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tv   Cuomo Prime Time  CNN  March 14, 2019 10:00pm-11:00pm PDT

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well at night because he had, quote, friends in high places. that attorney, robert costello, disputes cohen's interpretation of the messages. again, prosecutors from the southern district want to see the exchanges. we will keep you posted as we learn more. that's it for us. the news continues though. i want to hand it over to chris for "cuomo prime time." welcome to prime time. we are going to get after what matters here. this emergency declaration that just went down in the senate. some republicans passed the loyalty test but others finally showed that principle still has a place in their party, and that this emergency declaration is the wrong way to build barriers. this was the biggest of three votes in the last two days where republicans broke ranks with the president. is this party actually taking power back from the president? we have the president's counsellor and best defender here to make his case, and breaking new information on that doomed boeing jet. a chilling detailed account of
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the final minutes, what the pilots reportedly said when they knew something was very wrong. and a timeline between the two flights that tells us a lot. what do you say? let's get after it. ♪ all right. so for a president who demands loyalty, he isn't getting much of what he wants on capitol hill the last few days. first, there was this stinging rebuke to foreign policy as republicans joined democrats in condemning the support for saudi's in yemen. then in the house, another big blow. not one republican voted against the full release of the mueller report. they overwhelmingly want you to know the findings of the probe. now the emergency declaration goes down. so how is this sitting with the president? or -- or another angle for us on this as well, which is whether or not this party is going to
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confront power in this president. we heard something here last night. you remember what the rnc chair said to me. i'm going to play it for everybody i talk to tonight because i think it kind of went back -- one of those things that went through too fast for you to grab it in the moment. and we're going to play it now with the white house counsellor, kellyanne conway, because i think it really spoke volumes about where that party sees itself, and it is a place it has never been. kellyanne conway, thank you for joining us on "primetime." >> good evening, christopher. >> let's deal with what should be easy. this brightbart interview and the president, the comments that he made about who supports him and what could happen. even if egged on, even if in the context of the left is very tough on you, the left does a lot of violent things, even if that was the context for the reply, are you open to saying he should not have said what he said?
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>> you're just reading into it like you usually do. you have to read the entire interview. he was talking about how peaceful and gentle many people are who are otherwise tough. he has the military, the veterans, the bikers, et cetera, and he was commending the democrats for always sticking together. and isn't he right about that? they agree on infanticide, they agree on socialism and on anti- semitism which is odd. they don't like the result of 2016, they go and investigate it. they don't like something else, they go and investigate it. what if the republicans turned around and did that? what if his supporters said that. >> that is not even possible context. >> no, no. excuse me. let's review the facts here. it is maxine waters, chairman of an important committee in the house. >> it has nothing to do with the question. >> if you let me finish. who crazily told people, go get up in their faces. if you see somebody in the trump cabinet -- >> you really can't defend it. >> -- tell them they're not welcome here.
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excuse me. tell them they're not welcome here. >> i thought you were going to say you should pick his words more carefully. you're going to defend it? >> here is what you should pick. you should pick better things to cover. it is your show but you invite me on. i work on policy at the white house, there's a million things to talk about. we have an emergency at the border. >> i thought it would be easy for you. to say, look, the president shouldn't have said -- >> you always want to interrupt me. >> -- that the military, bikers and cops may get violent in his defense. i don't -- >> he didn't say that. >> he said exactly that. >> where did he say that? >> whoa. where did he say that? >> i have it right here. i have the support -- >> i can't see a blank screen. >> i will read it. >> ac, just spent 20 minutes on it but go ahead. >> because it matters, kellyanne. you can't have a president that threatens if things don't go the way he likes people will get hurt. >> he didn't threaten any kind of violence. >> it changes people's lives. >> it is maxine waters who did that. >> it is not maxine. she is not the president and she was called out for what she
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said. she was called out for what she said. >> really? because joe biden was the vice president. called out? guess what. some crazy lunatic lady did exactly what maxine waters said to do, did to me in a restaurant in maryland. >> all right. >> you know what, it is crazy you would defend that, that you would gloss over that and try to read into it when you have actual quotes. >> you know what. i give up. >> you have an actual quote from maxine waters and joe biden, the vice president of the united states, who said he would like to take him behind a building and punch him. that's violent. >> that's dignity of somebody that wants to be president. >> he's the front-runner in the democratic party. >> you won't let anybody else run in the republican president. >> what are talking about? >> you have a president who threatened more people than we've ever seen. >> this economy is booming. >> all right. hold on. we will get to it when you want to defend the declaration. >> i know you don't like to cover the economy. >> i cover it all the time. >> you read into words.
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>> i'm not reading into words. >> no, you don't. >> here is what i did. i made a mistake so i surrender. you will never, you will never call him out for whatever he says, whatever he does. you are choosing pragmatism over principle. >> that's not true. >> i should know this. >> that's not true. >> listen to what ronna mcdaniel told me last night. i should have learned this lesson already. she gave me the lesson last night. >> i go to church for my moral leadership. i look on politicians, are you aligned with my issues. are you the nicest, most moral person in the world, i don't want you to be the president. i want to make sure you are lined with my policies. >> the party of character counts, the party of reagan, of lincoln, no more. forget about the moral leadership. that's not what we're about anymore. >> that's ridiculous. >> and that's because of trump. >> i'm sorry. is there a question lurking in there or are you pontificating? you invited me on to answer questions. >> well, that would be a blessing. >> i'll tell you -- but, look, christopher, you don't want to cover the issues. you don't want to cover the economy. >> you want to dump what is obviously in front of your face.
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the head of your party said we're not looking for moral leadership in our leaders. this is the era of trump. >> that is not what she said. she was answering a specific question. i watched the entire interview. i am really proud. >> she was honest. >> she invested more in the ground game and technology. >> good. >> she is aligned with the types of voters, the one who -- >> and she said if you want morality in leadership, go to church. >> she was answering a question. oh, where exactly should we go for morality and leadership? should we go to the field of the 2020 democrats? should we go to elizabeth warren who is appropriating somebody else's ethnicity? >> how about the oval office. >> for decades to get an economic advantage? >> how about the oval office? >> should we go to joe biden who wants to punch out somebody? >> how about the office office? >> hillary clinton who is a proven liar. >> tell me we should go to the oval office.
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>> i'm telling you right now, you can go to the oval office. >> and what are we going to find there? >> you were with the president recently. >> i know. >> how come you didn't have the guts to tell him to his face? how come you asked fluffy questions when you were across from him. >> i'm always respectful. the tone would change, but when we're face-to-face he is a different person. >> he is a great person. more importantly, what he is doing for the economy, this economy is the envy of the world. he is putting our trade policies back in balance. he is renegotiating trade with mexico, with canada, with korea. >> why can't he do that and -- >> with south korea and china now. why is it not important to you? >> why can't he do that and be decent? >> he is a good person. you want to throw these words out here. >> kellyanne. >> guess what? that's why he is the best boss i have ever had. >> good for you. >> he's the best boss i ever had. >> you were your own boss for as long as i can recall. >> i had a lot of clients.
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listen, i will be the boss tonight because i won't let you get away with -- >> you can't call out anything he says. >> i'm not going to let you get away with hurling scurrilous. >> it is not scurrilous. >> you had the president as children, doubts and son-in-law, who are presidential advisors, as cockroaches. >> i don't like that kind of talk. >> you have paid people on your network. >> i don't like that kind of talk. the president called me a chained lunatic. >> where are we going for leadership, cnn? >> the president called me a chained lunatic, was that nice? >> and other networks. >> you just ignore it. >> i knew it would have to be about you. >> you just ignore everything he says. >> it was a long time ago. we talked about it. chris, if you want to interrupt me, if that's how you get the ratings -- >> of course i'm going to interrupt you. you go to the mother ship here --
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>> you have people in your network pretending -- you have people pretending on your -- on your network and who are paid by your network and pay pier on other networks that there's a body double for the first lady. when are you going to clear out the kooks at cnn? >> what are you talking about? this is kooky talk. there's no cnn story about body doubles. we don't talk about that. that's not a narrative for me. >> you have some -- >> this started this conversation -- >> you have it out there. >> for those who haven't pulled out their harriet, this started with, don't you think he shouldn't have said, i have the tough people. >> don't have her on anymore? >> and i do. why? because the white house deserves a voice and the case deserves to be made. >> guess what -- >> but you don't make it easy for me to defend you when you don't answer any of the questions. >> here is what he means by tough -- yes, i do. i answered all of your questions because you're impolite when i'm o you don't do it to other people. >> that's not true. i do it to everybody. >> anyway, you don't interrupt. you sit there with a look on your face. >> go ahead. don't make fun of my face. >> you have that look on your
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face. >> don't make fun of my face. >> your face is fine. i'm not making fun of your face, if you won't make fun of mine. >> never. answer the question. >> this is what god gave me, all mine. here is the deal. when he says "tough," we do believe in the trump administration the military are tough, our veterans are tough, the first responders are tough. in fact, because of this president's leadership, moral and otherwise, our first responders, our military, our veterans are better resourced and more deeply respected. >> moral leadership? >> and that includes. >> that's not what he meant -- >> the men and women at border patrol. >> that's not what he meant. he was talking tough. >> the same way it is not a national emergency -- >> the same way he says carrying him out on a stretcher, beat him up, i will pay the legal bills. i think he should be better. >> those who are nostalgic for the campaign -- >> hold on. i don't want you to run out of time on the yammer. >> he is better than you describe him. he wasted the time on this topic. >> the topic matters but we're
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not getting real purchase on it so let's move on. >> he is great and he goes abroad and gets a hero's welcome at the multi-lateral summit. >> then he should be in a better mood and he should speak with more respect and be more decent and more presidential. >> he is in a great mood. >> that's my advice. >> how is he in a bad mood? you read about the stuff about people having been kicked out of the white house and couldn't get in in the first place and he is fine. how do you know that? >> the emergency declaration vote, what does it mean? does it mean the party has drawn a line, there are still principles that will come before just straight party vote? >> no. it means that this president declared a national emergency because he has the authority to do so. the act has been around since 1976. this president allowed congress and the courts, waited for them to do their job. they fell down on the job, didn't do their job. they didn't get the money for the steel slat barriers, the wall, the border security, and he turned around after exhausting all other possibilities, christopher, and declared a national emergency.
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now, 12 republicans have decided that we don't have a national emergency at the border. they decided that -- >> that's not what they said. >> -- that 300 heroin deaths a week -- >> they said it is the wrong way to do it. >> no, a constitutional crisis -- >> yes, because it is a usurpation of power. >> we see a national security crisis. no, it is not. change the act. why doesn't congress change its own laws. >> he admitted himself it is not an emergency. why would he use an emergency law when he says it is not an emergency. >> wait a second. let me ask you a question. >> please. >> it is an emergency and you know it. >> no, i do not know it. >> cherry picking comments here and there, and i'm going to do it with cnn which would be tons of fun with all that is said during a week. i have lots that i'm saving. they're all fun. >> do you have a question or not have a question? >> yay. sure. i'll be happy to ask the questions. do you think it is an emergency when you have 76,000 apprehensions of illegal aliens at the border in february alone?
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do you think it is the emergency when girls the ages of my daughters and your daughters are pumped up with birth control and given pregnancy tests starting at the age of nine and ten? i have a 9 and 11-year-old. >> i think that -- >> you don't think it is an emergency -- >> you have come up with a solution that does not address the crisis. >> no, it is not a problem, right? >> the crisis of children coming with their families, of girls abused on the way here, we are not a wall away from fixing them. >> have you seen these children before -- >> you have a dozen republicans that say just that. >> the unaccompanied children means children without families. >> you heard what i just said? eight out of the twelve voted for $5 billion in funding. it is not about whether or not to build barriers, it is about how to do it. instead of running around the constitution and the meaning of this law, you do it through congress, which is still republican-led in the senate. >> right, because your party has so much respect for the constitution, right? we have so much respect for the constitution on the democratic side. that is something. >> when it bothered you with
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obama you said he can't do it. now you do the same thing with the emergency declaration. >> what bothered me with obama. >> and you expect the party to walk in step? >> what bothered me with president obama was when "the washington post" ran a big story yesterday -- >> the republicans said -- >> i tell you what bothered me with barack obama. >> i don't want to hear anything else. >> why we're in a current emergency. no, no, no. there was a big article yesterday. >> sunday that daca was a usurpation. >> talked about how president obama ignored the fentanyl crisis as he was escalating out control. >> the republican party said daca was a usurpation of power. this is an analogy of what is going on right now. >> no, president obama said he knew it wouldn't stand. he said it wouldn't stand. >> but they aren't -- >> you remember that, right? president obama said -- >> that's my question, you are worried the votes over the last couple of days are the beginning of a trend? >> i'm not, and here is why. because just yesterday those
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same republican senators unanimously voted to confirm naomi rau, the new justice on the district that took brett kavanaugh's seat because he's now a supreme court justice -- yay -- withstood the haters and liars. >> what does it have to do with what i asked? >> they voted for her yesterday. they're going to continue to coat for tax cuts and deregulation. >> that's different. i'm saying we're seeing them vote differently when they don't agree. >> on one resolution? the president said -- the press pool was in there. the president said yesterday, vote however you want, do whatever you have to do. >> what if they override his veto? >> one of the senators in the room that voted against the president today never said a word yesterday. it is very funny the way that goes. >> they're afraid. he is a vindictive guy. >> afraid of what? they're tough on twitter. >> he will say ugly things about you and your family. that's why. >> no, he doesn't. >> sure he does. does it all the time. >> he doesn't, that's not true. >> he says ugly things about people and their family all the time, even if they're the most loyal and closest people. he will turn on you like that,
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they know that. >> he is always helping americans and americans know that. look at this economy, it is booming. the growth numbers, unemployment numbers, you can roll your eyes because maybe it doesn't affect you. >> it affects me. >> it affects most people. >> it affects me. >> and they're happy the president's economy is there. they don't want to hear medicare for all which means choices for none, less medicare for seniors. they don't want to hear the nonsense. they don't believe free college, free housing free everything, free money. people don't believe that's true. now we've got beto in there today -- >> if you are worried about what people believe and don't, you have a candidate who has the lowest -- >> no, not the candidate. i work for the president of the united states. >> but he will be a candidate, right? don't tell me he's not running. he's going to run, right? >> he's the president. of course he is running for reelection. of course he is. >> you have a candidate with the worst ratings for truth telling recorded. >> the president. he's the president now. >> he has the lowest record for truth telling ever. >> he will be the president.
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i have a question for you. >> final question. i will give you the last question. >> how does the democratic party -- how does the democratic party tonight as we sit here have a woman running for president who lied about her ethnicity for decades to get academic ink, amid the worst academic cheating scandal in history, we have a party that can't denounce anti-semitism, a party over the bridge in virginia remains a racist democratic party. lieutenant governor. >> that sounds like -- >> by the brett kavanaugh standard he would be run out of town. >> here is the answer to the question. >> do you think they're people of character? >> i think there are people of character, moral character involved on both sides. i think that your character is only as good as you show it, and this president has set a new standard in politics, which is that you can lie your butt off and it is okay.
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that is a dangerous standard. >> excuse me. he is leading and you want to say that and invite different supporters of the president, people on from the white house and show them -- >> i have to say it. >> -- show them tremendous disrespect. >> the respect is in having you on. >> we have beto saying in el paso tear down the wall because one of the most dangerous cities is on the other side. do you think people hear beto o'rourke say tear down the wall and they hear ronald reagan telling gorbachev to tear down the wale wall? >> maybe they will see it as they do with the president where it says it but means something else. >> we have voters in iowa saying their top two choices to equal 50% of the vote are biden and bernie. that must rank will the party trying to put forward a woman of color, a man of color. >> we'll see. >> other women. >> we'll see who they pick. one is not even in the race. we'll see. kellyanne, thank you. >> oh, yes. that's why he's popular. you're welcome. >> you see, everybody is popular until they get in. take care.
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kellyanne conway, thank you for being here. the gop is soul searching, that's my suggestion. the democrats are, too. kellyanne is right about that. so what is the gop going to line up on? the democrats have to figure out. they have to go through a primary. for the gop it is trickier, conservative principles or pragmatism because of fear of the president's pull? we will look at the facts on both sides of that equation, and beto o'rourke is in the news. he's in the party and it didn't take long for the president and his counsellor to pounce. is o'rourke the one that trump fears the most? let's take it up next. whooo! want to take your next vacation to new heights? tripadvisor now lets you book over a hundred thousand tours, attractions, and experiences in destinations around the world! like new york! from bus tours, to breathtaking adventures, tripadvisor makes it easy to find and book amazing things to do. and you can cancel most bookings up to 24 hours in advance for a full refund. so you can make your next trip... monumental! read reviews check hotel prices book things to do
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are you going to cut taxes >> you don't think the president is a moral leader? >> i think he is. >> but you don't look at politicians for moral leadership? >> i look at all of my political leaders more in line with how you line up with my policies. >> this is new and the new predicament for the gop, the true trump derangement syndrome. the party is battling whether to abandon long-held principles to maintain power, and it explains why the vice president, mike pence, is so quiet these days. with clinton's transgressions, he said this. the very idea that we ought to have at or less than the same moral demands placed on the chief executive that we place on our next-door neighbor is ludicrous and dangerous. but no more. not about this president. remember when ronald reagan said this? >> the truth is politics and morality are inseparable. >> george h.w. bush as president said this. >> america is never wholly
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herself unless she is engaged in high-moral principle. >> that was the gop then. now it is about pragmatism, and the shift is not just about talk. the line this party decides to walk, that's the real issue. the party that bashed president obama over daca, screaming about his end run around the separation of powers, now only a handful call out an equal or greater power play by this president. now, to be fair, a dozen republicans did vote against trump's emergency declaration. but many who attacked daca did not. some like senator tom tillis who wrote an op-ed saying he would vote against the emergency flipped his vote on the declaration disapproval resolution, wound up voting against the measure. in the op-ed published a little over two weeks ago he wrote, although trump certainly has legitimate grievances over congressional democrats obstruction of border security funding, his national emergency
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declaration on february 15th was not the right answer. why did he change his mind? new position of principle? no. same reason pence is quiet and the head of the party through away the moral high ground, fear. a north carolina gop official says tillis was hit hard in the state over his initial embrace of a democratic resolution rebuking trump. so party over principle. the struggle is real, but the good news for real conservatives is there is a struggle. you had 12 republican senators resist something they knew is not right and will more than likely force the president into his first veto. the real question is whether enough republicans can still muster enough belief in principle to override that veto. faith and principle or fear of potus, which will win? party of principle will be a big issue for both parties. beto or biden or harris or sanders, what is the best position for the left and the right on these two situations? great debate next.
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the entrance of a beto for the democrats. what does each mean for left and right? that's our starting point for the great debate. christine quinn and scott jennings. let's start on the democrats. christine quinn, what does beto mean? is he beto than biden and bernie? >> that wasn't even funner though i laughed, chris. >> you laughed. i win. >> i think beto getting into the race is a further reflection of what a terrific bench we have in the democratic party, how deep our leadership is, the diversity of voices that want to be part of this conversation. i think it is a really good thing. now, who is going to rise to the top tier and the top, that's yet to be determined. but this is true democracy in a small "d" and a true democratic party in a big "d". the more voices the better. >> am i fair to pick up on the question of whether or not a white male, christine, has a place at the top of the ticket in your party right now? >> you know, look, i think the best candidate has a place at the top of our ticket, the one who can win.
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the most important thing is to beat president trump, make sure he doesn't get re-elected. i think our candidates show how deep the party is committed to diversity and how diverse our strength is and our leadership is. so i have, you know, full belief we are going to get most diversity in this race and in the ticket, but we need to win. that is critical. >> scott, is the president worried about beto? is that why he had the lame, early attack on him today? he hasn't gotten his material together yet but he showed the intent. >> i don't think they're worried about anybody yet because it is far too early to see who is going to actually win this primary. i mean as far as diversity goes -- >> that's true. >> -- the three front-runners, sanders, beto and biden, are all white guys. the people leading this primary are not diverse at all. >> it is early. >> yes, it is early. >> even though there are diverse names in it. >> a lot is name recognition. >> i presume what will happen to any of these people, they have to drift and gravitate farther
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and farther left to have a chance to win this primary. it doesn't really matter who they are today. it only matters who they are at the end of the process, and who they are at the end of the process will be left wing socialists. that's how the president is going to paint them and how the democratic activists expect them to perform. >> i agree that's how you guys will paint them. christine quinn, you have the sour look. make the case. >> i do. first of all, there's an integrity that exists in the democratic party. these candidates are running as who they are based on their record. they have progressive records as progressive democrats. they don't have records as socialists. these candidates are not going to do a 180 or 360 and change who they are and what they believe in. that's simply not how our primary works and not what democrats are about. none of them have to because they all have incredibly strong records on core -- >> what is beto's record?
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name -- tell me beto's record. what is his record of accomplishment, in his personal life, in his professional life or in congress. name one. >> i'm not so abreast on his personal life, nor should i be so i'm not going to talk about it. >> of course not. there is a reality -- >> he has a personal life. he is an accomplished former member of congress. he ran one of the best senate campaigns in history, almost taking out a long entrenched incumbent. he is someone who galvanized crowds and enthusiasm and young people like we have never seen before. you want to talk about somebody who had no credentials to be president before the election? hello, he's tragically sitting in the white house right now and his name is donald trump. >> yes, except now he is president. >> now he is, unfortunately. >> i was going to say, scott jennings, you know, none of you guys were touting trump's credentials when he was a candidate but now he is a sitting president and it comes with a big stick. christine, who do you have that is going to take him out? look, it is early around we'll see how it develops. >> and the primary in large part
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will answer the question. >> and, look, they always push people to the side. that's one of the reasons this president is where he is, because of the way the party shifted. now there's a new battle for the soul. we have seen it in the votes in the last few days and in what ronna mcdaniel said on the show. i have never heard anything like that from anybody at the top of the rnc before, where she dismissed morality as part of a political scorecard. you know, i go to church for that, scott. i go to church for that. i don't -- i go to my politicians for their positions. that pragmatism has not been present in your party to date. does it win out? is that the new soul of the party, that whatever gets it done, baby, just win? >> well, i think what you're seeing republicans do is reacting to what they thought was eight years under barack obama of a complete disrespect of their conservative values, certainly christian conservatives felt that way. no, i don't believe they hold donald trump up to be a moral figure. they don't hold him up to be a perfect christian. they didn't hire him necessarily to sing in the church choir.
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they hired him to push back on the extreme left in this country as they saw it that took this country so far culturally to the left it was almost unrecognizable to them. they lived through john mccain, mitt romney and other republican leaders who were honorable people and who did things very, very well in their personal and their professional lives, but as they saw it they did not have the intestinal fortitude to take on the extreme left and the media that was pushing this country so far to the fringe. that's what trump delivered for them. they don't look to him, in my opinion, to be a christian leader. they look to him to respect their christian values, which is not what they were getting under the previous administration. >> listen, i got to tell you, you are shaking your head no, christine. i believe everything he just said. they hired a hitman. >> i agree with what he said. >> they didn't see him as the antidote but a poison to the system. the question on your side of the ball is, whom do you have that can go toe-to-toe with a guy whose party is happy to watch him fight dirty? >> look, i don't disagree with what scott said about the deal that was made, but let's make no mistake about it.
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it is the height of hypocrisy. >> that's politics and it is the way it will be fought and you have to have a street fighter. >> i don't believe it has to be part of politics and the far religious right made a deal with the devil. that's the fact. what i am shaking my head about is i think it is really unfortunate that those types of deals were made. now, look, we are going to have a democratic primary here. clearly that's going to be robust and active. i agree, we have to come out with the best candidate to beat donald trump, because that's our mission, to beat donald trump. who that's going to be, a good multi, multi, candidate field will help us because we need somebody up against donald trump. he is a great campaigner, that's a fact. he is tough as nails as a campaigner, and we need a candidate who is going to be just as good, and the primary is going to help us see who that person is. >> i think the biggest challenge is for the media, because i think it is going to be a circus.
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i think it will be the worst thing i have ever covered and it will be so tempting for the media to play to the new lows, and we're going to have to find a way to thread it through for people so they don't lose all hope in all of you because that's what i'm worried about, is where we're headed. christine quinn, scott jennings, appreciate you making the case here on "cuomo prime time." >> absolutely. the plain story, not letting it go because we know it doesn't make sense, the timing of what happened. we know we have to keep digging and we are and there's new reporting. the biggest fear is this ethiopia crash was a repeat problem, right? we have some of the pilot's final words coming to light in a new report. they tell us things and we have new data that compares the two flights, and you will want to see it. maria ramirez?
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>> the "new york times" reports radio messages. made to air traffic control problems, less than one minute into the flight. less than one minute into the flight they told the air traffic controllers, we have trouble. controllers apparently observed the plane going up and down by hundreds of feet at an unusually fast speed. panic could be heard in the captain's voice as he said, break, break, request back to home, request vector for landing. that was three minutes into the flight. all contact was lost two minutes later.
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now, i'm giving you time cues because i want you to look at the graph. it shows how the ethiopia airlines flight followed the same erratic pattern to my eye as the lion air jet. okay. and we have bracketed the relevant time section, okay, because, yes, in the beginning it is different. you see an angle of ascent on the top graph that is different than the one on the bottom, but do you see in that same interval in there's a precipitous drop, okay. then you see a flagging pattern and we all know what happened after that. so this is what has alarmed investigators the most as they wait for data from the black boxes. i want to bring in cnn aviation analyst miles o'brian. always a pleasure to see you. >> good to see you. >> a pleasure to have you on the new show. >> yes. >> keep that graph up. am i getting this wrong that those similar segments and drops are worth being worried about? >> absolutely. you have this entirely correct. you don't have to be a rocket scientist.
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you don't have to be an aviation person, you don't have to be a pilot. you look at those graphs and you see something very similar is going on here. what you have is an aircraft fighting against its own crew, an aircraft that is programmed to correct the incorrect actions of the crew, but for whatever reason, because of bad data from a sensor or some faulty software, is doing the wrong thing, and the crew, you know, doing its best to pull back on that yoke, that wheel, 90 pounds of pressure to try to get -- to overcome it, trying to fight this thing. now, one thing you can do is disconnect the system, but when you are in a struggle like that, you're just trying to keep the thing from -- the stability is a huge factor. you may not have the time to do what you need to do. so, you know, this is so hauntingly parallel that it makes me think about that lion air incident. now, at that time boeing and the
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faa said, we have potentially a problem with the software, we need to fix it. faa said, okay, well, we will fly the airplanes, we'll do it by april. well, they identified a fleet-wide problem that could be catastrophic and could lead to deaths and they didn't ground the planes at that point. you could make an argument that that was the time to ground the planes and fix it. >> and i've been asking this question, this is great to have you. i'm so -- i'm not happy about any of this, but this is good. my suspicion is that if you knew you needed a software upgrade as soon as that lion air jet went down essentially, you must have known something before about the lion -- about this plane for you to immediately know, we have to do this. >> well, there were a series of reports out there that didn't lead to crashes. that's an anonymous reporting system run by nasa and it is purposeful so the pilots feel comfortable reporting and realize the faa won't lower the boom on them. there were several incidents of autopilot problems where the aircraft did just that.
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there's a recurring pattern here. put it this way. imagine if the lion air crash was an engine falling off or a wing falling or or some mechanical hardware thing, that plane would have been grounded pretty quickly, right? it was software. increasingly we're relying on software to control our aircraft, and perhaps there's not a recognition of how important it is to fix the software, too. you know, do it by april. well -- >> you sound like the president. are you saying planes need less technology? >> albert einstein as your pilot, right? listen, i'll take einstein as pilot. i like smart guys. >> it is not about having too much technology, it is about making sure the technology works and the people flying the planes know how to do work with it. >> the key is being in the loop. a lot of automated aircraft are safer, however, when the automation fails the pilot needs to know what is going on. they are frequently for lack of training, the lack of knowledge of the system -- this system was not well-explained to the pilots at all. they don't flow what is going on. it is a black box to them. if the system works, it is
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great. if it goes south, these pilots have to be on their toes quickly. >> here is my question. when did the faa know about the similarity between these two? >> i'll be honest, i look at those graphs, we knew that information pretty much the day of. those flat tracks a little more rudimentary came out quite awhile. >> if miles o'brien is working at the faa and you see that graph, wouldn't you know something is happening? >> got to ground them. >> why didn't they? >> it is probably for the same reason the ethiopians sent the black boxes to france, not the united states. there is a perception that a u.s. company, boeing, the biggest exporter in the nation, gets favorable treatment politically and otherwise. that's the suggestion. i can't say that's what happened in this case, but i do know that the faa has a long history of
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being very close to the industry it regulates. >> now, this is one of the cases where we cannot fatigue. we have to stay and see what they do with the planes now that they're on the ground and what they can assure when they put them back in the air. i know that's going to be squishy. it is going to be squishy. >> it is software and you have to make sure it works. first, do no harm, right? >> right. >> miles, a pleasure. i'm going to call on you for this. i need the best. >> any time. >> thank you very much. so back to politics. do you think that the left is going to still feel the bern or have they found someone -- wait for it -- beto? is o'rourke the answer? there's a lot of hype. you know who likes to talk about hype? d. lemon. we bring him in next. thanksmrs. murphy. unitedhealthcare, hi, i need help getting an appointment with my podiatrist. how's wednesday at 2? i can't. dog agility. tuesday at 11? nope. robot cage match. how about the 28th at 3?
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apart? here is his answer? >> i'm just going to be me, you know. i'm going to run for everyone, run with everyone, listen to everybody, try to answer every question. but at this very divided moment in our country, people want to come together. >> d. lemon, come on in on this. first of all, i'm asking this question. people on the left don't like that i'm saying it, but there does seem to be momentum in that party that they are about diversity and youth now and that they may not be ready -- ready. they may not be open to another white male. is that an unfair question? >> no, it is not an unfair question. listen, i don't think any question is unfair as long as you can explain the rationale behind it. before i answer i was going to say we're going to talk about that, discuss it this evening. can he garner the support of african-americans in this race? it is a huge voting block. it makes a difference, especially black women made a difference in many elections as
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we've seen since 2016 across this country. so we're going to talk about that. but i think it is a fair question, and i also think it is a fair question about policy, about his policies, right? because that's where the rubber meets the road. now, i'm just going to say, so he spoke in iowa today, and this is a criticism that he doesn't really -- he didn't really give any policies, that he doesn't really have a platform. that's a criticism. you know, how much of a platform did trump or anybody have at this point in an election? how much did he have or how much does any candidate have at this point? here is what he said as he was speaking. we have the single greatest mechanism to call forth the genius of our fellow human beings. this democracy can bring the ingenuity, the creativity, the resolve, of an entire country. >> look, you know -- >> sounds good. >> i've heard it before. >> but what does that mean? >> and when barack obama said it, people hit him with the stick of, what has he done? >> what has he done? >> i think that what we're going
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to see here, you know, with all due respect to my brothers and sisters in the media, you know, they love to love people up, and then they tear them down. and beto o'rourke has gotten a lot of love from the media. >> he's a media darling. >> now he's going get scrutiny and tonight, the republican came out of the box in the great debate, said, hey, wait a minute, what has this guy ever done? remind me. >> yeah. >> and i got to tell you, it was a little bit of a struggle. >> right. >> for the democrat to say, well, it's early, we don't really know him. >> yeah. >> i think it's going to be a problem that's going to be early and often for him. >> i say rightfully so, and if he has his wits about him, he will take on that challenge and those questions. >> sure. >> he will welcome them. and, and if any -- i'm speaking to all of the folks who are running, if they are smart, they will take a page from the trump playbook, and when folks call you and say, will you do an interview? not going to do that. >> do them. >> do it. own the media. >> they're already not doing it. they're already picking all the favorites. >> stupid.
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>> getting the blessing of the high pundits of the left. >> stupid. >> making a mistake. >> stupid. mr. trump, will you do an interview with me tomorrow? sure, don, what time do you want me to call? right? can you come in? no, i can't come in, i'll call. i'd like to come to trump tower. i'll get ronna to work on it, whatever. guess what, who's sitting in the oval office now. >> it was definitely part of it. people say, you gave him too much attention. he took the opportunities presented. we gave the clinton campaign the same opportunities. >> don't blame him for saying yes when other people said no. and if you think about it, on this program, the things that he said, he came on blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her wherever. that was on this show. what's doing the raping, don? that was on this show. are you racist? are you bigoted? that was from an interview with -- and you know what, he took those challenges and instead of folding and saying, oh my gosh, i'm sorry, he capitalized on it and said, yeah, you know what i meant by that. and he wasn't afraid of it.
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they should do the same thing. take a lesson from the trump playbook, democrats. >> take the opportunities. make them what you want them to be. >> yep. >> all right, bud, talk to you in a bit. >> see you in a bit. president trump likes to talk tough. kellyanne didn't want to deal with it. i understand why but we have to. not enough to call other people names when they're asking you about the names he called people. what he's doing is symptomatic of what he wants us to be. we have to see it for what it is. that's the job. my argument is next. ready for a lash lift? l'oréal's new unlimited lash lift mascara. 1. stretch it. 2. tilt it. 3. lift it. reach even smaller lashes. unlimited length. unlimited lift. new unlimited mascara by l'oréal paris. ♪
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all of you. how you live, what you love. that's what inspired us to create america's most advanced internet. internet that puts you in charge. that protects what's important. it handles everything, and reaches everywhere. this is beyond wifi, this is xfi. simple. easy. awesome. xfinity, the future of awesome. imagine for a moment if i said something like this, you know, trump supporters, they play rough. threaten my life. bother me at home. scare my kids. but you know, i have the support of my local police and the military. and some biker friends. i have the tough people, but they don't play it tough until they go to a certain point.
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and then it would be very bad, very bad. what do you think happens if i were to say that for real? at a minimum, the trump trio of fox would go nuts and rightly so for a change. my boss would insist i apologize if he even let me stay on. i may be seen as way too unstable to even do this job. well, what i just said is exactly what this president said today. and he actually does have control of the military. now, he was talking to some right-wing fire-breathing outlet that was arguably egging him on about how ugly the left can be, but still, here's the quote. "i can tell you i have the support of the police, the support of the military, support of the bikers for trump. i have the tough people but they don't play it tough until they go to a certain point and then it would be very bad, very bad." the "they" is the left. this is cherry picking, kellyanne says. maybe just a one-off weak moment. wrong. listen to this. >> they're so lucky that we're peaceful.
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law enforcement, military, construction workers, bikers for trump. how about bikers for trump? these are tough people. these are great people. but they're peaceful people and antifa and all, they got to hope they stay that way. >> the argument is over. it wasn't about context. it's not about what was asked of him. he said the same damn thing before. the best his defenders can do is say, well, the left is mean and inflammatory, too. fair is fair. no, they mean foul justifies foul. and that is pathetic. matching tone with a mobbish fringe contingent of antifa or some anarchists? you're the president, not the head of a right-wing extremist group. this is not okay. ever. but especially not now. the temperature is already too high.
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too many of us have too much heat from this kind of talk. and the reaction to this kind of talk. this president is jumping up and down on too many fault lines and he knows it. and it seems he likes it because he keeps doing it. it is by definition in the law reckless behavior. he knows the risk the words create and he does it anyway. and his party is now apparently moving away from the message of character counts to being okay with a man named donald who talks like a mafia don in the white house. i wish he would pick his words more carefully. that's the best you'll hear. he's picking them carefully all the time. he means it all. he has repeatedly encouraged violence. and it too often sounds like the tacit approval of violence if things don't go his way. like the mueller report.
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congressional investigations. maybe god forbid he loses in 2020. i'm not picking on the president. i do not show him disrespect on this show or when i see him in person. i'm always the same people. if anything -- same person. if anything i act in a way that shows more respect for the presidency than he does. i came up in the same place. i get that there's a time to stand and fight. that's a street standard for justice. not the standard for a president. it's good that the economy grows. it is good that wages rise and that trade favors american workers more. it's good if more americans are optimistic about their future and if that's because of the president's policies then okay, good for him, but none of that makes this okay. not in a president. money is not a replacement for morality in our leadership. the scrutiny cannot be curtailed just because there are some policies that are making a positive difference in place. it doesn't make what the
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president says okay. his party may fear not having his favor, but we do not. we will call this out because if we don't, who will? thank you for watching us tonight. "cnn tonight with don lemon" starts right now. >> the last question is a good one, who will? certainly not most people in the administration. his spokespeople. including the person you had on tonight. they just cannot do it. i just don't understand. >> oh, they can. they choose not to. i've never seen kellyanne less effective in defense of the president than she was tonight. i think that's maybe just getting too hard to do. >> so here's the thing, then, this is how i feel, this is what do you want. she never answers a question. she berates you. she's condescending. she uses our network for, to give her talking points. for me, it feels beneath the dignity of this network to have someone on who just constantly

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