tv CNN Newsroom CNN March 23, 2013 7:00pm-8:00pm PDT
officer -- excuse me. junior officer training program which was run by a certain agency -- and you're correct -- cia. but i never said that i worked for them. i simply said -- >> now who's splitting hairs? were you trained -- >> some contact with some person and that's all i'm going to say. >> were you trained? >> that's all i'm going to say. >> in these techniques. >> that's all i'm going to say. >> he did acknowledge it was cia training but said no more. so is this true? or only a fantasy in his mind? the mind of a man the courts have found to be a killer? we'll leave that question with you. the verdict is now yours to decide. three choices -- guilty, innocent or not proven either way. in a few moments we'll show you the verdicts that our audiences reach when this documentary was first broadcast.
but before then, a look at some of the answers from those who lived through the terror 30 years ago. the prosecutor. >> obviously guilty. >> the defense attorney. >> not proven. one way or the other. >> the fbi agent in charge. >> guilty of two double homicide. >> sheila baltazar. >> he could have killed all of them. >> the supreme court justice. >> not proven. >> the witness. >> guilty. >> camille bell. >> innocent but stupid. >> that first task force detective. >> no maybes, ifs. guilty. the right man for those homicides is in jail. >> the original audience verdict, guilty. 69%. innocent 4%.
innocent 4%. not proven either way, 27%. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com hello everyone. don lemon here. the stories you're talking about in just a moment. but first, let's get you up to speed on some of the day's headlines. president barack obama back home after a busy trip to the middle east. he arrived at joint base andrews earlier after his first visit to israel as president. the trip also took him to the west bank and jordan. secretary of state john kerry didn't return on air force one. he stayed behind to hold separate talks with israeli and palestinian leaders. the defendant's motion to vacate the judgment is granted.
>> david ranta was freed from prison after spending more than two decades behind bars for a murder he didn't commit. tonight he is recovering from a heart attack. david ranta was wrongly convicted of killing a new york rabbi in 1990. his lawyer said he plans to sue the city of new york. and joe weider died today. in the 1960s, he introduced the world to a young athlete from austria named arnold schwarzenegger and he founded the mr. olympia competition. he died at his los angeles home. he was 93 years old. here's what else we're working on -- did you know your neighbor or friend could be a sociopath? with all the high-profile murders lately, we checked and found a surprising statistic. hope you're sitting down.
is america going gay? the supreme court is about to weigh in. so goes the court, so goes the entire country. the late-night shuffle, jay leno, jimmy fallon, seth myers, tina fey. who's out? who's in? and what could possibly make me do this on national tv? all that in just a moment. first this, a small town in georgia, it is a weekend of sadness, shock and anger. this is where a mother and her 13-month-old child were both shot allegedly by teenagers who pulled guns and demanded money. the mother was shot in the leg, the child in a stroller was killed. people who heard the gunfire called 911. >> it appears that her baby's been shot. >> listen to me, ma'am, is the baby breathing? >> i don't know. he's in a stroller. i just came out the door. yes, she's trying to get the
baby out now. >> did you hear any shots in the area where it happened? >> listen, the baby is shot. the baby has been shot. >> ma'am, listen to me. we've got the people en route to you. i have to ask you these questions. did you hear the shots in the area? >> yes, i heard the shot. >> police have two teenagers in custody, one is 17, the other 14. they are charged with murder tonight. earlier today, the child's mother spoke to cnn. she has a message for those boys she says killed her child. >> that i hate you and i don't forgive you and that you killed an innocent human life and that i hope you die for it. and that's how i feel. >> no one would blame you to feel like that. >> because this is the second child that people have taken from me in a tragic way. and i'm so afraid to have any more babies now.
i tried to raise really good kids in a wicked world. so i hope he dies for what he did. >> this is one of the suspects, a 17-year-old named demaremarre elkins. ] . my next guest says we may be seeing the work of sociopaths and we're going to see a lot more of this with this younger generation. this past week, ohio school shooter t.j. lane was sentenced to life in prison. a year ago, he shot six high school students in suburban cleveland. three of them died. one of the surviving students now has to use a wheelchair. during this week's sentencing while these horrific killings were detailed in the courtroom, there lane is, smiling, giggling and unbelievably here's what he
probably wore to that hearing, a t-shirt with the word "killer" written on it. no remorse, no regret, no hint that lane even felt the killings were wrong. that is a top trait of a sociopath. this isn't new behavior theer. some experts believe we're seeing more of it in not just boys. remember this? just last fall near philadelphia, six teenage girls attacked a mentally disabled woman as she sat on her porch, laughing as they beat her, cheering each other on and they shot this video of it. they're the ones who put it on the internet. helen morrison and jim clemente join us. helen, i have two questions for you. this is a sociopath. what's a sociopath and do you believe we're seeing an uptick in their numbers?
>> first of all, the primary information about a sociopath is that they have no conscience. they don't feel that they have right or wrong in their life. they also note that whatever they do is fine. and we do see an uptick, especially among girls. usually in the past, sociopaths or psychopaths were thought to be primarily male. but as you saw in that video, the girls are just as difficult. and there is a definite change and a definite increase in this diagnosis. >> jim, with your work with the fbi, did you see an uptick? do you think we're seeing an uptick? >> yeah, i think we're seeing an uptick. the evidence that we just saw -- you should look at with women you're more likely to see group or mob behavior. that's when they act out that way. individual women are not as likely to act out that way as men are.
but with social media these days, i think they get the feedback right away. they posted that video because they wanted to show off. and i think that adds fuel to the fire. >> stay right there, both of you. we're going to come back in just a moment. we're going to talk to a number of people. we're going to talk about the rise in this behavior and they're going to tell us how we might be able to recognize these straits in people we see every day. researchers say one out of every 100 people is a sociopath. but it may be a lot higher than that. we'll talk about that next. neil and buzz: for teaching us that you can't create the future... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history. instead of looking behind... delta is looking beyond. 80 thousand of us investing billions... in everything from the best experiences below... to the finest comforts above. we're not simply saluting history... we're making it.
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one of the best cinematic expressions of scioscia pathic behavior is in a film. we're seeing a sharp rise in sociopathic behavior in today's kids. jim, you dealt with things like that. people like this are usually very smart, aren't they? >> yeah, usually on the top end of the intelligence scale. they're very charismatic.
they have a way of dealing with people, drawing them in, they typically have a circle of friends around them that they've been able to draw into their cult of personality. some of them go on to start cults. you'll see that in jimmy jones and apple white. they both started cults in which they were able to convince people to kill themselves for the cause. >> jim, what do you think moves someone from sociopath to psychopath? >> well, i think sociopaths and psychopaths are sort of the opposite ends of the spectrum. i think they share a lot of the same traits. but the psychopaths are the ones that really go into that violent, criminal and sexual behavior. i think although a sociopath might have multiple sexual partners, a psychopath might have a history of multiple rapes. i think that's one of the most distinguishing factors. >> helen, the numbers we hear is one in every 100 may be a sociopath. do you agree with that number?
>> i not only agree with that number but i think it's a bit low, especially in this generation. we're seeing behaviors -- >> helen, we can't hear you. i'm going to go to jim. jim, do you remember a time that you dealt with a case where at first here's a suspect but then the realization that this person is a sociopath? >> sure. robert spangler was a great example. here's a guy whose wife and teenage son and daughter were killed and supposedly it was the wife committing murder/suicide. and then a couple of years later, his second wife got away from him. but his third wife accidentally fell off the grand canyon when she was hiking with him. the second wife comes back to console him and she ends up dead of a pill overdose. and then we actually caught him when he was about to bring his fourth wife, his potential
fourth wife, to the grand canyon. and here's a guy who was very intelligent, high in the 160s or 170 i.q. he talks to you and seems like a normal human being. you drill down deeper and you see the fantastic stories, the huge ego. the amount of charisma that he had to use to convince his second wife to come back. then she ends up with this pill overdose. we eventually realize that these were not accidental deaths or the work of somebody else. but he actually orchestrated all these murders himself. >> when you see all of these high-profile trials playing out on television for people -- there's one going on now, the jodi arias trial where she admitted to killing her boyfriend. and it seems she's told the jury and the judge a web of lies. is it possible that someone like her, that jodi arias is a sociopath? >> sure. i think she's exhibiting a number of psychopathic traits. first of all, i have to say, she's very intelligent.
she's on the level of intelligence of bundy. her ability to look at the jury in the eye and manipulate them basically manipulating the prosecutor by getting under his skin. she totally undermined his prosecution by needling him with details. she's hyper alert and hyper accurate. unfortunately the prosecutor is not. so she's able to call him out on these generalities that he uses with very specific language. she's playing a great role. she's obviously a compulsive liar, the victim role she's playing is all an act. >> i'm sure you worked with internet crimes. what role does social media, does it play into any of this? >> well, sure. you see it most dramatically in situations like what we saw with
those young ladies who were attacking that woman where they posted their own violence. it's sort of a way to brag. it's sort of a way to get everybody to see the accomplishments they've made. it actually fuels the fire of people who want to sort of make a name for themselves. i think we see it in school shootings as well. they want to one-up the next or the last biggest shooting. they want to be bigger, more well known than their peers. so i think it's dangerous because of the instant gratification it gives them and plus the broad reach that putting something into social media networks gives them. >> this sounds like an odd question. but i've had people talk to -- say this because this next character doesn't exhibit emotion a lot. do you think our society romanticized his behavior -- someone say that someone like james bond fits into this
category? >> he's charismatic, very accomplished, very intelligent. what we love as a society about sociopaths or psychopaths, their lives are typically filled with adventure. they get bored very easily. they're constantly thrill-seeking. i don't think you can find a greater example of a thrill-seeker than james bond in our popular media. of course, he's not a real person. but i think the people that are in special forces have to have a little bit of that thrill-seeking adrenaline junkie kind of personality. >> before we run, what do we look for if you want to know if your friend, neighbor, someone you may be dating may be of psychopathic behavior? >> first of all, they will never admit to being the wrong party. everything is always somebody else's fault. when you see some of them, they'll talk sort of as if they're grander than the average person. they refer to themselves as "we" a lot. they'll get you hooked into things on the spur of the moment. you'll make plans to go away for
the weekend and they'll have made plans to instead climb a mountain and be gone for a week. they always want to push the envelope. they're doing more and more and more. i think that if you actually drill down and ask them for details of the kind of wild stories that they weave, they'll get more mad. and if you call them on their integrity, they will attack you rather than addressing the issues that you bring up. i think all those things, if you find them together, we'll see some of those individual characteristics. but when you find all those things together in one person, you might be living next door to a sociopath. >> sounds like a couple of people i know. thank you very much, jim and helen. i'm sorry we lost dr. helen's aud audio. coming up -- >> i pronounce you legally married. >> is america going gay? the supreme court is about to weigh in. so goes the court, so goes the entire country.
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. the supreme court will hear two lawmaker cases involving same-sex marriage beginning tuesday. and people are already lining up outside the high court hoping to hear the arguments. one of the cases is a challenge to the defense of marriage act which prohibits federal recognition of gay marriages. the other, a challenge of california's proposition 8, a ban on same-sex marriage that was approved by voters. that's just days away now. earlier this month, the president who signed the defense of marriage act 17 years ago had a change of heart in a "washington post" op ed. former president bill clinton wrote, as the president who signed the act into law, i have come to believe that doma is in fact imcompatible with our constitution. he said, back then it was less of a condemnation of legal marriage and a bit of legal
maneuveri maneuvering. i asked jeffrey toobin to explain that. >> all we can say for sure is bill clinton thinks it was a mistake to sign doma. he wrote an op ed a couple of weeks ago saying whatever justification he may have had in 1996 wuntd good enough. and he, like virtually the entire democratic party, repudiates it and wants to see it overturned. >> this isn't a thumbs-up or thumbs-down decision. this is the supreme court. what are we looking at here? >> this is a bit of a rubik's coupe, the defense of marriage act and the case of proposition 8, the ban that prohibits same-sex marriage in california. the federal law says the federal government will not recognize same-sex marriages even in states where it's legal. so people -- gay people who are married in new york and new
england and all of the states where it's legal, they can't file joint tax returns or get joint survivor's social security benefits. if the supreme court upholds doma, all of that remains the same. if they overturn it, the federal government will have to treat married people as married people. >> more than half of the country now in support of same-sex marriage. is it that way? does the court line up that way as well? >> this is always a very difficult question. what effect does public opinion have on the justices? the official answer is none. they just apply the constitution. the real-world answer is, plenty. there are five republicans and four democrats on the supreme court. that's pretty much all you need to know. however, one of the republicans is anthony kennedy who has been generally very supportive of gay rights. so many people think he will join the democrats in voting to
overturn doma. >> when talking about interracial marriage, i would imagine it was a very similar situation at that time. >> the parallels to the case you're referring to, loving versus virginia, 1967, the case that said states could no longer ban racial intermarriage, that was a big deal at the time. and there were still 19 states where racial intermarriage was illegal, when barack obama's parents got married in 1960 in hawaii. so the country changed. and that law is not only unconstitutional now, it's unthinkable. and the question is, is same-sex marriage moving in the same direction? at the moment, it does. but it's certainly not there yet. >> jeffrey, i know you don't like to make predictions about these things, but what do you think is going to happen? do you have any idea? >> well, i think the most likely
result is that the court will overturn the defense of marriage act, will say that that law is so discriminatory, it's unconstitutional. the proposition 8 case is a much tougher call. there are a lot more moving parts. they could rule just in california, they could rule for the whole country. they could dodge the issue on procedural grounds. so that one, i'm not even going to venture a guess on. >> all right. again, thank you, jeffrey toobin. >> okay. a well-respected conservative senator, the latest republican to endorse gay marriage. are we seeing the beginning of a shift among republicans? we're asking the former chairman of the log cabin republicans next. [fight bell: ding, ding] how many here are google users? what if i was to tell you that you would actually like bing way more than google when it came to the results? prove it. let's look up some taco places. i like the left side. yeah? okay, do we need to find out what the waves are like down at the beach? what side do you like better? i like the results on the right. i'm gonna go with the one on the left. oh! bing won! people prefer bing over google for the web's top searches.
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just days before the supreme court takes up same-sex marriage, the republican party has announced plans to get beyond itself, the stereotype of being too white and too closed to younger votes. good to see you. >> good to see you. >> he's reaching out to gay people and everybody at home gasped. what do you make of it? >> this isn't new. to be fair, chairman priebus, as soon as he was elected chairman back in 2011, was very aggressive about reaching out to all the different affinity groups or ancillary groups
within the republican party, including log cabin republicans. he was the first chairman to make it clear that the corporate culture, as soon as ince priebus came in, was to be inclusive and welcoming. he took a lot of hits for that during his first term as chairman -- >> let me in here. don't filibuster me. none of that played out. we heard none of that in the last election. we heard the exact opposite from the gop in the last election. >> well, what you're talking about is you're talking about the platform which was an anchor around our neck during the election cycle. that was very clear amongst many in leaderships which is why in project is very important. it was a very pragmatic approach, very similar to an after-military option. you do an after-action review. the party was very honest about our weaknesses and why we aren't attracting the voters that we should attract. it's very healthy.
this is the first chairman to actually recognize the lgbt members of the party as well as the community at large. >> clarke, reince priebus doing it is one thing. but for people who are actually running, the people who are visible, the people who are seeking offices, for them -- it's one thing for him to say it. but for them to actually get it and get out on the campaign stump and go into their own communities and promote that, that is another thing. do you think they get it? >> you're right, it is. some do. some candidates do. if you look at if house level races in 2012. you had leaders in the house like pete sessions of texas, eric cantor, the majority leader, really reach out in their young guns program to make sure there were candidates that were very welcoming to the party that had positions that support marriage equality.
an openly gay republican in the senate embraced by the party, he did not win his race. but it was a symbolic step within party leadership to say, we're getting behind this candidate. we're going to support this candidate and his orientation isn't an issue. and he says he's going to support to repeal doma when he gets in congress. >> what do you say to the reince priebus -- i'm sorry, to the michele bachmanns of the world, the mitt romneys of the world, to the people who are at the top of the party who everyone listens to? what do you say to them? >> i can tell you what i shared with governor romney when he was running for president. regardless of where you may personally feel, you have to take a pragmatic approach to this. haley barbour is one of the opportunities of the growth and opportunity project report. he made a very clear message before the 2012 election that purity is the enemy of victory. if one just looks at numbers as
far as winning an election and making sure that you're getting out the positive message of opportunity, individual liberty, personal responsibility that you're the party of opportunity, then it does need to be inclusive. and there needs to be a reality check that there's about 11 million to 12 million illegal immigrants in this country and the majority of americans support equal workplace opportunity and the majority of americans support same-sex marriage. those are realities you have to recognize and be cognizant of that. >> at one point, we were all illegal immigrants. let's not forget that. people like michele bachmann and mitt romney, when you look at cpac, right, and the messages -- not from everybody that was coming out of cpac -- but for many of the members coming out of cpac, it seemed like it was 50 years ago.
you're like, what century are these people living in? i say that because i have a number of friends who -- some of them gay -- say, i would love to be a part of a fiscally conservative party. but when all of the hatred comes out on the social issues and the craziness, i cannot be affiliated with that. >> you're touching upon the battle that happened during the week prior to the republican national convention. there was actual debate. but this is where the generational divide was extremely present. you had some much, much older members of the party who are delegates on that platform drafting committee who did not want to look at these realities. in fact, there was a healthy debate -- there were two amendments offered to insert support for civil unions. one amendment was offered to strike any reference to doma at all from the platform. if you can't say anything nice, say nothing at all. it was a very divisive debate.
what one saw was it was a much older generation that was taking a lead on that language. >> you think it's generational among republicans? >> not completely. but that is if you look at all the different data points, as far as where we're looking at growth and opportunity, we're looking at younger voters, we're looking at voters that have not been lately enfranchised by the party. >> i have to run. last time you were here, you said you were resigning as head of the log cabin reports because you wanted to start a life, family and get married. where are you on that? >> i think you and my mom must talk offline. i have a boyfriend now. there's a guy i met actually at the capitol the day of the vote of the repeal of "don't ask, don't tell." fellow army officer. he happens to be in afghanistan right now. >> you're on your way? >> yeah, no pressure. >> thank you.
that's all i needed to hear. good for you. i'm sure mrs. cooper, the mom, is very happy about it. thank you, clarke. hope to see you soon. >> all right, don. coming up after this quick break -- the album that defined a generation hits a milestone. find out how fans of pink floyd are marking the event. director's voice: here we go. from the top. and action for over 75 years people have saved money with gecko so.... director's voice: cut it! ...what...what did i say? gecko? i said gecko? aw... for over 75 year...(laughs. but still trying to keep it contained) director's voice: keep it together. i'm good. i'm good. for over 75...(uncontrollable laughter). what are you doing there? stop making me laugh. vo: geico. saving people money for over seventy-five years. gecko: don't look at me. don't look at me.
it was the soundtrack for a generation. pink floyd's "dark side of the moon." the album turns 40 this weekend and no doubt fans worldwide will be marking the event in their own unique ways. have a listen now to bob boylan and his memories of what it was like to hear groundbreaking sounds for the first time. >> "dark side of the moon" made all those psychedelic songs that
they made that were always long, long forms, 18 minutes, very much more concise. that was what did it. it influenced -- look at sampling and what people did with sampling ten years later and look at what the cash register sound of money is. they did that with tape. but it basically put natural sounds, other kinds of sounds besides musical instruments into pop music which changed the face of pop music in many ways. >> there's a copy of the album cover up on the screen. what do you think of the cover? a beam of light going through a glass prism. what's the meaning of that, do you think? >> how many hours you and i sat and just stared at that cover while we listened to that record. i think it's about simplicity and things that are complex. here it is, you have a beam of white light. but what does white light made of? so many different elements and all the different colors. even the most simple of things is complicated. >> let's be honest here.
a lot of potheads listened to this. >> i think there's a real complicated, interesting story of drugs and creativity, alcohol creativity, long for authors, writers, painters and pink floyd are no exception to that, and listeners. and i think those sort of mind-altering thing help or make people think of things in different ways. there's a negative side to it and an awful side to it. there's a creative side to it and it's all part of the big puzzle of life and creativity. i waited a year for that record to come out. no one knew what it was. when that record came out, it was absolutely mind-bogglingly beautiful. i've loved pink floyd. but this was better than anything they'd ever done. it was a step above in terms of lyrics, in terms of sound. so many things, it was what the
album was made for -- to tell a story, to make you think, layers and layers of meaning. you can listen to -- still i've put it on the 40th anniversary on the day of, and i listened to it, side a and b. still loved it. >> i still comb like album stores, vinyl stores. you can find some really, really cool things. i miss -- being nostalgic here. you go to the record store and they have something new for you. that doesn't happen anymore, does it? >> i was the dude in the store. we played that record over and over again in the store. and people would walk in -- there are records that have a vibe. immediately you walk into a room and it changes the room. and "dark side of the moon" was exactly that. it completely changed -- when people walked into our record store, they were like, what is this? no one had heard stuff like this before. for the most part.
on the radio, you could listen to bread and raspberries and just fairly bland music. and then there was pink floyd. humor is one of the president's most powerful tools. but my next guest says the current president uses it as a weapon. i'll explain right after this. whoooo! you're crazy. go faster! go faster! go faster! go faster! no! stop...stop... (mom) i raised my son to be careful... hi, sweetie. hi, mom. (mom) but just to be safe... i got a subaru. (announcer) love. it's what makes a subaru a subaru. today is gonna be an important day for us. you ready? we wanna be our brother's keeper. what's number two we wanna do? bring it up to 90 decatherms. how bout ya, joe?
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[ male announcer ] engine light on? come to meineke now for a free code scan read and you'll say...my money. my choice. my meineke. presidents have used humor for years to sidestep questions, divert attention. but more often than not, it was self-deprecating in nature poking fun at themselves. dean obeidallah could do an entire show making fun of himself, yish. dean, you say that president obama used his comedy as a weapon.
we have president bush doing to presidential humor. we've seen more of than a couple from president obama. >> this is my last white house correspondents' dinner as president. i'm not sure what i'm going to do next. after he left office, vice president gore won an oscar and the nobel peace prize. hey, i don't know, i might win a prize, publishing clearinghouse or something. >> i went shopping at some stores in midtown. i understand governor romney went shopping for some stores in midtown. it's great to be here this evening in the vast, magnificent hilton ballroom or what mitt romney would call a little fixer-upper. >> dean, you see this as a big change in presidential joking, right? the attack comic. >> it is. i wrote about it in my cnn
opinion article. you can see the contrast in jokes from reagan making fun of himself for being old. bush made fun of his inability to speak english. self-deprecating humor, you can't go wrong. it makes people like you. no one's offended because you're making fun of yourself. i should do that more. but president obama's turned it around. he does it like a comedian, like "the daily show." the comedy has a message in it. people go, it's just jokes. no, that's not how political comedy work. there's an embedded message and he's trying to further a point. this one, the jokes we heard about romney was to show romney is rich. we know that. but it reaffirms it over and over. romney is not like us. he's a rich man. different thing. it's subtle but effective. >> but sometimes the best way we learn is through humor with a tinge of humor in it -- it's like sugar that makes the pill go down. there is a fine line, though.
the president jokes like that, they can backfire. >> they could if he went too far. we're not saying president obama's out there writing his jokes. he has joke writers involved. but he picks the jokes and he has to approve the jokes. you can go too far. obama hasn't yet i think because we are all conditioned by "the daily show" -- jon stewart took over in 1999. we'resed to people using comedy in a biting way that makes a point. it's like politics. it's okay. president have comics on their writing team on the payroll? >> we will have people -- people wrote in the past when seth myers was doing it. i know comics were helping president obama write jokes. not saying president obama doesn't write any jokes. but he's president of the united states. jokes are for guys like me. do you need some jokes, don? >> you wrote me some jokes for a roast once.
and i didn't use one of them. but don't go anywhere, dean. we have a lot coming up. take a look at this -- the late-night shuffle. jay leno, jimmy fallon, seth myers, tina fey. who's out? who's in? let's talk. and changes everything.g the powerful gs. get great values on your favorite lexus models during the command performance sales event. this is the pursuit of perfection. during the command performance sales event. try running four.ning a restaurant is hard, fortunately we've got ink. it gives us 5x the rewards on our internet, phone charges and cable, plus at office supply stores. rewards we put right back into our business. this is the only thing we've ever wanted to do and ink helps us do it. make your mark with ink from chase.
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three years. he must have work at nbc, too. i couldn't believe that. >> jay leno firing fresh jabs at his employer. the rumor mill is cranked up with reports about nbc possibly replacing leno with jimmy fallon next year. fallon's camp is staying quiet. rumor has it that "the tonight show" could move back to new york if fallon takes the helm. dean obeidallah is back. he's the co-host of "the big three." you worked with jimmy fallon for years on "saturday night live." give us your take on fallon. >> i remember jimmy vividly. when he was auditioning, he was 23 years old. he was nervously holding his guitar. we talked for a minute or two. and i saw this whole trajectory of a guy who went from unknown, becoming a star on the show now to about to take the seat of
basically the king of comedy. you dream as a comedian just to be on "the tonight show" let alone to host it. jimmy is a truly nice guy, unbelievably talented. i think it's going to work out. i think mid america is going to like it as much as people in the cities. he's like a young johnny carson. >> what i don't understand and correct me if i'm wrong, the ratings for jay leno are still very strong. he's number one. he beats all of them. why change horses in midstream if he's still doing okay? >> he's number one when you see the ratings. but in advertising sales, it's gone down a lot from the last few years because it's not doing as well. he's beating letterman. they're concerned about the future. they're concerned about jimmy kimmel. >> i love kimmel. >> that's the concern from nbc. that jimmy kimmel is going to take the young people. it's now, wait a few more years for jay or do it now. i reached out to people at jimmy
fallon's show and no one would respond to me. and then they're going to need a replacement for jimmy fallon's show. i'm ready! >> no, no, seriously. who's that going to be? seth myers. >> i'll go to network -- you're a basic cable guy. i think seth myers. from everything i read. seth's done a great job. there's another guy i met who was unknown and became very famous. great writer. i think he would do an excellent job. he's a different personality than jimmy. jimmy's playful. so much enthusiasm. it's contagious. seth is a little bit more serious. >> we haven't seen a woman in there since joan rivers. i think tina fey would be terrific. >> tina or amy poehler. but they have kids and they're doing movies and stuff. it's different. >> i just moved you along. come on, it's never going to happen. you're never going to do that. >> don, you never know. i've got a podcast now on cnn.
that's step one. next thing, youtube. after that, basic -- public access. >> don't be downing basic cable if you're working for a basic cable company. that's your gate. chill out. >> this is comedy, don. >> thank you, dean. coming up -- what could possibly make me do this? on national tv? at you got. rv -- covered. why would you pay for a hotel? i never do. motorcycles -- check. atv. i ride those. do you? no. boat. house. hello, dear. hello. hello. oh! check it -- [ loud r&b on car radio ] i'm going on break! the more you bundle, the more you save. now, that's progressive. the in their portfolio, isent of invesunexpected risk.to find
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