tv At This Hour With Kate Bolduan CNN July 28, 2017 8:00am-9:00am PDT
hello, i'm monica. thanks for being with us on this friday. from slim to none, the seven-year itch, to fulfill a seven year republican promise to change the health care. rejecting the slimmed down obamacare repeal in a fatal blow delivered by republican senator john mccain. so much drama, you could hear a gasp as he gave the bill a big thumbs down.
>> mr. peters? >> you see democratic leader, chuck schumer after the mccain vote. majority leader, mitch mcconnell standing with his arms folded. schumer choked up about mccain's return despite the diagnosis. >> turn the page another way. all of us were so inspired by the speech and the life of the senator from arizona. he asked us to go back to regular order. to bring back the senate that some of us who have been here a while remember. maybe this can be a moment where we start doing that. >> the majority leader, mitch mcconnell says it's time to move
on. >> as i said, we look forward to our colleagues on the other side suggesting what they have in mind. now, mr. president, it's time to move on. >> let's get to cnn's phil mattingly on capitol hill. a dramatic ending to the years long fight over obamacare. >> reporter: at large points, it wasn't expected. republican leaders thought they were going to get there. house republican leaders thought they were going to get there as well. it was scheduled with the expectation they would be meeting with how to vote on a conference committee with the u.s. senate. they weren't able to get the job done. the house lawmakers passed their own version. paul ryan, at this closed door meeting telling his members, we did our job saying we are the
only functioning arm in congress right now. he also publicly released a statement saying, quote, we were sent to washington to fulfill the pledges we made to our constituents. unfortunately, the senate was unable to reach a consensus. i'm disappointed and frustrated, but we should not give up. i encourage the senate to work toward a solution that keeps our promise. you heard that from a lot of members from the house. we are going to underscore what happened here. that is when it came to repeal and replace or repeal only or skinny repeal or broad based obamacare health related issue, senate republicans were simply incapable of getting 50 republicans to agree on one thing. take a listen to what charlie dent had to say about what went wrong. >> i was not surprised. it's pretty clear to me that this process was not a good one. i think one of the issues was the president never laid out
core principles. i think that was a big part of it. there's a lot that went wrong. they should never force it on a partisan basis. i think that's why we are where we are. >> reporter: that's a good rundown of complaints of realities of how things went south. i can tell you republicans frustrated here and in the senate. something i heard a lot last night leading up to the vote and afterward, a lot of republican senators didn't want to take the vote. they didn't want to sink it, but didn't want the vote. there was a lot of concern if it would pass or senate republicans could agree on something more. it frustrated a lot of senators, they want to repeal and replace obamacare. not everybody was sobbing. >> the question is now, what's next, phil? what are you hearing? >> reporter: that's the biggest
question. they want the senate to do something. they stand here ready with their bill. the sound you played from leader mcconnell is a crucial moment. we are moving on. there's no question, conservatives campaigned on it year after year after year. this is one of the primaries with majority in the house, majority in the senate. a reason they have somebody in the white house that is a republican. they are not going to leave it entirely. if you look at what they have on deck, a debt limit or spending bills, defense authorization, tax reform, their budget, there's not a lot of time or space to continue the debate. will there be bipartisanship? they know a short term stabilization package given the problems is necessary and they hope likely. the big question is republicans said repeatedly, we want to repeal, fix. can you pull them over to fix? if they can answer the question
yes, perhaps bipartisanship is possible. we'll see. anna? >> we'll see about the process moving forward given the criticism of how that process unfolded. phil, thank you so much. we know you haven't slept much. you are keeping everything together, we appreciate it. repealing and replacing obamacare was one of the president's top priorities. the white house is engulfed in turmoil. what is the mood at the white house? >> reporter: it's been quiet for most white house officials. we have heard from the president. he tweeted in the wee hours of the morning, he was disappointed, expressing that frustration saying those who voted against this bill let americans down. they were going to go back to his plan, to let obamacare implod, then deal. an hour ago, we heard from the president, again. let's put the tweets up on the screen. trump said if republicans are going to pass great future legislation in the senate, they
must immediately go to a 51-vote majority, not senseless 60. parts of health care could pass at 61, some good things need 50. future bills and budgets need 50 votes. of course, this wouldn't have helped the president last night or the republican party because they only got to 49 votes for this bill in the wee hours of the morning. putting that aside, this is a big setback for republicans. they have run on this for seven years now to repeal and replace obamacare. now, their efforts have been derailed. >> they have. the house, the senate and the presidency. where we go from here is yet to be seen. thank you. joining us to talk about it is david, and shelby. david how interesting is it that mccain was the deciding factor here? a man who ran for president, against president obama, siding with obama rather than the
president from his own party. >> great. i don't think obama was much of a factor here. i think it has to do with the mccain/trump relationship and the unique position that mccain holds at this particular moment, not only with his reputation as a maverick, he certainly wants to solidify but also because of his health matter that he has recently revealed, now going back to arizona to start treatments on his brain cancer. that put him in a really unique spot. he sees that spot on tuesday with that big speech when he came back and laid forward the path here of why he did not agree with the process in the way this was happening. what i find really interesting, if you look at the history here, obviously donald trump, two years ago, made jaws drop in american politics when he took on john mccain and suggested he wasn't a war hero when he clearly was in many people's
minds. yet, he was able to get past that and go on, win the nomination, the presidency. john mccain has a little bit of payback here because he clearly was the critical vote that derailed the president's top initiative. >> shelby, i want to get your take. it was a big moment when we heard then candidate trump criticize john mccain, questioning his heroism because he was a prisoner of war. he was captured. >> it was shocking. that was the word some used, how could candidate trump survive that to continue on in his quest for the presidency. look where he is at. is this a moment where that instance came back to haunt the president? >> it might have. if you look back to mccain's speech on the floor, there were tea leaves you could read from the speech. he mentioned the senate is a check on the executive. they are equal to the president. here he is standing up to the president. i don't think mccain could take such a personal thing and use it
as, you know, revenge against the president. this is an issue he deeply cares about. certainly, it comes back around to trump. you could glean from that speech he gave. he wanted to return to regular order. it's not surprising he voted against this given the scramble he had to get the votes. i also think it's -- it's really interesting that mccain now goes back home for treatment. we are not sure when he will return. >> do you think he -- change his mind about where he was voting in this regard? >> i'm not sure because they have had conversations about this. the president was cheer leading the senate saying go republicans, go. we know he made a phone call late last night. we know the president was watching. john mccain seemed like he made up his mind. he was talking to the senators also voting no. he was not showing openness to the argument of voting yes. i'm not sure there's anything the president could have said. if anyone swayed it, it would
have been his colleagues. we know republicans will be a man down after the august recess. we are not sure how long that will be. the senate will have to return to regular order and work with democrats because, where do they go from here without being able to get republican support. >> let's talk about that. >> one more point about mccain there. i want to make one more point about mccain. because of his unique position, stature in the party and his health issue, in making this vote, he was able -- there was a lot of people who voted yes on this who didn't want to. this is what phil mattingly was talking about in the hallways. you have to remember, this was a very unpopular solution to repealing and replacing obamacare, even among republicans, this was not a widely popular bill across the country. john mccain was able to provide cover and now some members can go home and say, i did. i followed through on my promise, i voted for repeal and replace but we are not stuck with a bill most of the country
did not like at all. >> i have to wonder if his health diagnosis had a bigger role. he had nothing to lose, politically. it really puts something in perspective in terms of life in general. he says he did the right thing in terms of doing the right vote. let me ask in terms of what's next, shelby. tax reform is the big hurdle they are going to try to get over. will that be easier or harder than health care? >> it will be easier. it will not be easier. you have two factions within congress, within the republican party, the moderates and conservatives. you have people who don't want to take things away from americans in terms of help. there are sticking points. the border adjustment tax is gone. that was a big deal. that was a sticking point. they have made progress in terms of it. you have questions about how low
the corporate tax rate could be and whether or not you are going to lower taxes for middle class americans. major pass through taxes. they have not agreed to a lot of these nuances in the bill or the plan. we didn't get many details about the plan. we have so many details left unknown, even after they released a few more details this week. it's not going to be easy. it is not an easy task, talking about reforming the tax code or health care. they are huge parts of the american economy. >> it's not republicans versus democrats. it's republicans who can't seem to agree, even though they hold all the chambers when it comes to leadership on capitol hill. thank you very much. adding to the president's bad week is the war breaking out inside the white house prompting covers like this. cnn reporting about the fate of reince priebus and what the president is being urged to do. plus, he's in charge of the
white house message, but what happens when the words of the speaker are rated nc-17. some would be fired for the same thing. we'll discuss. when heartburn hits fight back fast with new tums chewy bites. fast relief in every bite. crunchy outside. chewy inside. tum tum tum tum new tums chewy bites. ykeep you sidelined.ng that's why you drink ensure. with 9 grams of protein and 26 vitamins and minerals. for the strength and energy to get back to doing... ...what you love. ensure. always be you.
her long day as anne. hair stylist starts with shoulder pain when... hey joanne, want to trade the all day relief of 2 aleve with 6 tylenol? give up my 2 aleve for 6 tylenol? no thanks. for me... it's aleve. won't replace the full value of your totaled new car. the guy says you picked the wrong insurance plan.
no, i picked the wrong insurance company. with liberty mutual new car replacement™, you won't have to worry about replacing your car because you'll get the full value back including depreciation. switch and you could save $782 on home and auto insurance. call for a free quote today. liberty stands with you™. liberty mutual insurance. "how to win at business." step one: point decisively with the arm of your glasses. abracadabra. the stage is yours. step two: choose la quinta. the only hotel where you can redeem loyalty points for a free night-instantly and win at business.
john mccain, he and i have been friends for a very long time, ever since the gang of eight, which we put together. i have not seen a senator who speaks truth to power as strongly as well and frequently as john mccain. very same courage he showed as a naval aviator in vietnam, he showed last night and has shown time and time again. he's just a wonderful man. i treasure his friendship and just the fact of knowing him. i have known a few great men in the senate. i'd put ted kennedy in that category and i put john mccain in that category, too. certainly not to be forgotten, of equal praise are susan collins and lisa murkowski, they
were amazing. women are in so many instances stronger than men. they brag less about it, but they are. last night sort of proved that. somebody who is in a family of strong women, i very much appreciate their strength, their courage and their dedication to principle, despite. where do we go from here? john mccain said it all on tuesday night. i hope this is a turning point, his speech. when he returned to the senate and his vote last night and his actions in the last few days. do i hear an echo? you know, on health, we have to shut that off, whatever its doing. what is it? okay. thank you.
on health care, i hope we can work together to make the system better in a bipartisan way. i'm optimistic that can happen. i think, at the very beginning, we should stabilize the system. we should make permanent the cost sharing, which keeps people's premiums down and the counties that are covered up. we should look at reinsurance. tom carper and tim kaine have a bill. susan collins and bill nelson have a bill. they will help stabilize the insurance market. we should look at claire mccaskill's bill for the bare, b-a-r-e counties for a relatively small counties, almost all rural that are not covered. then sit down and trade ideas.
lamar alexander and patty murray are already talking about doing that. i'm hopeful they can begin a series of hearings. nobody has said obamacare is perfect. nobody has said our health care system doesn't need fixing. the problem was, when they tried to pull the rug out from under the existing health care system. so, change it, improve it, but don't just take a knife and try to destroy it and put nothing in its place. so, we can work together and i said that on the floor last night and a whole number of republicans who were usually more quiet and more conservative came over and thanked me and said they want to do it. on health care, but also in the senate as a whole. i hope what john mccain did will be regards in history as a turning point where the senate turned back from its partisanship and started working
together. we long for it. we yearn to work together. there are various forces, they call them s call. sometimes you need a spark to inspire the forces coming together to outweigh the forces coming apart. john mccain may have done that. i intend to follow. i'm not finished. two other things i would say. president trump did a tweet last night and a tweet this morning. not presidential. his tweet last night said we are going to let the system collapse. we are going to hurt innocent people because we are angry we lost politically. that is small. that is not what a president does. i hope our senate colleagues, our house colleagues on his side of the aisle will turn a deaf ear on that. the things i mentioned will help make the system stronger.
they are not ideological. we can do those first and look at each other's idea. the idea of sabotage is a bad thing. mr. trump doesn't get it. if we sabotage the system, it will hurt him as well as millions of americans. second, this morning, donald trump pulled away from the bipartisanship that john mccain and so many senators felt last night by saying we should change the rules and go to 51. hello. he had 51. he only needed 51 in the health care bill and couldn't do it. so, let him turn around, too. let him understand that the only way we get major things done in america, in the congress and particularly in the senate is bipartisan. i hope he changes. his analysis is based on fluff because he had the 51 votes
already, with reconciliation and he couldn't get it done and he says let's go down to 51. i just don't get it. finally, just a deeper analysis. will people blame mitch mcconnell? i don't think that's fair. i think there were deep, deep fault lines in what our republican colleagues tried to do. because donald trump and the republican party campaigned on one thing, lower premiums, more coverage, don't cut social security, medicare and medicaid. and the bill they put together did just the opposite. they didn't campaign on what they proposed, tax cuts for the rich, slashing medicaid. >> we are going to pull out of here and get into the top democrat in the senate, chuck schumer praising john mccain for being the deciding vote against the efforts to repeal obamacare in the wee hours of the morning.
he praised two republican women who voted no. democrats and republicans like john mccain calling for bipartisan solution to fix obamacare's problems, admitting there are problems. the president says let it implode. schumer calls that unpresidential. up next, the white house infighting that is making it more and more difficult for the president to get anything done. stay with us. um...i'm babysitting. that'll be $50 bucks. you said $30. yeah, well it was $30 before my fees, like the pizza-ordering fee and the dog-sitting fee... and the rummage through your closet fee. who is she, verizon? are those my heels? yeah! yeah, we're the same size...in shoes. with t-mobile taxes and fees are already included, so you get four lines of unlimited for just $40 bucks each. the price we say is the price you pay.
the worst chief of staff in 25 years. cnn is learning those close to president trump is urging the president to make a change. they believe priebus has proven ineffective in shepherding the president's agenda. the knifes may be out for national security adviser, hr mcmaster. they tell cnn mcmaster is at odds with cnn white house officials and the president himself. much of the conflict is the delays over afghanistan. the president has not signed the order for troops. the war raging in the the west wing has taken a vulgar turn. anthony scaramucci unleashed an unsensors interview. he called the president's chief of staff, a bleeping paranoid schizophrenic and described steve bannon in words we cannot
say on television. the new york post ridiculing the president and his administration with this cover page, depicting the white house as an episode of the reality show "survivor." the cast of characters include attorney general jeff sessions who suffered public humiliation. it is scaramucci's foul mouthed assault and the threat to fire the entire white house staff that is grabbing the attention. he calls the colorful language, he will refrain from using it at the white house, but issues no apologies. joining us to discuss is the author of "the gate keepers, how the white house chief of staff define every presidency." first week on the job and scaramucci does this. >> yes. >> how does he still have a job? >> it's unbelievable. i mean, this was a broken white house before the last 48 hours. it's a white house that can't get anything done.
it can't enforce executive orders, it can't pass legislation, as we saw last night. it can't prioritize the president's agenda. it can't stay on message. scaramucci is the latest surreal twist in all of this. the fundmental problem is that donald trump, an outsider president, who has no idea of how to govern, in my opinion needs an empowered white house chief of staff who knows the ropes who can execute his agenda and most importantly tell him what he doesn't want to hear. this is a west wing populated by enablers, priebus and scaramucci, i include both of them in that category. that's a recipe for chaos. >> speaking of those two, they are at odds with each other. they have made no secrets about that. but, here we have scaramucci saying this outlandish rant, vulgar as all get out, yet, we
see the white house press secretary defending scaramucci, chalking it up to him being passionate and not defending reince priebus. do you think the president applauds what scaramucci did? >> that's the troubling thing. donald trump is a disrupter. he creates chaos. we have seen over the last six months he has no idea how to govern. he appears to enjoy the show more than he enjoys the process of trying to get anything done. that's got to catch up with him at some point. you know, this is a white house, as i said, that can't do anything and this has exasperated their problems. every president learns the hard way to achieve anything, you have to have a chain of command, an empowered white house chief. scaramucci is reporting directly to trump.
that's a recipe for chaos. scaramucci is a joke. he's a walking cartoon. a guy completely out of his depth. this way lies disaster. >> i hate to cut it short. great to have you with us. we have breaking news we have to get to. thanks. we'll be chatting again as the house of cards continues. >> glad to be back. >> stay with us. >> breaking news just in. the pentagon confirming to cnn the u.s. detected a ballistic missile launch in north korea. i want to go to barbara starr for the latest. what can you tell us? >> reporter: the pentagon telling reporters a short time ago, they have detected a ballistic missile launch out of north korea making it just about midnight north korean time. this had been anticipated, u.s. spy satellites had been watching the area for the last several days, believing there was evidence that the north koreans
were going to do another ballistic missile launch. what is happening now is u.s. intelligence is assessing every piece of information, all the imagery, all the electronic intelligence from the north korean missile that it can quickly gather to determine where it went, how long it flew, what kind of missile it was. some early indications out of japan, not confirmed yet by cnn the north koreans used a typical trajectory they fired to the east into the sea of japan. that still has to be confirmed. i have to tell you that one of the things in the last 24 hours, the pentagon was very concerned about is that this could be the second intercontinental ballistic missile long by them. the long, long range capability was on july 4th. if they have done another icbm so quickly after the first test,
that is going to be something for the u.s. to contemplate. they have already revised the intelligence assessment by about two years that north korea could have a capable long range missile by some time in early 2018. that's only months away. we will see in the coming hours, probably fairly quickly, what kind of missile this was and if this really, again, changes the equation about the north korean threat. >> barbara, remind our viewers what the u.s. response was the last time when they had that ballistic missile launch, the icbm on july 4th a few weeks ago. >> reporter: it was. it did spark a great deal of concern. if north korea has the capability for icbm long range, that means they could achieve their goal some day of really being able to hit the united states with a missile, with a nuclear warhead. let's be clear, the missile they
fired on july 4th has that theoretical range and capability, whether or not it can actually hit a target with precision at that kind of range, 5,000 miles plus away. that's a technical engineering question, but perhaps small comfort because north koreans are rapidly able to demonstrate the capability. this puts it square in president trump's pile of decisions to make about what he wants to do if this new missile today does prove to be another long-range missile. u.s. policy by the state department and the white house has been to focus on diplomacy, to focus on pressuring the chinese to pressure the north koreans, but, i remind everybody, it was a few days ago, the chairman of the joint chief of staff publicly said he was always ready to take military options to the president if it came to that.
the general thinking has been, if north korea takes steps that are considered so imminently threatening to the u.s., so imminently destabilizing to global security, the u.s. might have to contemplate military options to deal with north korea. they don't want to do it. defense secretary mattis has been very clear, war with the north korean regime would be utter disaster, utter catastrophe, tens of millions of people could die in south korea. the north koreans, no telling how they would react to that. if, we still don't know, if this ballistic missile that was launched within the last hour proves to be at icbm, long range, capable of hitting the u.s., it presents the president of the united states with a number of things to think about if north korea has been able to test launch two of those within a month. we just want to emphasize,
again, we have no official word from the pentagon, from the trump administration, about whether it is a long range missile but there have been a lot of reason to think it was and the only other option really out there is the intermediate range, slightly less but that's a missile that can threaten japan, south korea, guam, a lot of area in the asian pacific region. >> looking at our latest reporting, we are seeing the japanese are coming out saying they, too, are trying to make an assessment of this missile launch. possible it landed in the economic zone, which is a bigger threat to that country. barbara starr, you are going to continue to work your sources. i want to get reaction from republican congressman, adam of illinois, a member of the foreign affairs committee. thank you for joining us. what do you make of the breaking news? >> it's of concern. north koreans are way more
advanced than we thought. the icbm missile test surprised me when it happened on july 4th. if this is another one, it's concerning. one thing to keep in mind, every time they have a missile test, they learn from it, we also learn from it. we can watch trajectories, how they are doing and what they are doing. it makes us better at defending. this is concerning. what this does for us is should we double our efforts in the house with the administration to invest in future missile defense whether it's intercepts. on the medium range missiles, that's where the thud missile defense system comes in very porpt because that's what defends japan and south korea from intermediate range. >> how confident are you the systems we are developing are keeping up with the missile program we are seeing in north korea? as you mentioned, this week
alone, we saw a huge acceleration based on expert analysis there. >> as of today, we are in okay shape. this is still technology in its, i don't want to say infancy, but still in development stages. we had a successful intercept test a few weeks ago or month ago. we have to continue to stay ahead of this threat. if the north koreans have figured out icbm technology and can replicate it and can do it more inexpensively, we have to keep up with it. this isn't partisan. we have to come together to see how to keep homeland and allies safe. that is going to be further investment into this technology. >> this is yet another launch just this year. we know there was the one back on july 4th, intercontinental ballistic missile is what that was determined to be. this week, we heard the message from kim jong-un that they would strike the heart of the u.s.
should there be reason to believe the u.s. is trying to take out this regime. what is the message kim jong-un is trying to send with this launch? >> i think he's crazy. he may be saying what he is trying to do in terms in his mind. he's crazy on the world stage. this is taking us to the brink of a war that would not be good for either side, especially for north korea. if there was a war that launched, north korea, 100%, without a doubt, would lose the war. the problem is there would be mass casualties and a lot of american soldiers that would lose their life stationed in the area. this is insanity, doing the same thing over and over. taking it to the brink to step away from. we need china to get serious about really tough implications to north korea, whether it's their business, exports or anything else. >> you heard barbara say the launch puts the president directly in the cross hairs on
this. in terms of a decision to make, how should the u.s. respond beyond the defense development we discussed sf. >> i think it's extremely important. i think our military posture is extremely important to make sure we have an option if, in fact, we need to. that is the almost absolute last thing we should do. the last thing is allow them to fire a nuclear weapon at us. having that posture there and finding leverage points, pressure points against the chinese to say you may be worried about mass refugees in your country in the event of a collapse of the regime, but this is making it more and more likely this is going to happen. you have to work with us. they act like they have done everything they can. they have not done everything they can. >> it is interesting we were going to talk to you about the new sanctions bill that was passed by the house and the senate in a bipartisan way. it includes russia, of course as the headline, but includes north
korea, yet the president's spokes people are saying it's unclear whether the president is going to sign this bill. your thoughts? >> everything i hear is he is. if he doesn't, his lack of signature or veto will be overridden because we pass zed 419-3. it's override on steroids. we are completely as republicans -- >> 98-2. 500 members in congress, total. five people said no. >> that doesn't happen very often here. i think every indication i get is the president is going to sign it. this would be great and continuing to ratchet up the pressure between north korea, iran and russia. >> real quick, do you feel like the infighting in the west wing is impacting the president's ability to be effective in his role as president of the u.s. and dealing with foreign crises? >> yes. i don't know about the foreign crises because he has individual
power to make those decisions. where it's affecting domestic agenda, the headlines are infighting. this is intriguing stuff. until yesterday when the health care bill failed, he should have been pushing the message on health care. we are taken up by infighting and this weird article. he is doing himself a huge disservice. i think it would benefit the president to get a handle on the message coming out of the white house. that's as gentle as i can say it. >> speaking of message, what do you make of scaramucci's vulgar report in an interview. >> i read it. it was disappointing. the language was bad. what bothers me most is the willingness to take down people, attack people, reince priebus, steve bannon to a random reporter. character assassination that i don't like. we have to get back out here where we can have disagreements and don't have to assassinate
people's character. itis what was happening with the jeff sessions thing. if you don't like him, fire him. why put it all over twitter? this should not belong in the president of the united states. this is the most sacred job in the world. keep it that way. >> congressman, thank you for your thoughts. i want to get back to the breaking news in north korea. joining us on the phone is jim walsh. he met with north korean officials many times over the years discussing nuclear weapons. thank you for being with us. how significant is this missile test given it is on the heels of a ballistic missile test on july 4th? >> caller: anna, i would say each test is unwelcome. it remains to be seen. i want to ceda ta on the trajectory before we conclude it's an icbm. reality is we have had 14 missile tests already in 2017.
the north koreans are on a pace now that would almost double the number of tests they had in 2016 under president obama. so, no one should be surprised. whether this test turns out to be a scud or intermeet yat missile or submarine missile. i am confident they will conduct future missile tests and some will be icbm. >> what is the strategy for kim jong-un here? >> caller: you asked the congressman and it often comes up, is he signaling? what is his intention? in the old days, under kim's father, jung ill, we debated about missile tests, was it a signal to domestic audience? trying to send a message to an audience? under the young son, the pace of testing increased so dramatically, basically, they
are not interested in signaling, they are interested in building a missile. it's not about sending messages, it's about getting good at missiles. their view is, if we can build a nuclear weapon and a missile to carry it, the u.s. will never invade us and we would be able to go into negotiations from a position of strength. in any case, the former being the most important. you might call it the lesson of libya or the lesson of iraq. that is if you are in the u.s. cross hairs, if you don't want to face regime change, you are going to take steps like acquire nuclear weapons to prevent it from happening. >> is this a sign they are feeling increased pressure that kim jong-un is worried? >> caller: well, i think they have been on this trajectory out of the gate he started testing. long before the most recent sanctions bill that passed, it seems to me this -- it seems like it was a decision that was
made four, five years ago. as to sanctions, you had a chance to talk to the congressman. i must say, i see a big disconnect between u.s. policy and the problem we are facing. yeah, we can pass sanctions. we have been doing it for more than a decade. the basic disconnect is the north koreans can build missiles faster than we can impose sanctions that matter. if we keep doing the same thing over and over, that's not going to work out well. on missile defense, we have been working on missile defense since ronald reagan. it's a big mistake to think there's some shiny technology that has yet been proven under wartime conditions that there's a magic wand that is going to save us from this. that's a really bad bet. i think we have to face this problem head on and not hope it's unproven technology is going to save us from the north koreans.
>> yet, the question north koreans. >> go ahead. >> yeah. i say we need to engage in, sit down and have negotiations without preconditions. that doesn't mean we'll arrive at agreement with them, but able to freeze their program now that is to say no missile tests no nuclear tests which is something we did accomplish in the 1990s under something called the agreed framework, if we were able to freeze those tests and their program would not progress. now, i wouldn't get rid of the program, but at least a freeze would stop it from getting more capable and more of a threat every day. so i think negotiation has to be part of it. obviously working with the chinese, but i don't think the chinese will cooperate with us if we attack them, ridicule them and sanction them. we need to think how that that a little better. >> interesting you suggest negotiations, given that south korea, we know in recent weeks, has been repeatedly asking, reaching out to north korea if
they're willing to talk and it appears north korea is simply ignoring that gesture. why? >> well, i have spoken with north koreans, in formal -- we won't call them negotiations, in info informal meetings and they're interested in talking with the trump administration. i don't rule that out. the fact the north koreans haven't responded yet to president moon's offer i wouldn't read too much into that. north koreans are facing some pressure. people seemed to have missed this, but over the past month they imposed gas rationing in the capital city in pyongyang, and to the chairman, an embarrassing thing to do. to have gas rationing. i think they're feeling some pinch, and the question is, is there a way to get everyone around the table? i say that this is important first because, history shows
that the north koreans are better behaved when sitting at a negotiating table then without the negotiating table throwing stones. secondly, to at least keep it from getting worse, i would say, third, finally, you want to talk to the north koreans. hold your friends close, your enemies closer. the real danger is not someone will go off are and start a war. the real danger, something small escalates. a mistake, miscalculation, misperception and if the parties are not talking to each other, that danger is much higher. >> jim, thank you. stand by. i want to bring in cnn international correspondent will ripley, live from beijing right now reporting extensively inside north korea. will, what it's your reaction to this missile launch? >> reporter: ana, it's surprising given people along the demilitarized zone watching specifically for a launch like
this. pretty heavy rain over the launch site where the state department observed heavy machinery rolling up in recent weeks. that indicated a likely ballistic missile launch. we don't know where the missile was launched from yet, don't know the trajectory, although japan has said very close to the mainland of japan. in the economic zone. no government reaction yet leer in b here in beijing, often we don't hear from the chinese government right away, but clearly this is yet another embarrassment for them, because every time north korea launches one of its missiles, remember, launched an int continual missile on the fourth of july, the conversation veered right here to china, to beijing where they continue to train very heavily with north korea. north korea's economy despite round after round of heavy sanctions grew by nearly 4% last year because of its trade relationship with china. yes, they have cut off purchase
of coal for north korea. there are reports that, as the gentleman just mentioned gas rationing. although i was in the country last month and able to get out and see tanks, no issues. although the price of gas is mostly higher than it's been. i did not witness gas rationing personally. maybe north korea has joined the squeeze. even if they are officials told me last month they're not worried about it. lived through so many sanctions and hardships and feel the weapons, missiles and nuclear warheads of the ticket to their regime's survival and the comments last week by the cia director pompeo own justified in the eyes of kim jong-un spending massive amounts of resources on getting these weapons and ana, analysts say within a matter of months now north korea could be in po zcession of a nuclear wean
in their arsenal, much sooner than anyone would have predicted even just six months ago. shows ow rapidly they're add varns i -- advanci advancing. >> just since february, kim jong-un more tests than his father or grandfather and we learn something more each time. seems common to launch these missiles on significant dates. anything noteworthy about the timing here? this date? >> yesterday, 92th of july, armistice day marking the signing of the agreement that ending the fighting in the korean war back in 1963. the 64th anniversary of what north korea considered the biggest military victory even technically, a stalemate and both north and south korea are still technically at war. these holidays are times when
they've try tried to show force. parades on this particular holiday, 2013 and 2014 and even if they didn't launch a missile on the holiday itself, launched the day after sends a defiant message. >> thanks to both of you. special coverage continues in just a moment. stay with us. with water dripping from the ceiling. you never know when something like this will happen. so let the geico insurance agency help you with homeowners insurance and protect yourself from things like fire, theft, or in this case, water damage. cannonball! now if i had to guess, i'd say somewhere upstairs there's a broken pipe. let the geico insurance agency help you with homeowners insurance. call today to see how much you could save.
if you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis like me, and you're talking to your rheumatologist about a medication... ...this is humira. this is humira helping to relieve my pain... ...and protect my joints from further damage. humira has been clinically studied for over 18 years. humira works by targeting and helping to... ...block a specific source... ...of inflammation that contributes to ra symptoms. it's proven to help relieve pain and... ...stop further joint damage in many adults. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened, as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb.
politics." i'm john king. a lot of breaking news here in washington. obamacare repeal is dead and the white house is in turmoil, but to those stories in a moment. we begin with major breaking international news. the pentagon now confirming to cnn north korea has launched yet another ballistic missile. it happened just over an hour ago. cnn pennell correspondent barbara starr has the latest. >> reporter: as you well know, john, it's often the case world threats intervene on washington politics. that may be what we're dealing with here today. the pentagon at this hour is