tv CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin CNN July 10, 2017 11:00am-12:00pm PDT
hello. great to have you with us on this monday. i'm pamela brown. we're going to take you to the white house press briefing which is oftf camera. we begin with an admission by the president's son that he met with a russian during the presidential campaign. he says in the summer of 2016 he met with a russian attorney who claimed to have information helpful to his father's campaign. sources tell "the new york times" this woman claimed to have dirt on hillary clinton. and it wasn't just trump junior who attended to find out what the attorney had. the president's son-in-law and now advisor was there as well as was then campaign chairman paul manafort. when asked about the substance, here's what kellyanne conway told cnn's "new day". >> it's very typical to have principles in the meeting. we had a fraction of the staff and a fraction of the money that they had over there in clinton
inc in brooklyn. you're trying to have your viewers think because the principals were in there it was em bued with seriousness that simply is not true. this was standard operating procedure for the campaign. let's focus on what did not happen in that meeting. no information provided that was meaningful. no action taken. >> the president's son responding to all of this with a sarcastic tweet. it does confirm his intent going into meeting was to get information on the opposition. you see the tweet on your screen. and joining me now mark mazetti. mark, great to have you on. this tweet is significant, because it contradicts some earlier statements from donald trump junior, right? >> yeah. there's been an evolving story here really going back several months. a few months ago we asked donald trump junior among other senior members of the campaign if they'd had any contacts with russians during the campaign,
and he said absolutely not, and certainly not anything on policy. on saturday the statement we got from him was that there was such a meeting, but it was about adoptions and it sort of seeped into this issue of an act which is something that the kremlin wants repealed. and sunday we have a story that it was because there was an offer of damaging information about hillary clinton, and then a we have the tweet today. yes, there's a number of statements, and they really have kept changing. >> all this raises the question, because don junior, donald trump junior has repeatedly said he didn't know when who he was meeting with. he was left in the dark and he had a meeting and brought along jared kushner and paul manafort. did he know he was meeting with a rational national, even if he didn't know her name? >> it certainly has the appearance that his intermediary, his acquaintances, as he said, gave him some indication of who he was going to be meeting with, if not specifics about the name or
whether he'd remember the name, he seemed to think it was significant enough to have other senior campaign officials at the meeting. manafort and kushner. and so if we are still obviously trying to learn more about what transpired during the meeting and why it was set up, but this is someone, his intermediary was someone who we now know is connected to his client, a pop star in russian whose father, donald trump, the president, worked with during the 2013 miss universe pageant. there's a lot of linkages. >> what do we know about the russian lawyer and her links to the kremlin? >> she certainly has done work that on cases that advance the interests of the kremlin yk even if she's not a direct government official, she has been advocating in the united states, lobbying to repeal the magenski
act. the kremlin wants that repealed. there's been a lot of tit for tat in washington over that. she is connected in moscow with -- through her business ties to her firm, and so -- and family connections as well. so it's -- it's an evolving thing. but it is certain that at the very least her lobbying interests are very much in parallel with what the kremlin wants. >> and don junior also said that nothing came of it in terms of what she was allegedly offering in terms of helping the trump campaign and hurting hillary clinton's campaign. do we know if there was any followup after this meeting, this initial meeting? >> we don't, and the on the record claims from donald trump junior and others was there was no followup, that there was a one off and ended after a half hour without anything really
coming of it. >> and just before i let you go, as you point out, months ago you were asking this question, did you ever meet with any russians during the campaign, and the answer was no. are you getting any sense from those you're talking to close to the white house, close to don junior as to why they said no when the meeting did in fact happen? >> it's a good question, and, i mean, certainly if we just think about what's happened over the last six months we've gone from the president himself and his advisors saying no government, no meetings with any government officials or russians period, whatsoever, and we've seen a steady stream of reports of meetings. i don't know. whatever was claimed back in january or february we now know is not to be the case, and it is a continuing nagging question why people don't seem to keep forgetting about these meetings that they had. >> and just quickly, there's no indication the president knew
about this meeting, correct? >> there's no indication at this point that the president knew about the meeting. >> okay. mark, thank you very much. >> thank you. i want to bring in any panel now. a former cia counterterrorism analyst, mark preston, mackenzy england, and shamila s a shodri. to break it down, how significant is it that this is the first time we've heard about the willingness to meet with the russian and possibly accept help from a russian national? >> it's very significant. t interesting to hear kellyanne conway say nothing came out of meeting. that's not necessarily the issue right now. the issue is there was a meeting with a foreign national talking about potentially tampering with our election system, passing off
opposition research. i should tell our viewers, and we know this. opposition research gets passed around all the time. however, i don't know of an instance where it was from a foreign government or at least talk about a foreign government being handed over. it's significant because it's july right now, and we are still talking about this issue, and we are seeing a stalled agenda for president trump. >> and also, jared kushner, the fact that he was in this meeting. do you make anything of that? >> the fact that the son was there is an issue, the fact that jared kushner and paul manafort were there is a bigger issue. these meetings just don't happen. i know that there's talk about oh, they just kind of got invited to a meeting and went to it. that doesn't happen on campaigns. it certainly doesn't happen here at cnn. >> and kellyanne conway was making the point that we were a small shop. this wasn't that unusual, but from your perspective, it was significant to a degree. i want to go to the point that opposition research being shared is not unusual.
when it comes from a foreign government, a foreign adversaries, someone connected to russia, what kind of a red flag would that raise to you? >> that would be a huge red flag. and what we're focusing on is what don junior did because he was the con dduit for the meeti. but jared kushner is a government employee with access to the top secret that the united states government has. the fact that he was not willing to put this on his security form when it first came out was a very problematic thing. if you're now meeting with an individual like you said, somebody who has access to a lot of the greatest secrets the united states has, and you forget to tell about i met with a russian lawyer with ties to the kremlin, probably tied to the security services, that's a huge problem. >> and again, he has said repeatedly, mackenzie, that he didn't know who this was. he didn't know the name. he just said this was an
associate of him said will you meet with this person? you've advised campaigns before. is that unusual to take a meeting with someone you don't know and bring in other high profile people from the campaign including paul manafort and jared kushner? >> it's very unusual. you wouldn't want to put all your star power with a loose connection to the grown. you would want to spread out your staff resources if they were such a small shop. why aren't they busy doing other things. it speaks to the mob style lobby where you're an acquaintance of the family, it's that easy to get a meeting. we should all be to lucky to have a meeting with the white house. when a friend of the family suggests, it's okay. that's something that will plague this administration. >> we've had reporting that the russians were trying to use carter page who was connected to the pain to get into the
campaign and hopefully provide intelligence, something he's denied. this this case you hear about something like this happening, what comes to mind? would it be concerning to you that the russians were tieing to use this lawyer to get into the campaign essentially? >> i think the russians are going what they're supposed to do as a foreign government wanting to collect more information on americans. they're able to do it because the trump administration is populated with people who are easily influenced as was the campaign, and i think that's what we're seeing in this yet another example of a questionable meeting, and in this case, i think donald trump junior's behavior is indicative of how the trump organization governs itself. ask for forgiveness later. what whatever you think needs to be done first. >> well, to that point, mark, this has happened repeatedly where they deny something and then low and behold, something did happen. in this case there was a meeting
between don junior and a russian national. why don't they get ahead of this? why didn't they be up front about it months ago when it started to become an issue and focus? why wait for the news to cover it and then change the story the next day? >> a couple things. i think it does go to the culture of how they've worked with the trump organization. the trump organization is not the government. there are a different set of rules. they use a different kind of language. if you notice how the president actually speaks, he talks like a marketer than he does as a commander in chief. there may be a naivete from jared kushner and donald trump junior saying we can get away with this. we're in power and don't have to follow the rules, but you do have to follow the rules even more so in this position. he really has put the white house in an awkward position.
>> it strikes me that not only, of course, was he transparent about the meeting until pressed about it, but also that he changed his story first saying it was about optioadoptions and next day saying there was incriminating information was offered about hillary clinton. is it illegal? >> is it illegal to meet anybody? no? >> looking at the other side, if someone says you're in the middle of a heated campaign, you're trying to win, someone says i've got some information that's going to help your campaign -- >> that's right, but the interesting thing about presidential campaigns is you're going to run into people like that all the time, and you have to learn what is real and what's not? if you have an individual who says i've got this hot juicy thing we're going to torpedo the other side, you have to be careful. even though there's a relationship between don junior and some other folks that led to this one russian lawyer, you need to do preliminary vetting,
especially given we know donald trump had just won the republican nomination. he was theoretically going to become the president of the united states in a 50/50 chance. the fact that you're meeting with individuals with a shady background is difficult to swallow. >> all right. stick around. a lot more to discuss. senator lindsey graham calls it one of the dumbest ideas he's ever heard, and now president trump already backing off his plan to partner with vladimir putin on a cyber security unit. plus how a misleading fox news clip inspired the president to accuse james comey of breaking the law. the details just ahead. and moments away from hearing the white house try to explain all of this. the briefing coming up. stay with us. reless foundation from maybelline new york. beyond matching skin tone... fits skin's texture. blurs pores. controls shine. our most natural look... now, in more shades than ever! maybelline's fit me make it happen maybelline new york.
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ready to of your back pain? new icyhot lidocaine patch. desensitizes aggravated nerves with the max strength lidocaine available. new icyhot lidocaine patch. the kremlin today confirming what president trump tweeted that he and vladimir putin did discuss forming a cyber security partnership. trump has since backed away from that idea. here was the origin sunday morning tweet. take a look. it said putin and i discussed forming a cyber security unit to election hacking and many other negative things will be guarded and safe. but then hours later trump tweeted this. the fact that vladimir putin and
i discussed a cyber security unit doesn't mean i think it can happen. it can't, but a cease fire can and did. trump's reversal came after backlash from some top senate republicans. >> i am sure that vladimir putin could be of enormous assistance in that effort since he's doing the hacking. >> it's not the dumbest idea i've heard, but it's close. tillerson and trump are ready to forgiver and forget when it comes to cyber attacks on the american election of 2016. nobody is saying mr. president, the russians changed the outcome. you won fair and square, but they did try to attack our election system. they were successful in many ways, and the more you do this, the more people are suspicious about you and russia. >> the panel is back with me now. mark, first to you. why did the president change his mind? >> that's an unfair question to ask. for us to actually get inside president trump's mind and try to figure out what he's doing --
i don't know other than than realistically what he did. i wouldn't say it was irresponsible, but it was ill-timed. it wasn't that smart right after the meet, and we're seeing republicans on capitol hill that have been critical of him for putting that out. literally, i think john mccain said it best and said it would be great if vladimir putin joined with us. he wouldn't be doing it because he's the one responsible for it. i don't know why he pulled it back, but we've said this time and time again, and we'll say it throughout the years of his presidency. his words matter and he needs to be careful of what he says. >> his tweet was after the unit was called a significant accomplishment by steve mnuchin. let's listen. >> i think this is a very important step forward that what we want to make sure is that we coordinate with russia, that we're focussed on cyber security together, that we make sure that they never interfere in any democratic elections or conduct
any cyber security, and this is like any other strategic alliance, whether we're doing military exercises with our allies or anything us. this is about having capabilities to make sure that we both fight cyber together, which i think is a very significant accomplishment for president trump. >> okay. so mackenzie, clearly the president and people within his administration are not on the same page here about this. what's going on? >> well, that's also a pattern that we see with this administration. take on the same trip the president concluded, we positively confirmed the commitment to the nato allies that an attack against one is against all. but in his last trip, he did not say that and his advisors, tillerson, said you have to leave that line in there, and he purposely left it out. president trump is basically renowned for not being a master of the details. he thinks he's a good delegator.
he's on a learning curve. it's self-evidence from all the mistakes. >> on that note, the president has not come out and just outright refuted the claim from the kremlin that russia had nothing to do with the election mettling, and putin's denial and so forth even though reince priebus came out and said he didn't accept that denial. what do you make of all this? is this a potential scenario where the president is taking putin's word over the intelligence community? what's your take? >> i don't think it's eve n a potential. you droeon't have to take what intelligence community of the united states -- they're smart and well thought, thought about these things a long time. you can look at what private organizations have done, other folks have said. they've all looked at the evidence and said russia was involved in undermining our election, and hacking into various groups in the united states during the last election. the fact that donald trump
cannot positively affirm this very basic fact is extremely surprising. the fact that he's willing to take vladimir putin, a former kgb officers's word and cannot say this truth occurred is troubling for the americans. it's great for russia. russia can keep pushing on this narrative saying that, well, the president of the united states says this is not actually happening, and they can run with this until the cows come home. >> and when it comes to his openness on createsing the cyber security team and backtracking from that, what do you think? is it that he just doesn't know, doesn't care that putin and russia are serious security threats to the snus. >> -- u.s.? >> i think it shows they don't know how to make policy. so much of policy is done in advance of a big meeting. last week several senior officials in the administration said there is no agenda. trump is just going to meet putin, and so him announcing an
initiative by a twitter and taking it back is indicative of his lack of policy experience. the fact that the treasury secretary is off message is another example. we're dealing with policy novices and people new to politics. >> let me ask mackenzie for a perspective. the president has been open even since the campaign about the importance of having a good relationship with russia. so some may be watching this and thinking what's wrong with trying to team up with russia on something like this? why is lindsey dwram sayigraham this is dumb? >> you have to be shown as somebody who can learn from the past. the barack obama and bush wanted better relations with russia. they put blinders on. russia isn't a helpful partner or our friend and on our side. that's a problem. on the cyber unit in particular, to focus on that area as one of cooperation when that's the obvious biggest point of
convention right now aside from what's happening in ukraine, it shows a lack of understanding of our capabilities. when anything is created, the embryo for the counterweapon is created. to think this is inpenetrable is laughable. >> lots more to discuss. stick around. did a misleading fox news report inspire the president to accuse james comey of breaking the law. that's ahead. and the health care bill is dead. the president daring them to skip their august recess. new details on a bill in serious jeopardy. no, please, please, oh! ♪ (shrieks in terror) (heavy breathing and snorting) no, no. the running of the bulldogs?
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president trump reig nating his f his feud with james comey acc e accusiaccus accusing comey of breaking the law. tweeting james comey leaked class if ied information to the media. that is so illegal. he was referring to a story on fox. according to sources more than half of comey's private memos documenting conversations with the president contained classified material, but the hill report does not say that the memo comey leaked to his friend contained classified information. this is how comey described that memo when he testified last month. >> what kind of information did you give to a friend? >> that the flynn conversation. that the president asked me -- but the conversation in the oval office. >> you didn't consider your memo
or your sense of that conversation to be a government document? you considered it to be somehow your own personal document that you could share with the media as you wanted to? >> correct. >> to your friend? >> i understood this to be my recollection recorded of my confers with the president as a private citizen i felt free to share that. i felt important to get it out. >> all right. with me now brian stelter, cnn senior media correspondent and also jessica snyder. it's clear just from his testimony that james comey did not believe that there was any classified information in the memo he gave to his friend. have we heard from the friend about whether there was classified information in the memo? >> we did just hear from his friend, daniel richmond. he says he doesn't believe that the memo he was given from james comey contained any classified
information. his statement is the memo whose substance i conveyed to the times was not classified at the time, and to my knowledge is not classified now. here's what the hill is reporting. the hill didn't report there was classified informing in the memo. you heard him stress it contained his own personal recollections and not anything classified. the hill reports this. according to their sources the fired fbi director wrote seven memos detailing nine conversations with president trump. four of those memos according to the hill had markings to make clear that they contained information classified of the secret or considerable level. they said it was shown to members of congress only four of them, however, marked classified. and it's made clear from daniel, the friend of james comey who leaked it to the new york times and also comey in the hearing, that the memo that was leaked, that it was not classified. the hill only saying that four other memos were.
>> it raises the question how does he know that it didn't contain any classified information. brian, in your view is this another case of the president selectively choosing what news he believes is real and what is fake? particularly when it comes to reports with anonymous sources, something that he has continuously gone after the media for? >> this is what happen when the president gets his morning briefing from conservative entertainment talk show, the show that prizes pro trump messaging as opposed to one from a reliable news source. this is a mistake that fox made and half an hour later the president tweeted about it. we haven't heard from fox. i've been asking fox if they're going to correct the error. at one point the anchor said this accuses comey of putting our national security at risk, and the report also falsely said there was top secret information. top secret, a defined term in
the u.s. government. no one is saying these memos had top secret information. bottom line is that this is what happens when the president selectively, conveniently hears things on fox that he shares with his millions of twitter followers, creates a news cycle, gets his fans angry at comey and conveniently distracts from what i would argue is the more important story, the story you led the hour with about donald trump junior and manafort and kushner. you might wonder if it's an attempt to create a counternarrative or just convenient. it goes to show how the protrump use universe works. >> there's a pattern. i'm thinking of examples in my head. i remember at one of his rallies when he brought up that there was growing violence in sweden, and he was basing that if you recall, on a fox news report that he had seen. that's because we were all asking where is he getting that information? so this is not the first time that he's taken something from
fox news without verifying it and put it out there to the masses. >> you wonder what would happen if he had someone working with him on his tweets ahead of time to fact check them. if they pulled up the article from the hill, that reporting comes from an outlet that has a sketchy track record, sometimes reliable, other times not so reliable, but it is a news outlet. you could have read the article, checked the facts and before publishing the tweet, corrected it. that doesn't happen. the president impulsively shares something, in this case based on a series of mistakes on fox news. will the show correct it? we'll see about that. i'm curious to see if it comes up in the white house briefing. it's an off camera briefing. we can hear it later. let's find out if the white house wants to walk this one back. obviously his tweet was based on false information. >> right. we hope to hear that on this show. thank you both. >> thank you. the republican health care bill is likely dead.
according to two republican senators, this as the president dares the republicans over their vacations. plus who is the russian lawyer that met with donald trump junior in we're live in moscow with interesting new details on her. stay with us. where are we? about to see progressive's new home quote explorer. where you can compare multiple quote options online and choose what's right for you. woah. flo and jamie here to see hqx. flo and jamie request entry. slovakia. triceratops. tapioca. racquetball.
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break. but they are just three weeks before the next recess. mitch mcconnell is trying to find a way to save the republican's health care bill. while some gop senators are saying the bill is likely dead, president trump for his part weighing in on twitter this morning tweeting i cannot imagine that congress would dare to leave washington without a beautiful new health care bill fully approved and ready to go.
and this just in. protesters are being removed from republican offices on the hill. this video is just coming in, including senators flake and cruz where the protests are happening. i want to bring in our cnn national politics reporter. mj, a white house official is saying trump won't play a large role in selling the republican health care bill. >> this isn't prisurprising. if you look at the way president trump has engaged in the process over the last six months, you can imagine why a lot of republicans sort of thought that his involvement did more harm than good. a couple of things i would point out. president trump throughout this process has set arbitrary deadlines, whether it's a time line for getting a proposal out or having a vote that republican couldn't meet. that was an uncomfortable position the president has put republican lawmakers in.
he has also sort of been repeatedly off message when it comes to the big policy goals that republican lawmakers have on capitol hill when it comes to repealing and replacing obama care. and he also has shown he's not very well versed when it comes to the detail policy leading to some republicans to sort of wonder how can he be so involved in the negotiations if he's not really that interested in the minute policy details of health care, and probably the biggest burn that senate republicans are thinking about is when president trump went out there a couple weeks ago and said that the house bill was mean. this was several weeks after he celebrated the passage of the house bill in a rose garden ceremony. they're looking back at this and thinking look, this is already a difficult process, and we might be better off without the president mettling in a process that has already been very
and this just in to cnn. donald trump junior responding to the request to be interviewed saying he would be happy to meet with the committee to pass on what he knows. meanwhile who is the woman at the center of the meeting with donald trump junior? that's what a lot of people are asking. this meeting took place during the campaign at trump tower, and so far we know natalia veselnitskaya is a russian lawyer who apparently had enough clout to land a meeting with some of the top players on the trump campaign. but who is she? we're joined by ivan watson. the kremlin is denying knowing her and saying the kremlin was not aware of this meeting. what do we know about her?
>> reporter: that's right. the kremlin has distanced itself from natalia veselnitskaya saying they do not know who she is and they should not be expected to keep track of every russian lawyer who travels abroad or to the u.s. as for veselnitskaya, we reached out and have been in communication with her. she has not agreed to an interview. she did give a statement to the new york times. he does not represent the russian government and she also insisted she did not discuss the presidential campaign during her meeting with donald trump junior in june of 2016. what we do know is there was legislation from 2012 that included sanctions first against russians, when it was expanded, who were implicated in human rights abuses and in large scale corruption. in response to this, the russian
government banned the u.s. adoption of russian children, and she was very much involved in this. one other bit that we know about her or these ties are that bob goldstone is who is a president of an entertainment company, he told cnn he helped organize the meeting with veselnitskaya as a request to a client named emin agalarov who had business with donald trump senior with the miss universe pageant of 2013 and president trump actually appeared in a music video of this singer, agalarov. >> the president as we know agreed on three key issues with putin when they had the meeting last week, but he's already backing off one of the agreements when it comes to the
cyber security initiative. how is moscow reacting? >> the kremlin spokesman was asked about this. and he kind of said, well, it's not entirely clear that this cyber security working group or unit that president trump and president putin both discussed on friday, it's not clear that it's been cancelled. he said no promises had been made to establish it, but there's no question that the two top diplomats who accompanied the two presidents in that two-hour and 15 minute long meeting came out with three things. they were a regional cease fire in syria. appointing a u.s. envoy to deal with the war in ukraine that russia is implicated in and this kind of working group that wasn't clearly defined. secretary tillerson said it would probably include people from the state department and the national security advisor. later president trump tweeted that it would be an inpenetrable
cyber security unit, and hours later he said it can't be formed. one of the three accomplishments now appears to be dead. just 48 hours after both presidents seem to agree on it. a russian official who was at the g-20, she said that it could be some kind of bilateral mechanism or it could involve the united nations. so it was a hazy kind of proposal that now seeps to be falling to pieces so soon after that historic meeting. >> all right. ivan watten live from moscow for us. thank you. any moment from now the white house responding to questions about this meeting that we were just discussing. plus questions about what really happened inside the sit down between the president and vladimir putin. stay with us. we'll be right back. have laser drilled holes. they release medicine fast, for fast pain relief. tylenol®
top of the hour now. i'm pamela brown. we're about to bring you the white house press briefing which was off camera. the press secretary expected to answer questions on the admission by the president's son that he met with a russian during the presidential campaign. donald trump junior now says in the summer of 2016 he met with a russian attorney who claimed to have information helpful to his father's campaign. sources tell "the new york times" that this woman claimed to have dirt on hillary clinton. and it wasn't just trump junior who attended the meeting to find out what that attorney had. the president's son-in-law and now key advisor, jared kushner was there as well. as was then campaign chairman paul manafort. when asked about the substance to the meet, here's what kellyanne conway told cnn's "new day". >> it's very typical to have principals in the meeting. we had a fraction of the staff and a fraction of the money that they had over there in clinton
inc in brooklyn. you're thinking it had seriousness that just simply is not true. this was standard operating procedure for the campaign. let's focus on what did not happen in that meeting. no information provided that was meaningful. no action taken. nothing. >> the president's son responding to this with a sarcastic tweet. that does, in fact, confirm his intent. in going into this meeting was to get information on the opposition. joining me now dan. dan, this tweet contradicts earlier statements we received from donald trump junior, right? >> that's right. and not just from donald trump junior. from a series of campaign officials that denied in the past that there were any connections or meetings between trump campaign officials and the russians. this is significant. there's reasons on capitol hill this isn't significant, but it's also significant because it knocks the trump administration off message.
they've acknowledged in the last few days that it's harder to get things done on capitol hill because of these swirling russia stories. and we just got a tweet from donald trump junior who said he would be willing to talk to people on capitol hill about what he learned. that is obviously going to be significant if and when that happens. but from a legislative standpoint, you have to remember donald trump is trying to get things done on capitol hill while all of this is going on. and his aides believe that when he went to poland, when he went to gemny and met with putin, this would be take care out of the story that has been hanging over this white house for really months now. and it doesn't seem to have done that. he touched down here in washington d.c., and hours after he landed this story came out. and then you saw the change in topic, the change in explanation. at first it was a meeting just on adoption policy. and that's why they had it. and then you saw donald trump junior kind of add to that statement and say it was actually because he wanted to try to get some dirt on hillary
clinton. all of this will be evaluated by invest g investigators on capitol hill. that will compound the white house is having with these investigations. >> all right. dan, thank you so much. and now i want to bring in my panel. there is so much to discuss. jennifer tow, as well as matthew whittaker, also with us john nixon and of course my colleague gloria borger. i want to go to gloria first. i want to break this down for us. it's not unshl for a campaign to want the dirt on the opponent. >> absolutely not. >> what is significant? what is unique about this situation? >> well, what's unique about this situation is not the fact
that you want dirt on another campaign. okay? we've all been there, done that, campaigns do that all the time. what's significant is that it's from a foreign national from russia, from somebody where this meeting was set up in a chain that apparently people in the trump campaign knew this person who knew another person, and this meeting was set up to provide this dirt. donald trump junior in his statement said that he was not told her name prior to the meeting, and that's also odd, because when you're the son of somebody who is likely to be the nominee of the party at that point, it would seem to me that you would only be meeting with people with whom you knew or had some interest in or why would you waste your time? >> right. and not only -- it wasn't just him. it was jared kushner. the president's son-in-law. paul manafort. >> the chairman of the campaign. >> the