tv The History of Comedy CNN July 21, 2017 10:00pm-11:00pm PDT
>> yeah, it certainly came off that way. for all of our viewers joining us, we are just at the top of the hour, a busy one, the end of a very busy week. a new story out in "the washington post" saying that russia's ambassador, ambassador sergey kislyak, ambassador to the u.s., told his kremlin bosses that he did in fact talk about campaign matters with then senator jeff sessions. current and former u.s. officials telling "the washington post" they know from american intelligence intercepts. if true, it is also possible the russian ambassador was boasting to his bosses. but if it wasn't a boast and the information bears out, it does cast serious doubt on the credibility of jeff sessions, the highest law enforcement official in the land, who denied having any contacts with russians during the campaign about the campaign. this is what attorney general sessions said during his confirmation hearing back in january. >> if there is any evidence that campaign communicated with the p russian government in the course of this campaign, what will you do?
>> senator franken, i'm not aware of any of those activities. i've been called a surrogate a time or two in that campaign and i did not have communication was the russians. >> he said he didn't have communications with the russians. then when asked in a written question whether he had been in contact with anyone connected to any part of the russian government about the 2016 election, either before or after the election day, sessions responded no. now listen to what he said when he recused himself from the russia probe back in march. >> let me be clear, i never had meetings with russian operatives or russian intermediaries about the trump campaign, and the idea that i was part of a "continuing exchange of information" during the campaign between trump surrogates and intermediaries for the russian government is totally false. >> now, listen to what the attorney general said in the senate testimony back in june.
listen to how he's changed what he is saying. >> i have never met with nor had any conversation with any russians or any foreign officials concerning any type of interference with any campaign or election in the united states. >> all right. >> so cnn's sara murray joins us from the white house. first of all, have you reaction to all of this? >> well, we asked the white house for a reaction. we have not heard from them yet on this tonight. obviously we know that the president has had some concerns about jeff sessions recently. he aired them in an interview with the "new york times", mainly lashing out that sessions has recused himself from the russia investigation, which sessions was of course told to do by lawyers at the department of justice. we have a statement tonight from justice department spokeswoman flores, so i'm going to read that to you. she says, obviously i cannot comment on the reliability of what anonymous sources describe in wholly uncorroborated
inlligence intercept that "the washington post" has not seen and that has not been provided to me, but the attorney genel stands by his testimony from just last month before the senate intelligence committee when he specifically addressed this and said he never met with or had any conversations with any russians or any foreign officials concerning any type of interference with any campaign or election." so that's the statement from the department of justice. still waiting to see if the white house weighs in on it this evening, but clearly a tough week for jeff sessions. >> sara, what is interesting about the statement is it says he stands by his amended statement which was in his second time testifying under oath where he said never had contacts with russians about interference in the campaigns or the elections, whereas previously he said never had any campaign contacts with the russians, full stop. >> well, right. and that's what's continued to dog this white house, right? the fact that they were so adamant, jeff sessions, but so many officials in this white house, adamant there was no contact with any russian
officials and then you find out drip, drip, drip, there was this meeting, there was that meeting. this obviously has to do with jeff sessions' conversation in particular with russian ambassador kislyak. but we're seeing this kind of thing continue to trip up other people who were close to president trump. obviously his son-in-law jared kushner, his own son donald trump jr. it is the reason michael flynn was eventually fired and is no longer serving in this white house. this is the kind of thing that has come back to haunt the west wing over and over again. circumstances also, sara, this could not come at a worst time for jeff session, given what the president just said about him to "the new york times" the other day. >> well, that's right. it's essentially a double whammy. sure, sarah huckabee sanders says the president has confidence in sessions, and if he wanted sessions out he would be out. but these were very difficult comments. if you are anyone serving for the president, if you are someone who decided to serve in %-p that was probably safe for him for quite a long time. he was one of the first people to endorse president trump, and
president trump repaid that by lashing out in the "new york times" about how jeff sessions was very unfair to him and should have told him at the outset he was going to recuse himself from the russia investigation. if so, the president would have chosen someone else. like i said, not a great week to be jeff seions. >> although at beginning he didn't know he was going to recuse himself from the russia investigation because that was all based on his statements. anyway, sara murray, thank you very much. i want to bring in cnn contributor and "washington post" adam entes, one of the three names in the biline of "the washington post" story. for his part he has financially supported her organization, the american union fund. also with us scott jennings, maria cardona and jason miller. so adam, first of all, i just want to focus with you. the report about the attorney general, just explain what you are reporting tonight. what's the story? >> so, you know, we reported back in march that when sessions appeared before the senate judiciary committee and was
asked the question about, frankly, al franken didn't really ask him that question, but his answer was that he didn't have any contact, communications with the russians, we found out that wasn't the case, that there was a meeting at the rnc on the sidelines of the rnc that he had a meeting with kislyak, and that there was a second meeting in his office in september. we subsequently learned that they were kislyak and sessions attended the same event in april where trump gave his first foreign policy speech. >> i recall. >> we were trying to figure out what were the contents of these contacts? what they discussing? so, you know, sessions specifically said he did not discuss campaign matters in his march 2nd appearance where he announced his recusal. >> right. he was very blunt about that. >> well, he was blunt about it when referring to the -- you know, i guess the july event. he was a little bit less clear when referring to the september event. the bottom line is we wanted to find out, you know, whether that
was true. so what we learned is that kislyak had reported back to moscow about two conversations in 2016 with sessions. the first one in april, the second in july in which he reported that he told moscow that they did discuss campaign issues. >> and it is possible -- and this is based on u.s. intelligence intpts -- >>orrect. >> you haven't heard the intercepts but you have spoken to people who have? >> correct. i don't know if they listened or read intelligence reports based based on those intercepts. >> it is possible and you write about this in the article as well, that kislyak is lying, that he is boasting or embellishing to his bosses to make himself seem more important. >> he could be doing that. he could also be planting false information to throw off u.s. intelligence analysts, which is a practice. but let me just vouch for kislyak. in the past his reporting has appeared to be accurate -- >> this is according to what intelligence people you have talked to?
>> according to actually u.s. diplomats and other officials that dealt with him over the years. not only that, but we did an earlier story that was about a meeting at trump tower in december where kushner, the son-in-law of the president, also met with kislyak, and kislyak also reported that conversation and the contents of that proved to be accurate. >> to those that read a conspiracy, that perhaps president trump is behind this leak because based on what he said, his anger about jeff sessions in that article in the "new york times", you have had this information about the intercepts for sometime? >> yeah, no, and, frankly, it has been rather obvious to people who were looking at it when members of congress, democrats particularly, started making public calls saying they believed there was a third meeting and asking for an investigation of the third meeting. comey testified in early june in which he basically said, you know, there is -- he had reason to believe that sessions would have had to recuse himself, but he wasn't going to be able to
discuss at that session in open session what that information was. so, you know, the bread crumbs, if you will, were being left in those june appearances, and so that's when we started to piece this together. >> maria, you know, a lot of people could listen to this and say, look, what is the big deal if jeff sessions meets with the russian ambassador and talks about the trump campaign? he was on the campaign, one of the top surrogates. it would seem normal. what else is he going to talk to the russian ambassador about when he is at the convention? that's all you talk about is the campaign. so there is that question. >> sure. >> the other question is why then does sessions just not say yeah, i talked to him about the campaign, but sort of have to go twice to amend his testimony, now maybe a third time? >> and that's exactly the point, anderson. if, in fact, it was no big deal, why did he perjure himself then, trying to cover it up? if this is true, that's exactly what happened. so put aside how damaging and
damning this is for jeff sessions and the trump administration. this is a big deal. and jeff sessions could be in big trouble legally, because if it is true, you know, i thought the first time around that he had perjured himself because he had lied. but this is proof that if these meetings happened he willfully perjured himself before congress. >> i have a hard time believing a man like jeff sessions would willfully perjure himself in the way you're sitting here discussing. look, we sat here for months and have listened to people say the russians are bad, you can't trust the russians, the russians are all liars. tonight we hear we got to take this russian's word as the gospel when the story points out that sometimes they lie, sometimes they embellish. right now all we know is kislyak's word versus whatever the justice department's statement is, which they deny any wrongdoing in this conversation. you raise that point. and the other critical point you raised, anderson is there a big
deal here? wouldn't we expect sort of conversations like this to be going on? jeff sessions says nothing bad happened in these conversations. >> why did he lie about them then? >> he did in that march -- when he recused himself he said clearly, never met with any russians. >> sure. >> to discuss, you know, anything going on with the campaign. >> i'm not denying that i wish they had gotten all of the meetings right on the front end, but that doesn't mean somebody willfully lied about it, which is your word. >> but it means he could have. >> and it doesn't mean he discussed anything that was any big deal. >> pretty damning. >> margaret? >> the content of the conversation is what is relevant and we don't know the content of the conversation was. if the content of the conversation was talking about the campaign and possible coordination with the russian government about the campaign, that would be an incredibly big deal. we don't know what it was. the problem is that jeff sessions has lost an enormous amount of credibility for people who want to defend him. for republicans who actually
while don't agree with many of his policies, i want to think that this long serving senator actually has the integrity to tell the truth when he is being questioned in front of the united states senate and the american people. now i have a hard time defending him because there are just too many times. >> other breaking news, paul manafort say they will speak to the senate judiciary committee. not going to be in the public on wednesday. we'll tell you the details of that ahead. when you've been making delicious natural cheese for over 100 years like kraft has, you learn a lot about people's tastes. honey, what do you want for dinner tonight? oh whatever you're making. triple cheddar stuffed sliders. sold! what's going on? oh hey! ♪ that's it? yeah. ♪ everybody two seconds! ♪ "dear sebastian, after careful consideration of your application, it is with great pleasure that we offer our congratulations
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talking about the latest bombshell report from "the washington post." adam from "the washington post" is with us to discuss. i want to read the department of justice statement to all of you. that just came out. it says, "obviously i cannot comment on the reliability of what anonymous sources describe in wholly uncorroborated intelligence intercept that "the washington post" has not seen and has not been provided to me, but the attorney general stands by his testimony from just last month before the senate intelligence committee when he specifically addressed this and said that he never met with or had any conversations with any russians or any foreign officials concerning any type of interference with any campaign or election." interesting. i mean, adam, you tell me your reading of that statement, but they're not standing by his statement from march saying he had no contacts with any russians during the campaign about the campaign. now it is the focus on his june statement which was amended about interference. >> right. so, yeah, no, i mean clearly they have decided -- >> they're not saying it is not true. just saying your sources are uncorroborated.
>> well, they're really not responding to the story. >> right. >> what they're basically do is saying there's no communication was the russians about coordination or about what russia was doing in the election. frankly, we have nobody telling us that that was in any way discussed in any of those meetings. what we are reporting is basically that they did discuss campaign matters contrary to what sessions said in his march 2nd press conference. >> right. and that goes to the credibility of jeff sessions. carl? >> you know, there's a move here for the former attorney general -- or the current attorney general of the united states, and that is to look at the president of the united states who has thrown him under the bus and go to congress and say, "i'm here to tell you everything you want to know about what happened in our campaign with the russians. ask me anything you want, i'm going to tell you everything, i'm going to tell you what the president and i talked about, i'm going to tell you what flynn and i talked about, i'm going to tell you what the russian ambassador and i talked about," and then we will have some clarity.
>> why would we trust -- >> let's see what he says. i don't know if we will trust him, but let's listen to him and see if this coverup continues, because he is in a position to ll us a lot, and perhaps now that the president has thrown him under the bus he might have motivation to let us know what he knows. is that a radical idea? >> it is, and it would make sense, but we know that this is an administration that doesn't listen to common sense. this could have been so much better handled from the get-go. we have all talked about this, right? just to be straight, to be honest, to be transparent, which is what they always talk, about what actually happened. >> unless -- >> the fact -- exactly. the fact they haven't been able to do that each and every time and the fact that we continue to find out nuggets about the russian either interference or collusion or conversations about campaign -- >> remember, filled out a form straight three times, a number
of these people. >> exactly. and everybody seems to have that symptom, right? there seems to be some kind of syndrome when it comes to the russians of forgetfulness. >> let's also be transparent what we're seeing here. everyone has see "friday night lights." here we have another episode of friday night leaks. another day, another friday where the president and his team have another excellent friday and here we go with another leaked report to set it up for the weekend and the sunday shows. so here is what -- >> but he's been -- they've had this information. they've been working to try to get this information for a long time. >> again, a report no one at this table has actually seen the transcript of what is actually in this, and we're relying on what supposedly this russian ambassador said in his communication that he knows would have been monitored going back home. look, no ambassador or spy or whatever kislyak is in the history of mankind is going to go and file a report saying another completely worthless week here. i learned absolutely nothing.
of course they're going to go -- >> i will say jay sekulow, the president's attorney when arguing on donald trump jr.'s behalf on this program and everywhere, was taking the word and quoting the russian attorney's standpoint of what she said in a television interview as a reliable source. so i think -- i totally agree you can't take a russian ambassador, but i'm not sure -- >> i'm not vouching for any russian here, but i think that there is a key point in the story as i read it through the second time. in the report from the russian ambassador he made the comment they had a substantive conversation. i think the word substantive was in quotes. i'm not sure if it was a translation issue or if it was in quotes. attorney general sessions said there was no meeting. clearly there's a disconnect here, because if there was no meeting and there was no substantive conversation, then this is absolutely false on its face. just period point-blank. completely debunks it, end of story. that's a key detail right there. >> it doesn't make it false that it never happened. it makes it false that the guy
was lying, which is in "the washington post" report. >> i think it makes it very clear that if there is no meeting, i think it makes it very clear this gentleman was lying. >> what if there was? >> yes. >> if there was, that's a big problem for jeff sessions in and of itself. >> adam? >> it is how you define it in first case. is a meeting a ten-minute conversation when everybody else is in a greeting line to shake the hand of the candidate trump? is that sufficient for kislyak to ask some questions of sessions and get some answers and then write a report? sessions -- >> that wouldn't be substantive. >> i think it is in the eye of the beholder what substantive means. >> under definition -- >> i'm not sure -- >> can you see from one who is a trump supporter where it would raise serious red flags, literally and figuratively. it is like, wait a minute, this doesn't pass the smell test that there was any there there.
again, i can't believe that we're putting this much stock in, you know, the intercepted -- to begin with, you know, cable, phone call or whatever it was between a russian ambassador going directly back to his people when, of course, he is going to go and tell a story to begin it up to make it sound -- >> and we don't know what the story is. we don't know the contents of the meeting. you used the word nugget of collusion. there's no nugget here. >> we don't know that. or ketchup pacts. there is nothing here. >> we don't know that. >> do you know the contents of the meeting? >> no. here is the problem. the problem is history, right? it strains credulity that the attorney general of the united states who was supposedly prepared for a -- a briefing, a testimony before congress -- and i have been in these briefings preparing cabinet secretaries for these. they are meticulous. when the russia story was front and center, for him to forget these kinds of meetings twice, maybe now three times?
i'm sorry, it strains credulity. the flip side of what you're saying, if you are a trump critic you can understand why this then feeds into the notion that the trump administration does not have any relationship with the truth whatsoever. >> all we know tonight is it is jeff sessions' integrity versus some russian's word on a cable we haven't seen. and until somebody tells me that this russian is somehow more credible than jeff sessions who i know is credible? i'm inclined to believe that. >> he has already lied. he has already lied. >> say mr. attorney general -- >> going to end uppancing the question, of course. don't you think that's where it's going toind up? >> don't you think aft two testimoniesin' oath thate would have already answered that question? >> he has to go back and clean up, no question about that. this is where it will wind up. he will go back and answer questions, but it doesn't mean we're going to find out something nefarious happened. >> it certainly does not, and it would be a delight to learn what happened, nefarious or even
better than nefarious, answers that would show us that nothing happened. that would be good for the country, good for the president. >> but, carl, we can't rake attorney general sessions over the coals every time the russians want to put out information. >> who is talking about raking session over the coles? >> he is getting attacked -- >> he is getting attacked by the president. >> that's the person who is -- >> who is raking him over the coals more? >> the president of the united -- >> slow down, please. >> the president of the united states raked the attorney general of the united states over the coals yesterday in a way no attorney general i have ever heard of has been raked over the coals by the president. that's where we are. where we also are is the reality that so far for six months not a single official in the trump white house, in the campaign, in the trump family has come forward and said, i want to be open with you, i want to tell you what happens here. >> do you want to -- >> he gave us e-mails --
>> i want to understand what you're saying. >> no, in fact, i would love to see all of these people say, here is what happened, nothing nefarious happened, here are the meetings, here are the contents of what was disclosed and discussed. >> yeah. >> end of story. >> nothing happened, they don't have to come forward to say nothing happened. >> this is trey gowdy's point, which is anybody who met with any russians tell the special counsel, don't wait for the "new york times" or "washington post" to drag it out. >> i rest with trey gowdy. >> more to talk about. take another break. also russian related. donald trump jr.'s and paul manafort's testimony to the senate judiciary committee. not sure how they're going to give it. we will tell you all of the details we know ahead. point decisively with your glasses. abracadabra! the stage is yours. step two. choose laquinta. where you'll feel like the king of the road. check out our summer rates now
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the republican chairman chuck grassley threatened to subpoena them for their appearance. instead, they agreed to provide records to the committee. they agreed to a private interview. a date has not been set yet. they agreed to do it with senators as well as staff members. it is notable donald trump jr. in particular agreed to this. remember, anderson, it was just last week in which he said he would be willing to tell congress everything under oath about that meeting that he took at trump tower with russian officials during the campaign season in which he was promised dirt on the clintons, that both paul manafort and jared kushner were also at. it was very clear as soon as that invitation came for a public hearing, instead, anderson, he worked behind the scenes to avoid a public hearing. we'll see if that ever comes to pass, anderson. >> so they won't appear at wednesday's hearing in public. it is possible they may still have to appear publicly at some point, is that correct? >> it is possible. now, that is a threat that a judiciary committee is continuing to keep out there. chuck grassley, the chairman, did tweet after the news was
announced about this deal saying that he does expect them to "also appear openly." so there's no expectation that they should appear as well, but, of course, if they decline to do so, that would force the committee to either subpoena them, and then that could lead to a long process to try to get them to appear. so that may never happen if they decide not to. also, anderson, jared kushner, the president's son-in-law, coming before the house and senate intelligence committees senate, tuesday to the house.n but also behind closed doors. unclear if that will ever happen publicly or if we will learn exactly what happen in that classified session. >> manu raju, thanks very much. back with the panel. carl, earlier you made a point, and i think an important one, these behind-closed-doors testimony actually can be more efficient because you don't have senators or congress people playing to the cameras and you also have their staff asking questions. so it can be more direct. >> yes, and you also have the opportunity, as the senator has said, to bring them back in a
public session and you can issue a subpoena, but also donald trump has been talking about a witch-hunt. it seems to me that one of the things that the investigators in the house and the senate want to do is make sure that there is nothing that even could be interpreted as a witch-hunt. >> not make it a spectacle? >> well, first find out what these people have to say. find out what evidence they have. ask them are they going to be forthcoming and go on with the procedure that is normal investigative procedure that enables them to have a hearing in which the most evidence is produced. this is a first step. it puts the onus on manafort, it puts the onus on donald trump jr. to come up with information. if they don't, there are plenty of avenues left to the investigators to bring them before the full committee. >> adam, is it clear how much information the committees will get in terms of e-mails? i mean donald trump jr. has shown, you know, photographs of
an e-mail chain. we don't know if it is the entire chain, we don't know if there were other e-mails. do we know? >> no, i don't think we know. we don't know how much also -- you know, we have jared kushner who will be in front of the senate intelligence committee on monday. >> again, privately. >> right. you know, obviously there's been some sharing of information. we don't know how much has actually been shared, how much they have that they're going to be able to cross check with him, that they have from intelligence, for example, like what we're talking about today. they have similar intercepts of kislyak talking about jared kushner. i'm not exactly sure, you know, if those are the kinds of things that they would -- i'm sure that's the kind of thing they would want to ask out. i'm not sure how much information they can share about at because of the classification of it. these are the kind of questions we're waiting to see, you know, whether or not he's -- you know, we're going to get versions of these events in ways that are more detailed or possibly conflict with the way it's been reported or the way it's out there currently. >> jason, i mean you know how
these things work. what is the -- i mean is it simply to avoid the public spectacle someone would want -- if it was me being called, i probably would want to do it in private. i wouldn't want to be hauled in front of cameras. is that just common sense for anybody trying to get it to be private if they can? >> well, i'm not an expert necessarily on this aspect of the hill testimony, but i think there are a couple of things here. i think it probably makes sense for both sides. i think as carl pointed out and we actually agree on this matter, i think this is probably smart for the -- both the members of the house and the senate because i think if they're playing to the cameras or if it is perceived they're playing to the cameras, particularly if the criticism of the president's son or son-in-law becomes very pointed or if we do see folks who are grandstanding or trying to get themselves a youtube moment in advance of 2020, that's going to backfire and look really bad. i think what we need here, everybody i think would agree across the board, is to ask some tough questions, get the straight answers and, again, we
have seen from jared kushner, we have seen from donald trump jr. a very direct statements and willingness to say, you know what, i'm more than happy to come forward, answer completely and honestly and get everything out there. now, i know manafort through a spokesperson made similar type comments in months previously. i will let him do his own speaking, but what we need here are answers. let's go ahead and get to that point and not make it a big spectacle. >> their testimony could be released also. this session does not necessarily have to remain off the record. i'm sure those terms have been agreed to yet. >> a lot of people prefer transparency, they prefer public testimony, they prefer to see it all in the sunlight. the one thing i will say is that it doesn't matter what they say, whether in private or public, every single thing they share with the senate also will be reviewed by robert muller. everything that robert muller examines will become public. even though thisticular one -- >> is that true? >> everything that is relevant will become public to the american people.
that's robert mueller's charge at the end of the day. >> he doesn't have to do a public -- adam -- >> all will come out eventually. >> we're not sure robert muller -- >> after watergate, it comes out in the end. >> we're not sure that robert mueller is going to be there for the duration, because the president of the united states is doing everything he can to ensure that robert mueller won't be there. that's a really important fact to keep in mind. >> -- sessions resigns or is fired and a new attorney general is appointed, that person then who no longer has to recuse himself from the russia investigation, they are overseeing the robert mueller investigation, correct? >> presumably. i think if it gets to that, it is another can of worm that the trump administration opens. >> at least for democrats it is. >> well, i don't know. >> well, for republicans because that's a line that republicans might not want to cross. >> right. i think republicans certainly won't be happy with it. but i think that this -- everything we are talking about, jeff sessions and even these
testimonies, whether they're going to be public or private, goes to credibility. we are talking about this, anderson, in the shadow of what to me has been an astounding 24-hour news cycle. this just broke, the sessions thing just broke before we went on the air. we have two other astounding pieces of journalism from the "new york times" and i think "the washington post" as well, one much which talking about how the trump campaign is trying to discredit robert muller. the second one talks about how they're having conversations about whether it is possible for trump to pardon his aides and whether he can pardon himself. in the spotlight or in the shadow of those stories, again, the underlying thread here is they have done nothing to convince the american public that they are dealing with them in a straight manner, that everything that has come out of their mouth has been a complete and total lie. i think that is a huge problem going into in. >> scott, do you want to respond? >> i think we talked for several days now. the path out here for donald
trump jr. and for kushner is to go testify. they've agreed to do that, just as they said they would. i think the private testimony is interesting and it doesn't necessarily mean they won't testify in public if that's what the senate committee wants them to do. i would also point out one other issue. the implications of having a serving senior staffer to the president answer questions before congress, i believe both the obama and bush administrations held in many instances that assistance to the president should not be forced to answer questions from congress. what i think is note worthy here is kushner is going to answer questions, which to me shows a willingness to be more transparent than some other administrations have held you have to be. >> yeah, we got to take a break. as murray said, a busy night. after a busy week. much more ahead. including a shake-up in the west wing staff. find out who is leaving the trump administration next. pistae a good source of protein. that's why they're my go-to snack while i get back in shape.
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well, sorry "snl" but sean spicer is out at white house spokesman. sarah huckabee sanders takes his place. she'll be reporting to the new white house communications director anthony scaramucci who answered questions today at a white house briefing that made news for another reason as well. it was actually televised. he answered a wide range of questions and had plenty of kind words for the man he'll be reporting to. >> the president is a winner. what we're going to do is do a lot of winning. i love the mission the president has. i love the president. i obviously love the country. he's genuinely a wonderful human being. i love the president and i'm
very, very loyal to the president. i love these guys. i respect these guys. i love the president. the president as phenomenal with the president. the president himself is always going to be the president. i think he's got some of the best political instincts in the world and perhaps in history. he's done a phenomenal job for the american people. he is the most competitive person i have ever met. okay, i've seen this guy throw a dead spiral through a tire. i've seen him at madison square garden with a top coat on, standing in the key, hitting foul shots and swishing them. he sinks three foot puts. >> carl bernstein, margaret hoover back. joining us mike dantonio and alice stewart. i don't know about three foot putts, i don't know what that means. scaramucci is not a politician. he has a successful record in the business world. the most difficult thing it seems about this job in any white house is planning the communication message. but particularly with this president who often changes the message, even if you plan a made
in america week, that's not what the president is talking about. >> is that what this is, made in american week? >> i believe it was. >> we all had the opportunity to put such praise on our new boss as he did, we'd all be in great shape. look, you can't blame him for what he said today. president trump wants people who are loyal to him, who will go out there on the podium or on television and be his biggest cheerleader. clearly that's what he is going to do, and that's what he is there to do. the problem with that is communications director, their role is to look long-term, define your long-term strategy, plan your work and work your plan and really define how you're going to sell health care, how you will convince people in middle america tt this preside really is goi to repeal and replace obamacare. that's a lot of work, and it is sitting down with your policy shop and with your treasury department and with your doj and plan this out. hopefully scaramucci realizes it is part of the role because it is a critical part. >> in this white house it is hard to do. >> the problem all of us are making -- and i am absolutely guilty of this.
when i learned of this appointment i thought, it is ridiculous. then i thought, actually it makes so much sense because we actually aren't in an orthodox administration, right? as we all know. >> i mean he's been on this show. he is a great defender of the president and speaks very well. >> i have worked with anthony scaramucci. he has supported an lgbt advocacy organization i run. so i just want to be clear i have a good working relationship with him. but this is not orthodox, but nothing about this is orthodox. if you take that and put it aside, trump is a guy who has come to the presidency by being incredibly successful with marketing, on television, in the press. he is polished. all of these things anthony scaramucci is as well. they kind of come from the same soup, right? anthony scaramucci is from long island. >> has a great story. >> donald trump is from queens. they were sort of raised in a very -- i think in similar enough ethos, especially both being in new york city and in manhattan, in finance and real estate over the last 20 years, and they've known each other. trump is comfortable with people
he knows and trusts. he likes anthony scaramucci. >> scaramucci is more self-depracating. did say he bought all the copies of his own book to make it a best-seller which i don't think you would hear donald trump say. >> which endears him to the press. >> of course. >> anthony scaramucci, much as many call him, has been on tv and has relationships with reporters. >> he is good at tv, we know that. we saw him today obviously giving basically a video interview to the president to confirm that he got the job. it was an audition. but that's not the job of the white house communications director. it is about planning. >> his job is not going to be planning. >> who is going to plan? that's a problem for the white house. >> you know, what has been so many problems, this is not the number one problem. they're going to have an unorthodox communications director. >> you've known sean spicer for a long time. >> since '95. >> the person you know, is that every day? you saw at the podium >> quite often, yes. he and i had a lot of very loud conversations over the years,
we were somewhat frenemies as much as we're friends. i know his commitment to the company, he serves in reserves still. he was someone loyal to the president despite getting slings and arrows every day. he had to audition for the job that he rightfully earned. he and i go to the same catholic church on capitol hill. being snubbed at the vatican visit was really personal hurtful for him. but those are personal slights. what happened today's was a professional slight. for him to walk away with graciousness and dignity as he did today, it says a lot. >> it is interesting to the point doug was making, that anthony scaramucci was talking in the press room, and effectively, but he was talking to president trump who he knew was watching. i mean all of that -- you know, i love the guy, he's great at this, he's great at this. >> yeah. >> i mean that is all stuff donald trump loves to hear, the president loves to hear. >> as i was watching that i was thinking, this guy separated a lot of very rich people from an awful lot of money. he is a salesperson, and this is the skill that i think donald trump values above all others. he's also i think very
comfortable, mr. trump, in fighting with somebody in one moment and then embracing them the next if he feels that the other person gave as good as they got. scaramucci actually to what you were saying to two fellows from long island, scaramucci actually spoke very derisively about his queens background. >> called him a hack. >> well, he is a guy from queens who inherited all his money. scaramucci is a man from long island. they are very much a person who will say something horrible about you today, and if it's to their benefit, the next they'll they'll work with you. i think that is something trump is comfortable with. >> something about the timing of this today. i think they had a good day at the white house because yesterday, the day before, the president of the united states spoke on the record in such authoritarian tones that we have never on the record heard from an american president that i know of in our history.
it sounded like a juan peron or somebody from banan republic dictator about how he is going to undermine the judicial system of the united states, how the attorney general of the united states has acted illegally because he's not been loyal to the president of the united states and followed a few procedures that indeed are called for in a legal investigation. we've never heard anything in our history like what the president uttered in terms of augthoritarianism and danger to our process. today it went away when scaramucci got up there. we were all focused and jumping up and down instead of going back to the president's words and what they meant. >> we got to leave it there. before we go the break we have late news on senate republican efforts to come up with a obamacare repeal and replacement bill. this one is a potentially fatal snag. cnn learned the senate parliamentarian ruled key anti-abortion provisions, a major selling point to
conservatives have been judged not to meet certain budget rules under which the entire piece of legislation is being voted on. so it is technical, but the bottom line is that this ruling effectively would keep certain abortion-related provisions out of the bill, which would cost it vital conservative support. up next with o.j. simpson planning for release from prison . >> after o.j. tapes revealed when we come back. david. what's going on? oh hey! ♪ that's it? yeah. ♪ everybody two seconds! ♪ "dear sebastian, after careful consideration of your application, it is with great pleasure that we offer our congratulations on your acceptance..." through the tuition assistance program, every day mcdonald's helps more people go to college. it's part of our commitment to being america's best first job. ♪ fit me matte + poreless foundation make fit happen!
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away from any inmates who may want to hurt or harrass him before his release. he was granted parole. the tapes that rocked his 1995 murder trial, the special report after o.j. take deferment revealed. here's a preview of the report. >> she is laura heart mckinney, the writer who recorded conversations with mark ferman. >> -- is a [ bleep ] lie. >> excerpts from the ferman tames you never heard. vulgar. >> -- >> sexist. >> how do you arrest a violent suspect? >> have a man do it. >> disturbing. >> got to be a social owe path,
violent. >> kera philips joan us with more on her special report. why did mckinney decide to come forward and talk now? >> a lot of people have asked me that. look, i tried to get her to talk to me 20 years ago. we stayed in touch over the years. finally she said she felt comfortable and was ready because her heart was just telling her so. she flew under the radar because she felt these tapes swayed a verdict. that was a heavy burden for her to carry. she got death threats and people hated her and people were fewer yos that these got out. she tried to hold them in a private place and not allow them to bereas a court decided otherwise. >> it's impossible to overstate just the impact these tapes had, not only on the trial but also on the lapd. >> absolutely. we heard the "n" word.
he was horrorless to hear what markferman said and how he referred to blacks on the force and outside the force. there's also a sexist force. these guys wanted to intimidate women and push them out and do everything they could to bully them. that's the part we didn't hear. it was strong and it forced the l.a.b.p., these tapes who was heard and investigated forced the policy to change policy when it came to women and minorities. >> thank you so much. after o.j. the if you areman tapes revealed. american spies returns tomorrow night at 8:00 p.m. right b right back.
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for tonight. have a great weekend. see you on monday. time to hand thing over with don lemon on "cnn tonight." breaking news tonight on the russian investigation, this is "cnn tonight" i'm don lemon. the russian ambassador reportedly told his superiors in moscow he discussed campaign related issues with jeff sessions during the campaign. sessions has repeatedly said he never discussed campaign realized issues with russian officials. this is not the first time information has come to -- come out to contradict his statements about russia. a stunning white house shake up. sean spicer re-signing after anthony scaramucci, trump fundraiser with no experience is