tv Legal View With Ashleigh Banfield CNN October 27, 2014 9:00am-10:01am PDT
been spread is far broader than anyone showing symptoms and it says we should be afraid of arks symptomatic people that went there. >> this is the debate happening right now. it will continue. >> it certainly will. >> "legal view" with ashley banfield starts right now. hello, everyone. well come to "legal view." we begin this hour with this breaking news. cnn learning that the joint chiefs of staff now considering mandatory quarantines for all u.s. troops returning from west africa. and the fear, you guessed it, ebola. and our pentagon concerned barbara starr joins me with the details. perhaps not as surprising or as difficult as the other kwoorn teens we've been talking about. give me the rundown. >> the administration is trying to get away from mandatory
quarantines, it looks like the u.s. army and pentagon is moving in that direction. here's what we know. today an army two star major general darrell williams who headed up the ebola effort in west africa is back in italy with about a dozen of his team. when they landed they went into what the pentagon is calling enhanced monitoring, what the rest of us might think of as quarantine. they are in a separate building on their military base in italy. you see general williams there. for the last 30 cadays, this is guy who went all over liberia, saw everything. he's been out and about. they are now in this building for the next 21 days. they'll have their temperature taken twice a day. they are not allowed to go home. they're not likely too see their family for 2 is days. none of them have symptoms, we
are told. they're a symptomatic for ebola. but the army doing this as an abundance of caution. several dozen more troops expected to land back in italy later today and we're getting into a period of a constant rotation of troops going in and coming back out. so what is on the table? well, defense secretary chuck hagel has to decide whether or not he wants to institute mandatory quarantine, 21 damon toring behind closed doors for all military personnel coming back. there are a couple of issues here. countries like italy where these cou troops are going bab, spain and italy, those nations very sensitive about it. they have a lot of concerns. but u.s. military families obviously very worried. and at the end of the day it could total 4,000 u.s. troops going to west africa and the decision has to be made, do they
all go into a mandatory quarantine. >> interesting. thank you for that. and we're of course finding out a whole lot more about developments today in the ebola frant. we could actually find out anytime now whether that disease has struck a five-year-old boy in new york. the child was rushed to new york's bellevue hospital last night. the symptoms were alarming. the travel history included ebola ravaged west africa nation of new guinea. i had so many questions when i heard about a five-year-old. for instance, you cannot just put a five-year-old in a tent alone >> he's with his mom. >> how is she safe? >> it's unclear what precautions would need to be taken because she's already been exposed to him. we don't know how they're protecting them from each other but i imagine they're treating him as if he has ebola while they test him because they don't
know if he has ebola. gentlemen, he was in guinea, but we need tomorrow, was he exposed. your child has had 103 degree temperatures before. it could be a sign of a whole bunch of things. >> i really don't understand when i'm sure a lot of people don't understand, including the medical community, but for children, there they vastly more susceptible to the adults who have shown great success in their treatment? >> i think what we've learned is that whatever we know about children in africa will not necessarily apply here. in africa there's a 70% mortally rate. in the united states we've had seven people with ebola and only one death. >> but not a good sampling unfortunately. >> that's a very small number. but i think what we've learned is how you treat ebola matters. that its not necessarily deadly.
>> and the other issue with a five-year-old is that, i mean, we all know that five-year-olds are like petri dishes and wherever that child has been in the home there is without doubt some kind of mark that has been left, some kind of bodily flund, the cups, saucers, table surfaces. >> i think if they get a positive ebola test from this, they're going to -- obviously they're going to be sure to clean, clean, clean. you wonder where was this child besides home. did the child go straight from guinea to home to the hospital? >> i'm sure that you knew that mayor de blasio here in new york city held an impromptu news conference and he stated that the mother of the five-year-old is being treated in a like man are, i'm assuming similar type of quarantine measures, she
shows no symptoms or signs. but at the same time i couldn't get over being a mom myself, when you have a child that age that is sick, if you tent up in one of those space suits, that child is going to be terrified. >> oftentimes the patient is the one in the suit. there was some video from nina pham when she was treated in dallas and it was the caretakers, the doctors and nurses in suits, not the patient. so it is possible that the little boy and the mother are not in suits but everyone that comes in contact with them is in a suit. >> i've got some news coming. i'm not sure if it's significant or not. but with so little that we know. this family of the five-year-old apparently just go into jfk sad night at 9:00 p.m. and apparently they had spent an entire month in guinea. so plenty of room for exposure in a country of -- it's right up there with all three e of those
really severe. and that his latest temperature is 102. >> he had plenty of time to be exposed to ebola, malaria and other things like typhoid fever. we don't want to say this is ebola because we just don't know. a fever can be a sign of so many other things. >> i think of that little child and being in a circumstance and what the mother is going through as well, if they're trying to separate with her any kind of barrier, be it clothing were anything, how difficult that would be. >> and how scared it must be. >> it's just awful. we pray for this family and we pray it's not ebola. >> do we ever. keep us updated. the other thing is that the nurse who was absolutely furious about a forced quarantine in new jersey all ebola based, all all of the suz sudden now she's not
so forced in quarantine, she's being discharged. her attorney is going to join me live in the studio with the very latest after this break. they work just as fast and are proven to taste better than tums smoothies assorted fruit. mmm... amazing. yeah, i get that a lot. alka seltzer heartburn reliefchews. enjoy the relief.
a nurse from maine who claimed that being forced into quarantine in new jersey violated her basic human rights is now headed home. casey hickox landed in newark on friday after weeking of treating ebola patients in west africa. airport health screeners determined that she had a fever. though that seems to have been a faulty reading, off she went to an isolation tent. two ebola tests were negative and at the hospital her
temperature never rose above anything than normal. her frustration level was something different and it lead led to be a public back and forth with the new jersey governor chris christie. they've announced that ms. hickox is free to go but not just anywhere. she'll apparently be flown by charter plane to her home state which will then decide if she'll been quarantined or monitored or neither. yesterday she spoke by phone to cnn exclusively. here's a little of what she had to say >> when i arrived at the airport in newark, i of course presented by paperwork to the immigration official and told him i had been in sierra leone. i verbally described it myself as well as writing it in the documentation. and he said okay, they'll have a
couple of questions. there were many people that then asked me questions. no one seems to be leading or coordinating the effort. a lot of the questions were repetitive. and as an ep deemologist i was surprised that i saw people writing in the margins of their paperwork which shows they weren't prepared to capture all of the information they needed. they took my blood and it was negative. and i know there have been reports of me having a fever in the airport, but i truly believe that was an instrument error. they were using the forehead scanner and i was obviously disstressed and a bit upset so my cheeks were flushed. there had been some evidence that that machine is not accurate in these kinds of situations. so when i arrived in the isolation unit they took my temperature orally and it was completely normal. the first thing i would say to
governor christie is that i wish that he would be more careful about his statements related to my medical condition. i am not, as he said, quote unquote, obviously ill. i am completely healthy and with no symptoms. and if he knew anything about ebola, he would know that a symptomatic people are not infectious. i understand that people feel hi like they have a risk and i think we can have a conversation about what further measures might look like. but i think this is an extreme that is really unacceptable and i feel like my basic human rights have been violated. and i hope that he will also consider me. >> well clearly new jersey officials have now considered casey hickox. she did have a plan b if they refused to lift the quarantine and steve highman is part of
that quarantine, u casey's lawyer. you were going to take this to court. what was the basis? what were you looking for? a hearing or much beyond that? >> no, she should be released. the issue is that she is being kept in detention to be call it what you will, isolation, and it's against her will. there is no medical reason for it. there is no reason, health reason for her to be kept in isolation. and we were prepared to go to court to file a hab yous and get her released. >> but you know full well as a lawyer that there is vast discretion given to public health officials if there is concern. doesn't that have merit on its own? >> will is no health care professional that i've heard or seen that has said in any way that caskaci hick cox is a thre
>> those two nurses in dallas who contracted ebola, before they began to show the symptoms, the same was said about them. they do not pose a threat, they do not need to go into quarantine. low lo and behold a domino effect. >> they haven't infected anybody else. >> thank god for that. >> the disease, as i understand it. i'm not a doctor. i'm a lawyer. i look at what are the basic civil rights and human rights of individuals as well as their medical conditions as it relates to that. she -- these individuals who contracted it contracted and exhibit symptoms. if a symptom is exhibited, they then go to a hospital and get treated, as we saw in dallas. and it's unfortunate that they had any contact.
but kaci has had no symptoms. she's not a threat or a danger to anybody. >> i'm not a doctor and i'm not a lawyer but i am a journalist. and i heard you say the words that are key in this whole discussion across america. as i understand it. the truth is, lawyers, doctors, public health officials, even the president, nobody understands exactly how you get sick. >> that's not entirely true. people understand the nature of the disease. you can ask kaci and she's explain it to you in detail. >> then nurses who wear full protection get sick and die. >> no, they didn't have full protection, as i understand it, they were exposed. >> i'm just playing the devil's advocate here. but the truth is the governor of new jersey did not know exactly what kaci was wearing for those weeks that she was treating people who were dying of this disease. >> she is not a medical threat and we're prepared to go to a
hearing and have doctors testify and ep deemologists testify that this she is not a threat and there is no basis to keeper. >> today in. >> that's the only way to do it. >> do you agree -- you have to be honest with me here. do you agree there could be a potential -- that kaci could get sick within the 21-day period just like so many others wfr her? >> i don't know about so many others. >> there are been many health care workers who have been sick. >> there's a possibility. >> isn't that what the governor is worried about, that possibility? >> no. the governor is worried for -- i can't speak to what the governor is worried about. they're saying this is the wrong policy. one thing we have to take into account ask that kaci did a
noble and he roic thing and we're treating her like a prisoner. >> i agree with you on the conditions under which she was held. it looked like a jail, no shower, no television, no reading materials. i was crazy. >> any place her put her against her will when she is not ill because you fear her is wrong. >> i think there's room to disagree at this early stage. but vi to cut it there. >> that's good. >> thank you for coming in. i appreciate it. steve hyman, thank you. we're covering a lot of rules on this. the quarantine rules caused fear and confusion and now frustration. next an attorney who helped one state actually write the quarantine law to make them tougher. his take next.
white house officials are urging states to inact ebola quarantine policies based on science, not based on fear. and they're expressing concerns about medical workers being deterred from going to ebola hot zones to help out if they know that they're going to face three weeks of confinement when they get back stateside. and cdc director tom freidman said the ebola crisis will not stop unless people like to people go over and help to beat it. there have been a lot of back and forth about who to quarantine health care workers who are returning from ebola ravaged africa or rely on their ability to self monitor their own symptoms. it is a tough call. this morning chris cuomo talked
with e an ebola survivor about what he thinks is the best approach to protecting the public without deterring the volunteers from wanting to go overseas to fight ebola in the first place. >> you know there are questions about this self monitoring, can we trust people to do it. will they be really that aware? maybe we should take a further step because you don't know when you're getting it, 21 days, 40 days. there seems to be so many variables. is there a middle ground? >> please don't say 40 days. there's no data to suggest a 40-day window. >> but you know somebody came out with a study and said that 21 days is from the 1970s and now it could be longer from that. that's where the number comes from. >> that was based on mathematical modelling and not on clinical data. they don't have cases that came out 40 days later.
it was mathematical model they were using on their computer. >> here to discuss the legal implications of being legal quarantined and just what the governor can and can't do, legal analyst paul cannon along with stephen can noly who wroets virginia quarantine laws. so i'd like to ask you about that, strooeeve, about what you think the law says about those health care workers who return from the ebola areas who has have been in contact with the patients, who might pose a risk here. where are we with the law and is it good enough? >> it's nice to be with you today. one of the challenges with this particular outbreak is that the laws are very different. every state has its own
quarantine laws and isolation laws. the states under the constitution have the authority toen force public health. so you have a patch work of laws that vary from state to state. wi there's not a consistent federal law that governs here. >> aren't there the rules of the constitution that start take ling up what the states have put in place? >> under the constitution the states have the authority, over public health. the federal government certainly has authority for international airports and shipping ports and the cdc has quarantine stations in those airports. but this is a jurisdiction turf battle unfortunately between the federal and the state government. and generally the state government would be the one responsible for enforcing quarantine laws or isolation. and there's a difference as you probably know. we quarantine folmentes who have
been exposed but are not yet infected. we isolate folks who are infected. the goal here, quarantine has been around for hundreds of years. the goal is to keep people who have been exposed who may or may not be sick from infecting other people. so there's a sound basis for quarantine medically but there's a lot of debate over what new york and new jersey did was appropriate. >> i want to bring in paul callan into the discussion. he's done a lot of research on the latitude that officials are given when it comes to the potential for protecting others from this kind of problem. but nobody really knows where that trigger is. nobody really knows when the state official or the local official gets all of that power. how thick do you got to be? how threatening do you got to be? what is it? >> i think it's an example of the judges and the lawyers being
careful to leave certain things to the doctors and the public health officials and sort of fighting an epidemic and a communicable disease and infectious disease is a moving target. the judges aren't going to jump in right away and say this is ridiculous, making this poor nurse stay in quarantine for 21 days. now what's the trigger point. you got to go back really -- they don't use it very much. you got to go back to world war ii the last time it's been effectively used in the united states. and we have become a lot more due process or jebted saying that the courts have a right to look at every situation when an emergency citizen gets locked up. but in this case if a local court or even if you got it into federal court looked at it, they would be saying, is there any medical reasonableness to what's going on and how do you weigh that against the threat of the
disease. here we're told that ebola is 50% to 70% fatal if you get it. that's a huge threat of death if that disease spreads as against 21 days in quarantine. that's a minor liberty. >> it's awful for the health care worker, who was, as she said, cdebrooifd of her liberty. but. >> but steve gravely, it's true, it's 70% lethal in africa. we can't give you the statistics because it's so new in this country. but it's real lethal. shouldn't be trigger point just be -- devil's advocate here, why risk it? >> i think that's a great question. so with pandemic inflew when za or sars, those are much more easily transmittable than we think ebola is. but you're right, ebola is often fatal.
but i think we have to go back to the science, and that is based on what we know today -- and i affirmed this morning with some colleagues in public health -- that unless you have a fever with ebola, you are not infectious and once you have a fever you are. that's an important distinction that we can't lose site of. when we taught after mass quarantines, we're going to impact the civil liberties of people who are not a threat. maybe that's the right decision in order to protect the public. i think that's a complicated question. but we need to not lose site of the science. and i think governor christie recognized that based on the fact that the nurse did not skpibt a fever of several days of monitoring, she's now being released. to me that's public health doing what it should do. >> i think people have to remember too, that when she first came into the united
states, they did a test -- they touch the tissue on her forehead -- >> i don't think they actually made contact. >> but they concluded that she had a fever. now she said she was only flush and that was sort of a bad reading. but there was a basis for them to say -- to be worried about her at least initially. >> thank you for your insights. just invaluable at this time when there ooh so many questions left unanswered. not to be forgotten in all of this is that there are a lot of people dying from this disease and the loss is de stating. just last night on cbs's '60 minutes" thomas eric duncan's nurses at the hospital in dallas told the heart wrenching story of duncan's last minutes alive. >> and i grabbed a tissue and i wiped his eyes and i said, you're going to be okay. you just get the rest that you need. let us do the rest for you.
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sfloo this morning i'm sure aare the of you woke up to the news that another girl has died after friday's school shooting in marysville high school. how does a homecoming prince popular with all of the kids just seemingly snap. this is video of jalen fryberg taken just a few weeks ago. dan simon take as look at signs of a troubled teenager. >> a second victim, gia soriano died after a shooting at the high school. her family devastated he leasing this statement. >> gia is our beautiful daughter and words cannot express how much we'll misper. >> this just hours after
hundreds packing the bleachers of the gymnasium. >> families are hurkt really bad right now looking for answers. answers that might not exist for us. >> many still asking why this popular teenager would want to target his best friends and his own family. it was friday morning when freshman jalen fryberg entered the cafeteria, walked up to a table where his two cousins were sitting with friends and opened fire. >> he came up from behind and fired six bullets into the backs of them. >> three others remain hospitalized in intensive care. the first victim now identified as zoe galasso. >> she was so beautiful and so funny and amazing and we all
loved her so much. tea teacher has been hailed as a hero. >> he grabbed his arm, happened like in seconds. >> moments later, fryberg is dead of an apparent suicide. exact hi why all this happened is still unclear. they're saying that she targeted the group after husband he was spurned by a love interest. a friend of zoe galasso saying that she was dating a jalen fryberg's cousin. >> he snapped for whatever reason. >> fryberg was a well-liked student but on twitter, a darker personali personality. i know it seems like i'm swaeth it off but i'm not and i never will be able to. one day before the attack, it
won't last. it will never last. >> and our thank to dan simon for that report. and now to the fight against isis. a former soldier in the united states from wisconsin has decided to get back in the fight. but not by reenlisting. instead, just going to the front lines in syria, just going. his story of what i hedy sided to pick up and go to syria for this fight and what it's been like to take on isis fighters and we'll tell you this story from where he's fighting next. , then you don't know "aarp." life reimagined gives you tools and support to get the career you'll love. find more real possibilities at aarp.org/possibilities. to get thebig day?you'll love. ah, the usual. moved some new cars. hauled a bunch of steel. kept the supermarket shelves stocked.
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mercenariries or fighters from several countries joining the battle to defeat isis militants and they come in all shapes and sizes, it turns out, several big tough guides who belong to a motorcycle club in the netherlands. they're not the only ones leaving home to fight abroad against isis. an american army veteran who heard enough about isis militants has now decided to do something about it, too, all on his own. he left his wisconsin home and is now fighting side by side with the kurdish forces in syria to destroy isis militant. cnn's ivan watson caught up with him and has more on the story. >> armed men are a common site near in syria, a country embroiled in a vicious civil war. but one of the gunmen in this truck is not like the others. >> how do people react to you
when they see you and realize that you're from the u.s.? >> they ask me if i'll come over for dinner and stay the night at their house. >> he's a 28-year-old army soldier from wisconsin. for the last month he's also been a volunteer fight near the kurdish malitia known as the ypg >> i got in contact with the ypg on facebook and soul searched, is this what i want to do, and then decided to do it. >> soon after arriving here in syria. said he wound up in a battle against isis. >> the second day in i got hit by a mortar in a fight. >> while recovering from shrapnel wounds, he went to work online recruiting more foreigners to help in the fight against isis.
now he list in places like this former restaurant converted into a malitia camp. what are the pictures? >> these are all men who have died fighting against isis. >> the ypg or very lightly armed guerrillas. >> this is a vest to carry ammunition. >> people are running into battle without any armor? >> yes. >> and wearing sneakers half the time. >> yes. >> u.s. law enforcement officials say it's illegal for an american to join a syrian malitia but matson says being here, fighting isis alongside the kurds in a dream come true. >> all mu life i wanted to be a soldier, i guess, growing up. and i'm at peace being here. >> ivan watson doing great work for us. he's been in northern iraq for
quite some time. by the way, iep watching the clock because the white house briefing is expected to get underway at any moment. we don't always go live to it but there's a lot going on here with the ebola cases here in the u.s. so we're going to bring it to you live just as soon as it gets under way. quick break. back after this. a woman who loves to share her passions. grandma! mary has atrial fibrillation, an irregular heartbeat not caused by a heart valve problem. that puts her at a greater risk of stroke. rome? sure! before xarelto®, mary took warfarin,
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white house briefing room. why the daily briefing live on television today? there seems to be a lot of movement, a lot of questions yet to be answered about just where we stand with the possibility of quarantining in this country, not only those who might be returning from active duty, which is now a big issue. the pentagon suggesting this is in the works, a possible quarantine for troops who are working in the active ebola zones, provide care and comfort and logistics in those zones. but also the notion that, you know, the new york and new jersey governors have taken a lot of heat over the last 24 hours regarding the quarantining policies in place for the health care workers returning. people who have given selflessly of themselves to help get the crisis under control so that the rest of the world can survive the epidemic, then suffering themselves when they come back. the latest case kaci hickox.
the news has come today that she has been released with a little less than three days. international fears growing over the ability of isis to recrete jihadists abroad and inspire the lone terror attacks at home. big questions now, what do you do with the recruits? what do you do with them when they come home from training and have been fighting alongside the militants. one european country has come up with what they'll calling a deradicalization plan. it lets the jihadi fighters come home without facing any jail time. so what exactly do they do? >> there are an estimated 100 danish fighters in syria. that is a lot far small country. denmark has the highest rate of the jihadi fighters and it faces
a dilemma, what to do with these fighters when they come home. this man recently returned. his parents thought he was help pg at a refugee camps. >> nobody has ever talked about getting back to planning, to bomb these countries. >> omar is one of 16 known fighter to return. on arrival he did an unradical thing. he contacted the danish police program for returning fighters voluntari voluntarily. >> were you nervous about coming back home to denmark. >> i wasn't that nervous because i knew that i didn't do any kind of criminal act or something like that. >> here's how the program works. any returning fighter is eligible for getting a job, a hus, and education and psychological counseling, just like any other danish citizen but they must be screened by police. anyone found to have committed a crime will be put through the
courts and possibly prison. their information is also passed to danish intelligence. >> this is not a gift shop. you have to be motivated. you have to really want to become a part of the danish society. we help them find a way through the system. and what we've seen is that out of the 16 who have returned, ten of them are now back in school, have a job and it seems to us that their focus is on something else than in syria. >> police here say it is a danish solution that's not that special, simply a crime prevention program with a focus on jihadis and it's volunteer. omar is one of those who decided he didn't need the help but he has friends in the program. >> they didn't help people by arresting them. >> the program does not try to change the fundamentalist believes of the returners as
long as they do not advocate violence. >> they are still muslim believers perhaps in a way that we'd call radical but not to an extent, as far as we can see, that they're a threat to the society. >> he says he might return to syria. >> young people have a lot of feelings. so you know, if you're going to be humble towards the fighters, they will be humble to us too. if you're going to be harsh towards them, they're going to be harsh towards you. >> what advice do you have for somebody who wants to come from syria back home? >> i will tell them they have nothing to fear. >> does it work? it's too soon to know but police say the alternative would be fighters that return and simply disappear. this program is designed to help while also keeping a close watch. couple of other top stories
we're checking and covering. the prosecution announcing today that it has plans to appeal the judgment and sentence on oscar pistorius. the olympian was sentenced last week to five years in prison after a judge found him guilty of culpable homicide in the shooting of his girlfriend reeva steenkamp. they're seeking the death penalty for the captain of the sea wolf ferry. they want life in prison for three other kru members and 30 years in prison for the woman at the helm of the ship when it began to sink. last april, 294 people died, including hundreds of high school students who were on a field trip and today there are still ten bodies that have yet to be found. university virginia students have set up this memorial for hannah graham with a chalk board where students can write messages. she disappeared september 13th and her remains for found just a couple of weeks ago. on friday, the start of
homecoming weekend, the sad news came, hannah's remains were identified. prosecutors have charged jesse matthew in her abduction and now they're determining what other charges mr. matthew could face related to that story. an active lava flow on hawaii big island is gang some speed and making people nervous. because it's getting close tore a residential neighborhood. and people living there may actually have to leave their homes in the coming days or perhaps even coming hours with the smokey conditions. authorities are also advising people with respiratory problems that they need to stay indoors. quick reminder to you as well abat 12:56 eastern time we're watching the clock on the white house because we're expecting a live press briefing and the person who is going to pick that up is wolf, my colleague, who starts right after this quick break.
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happening now, she's getting out twb nurse kaci hickox said her basic rights were violated when she was quarantined against her will. but after a heated war of words, the nurse who has been tested ebola free is being released. from a wisconsin food packing company to fighting on the front lines against isis, you're going toee