport for now. i‘ll have more for you in the next hour. for decades the black sea was used as a dumping ground for plastic and chemical waste from south eastern europe ? with things so bad that scientists considered parts of the sea almost entirely dead. in the first of a two part special report, our correspondentjonah fisher travelled across the region to find out whether there‘s any prospect
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of the area recovering. this is the dnieper in ukraine. for decades, large rivers have washed away eastern europe‘s waste into the black sea. we‘re being shown what‘s known as blooming. it happens when excess nutrients, often from fertilisers, cause a rapid growth in algae, starving the water of oxygen. decades of regular blooming has killed off life in large parts of the black sea, creating underwater deserts where onlyjellyfish thrive. on the black sea‘s eastern coast in georgia, we see and smell another of its big problems. so this is the main rubbish dump here in batumi,
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but the big issue for here is that it‘s only about 300, 400 metres from this rubbish dump to the black sea itself, and there‘s a waterway which basically leads all the way down there. taking rubbish with it. this is just one of numerous examples around the black sea of how easily poorly managed waste can get into the water. we have already kind of disturbing evidence that the marine litter, which is number of floating items per square kilometre, is almost doubled compared to the mediterranean sea. it is the worst situation for all the european seas. even more alarming is the evidence of how deep the contamination goes. we‘re on board a research vessel hundreds of kilometres from shore, and this probe is being sent two kilometres down to take
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samples from the sea bed. analysis of the mud has revealed the presence of tiny fragments of plastic, known as micro plastics. the scientists also have worrying news about what they‘re discovering in the water. the biggest threat is coming from pharmaceuticals, especially from antibiotics. because if there is antibiotics in the black sea that means the bacteria will develop here that will resist the antibiotics and mean that ultimately that medicine doesn‘t work any more? yeah, this is now a real problem. people are dying from that. taken together, it‘s a sobering catalogue of environmental woe, testament to decades of neglect and abuse. but in the next part of our black sea journey, we look at what‘s being done to turn things round, and discover that projects thousands of kilometres
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awayjust might make a difference. wow! jonah fisher, bbc news, in the black sea. the trial of the hillsborough match commander, david duckenfield. thejury commander, david duckenfield. the jury have just returned a verdict of not guilty. they say that 75—year—old david duckenfield, the man who was a match commander on the day of the hillsborough disaster is not guilty of gross negligence manslaughter. the families will find this very hard to come to terms with because you know from those inquests in 2016 thejury because you know from those inquests in 2016 the jury then returned a verdict of unlawful killing based on their finding that verdict of unlawful killing based on theirfinding that his verdict of unlawful killing based on their finding that his actions contributed to the deaths. the process of the current is different to the criminal one and what we have now is thisjury to the criminal one and what we have now is this jury turning round and saying, we do not believe that his
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actions that day were of a substantial cause of the deaths of 95 innocent, liverpool football fans. just to remind you, the law said there could be no prosecution over the 96 victim tony bland because he died later. let‘sjust go over what the jury had to think about when they were considering this is not guilty verdict. they we re this is not guilty verdict. they were told that 24,000 liverpool fans we re were told that 24,000 liverpool fans were directed towards the lapping ‘s main area of the hillsborough stadium on the day of the disaster. there were not enough turnstiles, there was a bottleneck. to relieve that overcrowding, david duckenfield agreed to requests from officers on the ground to open a gate, exit gate c. that meant thousands of fans went through that gate onto a terrace into closed pens that were already packed. that had a fatal crash occurred and the prosecution said,
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he gave no thought to the inevitable consequence of people flooding through the gate. he didn‘t even monitor what was occurring let alone avert the tragedy. he had ultimate responsibility that they are as much commander, the prosecution said. he is extraordinarily bad feelings were so bad, so reprehensible, so blameworthy and unforgivable, it amounted to a gross failure but david duckenfield‘s defence lawyer said this, he was unfairly singled out and made a target of blame for the disaster. he said he had only beenin the disaster. he said he had only been in the role for three weeks. there were existing safety issues at the stadium, you know earlier this year that the man in charge of safety, graeme al at the ground, he was prosecuted because there were not enough turnstiles to accommodate fa ns not enough turnstiles to accommodate fans that day and ben myers, qc, said it was like giving a captain a ship that is already sinking. so by returning this not guilty verdict
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here at preston crown court today, thejury here at preston crown court today, the jury has agreed with that. they say that 75—year—old david duckenfield is not guilty of gross negligence manslaughter. this is going to be hard for the families to come to terms with. they are in court here at preston, there are relatives who have been watching court proceedings over in liverpool too. we will be hearing from them, getting reaction from them. we are also expecting a statement from david duckenfield‘s legal team and no doubt we will hear from operation resolve to the police team that has been investigating the hillsborough disaster. of course, england‘s longest lasting criminal investigation. fiona, he was charged with gross negligence manslaughter, he was charged with doing anything wrong. at the end of the day the
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prosecution say he was the man that was in charge of everything that happened that day. he was the man that had ultimate responsibility but of course with the defence has turned around and said is that look, there are existing issues that day or existing problems and he has a lwa ys or existing problems and he has always been a target of blame and i think that is what the jury were considering when going through the verdicts in their minds. let‘s think a little bit more about how they may have reached this not guilty verdict. one of the things they were told to ask themselves was, was he in breach of what was expected of a match commander at that time? 30 yea rs match commander at that time? 30 years ago, not by today‘s standards but back then, did he do what a normal, competent much commander would have done under the circumstances? you will remember that when the jury heard from the south yorkshire surgeon michael godard, he said back then newly
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appointed match commanders were given no training. you just pick stuff u p given no training. you just pick stuff up as he went along, he said. to say david duckenfield was thrown in at the deep end would be an understatement. as for gross negligence, when you are talking about blame, the jury also negligence, when you are talking about blame, thejury also had to ask themselves, how serious was that breach? the prosecution said he failed to react but the jury had to consider the extent to which he only had that short amount of time to reflect. the judge also had that short amount of time to reflect. thejudge also reminded had that short amount of time to reflect. the judge also reminded the jury reflect. the judge also reminded the jury about david duckenfield‘s positively good character, thejudge said. that may mean he is less likely to commit the offence. his defence lawyer said was david duckenfield lacked experience, he only had thejob duckenfield lacked experience, he only had the job three weeks before, his 29 years of service and commendations may mean he applied himself properly to his
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responsibilities that day and with the less likely to have breached his duty to the public. however the jury has reached this not guilty verdict, the families will find this hard to come to terms with given what they have heard in those inquests in 2016. david duckenfield himself saying probably wasn‘t the best man for thejob that saying probably wasn‘t the best man for the job that day. he also said during those inquests that yes, his failure to close that tunnel when those hundreds and hundreds of fans went through into those packed terraces, he admitted that was a direct cause of those deaths and of course we will hear from the family shortly. fiona, we will come back to you for that. but in the meantime, let‘s look at some of the background to this case. and if deaths of the 95 fa ns to this case. and if deaths of the 95 fans who died at the ground in 1989 because of the law at the time, there was no prosecution for the death of a 96 victim who died after
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his injuries were caused. the background to this case, here is judith moritz. david duckenfield has been a plane figure for 30 years. in charge of policing hillsborough at the helm when disaster happened. but a jury has found that he is not guilty of manslaughter. the chief superintendent was only put in charge of the fa cup semifinal three weeks before the match. many say he just wasn‘t ready for the job he was given. amongst them, former sergeant william crawford who was on duty that day under david duckenfield‘s come on. it was like a poisoned chalice. he was left with the responsibility of working that match and being overall in charge. and he didn‘t have the experience on that day. i don‘t blame david duckenfield, i blame the person who put him in that position. in 1989, liverpool played nottingham forest
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in an fa cup semifinal. liverpool‘s followers... 24,000 fans travelled to the city for the fixture. minutes before kick—off, huge crowd were still queueing to get the ground. as thousands of fans are getting crushed here at clippings lane, david duckenfield had to make a decision. by opening a large gate into the ground, he relieved the pressure outside. but he didn‘t think about where the supporters would go next. thousands of people poured through the gate. the tunnel to the terraces was left open and the crowds surged down it into fenced pens which were already full. some fans climbed out of the crash but most were trapped. 96 people we re but most were trapped. 96 people were killed on the terraces at hillsborough. a10—year—old boy, 37 teenagers, parents, siblings, a father and son, a pension of 67.
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david duckenfield accepted that his failure directly caused their deaths. when he gave evidence at the hillsborough inquest in 2015. you fail to recognise that there was a need to close that tunnel.” fail to recognise that there was a need to close that tunnel. i did fail to recognise that, yes. that failure was the direct cause of the deaths of 96 persons in the hillsborough tragedy. yes, sir. 38—year—old brian matthews was pulled out of the pens but did not survive. he loved life. he was larger than life in fact. brian came from a large merseyside family who spent 30 years campaigning on his behalf. his sister debbie has passed the baton to the next generation. brian‘s niece was born after hillsborough but driven by injustice to herfamily, hillsborough but driven by injustice to her family, she hillsborough but driven by injustice to herfamily, she is training to be a barrister. people went to that football game has a family. dad went
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with their sons, dad came home with their sons in body bags. he went as afamily on their sons in body bags. he went as a family on a saturday to watch a football tea m a family on a saturday to watch a football team play. there shouldn‘t have been any risk that you wouldn‘t come home, there shouldn‘t have been any risk that you wouldn‘t be safe while you were there. her interest came about from being a baby and a little carry tot and are used to ta ke little carry tot and are used to take her to the hillsborough family support meetings. if we had a criminal try 30 years ago, it would have been put to bed by now. but we have been put to bed by now. but we have not been allowed to grieve. have been put to bed by now. but we have not been allowed to grievem 2016, inquest found that the fans we re 2016, inquest found that the fans were unlawfully killed. they were radioing in. we were not a threat to anyone. we are five middle—aged women. it is disgraceful. this verdict today does not take the findings of the report are or
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findings of the report are or findings of the inquestjuries. the world knows the truth. we up against the establishment. in the first trial, prosecution counsel didn't even object to one single thing in that courtroom and it was ben myers opportunity to say david duckenfield was here there and everywhere in the ground. 18 minutes past ten, mr duckenfield, after... from 80 minutes past ten, he was missing to a ten past two. that is nearly four hours. you can only make up your mind where he was because i know where he was and he certainly wasn't doing hisjob on the day. he should have been in the control box at 12 o'clock, monitoring them pens on the outside pens and watching the fans come in. he had the safety of the fans coming into that ground that day. he wasn't there because he was somewhere really shouldn't have been. and we all know where he was. if it wasn‘t for us families, they
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wouldn‘t be evidence in there. i am so proud of theirfamilies because without us, we wouldn‘t have got a retrial. the defence said david duckenfield was unfairly selected out for prosecution. no, this was my argument from the beginning. i have a lwa ys argument from the beginning. i have always believed there are more people who should have been on trial andi people who should have been on trial and i said that. what i feel is david duckenfield should be accountable for his actions and his lack of action is just like all the other police officers, ambulance service, etc, they should be held accountable for their actions and their lack of actions. this country is an absolute disgrace and i would also... we will pull away if from that press conference for legal reasons but we will return to preston crown court for further reaction to that news that david duckenfield has been cleared of
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gross negligence manslaughter of the 95 liverpool fans in the 1989 disaster at the hillsborough stadium. the former south yorkshire police chief superintendent of 75 yea rs old police chief superintendent of 75 years old was cleared after a seven—week retrial at preston crown court. mr duckenfield who now lives in dorset, he was in charge of the fa cup semifinal at which the 96 liverpool fans died. as you are hearing there, still very raw emotion from the families of those who died. the ten juries at preston crown court retired to consider their verdict just crown court retired to consider their verdictjust after crown court retired to consider their verdict just after two o‘clock. they were given a majority verdict and the jury returned their verdict and the jury returned their verdict after 13 hours and 43 minutes. whilst 96 fans died in britain‘s deadlier sporting disaster, no charge could be bought
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over the final victim‘s death after he died more than a year and one day after the tragedy at hillsborough. tony bland, who died after the 15th of april disaster in 1989. the family still giving reaction to that. david duckenfield found not guilty. he was cleared after that seven—week retrial at preston crown court. but the jury at his original try out this year failing to agree a verdict. we‘re still hearing from families who are giving their reaction but there are legal reasons why some of the things they are saying we cannot bring to you but emotion is very raw after what was a terrible tragedy and a very personal tragedy for the families of those
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involved. the hillsborough match commander, david duckenfield, not guilty of the gross negligence manslaughter of 95 liverpool fans after the jury at preston crown court was sent out to consider, a majority verdict this afternoon. the older brother of stephen robinson who died at the age of 17 has said he was bitterly disappointed by the not guilty verdict but i thanked the jury not guilty verdict but i thanked the jury for what must have been a long and difficult trial for them to sit through. speaking on behalf of his family, paul robinson said, as a family, paul robinson said, as a family we would like to thank all those who have supported us over the yea rs those who have supported us over the years in our quest for justice those who have supported us over the years in our quest forjustice and accountability. we firmly believe that we have done everything in our power to do right by our stephen and we walk away from this case with our dignity and our heads held high. all
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families of course finding any verdict inevitably difficult in that it brings back memories of what was a terrible tragedy at the stadium on april the 15th 1989. we'll a terrible tragedy at the stadium on april the 15th 1989. we‘ll be back to preston crown court for more reaction injust a moment.
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some breaking news, the last few minutes — the hillsborough match commander has been found not guilty. david duckenfield was cleared of the gross negligence manslaughter of 95 liverpool fans who died at the 1989 fa cup semi—final. the former police chief superintendent, who‘s 75, was cleared after a trial lasting six weeks. some of the hillsborough families were watching the verdict from the cunard building in liverpool, where the trial was screened, there were shouts in the room as the verdict was announced. emotions as the verdict was announced. running very raw, 5s women emotions running very raw, seven women and three men on the preston crown court bench returned their verdict, the trial lasted six weeks, the prosecution case alleging that
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david duckenfield had a personal responsibility for what happened at the match between liverpool and nottingham forest on april 15, 1989. 96 men, women and children were fatally injured in the crash at the leppings lane terrace, a jury has found david duckenfield not guilty. looking back at the case, judith morris. david duckenfield has been a blame figure for 30 years, in charge of policing hillsborough, at the helm when disaster happened. a jury has found that he is not guilty of manslaughter. the chief superintendent was only put in charge of the fa cup semifinal three weeks before the match, many say he just was not ready for the job he was given. amongst them, former sergeant, william crawford, on duty that day, under david duckenfield‘s command. it was a poisoned chalice, he was left with the responsibility of working that match, and being overall in charge. he did not have
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the experience on that day, and i don‘t blame david duckenfield, i blame the person who put him in that position. in 1989, liverpool played nottingham forest in an fa cup semifinal. commentator: livable‘s faithful followers, feeding u nsuccessful 25 faithful followers, feeding unsuccessful 25 years, at the leppings lane end. he killed 24,000 liverpool fans travelled to the city for the fixture, minutes before kick—off, a huge crowd was queueing to get into the ground. as thousands of fa ns to get into the ground. as thousands of fans were getting crushed here at leppings lane, david dukinfield had to make a decision. by opening a large gate into the ground, he relieved the pressure outside. he did not think about where the supporters would go next. thousands of people poured through the gate, the tunnel to the terraces was left open, and the crowd surged down it, into fenced pens, which were already full. some fans climbed out of the
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crash, but most were trapped. 96 people were killed on the terraces at hillsborough, a ten—year—old boy, 37 teenagers. parents, siblings, a father and son, a pensioner of 67. david duckenfield accepted that his failure directly because their deaths, when he gave evidence at the hillsborough inquests in 2015. 38—year—old brian matthews was pulled out of the pens, but did not survive. he loved life. he was larger—than—life, in fact. survive. he loved life. he was larger-than-life, in fact. ryan came from a large merseyside family who have spent 30 years campaigning on his behalf. his sister, debbie, has
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passed the bat onto the next generation. ryan‘s niece was born after hillsborough but driven by injustice to her family, after hillsborough but driven by injustice to herfamily, she is training to be a barrister. —— baton. people went to the football game, as a family, dads went with their sons. they came home with their sons. they came home with their sons. they came home with their sons in body bags. you won‘t asafamily their sons in body bags. you won‘t as a family on a saturday to watch your football team play, there should not have been any risk that you would not come home, there should not have been any risk that you would not be safe while you were there. the interest came about from being a baby, in a little carrycot, i would take her to the hillsborough family support meetings. if we had had a criminal trial, 30 years ago, it would have been put to bed by now, but we have not been allowed to grieve. in 2016, inquests found that the fa ns were in 2016, inquests found that the fans were unlawfully killed, and they were not to blame. following
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that, david duckenfield was charged with manslaughter. the jury that, david duckenfield was charged with manslaughter. thejury at that, david duckenfield was charged with manslaughter. the jury at his first trial could not agree on a verdict, and now, a second jury has found that he was singled out unfairly, and is innocent of any crime. professor phil scraton was a member of the hillsborough independent panel and his report in 2012 revealed new evidence. there had been other senior officers who died, in the meanwhile, who may have been prosecuted, but the truth of the matter is, there are those who are still alive, and only one has been prosecuted, that does not shine well with me in terms of the range of culpability that both the hillsborough independent panel and the inquests have demonstrated. for the inquests have demonstrated. for the last seven years, hundreds of detectives have been gathering evidence into hillsborough, costing 72 £60 million, operation result is the ever criminal investigation in
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england, and hillsborough survivors have spent decades campaigning for justice. this verdict means no one will be jailed for so many lives lost. —— operation resolve. —— costing £60 million. this is the third time that david duckenfield has faced trial. there was a private prosecution and a trial earlier this year, of course, where a jury was unable to reach a verdict, now, by majority, they have been able to reach this not guilty verdict of gross negligence manslaughter, obviously very difficult for the family to come to terms with here, you can see some of them behind me, giving statements to reporters. and, of course, what they were saying, inside called, when that verdict came back, one of them shouted, "stitched up again!". a lot of the
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relatives were in tears. david duckenfield himself and his wife we re duckenfield himself and his wife were hugging each other. a huge relief for him, i‘m very sure. this isa man, relief for him, i‘m very sure. this is a man, 75, suffering from post—traumatic stress disorder, and has not been able to give evidence in court because he has been so distressed by what has happened. him and his wife, hugging in court, and what we have heard from families here is that a couple of the relatives have said they were not happy with the crown prosecution service, they have said this was not our trial. and so, a lot of them trying to come to terms with this here this afternoon. no doubt they will hear more reaction from them, also due to get a reaction from david duckenfield‘s legal team. don‘t go away, a statement
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commenting on the verdict, assistant commissionerfrom greater commenting on the verdict, assistant commissioner from greater manchester police has said this: it was never disputed, was it, indeed by david duckenfield himself,
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that he made the wrong decision on the day. he has said previously in those inquests in 2016, "probably, i was not the right man for the job on the day" and even admitted that not closing the tunnel on the hundreds of fans, as they went through the tunnel, into the terrace, into pens that were packed, he said his failure not to close the tunnel was a mistake. he said it was a direct cause of deaths. that was at an inquest. this process is different toa criminal inquest. this process is different to a criminal one and what we had at reston crown court today was a jury ina criminal reston crown court today was a jury in a criminal trial saying, we do not believe that his actions that day were a substantial cause of the death of 95 innocent liverpool fans, just as a reminder, important to say there could be no prosecution over there could be no prosecution over the 96th victim, tony bland, because he died later. reading that
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statement they are from rob steckley, operation resolve, the criminal enquiry into this, the police team leading the longest criminal investigation in english history, he was talking about the passage of time, 30 years it has taken for this verdict here today. —— rob beckley. hard to imagine, those families behind us, hard to imagine what is going through their minds, how they are able to come to terms with this, knowing what david duckenfield said in the inquest. the passage of time, 30 years. they have fought so hard through those years, private prosecution, as you say, where a jury failed to reach a verdict, criminal trial earlier this year, jury failed to reach a verdict. this trial, an enquiry, two inquests as well. that is why, today, they are giving this reaction outside court, they will be speaking to us later. of course, what
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operation resolve has also said is that this investigation is thorough. and, separately, of course, there will be a second trial later in the year, due to take place, former solicitor peter metcalfe and former police officers donald denton and alan foster were charged with perverting the course ofjustice. they deny these charges, of course. they deny these charges, of course. the charges against the former chief inspector, sir norman bettison, were dropped, he faced four counts of misconduct in public office, the cps said insufficient evidence meant there was no real prospect of securing a conviction. operation resolve, giving their statement, their reaction, to this not guilty verdict, for david duckenfield. not guilty of gross negligence manslaughter here at preston crown court today. you mentioned he was
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suffering from post—traumatic stress disorder, he did not give evidence at his trial. that's right, and what thejury at his trial. that's right, and what the jury heard instead was evidence from those inquests, back in 2016, where it was put to him, do you ee, where it was put to him, do you agree, do you believe your failure to close that tunnel on the day was a direct cause of those 95 deaths, and he said, "yes, i did" and he also said that he probably was not the best man for the job on the day. and what was also revealing in those inquests was that, of course, this is the other thing families have found it difficult to come to terms with, is that he admitted that the comments he had made on the day itself about fans themselves pushing open the gate, he admitted it was a lie. of course, at the time, we heard, on the day, he told someone
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from the football association that it was the fans that had done that. we knew, subsequently, it was the order made by the police, that gate should be open, to relieve the crush. what he told the inquests was, "i apologise unreservedly to the families, everybody knew the truth", he said, "the fans and the police knew the truth, that we had opened the gates. i will regret this light until my dying day." "a situation i was totally untrained for, totally unprecedented and i make no excuses: i was for, totally unprecedented and i make no excuses: i was the man who did it but i was faced with a difficult decision." he agreed he had very limited direct experience of planning or policing football matches, and that formed part of this defence case here at preston crown court, of course. then myers qc, his lawyer, saying, look, he only had three weeks to get up to
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speed for that match, and he had a lack of experience and it was not his fault. as you can see, we should just explain where we are with legal proceedings, because it has been 30 years and it goes on. we heard this statement from operation resolve, england‘s longest running criminal investigation, into the hillsborough disaster, explaining
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that 30 years is a long time, should not have taken that long. as i said, operation resolve continues and of course, this second trial is due to ta ke course, this second trial is due to take place later this year, including former solicitor peter metcalfe, former police officers donald denton and alan foster, charged with perverting the course of justice. they deny charged with perverting the course ofjustice. they deny these charges. but, of course, like you say, 30 yea rs but, of course, like you say, 30 years is a very long time, for the victims families, who are here outside court today. they have fought 30 years for justice and outside court today. they have fought 30 years forjustice and this not guilty verdict for gross negligence, manslaughter today, they will find it very hard to come to terms with. going over what we have heard in previous inquests in 2016. we have here a 75—year—old man who has said at the inquests, i was not the man for the job has said at the inquests, i was not the man for thejob on has said at the inquests, i was not
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the man for the job on the day. he has admitted that not closing the tunnel when all those fans are rushing through to get to the pens, already closed, he said a failure to close that tunnel was a direct cause of those 95 deaths. for them today to have 30 years of legal battles, inquests, and enquiries, and then have this not guilty verdict, for them today, we are going to find it very difficult to come to terms with and we are still hearing from them outside court. thank you very much, preston crown court. we have been hearing from christine, who lost her father, henry, in the disaster. she gave her reaction to the verdict outside court. all the findings of the inquest. the world knows the truth, we were up against the establishment. in the first trial, prosecution counsel did not even object to one single thing in that
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courtroom, and gifted myers the opportunity to paint david duckenfield as though he was here, there and everywhere in the ground. inaudible 10:18am, he briefed them, the cereals, at ten o'clock, until 10:18am, he was missing from then until to 10pm, that is almost four hours, you can all make up your own mind where he was, i know where he was, he certainly was not doing his job on the day. he should have been in that control blocks, 12 o'clock, monitoring the pens and the outside pens and watching the fans coming in. —— 2.10pm. he had the safety of the fans coming into that ground that day. but he was not there because he was somewhere where he should not have been. it has been another show trial, if it was not for us families, there would not be half the evidence in there, and, do you know what, i am so proud of the families because without us families, we would not even have got
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a retrial. defensor david duckenfield was a retrial. defensor david ducke nfield was unfairly a retrial. defensor david duckenfield was unfairly selected for prosecution. no, this was my argument from the beginning, i have a lwa ys argument from the beginning, i have always believed there are more people who should have been on trial andi people who should have been on trial and i said that. what i feel is, david duckenfield should be held accountable for his actions and lack of actions, just like all the other police officers, ambulance service etc, they should be held accountable for their actions and lack of action. this country is an absolute disgrace. i would like to speak to dame baird, the victims commissioner, because i have a lot of things i would like to discuss with dame vera lynn, because the way that we are treated, we have had no funding whatsoever to come to this trial. -- funding whatsoever to come to this trial. —— dame vera baird. some of us live 150, 300 miles away, no one has been on our side, at all.” truly believe that this trial was
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put in place for david duckenfield to be found not guilty and what you have got to remember, this was a trial brought not by us but by the cps on behalf of the crown. christine burke, in the background, lost her father, christine burke, in the background, lost herfather, henry, in the disaster, giving her reaction. liverpool mayor, joe anderson, has described the outcome is a huge disappointment. he says in recent years they had to relive the events by sitting through the longest inquest in british legal history followed by two trials.
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that statement following the news, breaking in the last hour, that the hillsborough match commander, david duckenfield, has been found not guilty of the gross negligence manslaughter of 95 liverpool fans, 96th fan who died more than one year and one day after the disaster was not the subject of any charges. the jury at preston crown court decided that david duckenfield was not guilty of gross negligence manslaughter. and lots of reaction coming from families, all expressing disappointment at the fa ct expressing disappointment at the fact this has taken 30 years to get to this stage. 30 years since the disaster. we will have plenty more from our correspondence at preston crown court. as you can clearly gather,
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there is concern that because there are still trials to be carried out in connection with this, we will have to be careful about what is said. and we heard from the mayor of liverpool, joe anderson, saying that it isa liverpool, joe anderson, saying that it is a day of unimaginable pain, but let‘s not jeopardise it is a day of unimaginable pain, but let‘s notjeopardise other trials that are still to be held. we‘ll have plenty more from preston crown court, interviews carried out, we will be hearing from fiona later on. neither the conservatives nor labour are being honest about spending in the run—up to next month‘s election — according to the independent institute for fiscal studies. the research group has examined both parties‘ economic plans and say they‘re not credible — because the tories would end up spending more than their manifesto pledge, and that labour would struggle to deliver the spending increases it has promised. the details come from our economics correspondent andy verity.
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institute for fiscal studies is look to for objective analysis and its objective view is that neither major party is being honest. labour pretends huge increases in spending can be financed only by corporations and the rich, the conservatives continue to pretend taxes will not have to rise to get decent public services. we know the conservatives over the last two electoral cycles have ended up spending and borrowing a lot more than they said it would in their manifestos, i think that will happen again because they are suggesting essentially nothing in this way of additional spending this time beyond what is announced. labour has vast spending increases and tax increases which probably can‘t be delivered within a single parliament. the conservatives have promised no rise in taxes, but with extra spending already pledged, they are likely to break their own rules on keeping borrowing down. and the risk is, if a brexit trade deal was not finalised
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soon, it will jump. we welcome the scrutiny. if anyone has a look, they will see that alongside our manifesto we have published the most detailed costings document any party has published in any general election. the lib dems are promising big increases to tax and spending, helping public services but needing tax rises of £36 billion. they acknowledge they will have to raise income tax by a penny to pay for it. there are a lot of significant investments that lib dems will be making. the ifs has recognised that is a pretty radical manifesto to set out. it is one we know we can deliver as well. labour is planning the biggest increase in public spending in peacetime. the ifs has said public spending would still be lower than germany. but they say it would involve everyone, notjust corporations and the rich. i think our manifesto is bold,
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ambitious and no other party has produced a costed manifesto and put themselves up to that type of scrutiny. the ifs has warned all plans could be thrown into disarray by brexit. not the departure agreement but the final trade deal, which was supposed to get done by the end of next year. labour‘s plans would require borrowing to rise. if under the conservatives britain were to leave the eu without a full trade deal, borrowing would have to rise by even more. borisjohnson has said he is committed to the "biggest drive" of female member, activist and candidate recruitment. during a visit to devon today, the prime minister said it is his ambition that half of tory candidates on the party‘s list for future parliamentary
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elections are women. he told reporters, "talent and brilliance is equally distributed, but opportunity is not. i will make sure that women are supported to take up the opportunities that politics present." with two weeks to polling day, labour is changing its election strategy in areas which supported brexit in an attempt to widen the party‘s appeal. members of the shadow cabinet who back an eu withdrawal deal will be given a higher profile, while more activists are going to be sent to leave constituencies. jonathan blake has been following the labour leader in southampton. whenjeremy when jeremy corbyn whenjeremy corbyn spoke here this morning about environment plans he did not address specifically any shift in the party campaign strategy but he did take time after the speech on the question and answer session to set out in some detail labour‘s policy and to try to make it as clear as possible that is that the party would negotiate a new deal with the eu within three months of joining the election and put that to another public vote in a further six months, he was asked if he now had any different message to voters who voted to leave the european union in key parts of the uk. he said that his message was the same wherever he
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went, as he put it in 2016, people did not vote to lose theirjobs or see their rights put at risk and he said the party needs to come together over brexit. there was no explicit acknowledgement that labour is changing tack at this point in the campaign. but, i think we will see, in the days and the weeks left in the campaign to go, a bit of a shift and more of an attempt by labour and certainly those key figures who support leaving the european union with a new deal within the labour party popping up and campaigning in key parts of the uk. here in southampton, this is one of those, it did vote as a majority to leave the eu and two of the three seats here are held by conservative mp5, one on a knife edge at the last election. something that labour will have its sights set on. as i say, jeremy corbyn, while focusing on the environment today and linking back to brexit, saying that close cooperation with european countries would be key, did acknowledge that the brexit policy that labour has is
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something that perhaps they need to get across more clearly and that is reflected in the united boss, len mccluskey‘s comments this lunchtime, saying that the party needs to explain its policy better to working class voters to voted to leave. —— unite boss. the dup launched its manifesto today, saying it is united in opposition to a customs border in the irish sea after brexit. the leader arlene foster said that the number of democratic unionists elected would determine the future shape and direction of the united kingdom, and they would continue to try to change the prime minister‘s brexit deal if borisjohnson remains in number10. of the deal that is there at the moment is not acceptable, everyone across northern ireland knows the reasons for that, the unionism is united, in relation to... —— union is united in its rejection of the boris deal and therefore it needs to be changed. you can find out what each party is promising to do on the issues that matter to you by using our general
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election policy guide — which lets you easilycompare the parties‘ policies. find that at bbc.co.uk/news or on the bbc news app throughout this election campaign we‘ve been reporting from some key battleground constituencies — let‘s go to my colleague martine croxall who is in cheltenham for us today. martine. .. simon, thank you, yes. throughout the campaign, bbc news will be looking closely at the places where the election could be won and lost. we will be visiting 10 parts of the uk where seats will be closely contested. we will be visiting 10 parts of the uk where seats will be closely contested. today, we re in cheltenham, which is in gloucestershire. this seat has been held by the conservatives since 2015 — and is bordered by two other constituencies, also belonging to the tories. the conservatives took cheltenham four years ago with a swing of 10% from the liberal democrats, who had held the seat for 23 years. but the liberal democrats
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will be hoping to regain the seat this year — the conservatives have a majority ofjust over 2,500. cheltenham general hospital a&e was controversially downgraded a few years ago, so its no longer open at night. a recent campaign saw locals successfully stave off the potential closure of the a&e. waiting lists in gloucestershire have reached record levels though — at the end of march this year more than 56,000 people were waiting to start elective treatment. we arejoined by we are joined by chris hickey, we arejoined by chris hickey, from reach, it stands for restore emergency at cheltenham hospital. thank you forjoining us, and, you we re thank you forjoining us, and, you were a nonexecutive director in the health service. yes, for eight years. so you know the inner workings. so, for those unfamiliar with the issues, what is the background, what has the background been to accident and emergency provision in cheltenham. seven years ago it was downgraded from 24 hours down to 12 hours, and injune of la st down to 12 hours, and injune of last year they began a consultation
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to close it completely and replace it with a minor injuries unit. we spent six months fighting with the health service to save that, and only found out about three weeks ago that it was going to stay as it is. just a short time before the general election... just before the announcement. wedges the decision lie, ultimately, is it a for westminster? —— where does the decision lie? this is a local issue, the critical issue for people up and down the country, we have seen what has happened in telford, shropshire. local nhs managers made their own minds up about what services are going to be provided, they are not accountable locally, not accountable to the local mp or the local authority, county council, district council. they are able to make up their own council. they are able to make up theirown minds council. they are able to make up their own minds about services. explain more at the end, what the view of the trust is, but they are saying that, we are not going to close the accident and emergency, people should not worry.
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the nhs always comes out top in terms of peoples concerns. what is it that we want? if you have a district hospital in your areal think everybody expects that it is able to cope with accidents and emergencies. if you have a district hospital, we expect that service to be provided. the national picture as we know the nhs is under a great deal of pressure and is at crisis, this is about the collapse of social ca re this is about the collapse of social care and local trust managers don't seem to be responsive about what people want and they are on their own agenda which is separate. nationally what we are looking for isa nationally what we are looking for is a fully funded well—equipped health service that meets the need of people and we are looking for a local health trust managers to provide the services people want. local health trust managers to provide the services people wantm is very, located, isn‘t it? your
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campaign has had cross—party support and as you say, all of the parties are talking about funding for the nhs. what are the party is saying that reassures you that they are going to get it right? that social ca re going to get it right? that social care will have the right funding? which then, of course, has a knock—on effect to hospitals providing health care.” knock—on effect to hospitals providing health care. i don't see any party having a credible plan to deal with the social care crisis. i think the next ten years in this country we are going to have two really major strands of thinking what is going to happen after brexit and the second thing is what are we going to do about social care? and do we fix that, we can't fix the health service. we don't see anyone with credible plans to solve that social care crisis. a lot of people will be looking at this and thinking, you are talking about accident and emergency services at a hospital in cheltenham. what has that to do with national funding for social care? people voting in this
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election willjoin the dots in that way? i don't think they are and what is interesting, i don't think the nhs arejoining is interesting, i don't think the nhs are joining the dots. local trust managers are responding to the increase in demand for social care by saying we can't cope and therefore we will reduce the last service that is standing. there are lots of reasons why more people are using the service. bless access to gps, the collapse of the provision for social care to maintain people in theirown for social care to maintain people in their own homes. mostly elderly people. we have a rising elderly population. in 20 years time they will be twice as many over 85 is that there are now. we have two million and there will be 4 million. the nhs trust... and it's notjust here, it is an nhs problem. they seem to live into different worlds. there is the real world that all of us living in which we see these pressures and there is the nhs world in which they want to plan services
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almost in a vacuum. it is actually a national crisis. how vulnerable do you think the nhs might be post brexit to greater involvement from private organisations? that direction of travel was set 15 years ago when i was a nonexecutive. 15 years ago for an example, an american provider was providing operations in gloucestershire. this isn't new. it has been provided undera labour isn't new. it has been provided under a labour government, under the coalition, under the conservatives. the direction of travel for that, it's very difficult to understand how we are going to do a trade deal with the united states in which we are able to resist accelerating that already existing trend. that has got to bea already existing trend. that has got to be a concern. how dependent is that trade deal on the deal that britain gets with the eu? yes, exactly. and i don't want to do
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that. we are not a party political organisation and i want to stay out of that. i would be commentating hopefully as an independent commentator in terms of those things and trends. it does depend what happens to the eu. we saw a great deal of scepticism as to whether there would be a deal before christmas and a rabbit was pulled out of the hat. we can't know what will happen over the next 12 months but i am saying that trends for involvement of the americans is a trend that has been set for a long time. chris at cheltenham hospital, thank you very much. well, the gloucestershire hospitals nhs foundation trust has told the bbc that nhs foundation trust department is open 24/7. but from 8.00pm to 8.00am blue light ambulances go to gloucestershire royal hospital, during that time cheltenham is open for minor injuries. it believes it can improve the way care is currently provided,
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as working across two hospitals does not allow it to make the most of highly skilled staff and specialist equipment. it has shared ideas with the public on how to improve and will continue to do this, but no decisions have been made yet. the trust adds there are no plans to close cheltenham a&e. simon, it is all yours. thank you very much, martin. thank you very much, martine. now it‘s time for a look at the weather with tomasz. it is pretty grey and some rain around too but tomorrow we are expecting a lot of sunshine across the uk, and it will also turn a lot colder. this is what‘s happening in the here and now so you can see the extent of the cloud across the southern half of the uk with outbreaks of rain. colder weather has now reached by this stage northern parts of the uk, scotland, northern parts of the uk, scotland, northern england and northern ireland. through tonight you can see
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the cold wind blowing. wintry showers across the highlands. and a widespread frost developing across the northern part of the country. the south is still going to be relatively mild. tomorrow we are all in that cold air coming in from the north, so i think first thing in the morning on friday for many others a touch of frost and a decent bright, if not sunny, day. this is bbc news — our latest headlines. david duckenfield, the police commander in charge of operations during the hillsborough disaster, has been cleared of the gross negligence manslaughter of 95 liverpool fans who died at the 1989 fa cup semi—final. families of those who died say they‘re shocked and stunned by the verdict. i truly believe that this trial was put in place for david duckenfield
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to be found not guilty. this wasn‘t our trial, this was a trial brought by the crown prosecution service on behalf of the crown. they don‘t add up — conservatives and labour are both accused of not presenting credible spending plans — by a leading economic research group. net migration falls to its lowest level for nearly six years — driven by fewer people entering the country from the eu. let‘s return to our main story. hillsborough match commander has been found not guilty. david duckenfield was cleared of the gross negligence manslaughter of ninety five liverpool fans who died at the 1989 fa cup semi—final. the former police chief superintendent, who‘s 75, was cleared after a trial lasting six weeks. some of the hillsborough families were watching proceedings from the cunard building in liverpool, where the trial was screened — there were shouts in the room as the verdict was announced. let‘s talk now to sheila coleman from the hillsborough justice campaign. shejoins me on the phone now.
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first of all, your reaction to what has happened ? not in the least bit surprised but i have to say it reawakens an immense sadness and anger, and my heart goes out to the repair weaved —— to the bereaved families and the survivors who have fought so long forjustice for those who lost their lives. it isa for those who lost their lives. it is a sad indictment of society, in my view. a lawful killing of 95 people... bear with me, sheila. we are hearing from the assistant commissioner at the court. my first thoughts are with the 96 people who died in the hillsborough disaster. they have families and the many thousands of people who were deeply affected by the events on the
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15th of april 1989. the jury had a difficult and challenging task, examining evidence stretching back decades and i respect their decision. it may sound like a cliche to say that lessons must be learned but given this verdict that has never been more relevant or important. it is right that an impartial and thorough investigation was carried out. it was right it was presented the cps to a jury and it was right that a jury made a judgment on the facts. what is wrong
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is it has taken 30 years to get to this point. the passage of 30 years has presented challenges to everyone involved in the legal process, both the prosecution and the defence. there are organisations and people who should have answered questions about actions on the day who are no longer with us. 30 years during which myths took root about funds being a cause of the disaster —— fans being a cause of the disaster now shown through evidence to be unequivocally wrong. 30 years when
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many people, especially the families, have had to relive their terrible experiences. when all the hillsborough legal proceedings are concluded, we should as a society ta ke concluded, we should as a society take time to consider these matters and to learn those lessons, for the sake of the 96 innocent people who died 30 years ago. something like this disaster and the 30 year wait to get to this point should never happen again. thank you very much. sorry, i'm not answering any questions. was that a waste of money? they will be opportunities when all the legal proceedings are over to answer questions, thank you.
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that was robert backley talking, and as he heard there, that was the extent of direction from him given that there are still live proceedings going on in relation to the hillsborough disaster. let‘s return to sheila, the hillsborough campaigner. you were saying you weren‘t surprised by this verdict? why not? obviously, this is the second trial. this time around for david duckenfield. they didn‘t disappoint the second time in it being largely the same, and so we didn‘t think there was a strong direction. we felt that david duckenfield was allowed certain advantages that anyone else was being prosecuted wasn‘t allowed. when thejudge being prosecuted wasn‘t allowed. when the judge apologised for having to ask him to stand well charges we re to ask him to stand well charges were read out, he was allowed to sit with his team throughout the trial.
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the whole thing was skewed. certainly in my opinion. and ifeel that i said a long time ago that i felt the only thing the families would get was the unlawful killing verdict from the coroner‘s court. so now you have a situation when there we re now you have a situation when there were unlawful killing verdict and the deceased of hillsborough were killed unlawfully, so who is responsible for that unlawful killing? also as well i think it‘s important to remember families and providers should take solace from the fact that it never would have got this far if it wasn‘t for a campaign over the years. all those people who campaigned for years can hold their heads up high because this has remained a major injustice. it is down to how you measure justice. we had no illusions, and as
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was previously said by people, the prosecution, we had no control over that. her campaign had no control over it. it was the cps that brought the case and i think there are lessons to be learned. it is the families and survivors that have learned in the present day in britain you can‘t put much faith in the system. sheila, nobody listening now can argue with what you are saying but the dignity of the families, those who died and of the survivors. many people will still wonder why on earth it has taken 30 years to get to this stage? yes. i think dignity is vastly overrated and i think if people hadn‘t been so dignified in the early years and put their faith in the system, it might have been a different outcome. however, it is a major injustice and i know how wounded people are and the impact
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this is going to have. which will have a huge ripple effect that goes way beyond the football and hillsborough, it goes to the heart of our society. people are traumatised and we were expecting to have some sympathy from duckenfield because he says he suffers from post—traumatic stress disorder. i‘ve watched thousands of people over the yea rs watched thousands of people over the years with that after hillsborough, and they will be plummeting into even darker places after the decision today and i just even darker places after the decision today and ijust hope they pick up the pieces because this is a dark time. sheila, thank you very much for your time. let‘s talk to the mayor of liverpool. your reaction to this verdict? my verdict? my first thoughts are with the families, because i have witnessed them on a daily basis over the last
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six weeks but previously to that as well, coming into the building and sitting through the trial. obviously, suffering for 30 years. my obviously, suffering for 30 years. my thoughts are with them. for members of their families had my thoughts are with them. for members of theirfamilies had died and unfortunately they didn‘t get to see the inquest verdict and some of them are not around to witness what has happened. first of all, my thoughts are with them. i think sheila just talked about the fact that the dignity and respect that people have for the families in terms of how they behaved but i think that we all are hugely disappointed today and as a city, in those terms, we will be behind them. we know after the inquest that what was proved was that the families had no involvement in terms of blame, and the inquest itself actually, you
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know, made it absolutely clear that it was unlawful killing. and so i think that people will now be looking at each other‘s families and people in this city to say, ok, we know that a further trial is to take place but clearly somebody has to be held accountable and that is not for them, that is not for anything other than as a result of the inquest verdict and the truth coming out. justice needs to be done on behalf of the deceased, the 96. those that we re of the deceased, the 96. those that were injured as well. so i guess for me, iam really were injured as well. so i guess for me, i am really frustrated and really angry that at this juncture, the families can‘t take any comfort from the fact that somebody is held accountable for the deaths of their loved ones that just went to the football that day.
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you say someone needs to be found responsible. the difficulty here is david duckenfield became the focus of this, the one man could not possibly be responsible for a disaster of this scale, perhaps? and thatis, disaster of this scale, perhaps? and that is, i think, accepted by many people but at the end of the day, he was the commander, in charge on the day. he made decisions on the day that contributed to the disaster unfolding and getting to the stage where people were crushed and lost their lives and yes i expect that these things will be discussed and debated in terms of trials and organisations, either the omission organisations, either the omission or commission in terms of involvement of what went on so we won‘t get into that but i think at
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the end of the day, everybody respects that this was... sorry, accepts, not respects, that there was a number of contributing factors why this happened. but i think from our point of view, and as a football fan, who was at the ground and was at that semifinal that day, decisions were made around the police and everybody accepts those decisions could be due to what unfolded before our eyes. i think the families will be hugely frustrated that, you know, whether it‘s him or whether the police force of south yorkshire has been held accountable for those decisions and actions, i think, accountable for those decisions and actions, ithink, will take accountable for those decisions and actions, i think, will take a long time for them to accept. in fact, i
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don‘t think they will ever accept them. the reality is... one of the probably longest inquest in history as we also know, the 30 year wait forjustice, as we also know, the 30 year wait for justice, you know, as we also know, the 30 year wait forjustice, you know, they are still very, very short of that happening, despite the fact that we all know that they were not responsible for their own deaths, as some news outlets and papers actually said at the time, they were responsible. and so the fight will go on, i guess, from the families point of view. i think the wait for some sort ofjustice will also contribute. because you just talked about the families dignity and the way they behaved. they are not going to do anything other than carry on in the same way. it is hugely frustrating at they now have two,
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you know, wait even longer and, you know, at some stage hopefully they may get something that satisfies them. it is very good a you to join us, joe anderson, mayor of liverpool. the fallout of the tragedy obviously continues. proffessorjohn ashton was at hillsborough on the day and gave evidence at the inquest. your reaction to the verdict? it is shocking. i agree with what sheila and joe have said. there is a feeling this afternoon. but i also think it was probably predictable... i‘m sorry. it looked as though this old man was becoming victimised... we are going to have to leave that, i‘m afraid, professor. we have problems with the line but we will
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try to re—establish contact. i want to bring your reaction from the families of those who died in the families of those who died in the hillsborough disaster. let‘s hear from the hillsborough disaster. let‘s hearfrom them. no. we‘ve got the hillsborough disaster. let‘s hear from them. no. we‘ve got a problem with that. let‘s just say. professorjohn ashton, are you still there? no, we have lost that line completely. so let‘s just now... we can take you to that news conference with the families. let‘s hear from them. there are so many people i need to name so for those i forget, you are not forgotten and we truly thank you. first of all i'd like to thank our supporters, our survivors who supported us from day one. also the people of our city. there's been tremendous... they didn't come years later but from the very beginning
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they believed in us, so i thank all of them. i would also like to thank the h it for what it achieved on behalf of the families, from the chair to the panel. behalf of the families, from the chairto the panel. i behalf of the families, from the chair to the panel. i would like to thank operation resolved for all they have achieved as well. they really have done a lot of hard work for us to get where we were. i do not blame any of them, i do not blame the ilp cc for what went on today. i do not blame people for their contribution, i blame the syste m their contribution, i blame the system that is bonded in this country that is a disgrace to this nation. when 96 people, they say 95 but we say 96, were unlawfully
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killed and yet not one person is accountable. the question i'd like to ask all of you, and people within a system who then put the 96 in their graves, who is accountable for 96 unlawfully killed? what a disgrace this has been today. and what a shame on this country of ours. i feel so embarrassed to say thatis ours. i feel so embarrassed to say that is the system within our country. i'm really angry. i'm trying to be calm for the sake of these families that have suffered so much for 30 odd years. they have suffered. they've gone through hell. they've gone through all kinds. the people we've lost along the way. we've lost so many good family members. now my concern is that
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these families... i look at their faces... please, god, give them some peace. they deserve it. most importantly, those 96 deserve it. and they deserve something from this country that was morally right. as faras i'm country that was morally right. as far as i'm concerned, and country that was morally right. as faras i'm concerned, and i am starting to get angry now, that was a kangaroo court that we all sat through. there was so much evidence that could have been brought forward that could have been brought forward that was not allowed. it was not allowed. and i would like to know the jury saw the taylor report. if they had, there couldn't have been any other verdict. there couldn't have been any other verdict but guilty. we all know who's guilty. the families know who's guilty. our city knows who's guilty. he can walk around now and get on with his life
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with a not guilty verdict. to me, thatis with a not guilty verdict. to me, that is a disgrace. the things that -- if that is a disgrace. the things that —— if things had gone right on that day, he would have took all the praise and nobody else would have been at fault. because things went so wrong, he's not at fault, others are. yes, there is others. yes, there is others and we all know there is others and we all know there is others in the frame. the fa has got away with it, the city council got away with it... i ask all of you, how the 96 can be u nlawfully all of you, how the 96 can be unlawfully killed and there would be accountable ? please, give unlawfully killed and there would be accountable? please, give us the answer. who unlawfully killed my son along with 95 others? and i think now what we got to try and do is change the system that is in this country that is so wrong because of
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that can happen to 96, what could happen to individuals who are fighting on their own? they have no chance if that has happened to us. sol chance if that has happened to us. so i think it is an absolute bloody disgrace, and things need to change. applause i would like to add to margaret‘s speech, i would like to thank the wonderful barristers that we had for our inquest that made available every one person is individual journeys. they weren't lumped together as 96, as they have been over the years. we all had our own individual inquest. we all find out
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what happened to our own individual person, and to me, i will never forget those barristers. they were wonderful. steve. i'm feeling very angry. i have prepared a statement i would like to read from. i don't normally like to read from. i don't normally like to read from. i don't normally like to read from statements but i had to prepare this, otherwise my anger probably would have got the best of me. i believe the die was cast many years ago, so did a's decision was no surprise. if the evidence uncovered by the independent panel report would have been available in a private prosecution back in 2000, i believe ducke nfield
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a private prosecution back in 2000, i believe duckenfield would have been convicted then. we have sat here through to trials and duckenfield said here through to trials and ducke nfield said two here through to trials and duckenfield said two words in court. those two words were foresight and hindsight. his legal team depended on them, with lashings of repetition of his post—traumatic stress disorder being used as a tool for is catch. the qc invited the jurors to look at the state of him during his summing up. even when family members and survivors of hillsborough were sitting in preston crown court, showing them remarkable courage. 30 years later to the jury. i refer

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