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tv   Fareed Zakaria GPS  CNN  April 14, 2019 10:00am-11:00am PDT

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this is gps, the global public square. welcome to all of you in the united states and around the world. i'm fareed zakaria. today on the show, hillary clint clinton. the field of 2020 democratic presidential contenders. >> i am absolutely delighted to see this incredibly diverse field. >> robert mueller's findings. >> we deserve to see the mueller
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report. >> on leadership. do men and women lead differently? >> of course. >> much more -- >> if you really wanted to solve this problem, you would not be separating families and putting babies in cages. >> but first, here's my take. there are many explanations for benjamin netanyahu's victory in this week's elections that have to do with israel's particular situation. it's economic boom, stable security climate and the prime minister's political talent. he's also part of a much larger phenomenon. the continued strength of populous nationalism around the worlds, and the continued inability of left of center parties to respond to it, the case for populous national inch goes something like this, it's a nasty world out there, people are trying to take our jobs, undermine our security. move into our country.
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the cosmopolitan urban elites don't care. we need a touch guy that will stand up for the liberals in our midst. this is the argument made by netanyahu putin, erdogan, the brexiteer and donald trump. the philosopher from berlin wrote, nationalism inflames the desire to count for something among the cultures of the world. the sentiment can be found in almost all modern variations, even among rich and powerful nations. look at putin's claim that russia has been pushed around by the west since the cold war. the chinese obsession with the humiliati humiliation since the opium wars. the world is also biassed against israel. and trump's constant refrain that all foreigners take
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advantage of america. these leaders promise to rectify the legislation and restore their country's proper standing in the world. netanyahu argued in his 1993 book, for an israeli nationalism that is aggressive and unapologetic. israel's strength and security have grown immeasurably -- they've either become buddies or basket cases. the idea that the world is against it is somehow persistent. nationalism is probably the most widely held ideology in the world today which american politician today does not speak up for america. the danger for liberals, they underestimate the power of these raw emotional appeals. for centuries, liberals have assumed it was an irrational
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attachment that would grow weaker as people became more rational, connected and worldly. in fact, a tweet that is bent in one direction and has to snap back as globalization grows in its reach. nationalism will be the predictable backlash. populous nationals understand the ideology. recently asked whether the brazilian president's policies or his cultural nationalism is the key to his appeal. the answer nationalism is the party's core. meanwhile, liberals in america still don't seem to get it, the democratic party continues to think the solution to its woes is to keep moving left ward economically. bernie sanders revealed his medicare for all plan, which
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four other presidential candidates co sponsored immediately. donald trump tweets, about the democrats love of open borders, and in sifts that he and he alone will protect the country and enforce its laws. what if trump understands the mood of our times better than bernie standards. for more, go to and read my washington post column this week. let's get started. there are still 569 days until the 2020 election, already there are nearly 20 democratic presidential wannabes. hillary clinton knows something about being a presidential candidate, she was one in 2008 and again in 25016.
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what is her advice to the 2020 contenders? i was invited to interview the former senator and former secretary of state on friday at the 10th annual women in the world summit. i talked to secretary clinton in front of a packed audience at the event founded by tina brown and held at lincoln center here in new york. >> hi. >> welcome, hillary clinton. >> so happy to be here. >> pleasure to have you here. >> thank you. thank you. >> today, april 12th, four years ago, you announced for the presidency of the united states? >> i did. i did. >> if there's one piece of advice for the 18 democrats who are trying to do what you did about running against donald trump, what would it be? >> wow! i am absolutely delighted to see
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this incredibly diverse field and especially to have more than one woman running for president of the united states is exciting. but i think -- you really have to do two things simultaneously, and it's challenging. you do have to present what you want to do. what is your vision? what is your hope for our country. how do you see the future? what are you going to propose that will make a difference in the lives of americans and maintain the values, the ideals of america in a very complex world? so you bear that responsibility at the same time, you have to be able to counter and ignore where possible, respond where necessary to the diversion and distraction that we see
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unfortunately working by the current incumbent in the white house? so you have to do that balancing act, and i think that we have excellent candidates who are demonstrating their ability to do that, but really, fareed, what it comes down, to because yes, i -- i kicked off my campaign four years ago today and i think about what an amazing experience it was traflting the country, talking with people, listening to people, making the case for the kind of america that i want for my children and grandchildren. but i also think about what i said at the very end of that campaign, when i addressed all the little girls and told them to keep dreaming and told them to be powerful, be ready. to take on risks, be brave.
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because it comes down to n down to all of us. our country, our democracy, they need all of us, they need all of you, and so while the candidates are doing the best job they can, i hope that people, voters, citizens are thinking about what they can do to make sure that we live up to our bestselves and we elect someone who will reflect our positiveself and not our negative. and will try to lift us up and move us with confidence and optimism into the future. >> so one of those candidates running, pete buttigieg gave an interview to the washington post, he said, hillary clinton went around telling the country america is great weather. trump was able to appeal to
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people's anxieties, he sensed that things were going wrong, the america they loved was changing, and that you appealed too much to the hope. that in fact a democrat needs to understand that people are feeling pain, they're feeling there are problems, and those problems need to be addressed in some way. do you think that's a reasonable critique? >> well, i don't want to comment on any of the can dir dates. because like i say, i think they all have a lot to contribute, not only to the democratic party, but to the country and it will be up to voters to decide who our nominee is, but i would say this, i really do believe that we always have to appeal to our betterselves, because the wolf is at the door my friends. negativity, despair, anxiety, resentment, anger, prejudice, that's part of human nature. and the job of a leader is to appeal to us to be more than we
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could be on our own. to join hands in common effort. and i absolutely though agree with the thrust of your question, because the campaign that was run in 2016 was dark. it was negative. it did provide a long list of scapegoats, so if if you did have problems in your life, if you were feeling left behind and left unite. there were answers as to why that was happening that the other candidate, the opposing party was going to offer to you. so i am well aware of the power of that, and i think you wrote an article recently about the power of appeals to nationalism. and how we see that, not just in our country, but elsewhere in the world. i just believe that it is important to say where there are
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legitimate concerns. and i address that, i did put out what i would do to bring jobs to places that were left out, to deal with inequality in our economy. to try to make sure everybody had quality affordable health kash. that's what i've been standing for, fighting for, working for my entire public life. so i was well aware that we have problems that we have to solve, but it's been my experience that anger, resentment, prejudice are not strategies. they stop people from thinking. they don't enlist people in a common effort to try to find solutions. so i believe that we have to start where people are and the country is very divided. and there are a lot of positive optimistic people and events happening. there are people who feel left out, unheard, dismissed,
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marginalized, but what we've got to try to do is appeal to everybody. and i still believe that we will do better as a country in recognizing our problems. but appealing to our and our common hopes to try to deal with those problems. that's what i believed in, that's what i ran on, and that's whey think is best for the country. next on gps, the mueller report, or at least the barr letter. does secretary clinton believe there was no collusion? >> tech: at safelite autoglass,
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attorney general barr has now promised mueller's report with some deletions will be delivered to congress in the coming days. i wanted to find out hillary clinton's thoughts on the report. >> do you believe william barr's summary of the mueller report? >> how can we? >> i mean, how can we? we deserve to see the mueller report. and if there is material that for whatever reason should not be shared publicly, it should be shared with the congress. i do have a life you cannot make up, and one of the things that i did as a very young lawyer was work on the impeachment staff of
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the house judiciary committee in 1974 investigating richard nixon. so i know what can be made available, what the court has to be asked to permit to be made available. i know the republicans did when they were in charge of the congress in demanding information from the justice department that had never been offered before. it was all turned over to the republican congress. so we're in this bit of a white zone, aren't we? there's a report, depending on which figure you believe, is between 300, 400 pages long and it is not being delivered to the congress which has an absolute right to see it. it is not being presented to the public. so i think that what we saw in congress with the attorney
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general's presentation in the house and the senate is someone who considers his principle duty to be protecting donald trump, not protecting the rule of law and the democracy that the justice department should be defending. and i remember when nixon was really upset gauze there was an investigation going on, and he fired people who would not do his bidding, until he finally ended up with somebody who would do his bidding. but it didn't save him, because the information that had been collected was made available to the congress to the courts and eventually to the public. so i would hope that the law is followed, that the information is provided, the american public and the press has a chance to go through these 300 to 400 pages
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with as few redactions or crossouts as possible. and i think the congress has to take a hard look at what their remedies are if they're not given that information. and they do have remedies to go to court and the like, it should not be necessary, this information should be provided. as someone who has been in the eye of the storm all of these years. i think that everybody deserves their chance to tell their story, i believe in facts and evidence and law. but this was an investigation that had a serious purpose to determine what role the russians played in our election, to try to understand the kind of bizarre connections between russians and members of the trump campaign and people close to trump is. these are really important
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questions, it's not just because we should for historic purposes really find out what happened. it's because we need to be prepared to prevent from whatever happened in the past from happening again, that would influence wrongly our elections. >> when you look at the crisis in immigration. and there is a crisis in terms of all these asylum seekers coming. >> right. >> is president trump right in saying you can't take everyone in, we have to be tough on this issue, we otherwise will get overwhelmed. is there a danger that the democrat democrats -- i'll read to you what was written, democrats are having a purity test, the idea that everyone has to demonstrate particularly on immigration how pure they are, donald trump
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would say i'm the only guy who's actually willing to enforce the law. >> if that were true, but it's not here's why, if you were serious about dealing with immigration which i am and believe we must. we do not and cannot have open borders. that is not in anybody's interest. but we also can't demagogue the issue and expect to solve the problem. so for people who want to deny there's a problem or people who don't want to solve the problem but use it as a political issue. they're both in my view failing. here's what we could be if the president wanted to solve the problem as opposed to keep beating it as a political drum to try to rally his supporters. what is asylum? asylum is a request by a person who under our law has the right to come and say there are
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reasons why i cannot stay in my home country i am seeking asylum. how do you resolve asylum cases? you resolve them by eventually having somebody appear before an immigration judge to have their case heard. if you really wanted to solve this problem, you would double, you would quadruple the number of immigration judges. you would hire more people, you would send them to the border, you would begin to organize a system so that people could be quickly processed in a legal and humane way. you would not be separating families and putting babies in cages. you know, we're really good about doak thing doing things we want to do them. you would have enough decent humane housing, you would have
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people who were in a system, one of the worst things this administration has done is to separate those children and have no system if that many actually would tell you where they are. i mean, i would go to the big tech companies and say, you have 15 days, give me a system so i can keep track of everybody, i'm not going to lose anyone, no baby, no older person, everybody is going to be in the system and we're going to have enough judges down there, and we're going to start hearing those cases. that is what someone who wanted to solve the problem would be doing as opposed to denying it or politicize it. that's whey hope eventually will be done. we'll be back in a moment with much more of my interview with hillary clinton from lincoln center. >> we do have the largest
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as secretary of state, you met many many world leaders. one of them, you met often was benjamin netanyahu. do you think that the administration's strategy toward israel, which seems to be to largely accommodate prime minister netanyahu, give him what he wants, recognition of israeli sovereignty over the golan heights, move the embassy, in the hope that this will produce a deal between the palestinians and the israelis? does that strike you as realistic given what you know about bibi netanyahu? >> i don't know, we'll find out. if there is such a deal ever presented, which hasn't been yet. i worked closely with him. and i had a very positive working relationship, and i honest with me. i didn't think it was useful to pander. i thought it was better to
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provide our best assessment. you know, i worked with him to end a hamas attack on israel back in november of 2012. it was really complicated. had to go to jerusalem meet with him, go to ramallah and meet with abbas. go back to jerusalem, go to cairo, meet with the then muslim brotherhood president. i've had a lot of hands on first person experience with him. he's very smart, he's very determined. whether the kinds of actions that this administration has taken will in anyway move toward a two-state solution i think is an open question. and i worry that toward the end of the election bibi was talking about annexing all the
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settlements. you would start from a difficult position trying to reach some sort of resolution. i'm democracy, i also believe that the palestinian people deserve to have more support, more a autono autonomy, more efforts to practice self-government. and so how we get there, and -- i watched my husband make an offer to the palestinians on behalf of the israeli government, that if they had accepted it, they would have had a state now for more than 15 years. but they didn't. and so i watched in my time in the senate and then as secretary of state with all the efforts that were undertaken, not only by the united states to be an honest broker but other countries by the u.n. and none of it has been resolved.
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we'll see, he's obviously been re-elected. he gets to govern for probably another five or so years. let's see if there's any kind of movement. because everything who cares about israel knows that in the absence of some resolution, you know, the democracy is changing, and the palestinian population is increasing far faster than the israeli population. how do you reconcile that? and that's going to be the real test of leadership, and i hope that everybody's ready for it. >> president trump says in dealing with saudi arabia, that you cannot do much more than they have done in pushing on any kind of consequences for the murder of jamal khashoggi, because saudi arabia is at the end of the day, the central banker of the world's oil, i think as donald trump says, if you push that area too hard, oil
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will go to $150 a barrel, we'll have a recession. what would you do if you were at the state department today in response to the khashoggi murder? >> well, today it's -- unfortunately kind of late, isn't it? if it had been in the immediate aftermath of this brutal murder, which i don't think anyone doubts had to be ordered from the highest levels of the saudi government, there should have been a much stronger response by the united states. we cannot single handedly and in anyway reach in and change the saudi government. that's beyond our power to do so. but you can certainly set standards, and the united states historically has been the gau n
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gaurentor of human rights in the hope that countries will not revert to crass behaviors, including the murder of political opponents or journalists. we should have been much more vocal in standing up against the saudis, they finally got around to using sanctions against some of the principle identified personnel. but even if you're dealing with a country. i dealt with countries that commit gross human rights abuses, i negotiated with leaders who were really difficult to sit across from, because you knew what their behaviors were. but at united states has to stand for something besides barbarism. we have to stand for a society that is constantly trying to
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create the institutions that will support a rule of law, that will support human rights, that will give us the position of leadership in the world to speak out and speak out forcefully. when we retreat from that, and we basically say, we're not going to interfere, for whatever the excuse is. right now, the united states has actually surpassed saudi arabia in the production of oil and gas, and we don't need the saudis like we did before. but we want to continue to work with them, but not on any terms. there has to be some -- at least rhetorical if not actionable steps taken. when you retreat from that, when you surrender that, you surrender a lot of our power. we do have the biggest economy still. we do have the largest military still.
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those are important. but what we stand for has always been more important. people have followed us. people have not wanted to get on the wrong side of us because of what we represent. and when you walk away from that, when you make fun of it, when you deride it, we lose power. this is not just a nice thing to do, this is leverage. this is how we try to create a world of laws, not of strong men and we try to enforce those views of how the world should work. and the current administration has an affinity toward dictators. they have an affinity toward knocking out all of the institutions that have been built up to restrain nations. i mean, when you blow the top off and say that you are supporting autocrats, dictators, nationalists, you are forgetting
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the lessons of the 20th century. we fought the bloodiest war in human history twice. we dealt with gulags, concentration camps, we dealt with the worst that people are capable of doing. why did we set up institutions like nato or the eu? why did we pass something called the universal declaration of human rights? because we wanted to contain those impulses. we wanted people to be held accountable. when you walk away from that, whether it's in saudi arabia or russia or anywhere else, you are contributing to the unleashing of those very basic primal instincts. we didn't change human nature by creating this institutional framework, but we contained it, and we set standards for it. and we were able to win a cold
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war because people never gave up on freedom and on the hope that they would have a better future. when we received from that, we received from america. we received from america's power and influence in the world. that is a dreadful mistake. >> last week tina brown, the founder of women in the world told me, she believes women and men lead differently. i'll ask hillary clinton what she thinks when we come back. don't forget if you miss a show, go to for a link to my itunes pod cast. ♪ hoo!
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she said women lead differently than men. they have different qualities. do you think that's true, the world would be different if it were led by women? >> of course. i don't just say that, i believe it, it's not that every woman who would govern differently, we know that, but let's just take the example of the horrific terrorist attack in new zealand. and the response of the prime minister, right? and i had a chance to meet with her about a year ago, while she was very pregnant. and we talked about all kinds of things, we talked about having air baby when you're in a public
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position and how you balance that, the things we talk about with our friends. and she showed the heart, not only of a leader, mother. and her reaching out to the muslim community in new zealand sent a message about how leaders should behave in the face of horrific violence conducted for ideological reasons. and i think that that was as strong a signal as we could get, that given the chance many women will govern and lead differently. i want to end with this story, i had dinner the other night with
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alan johnson. first woman elected president in africa, she was elected twice to be president in liberia a country that survived barely a terrible civil war, how did that end? it ended because leaders like ellen and others, enlisted the women of liberia the market women. christian and muslim alike. to make it clear that they were not going to put up with the war any more. there was a conference that was called to try to end the civil war. it was being held in ghana. no women were involved. no women were invited. and so those women, those market women and their leaders made their way to ghana where they camped out around the building
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where the negotiators were meeting, and they would not let the men out until they had ended the civil war. and there is lots of evidence that including women in the economy, in politics, in conflict resolution, leads to better more sustainable outcomes. and if you're interested in what happened in liberia where women truly made the difference, there's a great movie about it called "pray the devil back to hell." and there are other examples like that around the world. and all of you who are here and this wonderful conference that tina conceived and now has put on for 10 years gives us this moment in time to listen to people. but also to ask ourselves, what can i do? you know, you may never run for office, you may never be
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appointed as some big position somewhere, but there's something everybody can do, speaking out, speaking up supporting organizations, nonprofits and others. supporting candidates who you believe in, who can make a difference. so yes, i think that we saw this in the midterm election when all those women who were elected to the house of representatives. and maybe most importantly, their led by one effective tough woman, the speaker of the house, nancy pelosi. so, yeah, it makes a big difference. >> hillary clinton, 34resh our to talk to you. >> thank you so much, fareed. >> thanks to tina kbroun and the 10th annual women in the world summit for asking me to interview secretary clinton. thanks to mrs. clinton for the grade conversation.
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as the next presidential campaign begins to ramp up, candidates promise to improve the lives of their fellow americans. >> i am running to declare once and for all that healthcare is a fundamental right. >> i do believe housing is a human right. >> we need to protect the individual rights and wages of working my question. americans are least satisfied by which of the following parts of their personal lives, a, household income, b, personal health, c, education, or, d, amount of leisure time? stay tuned and we'll tell you the correct answer. my book of the week is "accidental precedence" by jarred cohen. this is a fascinating prism through which to look at american history. the eight men who ascended to
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the presidency because the elected president died. it's a well-written fast-paced book that is filled with interesting facts and insights. anyone interested in american history will delight in it, and now for the last look, 800 miles from the north pole sits the island that's home to the northern most town in the world and also one of the places most dramatically affected by global warming. the town is completely built on permafrost. with rising temperatures buildings are sinking into the ground as what used to be a solid foundation transforms into something more soggy and less permanent. some residents have moved to safer ground, but it's not just townspeople and local reindeer who rely on the permafrost. this is the global doomsday vault in case of catastrophe.
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it's the world largest speed bank, a natural fridge, of course, for the precious cargo, but no it's confirmed that the permafrost is melting. of course, seeds are not the only thing stored within the permafrost. it also holds vast quantities of carbon so melting it will exacerbate global warming. at least we do have a backup of the world's plants for now even though we don't have a backup for human beings. the answer to my gps challenge this week is, q, it turns out americans are mostly very satisfied with their family life than with education, the way leisure time is spent, housing, personal health, community. their standard of living, their job, household income. the item with the least satisfaction is their amount of leisure time. well, summer vacation is right around the corner. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week. i'll see you next week. or what your dreams entail,
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the new galaxy s10 on xfinity mobile. the phone and network designed to do more. switch and save today, and you get a new galaxy. say "get a galaxy" to learn more. hello, everyone. thank you so much for joining me. i'm fredericka whitfield. at any moment now, south bend mayor pete buttigieg is expected to formally enter the 2020 race making him the first presidential candidate ever to be in a same-sex marriage. that's not the only thing that helps the 37-year-old standout from a crowded field of candidates. he also served in afghanistan, and if elect the buttigieg would become the youngest president in u.s. history. we'll take you live to south bend for that special announcement when he takes to the stage. we're also tracking a deadly storm system sweeping across