tv Anderson Cooper 360 CNN February 12, 2019 9:00pm-10:00pm PST
i can worry about it, or doe. something about it. garlique helps maintain healthy cholesterol naturally, and it's odor-free, and pharmacist recommended. garlique good evening, amy klobachar, joins us tonight, so as former white house aide. we continue with a deal spending relatively small amount of money on a border. the president talked about the compromise today he would not commit in signing it. our reporting suggests that he will. he also said this about the longest shutdown ever, no, it is not factually correct. >> i accepted the first one and i am proud of what we have accomplished. people learned during that
shutdown. all about the problems coming in from the border. >> it did not last long. he did offer to accept responsibilities for the shutdown. >> i am proud to shutdown the government for border security because the people of this country don't want criminals and people that have a lot of problems and drugs pouring into the country. i will take the mantle. i will be the one to shut it down. i am not going to blame you for it. >> i am proud to shutdown the government. that's where he started as harry truman once put it. as the week went by, that changed, he says the books stop at everybody. at one point he didn't even call it a shutdown. >> i call it whatever you have to do for the betterment of our country. you can call it pelosi or
trump's shutdown, it is just words. >> the president did not circle back to them today, he came close and painting it as a valuable lesson to the public. >> i accepted the first one and i am proud of what we have accomplished because people learn during that shutdown. all about the problems coming in from the southern border. >> well, the president there is alluding to the privilege that all presidents enjoyed. that privilege comes with responsibility of actually doing it accurately and factually and truthfully. what americans have learned about the president about the border and all legitimate problems associated with it was misleading or flat out false or contradicted in my cases. that's one aspect of what people learn from the shutdown from the president. how to absorb the untruth from
another. these are people we talked to on this program. they learn to go without pay or worst go to work everyday and stressful and sometimes life or death jobs without a paycheck coming in. some even have yet to see their back wages, 800,000 government worker and many government contractors who may never see a dime. the president says he's proud of what he's accomplished. it is unclear by his own terms of what he really accomplished? back in december before the shutdown, the president turned down a proposed $1.6 billion for 65 miles of fencing. january 4th, the president threatened to keep the shutdown going for months or years if he did not get the $5.7 billion and 200 miles he wanted. after all of that, what did the president get? well, this new deal provides a little less than $1.4 billion for just 55 miles of newber barr
fencing. the president is radioiight. it is certainly has been a learning experience. jim acosta is joining us at the white house. do we know if the president is going to sign this deal? >> reporter: that's a question tonight anderson. i did talk to a white house official, the indication is the president is likely to sign this legislation to keep the government open and preventing another costly shutdown. they're still reviewing the details at this hour. i am told by aides until they review this. the president tweeted in the last hour, he was presented the concepts and parameters by senator richard shelby and looking at all aspects and knowing that this will be hooked up with a lot of other sources and getting $20 billion, non
wall money that's in the bill. regardless of the wall money, it is being built as we speak. we know they only repaired fencing so far. they're not going to start building new walls until later on this month. andreas lubi anderson, i did bounce this tweet off from a white house official, this person says this is encouraging, reading between the lines and the president's tweet, it sounds like he's going to sign this deal but president trump being president trump, all bets are off. >> where would the extra funding from the wall or barrier come from? >> that's something that's discussed inside the administration. and mulvaney, he had been going looking under the sofa for loose change. no, i am kidding. they're going through agencies and government to see where they can find money. we know congress appropriates these money. they are looking for funds in
areas like nature crcotics or m that could be designated for wall construction and that's something they are looking at this point. nothing is finalized. anderson, it seems as though members of congress on capitol hill, they made up their minds and gotten this legislation to the president's desk. the question is at this point, whether or not the president is going to sign off on this. the longer he hates, even though he says earlier today, if the government shuts down again, the longer he creates this cliff hanger or essentially at the edge of your seat entertainment here as to whether or not he's going to sign this bill. that's going to put the pressure onto the president to sign this and it is going to make it all about him which i don't think they want much from the white house. >> is there a plan b? >> at this point, no. there is a potential they could
come up with a continued resolution that gets the government running a little while longer. it could be any particular stretch of time that's not decided. that's another option they are looking at. that would kick the can for another brief period of time where you can end up right back to the same place where the border security deal which has been worked out by democrats and republicans on this conference committee, that's seen by both republicans and democrats as the way to go. as long as the president drags this out, he makes this about him and i don't think that's a place where a lot of republicans want to be frankly. >> jim acosta. thank you. charlie dent and our kirsten powers and rick santorum. kirsten, is this how you expect this all to go if the president does not get his $5.7 billion from congress but he does get the money from elsewhere and therefore say it is a win?
>> i don't know if he can call it a win but i do think that's the only way forward for him and in a way it is probably the best case scenarios for the democr f well. he's the one who made the promise and broken the promise. if he wants to go and get the money some where else, then it is on him. i think in the end he came out of this deal in a less good place when he started. when he started he got less money and he had to give up something on in terms of the number of beds and so i think he would have been smarter to not shut down the government. >> senate ersan or santorum, whu see is happen sing? >> the president is not a winner out of this. he's not going to give the
decision sort of the last minute he has to. i am sure he does not feel good about it. having said that, i think there are alternatives for the president to sign this bill and he should sign it and look for other places as jim was talking about to get his wall construction. the other side is not nearly as big of a loss but you are looking at nancy pelosi, not a penny. nancy pelosi says if you are going to get wall funding, you have to give us other thing, daca -- the president did not have to give out any of those things. it is not a complete route for democrats because they did not get anything out of this bill. the president was the one who had the big show and did not deliver. >> congressman dent. how do you see it? the president get money from other places?
do you expect con depressigress republicans standby him on that? >> i am anxious to see what the president is trying to do. i can tell you all that, he can't simply move one money from one account to another without the sign-off of the chair and the subcommittee of homeland security. those are controlled by democrats and same thing with the senate. congress considers that a requirement to reprogram a congressional approval. i think the white house may consider this as a simple curtesy they are not bound by that. if the president is going to reprogram dollars without con depressi congressional approval, i think there will be a big fight especially if he's trying to take military construction fund for a non-military purpose. that violates the law. i am anxious to see how they reprogram dollars. that can be a nasty fight.
>> senate ersan to ror santorum agree with senator dent? >> that's certainly in the realm of possibility for the president simply to say that there is an emergency and these funds are available. you go a different path. >> kirsten, if the president does go along with this deal, it is still not -- i guess he can say it is a wall but it is a barrier fencing that has been always been used, different times perhaps. >> i actually nancy pelosi is correct. there is going to be no construction of a wall. when he talked about a wall, he was talking about something much grandiose than fencing. you know he referred to the great wall of china, this is what he's envisioning, something
of really grandiose. he's getting funding for some border security which is something that the democrats care about, there is additional funding in there for technology to help, to help secure the border. what the democrats got in return for that is a reduce number of beds for i.c.e. >> senator santorum, can the president continue to blame democrats for not getting full funding for the wall considering the deal is signed off by republicans as well? >> it is a compromise that he's been public and he does not like and he thinks that he should have done better and republicans should have done better. this is a president that's not shy of blaming democrats and calling out republicans for being weak and not standing with him as tough as he likes. again, the president is going to charge his own bath or political
future. the democrats will be apart of that coming out and some republicans also. both. >> congressman de dent, we se t certainly don't hear of mexico paying for that wall. >> the president and his budget request for fiscal year '19 requested $1.6 billion for barriers. he wants $5.7 billion -- well, why didn't he put it in his budget request? he could have had $5.7 billion when republicans controlled the house. it is beyond me. this whole shutdown was a harmful gesture, made no sense and they got a worse deal. the number of beds, that's the
current law. it is basically status quo. they're not getting anything at all. it is a stalemate. that's a lost for the president. >> senator santorum, did you understand the thinking of the white house on that. why not have done this when republicans were in control. >> you had to get votes from schumer and democrats in the senate. i am not sure he would have gotten as good of a deal because democrats and the senate were in a position to block and then blame the republicans because quote, they were in the majority. i think democrats being in control gave the president actually more leverage to put them on the spot to have them compromise. being in the minority in the senate is a powerful place to be if the other side, if the majority does not have 60 votes. >> kirsten? >> no, they did not -- what he
wanted was $5 billion for a wall. what he got was a little ov over -- like a fraction of that basically to build a fence, that's not the same thing as him as the democrats giving him something. it is actually giving him something that they agree with. the republicans have spent a lot of time casting the democrats as people who don't care about border security when in fact they have supported this security in the past and they supported it now. with the president's promise was to build al wall that frankly costs more than $5 million. in order to build the entire wall, we would be talking about $15 billion or $20 billion. >> we got to leave it there. congressman dent and kirsten powers and senator santorum. thank you very much. the collusion, he has seen no evidence between the trump campaign and the russians. top members said no so fast.
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breaking news on capitol hill, last week senator richard burt told cbs news they did not see any collusion. richa richard burr says respectfully i disagree. we still have a number of key witnesses to come back. the split between the two senators is significant because it is rare frankly, their committee operated smoothly without the partisan division. congressman jim hans, i spoke to
him before. >> given the intelligence committee in the senate unloo i can -- unlike the house has worked well together in a bipartisan way. >> there are still witnesses to be called on either side and the word collusion which is the word that senator burr split. gout three investigations out there, the house senate and the mueller investigation, it is best that we wait and see what they actually say in their final versions before we get too excited of any potential outcome. that of course anderson points to the need of mueller investigation to actually be reported to the american people so that we'll get finality which ever way the truth points us. >> none of the facts are in dispute, only what those facts mean.
it could come down to -- one set of facts but two different conclusions? >> that's possible. consider the word collusion, collusion is actually not a legal term. there is no particular definition of it. is it collusion when the president's son donald trump jr., invites russians to trump tower in order to give him dirt on the political component? the conversation that we don't know about that manafort when he was running president trump's campaign had with constantine. we know there was all kinds of communications back and forth and everybody who had that communication lied about it. at the end of the day, i would urge caution here. the facts rule out and people will determine whether it rises to the level of collusion when those facts are out. of course, if we point to things like conspiracy then of course we get into the legal realm of
whether anybody needs to be held accountable for that. >> the other question is whether or not there is any evidence that the president himself or everyone candidate trump knew of any of what some might call collusion if it is donald trump jr. meeting with the russians or other thing like that. >> that's a good question. if the president knew these contacts were going on, authorized these contacts and if the president said hey, i am not saying i have any evidence that this happens, but hey, let's continue this conversation, russia won x, y, and z, we don't know some big things. we don't know whether the president's son told his father about the meeting that he had with the russians? steve bannon says it is a zero percent probability that he did. we may not know that until we know bob mueller is able to get from the president when he got answers to those questions.
the thing to do right now is wait until these things are done. >> senator burr says, any goodwill that may exist is gone. do you expect cohen to appear in front of your committee on february 28th as he's scheduled to? >> i do expect him to. at the end of the day, if congress wants you here, you come. if you don't appear voluntarily and congress think it is important, you will be subpoenaed. who knows? some witnesses preferred to be subpoena. my point is particularly around issues is there a compromise of the united states government, is there an issue with russia or what can we learn about how to avoid or what happened s in the past. >> congressman, thank you. >> appreciate it.
>> joining us, how intelligence committee, sean wu and david gargon. do you think it is going to come down with one set of facts leading to two different collusion s collusions? >> not really, i think we are still in the midst of the investigation. these two men is telling the truth. senator burr is saying we had tha lot of hearings and we have not seen any evidence of collusion. senator warren is staying silence and avoiding the question. what he's saying is we should not reach a conclusion. we don't have that so far. the guy who has it is going to
have it in the end is mueller. back in the background here, what warner is saying, mueller has many pieces of this puzzle in his possession already than the senate intelligence committee has. therefore, we should wait and you can leave and by implications he's agreeing with burr that they have not seen anything so far but he's not saying that. >> does it matter that there ends up with no direct evidence collusion involving the president. plenty of convictions are based on circumstantial evidence and there are a number of people charged with crimes. >> absolutely, you can have an indictment, you don't have to have the smoking gun of the admission or the taped conversations. i agree with david, we are in the midst of this. they're still in the midst of things. they may never get to hear from
some of the witnesses such as flynn or manafort or gates because of their involvement of the criminal investigations. it is important for us to draw the distinction between how congress investigates verses how a criminal investigation proceeds. the criminal investigation almost focuses on the individual wrong doing at the end of the day. that's why the burden is so high beyond a reasonable doubt. they're both in search of the truth. congress is looking to uncover facts. it is a fact-finding mission is apart of their over sight then they can fulfill that mission by looking through the facts. they have been working diligently, hundreds of thousands of pages and a lot of witnesses interviewed. they can fulfill that mission by putting a more systematic review out, unlike the criminal investigation, at the end of the day, was there individual wrong doing or not? that's always a much more way to go. >> david, it is possible.
i think it is important to say this that there is no evidence of collusion involving candidate donald trump or president trump and russia and if mueller finds that, the white house -- do you think the increasing number of investigations by democrats in the house, obviously, they taken control in the house, they can justify as apart of their role. do you think part of it though just a sheer number and volume is out of concern that mueller may not find what the democrats certainly hav certainly believed that exists so they're launching the investigation to at least keep pressure on the president? >> that's quite a good point, anderson. it is also true that bob mueller's guidelines, his investigation is supposed to be focusing on the u.s. or potential russian collusion in
our elections. it does not go to say his finance or whether what's in his tax returns or whether it was laundered money or all those kinds of things. those paths may not be fully explored by mueller so democrats may have reasons to continue this. i do think if mueller gives president trump a fairly clean review and finds no evidence of collusion, there is going to be a lot of pressure on democrats to limit other investigations and not just piling on. >> david and shan wu, thank you. coming up, we'll talk to amy klobachar. an already crowded field, getting larger and larger. when i kept finding myself smoking in my attic. dad!
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i can worry about it, or doe. something about it. garlique helps maintain healthy cholesterol naturally, and it's odor-free, and pharmacist recommended. garlique welcome back, amy klobachar, is officially in the race. her announcement was made over the weekend during the snow storm. president trump tweeted, well, it happened again, amy klobachar, announced that she's
running for president. by the end of her speech, she looks like a snowman woman. >> she tweeted, science is on my side, looking forward to debating you in a climate change. i wonder how your hair would fare in a blizzard. >> do you feel that you know how to run against president trump? we ha >> we have all learned a lot about how to deal with president trump over the last few years. the first thing is you have to have your optimistic economic agenda. that's what my speech was about on sunday snow and all. there was a reason i decided to hold the announcement next to the mississippi river extending from minnesota all the way down to that city of resilience of
new orleans. we theed to bridneed to bridge our divide. off duty firefighters diving into the water and people taking kids off the school bus. that right now, that sense of community is fractured in our country. a lot of it has to do with how he's been running things. he seems to love chaos. we should have a government of opportunity and governed by opportunity and not governed by cha chaos. a lot is having our own economic agenda and it is important for any candidate as president and work with people on their aspirations but also practical way to get there. i have a track record of getting things done and i will be talking about it as well. >> when you look back at the republican race during the primary season, there were many qualified republicans who tried different ways and it was
obviously, they did not know how to respond to him and you responded, you said what you just said just made sense to me having optimistic and having a clear message on the political side, on sort of the actual fight side, do you respond tweet to tweet? do you ignore him or do you try to take a higher road, how do you handle it moving forward? >> it is a case by case and you don't want to go downey rabbit hole with him. in my case, i welcome being a snow woman. i thought it was a cool title. i did not do it right away. i thought it was important that my story and my speech get out there so i waited a little bit. those decisions have to be made on a strategic bases because he wants to dominate every news story and get himself in news story and that's just strategy.
for me, what's most important is not the strategy of dealing with him but it is what we need to do as a country. that's we need to look up and look at each other and look at these challenges. he may talk a good talk on precipitation drugs but did that help the women who were there with me, nicole smith's son died just because he aged off his parent's insurance and he miscalculated and died. that should not happen in our country. that's why i don't think the prescriptions that donald trump has put forward have made a difference. that's why i want to have negotiations on medicare and bringing in less expensive options from other countries or infrastructure. we still don't have broad band in mayjor parts of this country. i pledge that we can do this by 2020. >> i don't think many people
realize how much of the price of insulin gone up. >> simple drugs. >> there is obviously a lot of talk of the green new deal, car gone emissio car -- carbon emissions bringing new jobs. will you be voting in favor of it? >> i am in favor of it. we need to put out a negotiation bid here. i don't see it as something we can get rid of all these industries or do this in a few years. that does not make sense to me or reduce air travel. what does make sense is start doing concrete things and put some as separatipirations out t climate change. i will say the first thing, as president as first day, i would get back to that international climate change agreement. i would reinstate the clean power rules that president trump had worked on. i will bring back those gas mile
standards. we have the fourth hottest year in history last year. the visual of that dad driving through the wildfires in california with his little kid trying to talk her through it. these are weather offense that we have never seen before. that's because of climate change and the science proves it. >> you mention medicare for all, are you prepared to support that as many of your former candidates have. >> i want to see universal healthcare, anderson. >> the smartest transition right now is to do a public option. you can do it by ex ppanding medicaid and medicare. that's going to give us more quickly to where we need to go. i am happy to look at it as an option but i am not on that bill right now. the other thing that's completely neglected is pharmaceuticals in terms of the
prices there that we just discussed. that's why it is nearly 20% of our healthcare cost and we need to work on that as well >> senator klobachar, first of many long discussions. thank you very much. >> you are looking at the site of the scene town hall with howard schultz. the former starbucks ceo is weighing a run for the president. that starts at 10:00 p.m. eastern. up next on 360. the former white house insider now suing the president. cliff sims is his name. he joins me to explain why he's taking legal action against the president.
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book. this comes as days after the trump campaign files an arbitrary claim against him. the president calling him a low-levelled staffer that he hardly knew. sims posted these photos that the president did know him. sims joins me tonight along with his attorney. >> cliff, what do you think it is about specifically your book that the president takes issues with? the fact is you write favorably about him in the book. >> well, i think this is kind of hits on one of the themes i touch on in the book. he's basing his opinion on the book off of two things, one is the press coverage but two, other people around him portrayed in an honest but un r
unfavorable right on certain parts of the book. >> clearly we know he does not read a lot. he probably has not read the book. do you think people are whispering in his ears were not happy of the portrayal. >> i still talk to a lot of people in the white house. it is something that several people in there have told me directly. there are people on staff who are kind of egging him on with this so that combines with the new conversation is the main reason why. >> when i talked to you, you said you were not sure if you signed for the white house but you assuming you had signed what ever everybody else s signed. >> in the arbitration compliant that they sent to us from the campaign, it did include a copy
of that, i have seen it now. >> mark, in terms legally, this is an ever being done by the campaign, not by the white house itself. what's the distinction? >> the distinction would be significant if that were the factual truth. what they're trying to say is that cliff in signing this nda prior to service in the white house that has -- if donald trump lost the election and cliff wrote a about now bout hi the campaign. that's not what's happening here. the u.s. government threw the office of the president of the united states has instructed directed authorize to approve whatever words you want to use. having the campaign to enforce
this nda to quiet him with are pt to his federal service. this arbitration proceeding actually demands that cliff returns government documents that may be in his possession, not to the government but to the campaign. i mean this is the white house all over it. >> do you know for a fact that this is the white house? >> well, from my own sources that i have had and other documents that i am aware of - it gives every indication and i firmly believe that this is president trump giving instructions to the campaign to take action. i mean the lawyers for the campaign from what i understand exists out there have made it very clear that they are representing not donald j. trump candidate or donald trump runniru running again in 2020. they represent president trump. that's the precedent. >> the focus of your book is the
time at the white house and what you saw in the administration? >> that's right. in the arbitration complaint that they sent to us every single thing they listed was something from my time in the white house. so what our suit is really getting i served donald trump, but ultimately i work for the american people. so, this private entity can't keep me from talking about unclassified things that i experienced when i was working for the american people. >> is this something you actually think will go all the way through to court? or do you think this was an intimidation move by the president or somebody around him? and that you had to respond accordingly? >> mark could probably get at the legal side of that. having been around donald trump for a couple of years, and i
write about this in my book, he does not respond well to weakness. he will steamroll anyone who will allow themselves to be steamrolled. and i'm not going to be bullied. i felt like this is not necessarily i wanted to do, i've never sued anybody in my life, but i was backed into a corner and had to decide whether i would defend myself. and i will not be bullied. so i'm going to stand up for myself. >> i appreciate your time. thank you. check in with ches, see wri what he's working on. >> we have players on each side, let's see if we can make reasonable out of left and right. also, we're going to take on the issue, anderson, of the president saying the democrat
congresswoman omar should resign for what she said. where was he on steve king? it will be our great debate. >> that's in about ten minutes. chris, look forward to that. up next, we have the ridiculist. the president and his el paso visit. and his questionable crowd size numbers. yes, still talking about the size of crowds. we'll be right back. t with my p. how's wednesday at 2? i can't. dog agility. tuesday at 11? nope. robot cage match. how about the 28th at 3? done. with unitedhealthcare medicare advantage plans, including the only plans with the aarp name, there's so much to take advantage of. from scheduling appointments to finding specialists, it's easier to get the care you need when you need it.
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get your human to visit wellsfargo.com/woof. what would she do without me? and accessoriesphones for your mobile phone. like this device to increase volume on your cell phone. - ( phone ringing ) - get details on this state program visit right now or call during business hours. the president held a campaign rally last night in texas and here we go again. >> if you would say, as an example, that tonight 69,000 people signed up to be here. now, the arena holds 8,000 and thank you, fire department, they got in about 10. thank you, fire department. >> okay.
well, that's not true. we'll have more of that in a second because you know where this is heading. >> but if you want to really see something, go outside. tens of thousands of people are watching screens outside. >> okay. yeah. that's not true either. the "el paso times" cites a fire department spokesman as saying the arena holds 6,500 people and not 8,000, and that they did not let in extra people over that limit. a fire department spokesman also said the president's overall crowd might total 10,000 if you include the people watching outside. i'm neither a mathematician or a fire marshal but this all feels familiar. >> i've had the biggest crowds. they never say how big the crowds are. >> crowds like this, i go one to another to another all over the country. >> we have 7,000 people outside trying to get in. look at the people back there. shoot it. you have to shoot it. turn around. >> you ought to see the crowd we had in pennsylvania and ohio and iowa. >> they never talk about how big
our crowds are. we had one crowd in texas that filled up a stadium. >> we had the biggest audience in the history of inaugural speeches. >> the line went all the way back to the highway. >> those are the people that didn't get in. >> i looked over that sea of people and i said to myself, wow. >> now, you may ask yourself, what is more appealing to the president than exaggerating his own crowd numbers? how about bashing a potential rival who is also holding a rally nearby. for president trump that's a big, beautiful 20-foot-high see-through concrete christmas in february. >> but a young man that's got very little going for himself except he has a great first name. he challenged us. so we have, let's say 35,000 people tonight, and he has 200 people, 300 people, not too good. they won't mention the disparity
tomorrow. they'll say, beto o'rourke had a wonderful rally. of about 15 people. >> 200, 300, you can call it a small crowd or tiny crowd, you can call it peaches for all the president cares, just make sure that you point out how miniscule the o'rourke rally was. the president told "the new york times" of all the declared candidates he was the most impressed with senator kamala harris. because of the number of people at her kickoff event. but crowd estimates are tough. there's a reason i know that. >> this was the largest audience to ever witness an inauguration period, both in person and around the globe. >> how do you even make a jacket like that? i don't know. sean spicer, we hardly knew you. back to the president.
he didn't just focus on crowd size. last night, he mixed it up. he gave his supporters greatest hits but also dropped some new beats from his latest album. >> i loved the people of this state. we have had a great romance together. you know that. it's been a great romance. is there any place that's more fun to be than a trump rally? nice and calm. no, that's not what you're looking for. i really don't like their policy of taking away your car, of taking away your airplane flights. of, let's hop a train to california. you're not allowed to own cows anymore. the rio grande, it's happening, go check it out. there's nothing better than a good, old-fashioned german shepherd. i wouldn't mind having one but i don't have any time. how would i look walking a dog on the white house lawn? right. sort of not -- i don't know, feels a little phony to me. >> phony, interesting word. i love that the president is basically saying thi