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tv   Legal View With Ashleigh Banfield  CNN  October 7, 2014 9:00am-10:01am PDT

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so proud. >> nice cowboy hats. look at the hats on the dudes at that wedding. >> impressive. we'll wrap it up here. i'm michaela pereira. >> and i'm john berman. "legal view" with ashleigh banfield tastarts right now. just who is this 19-year-old from illinois arrested at the airport? was he on his way to join isis? wait until you hear the letter that he wrote to his parents and see the likes that he got on his facebook page. also this hour, talk about organized crime. isis isn't just smuggling oil and extorting citizens to finance their terrorist takeover. they're so entrenched, they're charging bank fees and collecting taxes, too. and nearly a week after that ebola diagnosis in dallas, they are finally finished fumigating
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the contaminated apartment. and you'd assume they took every precaution to protect the next-door neighbors, especially all the kids next door, right? hello, everyone. i'm ashleigh banfield. thanks for joining us. good to have you with us today. four men are being held in london at this hour on suspicion of plotting a terror attack. scotland yard says a number of homes and vehicles are being searched but there is no word yet on what authorities are looking for nor what if anything they've found. the suspects are 20 and 21 years old. and officials say one was tased while being arrested. we'll bring you more details as soon as they come in to our offices. he likes the chicago bulls, "the hunger games," batman and allegedly isis. he likes isis. but for all the details we know about a chicago area 19-year-old named mohammed hamzah khan, some pretty important questions are still left unanswered, such as
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who put up $4,000 to pay for khan's travel to turkey? who was supposed to meet mim wh him when he got there and lead him into the battle in iraq and syria if the allegations are true? the feds have some ideas but for now they're saying just enough to keep khan locked away in a country, a society he said that he'd come to hate. here's cnn's ted rowlands. >> reporter: according to the criminal complaint, khan did talk to investigators at the airport after he was arrested. but most of the evidence, according to that complaint, came from his home here in bolingbrook, a suburb of chicago. they found notes, drawings and they found a letter which sort of explains why an american teenager would want to travel overseas and fight for isis. according to investigators, 19-year-old mohammed hamzah khan was on his way to join isis when he was arrested over the weekend
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after going through security at chicago's o'hare airport. in a three-page letter allegedly left for his parents and signed "your loving son," khan according to a criminal complaint wrote that he was obligated to migrate to the islamic state and that he couldn't bear the thought of his taxes in the u.s. being used to kill his, quote, muslim brothers and sisters. the western societies are getting more immoral day by day, he allegedly wrote, i do not want my kids being exposed to filth like this. investigators say khan was expecting that a contact he met online would meet him in turkey and take him to join isis in iraq or sir. but details about who bought his plane ticket and who he would meet are not revealed. relatives declined to speak outside the family home in the chicago working class suburb of bolingbrook. neighbors say khan lived with his parents and a brother and sister and spent time at an
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islamic center across the street. >> it's horrible, man. and it's in our backyard. it's literally in our backyard and it's bad. >> reporter: next-door neighbor steve moore says he's known the family for about two years. >> surprised. really surprised. the kid was polite. didn't expect anything like that. >> reporter: what's unclear is how the teenager was radicalized or if his family knew what he was planning. the criminal complaint mentions pro-isis writings and drawings found in common areas of the house, suggesting his views may have been known to members of his family. khan made an official appearance in federal court on monday. his family members were there but had nothing to say after the hearing. khan is being held without bai he does have a detention hearing scheduled for thursday morning in chicago. ash leigh? >> ted rowlands reporting for us, thank you for that. in one respect, mohammed hamzah
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khan is a typical american teenager. that brings me to the tech part of all this with laurie segall, cnn's legal analyst paul callan who is going to be a weigh-in on the evidence that all of that tech might provide. laurie, what do we know about the digital footprint? >> i spoke to some of his friends who said he went to a predominantly muslim school. he took time off to qustudy the koran. but one thing that was interesting, one terrorism expert told me this image is overwhelmingly used by isis supporters. there are also different images -- he posted a picture that represents the schools of thought in islam -- >> are these pictures of him? >> they are. he talks about liking the chicago bulls, l.a. lakers, loves comedy shows. it's difficult to put this together. we gained access to his
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restricted facebook profile through a friend. and he said on september 2nd, isis's actions are just going to make our lives harder. so it's very difficult when you look at all this evidence to put it together. you have to think they must have pretty damning evidence against this guy that we're not necessarily seeing in this digital footprint. >> which brings me to what we're not seeing. brett larsen, everybody now knows whatever you type at some point can come back to haunt you, even if you press delete. but there are plenty of places you can go to get archived material. >> there are. when you tweet something or post something on facebook, even if you think it's just being shared with your friends, it's like standing in the middle of the town square and yelling as loud as possible. you don't know who heard you or who may have been recording it or grabbing a screen grab. >> if you delete and scrub -- >> there could still be a friend of yours who took grave concern about some of the things you were saying and thought, i'm going to start grabbing screen grabs of this stuff -- >> are there archival -- >> there are. you can look at websites.
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we have 435 billion web pages saved over time. the web makes it increasingly difficult for things you post to go away. >> that brings me to you, paul. we don't know yet what they got in that remarkable warrant that they executed and got the handwritten notes and we don't necessarily know what they've pulled from his digital past. this kid's 19. if you go back, say, five years to when he was 14, do all these things he typed online count to evidence? >> i don't think they would in this case. the law uses a test and it's called the prejudicial impact exceeding the probative value. in other words, are you going to be so prejudiced by the piece of evidence you won't get a fair trial? i think if you went back five years looking back to when he was in his early teenage years, how do we know he's not just browsing the internet?
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it doesn't prove he's involved in planning and plotting. i think that won't be allowed. when you get closer in time, within the last six months to a year, if there's a lot of digital footprint there showing a connection with isis, most definitely that will be admissible as circumstantial evidence that he was going to join that group. >> we still have a lot to find out. but that's very helpful. thank you all three. stick around, if you would, because there is another story, the bigger picture of the war against isis. fierce battles for control of the syrian town of kobani. while american and coalition planes continue to strike from the air. exactly what is the state of this battle? how much is this costing americans? and for all the money spent, are they really making much of a dent into this whole thing? we'll break it down ahead. [ julie ] the wrinkle cream graveyard.
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despite five overnight u.s.-led air strikes around kobani, isis fighters appear close to capturing the town. it seems like a head-scratcher. a total of 13 strikes launched overnight in iraq and syria, the battle for kobani, make no mistake, this has been a bloody one. hundreds of fighters and civilians have been killed in several weeks of battle. in the meantime, a hospital in northern iraq received the bodies of 29 suspected isis militants last night. most of the dead were killed in the u.s.-led air strikes. so that's a short snapshot of just the recent activity. president obama, however, is facing some blistering criticism
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and it's coming from a former member of his cabinet. all about how he's handled the war against isis. it's leon panetta, obama's own former defense secretary, he's hammering his old boss from everything on isis to not arming the syrian rebels soon enough. panetta sat down with gloria borger and he told her that the president shouldn't have taken sending the ground troops to fight isis off of the table. >> i take the position that when you're commander in chief that you really ought to keep all options on the table to be able to have the flexibility to do what is necessary in order to defeat the enemy. but to make those air strikes work, to be able to do what you have to do, you don't just send planes in and drop bombs. you've got to have targets. you have to know what you're going after. to do that, you do need people on the ground. >> coming up at 1:00 eastern time, wolf blitzer is going to
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have gloria borger's entire interview with the former secretary of defense, leon panetta. it's important to remember, these air strikes, they're not helping the extremists' cause by any many. in fact, they're inflicting a lot of damage. let's take a look at what the u.s. air strikes in syria and iraq have actually accomplished and how much of it -- maybe this is the bigger question -- all of it has cost so far for americans. the total cost for the u.s. portion of the involvement according to central command is $62 million. total number of air strikes so far, 266 in iraq, 95 in syria. type of weapons that have been used so far, 36 surface-to-air missiles, 102 laser-guided bombs and 47 tomahawk missiles. want to see what all those munitions got us? here are examples of the type of
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targets against isis that the u.s. is going after and what's actually been inflicted. on october 5th, air strikes destroyed one bulldozer, two tanks and six firing positions northwest of al mayadin, syria. on september 26th, destroyed one tank, three armed vehicles, one humvee, four mobile oil refineries, and one command center. while that settles in, joining me to talk about what the air strikes have actually accomplished and whether this coalition is actually on target, pardon the pun, is our global affairs analyst, colonel james reese. when i look at those, it kind of looks like pinpricks. but i'm not you and you know a lot more about this than i do. $62 million is not that much in the grand scheme of things. but there's a lot of other
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countries doing a lot of work, too. is this a good count of targets destroyed? >> i don't know if count is the best word. other countries are doing good things. what ewe got is the centcom's roll-up. nobody knows what abu dhabi or saudi arabia or others are doing. that's number one. just like the spokesman from the pentagon said this morning, we are making some damage. remember we talked about when we started this thing, we want to degrade in syria, we have to prep for a counteroffensive in iraq. >> so clearly isis can't just march along with great, big columns of fires and tanks and vehicles, et cetera. so that part has been disrupted. but that would also tell me as the lay guy that their ability to take towns is disrupted as well. and we're looking at black flags
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flying over kobani. how are they doing this if they're being disrupted? >> remember, unfortunately in the -- twitter is killing it on kobani right now. kobani's never really been a target for any of the coalition to protect. it's a shame. the kurds are there. they're fighting hard. we're giving them weapons to get in there. but it never was a targeted area to stop. >> so are these guys -- everyone says they're fierce and other people say, yeah, they're fierce but they're not ten feet tall. but are they clever like foxes? have they adapted their fighting strategies knowing there's a lot of power coming from the air? are they doing something different that we don't know about? >> no. one of the things they do very well is they camouflage, they now have changed their tactics. they're going in with the populace. this is a large sunni build-up. they have a lot of sunnis that are helping them. >> what might be distressing to a lot of people is that leon
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panetta also said, brace yourself -- these are my words, but brace yourself effectively for a 30-year war. does that make sense to you? >> how many years has it been already since 2001? add another 20 on top of that, there's 33. >> settle in for the long haul. >> absolutely. >> colonel, always good to see you. where does isis get all the money to arm those fighters to do their new tactics and get their weapons and machinery, et cetera, and all of their soldiers they pay? we'll follow that money trail and show you how that terror group regularly takes in millions of dollars up next. you know.... there's a more enjoyable way to get your fiber. try phillips fiber good gummies. they're delicious and an excellent source of fiber to help support regularity. mmmm. these are good! the tasty side of fiber. from phillips
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by now you may know that isis got where it is through epic displays of outrageous evil. but it takes a whole lot more than just evil to conquer armies and take over cities. it takes money, a whole lot of money. and isis has that to spare. cnn's senior investigative correspondent drew griffin takes us to the sources of the group's financial lifeline. >> reporter: this is the southernmost edge of turkey, just across those hills is the border with syria. in the area where extremist islamic rebels, known as isis, are fighting to create an islamic caliphate or islamic state. it is also in areas like villages like this where isis makes its money to finance its wars. small oil-smuggling operations, some estimate adding up to
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millions of barrels in the last few months have been uncovered. the oil comes from refineries isis has taken inside iraq and syria, up until just last week, it was easy to smuggle into this part of turkey. why? smuggled, cheap oil is a much-prized commodity here and it doesn't matter who's selling it. even if it's your enemy. buy gas at any station just across the border here in turkey and you'll see why it's so easy to overlook who is selling what. gas here costs roughly $7.50 a gallon. u.s. coalition forces just in the past week have destroyed, attacked and bombed isis oil facilities precisely to cut off the group's funding. but if you think just knocking out isis's oil will stop this radical islamic army, you don't understand just how many ways isis funds itself. >> we've described this as the best-financed group we've ever
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seen. >> reporter: matthew leavette says isis is different than any other traditional terrorist group and is funded like no other. yes, there is oil. yes, there are charitable donations from wealthy sympathize sympathizers. but isis funds itself mostly from within, born among the crooks and thugs of iraq, it is at its roots a criminal enterprise. >> they were always primarily financed through domestic criminal activity within the borders of iraq. >> reporter: it's massive organized crime run amuck with no cops. >> exactly. >> reporter: want to do business in isis-controlled territory? you pay a tax. want to move a truck down a highway? you pay a toll. villagers in isis territory pay for just about everything. >> there are reports that people in mosul who want to take money out of their own bank accounts need to make a not-so-voluntary
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donation to the islamic state. >> they're taxing the people. >> reporter: the executive director of the syrian emergency task force in washington, d.c. says isis literally formed in the void made by the pullout of u.s. troops and the retreating iraqi army. that kind of self-financing mob, he says, can't be destroyed from air strikes. you need to take back the territory and restore order. fighters willing to do that are frustrated that the u.s., so far, won't help them. it's a white house decision. >> it is. and it always has been. and i think the white house is slowly moving in the right direction. i can tell you the policy the white house has right now, if it had this policy three years ago, there would have never been an isis. we probably would have gotten rid of assad. >> reporter: u.s.-led coalition air strikes have now begun targeting isis locations attacking the oil facilities and even grain silos.
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but as long as isis controls any ground where civilians can be taxed, extorted and robbed, isis will remain self-financed. >> drew griffin joining me live now from cnn center. drew, does anybody know how much isis actually makes in one day and how much isis actually needs to operate? >> reporter: if i was to be perfectly honest with you, i would say the answer is no. this is a criminal enterprise, ashleigh. u.s. treasury tries to track this. they believe it's about $1 million a day coming in. but when you start asking the follow-up questions, they really don't have a clue. and that's because so much of this is built on crimes, thuggery, taking over of property that they don't really have a handle on it because as you said in your previous conversations about air strikes, we don't have people on the ground. we don't have the human intelligence telling us this. >> oil smuggling sometimes is also referred to as the world's oldest profession. but is this really all isis?
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>> reporter: this oil smuggling has been going on for years and years and years. being on that border with turkey, i tell you, it is extremely porous. there's a lot of small, rinky-dink operation there is. and there's so much gas coming across that you can smell smuggled gas being burned in a car. it's not all isis. isis took advantage of it while it could. and now some of those facilities has been bombed. but isis will adapt and that's what they're doing right now. >> we were just talking about that before you came on. the adaptability of this foe. drew griffin, great work. nice to see you, sir. the dallas apartment where a man who had ebola stayed, it has been cleaned up. but all at the same time while other residents, including children, were nearby. what's wrong with that picture? was that actually safe? what we found coming up. ♪ who's going to do it? who's going to make it happen? discover a new energy source.
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this news just in to cnn. the aid group, doctors without borders, says one of its staffers in sierra leone apparently has ebola. that patient is a norwegian national who apparently had flown to oslo for treatment. he or she was put in isolation on saturday. the group says after running a fever, but there are no other details being released right now. but at the same time, a hospital in spain is now monitoring three more potential cases of ebola
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after a nurse's assistant contracted the virus in spain. the hospital says it's now monitoring her husband as well. and then it's also monitoring a man with a suspected case who traveled overseas but has tested negative so far. it's monitoring a woman who was exposed to ebola but was wearing protective gear at the time. and it's keeping an eye on 22 other people who had contact with the nurse's assistant who was diagnosed after treating a spanish missionary and priest who died after they had returned to spain from west africa. and, again, unusual case because she contracted it in spain. here in the united states, the liberian man with ebola contracted in liberia and a man who traveled here is now in critical condition in dallas. thomas eric duncan has been given the experimental drug brincidofovir.
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duncan did not get this treatment until he'd already been sick for ten days. and speaking of mr. duncan, a hazmat crew has finally gone and cleaned up the dallas apartment where he had been and had been very sick before he went to the hospital. look at some of the mist as the workers spray. and what's troubling is something that we just heard yesterday. the photographer who was infected with ebola, the nbc photographer who came home, he told his dad that he might have actually been infected by spray hitting him while he was helping to clean a vehicle in which someone had died from ebola. but it is not certain how he actually got the disease. it's just that we heard that yesterday and then we see these pictures of the spray at the apartment where other people are still living. here's what gary tuchman found during the clean-up in dallas.
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>> reporter: what you are looking at is the first time in american history a hazmat team has worked an ebola clean-up scene. men dressed like astronauts who work for a texas company destroying everything in the apartment thomas eric duncan was staying in that could still have the living ebola virus. brad smith is the vice president of the company. >> anyone that could give us advice from this, we've taken it and gone a step further in our own training and taken care of it. >> reporter: this is kind of a surreal spectacle. we see the workers going in in their protective hazmat suits while parents and children wander around on the nearby balconies. look closely, you see mist being spray sprayed. and a child on the balcony who can't be far away. people from all over the world
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live in this area, very little english is spoken. lorenza has seven children and lives in the complex next door. she has no idea if it's safe for her and her family to be there. no official's told them anything. she tells me, i am scared of what's happening. it's bad because we don't know anything. we don't know if it's going to spread. i keep my kids inside the apartment. joseph thomas lives even closer. he's been told nothing either. but is resigned to fate. >> i'm believing my god. i'm trusting my god. he will protect me. i'm ready to die. >> reporter: the neighbors are all coming out on the balcony watching. your people are going in with their hazmat suits and they're wandering around 30 feet away, is that safe for them? >> i don't want to comment on that. that's not my expertise. >> reporter: that's not your job to tell people they should leave
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this apartment complex? >> no. i can't say i'd leave my family here. >> reporter: the cdc says there's virtually no risk of ebola spreading during the cleaning. ebola doesn't spread through the environment. but it's not clear which local officials would be responsible for giving the residents information and/or temporarily moving them out. a spokeswoman for the dallas county health and human services department says, we perform contact tracing, investigations and public health follow-up. we will not comment on something that is not in our purview. the spokeswoman says get in touch with the spokeswoman for dallas county but she hasn't responded to us as of yet. the work has taken over three days. and now the job is finished. the hazmat trucks start driving off to an undisclosed location. >> we have totally cleaned the apartment from the ceilings to the floors, removed everything out of the apartment, carpet, drapes, blinds. obviously put a final decon on everything just to make sure that nothing is living in there.
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so it's all been removed. >> reporter: the hazmat team is now gone. but it appears that most of the neighbors never left. gary tuchman, cnn, dallas. to ferguson, missouri, next. you have probably heard often, move along, folks, nothing to see here, especially when police don't like protesting. well, a federal judge has just weighed in on your right and those people's rights and every american's right to stay put. and not move along here. i'll explain it in just a moment. tag: sooner or later, everyone needs a helping hand,
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mattress discounters good deed dogs-- helping dogs help people. police in ferguson, missouri, told peaceful protesters to keep on walking, that they could not stand still for more than five seconds on the sidewalk, even those who were moving. they were told that they were walking too slowly at times.
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we saw it all unfold here on cnn with our own don lemon back on august 18th. here's the proof in the tape. >> we've been standing here all day -- >> let's go. come on, let's go. >> that's what's happening here. people are here and they're standing on -- you can see what's happening. >> let's go! >> they told us -- i can't move. i'm not going to resist a police officer. i'm being pushed by a police officer. this is exactly what the citizens have been dealing with. >> and that's what a lot of people were putting up with, trying to just stand in place and peacefully protest being told, nope, no standing. just yesterday, a federal judge ruled that police violated the constitution with the policy that they adopted that day and continued to enforce as recently as september the 27th. i want to bring in cnn legal analyst sunny hostin and cnn
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legal analyst paul callan, defense attorney and former prosecutor. this is almost like shooting fish in a barrel, this one. it just defied logic. where would any police officer come off thinking that you could actually do that to someone standing peacefully on a sidewalk? >> it's surprising. certainly officers are trained about constitutional rights. it's a core constitutional right, the right to peacefully assemble, certainly the right to demonstrate, the right to express yourself, freedom of speech. so the fact that this policy was implemented from up above, i think, was probably the problem. >> this was coming through roll call. they were told from the highest levels, this is the new normal. we're going to continue moving people. paul, you've heard some of these things -- five seconds. if you're standing for more than five seconds, you're in violation, could be arrested. you're walking too slowly or you can't just walk back and forth -- >> who came up with that? >> they were making it up as they went along.
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>> did they have any legal counsel? >> i don't know. but we should be clear, though. the police do have the right to tell you to move on and not stand where you are if you are interfering with a crime scene or you're obstructing an arrest or -- there are a variety of things that you can be doing that would give them the right to push you along. but where you are demonstrating and peacefully assembling, the constitution protects your rights. and it can't be restricted unless there's an overwhelming interest otherwise. >> and let's hone in on that. the judge, right on page two of this injunction, said that nothing in this preliminary injunction prevents missouri failure to disperse law or any other law, law enforcement must be able to use the full range of lawful means to control crowds, including ordering a crowd to move and disperse if law enforcement believes the crowd is assembled for the purpose of violence and rioting. but then the decision maker, the
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decider is the guy on the sidewalk. that guy who is saying, don't walk back and forth -- it becomes willy-nilly, doesn't it? >> it does. but our officers should be trained in protocol and constitutional protocol. and how to do this correctly, yes. you have to disperse if you're in a crowd that's committing a crime, a violent act. if something is going on that doesn't protect the public and can harm the public. but that is certainly not what happened here. and we know that that right, the right to assemble, the right to demonstrate -- it's so very important and goes back to -- we remember hearing it and seeing it in the civil rights movement. that sort of assembly is so very important to our people -- >> i showed up in iran with a camera and i was almost arrested. you just can't be. >> we saw don lemon being pushed back, a reporter with a big cnn microphone. i was shocked. >> if you think that's shocking, i have something for you coming
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up next. this is just in, some video that we've got -- not this video. but the video we got, two kids in the back of a car, a routine police stop for a driver and a passenger. they weren't wearing seat belts, apparently, or at least one of them wasn't. and what happened next, tasing, children screaming, crying, a family in disarray and a police department responding and saying why this happened the way it did. you'll see it all next. go ahead and put your bag right here.
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we're going to show you some video that is really disturbing. police in hammond, indiana, smashing a car window and using a taser on the front seat passenger. all of this starting out from a routine traffic stop over a seat belt. what may be a little different from some other things you may have seen, two kids were in the backseat when all of this happened. you can hear as this unfolds how traumatized they were. have a look. >> no, i'm not making it worse now. i'm scared for my life because he just pulled a gun on us. we don't have a gun. go ahead. go ahead. >> i suggest you come out. >> go ahead. >> i want to know what's going on. i just gave him my information.
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i don't know what's going on. >> right. right. listen, listen, that's what i'm trying to tell you. >> i don't know what's going on. i never got out of the vehicle from the passenger side, you know what i'm saying? >> i gave it to you. he asked the man -- he didn't have any id. >> i just gave them my information. i just gave both of them my information. y'all got my information. what do you do with that piece of paper? >> for no seat belt. if you're going to give me a ticket for no seat belt, it's right here. just give me a ticket so i can go to the hospital because the doctor called me to tell me to come in because my mom is about to pass away. all right. so he's looking for his information in his book bag. when he digs in his book bag, they pulled a gun out. what was the purpose of a gun?
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and now they're asking us -- they're asking me to open our door so i can get out. if you pull out a gun in front -- there's two kids in the backseat. they're about to mess my -- no! they're about to bust my window. >> if you do that -- i'm not the operation in this deal. >> are you going to open the door? >> oh! >> damn! >> that was crazy. >> that's horrible. are you recording this? >> i am. >> this is terrible.
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>> take it off! >> this is crazy. >> take it off now! i told y'all, my kids are in the car. what would y'all do -- >> this is crazy. they busted out the car window and everything. >> that is just so disturbing on so many levels. i want to bring in cnn's national correspondent susan candiotti, paul callan and sunny hostin are still here as well. fill us in on the backstory. >> this happened september 24th,
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hammond, indiana, south side, chicago, illinois. in the car, a mother, her two children in the back, 7-year-old girl, 14-year-old son. >> little 7-year-old girl. >> that's right. 14-year-old son. he's the one filming this from the backseat. there's an adult passenger male, that's the man that you can see sitting in the passenger side. they're stopped, as you heard, for not wearing seat belts. the issue arises when they're asking him to get out of the car and he won't do it, the police say. they wanted some identification. he didn't have an id with him and they're sorting around looking for -- he's looking for some other id. this goes on, police say, for at least 13 minutes. ultimately, you see a police officer come up -- back-ups are called. in the meantime, the driver, the mother, is on the phone with 911. that's who you hear her talking to to say, what's going on? when he refuses to get out, you
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finally see another officer approach with that ax crashing the window -- smashing that window. that's when you hear the children react as they do. and they tase him and finally get him out of the car. these people have now filed a lawsuit against the police department saying -- alleging excessive force, using the taser. they were assaulted by the police officers. police officers say, we saw him moving for something and there could have been danger involved so we had to get in there. >> they made a statement. i want to get our lawyers' takes on it. the statement from the police department. >> it reads in part, police officers who make legal traffic stops are allowed to ask passengers inside of a stopped vehicle for identification and to request that they exit a stopped vehicle for the officers' safety without a requirement of reasonable suspicion. >> paul, is that going to be enough when they're looking at a lawsuit for what happened?
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>> well, it functions on two levels. reasonable human being and legal. the cops screwed up here. come on. there are kids in the backseat -- >> a 7-year-old. >> they should have handled it differently. but the law, i think, will back them. and you have to understand that -- >> back them, the family? >> you have an obligation to produce identification -- >> the family or the officers? >> the law will back the cops. they have the right to ask you to get out of the vehicle, show identification. cops get killed every day, about 50 a year get killed in incidents like this. >> i have been told as a single female driving on a road that if i see someone trying to pull me over, i have the right to continue to a populated area because if i am in fear, i don't have to stop on a road in the dark. is this the same kind of fear? these people were afraid? >> of course they were afraid. i have to tell you, i'm so upset -- i think paul is correct. but this is the hazard of being a black person in the united states today. there's a family in a car and
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they are completely complying. you see that she has called 911. he isn't even driving the vehicle. he has provided several pieces of paper. this family was -- of identification. this family was tortured for over 13 minutes. those children were traumatized and guess what? the law as it stands right now, probably protects the police officers' actions. as a woman of color, i don't know what to do because this could happen to me. this could happen to my child. this could happen to my father. this could happen to my husband. what do we do about the inherent racism that we're seeing over and over and over again in these united states during this traffic stop? >> there's no evidence that this is a race -- >> give me a break, paul if this was a white family, this wouldn't have happened. >> you have no idea. it's wrong. it shouldn't have happened. but to turn everything into a racial issue.
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that's incorrect. >> this is. >> the cops can ask you for id and ask you to get out of the car. >> if you were with your family in this car, this would not have happened. >> the advice i give my kids, don't get into an argument with a cop, you're not going to win. >> you both have a lot of merit in what you've said. this could be one of those things where you see people taking to the streets out of the frustration that sunny has mentioned. thanks, guys. appreciate you all for watching. wolf starts right after this break.
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will that be all, sir? thank you. ordering chinese food is a very predictable experience. i order b14. i get b14. no surprises. buying business internet, on the other hand, can be a roller coaster white knuckle thrill ride. you're promised one speed. but do you consistently get it? you do with comcast business. and often even more. it's reliable. just like kung pao fish. thank you, ping. reliably fast internet starts at $89.95 a month. comcast business. built for business. hello. i'm wolf blitzer. it's 1:00 p.m. in washington. 6:00 p.m. in london. 8:00 p.m. in damascus. 1:00 a.m. in hong kong. wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us. we begin with a possible terror plot now disrupted

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