tv CNN Newsroom With Carol Costello CNN February 11, 2016 6:00am-8:01am PST
to somebody else though that's for sure. >> glass house and all that. whew hoo hoo. all right i guess that is it for us. >> time for the newsroom with carol "cookies and milk." >> i don't even know what that means. >> it's positive. you can skip over it by the way. >> newsroom starts now. happening now in the "newsroom," the first match up after the new hampshire takedown. bernie sanders on fire and tonight face to face with hillary clinton. will she unleash a new strategy? and no pressure in south carolina? >> now it's up to south carolina to pick a president. >> but can donald trump's rivals convince voters who the billionaire shouldn't be. >> can you imagine donald trump as president of the united states? we'll be worse off. >> the hard thing is he doesn't
have any policy positions. >> and 125 miles per hour winds, huge waves. the nightmare finally over for thousands of vacationers. but the storm just beginning for the cruz company. >> that guy should be thrown in jail right now. thrown in jail. >> let's talk. live in the cnn "newsroom." >> and good morning, i'm carol costello. thank you so much for joique me. we are now 12 hours away from what could be the most important democratic debate yet. hillary clinton considered the shoe in months ago now scrambling to regain momentum. both facing off for the first time since the primary there and both ramping up their efforts to win african american support. in just a couple of hours clinton will receive a key endorsement from the political arm of the congressional black caucus and sanders ramping up his efforts to court african american leaders as the first
primary soft the south looms next week. first let's focus on the debate. cnn's brianna keeler live in milwaukee this morning. good morningment. >> reporter: good morning. right now the narrative is that hillary clinton lost the new hampshire primary and bernie sanders is really soaring high on the victory there. so the goal for hillary clinton is to turn around that narrative and the goal for bernie sanders is to keep it going with momentum going into the nevada caucuses and the south carolina primary. we'll see them debate tonight. we expect bernie sanders to be pressing his economic message as he has on what's really been a bit of a whirlwind tour. hillary clinton has been painting bernie sanders' proposals for medicare for all, for free public college as
unrealistic. but i think we're also expecting that she's going to focus a little more on issues that are tailored towards african american voters and hispanic voters as she looks to key constituencies into the south carolina and nevada. tonight you will see in the pbs news hour democratic presidential debate, the sixth time hillary clinton and bernie sanders have faced off. this is going to take 95 minutes where they meet and debate here at the university of wisconsin. milwaukee. they will have a couple of quick breaks. but they are really going to be battling this out trying to keep the narrative or shift the narrative where they want it to be, carol. and i should also mention you can watch this debate. we're going to be airing it on cnn and you can also watch on your local pbs channel to see who comes out on top. very important debate. >> live from milwaukee this morning. both clinton and sanders as i said are fighting for minority
voters, especially from the african american community. clinton already has a strong edge in that competition and in a couple of hours it gets even stronger. joe johns with a closer look at that. >> the congressional black caucus political action committee is endorsing hillary clinton at this time. she has strong ties to members of the caucus. in fact she served in congress with many of them. and the head of the congressional black caucus political action committee is from new york. so he says that endorsement is coming today. but not all of the members of the congressional black caucus proper have endorsed her as of yet. all of this drama against the backdrop of this debate occurring in wisconsin and the move to south carolina as the primary approaches. bernie sanders raising over $6 million after polls closed in new hampshire. gaining momentum before
tonight's crucial debate. descending on new york city in a victory lap, celebrating his sweeping win in tuesday's primary, bringing his antiestablishment message to the late show with stephen colbert. >> our campaign finance system, our election system, and our economy is essentially owned and controlled by a relatively small number of people, whose agreed in my view is really reeking havoc with the middle class of this country. >> and the daytimetalker, the view. >> this is is supposed to be a notion of fairness and we're not seeing that fairness. >> and hillary clinton laying low after her defeat. no longer the undisputed front runner, tonight's debate could help her get her campaign back on track. the former secretary of state already making change, promising a more aggressive edge. the challenge for sanders going forward will be capturing the
african american vote. a key piece of the democratic electorate and the pivotal south carolina primary later this month. courting the african american vote sanders took his campaign to harlem tuesday meeting with civil rights leader al sharpton. one of the members of the congressional black caucus who has not said who he's endorsing yet is james clyburn, the third ranking member in the house of representatives. he's still holding off. we also have to report this morning that to the rutherford the south carolina house minority leader is also endorsing hillary clinton. so people very much coming together for her. those are establishment politicians carol. it will be interesting to see what happens on the ground. >> yeah. and by the way representative grego grego gregory neeks will be joining us
in a minute. and her biggest challenge may be the actual foundation of the campaign. her staff now in a rush to rethink and retool her message. in an effort to recapture the fire that once had her on a track straight to the white house. i'm joined by robert wolf. a hillary clinton sporter and three time presidential appointee and outside advisor to president obama. welcome. >> nice to see you. >> really glad you are here. we heard the clinton camp is calling donors to try to call them down. have you got an call. >> no i think the media has taken the victory and really has run with it. i think people have to remember we still have 48 state tots go and bernie ran a great campaign in new hampshire. >> but even he was surprised by the large margin. >> you can't take away the results. he did a real good job and the voters came out and that is good for overall democratic party.
having more voter turnout. but as you know i'm close to the president. eight years ago we got the call new hampshire that he lost to secretary clinton when he was up seven points that day and lost by eight. so nothing is ever a straight line and there is going to be bumps in the road. >> do you think that hillary clinton should retool her message? because bernie sanders is so clear. he's got one strong message. hillary clinton seems to be all over the place. >> you know, i wouldn't necessarily agree with that. certainly bernie's message on being this incredible progressive and income inequality is resonating and it should by the way. but i don't think the debate is on who's more progressive? the debate has to be on who is better for the economy? who is better on foreign policy? and is whoes going to make sure we have the next supreme court justices. as the guy who's been in the market for 30 years the market is trading down big. the fed is nervous.
jobs are slow, growth is slow. i think we should go back to what the people are really going to care about. that's going to be about the economy, jobs, wage, infrastructure. >> that's bernie sanders message. >> that's not his message no disrespect to bernie but his policies add up to a 17 trillion dollar spend. that is not happening. it is not applausable. i think at the end of the day i think we also have to understand that there is something going on where people are listening to the rhetoric but not really the practicality of it. so i'm hopeful at the end of the day as we continue to go through these primary times that people are listening to the detail of the policy and it is much more broad based. >> president obama leaning towards hillary clinton, he clearly favors her although he has not endorsed her or any other candidate. will he endorse her at some point? >> my gut tells me it is highly unlikely he'll endorse anyone
until if the primary is finished. but he did pick her as his secretary of state. and that was immediately after choosing his vice president. so listen, he obviously has a lot of respect for her. they have a very strong relationship. they have worked together. but i also think that for him it is incredibly important that a democrat's elected and that his legacy continues and they continue. >> would you like to see him perhaps say -- say more outwardly favorable thing about hillary clinton? would that help her? >> well listen, certainly as the hillary supporter i'd love to hear him say i'm supporting hillary. but i don't think that is going to happen with the president. and he was very clear that if you are not for gun reform he will not support you. there is no question who is much more forceful when it comes to
gun reform. and that is important to me. my wife actually works at sandy hook. i look at those issues and i've been with the president and he says that was his worst day in all of his time as being president was newtown. so you have to look at some of the vibes he's saying but i don't think he's going come out. >> let's talk about young voters for a second because i talked to one young feminist, young woman who said hillary clinton is just an old white rich person, why should i listen to her? and that sounds really harsh but young people are gravitating around bernie sanders because they like his ideals. >> he's doing well and getting out the vote and popular and it works. in the sense here's free education and free healthcare. i think at the end of the day though we've only been in two states. yes he's done a good job with the young. and i think that is a good thing by the way. for us to win as the democratic
party we actually need the young voter turnout. with the president it was inkroebl important. i also think she will also get the young turnout. but today bernie's done a better job. we need to improve. >> thank you so much. you can watch the pbs news hour democratic presidential debate tonight, 9:00 p.m. eastern right here on cnn or on your local pbs station. and still to come, marco rubio unplugged, tearing into the donald trump and others. what he's saying to supporters in south carolina right now. (ray) i'd like to see
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christie announced they were suspending their campaigns. jim acosta is with me this morning in greenville keeping an eye on all things gop in south carolina. tell us more. >> south carolina is well known for its cut throat politics and very likely to get down and dirty the next nine days before the south carolina primary. and donald trump is going to find out this out all too well. he's firmly in place as the gop front runner flt field but the rest of the gop pack is determined as r to bring him down. >> when you have victory you don't need sleep. >> reporter: only one candidate is clearly leading a shrinking field of gop contenders. >> i'm your guy. >> reporter: marching on to south carolina. >> now it is up to south carolina to pick a president. >> reporter: donald trump riding high after his huge new hampshire win seemed to switch his campaign tactics wednesday night, choosing not to go after most of his gop rivals. >> this whacky socialist guy bernie. >> reporter: this time hitting
his democratic opponents hard, sounding more like a general election candidate. >> this guy sanders is rant like a lunatic. hillary clinton. terrible. look at the damage she did. >> but the front runner couldn't resist taking a jab at his most vocal gop attacker jeb bush. >> he's a low energy person. i said -- no i said he's a stiff. and i said if he was in the private sector he wouldn't be able to get a job. >> what's left of the gop field now has a target squarely on the brash billionaire's back. >> you imagine donald trump as president of the united states? we'll be worse off than now. >> the hard thing about domd in the short-term is he doesn't have any policy positions. >> the only way to beat donald trump is hyal highlight the simple truth of his record. >> reporter: rubio is taking the high road addressing chris christie's decision to drop out of race. >> i think he was somebody who
concluded somehow attacking me would help him in his campaign. obviously it didn't work. he's very talent and would i think he has a future if public service beyond what he's doing now in new jersey. >> i had a chance to catch up with the trump campaign manager last night at this event here in south carolina. and he noted the fact that nine days before the south carolina primary, that is forever -- that is a lifetime in politics. but they are pretty confident in their strategy. they are not changing it one bit. they are going to continue to jump ahead to these states that are looming ahead on the campaign calendar. that includes louisiana and florida. trump is going to be in louisiana today. florida tomorrow. so they are not worried about taking time away from south carolina to go to the other states ahead on the calendar. they basically did that very same thing when all of those candidates were scrapping and fighting in iowa and then new hampshire. trump was jumping ahead and setting the table essentially for these later contests. and feels like they are very well prepared, very well
adjusted for this battle coming ahead. >> jim acosta live from greenville south carolina. south carolina is known for its nasty politics. so much so the charleston post and courier has launched a website encouraging readers to contact the paper if they receive offensive mailings or row bow calls. and john kasich is about to find out just how nasty it can get in that state. the ohio governor also facing attacks after surging to second place in new hampshire. he talked about that and more with cnn. >> you said fasten your seat belt. and you have exceeded expectations. but now the pressure is on. >> no i don't have anymore pressure. >> come on you're in south carolina now. >> look look look, pressure is a mom that's got three kids and a husband that walked out the door. pressure is not what i'm doing. you know, as long as i can do what i think i need to do,
whatever the outcome is i'll be fine with. people were on our bus and interviewing me. and looking at us for months and they come on the bus and it is like zen. why is everybody so calm? >> jeb bush went on the air this morning and he said john kasich has nothing in south carolina. they are saying you have no money. you have no ground game. can you compete here? >> well yeah, we're going to compete here. we don't expect to win here. >> some of these other states. the attack ads are already on the air. are you going to hit back? >> well i'm not going to sit there and be a marshmallow or some kind of pin cushion. where i come from the blue collar town that i come from if you come in and beat our football team we just broke all the windows on your bus -- that's just a joke by the window. but the fact of the matter is i'm not going to sit there and let somebody pound on me.
>> welcome. >> thank you carol. >> i think voters want to get to know john kasich a little more. that's why we invited you on. you have been around a long time in the state of ohio. he says he's zen but in ohio he's known for his temper. so which is it? >> carol, he's been remarkably self disciplined in this campaign. i've frankly been with him plenty in the campaign and it's totally different story. that is guy who in an intemperate moment a few years ago called a cop who pulled him over for a speeding ticket an "i idiot cop," not once but three times at a public meeting. and he's not like that now.
you will notice in the segment that the focus criticizing donald trump, john kasich wasn't in there. that is the tact he's decided to take. it will be an interesting balancing act. as he said in an interview, he doesn't want to be the marshmallow the pin cushion, whatever. so not attacking but then responding to attacks will be a fine line to walk. >> interesting. so kasich is billed nationally as the compassionate conservative. he says, he isn't going full conservative. he says there is a role for government to play. why say that in this particular political climate. you know, i think he doesn't care quite frankly. every politician says he is his own man or, you know, i'm my own woman or whatever. i think kasich means it. he is to a place in his political career. he's a second term governor. he is in congress for 18 years.
he is going to do what he wants to do. and i don't think his message is going change a lot in south carolina. i think he's going to emphasize jobs more. i think he's going to emphasize his 18 years on the house armed services committee for sure. but he's still going to talk about reaching across the party aisle because even in conservative states in the heart of hearts, most americans want people to work together and get things done. so we're going to see if that works. >> we'll see. i'm just going to talk about how conservative he really is. because on the other hand kasich is about to sign an ohio bill that diverts taxpayer money away from planned parenthood. a move critics say would harm poor women in ohio. so how conservative is he? >> well, you know, in 2016 that is an interesting question. in most years kasich wub pretty much a quintessential conservative. yeah he's against planned parenthood fund bing but i don' know there is anyone for planned
parenthood funding in the republican field. he's against abortion but for incest and rape of the wife and the mother and that puts him in the conservative field and in some ways that is struggle for soul and the heart of the republican party john kasich insists this is what conservatives should be. it should be about conserving about helping your brother, helping your sister but that is true conservativism and government should be there but only as the last resort. >> thank youing for being with this morning. >> stock futures signaling a massive selloff this morning. live to the is it stock exchange for the opening bell. and wishing you could stay in bed all day. when your cold is this bad... ...you need new theraflu expressmax.
carol costello. thank you so much for joining me. okay let's head right to the new york stock exchange. traders are bracing for a sharp selloff at the opening bell. alison kosik joins us live. something to do with oil prices right? >> lot of activity on the floor. get ready for stocks to be crushed here at the open. a lot of this has to do with testimony from fed chief janet yellen. first of who two day testimony on capitol hill and she talks about risk to economic growth. she didn't take it a step further. she didn't take the possibility of a rain hike off the table which means fed still could raise interest rates in march. we're just a few weeks away from that. and you are seeing europe cut
there a interest rates and japan and sweden, those central banks move into negative territory for thaz interest rates. yesterday we did see the investment move turn negative. we're seeing that carry into today. janet yellen is going to be back on capitol hill today for a second day of testimony a. >> thanks so much. it is a bizarre back and forth. the u.s. and russia clashing over exactly who is bombing aleppo syria. barbara starr with more on this. >> good morning carol. the russian government saying yesterday that there were two u.s. war planes that bombed in aleppo in northwestern syria. thousands of people at risk as regime russian forces have encircled aleppo. it is a dire situation.
why would the use be bombing interest? the pentagon says this is a fabrication, that the u.s. is not bombing in lep poe and is not bombing there because there is no isis there. this is an area why the syrian regime, backed up by russian and iranian forces have been pounding the city and pounding the area there according to the united states. all indications are that in fact the u.s. did not have any war planes in this area and is not bombing there. that is according to the pentagon and at the moment at least no evidence to the contrary, carol. >> so why would russia accuse the united states of bombing aleppo? >> they have done this before. several weeks ago there was a claim from the russian government that the u.s. was bombing syrian military sites in eastern syria. the u.s. was not bombing syrian military sites there according to the pentagon.
some of it is pure propaganda efforts in the view of the pentagon. some of it is the russian government putting out messages perhaps to its own people. certainly up to everyone to make up their own mind about this but the kind of aircraft that the russians are saying the u.s. used in aleppo, they are called a-10s. they would be very vulnerable to being shot down in that kind of heavy fighting environment right now. so again it seems pretty doubtful that the u.s. would risk pilots lives in such a situation, carol. >> barbara starr reporting live from the pentagon, thank you. senator sanders is on a role about to take the debate stage after the huge win in new hampshire but he could take it on the chin if he's pressed to answer exactly how he will pay for his revolution. as stephen colbert pointed out last night on "the late show." >> why not? why can't all people in this
country have healthcare? why can't we make colleges and universities tuition free? why not. we have -- [ cheers and applause ] >> the answer is that it's expensive. it is a very expensive thing to do. >> the top 1% has a lot of of influence with the government and they are not just going to give it up, you know? they are going to fight you tooth and nail. >> well -- >> i'll tell you how i know. i'm in the top 1%. why do you think you can make this change? >> i think we have reached a point in american society where people are just very very unhappy with the status quo. >> as you heard no real answer. a washington post op ed echoed that team. looping sanders in with the republican candidate donald trump calling both men dangerously wrong in their diagnoses and predictions. sanders has not leveled with americans about the true cost of single payer healthcare. joined by gary jaffe, the author
of why bernie sanders matters. welcome sir. >> happy to be with you. >> first off are you surprised that sanders is resonating? >> actually -- actually i am. because i think that everybody expected him to be a flash in the pan. but then having written a book about him, that is the way politicians saw him way back in 1980 when he ran for mayor of burlington. people thought well he's going to go away. he didn't. >> he didn't and he's still here. is he a pure idea log? >> well he certainly has a certain set of beliefs that he's not going to move from. and that is part of his secret sauce. let's face it. we haven't seen somebody like this in american politics for a long time. he believes in what he says. he's been saying it for 40 years. and apparently people want to hear it. >> well they certainty do. and he does believe in what he says but he never quite gets to the part where how is he going to pay for this? besides people will rise up and
there will be a revolution and it will force government to act. is that his shtick? >> it's absolutely his shtick. and i think that as the campaign it works really well. and i think that that is what we're doing now. we're having a campaign. and i'm not so sure that process is part of the process. >> what do you mean by that, process is not part of the process? >> well, how this is going to happen, how it is going to be specifically done. i mean suppose that he makes promises and he says we're going to redistribute wealth from the 1% to the rest of the country. suppose he says that we are going to tax speculation on wall street? he can say that. politicians promise everything they can in the campaign. then what happens when they come to office? who knows. so i think that at this point sanders is just putting it out there. and he has a whole lot of momentum behind him. >> would he be a good commander in chief?
>> wow, that is a rough question. you know, he has been historically very skeptical of the military budget. he clearly is not interested in being the big shot with the big stick going to war. he said specifically united states should not be the policemen of the world. at the same time he has voted for sending troops to afghanistan f so he's not afraid of deploying trups troops. i think we would have a different kind of commander in chief. that's for sure. >> how far does bernie go? >> i think he goes all the way do june. he's certainly going to the conventions. is he going to beat hillary clinton? i think it is all together possible. he's a very smart politician. this is a guy who has run for office 20 times. he runs for office for a living. and he's good at it. and that is what he's doing right now. he's got a good team. he's got a lot of money behind
him. he's fearless. he's patient. he's going to go a long, long way. >> harry jaffe, thanks. >> pleasure. >> still to come in the newsroom, armed protesters in oregon say they will surrender this morning following a night of intense negotiations. but will they? and to help you accelerate, we've created a new company... one totally focused on what's next for your business. the true partnership where people,technology and ideas push everyone forward. accelerating innovation. accelerating transformation. accelerating next. hewlett packard enterprise. are acidic... most of the time people are shocked when we show them where they're getting the acid, and what those acids can do to the enamel. there's only so much enamel on a tooth, and everybody needs to do something about it now if they want to preserve their teeth.
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dramatic negotiations between the fbi and the last four armed protesters holed up at an oregon wildlife refuge. a calm resolution did not look quite as certain in the overnight hours. listen as the negotiators talk with the militia members. >> they promised you you wouldn't do this. >> well they got their guys out there waiting and he's hanging out there. they're telling us to come out -- >> and they're getting closer
and closer. -- many in portland on the ground willing to negotiate a peaceful resolution and exit strategy. >> -- in portland or on the ground and he's willing to come here and negotiate with us. you need to stand down. she says you need to stand down. she's coming here to settle this peacefully, not your way. >> if they cut our phones off, that probably means we're dead. just so you know that. >> just trust and take a deep breath and don't do anything rash. >> we're not. our hands are at our sides, our weapons are down. if they cover communications it is because they killed us. >> all of this hours after the feds arrested cliven bundy, the father of protester ammon bundy after he got off a plane in portland. cnn is tracking all of the developments. >> reporter: good morning carol. well it appears that the last of
these remaining hold outs and beer talking about four of them are apparently going to turn themselves into the federal authority this is morning. perhaps in less than two hours from now they say they will do it at 8:00 local time in oregon. this after the fbi apparently had enough of all this. they surrounded all of the entries and exits into the refuge and decided enough is enough. so you had all of this playing out last night on live stream on youtube. at one point you had 66,000 visitors listening to the drama unfold. michelle fiore was part of the conversation. apparently they are going to turn themselves in peacefully in a couple of hours from now. and of course you have more drama with cliven bundy, the patriarch arrested last night apparently related to his own
skurmishes back in 2014. and you have a third bundy in jail, ryan bundy. another brother in jail. so apparently this is all going to come to an end hopefully at least in a couple of hours. but for now at least things remain tense. still to come, hillary clinton readies for round two against bernie sanders. what could she say to stop the bernie momentum? i've smoked a lot and quit a lot, but ended up nowhere. now i use this. the nicoderm cq patch,
to avoid jabs like this one that got boos at the previous debate. >> but you will not find that i ever changed a view or a vote because of any donation that i ever received. and i have stood up and i have represented my constituents to the best of my ability, and i'm very proud of that. so i think it's time to end the very artful smear that you and your campaign have been carrying out in recent weeks, and let's talk about the issues. >> ed lee is joining me live from atlanta. good morning. >> good morning. >> in your mind, how critical is clinton's performance tonight? >> i think that it's important, but one of the things that we are doing is that we are sort of inflating the value of the new hampshire primaries but south carolina and nevada seems to be
places where she's doing well and it's a population of people that she's done well communicating with previously. i think it is important to shift the momentum and the trajectory of the conversation. but in the grand scheme of things, not the most important issue. >> in south carolina she's winning big time over sanders. by i think 30 points in some polls. with that said, should hillary clinton come out swinging or just -- what should she do? >> i think part of the thing she's struggling with is an authenticity gap between her and bernie sanders. that clip you just showed indicates that she tends to be aggressive and that she comes off as being abrasive at times. and closing the authenticity gap means connecting with the public in ways that understands what their stories are and that she can communicate what her story is. that means being vulnerable but also being able to speak to
having some sense of strength and doing that with stories and stories about herself and stories about the communities that she wants to serve. >> and she has done that before, and has connected. >> yes. she has been successful in doing that. one of the things i think ends up happening is she falls into discussions about policies, and these things that ultimately i don't think that most of the electorate finds important or all that relevant in figuring out who they want to connect with. bernie sanders has figured out where the vulnerabilities are for the public and tapped into those things. it's one note about economic inequality w but most people resonate with it. and she's failed to find the note the community resonates with. >> she's tried to say i hear you, but how are you going to accomplish these things. that hasn't resonated so far, but is that something she should do tonight? >> no.
i don't think the challenge to bernie sanders is a question of policy. it's a question of who do you trust and want to lead the world and who do you think has your back. at this point in time, her emphasis on universal values or policy solutions will not connect with the public. what she needs to do is speak to the needs of the communities she's trying to have conversations with, poverty in intercity atlanta is different from other places. and the needs of different people are different. and her desire to speak to a universal notion of ethics or universal value of rights will not translate. she needs to understand and speak to the specifics of the needs of each of the communities. >> understand. ed lee, thank you for being with me this morning. >> still to come, a terrifying cruise in a storm has many asking why the ship set sail in the first place.
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at least one u.s. lawmaker is calling into investigation why a cruise ship sailed into powerful storms. anthem of the seas returned to port last night. passengers grateful to be on the dry land. we have more for you. >> oh, my god. >> reporter: a 12 hour nightmare finally coming to an end for rattled passengers aboard the anthem of the seas cruise ship. >> at one point i thought i wasn't going to see my family again. that boat never should have gone out. >> reporter: the vessel arriving back in new jersey after encounters a ferocious storm off the coast of the carolinas three days into the trip to the baa
haw mas? >> the whole ship was on a 45 degree angle for four or five hours. windows smashed. >> reporter: terrified, motion sick passengers hunkered down in their rooms as the captain battled the waves and 125 miles per hour winds. >> all that. i'm so nervous. >> it was crazy. i mean, everything fell out of the bathroom, broke. crash, crash, crash. >> reporter: many criticizing the decision to set sail despite the storm warnings days before leaving port. royal caribbean said the storm was worse than predicted and apologized to passengers,ed ad t admitting we have to do better. our ship and our crew performed well. the event exceptional as it was, identified gaps in our planning system we're addressing. passengers just happy to be alive. >> to survive a hurricane is incredible, but to survive it at sea? it was amazing.
>> the cruise line will give refunds and a voucher to a future cruise. the next hour of "cnn newsroom" starts now. the first matchup after the new hampshire takedown. bernie sanders on fire and tonight face to face with hillary clinton. will she unleash a new strategy? and no pressure in south carolina? >> now it's up to south carolina to pick a president. >> but can donald trump's rivals convince voters not to vote for the billionaire? >> can you imagine donald trump as president of the united states? we will be worse off than we are now. >> the problem about trump is he doesn't have any policy positions. >> and 125 miles per hour winds, huge waves, the nightmare finally over for thousands of vacatione vacationers, but the storm just
beginning for the cruise company. >> that guy should be thrown in jail right now. thrown in jail. >> let's talk live in the "cnn newsroom." good morning. i'm carol costello. thank you for joining me. as you can see from the count down clock, we're 11 hours away from the next presidential debate. and for the democrats, maybe the single most important showdown. you're looking at live pictures from inside the debate hall at the university of wisconsin in milwaukee. the two podiums for the pbs debate will be simulcast starting at 9:00 p.m. eastern. hillary clinton considered the shoe in months ago now scrambling to gain momentum. bernie sanders looking to build in new hampshire. facing off for the first time since the primary there, and both ramping up the efforts to win african american support. next hour clinton will receive a key, important endorsement from the congressional black caucus pact, and sanders is ramping up
his frts to court african american leaders after the first primary in the south looms next week. we're covering both the democratic and republican races. we want to begin with tonight's debate. cnn is live in milwaukee. good morning. >> good morning, carol. the narrative right now coming out of iowa and new hampshire is this loss that hillary clinton was handed, a big loss by bernie sanders. her goal here tonight is to try to turn it around. burny sanders wants to keep that narrative in place. he's been pretty busy here in the last day as hillary clinton was laying low, getting ready for the debate, bernie sanders went on a media tour in new york. he was on the view. he was on the late show. and emphasizing what i think we'll hear him talk more about tonight, this idea that the economy is rigged in favor of the wealthy. here's what he said yesterday. >> our campaign finance system, our election system, and our economy is essentially owned and
controlled by a relatively small number of people whose greed, in my view, is really wreaking havoc with the middle class of this country. i think the message that we're bringing forth that this country is supposed to be a nation of fairness, and we're not seeing that fairness right now. we have massive levels of income and wealth inequality. >> reporter: we'll also be seeing the candidates looking forward to nevada to the caucuses there. to the south carolina primary later this month n. and things are really different when you look at these two contests compared to iowa and new hampshire. it's a more diverse, democratic electorate, and hillary clinton has been doing a lot better in the polls with hispanic voters and black voters. you're going to see bern nir sanders trying to cut into that advantage for her. you have hillary clinton back on her feet, back on her heels going into this key debate
tonight. she's also got this advantage of being certainly more approved by these key constituencies she's going to taylor her message toward tonight at this pbs news hour democratic debate. >> thank you. next hour, hillary clinton gets an important endorsement. it follows a strong show of support from the white house. while stopping short of an endorsement, a former white house press secretary says the president, president obama, is pulling for hillary clinton. >> i think the president has signalled while still remaining neutral that he supports secretary clinton's candidacy, and would prefer to see her as the nominee. i don't think there's any doubt that he wants hillary to win the nomination and believes she would be the best candidate in the fall. and the most effective as president in carrying forward what she's achieved. let's turn to joe johns. good morning. >> good morning. it's a big deal. not really unexpected as the
congressional black caucus political action committee that's doing the endorsing headed by congressman gregory meeks. home state connections with hillary clinton. we've been hearing members of the caucus are going to be on the ground in south carolina supporting her in the run up to the primary. the political action committee normally supports african american candidates, but the clinton connections with the cbc go back years and years. the highest ranking black member of congress who happens to come from south carolina has been holding off on an endorsement not necessarily leading toward sanders either. he has an institutional position in congress. he's the third-ranking democrat in the house. that means if hillary clinton doesn't get the nomination, sanders could end up in a little bit of political friction down the road. he says that's not the main reason why he's holding off endorsing anybody, at least for now. >> there will be maybe a dozen
congressional black caucus members throughout south carolina this weekend. so i'll follow their lead and make a decision sometime soon. i think she has a great record for the american people, but people get so caught up in the emotions of a campaign they sometimes forget that history, and so we're going to be discussing all of that this weekend with family and friends. >> hillary clinton is going to be pushing hard on the state. she has the debate on cnn from wisconsin tonight, and then back to south carolina. we hear she's going to be focusing on friday on education in one of the state's poorest school districts. the challenge for sanders is going to be to match the clinton outreach to minorities in states like south carolina where she's already polling very well. >> that's right. joe johns, thank you so much. while clinton gets big name backers, she's struggling with young women voters, especially
after tuesday night's loss in new hampshire. on tonight's stage she has a chance to reset the race and redefine her candidacy. he's talk about that. i'm joined by bill press and doug hattaway. bill, we're talking a lot about hillary clinton redefining her message. she's up by a lot in south carolina. she's up by 30 points in one poll. does bernie sanders have to do well too here even though he has the momentum behind him after new hampshire some. >> sure he does. let's not forget, by the way, the nevada caucuses for democrats come first, and i hope we can talk about that too. both of them are challenges for bernie sanders. a caucus state, i think works better for him in terms of grass roots volunteers, getting people out of the caucuses, even though there are only democrats allowed in nevada.
both of them i think come out of new hampshire with a big challenge. bernie has to prove he can take his message beyond the all white states of iowa and new hampshire. i think he can. and i think hillary has to show that the one loss has not thrown her. she's able to retool and get her momentum back in territory that should be very friendly to her, and so i think tonight's debate is really, really crucial to both of them. >> and, doug, more than one analyst says the hillary clinton campaign is panicking. they think she has to redefine her message. what do you think? >> i think she has a new opportunity to talk to folks who actually might not have been paying as much attention. the game is on now, and i think there's a fresh opportunity, and i'd look for her tonight, actually not to go on the attack against sanders or try to outburn bernie. but talk directly to the voters, talk directory to people about
their hopes for their futures, and their concerns about the political and economic system today. because what we've seen so far is sanders is really tapped into anger. she can be the positives a separational candidate talking about the -- he's talking about problems. she's talking about solutions. the challenge for her is that she knows so much about policies and programs, she needs to step back and talk about the values and hopes that shows that she's in touch with the concerns of everyday hard working americans. >> and, bill, some say that because hillary clinton is so wonky, her message gets lost. people don't understand what she's most passionate about. >> i think that may be true. hillary is a great candidate. can be a great candidate. i don't think we've seen the best side of her lately, and sort of building on what doug was saying, i think that she has to -- i would hope that they would stop the attempt to tear
down bernie sanders. i don't think it's working. the idea of whining about a smear campaign, nobody bought that. it's a campaign. they both have differences and just air the differences. but i believe that she'd be smart to go positive, to be aspirational. i think the way bernie has. he says i want college tuition and universal health care. hillary may say i do but there may be a different way to get there, but she's been saying too much, no, we can't. i think she has to say yes, we can. it worked in 200 8. it will work again. >> i talked to one analyst who said both should be concentrating on donald trump and cruz. those two candidates democrats fear the most. >> good point. right. if i'm on the attack in this situation, i'd want to be drawing those contrasts with republicans. i think there's a tendency to go after the other guy and draw a
contrast. i think the contrast is very clear here where if you have the angry revolutionary candidate be the aspirational solutions oriented candidate. but remember, people don't dig into the details as much. talk about a positive vision for the future. show that you're in touch with their everyday concerns. it's interesting. she agrees, i think with bernie sanders on the problems on wall street, for example. but your arverage hard working person couldn't tell you how breaking up the banks is going to improve their lives. she needs to focus on everyday hard working people and those are the folks who will come out and vote. >> we'll see what happens tonight on cnn. thanks to both of you. >> thank you. >> still to come in the news room, the gop blitz is on. john kasich speaking right now in south carolina n. and as the playing field gets smaller the talks are getting stronger.
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the battle for south carolina rages on. these are pictures from moments ago. this is john kasich meeting with voters right now hosting a town hall. while he is riding high after finishing second in new hampshire, he's not banking on big numbers in south carolina. >> we're going to compete here. we don't expect to win here. i'm not worried about what the other folks say. this is not the end of it for us here in south carolina. we will be moving through south carolina to other places. >> so you don't expect to win here? >> oh, no. >> some of these other states, the attack ads are already on the air. are you going to hit back? >> well, i'm not going to sit there and be a marshmallow or some kind of pin cushion. where i come from, the blue collar town that i come from, if you came in and beat our
football team, we broke the windows on your bus. that's a joke. i'm not going to sit there and let somebody pound on me. >> jim acosta is in south carolina. he's following the blitz there. good morning, jim. >> good morning, carol. donald trump is riding high right now after that big win in new hampshire. we were with him in south carolina last night at a livestock arena. and it's a manner of speech when we say that these candidates take a victory lap after a big win, but donald trump literally took a victory lap on the stage in south carolina last night. it was something to behold. but donald trump and his campaign, they both know what's coming, and all of these candidates, this remaining shrinking field of candidates, they're starting to go after them. what's interesting to see at this point is marco rubio. marco rubio has sort of thrown out the rubio play book that wasn't working in iowa and new
hampshire. it really did not work in new hampshire after that disastrous debate performance. i was on his charter plane yesterday with other reporters including one who covers rubio consistently. and rubio was saying he's going to be unscripted and let it rip. and earlier this morning here in south carolina, he wept right after trump, cruz, in a matter of thirty-seconds. take a listen. >> donald trump has zero foreign policy experience. negotiating a hotel deal in another country is not foreign policy experience. ted cruz has a little bit foreign policy experience, and it's different than mine. the only budget he's voted for in his years in washington was sponsored by rand paul that bragged about cutting defense spending. >> and it was interesting to hear rubio on the plane yesterday talking about this new
style that we're going to be seeing here over the next nine days. he was joking about how his debate performance was not nearly as bad as rick perry when he said oops. rubio told the reporters on the plane there that rick perry's problem was that he couldn't remember what he wanted to say. rubio said that his problem was that he remembered what he wanted to say too well which is why he kept repeating things. there was another moment where he said he was going to get the boots everybody was talking about a few weeks ago. he was going to get those poll tested here in south carolina. he was having some fun. a lot more fun than i've seen him have on the campaign trail. we'll see if it has any effect. as for druonald trump, he's continuing with the strategy where he jumps ahead to other states. people might wonder why he's not in south carolina today. he's going to be in louisiana and florida. living on the calendar. they feel like that strategy
works for them. >> all right. jim acosta reporting live from south caroli south carolina. donald trump and cruz are pulling no punches. trump firing his shot with this ad, questioning cruz's trustworthiness. >> what kind of man talks from both sides of his mouth on amnesty for illegals on national television and still denies it? who runs a campaign of dirty tricks? ted cruz, the worst kind of washington insider who just can't with trusted. >> all right. not to be outdone. cruz took on his rival with a little help from kids, a doll house, and a toy that strongly resembles donald trump. >> look. i got the trump action figure. >> wait. it's huge. >> what does he do? >> he pretends to be a republican. >>
hey, hillary, i'll give you money to be my friend.
check out my house, mr. trump. >> that's a lousy house. i'm going to take your house and park my limos there. >> i can't help it. it was funny. all right. let's talk about that and more. editor and chief of the daily beast, and the executive editor of real clear politics are with us. welcome to both of us. tom, you weren't laughing at the cruz ad. >> i think the cruz ad is very well done. but i'm not clear that the issue of imminent do main, bush hit donald trump hard on
that, and donald trump rocked in new hampshire. i'm not sure as well done as that ad is, and it is entertaining and funny, i'm not sure how effective it's going to be in the final analysis. >> john, what about donald
trump's ad? he -- go ahead. respond. >> i just think the cruz ad is effective. it uses humor. humor is one of the most underrated tools in politics, particularly in attack ads. it's disarming. it speaks a different truth and gets a lot of everyoned media. and i think that is an effective ad. and cruz's ads and social media presence has been a lot more charming than the candidate himself. >> wow. okay. that was kind of harsh, john avalon. tom, a question for you. because south carolina is known for the nasty politics and voters will see lots and lots of negative ads until they just want to break their television sets, will that be effective for the candidates or do voters really get tired of negative ads and tune them out? >> voters -- the thing about negative ads is they're kind of like chemotherapy. too much of it can kill the
patient. candidates have to be careful about running too heavy on the negative ads they're effective but voters are also turned off. if you have candidates bashing each other, a candidate that takes a high road could sneak up and win support for that reason. it's a dangerous game to play but clearly everybody is now playing it in south carolina. >> absolutely. they're being bombarded with calls and television ads and all kinds of ads. john, the fight for voters between the candidates is a fight for evangelicals. who do you think will win? >> if the question is who is going to be a better job with evangelica evangelicals, it will be cruz. he's gotten the support of evangelical leaders. that drove him to success in iowa. now, there are other candidates who are competing for that. trump does well with evangelicals. the key to understanding the denamic is that his base is broader than any one
constituency. he appeals to voters whether they're blue collar voters to bosses to evangelicals. it's a broader coalition, and i will say that stereo types about south carolina fall apart when you understand the state up close. yes, it has a strong christian conservative component, but over the last two decades, a lot of folks moved there to retire. they changed the sensibilities of the state somewhat. the state has a reputation for dirty politics, but it's a lot more diverse and complicated than people think from afar. >> tom, what do you think? i know cruz has a great ground game in south carolina, and donald trump isn't doing so bad in that arena either. >> yeah. it's going to be interesting. we don't have any polling that even incorporates what happens in iowa or in new hampshire. it will be interesting to see where the race shakes out. i agree. donald trump is doing well there right now.
has done well there, at least his support in the polls say that over the past few months. he's been untouchable there, and cruz has a strong organization and support from a lot of important leaders. and it will be interesting to see if the new rubio reboot, if he's able to regain any ground or momentum after his fall in new hampshire. >> all right. i have to leave it there. thanks to both of you. >> still to come in the news room, it could make or break their campaign. both sanders and clinton pushing hard for the african american vote and now clinton picks up a key important endorsement.
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a brutal start on trading. the dow plunging more than 240 points just about an hour after the opening bell. on the floor of the new york stock exchange with more. >> the good news if you can call it good news is the sell off is stabilizing. the dow is down 247 points. there are a few things going on. we are watching oil prices plunge again, this time below $27 a barrel. this is great for consumers. it translates to lower gas prices. for the economy, there's a tipping point. you don't want to see any segment of the economy in free fall. that's what we're seeing in the oil market. we're seeing a lot of fear in the market. they are buying gold which is considered safe haven trades. and then there's the fed chief back on capitol hill.
it's day two of her testimony explaining about interest rates, how the economy is doing, and if her first day of testimony yesterday she didn't instill much confidence. part of the reason you're seeing the sell off today, we saw the sell off in the tail end of yesterday bled into today. >> all right. thank you. and good morning. i'm carol costello. thank you for joining me. in just about a half an hour, the political arm of the congressional black caw cucus w endorse hillary clinton. she needs the black vote to win big in south carolina. sanders is fighting for the vote too. he has earned the vote from some high profile names from professor cornell west and naacp ceo ben jealous to others.
they say clinton's wall street ties concern him. that's why he's backing sanders. on the clinton side, she has eric holder and sabrina folder, and atlanta's mayor. >> the way that senator sanders talks about the current economy and the current environment is dismissive of the contributions that president obama has made. it's more than about that. it's also about where secretary clinton has been her entire career. we're not going to continue to stand on the sidelines while senator sanders who has been in the senate for more than 25 years and has gotten very little done in comparison to secretary clinton and the president of the united states. you're not going to continue to let them talk about all this. >> all right. with me now, chairman of the congressional black caucus pack. nice to have you here.
why are you endorsing clinton? >> well, the congressional black caucus pac, the political pardon me of the cbc is focussed on electing democrats. we know when democrats are in the majority, the issues that are important to us become real. and when we run around the country whether it's for the house or for senate seats or for president of the united states, we try to elect like minded democrats. one of the individuals who have been with us time and time again has been hillary clinton. when we need to organize to get democrats elected, it's been hillary clinton who has gone into our communities and talked in regards to the importance of electing democrats, the portion -- importance of us being in the majority so we can make sure the policies and issues important to us are made real. she has been, her whole career, an individual that has been fighting for issues that are
important to the african american community. and so it is then -- when we do our evaluations as we do, in all, because one of the things that i want to make sure is clear, the cb cpac not only endorses members. we endorse noncbc members, those who are democrats and want to make sure the democrats are in the majority. >> what do you not see in senator sanders that you see in hillary clinton? >> well, what i'm saying is that the fact that the person that has been on the front burner, the person that has been very aggressive about getting folks e elected and making sure the democratic agenda is a reality and stayed on the scene when she would have gotten off the scene but has seen the importance of election cycle has been hillary clinton. the person that has partnered with the cbc in so many years has been hillary clinton.
and so i think that it is only -- and it's the right thing to do because it is the best thing to do, and she's the best candidate to be the next president of the united states. >> all right. and i want to run this by you. the nation, featured a devastating article on hillary clinton, an article that went viral. the article charges that mrs. clinton and her husband decimated black america. michelle alexander is the reporter. she thinks that clinton sent mixed cultural messages by belting out lift every voice and sing in black churches while signaling to poor and working class kwhiwhites that he was wig to be tougher an black communities than republicans had been. he signed the 1994 crime bill that critics say hurt the black community. but made the president look tough on crime. in other words, the clintons say one thing and do what's
politically expedient. your response to that? >> let me say that 1994 bill, the truth of the matter is bernie sanders voted for it also. a lot of democrat voted for it. and so it was the sign of the times then. if you want to go and use history, it's also true that when you talk about the economic gap and the creation of jobs and more black folks coming into the middle class, if you look at the same period of time, during that same time that president clinton was president, that you saw that gap began to close, and more african americans were at work and entrepreneurs were moving and gains in value went up. let's talk about the entire record of bill clinton. someone declared him the first black at the time. you have to remember, also, that in reelection in 1996,
activities the black community that came out in large numbers to make sure that president clinton was reelected because don't think that black folks are not dumb. they come out for individuals who they may have their best interest at heart, and as they did in 92 and did again in '96, they came out and supported bill clinton because economically and otherwise, he made a tremendous impact and difference in their lives, and that's -- go back and look at the news stories back then. and then let's talk about the entire record, and not just trying to piecemeal it. >> all right. thank you so much for being with me thank you. >> good to be with you. >> still to come, armed occupiers in oregon may be about to give up as federal agents move to end the six week p protres. 6 ready. avo: so he knows exactly when he can settle in and practice his big pitch. avo: and when craig gets his pitch down pat, do you know what he becomes?
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armed protesters occupying a federal wildlife refuge in oregon say they will surrender. there was a chase and a shooting that left one occupier dead. in a phone call last night the remaining hold outs talked about giving up. >> they promised you they wouldn't do this. >> well, they got their guys and [ bleep ] out there waiting. you know, they're -- they're telling us to come out. >> and they're getting closer and closer. >> on the ground. willing to negotiate a peaceful resolution and exit strategy. >> in portland, oregon on the ground. she's willing to come and negotiate with us. stand down. she says you need to stand down.
she's coming here. to settle there peacefully. not your way. >> if they cut our phones off, that probably means we're dead. >> don't do anything rash. >> we're not. our hands are at our sides. our weapons are down. if they cut our communications, it's because they killed us. >> last night the fbi arrested cliven bundy, the father of protesters, amann bundy and ryan bundy as he got off a plane in portland. we are tracking the latest developmen developments. hi, dan. >> reporter: good morning, carol. this has been a bizarre standoff that has lasted 40 days. it appears it's going to end as you have the remaining hold outs. four of them apparently are prepared to surrender in about 20 minutes from now at an fbi
check point. the federal authorities closed in on the refuge blocking all the entrances and exits to the refu refuge. this was playing on a audio youtube stream listened to by 66,000 people around the world. they were very intrigued by this. you have a nevada lawmaker apparently trying to play peacemaker. she was on the phone. she's been sympathetic to the cause. you can see her in the portland airport talking on her cell phone to the hold outs. we have part of that sound. take a look. >> i am with you in spirit. god is with you in spirit. we don't need our weapons right now. they can't fire upon you with the world watching. the world is watching. please tell -- yes, they do. the roads are blocked. they're not letting anyone in our out. the only way i'll get there is
with an fbi escort. i'm being to do that, but they have to be willing too. listen to me. yes, you will. yes, you will. yes, you will see the light of day. >> so carol, we are monitoring things very closely at 8:00 a.m. local time in oregon. in about 20 minutes from now, the last hold outs, four of them, say they will surrender. and of course you had more drama with drivcliven bundy arrested the airport last night. >> we'll check back in 20 minutes. dan simon reporting live from san francisco. >> checking other stories. cleveland under fire after the family of a 12-year-old was billed 500 for an balance ride for their dead child. rice was shot and killed by police as he played with a toy gun in a park.
the head of cleveland's police union called the bill unconscionable while the rice family attorney said it added insult to homicide. >> the paris concert hall that was the site of a terrorist massacre will reopen in november, one year after three isis gunmen waded into a crowd and opened fire. 89 people died in the city's most deadly attack. the cruz ship damaged in an extreme storm is back at home in new jersey. in four passengers were injured aboard the anthem of the seas. the cruise line under fire for sailing into the storm says passengers will receive a full refund for the cancelled voyage. still to come, an american olympian worried about competing in the summer games. why? is zika virus. they think that it's sad.
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vaccine. here's what the director of the national director of allergy and infectious diseases had to say. >> the issue of immediate importance is to be able to develop a safe and effective vaccine against zika. we will likely go into clinical trial in late summer, and i hope after several months we'll know if it is safe and induces a good response. if it does, we'll move to the advanced stage. i can't guarantee when we'll have a vaccine, but we got a good head start because of years of work. >> brazil's health minister sheds light on three new deaths from the virus. one a 23-year-old woman with a clean medical history. we are joined with more. he said we have a good head start on a vaccine. what's he talking about
somebody. >> we don't probably have as good a head start as we should. this is something we've just started paying attention to over the last several months. this has been around far long time. it's only really started to spread over just more recently, over the last several months, a couple years. it's interesting because there was no incentives or push to make a vaccine or treatment before now. it will still take, i think, even with best efforts, at least three years. this is not something that people should be waiting for for this particular outbreak. maybe for future outbreaks. >> how vital is it that the 1 -- $1.8 billion to given to the cbc? >> that sort of money helps. what needs is happen to s you have several different labs all over the country and world that will start working not only on the vaccine but also on potential treatments, anti-virals, and also really
interestingly, something we don't talk about as much, is just different ways of getting rid of his mosquitos. there's all sorts of questions now about what do we need to do about the mosquitos going forward? is getting rid of them a real effort, and how would we achieve that? you know, i say this stat, and it always kind of blows people's minds. mosquitos have killed more than any other animal, any other creature on the planet. they've led to more death than anything else. it's something that a lot of people are focussed on. >> thanks so much. still to come in the news room, an anchor stumbles and the internet feasts. some bennrnie sandwiches after break. the future belongs to the fast.
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lunchtime here in the east. hungry for a sandwich? how about a bernie sandwich in it all began with an anchor flub. it's been an online feeding frenzy ever since. he's genie moez. >> it's a pretty easy name to say. >> bernie sanders. >> reporter: which makes a minor slip of the tongue by an anchor all the more delicious. >> railing against pharmaceutical companies and bernie sandwich -- sanders message. >> may i please have a second helping? >> next thing you know everyone was making bernie sandwiches, bernie and corned beef, bernie between buns. holding a sandwich aloft, pulling one out of his pocket, hash tag, bernie sandwiches unleashed tweets like feel the heart burn and comments like bernie sandwiches. chris hayes tweeted in my
defense i was watching people being served dinner when i said bernie sandwiches. as if it wasn't enough for one election night, another anchor put her foot in her mouth. megyn kelly's blooper wasn't quite so -- >> bernie sandals. it could catch on in the summer months. >> reporter: it's already caught on. food and wine magazine created sandwiches to represent various candidates. hillary's was a subway sandwich. >> a little bit of everything and anything you want on it. >> bernie's was spicy and on cu secure. >> even chelsea clinton once misspoke. >> the president sander ys, excuse me, senator sanders? >> how about bernie sandwiches?
>> sandwich, sandwich. sandwi sandwich. cnn, new york. >> thank you so much for joining me today. i'm carol costello. at this hour with berman and bolduan saturdays now. -- starts now. >> hello, friends. >> we do begin with breaking news. hillary clinton picks up a big endorsement. the congressional black caucus, the political wing will endorse hillary clinton any minute. this comes with a big democratic debate airing on cnn tonight as bernie sanders is also picking up more and more support from influential african american leaders. >> both sides in this primary racing to appeal to this key part of the electorate in south carolina and beyond. and right now as john is talking about, the count