tv Fast Money CNBC December 9, 2013 5:00pm-6:01pm EST
of all of the tweets, i'm not an economist. >> thank you so much for joining us. governor dean lindsey and robert frank, appreciate the time that all of you have spent with us. fast money coming up. melissa, what's going on with bitcoin? >> one thing you need to know. in four days bitcoin dropped 44%. >> doesn't sound like a store of value to me. >> we'll ask him. great show. "fast money" starts right now. live from the nasdaq market site in new york city times square, this is request fast money". we have got some breaking news at this hour. the u.s. treasury selling its remaining stake in general motors. phil has the very latest. >> this ends more than three years of the federal government having a stake in general motors. remember they had more than 500 million shares following the ipo
of general motors back in november of 2010. we have not been able to determine the exact price if you will. we do average out how much they sold all of their gm shares for. they sold near the end, near the high because shares of general motors as everybody anticipated the end of the treasury stake. ta took shares to an all time high of more than $41 a share here today. and do some math here today when you take a look at what this means for general motors and uncle sam, etc. uncle sam held the shares for 1, 118 dips and they put in $51 billion. they lost 12 billion dollars. that means that uncle sam bought roughly $10.7 million a day. supporters will say that was money well spent when you look at the jobs that we will see and
the fact that the economy doesn't suffer any greater than it did. and a practical standpoint, what this means for gm, look for them to issue a dividend rather quickly. and they no longer are under the t.a.r.p. pay restriction. they have long said that has been holding them back from recruiting the type of talent that they want to recruit for executives. the two big changes immediately for general motors now that uncle sam has sold all of its position. >> thanks for that update. we appreciate it. interesting that phil brings up the math in terms of how much money per day the government has lost. that was also quite a chunk of change. they were saying that they saved a million jobs. >> a million jobs? >> more than a million jobs. would it cost the broader economy more than a million jobs? how much is that cost per job to save it if you're going to do those types of calculations?
>> i think it was a great thing for them to do. not just gm. we don't know all the ramifications. if they had actually rsh. >> you're talking about the pliers. >> and then the rest of can economy was absolutely teetering on the edge. it's ot to me that gm trades up. we're selling. they tell you we're going to be out by january. i'm prize surprised that it's up again. >> phil mentioned that a dividend should happen here. i'm not so sure that it should. >> and these guys are growing at roughly 5%k there is anything you do with gm here other than the company needs to fix europe.
i would be holding this stock because this has taken hay way a major overhang. >> listen. one of the biggest investors in the company just sold their last shares. do you want to sell along with a losing investor or do you want to buy when they lose? i want to be the buyer. >> i don't agree with that at all. >> that's exactly what's going on here. i think that's what brian is saying. treasury has thrown this out the door. they are not a hedge fund but i would like to wave that in.
>> they are doing a lot of changes. they are getting rid of the cheverolet imprint in europe. just a company on an operating basis. i like owning gm here but it has run up quite a bit. ford over the same period of time has basically gone sideways. since then people have been concerned that malali is going to leave. i think that has been priced into the stock. i think ford has completely underperformed for the rong reasons. i really think you got to buy it. but i think ford's the trade. we have been all over the plays for years now.
warner along with the broader market tape, another all time high today. >> i'm long ford and gm. i say that only because india hit all time highs today the jlr business is a global business. that is growing 30% a year. these guys are teterred to growth. >> and if you want to hit some of the high end on the u.s., look at penske auto group. they are the dealer of all of the high end calls here. >> the dough, s&p 500, and nasdaq all ending in the green. so, we're going on bubble watch. in fact the number of people searching for the term stock bubble on google is on the rise for the month of december. we wanted to take a look at specific highs and we started off with google itself.
i know what you're going to say here, valuation is not a bubble. 27, 28% since then. >> although, i would argue. that was a misleading piece of data. it is definitely higher for sure. that doesn't mean that it's expensive. remember, there is a big ton of cash. when you compare it to some of the peers -- >> like a twitter or a face book? >> like a facebook or yahoo! for sure. apple in some ways. >> you have to give it a higher growth multiple. look at the way the guys are growing. look at all of the ways that you see on black friday. >> all time high doesn't bother you? >> it does not especially when you get back to the valuation. this stock is traded between 10
and 25. it's not expensive. >> would you rather be a buyer of google or something else? >> something else. not that i dislike google. but at all time highs can i find better stocks out there. >> let's get to micron here. a regis philbin play. trading at the highest levels since july. >> and laughing at you right now. i know he's laughing at me. >> he has consistently said all he's trying to do is help you guys have a better life and all you do is mock him about micron. >> it's not working. >> i hope he had a good nap. >> we have specifically said as long as pricing gets strong,
that remains tight. there is still a 12% short interest. now you have got ap lists on board. a couple of guys and gals raised their price target. you know what? this is not an expensive sfok. >> at the risk of regis laughing at me again, 85 times rsi here? this is is a stock that is overbought. you may make this argument and we all know the green light argument, and these guys are going to dominate. >> does that signal overbought five dollars ago? >> if you look at extreme levels, there is a lot of guys that went the wrong way at this stock but i think this is way extreme. >> let's get to 3d printing. interesting couple of calls. a bullish and a bearish case out.
in the meantime, the other side of it initiating it. brian kelly? >> so if you want to look at it as do they have earnings or valuations, then absolutely. if you are just discovering 3d printing stocks today you will probably lose money. that being said this is a revolutionary technology that sit a factory in a box and ultimately that will -- they will grow into different valuations. these names are one of those. >> factory in a box? >> that's right. >> nice. >> that's what it's doing to the world. >> no kidding? >> exactly. exactly. >> i don't know. we were discussing this before. i don't know what has gotten into this. >> i know i know. >> let's play the game.
if you landed from mars and you heard about this industry and you saw the multiples on the stocks, you from mars, the visitor, would you say buy them? >> i would say complete insanity. comes in and grabs these guys for another growth type engine. to me that's what you're betting on. >> if hp swooped in and bought one of the names would that make you more bullish? >> i feel stupid in 3d printing to not be participating. >> i thought it was so expensive then. >> and i do see this and then
everyone will have one. i fully believe that. so i think it can go up. >> i just want to point this out. there will be an acronym associated with it. >> isn't it fiab? >> fib. >> you jerk. >> the stock moving closer to 50 bucks a share. we will tell you the next step for twitter. and dennis gartman coming on to tell us the top five trades before the end of the year. we will count them down next on fast. (announcer) scottrade knows our clients trade and invest their own way. with scottrade's smart text, i can quickly understand my charts, and spend more time trading. their quick trade bar lets my account follow me online so i can react in real-time. plus, my local scottrade office is there to help. because they know i don't trade like everybody.
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>> let's get to one social media stock, twitter soring and ending just below the $50 mark. >> if it's going to go to 50, i think it will do it without a lot of people which is probably why it will make the move up to the high 40s first. >> what does that mean? >> everybody thought that -- >> they didn't think it would go there. >> i want to make it clear.
i didn't think the right trade was to get a long stock. everybody is saying buy knit the mid 30s. what everybody thinks that it typically does the other thing which is exactly what happened. i think that's what is going on. fundamentally, you can't buy it at 40 and you certainly can't buy it at 49. >> does it set up for short? we got two big lock up expirations early next year. >> dennis is probably a perfect candidate. listen, yes, i think it probably sets up for a really interesting short trade. yes. >> but again this thing is trading at 25 times 2014 projected revenues. so the reason for this burst today is people are excited that they think they will be able to better target on twitter than they are anywhere else. people have shown an inclination on search.
>> so how should you be playing the end of the training? break down his top five trades before kicking off the new year. we want to count down so number one will be last. number five. >> number five. everybody else has the trade on. it's not an uncomplicated trade. people will be involved in it. give me a point and a half rally at the long end i'm selling the long end. >> i took it off today. on friday you had really bearish news and the bond market wouldn't falter. a good market that doesn't go down, go to the sidelines. i will sell the first rally. >> number four? >> i want -- you have heard me say this before. it's an old story. i want to own the things that if i drop them on my foot it hurts. >> so clever. >> i want to own copper, steel,
railroads, ships, the basic plumbing of international economic growth. good story. a story that has worked for a long period of time. >> both of these are international growth and gdp increasing. >> i'm not smart enough to know asia and international stocks. i'm an old guy. i know the tricks that i know. >> you're betting on global growth. >> i am. we are going to get global growth. you have got to go into china right now. things are going to turn around. yes, this is under a very clear rational bet on global growth. no question about that. >> it would be strictly the commodities as opposed to those exposed? >> underline? >> i want to yoen the underlying. i have got no problem with that.
>> so scopper versus iron ore? >> i want to own copper, iron, and nickel. give me a basket of a all of them and i want to own all of them. they are all going to hurt. >> ouch. >> you have got number five and number four. 3-1 is coming up. >> there you go. >> it's what they call a tease in the business world. could the news ban from bit coin transactions actually be good? (vo) you are a business pro.
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>> the a automotive service chain revenues that were light. and earnings of just two cents per share but it is uncertain if that compares to the actual estimates. analysts were expecting a gain of 14 cents but no less, manny mow and jack just having a tough go. shares finishing the day down on the news. for change in leader ship at the
country which is pretty much in opposite. >> yes, i would say exactly the opposite. it is possible they are in the sale process. i don't think that's what is happening. there are interesting people but i don't know the great directors. i don't know really where that fits in exactly to abercrombie's mission. i'm not really sure. so i don't think this is a really strong board that can stand up to him. i do think engaged will be back. if you look at this board, i think we have not seen the end of this and that sort of leaves a floor for the stock because you have an activist there. >> they will be back. >> i think they will be back and they are thoughtful and diligent
and we have seen them do great things in the past. it's some of the same folks so i think there's probably a floor here. >> we should be clear that he responded to this and had a strongly worded response. we are disturbed. the board's reaction was to ignore the reaction and resign jeffries. this is proof that the board is to serve mr. jeffries and not the shareholders. >> karen, if you take a chart on the stock back five years you can see that 33 to 34 bucks is a level that is held tlau lot of news. this is a level where you can get comfortable and put a stop under that. >> bounced off of that a few times. >> more bad news for bitcoin. just days after china moved from using digital currency and after baidu stopped accepting it, reports say that a number of
other chinese vendors are no longer taking bitcoins. is this a sign that the vendor is about to pop? this segment is going to be called fast bitcoin. joining us now is bobby lee, ceo of the country's largest bitcoin exchange. great to speak with you. >> thank you for having me on again. >> a lot of proponents will say that acceptance is key to the story in terms of it being a value that will go up, will appreciate. and here we are formal knock down of acceptance from the regulatory bodies in china. what do you make of this? is this a ceiling on bit coin's value? >> the authorities put out a communication that bitcoin can no longer be regarded as a currency in china. so instead, financial institutions and banks are not allowed to do business with bitcoin because it's not a currency.
>> they talk ability bitcoin so that legitimizes it? >> no, no. bit coin buying and selling is okay for the chinese people. >> okay. >> so websites are allowed to continue to service customers to allow people to buy and sell bitcoins in china. >> isn't it difficult to be sure -- when you see bit coin's value go down in a span of four days by 44%? how can you possibly call that any sort of a store value? so i think bit coin is a virtual
good, virtual commodity. >> bobby it's brian kelly. i am an owner of bit coin as of the last couple of days. i am curious about the security of bitcoin. how would you recommend somebody who goes out and buys bitcoin, wants to hold it for the next year or two, how do they secure that? >> as bitcoin is decentralized, people can hold them by themselves or defer it to websites to hold it for them. >> he actually covers u.s. dollars, yen, aussie dollars, yen, etc. somebody else behind you thinking it is more valuable in order for you to sell it. the fact of the matter is it's not worth anything on its own.
you can't use it for a transaction any more in one of the largest markets of the world. isn't this all part of a greater fool's theory? >> it depends on how you classify the greater fool's theory. >> like what in your view? >> i don't -- you know, tsh. >> gold can be used for something. right? other currencies can be used. people are used to make payments. >> i think that's an interesting point. gold is, to me, the only currency that has nothing backing it. that's why people liked gold forever. at a time when currencies were getting devalued right and left, i'm not saying it's the dwragre
fool theory. ultimately it's not backed. >> it's -- it dwarfs the volatility in gold. >> this volatility is insane. gold you can't use to buy everything. go try to pay your mortgage with it. they will laugh you out of the bank. >> gartman unveils his top five trades before year end. the moves might surprise you. stay tuned. [ male announcer ] here's a question for you: where does the united states get most of its energy? is it africa? the middle east? canada? or the u.s.? the answer is... the u.s. ♪ most of america's energy comes from right here at home.
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equities market. predicated on the fact that the bank of japan is expanding more than the bank of the fed. it has no choice. it's already gone up quite a good deal. it's going to continue. probably going to be long the nikkei. >> so this weekend, had other voices view on the nikkei and come april when the tax increase comes in, it is going to fail. i'm with you. i'm long nikkei. >> at the same time, the monetary authority is going to have to do whatever they can to overcome that failure. >> number two. >> number two you want to own gold in yen terms. it's been a terrible trade. i just went to north carolina state.
we're not an ivy league school but i know that 7% loss is a lot better. >> every time you say buy something in other terms how do you do that? >> it's very easy. you can buy gld, buy $100,000 of gld and sell $100,000 of the etf for the yen. it's not as difficult as it sounds. and i bet that somebody comes up with an etf to do exactly that. >> where do you expect the yen to be? >> 125 to 140. >> so for your trade, then, are you also short yen? >>s yes. it is the same trade. you have got the same trade on twice. you have got understand that. if you have gone short of the
yen you have gone long on the nikkei. >> number one later on the n the show. >> see you later dennis. pops and drops. big movers of the day. big pop for soda stream. >> yes, after opening the morning down actually had very, very positive day to day. >> i got a drop for mcdonald's. >> their november sales and global sales definitely missed the comps and they missed estimates and the question for mcdonald's, is this a value store or a value trap relative to the casual dining space? i think you own it here. >> i've got a pop for sysco. the food sysco. >> so what about the stock now?
traded over 70 million shares today. the levels that we open at were basically the highs of the day. i help you pull the rip cord today. you can't get initiate a long position at these levels. >> upgraded today at morgan stanley. this is traded between 52 and 56. i think you have still got to trade the range here. wait until it gets close to 52. >> and we have a drop here for just friends. a new study finds that boys and girls can't be just friends. 125 children were surveyed on pre-teen dating and social status. one boy said having a girlfriend made him cool while one girl said not having a significant other saying we're pringle
singles or taken bacons. >> what does that even mean? >> pringle singles? >> you can just be friends. come on. >> just have a couple crisps. >> that's what they all said to you. >> we saw some activity not surprisingly in some of the tractor names. that after deere's earnings were pretty good. agco seeing the most unusual activity. this is is a name that doesn't typically trade many options. traded over approximate,000 today. and the most active were the december 60s. that is open interest of less
than 1400. these were opening buyers making bullish bets that agco will be above only a week from friday. >> would you agree with that? a big move in agco? >> some of this has to do with what happened in china. >> also check out our website. coming up next, more coming at us tomorrow. is the holiday shopping season in trouble? we will talk to the ceo shopping center owner. stay tuned. [ indistinct shouting ] ♪ [ indistinct shouting ]
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country we will have fewer jobs. we're outrunning the bear. the bear is the federal government. the federal government is more taxes and more regulation. we will have the other states. >> we will sell 16 million automobiles. we have 950,000 housing starts. >> next year is going to be the year that it is not that eeoc siting and it's time to be more of an opera player. find the stocks that have a great story, something behind them and allocate your money there. the beta is challenging there. it's hard to move up a lot. they are highly complimentary. we are keeping all the airplanes and all the people.
supply should be on change. >> guy? >> talked about this last week. you overlay a honey well chart and you will see the outperformances there. although it has had a meteoric rise, i think that honeywell is interesting. >> i'm long ge. i think they have major exposure. the entire u.s. economy is on trend. to say that we're just trying to get over the trauma here and some of the data is already there. >> will the snow and ice keep shoppers at home or will they bare the elements. dan, always good to see you.
what have you seen so far? we have had nasty weather on key shopping weekends. >> we have had tough weather and nice cold weather. we just went two years where they didn't sell boots or carves or gloves or things of that nature. my guess is what will happen is you have people who are great merchants will say the weather helped them and those that aren't will say that the weather hurt them. >> we're very excited about people who sell branded goods off price. t.j., nordstrom rack, ross, they give you value on a consistent regular basis. >> who looks horrible? who is not executing well? >> the teen retailers on the mall and online stores are
good. >> compare the u.s. consumer. you guys are down in brazil and peurtorico. what do you think? >> brazil is an amazing market. rates are going up for rents. sales are up. everything that exists is very solid and good. growth is a problem. you have a lot of uncertainty and your execution. so the development pipeline has been less stable it has been a consistent grower for us. we happen to be the largest retail landlord in peurto rico. >> thanks for stopping by. i have got some breaking news.
>> melissa, check out shares of iep, icahn enterprises. the stock or depositing units are down about 6%. this after the company said they were announcing a 2 million unit sale of those partnership deposits. it's being run solely by morgan stanley. back over to you. >> thanks, dom. 2 million unit sale. >> first of all if you look at iep and where this stock has gone from. it makes a lot of sense especially when you consider how aggressive he is looking to be. >> at the beginning of the show, i said, you do want to buy gm
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gs to? >> they have seen an upleveling of china's activity. a big number of reports released in 2013 but china has a defense contractor type model. a supply chain where they are supplying cyber attack kits to infiltrate the western world infrastructure. it's a lot about stealing intellectual property. >> i think people don't realize how much can be or has been taken already. what source of information is being stolen right now? >> it's very agreejeous in terms of what's being stolen. we see it across every major critical infrastructure. often that innovation is being stolen.
it could be other assets that are important to smart grid designs and automotive inknow vagus. so we're seeing it across lots of different vert kls and different countries as well. because the internet has a lack of governing, it creates a perfect platform for adversaries to steal and police from. >> these attacks have been going on for years. how does this translate into business for you now that you're able to say you know what? there is one entity in china and we have got to reinforce the security? >> we see a lot of opportunity from a security point of view.
willing to do good and protect and block a lot of the attackers methods. we're expanding a lot and we see a real opportunity to disrupt t the. >> dave, thanks so much for joining us. a stock by the way of 85%. we have got your first move tomorrow when we come back. and gart man will be back with what else? his number one year end trade unveiled next. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 searching for trade ideas that spark your curiosity
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with investment information, risks, fees and expenses stick with innovation. stick with power. stick with technology. get the new flexcare platinum from philips sonicare and save now. philips sonicare. >> time for the final trade. >> big election result. opposition reform party coming through india. ibm. >> brian? >> i like the natural resources, tck. >> karen? >> linta, liberty interactive. >> guy?
>> lyons gate is overdone. i think it's interesting again, lgf. >> and we have got dennis gartman back with his number one trade that you must put on before the end of this year. >> i want to be short of the japanese yen and i want to be long the canadian dollar and long the british pound against it. >> wow. >> wow. >> that's actually a trade that i have on. i'm long british pound. i guess i must have gotten your newsletter. >> i have been talking about it for months and months and months. >> the economy is really improved over there. it's a great trade. >> you can't underestimate. timmy speaks to this all the time. now that it's held that 100 level magically it feels like the next move is into the teens. >> i remember trading at 285 yen
to the dollar. for me to go to 125 or 150 seems like a bounce. >> all right. long loony, long pound. thanks so much for watching. "mad money" starts right now. my mission is simple. to make you money. i'm here to level the playing field for all investors. there's always a bull market somewhere. and i promise to help you find it. "mad money" starts now. hey, i'm cramer. welcome to "mad money," welcome to cramerica. my job is not just to educate but also to teach you. so call me at 1-800-743-cnbc. to most private investors, the bad news is good news for stock story doesn't pass the smell te