tv CNN Tonight With Don Lemon CNN June 4, 2018 8:00pm-9:00pm PDT
supposed to attend the white house ceremony tomorrow. the president has repeatedly and publicly criticized players for not standing for the anthem. he's alled them sons of bitches. he aggressively lobbied owners to force players to stand for the anthem. he's gone so far to say the owners should fire players who protest. now the president is falsely claiming the eagles players don't want to stand for the anthem. that's right, falsely claiming they don't want to stand. i'll explain that. joining me now on the phone is the mayor of philadelphia, jim kenney. the president just tweeted this, the philadelphia eagles football team was i vieted to the white house. unfortunately only a small number of players decided to come and we cancel issed the event. staying in the locker room for the playing of our national anthem is as disrespectful to our country as kneeling, sorry. here's the thing. none of the philadelphia players stayed in the locker room. none of them took a knee for the season.
so what he's talking about, that is, in fact, a lie as well. >> well, there's no one more disrespectful to this country than the president of the united states, which is a sad thing to say, but it's true. >> you say that -- and it's tough to say that. before what you said about, you said it's embarrassing, he didn't want to be embarrassed. don't you think it's tough to say the words you just said but you have to because they're true? it's true >> well, first of all, i'm glad he disinvited us. or disinvited the team, because we won't have any lingering issues coming into next season. so i think it's very important. didn't want some players to show up and others not to. and have it enter into the locker room and, you know, keep us back from repeating a super bowl champion. so i don't really care what he does. the guy talks about being patriotic. he avoid the draft five times. in vietnam. and philadelphia has -- it's a city that has two high schools.
one is thomas edison high school who lost 64 members of their class in vietnam pen and the other is father judd high school that lost 27 memberheir he could have been patriotic back then as opposed to this sham of an issue relative to the national anthem. i stand for the national an nem and cover my heart because i'm a privileged white male and i have a reason to stand. there are other people in this country who have not experienced the same level of fairness and same level of issues that i have. and they have a right to show their displeasure. and that's what the first amendment is all about. and if he doesn't want to accept the first amendment or other amendments, that's on him. but i'm proud of our players. they're extremely -- they're wonderful athletes and great in the community. they volunteer, they raise money. they're all of them, malcolm and nathan and chris long and carson
wentz. i'm very happy that they're super bowl champions and they don't have to go. >> this is the question i want to askyou. you had some tough words, your first answer here. you released a statement saying disinviting them from the white house only proves that our president is not a true patriot. but a fragile ego maniac obsessed with crowd size and afraid of the embarrassment of throwing a party to which no one wants to attend. tell me about that. >> the truth hurts. that's the case. it's been happening since he was sworn in. every day is a new day in dysfunction. i hope we can recover from it and i'm looking toward to when he's not there to get our country back to where it should be. that could be 2018, it could be 2020. hopefully it won't be 20246. it's just an embarrassmentment. i'm d of our eagles and i'm proud they're not going. >> mayor kenney, thank you for
your time. >> take care, don. you're not a former philadelphiian, you're always a philadelphiian. >> i love my city. i bought my first home in that city and i will never forget it. monroe between 2nd and 3rd. >> queen village. take care, man. take care. >>t to bring in cnn contributor frank bruney also joe lockhart, the executive vice president of communications and public affairs and former u.s. attorney harry litman. and cnn commentator amanda carpenter, author of "gaslighting america -- why we love it when trump lies to us." let me start with you, joe and frank. you're the former communications officer for the nfl. the mayor did not hold back. what do you think? they booed santa claus one year. it's hard to hold punches there. let me try to be positive. the eagle the represent the best
of the nfl. malcolm jenkins has been the leader of this group that will now have $150 million, $200 million at their disposal to help do criminal justice reform and social justice. chris long donated every paycheck, 16 game checks to charity as a way of making a statement. carson wentz, $500,000 for haiti in the aftermath of the earthquake. to them, to donald trump, they're sons of bitches. and they're that because they don't kneel to him. there isn't just today's example. we have four of them today. it's just this evening's example. >> what do you think? >> i think the major was really eloquent and speaks for a lot of americans, and i think joe is right, there's only one metric donald trump uses above all others to judge people. that's how readily and
expansively. he is so demonized nfl players and done so in such an indis-christmas nit and gratuitous way and some of them didn't want to come. his response is okay, none of you come. i keep waiting for the president of the united states to be the biggest person in the room, not the smallest person in the room. and donald trump scuttles that expectation every day every way. bill clinton is trying to clarify his tone deaf comments about mon cue lewinsky tonight. here's what he originally said to nbc. >> looking back through the lens of me too now, do you think differently? or feel more responlity? >> no. i felt terrible then. anticipate i came to grips with it. >> did you ever apologize to her? >> no. yes.
nobody believes that i got out of that for free. i left the white house $16 million in debt. but you typically have ignored you don't even know them. this was litigated 20 years ago. 2/3 of the american people sided with me. they were not interested in that. i had a sexual harassment policy when i was governor in the '80s. i had two women chief of staff when i was governor. women were overrepresented in the attorney general's office in the '70s. for their percentage of the bar. i've had nothing but women leaders in my office since i left. >> you didn't apologize to her? >> i have not talked to her. >> do you feel like you owe her an apology? >> no. i -- i do not -- i've never talked to her. but i did say publicly on more than one occasion that i was sorry.
that's very different. the apology was public. >> not good. >> no, i think he made a mistake there that he doesn't make that often. and it's one that he see our current president doing all the time. which was not separating the two things. he was treated unfairly by the republicans. it was a partisan attack to remove him from office. newt gingrich famously said when asked why are you doing this? he said because we can. he con flated that with the underlying thing that he did apologize for at the time. and in doing that, he undermined the apology. it was a mistake. and i think he did try to clean it up later in the day. >> i was shocked that he was not prepared for that question. maybe that's him thinking he was prepared. it is such an easy answer.
this was a regret every single day of my life. i'm sorry to monica lewinsky and her family. if she's listening i would like to apologize to her i want to reach out to her but haven't done it out of respect or something. it's so easy to answer that question. >> again, i think, as we've talked about, that answer is diametrically opposed to at the time what the president did as president. which was not focus on himself, not focus on the victimization of the president and focus on the country's work. and you can see why, you know, when the answer comes out that way it's not effective at all. >> i got hot under the collar the way the questions were
asked. i think what was lost were the two points that i made that are important to me. the suggestion was that i had never apologized for what caused all the trouble for me 20 years ago. so the first point is i did. i meant it then and i meant it now. i did that. i benefited. i meant it today. i live with it all the time. the second is that i support the me too movement and i t it's rdue. i've always tried to support the decisions and policies that i've advanced.
>> is that clarification enough? >> he cleaned it up a little. i heard a lot "i" "i" "i." the question was about someone wha 21-year-old intern at the time. he attached the reporter, he cited public opinion polls, 2/3 of the earn maniies are with me and heho had a pity party. whom does that remind you of >> trump. >> i don't need to be reminded of donald trump with a man whom i have respect for, but didn't do his best today. >> bill clinton still thinks it's all about him. and there's no compassion for what he put, not only monica lewinsky rough, but his entire party through. she was gas lit, depicted as a narcissistic, obsessive loony
toon because of something that happened with president clinton. they had an affair. he gave her gifts. he invited her to the oval office. and still to this day, people will say well, monica lewinsky chased around that president and made him do it. no. he was the most po arguably person in america. she was at her first job. i want a retelling of monica lewinsky's story. she may be a victim. she's not innocent. she was a grown woman. she did know what she was doing, but everything that happened to her after, think about it. she was 21 years d. and linda tripp lured her into the ritz carlton in arlington, virginia, where fbi agents were waiting to lure her into a hotel room and threaten her mother with jail time. she has a story that she has never fully gotten to tell.
because as she wrote in the "vanity fair" article, she's still processing this. she has ptsd. she went into hiding. and bill clinton still got to be president. ey, he was em peached in the house, but man, i think monica suffered a lot more. >> i agree. >> there was an imbalance in power. >> he was commander-in-chief. she was an intern on her first job. >> we have two living presidents who have been investigated for obstruction of justice, both have also been accused of sexual misconduct by multiple women. bill clinton and donald trump, are they both more alook than democrats and republicans would like to admit? >> it's really interesting. i recognize he was tired. he missed the basic lesson of the me too movement. oh, i had two women chiefs of
staff when i was attorney general. it was like harvey weinstein gave a lot of money to women's causes. it misses the point ofsin. but i actually hear the similaritiesso i s a kind of co here. to me, clinton was caught off-guard and was a little bit trying to have it both ways in the way he sometimes does, sort of talking in half measures. and you compare that to the pedal to the metal sort of grievance and defiance you get from trump who, all his supporters know, for example, that of course, he had sexual relations with multiple women. but he's chosen to play it in such a pugnacious way that he's kind of retained his base. and you wonder if that is more effective. neither is a great model for american youth or america. but i was struck that clinton tried to tiptoe a little where
trump has been a real bull about it. and has in some ways succeeded on his terms. >> joe, i know you want to respond. >> i don't disagree that it was not a good interview and not a good performance and he messed up. but the comparison falls here, which is the president felt very strongly at the time that he was being unfairly treated. he never fired an fbi director. he never publicly shamed his attorney general. he never ridiculed the entire intelligence community. he never tried to undermine vast swaths of the government in order to protect himself. he did just the opposite. he kept his mouth shut and he went about doing his job. i don't think the compare sonls hold up. >> let me push back a little bit. i do agree with you, joe, when it came to the investigation, bill clinton did conduct himself more honorably, but i can't forget about things like bimbo eruptions. james carville saying well, if you drag a dollar through a
trailer park, who knows what you'll find. hillary clinton dismissing questions as a vast right-wing conspiracy. so i do think some of the precedent happening denying the accusations did provide some of the frame work that's being used today. >> go ahead. >> don, can i make a quick point? in general, look, both nixon and clinton felt constrained by a sense of the dignity and the importance of the institution of the office. trump has zero of that. besides agreeing with the whole litany of the really singular sense sins he's committed. he's shown in his whole approach no respect at all or worry at all about the status of the presidency. even nixon and certainly clinton were different that way. >> listen, we talked about this longer than we were going to. but i want to thank you, it was a fascinating conversation and deserved to be talked about. >> president trump thinks he is a king.
and if you want to read it, go to the new york times. a fascinating piece. i wanted to spend more time on it, but unfortunately we're out of time. thank you all. we have more developments to tell you about. first lady melania trump who had not been seen publicly for the past 24 days attended an official white house event with president trumptoday. the event was a private east room reception for more than 40 gold star military families. a person inside the room told cnn the president made a light hearted joke about the first lady's extended absence from public view saying the media was asking where's melania. in a statement, the first lady said it was a privilege to welcome the military families to the white house. and she thanked them and military members more broadly for their service. glad she did that. but it is a legitimate question. we have not seen the first lady in 24 days. it's not just the media. it would be common sense to ask how she's doing. where is she. after all, she's the first lady of the united states. robert mueller accuses paul
manafort of witness tampering. and that could send him to jail. social security alerts. oh! just sign up online and we'll alert you if we find your social security number on any one of thousands of risky sites. that sounds super helpful. how much is it? you he a discover no way!t's fr. yes y! we just think it's important for you to be in the know. all right! hey... ewww! everything ok? being in the know is very good. yeah, it is. ooo don't shake! don't shake! ahhh! know if your social security number is found on risky sites. free from discover.
find thenah.ote yet? honey look, your old portable cd player. my high school rethainer. oh don't... it's early 90s sitcom star dave coulier... cut...it...out! [laughing] what year is it? as long as stuff gets lost in the couch, you can count on geico saving folks money. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance.
why people everywhere are upgrading their water filter to zerowater. start with water that has a lot of dissolved solids. pour it through brita'two-. dissolved solids remain? what if we filter it over and over? (sighing) oh dear. thank goodness zerowater's five-stage filter gets to all zeroes the first time. so, maybe ime to upgrade. get more out of your water. get zerowater. robert mueller's team is accusing paul manafort of witness tampering. the special counsel is now asking the court to revoke manafort's bond and house arrest. we have the author of "messing
with the enemy -- surviving in a social media world of harkers, terrorists, russians and fake news." good evening, everyone. how significant is mueller's allegation that paul manafort is witness tampering? >> oh, it's incredibly significant. four quick point here's. the first is obviously encrypted messages don't work if the receiving participant is go i think to go to the prosecutors. surely, donald trump's campaign manager is guilty and his activities show that. he's trump campaign's manager. third, manafort clearly knew he was being surveyed. he knew that from before yet he still continued to try to disrupt witnesses, to try to get them to testify in his favor. so he made a calculation, which suggests to me that the truth is scarier for him than the possibility that he may be put away for obstruction of justice. and i think the big question now is will he plea, facing now?
clear jail time. and is the plea offer still available to him? we don't know if mueller would be willing to take it at this stage. that's my ick takeaways. >> according to today's filing, man to fort repeatedly contacted two people who worked and previously assisted in his lobbying efforts for ukrainian politicians. he called and texted one of the people encrypted messages. the textd we should talk. i have made clear that they worked in europe. do you think that this means that mueller's team has been able to decipher encrypted messages? or the recipient of the text shared them? >> i would go with the latter. what i think is so illustrative of this moment is this is human that fort's business and operations must have been running for years and to think he wouldn't stop this after all that's happened and after all the people that's come forward. having watched person a, which
is to be declared maybe as a known agent of russia, and having his side kick gates also go ahead and start to work with the special counsel. it's just stunning he continue t take these actions, he would continue to mess alk in this way. when he's been met at every single challenge. i think the important thing to note here is every time we've seen an increase in the president talking about maybe i can pardon myself or maybe'll just close down the investigation, we see an increase in pressure on people all the way around him. and it's not surprising to me that we see this pop-up here today with manafort in terms of the mueller teamually taking action. >> so i have to ask you then, does it make it more likely that paul manafort will or could flip? >> i don't think so. it seems that paul manafort has a lot more to lose outside of confinement than inside of confine .ment. i don't know what is holding him to where he thinks he should fight this a you would the way
out. but he seems to see there's no real way going back at this point. i can't imagine him flipping now that he's fought it in this direction. one thing that's really important is as this trial is coming up here this summer. as we s the president who seems to not want to do the interview, the pressure is going to pick up on everyone who is connected to the trump team going all the way back to 2016. they are going to push for more indictments. going to push on more witnesses, going to do more evidence gathering to build up a stronger and stronger case. while the president says we need to wrap up this investigation, he's the one that's delaying the investigation. and he's also the up with that's going to add fuel to the fire if they want to push this investigation forward. >> the president tweeted twice yesterday about manafort. oh, he arrived late, he dependent stay a long time. he complete lid down played it. he doesn't tweet about manafort often. which is not true, he was very
essential to the campaign. do you think he knew this was coming? >> he may have in terms of whether his lawyers got some sort oformation rarding mueller's investigation of the trump team. we often say that mueller doesn't talk, right? which is exactly what he should not do. he should not talk. but i actually think that trump speaks for him, that trump has some idea who's being talked to. he certainly knows his friends are being communicated with. this tweet, like a week ago about pretty young people, you might think that that has to do with hope hicks and what he might know about hope hicks. so i do think in a weird way that trump sort of channels mueller's case in ways that muler is unwilling to because he's a professional prosecutor. it does say something about trump at this stage. trump has one job in terms of this investigation which is be quiet, right? essentially be quiet. >> good luck with that. >> he can't do that. i just can't imagine that he will ever
talk to mueller. "the washington post" is reporting today that his prep is not ideal, i guess is the right way to say it. he can't control himself. >> i want to get something -- i want to get your new book in here, clint. it's called messing with the enemy. you write about how terrorists and criminals can use soushl media to identify weaknesses. does this aid ourersariries? >> the central ten net is how social immediate i can't have populism has really overtaken the establishment. when i've been tracking all sorts of adversaries all line, it's remarkable how the social media powered populist movements have taken over the establishment, whether it's the islamic state taking over kwael or if you context, we see the trump train overtaking the gop
accomplishme accomplishment. if you win the crowd, if you enforce your base and you continue to do this, which the president was doing today, he is setting the agenda. he's trying to win in blic, rather than win in the courts. and if he can win that and state that narrative, he'll capitalize in bullet points what his talking points are, how he's going to try to undermine the investigation. if he can do that successfully, he thinks he can win. what's been fascinating is how this populist mement on social media has really empowered people and really restored in them a new set of powers that transcends even a physical nation. it's a social media nation that they're looking to rule. >> thanks very much. "messing with the enemy." make sure you pick up a copy. is the president's cancellation of the philadelphia eagles just another example of how the president is dividing us by race? we'll discuss. nta. where we're changing with stylish make-overs.
then at your next meeting, set your seat height to its maximum level. bravo, tall meeting man. start winning today. book now at lq.com start winning today. prepare for your demise, do your worst, doctor. i will. but first, a little presentation. hijacking earth's geothermal energy supply. phase 1. choosing the right drill bit. as long as evil villains reveal their plans, you can count on geico saving folks money. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. you're in the business of helping people. we're in the business of helping you. business funding to help make a difference. another way we have your back. the powerful backing of american express. don't do business without it. if you have a garden, you know... weeds are low-down little scoundrels. draw the line with roundup.
i'm a small business, but i have... big dreams... and big plans. so how do i make the efforts of 8 employees... feel like 50? how can i share new plans virtually? how can i download an e-file? virtual tours? zip-file? really big files? in seconds, not minutes... just like that. like everything... the answer is simple. i'll do what i've always done... dream more, dream faster, and above all... now, i'll dream gig. now more businesses, in more places, can afford to dream gig. comcast, building america's largest gig-speed network.
>> president trump cancelling tomorrow's white house visit by the daechl eagles. just the latest example of how heay be dividing us on race. an analysis of how president trump and obama tackled race. john, i'm so happy to have you here. good evening. today, president trump canceled the philadelphia eagles visit to the white house due to the controversy of the nfl players kneeling during the anthem. the president continues to spread this false narrative that the players are kneeling to disrespect the flag when they're actually protesting police brutality. is the president's handenling of this an example of how he's using race to divide? >> certainly, don. when you look at how the president has handled race since he got intoice it's about equivocating and spinning the
narrative the way he wants to. so in this case, you have players who kneel or do other forms of protest. we're doing this to protest police brutality and injustice against african-americans. obviously there's a lot of trump supporters who see this as disrespect of the flag and the military. he often takes these instances to say hey, look at these players. they're disrespecting our country. and he's the one standing up for america. essentially you get, again, with the philadelphia eagles. this is an event that they've been planning for a while. and on the eve of it, trump puts out a very strong statement about questioning the nationalism of the player, questioning their respect for america. and in that way, he avoids talking directly about the racial issue that people want to talk about, that the players want to talk about. instead he makes it more of a where he had meat issue, more an
issue that plays to his base. >> you talk about the nfl players kneeling. mr. trump has emerged as a leading critic of the practice by some nfl players of kneeling dur the national anthem. as a way to protest racial discrimination in policing. mr. trump personally and successfully lobbied some team owners who earlier this month created a new anti-kneeling rule. he said his objection to the protest had nothing to do with race. it was rather about respect for our country. and respect for for our flag. so the president says it's nothing to do with race. but it has nothing to do with race. does it? >> well, that's the thing. the underlying issue is definitely about race because that's what players were initially doing for for. ufr predominantly african-american players. you have a lot of fans that are in the stands that are white.
you have an imbalance. you have 32 white owners and then you have a lot of rich, young black men. so naturally, that issue of race kind of stands out there. you have the owners trying to say one thing and the players saying another thing. and a lot of them african-american. it definitely plays into it. as i was mentioning, trump really tries to say it's not about that but, you know, at the end of the day, it really does -- it does speak to that issue, whether he wants it to speak to that issue or not. >> i want to get this in before we run out of time. your piece criticized putting obama and trump on the same plane. what is your response to that? >> well, they both hold the same office, the office of the presidency. and the office of the. icy has a role in responding to things. i think it's interesting when you compare obama, you compare it in the sense that obama is someone who has lived experience when it comes to racial issues. he was someone who had to go
through racism, some of it with president trump fro the birther issue. when he came to office and wou handle issues of race, he would be coming from a very personal perience. sometimes the v facts of him being black, his blackness was often looked at by some people who did not necessarily agr with him as saying that's divisive. one quick example, when trayvon martin was shot, he said if i had a son, he would look like trayvon. newt going are rich said that was disgraceful, it was about race. a lot of black americans saw him speaking to them. so president obama's blackness created this divisive wedge. and one thing i'll say, for. my president, it's somewhat of a lose-lose proposition. you did a poll that showed 54% of the country believed that relations between black and white people in america got worse under president obama. there was a pugh research survey that said 60% of the country
says race relations have gotten worse under trump. how the president speakings on race almost speaks to the divisions on race we have in th country. >> at least obama knew frederick douse glass was. we'll be right back. (butch barks at man) butch is like an old soul that just hates my guts. (laughs) (vo) you can never have too many faithful companions. that's why i got a subaru crosstrek. (vo) you can never have too many love is out ompanions. find it in a subaru crosstrek. i had a very minor fender bender tonight! in an unreasonably narrow fast food drive thru lane. but what a powerful life lesson.
and don't worry i have everything handled. i already spoke to our allstate agent, and i know that we have accident forgiveness. which is so smart on your guy's part. like fact that they'll just... forgive you... four weeks without the car. okay, yup. good night. with accident forgiveness your rat won't gup just because of an accident. switching to allstate is worth it. why people everywhere are upgrading their water filter to zerowater. start with water that has a lot of dissolved solids. pour it through brita's two-stage filter. dissolved solids remain? what if we filter it over and over? (sighing) oh dear. thank goodness zerowater's five-stage filter gets to all zeroes the first time. e it's time to upgrade. get more out of your water. get zerowater.
get more out of your water. and i ior public safety my namspecialist for pg&e. on how to deal with natural gas and electric emergencies. everyday when we go to work we want everyone to work safely and come home safely. i live right here in auburn, i absolutely love this community. once i moved here i didn't want to live anywhere else. i love that people in this community are willing to come together to make a difference for other people's lives. together, we're building a better california.
president trump tonight cancelling the philadelphia eagles white house visit which was supposed to happen tomorrow. we have a lot of ground to cover. angela, give me your reaction to this latest thing with the white house and the eagles. >> you know, don, nothing surprises me anymore. from the man who called nfl players in a hypothetical situation softens of bitches -- excuse me my french, mom and dad .i know you're watching. he doesn't have respect for protests. he doesn't have respect for the black lives who have been lost. we've seen it in lack of response to any racial tension that's been stoked by police who used excessive force in killing black men and women in this country.
and the fact of the matter is these players have every right to protest and more importantly, don, that's not even what this is about. folks just h lack of respect for donald trump. his lack of decency in this office and the shame he's brought to this space. i think they have every right to sit out and move on. >> what do you think, ben? is. >> i agree. they have the right to sit out and move on. the president has a right to say t's not fis. you don't want to come here, let's not waste time onka a photo op and move on with our days. that's what i love about this country. if someone is throwing shade at you and saying they don't want to be there, then let's just be men about it and say we're not going to do this. we're not going to fake it and take a picture which clearly both sides really don't want to be a part of. and that's okay. you can agree to disagree. they have a difference of
opinion, they have a difference of ideas in this country on issues of national anthem and what it means and that's also okay. it's unforpt that we try to blame the president when the initial reaction was from the team and players on the team saying i'm not going to show up. >> do you understand, last year a similar thing happened with the golden state warriors. but this is the first time in 2012, tim thomas didn't go -- i guess he disagreed with president obama. there was somebody else on the denver broncos who didn't go. tom brady and a number of people didn't go in 2017. what i'm saying is -- there were other presidents before that. nobody canceled it. they said those who want to come, come. 23 you disagree with me -- >> but i think it's very clear it's more than one player. you're talking about instance where is you literally have to find who the one player was. >> i have a list of different players here. >> i'm t i'm trying to help you make your point here.
"the washington post" is reporting that last week they promised as many as 70 players. this week now it got down to 10. >> at what point -- >> if they do the photo op then, then donald trump only had ten players show up. what a disaster p.r. wise. >> at some point a leader needs to look at himself and says what is wrong that so many people do not want to be in my do not want to come to a ceremony where i'm commemorating you. you can laugh, but this is not funny. >> by the way -- >> be a leader and show .and have a conversation with the president. >> the eagles didn't kneel all season. >> again, if you want to be a leader in the nfl and have a conversation. >> it's on the commander-in-chief, ben. do better. discover card.
hey, i'm curious about your social security alerts. oh! just sign up online and we'll alert you if we find your socl security number on any one of thousands of risky sites. that sounds super helpful. how much is it? we, you have a discover card, it's free. no way! yes way! we just think it's important for you to be in the know. all right! hey... ewww! everything ok? being in the know is very good. yeah, it is. ooo don't shake! don't shake! ahhh! know if your social security number is found on risky sites. free from discover.
the commute is worth it.me, the more you know you and at john deere tractor... you can keep dreaming up projects all the way home. it's a longer drive. but just like a john deere, it's worth it. a book that you're ready to share with the world? get published now, call for your free publisher kit today! the supreme court ruling with a colorado baker tonight who refused to bake a cake to celebrate the marriage of a same sex combecause of his own religious objection. it was 7-2.
it meld the civil rights commission showed hostility toward the baker based on his religious beliefs. but the ruling leaves broader questions of civil rights and religious liberty unsettled. justice kennedy who is the author of four landmark cases wrote in today' majority ruling. it says the outcome of cases like this and other circumstances must await further elaboration in the courts. all in the context of recognizing that these disputes must be resolved with tolerance, without unduect to sincere religious beliefs and without subjecting gay persons to indignities in an open market. joining me at the center of this. thank you so much for joining me. so charlie, you first. what was your reaction when the case came down, when you heard about this? you must have been disappointed, i'm sure. >> yeah, thanks for asking. this morning, we were not
expecting the case to have a decision but we were watching the scotus blog and all of a sudden it showed up on master piece. we saw the 7-2 decision and kennedy wrote it. at that point you just don't know what the decision says or how to decipher it. we're not exactly lawyers even though we'venoing through it for six years. so we ran around for two hours being very confused and sad and worried. as the day has progressed, we found little gold nuggets. like the colorado anti-discrimination laws are still intact. >> and the governor of colorado just put out a statement addressing the ruling and the state body who initially handled the complaint. while we are disboinld the decision, we take seriously the court's ad monday police commissioner the state must apply its laws and regulations
in a manner that is neutral toward religion. it says we have no doubt that the colorado civil rights commission will meet standard as they listen respectfully to all sides of the matter that come before and it issue dpigss uphold and p support under colorado law. so the court's verdict did not rule the cake maker's refuse on the to make a cake for you constitutional but criticized the way the state handled his religious objections. is that one of the nuggets that you're encouraged about? >> absolutely. we just got back from a rally at the state capitol. the governor spoke on our behalf and he gave as you giant hug and said that he supported us. that felt good. >> jack phillips did offer to bake other goods for you but refused the wedding cake. what would you say toeople who asked, why not just go to a cake maker who didn't object to same sex marriage? it's an obvious question but i have to ask. >> the point of this case wasn't
whether or not there was someone else out there who could bake a cake for us. the reason we brought this case was because we didn't want another loving couple to have to be tur from a business just for who they are. >> so dave, you said earlier today, that no one should be turned away from a business open to the public because of who you are. and as up, but the court agreed with you on some level. here's what it says. our society has come to the recognition that gay persons and gay couples cannot be treated as social outcasts or inferior in dignity and worth. for thateason the constitution must and can protect them in the exercise of their civil rights. at the same time, the religious and philosophical objections to gay marriage are protected views and in some instances protected
forms of expression. n't think gay people are part of a protected class. >> i feel like, in colorado, in about half the states, sexual orientation ised underneath a lot of the civil rights laws. six years ago when this happened to us, we had no idea about that law. we have since learned that. and i think the compromise is any business can choose what they want to sell to people. they can't choose who to sell it to. >> we have come, this is, this month in june, and the lgbtq community and rights has come a long way. do you see any hope in this ruling or is it a reminder of how far we have to go? do you see it as a setback? how do you see it? >> well, i think the main thing we want people to know about this ruling is that it has fully left colorado's anti-discrimination act intact.
it hasn't changed the law. >> so what's next for you? >> well, we're just trying to survive today. and then we'll plan for the future. we've been doing this for six years and we'll probably want to take a small vacation away from the world and then come back and keep fighting for the rights of our people. >> well, good luck, guys. thank you for coming. on i appreciate it. >> thank you for having us. >> thank you. >> that's it for us. i'll see you right back here tomorrow. -- captions by vitac -- y uwww.vitac.comoms flonase helps block 6 key inflammatory substances. most pills only block one. flonase. where we're changing withs? contemporary make-overs. then, use the ultimate power handshake, the upper hander with a double palm grab. who has the upper hand now? start winning today.
when you buy a house, it is imagine what you will need... how you will use it... ...and how you will make it feel like home. when you get a mortgage, it is harder to know what to look for and how to get it. better.com changed that. we made our mortgages transparent, affordable, and fair. spend your time imagining, not stressing. find out how much house you can actually afford, in just three minutes, at better.com.
good evening. several days of combative tweets and especially sweeping legal claims about the russia probe. one of them contained a newly published letter from two of his lawyers. put it go all together, paints a picture of a president perhaps getting ready to test the power of the law. this morning in a pair of tweets the