tv CNN Tonight With Don Lemon CNN June 22, 2017 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT
trump's tale of the tapes. this is cnn tonight. i'm don lemon. is anybody out there surprised to hear president trump doesn't actually have tapes of his chats with james comey? anybody? anybody? mueller? don't think so. but was this a much bigger mistake than the president realizes. plus the man they're calling a human bruce springsteen.
iron stash is running against paul ryan. does he have a shot. just wait till you hear what he wants to do now. right to the tale of the tapes. here to discuss historians, plural. he is the author of rightful heritage, franklin d. roosevelt in the land of america and cnn political analyst, david gurgen and david swurdly. david gurgen, you first. the president was on fox news tonight. let's listen. >> robert mueller, do you think he should recuse himself because he is good friends with james comey, he's hired attorneys part of hillary clinton's foundation and given money to president obama and hillary clinton's campaign. >> well, he's very good friends with comey, which is very bothersome but he's also --
we're going to have to see in terms -- look, there has been no obstruction, there has been no collusion. there has been leaking by comey but there's been noclusion, no obstruction and virtually everybody agrees to that. so we'll have to see. i can say that the people that have been hired all hillary clinton supporters. >> so david gurgen, he's declared himself innocent. should the it special counsel stop now? >> no, but i do think you can tell he's trying to discredit mueller so that if in fact the mueller and special counsel finds or has been obstruction or finds there has been collusion, the president's going to declare that fake news. fake findings. done by a bunch of democrats. he's muddying the water in such a way that if they kbaunerate them, he wins, if they find there are issues that ought to be taken on the congress, he's
going to call it all fake. a lot of his supporters, based on the past, are going to agree with him. >> what's he laying the groundwork for? is he hinting mueller might be out of a job soon? >> he wants to bloody mueller up and do it in a way he thinks is subtle there. the problem for the president is that when mueller was first appointed as special counsel, most prominent republicans praised him and he was appointed by president trump's own justice department and director mueller has a stellar reputation having served as 12 years as the fbi director. so the idea that now the president is going to come in here and suggest that he's in the pocket of democrats, even though as others have pointed out, president trump himself has on many occasions contributed money to the democrats over the course of his career. doesn't seem like it's going to wash. >> does this bother you?
is this concerning to you? >> very concerning. it means he's going to gut mueller in the end. the problem is will corker and flake and -- allow him to beat up on mueller like that. >> it would be disaster if he fired mueller or tried to through the justice department. let's turn now to the tame of the other news of the day. here's how it's all gone down. first, there was this tweet for the president and he says here james comey better hope there are no tapes of our conversations before he starts leaking to the press and this moment from the comey hearing and that was june 8th. let's watch this. >> i very carefully chose the words. lordy, i hope there are tapes. >> and this today the president tweeting with all of the recently reported electronic surveillance intercepts, i have no idea whether there are tapes
of my recordsings of my conversations with james comey but i did not make and do not have any such recordings. we have lost 40 days and 40 days that have damaged the trump presidency and cast doubt on his personal credibility as well. >> makes me ill. we have soldiers fighting abroad, a president jerking the american people around on the idea of dangling these tapes that didn't exist. it's a move of a scoundrel, i think and the president's behavior -- and we know republicans don't like it either. this is not any way to run a country. the world's got to be scratching their heads and laughing at us. >> would you describe these last days as self sabotage? >> of course. had it not been for the tweet, it's unlikely comey would have leaked his memos.
we are still the only superpower in the world. we have the most powerful nuclear arsenal. and we have a president of the united states who doesn't care if he makes things up. that undermines our ability to send signals to our adversaries and friends alike. this is real business, serious business and our president, in the way he dealt with this tapes matter for 40 days wasn't taking his job seriously, period. >> it has been said, one republican said the president has been amused by this and all that's been made of it. >> i agree with much of what has been said. i've reached the stage of feeling like yes, there's been a lot of self sabotage but there have been four special elections in the last 40 days too and all these assaults on the president and the democrats have gone zero for four, which means all this
conversation hasn't really moved a lot of the voters who were with him to start with. the question becomes how do we have a conversation in which we can listen to each other and i think in some ways persuade the trump supporters that those of us often critical of the president are not doing it because we want to bring him down. that's not the point. he's failing to meet the standards so often that we sfret presidents and that's disappointing and concerning and can be dangerous. i don't know how we get to a place where every night we throw stones at the president and think that's solving the country's problem. >> i think that's the big moment for our country. >> don't you think it's incumbent upon the president of the united states. because the president is the one who starts by saying the media's fake, there are terrible people.
tla they're liars and on and on and on. and he discredits the former fbi director and anyone who says this should be investigated. anyone who says there was actually tampering with the election, even though most of the intelligence agencies said they did, he says it's fake news. shouldn't that start with the president of the united states. >> yes, but you're expecting him to understand the rules of public administration. this man has never worked for a public organization. he's never been held to that standard. he has no desire to learn how to do it. and he's shown us he's not interested in playing by those rules. the question is whether the other branchs of government are going to continue to allow him to make those rules. >> and let's be honest. he's interested in not telling the truth because much of what he says about the investigation even in creating jobs is simply
not the truth. so to david gurgen's point, we said how do we reach the trump voter? >> i don't know unless you want to start not telling the truth or giving the reality 068 what's actually happening. >> if you take something specific like the tweets, i think it's incumbent upon us as journalists to call out where the president is either wasting time, as douglas said or dithering with the american people. you have a situation where unless there's a strategy that is later revealed about why the president tweeted about these tapes, what you're left with is it's a sense of nonsense. nothing about james comey says -- whether you like him or not, that he can be bluffed or took off his stance. so why the president thought he could do that to director comey is baffling. if you expand it out and think
about what david gurgen said, i agree. the president's approval ratings have never gone high schooler than 45 which suggest to me that on the one hand he's not losing a lot of support and not gaining a lot of support and we're sort of hardening it to camps and we've got to find a way to have a better dialogue. >> i'll give you the last point since we're discussing what you were saying. >> at the same time i think we've got to hold him accou accountab accountable. like this health care bill, of all the things that have been happening, the idea that the united states might actually take money away from poor people, take away their health care and turn it into dollars and give it to the richest people in the country in a country that already has terrible inequality, i find that stunning. we're at point we don't know whether to talk about the president squl the tweets and
craziness or the substance and how the may really effect the very people voting for it. >> i get your point and i think a lot of this is a distraction. we have to discuss it. it's the president but you're right this may be distraction to get people not to talk about it so they can sneak it through under the cover of darkness. when we come back the union iron worker who wants paul ryan's job. >> let's trade places. paul ryan you can come work the iron and i'll go to d.c. >> he'll join me live. ter a dvt. i sure had a lot on my mind. my 30-year marriage... ...my 3-month old business... plus...what if this happened again? i was given warfarin in the hospital, but wondered, was this the best treatment for me? so i made a point to talk to my doctor. he told me about eliquis. eliquis treats dvt and pe blood clots and reduces the risk of them happening again.
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set it free. see you around, giulia some call him a walking, talking bruce springsteen song. he is andy bryce and he's running for congress against paul ryan. >> i decided to run for office because not everybody's seated at the table and it's time to make a bigger table. i'm the best person to represent this district because i'm a working person. if somebody falls behind, we're so much stronger if we carry them with us. that's the way i was raised. you look out for each other. i think it's time. let's trade places. paul ryan, you can come work the iron and i'll go to d.c. >> joining me is andy bryce. welcome to the program.
>> thank you, don. good to be here. >> you're a father, an army veteran, an iron worker, cancer survivor. why do you want paul ryan's job? why do you want to challenge him? >> because paul ryan's been in about 18 years. i've been working iron about 20 years and i just compare what's going on. i can point to things that i literally built. i literally built our community with my hands and i look at what paul ryan has brought to the community and i see jobs leaving. we have a plant being taken away, good paying auto making jobs. uaw plant being torn down. there's a huge facility in jamesville just sitting there and just recently some of the best paying jobs are headed towards canada. >> so are you really serious about this, randy? >> absolutely. i'm dead serious.
it's been over 600 days since paul ryan's been seen in the district. when he's seen there's breaking news alerts and the people have had enough. we want to be heard. our concerns, what problems we're facing trying to raise families. it's ridiculous that paul ryan hasn't been in the area. had to borrow representative from a neighboring district to tell us how this health care bill is going to effect us. >> i want to watch part of this campaign ad. >> this is repealing and replacing obamacare. everybody doesn't get what they want. >> it's a very painful condition. it's like hot knives going through and you can't talk, you can't swallow. it's terrible. i'm going to cry. i'm on 20 drugs and if i don't
take one that costs thousands of dollars, i don't know what would happen. >> so tell us about your mom. >> she's lucky. she's one of the lucky ones. even having ms that can be debilitatingality times. because she has insurance, because she's lucky that my dad had insurance and my dad, by the way has alzheimer's and without the independence that the insurance brings, she can take her medications, she can visit him daily. it's horrible. it's a horrible medical condition that she has but she's a hero to me and i wouldn't be here if it wasn't for her and she's given me the strength. she's raised me to make sure we look after each other. and i can't say enough good things about her. but like i said she's lucky. she's lucky. >> we certainly wish her well. everything is pliticized,
especially the health care bill. what do politicians -- what don't they understand? >> for one i would say paul ryan doesn't understand the first thing about what people in the first district need. they don't understand we're working harder and getting less. and i mean this last health care bill that paul ryan tried pushing, it didn't even look. it didn't have the feel of any health care providing. it's not helping anybody. it's a tax break bill disguised as something that they want to portray as having to do with health. >> you announced your candidacy on sunday and then five days later, here you are. you have won and lost in state and local races before. >> right. and i think you're going to see why the losses took place when you see the new districts that there redrawn due to the
jerrymandering. that's given me -- i was going to say that those races have given me lot of experience and i think that what i've learned has been shown by the way that our campaign has taken off. >> we have you under -- it says iron stache. here's what writer says you have been genetically engineered from one of the boss's songs. he's running against speaker ryan in 2018. he was genetically engineered from bruce springsteen's songs. could you handle, iron stache be his next hit? >> what american worker doesn't love bruce springsteen. the boss rocks. >> that's a nice stache. >> it's a -- i don't want to give away the secret.
maybe come election time as part of the celebration i'll be happy to share the secret. so i'd invite everybody to come and watch the election results in november of 2018. >> thank you for joining us and best of luck to your mother. give her our regards. when we ecome back is the democratic party in crisis? why some are calling for nancy pelosi -- manait's a series of is nsmart choices. and when you replace one meal or snack a day with glucerna
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house minority leader nancy pelosi has a popularity problem but is she really to blame for the disarray in the democratic party or is she a scapegoat? van jones and nina turner. hello, good evening to all of you. becarry, you first. i'm sure you saw this. good evening, brother. i love this. last night i had representative tim ryan on. >> you think nancy pelosi is more toxic than donald trump? >> you know what the honest answer is in some areas of the country yes, she is. >> why so? >> i just think first as unfair
as it is there have been a lot of people that have spent a lot of money running negative ads against her and in certain areas like in some of these special election districts, it doesn't benefit our candidates to be tied to her. >> is that accurate? >> no, i don't think it's accurate and i don't think tim ryan is the answer. >> you think he's a hater? >> regardless of whether he's a hater, it's difficult to blame nancy pelosi for losses they had in kansas, south carolina and georgia. we need to win 24 seats to take back the house and there are 71 seats that are bluer than georgia's sixth. i do believe -- don't throw the baby out with the it bath water. i think the answer is nuance because i think we have a leadership crisis, that we have messaging crisis in the
democratic party and that our leadership, frankly is steal. whether you're talking about nancy pelosi or chuck schumer, we need to revamp our leadership because it's hard to be a party for change when you don't have change at the top. when it looks like the status quo. >> aren't you guys saying the same thing? >> i think he's castigating and throwing blame. forget about all the nancy pelosi has and they want to back the bus up over nancy pelosi and i refuse to let that happen. >> i just happened to run into her and for a second she sort of said the same thing -- >> you would not have the affordable care act right now without the strength of, many others, but particularly without the strength of nancy pelosi. >> look, nba draft was tonight and we should take a message. the teams that were losing wanted to draft players to help
them win and it is as simple as that and if the nba can do that every year, they don't wait every decade, they assess every year. and getting new players on the field doesn't take away from what players have done in the past or legacy players but what it does say that the nba can do that just to win a trophy. we as democrats have to do a real assessment, autopsy and determine whether or not we're going to start to win so that we can push policies that really help the american people. we got lot more than trophies on the line. we got medicare for all, social justice, whole bunch of stuff is on the line for every day working americans in this country. and we got to do better and not having the willingness and have an honest conversation and to do something differently that gets us that. einstein defined it, it's called insanity. >> you worked in the obama
administration -- because now people are saying the republican party is the trump party. there's probably lots of blame to go around. did -- the obama coalition was built around president obama and not necessarily around democrats. was there a false sense of security, democrats and did the obama folks leave any oxygen in the room for anybody else? >> that's a complicated answer. first of all with regard to nancy pelosi, we have a broken democratic party but one of the few things that works well is nancy pelosi. her job is to raise money and keep the democrats together in the house and she's been doing that. i don't think she's the problem with the party. i wouldn't put her even on the list. >> what's the problem? >> everything that bacari just talked about is not just about one person. she's actually -- on the books
she's actually doing her job well but there are a bunch of other jobs not being done well and i think there's a consultant class of people who are incompetent, tone deaf who make a ton of money, who are in the way and as long as they're there, giving bad ideas and still can't tell you where to go and what to do, that's a much bigger problem and so with regard to your question around the obama years, i think that the party got very happy and very lazy having such an extraordinary figure at the top and did not pay attention to the thousand plus people who lost their positions throughout the country and that is a problem. we have to turn our attention to now. but to me it is bazar that out of all people in the party is pick on nancy pelosi. >> and this nancy pelosi
discussion is phenomenal because it's not a question about the individual and whether she does her job well. i think we need to change the face of the democratic party. democrats do well when we have the jfk's and the bill clintons, and the barack obamas. i don't want to mince any words. this is still barack obama's party. we can talk about joe biden, elizabeth warren, we can talk about buernie sanders and this has been the core of the democratic party for a long period of time. that's african american women. we lost this election in 2016 because african american voters, the turnout compared to 2008 and 201220 down in every single swing state. in georgia six african american voters didn't turn out. and so we need to make sure not
only are we getting more progressive, but we also need to make sure we are not taking the backbone of our party for granted. >> so to that -- if it's the obama coalition, that obama coalition didn't turn out and the other side ran against nancy pelosi. they didn't run against president obama. nina. >> and that doesn't mean -- i don't think there's a disagreement among the three of us. i don't personally believe leader pelosi should be thrown under the bus. what i'm saying about the nba analogy is this. fresh doesn't always mean young but it just means at a certain point, a certain time people have to make a different play and that is what we are facing. that's what the democratic party is facing and the point about african american women being the backbone of the democratic party, you dog gone right but what have we gotten for
themselves and their families? there's never been an african american woman serve as governor in the history of this country and democrats should be the first ones doing that. so when you stacey abrams of georgia trying to win that. when is the democratic party actually going to do something for the loyalist part of the base? they haven't done a dog gone thing. people have to come out and vote and sometimes we talk about this as if the voters owe the elected officials something. people have to earn that vote every single time. >> i've got to run. when we come back, how bill cosby plans to educate people about sexual assault one week after he dodged sexual assault charges himself. when heartburn hits fight back fast with new tums chewy bites. fast relief in every bite. crunchy outside. chewy inside. tum tum tum tum new tums chewy bites.
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this is the last thing you'd expect from bill cosby. just days after his trial on aggravated indecent assault charges ended in a hung jury, he plans on town halls. >> we are now planning town halls sometime in july. >> like just talk with people. >> we're going to talk to young people because this is bigger than bill cosby. this can effect any young person, especially young athletes of today and they need
to know what they're facing when they're hanging out and partying, when they're doing certain things they shouldn't be doing and it also effects married men. >> here to discuss now, gloria alred. mark is going to join us by phone. thank you both for joining us. i know you have strong feelings about this town hall idea. please explain. >> i do. this idea of a town hall or work shop that i read was to talk about potentially false allegations against men, false allegations of rape or sexual assault helps them to be educated about this. i think it's just a transparent and slick effort to try to have an impact on the potential jury pool for his second criminal trial. the prosecutor, don, has announced he is going to retry bill cosby.
on the three felony counts against an aggravated indecent assault. so perhaps what he's trying to do is create a climate of opinion to potentially contaminate that jury pool or to influence them depending on your point of view so that if they're selected, they will decide that somehow the charges against him are false allegations and i'm sure the prosecutor would not file allegations unless he believes it was probable cause to believe it was true. >> because the montgomery county district attorney has announced he's refiling those charges, which means another trial. so from a defense attorney's perspiktipe perspective is that a smart idea? >> well, is it something i'd recommend? never. not at this point. not on a day when one of the jurors is reportedly saying the split was 5 to 7 or 7 to 5 on
the count. but more importantly there's two other things going on here and what they're fighting against. you have to understand. they're an advocate for people accusing cosby. she's been doing all kinds of media and so there's an argument she and the others have been polluting the jury pool. that by them doing press conferences and ratcheting up the media, that has a negative effect on them. and when the prosecutor comes out and says before you talk to the jurors, before the prosecutor even knew what the split was because until today t habeen variously reported at 10-2 or 7-5. the prosecutor's got a duty to investigate and decide and harken back to what gloria just said. they got a duty to not just believe there's probable cause
but they're supposed to ethically feel they can get a conviction beyond a reasonable doubt. if they had not done any investigation as to what the jurors thought or what they were fighting over or whether they believed, then technically there's ethical challenges on behalf of the prosecutor and by the way there is not necessarily -- the judge still has to make that decision. they dek do a motion to dismiss in the interest of justice. >> wait a minute. mark, first of all, the judge -- and i was there at the trial -- indicated to the jurors in that first criminal trial that they were not to discuss deliberations or how others voted after they were released from their jury -- wait a second. >> no -- let me play -- gloria,
i want you to finish. >> i want to address your point. >> fwlgloria, i'm playing the sd bite to help you make your point. >> oh, okay. >> it was hopeless. from the first time on, the statute of limitations were running out. >> did that really bother you? >> yes, it does. i think it created this whole thing, a case that was settled in 2005 and we had to bring it up again in 2017. >> the reason i interrupted you i wanted to play that before we ran out of time because you were talking about the juror. >> i thought it was mark. you can interrupt me anytime you want. let me just say i think the juror is a bit confused because the allegation was the subject of a civil lawsuit. it was settled. but there was no criminal
prosecution until now but the law allows -- in other words the statute of limitation s does allow a prosecution anytime within that 10-year period in pennsylvania and the fact that there may be a civil settlement does not mean that there cannot be a criminal case as well. i've been involved in many cases in which there have been both. >> that's going to have to be the last word. sorry. when we come back the story of these twins joined at the head. the extraordinary surgeons that separated them join me next. think again. this is the new new york. we are building new airports all across the state. new roads and bridges. new mass transit. new business friendly environment.
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tomorrow night cnn has a dramatic story of 13-month old conjoined twins and the two world class surgeons who separated them. dr. sanjay gupta reports. >> reporter: just seven hours after the first incision we check in with the family. it's 5:00 p.m. >> really? >> what's waiting in my stomach is for that phone call. i call it the land of the unknown. we're into that area we just don't know are we going to be separated today or are we not? ♪ >> reporter: around 10:00 p.m., 12 hours since the operation started, doctors hit that land of the unknown. >> so i was at a point i was wondering whether we were going to lose both kids. >> he has to stop. >> no, don't do that. the reason why. you'll tear these guys.
>> reporter: the dream of separating these boys is about to end. >> joining me now is dr. james goodrich, the director of the division of pediatric neural surgery and director of cranial facial and aesthetic surgery. thank you, doctors, for joining us. at that point, you had to stop. to have to stop at such a critical point must have been frustrating. >> we were rattled. it was a situation where as the procedure had gone forward, we were changing the blood supply and the direction and it clearly became more complicated. we had to sit back and reassess and work with the radio neurology department. >> and there were several surgeries before this one? >> yes. >> but this was the critical one? >> yes. >> you specialize in skull reconstruction and we have models you brought. you had to basically -- and let
me show the viewer what it is. you can see the faces here and this is how they were connected. there was one face here and on the other side there's another face and they were connected here and there's the brain connected together. what did two, whole skulls once it was complete, correct? >> and the models became helpful in the planning, as well. when dr. goodrich was able to make this separation final, the job as the plastic surgeon, the cranial facial surgeon, is to get it covered. we need to cover their bone as well as their scalp. what we're able to use, is the bone we had to go through to access the areas of division. but we have some tk neeks to be able to split that, to divide that and create enough bone to use for both children. >> right. >> and for scalp, it's dangerous to leave brain exposed. over the course of the previous surgeries, we inserted some
tissue expanders or balloons that ballooned up, and that gave us enough scalp to cover the children. >> the tissue, everything connected own worked after surgery, right? but we understand that one of the twins had a problem with his right arm? correct? >> both did when they woke up. this area that was conjoined here, we had to split through the brain. one child had a hemiplegia on one side. the other child had it on the opposite side. nine months later, both kids are movie ining both arms very well. >> let's look at the video. there's new video of them -- of him, i think you can see. there it is. using his arm. and you said they're both doing okay. they're both using their arms? >> correct. >> everything is working? >> everything is working. pretty amazing. >> how do you feel?
>> it was an incredible experience, to be part of this. fortunately these two boys survived. the parents have two healthy children who should live a normal life. >> is this the biggest or one of the biggest surgeries you had to perform? >> certainly in my career. >> we've been through seven sets that we separated. 28 operations. all of them are fairly unique. what was different was the conjoined brain and the vascu r vascularity. >> the mom's name is nicole. the first time she held them after the surgery. watch this. ♪ >> reporter: meanwhile, four days after the operation, jadon wakes up. he is ready for something his parents had only dreamed of.
he can be picked up and cuddled for the first time. it's as if nicole see him for the first time. >> as a mother, you know when you hold your child, you know every bit of their face. well, his face, also encompassed anias'. my first moment of relearning his face. and he looked up at me for the first time in that way. and i got to see that he was reassured and he was comforted in my arms, which was something i was scared of. he had never been held. and he melted in. and it was wonderful. >> what did you think? what was that like? >> well, we saw the parents so many times before surgery. and it's one of those things you take for granted. but the family, they had a system of bringing both boys in and putting them on the exam
table and turning and twisting, et cetera. but it seems so trivial to everyone else, to be able to hold your child individually. and for mom to bring jadon over and hand him over, it was powerful. >> what about you, dr. goodrich? >> been through this a number of times. and i can tell you, it's the moment, without exception. that opportunity to be able to pick up and hold them as two separate kids is -- it's an emotional moment. >> does everyone get a little misty? >> i think so, yes. >> including the doctors? >> including the doctors. >> thank you. >> thanks for having us. >> it's a pleasure. and thank you for what you do. >> lessons will work out. >> we've been talking about, we're going to go surfing together. a perfect person to have with me. i really appreciate you guys coming on. cnn special report, "separated, savining the twins," tomorrow night at 10:00. tune in. we'll the right back. whoooo.
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question for you -- where do you work? that's often the first question that people ask. but many adults with developmental disabilities have trouble answering because nearly 70% of them do not have jobs. amy wright the mother of two children with down syndrome set out to change that. and that's why he's this week's cnn hero. >> people with minorities are the largest minority in the world. so many of them are used to being in the shadows. our 40 employees are proud to be employed. and they will shout it from the rooftops. it's given them a sense of being valued and respected in ways that we take for granted. >> curious to find out how amy is making this happen? go to cnnheroes.com. and while you're there, nominate
someone who is changing the world to be a 2017 cnn hero. that's it for us. thanks for watching. good evening. thanks for joining us. a number of breaking stories tonight. the health care bill is a secret no more. it could mean drastic changes in the lives of millions of people, whether they're on medicaid, buy insurance as well, or get coverage from work. it does hit home. we'll talk to a gop lawmaker supportive of the plan. and democratic presidential candidate senator bernie sanders who is definitely not. he calls this the most harmful legislation he has seen in his lifetime. he joins me later tonight. we'll also look at what the senate plan means for you if you're counting on having coverage and being able to afford it. first the tale of the tapes. 41 days after first hinting he had tapes with james comey, and after 41 days of mostly playing coy and refusing to actually say, the president fired off a pair of tweets. quote, with all the recently reported electronic surveillance, intercepts, unmasking and legal leaking of