tv New Day With Alisyn Camerota and John Berman CNN November 22, 2019 2:00am-3:00am PST
>> he wants to go to the trial. >> it's obstruction of justice. obstruction of congress. this is "new day," with alisyn camerota and john berman. >> welcome to our viewers in the united states and all around the world. this is a special edition of "new day." it is friday, november 22nd. 5:00 in the east. so, here we are. two historic weeks, 12 public witnesses, a mountain of evidence, hours of testimony, all telling the same story. the president was using foreign policy for his own personal purposes. a domestic political errand. that's what happened, according to witnesses, their testimony, and the evidence. so, what now? what now for the democrats is moving forward without fighting in court for documents and testimony from a number of high-ranking administration officials who have refused to testify. sources tell cnn, the democrats are preparing a report of their findings that will serve as a basis for oral articles of
impeachment. they will focus on abuse of power, obstruction of justice, obstruction of congress and bribery. a vote to impeach the president in the full house will likely happen by christmas. meanwhile, republican senators are working with the white house on a strategy for a potential impeachment trial. will it be a lengthy trial or a speedy one? according to "the washington post," president trump is pushing the senate to dismiss the case immediately. so, after these incredible two weeks, which, if any republicans, accept the facts as laid out by witnesses under oath? let's begin our coverage with cnn's suzanne malveaux live on capitol hill. what a week. we're still processing it. >> reporter: we're processing, alisyn. it's quiet here on capitol hill, as most members of congress are on the thanksgiving recess. but house democrats on the intelligence committee are working through the holiday, writing a report that they have enough evidence to impeaecach t president. house democrats moving one step
closer to impeaching president trump, building their case that he orchestrated a plan to withhold military aid and dangled a white house meeting in exchange for ukraine announcing investigations into his political rivals. multiple democratic sources telling cnn, they're hoping to wrap up by christmas, including holding proceedings before the house judiciary committee, drawing up articles of impeachment against trump and holding a vote on them. >> we'll regroup next week. and talk about the steps moving forward. >> reporter: but the investigation has hit some roadblocks. the white house and state department both stone walling democrats from accessing important documents and having access to top administration officials, allegedly involved in the scheme. >> what i would like to see happen next, is that ambassador bolton and secretary of state pomp pompeo, do what the brave and courageous people who work for them did, is to step forward and
put patriotism for their country ahead of their own interests. >> reporter: nancy pelosi says they have enough to press forward. >> we're not going to put the courts aside. it's a technique. it's obstruction of justice. obstruction of congress. >> reporter: house republicans disagree. >> i think we've had enough. i think it's time to shut it down. >> the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you god. >> reporter: in the last hearing of the week, former white house national security official, fiona hill, described gordon sondland's role in trump's actions towards ukraine. >> he was being involved in a domestic political errand. and we were being involved in national security foreign policy. and those two things had just diverged. >> reporter: the white house's former top russia adviser also dismantling that it was ukraine, not russia, that interfered in the 2016 elections. >> i refuse to be part of an effort to legitimize an
alternate narrative. they are harmful for political purposes. >> reporter: david holmes, an aide at the embassy in ukraine, detailed a phone conversation he overheard between sondland and president trump, just one day after the famous call with ukraine's leader. >> the president's voice was loud and recognizable. i heard president trump ask, so, he's goings to do the investigation. ambassador sondland replied he was going to do it. >> reporter: holmes saying that sondland said the president did not care about ukraine. big stuff that benefits the president. like the biden investigation that mr. giuliani was pushing. >> reporter: the white house is preparing for the inevitable. it was yesterday that senate republicans met with a top white house lawyer to come up with a defense strategy for a senate trial like hi to happen next month. alisyn? >> suzanne, thank you very much for all of that. what happens now? as the impeachment process moves forward. and what are the political risks
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when i say solid, not a single republican in the house or senate has indicated that he or she would vote for either impeachment or reprooumovalremo. that's significant. joining us this morning is bobby phillip and jennifer rogers. she is a former prosecutor. john king said this yesterday. it's crystal clear that the democrats are headed towards an impeachment vote. the house of representatives will vote to impeach the president of the united states. that's a safe bet, jen. between now and then, what else can they do to present the case to the american people? we've had 12 days of witnesses, testimony and evidence, that all points to one thing, right? there's very little debate on what happened, which is the president asked a foreign country for domestic political help. that's there. what else can the democrats do in the next six weeks to sell?
>> they need to package this for the american public. they will have that opportunity in the house judiciary committee. what they really need to put together is like a closing argument, you would make to a grand jury before you ask them to vote on your indictment. so, they'll put together the pieces of the testimony. they'll say, dr. fiona hill said this. and marie yovanovitch said that, and they will put it together in a way to make sense. the way witness testimony comes in normally is not the way you would present it to a jury, right? they're going to take this chance to say, to house republicans and more importantly to the american people, this is the case in a logical progressi progression. and in a persuasive way this, is what the president did. that's where they're going to try to change people's minds if they haven't been changed already. >> abby, what are republicans planning to do next, if we know? >> it seems that republicans are starting to feel more comfortable with where they are on this. coming out of these hearings yesterday, which frankly were devastating to the president's argument and to this -- in the words of fiona hill, fictional
case, that somehow there was an alternative ukrainian interference in the 2016 election, the republicans are actually more unified, you know, representative will herd who was seen as somebody that could be gettable by the democrats, ended his time in the hearing saying, i don't like this. but i don't think it's impeachable. and for republicans that means that what they're -- they have a couple of options. they can do it as quickly as possible, get it off their plates, move it to the senate and try to quickly acquit the president in the senate. or they can drag it out and make it difficult for some of these democrats who are running for president, who are supposed to be campaigning in iowa in january and have a lengthy, maybe dragged out process. it seems that they are, perhaps, leaning towards a shorter process because they are more confident they are not going to have to fight to hold on to their members. and, you know, i don't know if
that's a reflection of what we heard in the testimony. it's more of a reflection of the fact that republicans have been through a lot of these scandals with the president before. and they're not confident that this is going to be the one that is going to change the president's level of support among either his base or among enough independents that it will make a difference for him. >> let's play what will herd said, what abby said there. it raises the key question about all of this now. play that. >> inappropriate, misguided foreign policy. and it's not how the executive, current or in the future, should handle such a call. an impeachable offense should be compelling, overwhelmingly clear and unambiguous. and it's not something to be rushed or taken lightly. i've not heard evidence proving the president committed bribery or extortion. >> he's a no vote on impeachment this morning. >> it could change. >> if the vote was held today,
he is a no vote. he said i haven't seen compelling evidence. maybe that will change. what does it say that democrats could not bring a single republican along with them? and it really does cut both ways? does that point to a failure of the democrats to present enough in the case? or does that tell you that republicans are just not willing to listen? or they are just playing a game of denial? >> it's more the latter. they're not willing to listen because the demes over the course of the last few weeks, have systematically destroyed every defense that the president and his team and his friends in the house have thrown up there. so, it's not that they've gone through and that they're not accepting the evidence. it's just that they've already cemented their views that it's not going to change for them. this is where dems need to take the opportunity to convince the american people that it is compelling and it is serious and the actions do show bribery and
extortion. >> do they? will hurd said i have not seen evidence that the president has committed bribery or extortion. have you seen as a lawyer, seen bribery and extortion? >> absolutely. there is a linkage of withholding of military aid and whatever the president is getting for himself personally. they have shown that in spades, over and over. >> stand by. one of the key questions i still have is what are the political risks now for each party in this? and i think fiona hill who lit the world on fire with her testimony, i think she illustrates what the risks are. we'll talk about that when we come back. ♪for the holidays you can't beat home sweet home.♪ we go the extra mile to bring your holidays home. we need a solution.ut their phones down.
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ukraine and warning that the conspiracy theories the republicans are pushing are hurting national security. back with us, abby phillip and jen rogers. she was a different witness than gordon sondland. it was a fascinating exchange between lawmakers and fiona hill. she has a story to tell. she wasn't just answering in yes and no answers. she feels, obviously, very strongly, that the conspiracy theories being peddled by rudy giuliani are detrimental to national security. >> yeah. for starters, she remembered a lot of things. she took a lot of notes. she came prepared. she remembered a lot of really minute details about these events that gordon sondland seem to fumble around about. and part of this is because this is someone who was a professional. she was crystal clear at the time about what was going on and what she thought was appropriate and appropriate use of the
efforts of the united states government. and she was given direction from her boss at the time, john bolton, to not get involved, not get tied up, in this domestic political errand that she saw unfolding before her. i thought, what was so powerful about what fiona hill did, was she really dismantled what had become the only remaining argument on the republican side, which is that democrats are ignoring that ukraine meddled in 2016 and that it was perfectly normal and understandable that president trump would be upset and would want that investigated. why wouldn't we want ukraine meddling investigated in 2016. and what fiona hill said was, that's not true. that's not remotely true. and here are all of the reasons why. she broke it down in a way that was crystal clear. she took all of their supposedly supporting evidence and she called it for what it is, which is to say, she said, there was
absolutely nothing about what ukraine officials said in 2016 or even did in 2016, that came close to systematic efforts of russia in the 2016 election. she was a powerful witness because she was, in a lot of ways, unimpeachable. she did not have memory lapses. she had the evidence that she needed to support her claims. and that was in stark contrast to someone like gordon sondland, who while he was important, he just couldn't remember a lot of things and it became a problem for both sides, i think. the very first words out of her mouth was, i'm an american by choice. and to me, she seemed to be saying, america, you are blowing this. i chose to be part of this country and you are blowing this and here are the reasons why and why you have to be careful. i want to move on and talk about other news, jen, that's really important. we now know the inspector general report, michael
horowitz, who has been doing the investigations, about part of the origins of the russia investigation. that will come out december 9th. cnn has exclusive reporting on what will be inside that report. and there will be a criminal referral for a former fbi lawyer. fairly low-level lawyer, for falsifying a document, i understand. changing a document. changing the meaning of what a document is. this is something that republicans will point to as, oh, my gosh, the republican investigation was flawed. but our reporting is clear, there's no way this would change the overall thrust of the investigation, the idea that russia meddled in the election, and any of the purposes for which the whole thing began. what's the significance here? >> it depends. we need to know more and we will wait with bated breath for michael horowitz's report. it's always significant when an fbi official of any sort lies in
a document or changes its meaning. that's not a good thing. it's important for those people to be referred for criminal action. it's horowitz's responsibility as inspector general to make that referral. that is a big deal and no one should lose sight of that. but the bigger question of whether that undermined the application for the carter-page fisa, was a change to impact the court's decision, and therefore that's how they got the fisa. that is the question that needs to be answered in connection with whether this gives republicans some talking points. >> "the washington post" says no. "the washington post" says the conduct did not alter horowitz's finding, that the investigation of carter page, had a legal and factual basis. >> if that's true, and we'll know more later, that shouldn't give the republicans any basis to make their deep state arguments and try to undermine the russia investigation. >> i'm sure they'll will adhere to that, jen. i'm sure they will adhere to the
factual basis. >> i don't think the president will care, in particular, about whether or not it undermined the underlying findings because think about the timing of this. i think we're expecting this report to come out, the beginning part of december. around the same time we'll be talking about articles of impeachment in the house. and i think the timing is going to be really advantageous for the president. he's going to use this as an example of all the ways in which this, in his words, witch hunt, was tainted from the beginning. it will be one more thing that they're going to throw at this, at the wall, to try to muddy the waters around the impeachment inquiry. that will be happening at about the same time. >> people need to pay attention closely. they may very well be, as some of the sources are telling us, that none of this will undermine the premise for the fbi's investigations. people need to listen care mful. abby, jennifer, thank you very much. prince andrew is a royal without a role.
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max foster live in london with the latest. max? >> reporter: there's a general election campaign under way here in the u.k. that's not the story that's been dominating the front pages this week. look at the best-selling newspaper in the country. again, on day six, with prince andrew on the cover. and that's a problem. by speaking out, prince andrew hoped to end speculation about him and his links to convicted sex offender, jeffrey epstein. but it ended up costing him his job. according to a royal source, he agreed to step back from his public duties, following discussions between him and the queen, prince charles and others. in a followup statement, the duke expressed sympathy for epstein's victims and regret for his association with epstein, both noticeably absent from his bbc interview. >> do you regret the whole friendship with epstein? >> now, still not.
the reason being is that the people that i met and the opportunities that i was given to learn, either by him or because of him, were actually very useful. >> reporter: the dukes has denied all of the allegations made by virginia roberts, who alleges epstein forced her to have sex with prince andrew while she was underage. >> i have no recollection of ever meeting this lady. none whatsoever. >> you don't remember meeting her? >> no. >> reporter: he even questioned the authenticity of this photograph of them together. he refuted roberts' claims he was setting while dancing in a nightclub, he was shot at while serving in the falklands war made him unable to sweat. a medical expert has cast doubt on that claim. >> i can't see how someone can stop sweating and overtime start
sweating again. if it occurs, it must be very, very rare. >> reporter: prince andrew also said that during a 2001 trip to new york, he didn't stay with epstein. but rather, with a then-british consul general thomas harris. but in an interview with "the daily mail," harris said he didn't recall the prince staying with him then. buckingham palace would not comment on the discrepancy. one by one, the prince's charitable causes peeled away. when the discussion was part of the election debate, it was clear the duke's position was becoming untenable. >> is the monarchy fit for purpose? jeremy corbin? >> needs a bit of improvement. >> reporter: that was the red line for any member of the british royal family. the duke's actions had affected the institution he was born into. >> this has damaged the british monarchy. it's not a full-blown crisis. what's called into question is
the judgment of many people, including the judgment of the queen, for allowing this interview to take place. >> reporter: an attorney for some of epstein's victims has asked for the prince to testify. but so far, no official request from investigators. no charges have been filed. he says he will help with appropriate law enforcement investigations, if required. in the meantime, the palace is in damage control, trying to carry on with work as usual whilst this blows up. hope it doesn't affect polling numbers of the monarchy, which before this saga, were at an all-time high. >> it's hard to see how it won't. but, max, thank you for all of that reporting. coming up, what will democrats do next in the impeachment process? first, this week's global energy challenge. ♪
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it's been a stunning two weeks. filled with testimony and mountains of evidence. so, house democrats are now strategizing on what to do next. joining us with a look on how this will all play out, we have legal analyst elie honig, a former prosecutor. so great to have you walk us through this. a lot happens next. let's start with adam schiff and house intel committee. what do they do now? >> you have the mountain of evidence and you have to boil it down to a form so people can understand. what will articles of impeachment look like? and i believe they're going to start, open, with an article a for abuse of power on ukraine. i don't think they will try to narrowly confine it to bribery or extortion. they can do it broadly and i think they will call it abuse of power. the whole ukraine story has so many dimensions. it comes down to three simple facts that we've learned the
last couple weeks. number one, trump withheld foreign aid and dangled a white house visit. he requested that ukraine investigate his political rivals. and the foreign aid and the white house visit were conditioned, connected to the political investigation. >> these are the quid pro quos we've heard so much about. >> that boils down to a quid pro quo. exactly. >> then, what does house judiciary do? >> the judiciary committee is going to ultimately have to take these articles of impeachment, present them to the full house for a vote. but to break down the pieces -- let's break it down. he withheld foreign aid and dangles the white house visit. this is not even disputed. $400 million in foreign aid was withheld. the witnesses said that was unusual and unexplained. it was against the united states and ukraine's national interests. we heard, i think really compelling testimony from george kent about the ongoing war, the deaths that ukrainians were suffering and how america's
support in ukraine's de facto war in independence, has been critical. we heard how the white house visit was dangled. david holmes testified how that was critical to president zelens zelensky, to demonstrate to putin that he had u.s. backing. >> that is interesting just because this wasn't just a social visit. it wasn't just zelensky liked trump or loved his behind. >> they weren't just sipping tea. >> this was an important, strategic visit. >> absolutely. we know that donald trump requested investigations of his political rivals. david holmes told us about the famous or infamous restaurant conversation. i heard it through the cell phone. president trump asked, he's going to do the investigation? and gordon sondland said that happened. and donald trump. the july 25th transcript, where donald trump says to zelensky, i want you to find out what happens with this situation with ukraine. and donald trump explicitly
asked for an investigation of biden's son, that biden stopped the prosecution. so, we have that piece. and finally, the connectivity, that the foreign aid and the white house visit were conditioned, connected, quid pro quo, on political investigations. and we just saw evidence upon evidence piled up of that. we saw bill taylor said, it was becoming clear to me that meeting president zelensky was conditioned on the investigation. we heard from vindman, it was a demand for him to fulfill this prerequisi prerequisite. it had to happen first to get the meeting. similar from sondland. i recall speaking with resumption of aid would not resume until the investigation. kurt volker quid pro quo to ukraine. and mick mulvaney said get over it. and donald trump said, i want you to do us -- i would like you to do us a favor. we have those three pieces all
connected up. >> your closing argument is pretty effective, counselor. then there will be a house vote. that's what will happen after that. >> yes. >> the way you lay it out, it should be an easy vote. >> the republicans aren't going to go away without a fight. we know what the defenses are going to be. no quid pro quo, i want nothing. it's after they got caught that donald trump said that. every defendant pleads guilty. we're going to see second-hand information. there's plenty of firsthand information this week. and we're going to hear, it was bad but not impeachable. that's a political argument. that's going to come down to where the members of the house and senate land politically. >> thank you for walking us through these two weeks. great to talk to you. fiona hill issued a stark warning to u.s. lawmakers -- russia is trying to undermine the election. and the conspiracy theories being pushed by the president are helping russia do that. we'll discuss, next.
i am totally blind. and non-24 can make me show up too early... or too late. or make me feel like i'm not really "there." talk to your doctor, and call 844-234-2424. he borrowed billions donald trump failed as a businessman. and left a trail of bankruptcy and broken promises. he hasn't changed. i started a tiny investment business, and over 27 years, grew it successfully to 36 billion dollars. i'm tom steyer and i approve this message. i'm running for president because unlike other candidates,
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happy veterans day. happy veterans day. please visit studentveterans.org i refuse to be part of an effort to legitimize an alternate narrative, that the ukraine, not russia, attacked us in 2016. these fictions are harmful, even if they're deployed for domestic political purposes. >> that's former white house national security official fiona hill rejecting the republican conspiracy theory, that ukraine, not russia, interfered in the 2016 election. and warning that these claims pose a growing security threat to the united states. join ing us now is guy snod
grasgrassnodgrass. his book is called "holding the line." great to have you on this morning. fiona hill seemed to be saying to congress and america, that russia is attacking you and you are helping them. specifically to the republicans. she was saying, you are helping them. in her message, her warning, resonated with you, why? >> well, it's an incredibly dangerous situation, like you said. there's a lot of false narratives running around, not only our country but internationally. i was with secretary mattis in 2017, when we were visiting ukraine for their independence parade. we met with volker and the team. we knew how dangerous the situation was between ukraine and russia. there's a hot war, as we know in the danbas region with thousands dying every year. the weapons that you heard
dr. hill talk about and others, is very important. to have that in a false narrative is dangerous. >> if republicans -- i'm not trying to drag you into a political argument here. but from a foreign policy standpoint, if republicans think they're helping the president politically, they're actually helping vladimir putin on the world stage. why? >> well, when you think about, we have this domestic situation playing out, just like we've been following for months, the impeachment inquiry and the steps that led into that previously. like you mentioned, from an apolitic apolitical standpoint, not only is america distracted, but when you think of our adversaries around the world, russia exclusively right now, china, north korea, iran and others, they want to take advantage of this distraction. they want to use america's uncertainty on the world stage to their advantage. that's incredibly dangerous for our nation and those allied and partnered with us. >> that was one of the messages from fiona hill saying, you're
blowing this, you're helping russia. the other message, and this was more subtle, it was the effect of her presence there, was, in a way, a validation of the military and foreign policy officials, the government public officials, who work -- the thousands and thousands of people who are out there working for the american people every day -- doing who they think is best for america. what did you see, not just from her, but over the course of the two weeks in terms of the officials? >> what i've seen is a recuring story, one that played out in the last year and a half. it looks like, in many ways, the president has pulled his pistol out of his hollster and shot himself in his foot. you have men and women who have dedicated their careers and their lives to public service. and to not be setting your own people up for success, to be keeping them in the dark, to be running a second or third line of communication, that seems to
be less about national security and more about maybe more personal affairs, is very dangerous. and like i mentioned earlier, you can't overstate the importance that that has and just how impactful that can be on our allies and partners. >> these people have stuck their necks out by testifying before congress, that could impact their career. it could hurt their career. it's put them in a spotlight that the way people want to work for decades in anonymity, they've lost that. i want to read you a tweet from emerald robinson, who is a white house correspondent for "one america news network." i want to warn our viewers, this is repugnant. i want our viewers to know what these people are undergoing right now. fiona hill with that prince andrew access and defense minister vindman from ukraine, are any americans going to testify against trump? fiona hill is a career
government official. colonel vindman, a purple heart recipient and military officer. to hear something like that for you, how does that make you feel? >> it's disappointing. like you mentioned, dr. hill and lieutenant conditional vindman and many others that testified, you're seeing a campaign to step away from the facts and the truth and focus more on the politics and focus on inciting individuals' passions on the left or the right side of the aisle. i think that we'll be well-served by focusing on the facts, by seeing where they lead us and following that to its conclusion. >> about ten seconds left. what do you think the effect will be on the other thousands of military and government officials working around the world this morning? >> i think it's a continuation of what we've seen over the last few years, where in this kind of administrative and political uncertainty, it's'sier to hunker down and hope it all blows over. >> guy snodgrass, commander, thank you for being with us.
appreciate your time. benjamin netanyahu rejectngn calls to resign after he was indicted on corruption charges in three, separate cases. paula newton is live in jerusalem with more. so, what's happening, paula? >> reporter: good morning, alisyn. in the words of the israeli president, in fact, alisyn, it's a mess. and this is why, the stakes could not be higher. benjamin netanyahu indicted on serious charges, charges that could take him to prison. it's breach of trust, fraud and most seriously bribery. at issue here is whether or not netanyahu is going to step down. he's already said he is not. but he is also defiant in saying, look, these charges are politically motivated. take a listen. >> translator: this evening, we are witnessing a governmental coup attempt against a prime minister, by false libel and with a tendenchous and
contaminated investigation process. >> translator: the time has come to investigate the investigators. it's time to investigate the prosecution that approves these contaminated investigations. >> reporter: investigating the investigation, witch hunt, coup, it's not your imagination. this is a playbook out of president trump's defenses. a lot at stake in israel because the government is in limbo. it's only a transitional government. netanyahu remains the prime minister here but there really isn't going to be much resolution to the indictment or anything else. they are still in the middle of trying to form some kind of coalition government. if that doesn't happen, it goes to elections. elections that netanyahu says he will run in again. there will be lots of legal challenges ahead. but as i said, historic here in the weeks and months ahead. never has a sitting prime minister been indicted. and the fact that it's happening, when this country basically is in political paralysis, extraordinary times,
john. >> netanyahu facing unprecedented challenges from his own party. it will be interesting to see how that plays out over the next few days. paula newton, thank you very much. fiona hill, not only owned these congressional hearings, she's also owning late-night comedy. here's your "late-night laughs." >> dr. hill grew up in england and came into the hearing with a reputation of not suffering fools lightly. once a boy in her class set one of her pigtails on fire while taking a test. she put out the fire with her hands then finished the test. [ laughter ] oh, my gosh. she is -- >> woo. >> that's tough. that's tough. forget pippi longstocking, she's pippi asskicking. >> white house aides have been worried that president trump spends too much time alone and isolated. yeah. and at this point, the only friends trump has left are his "fox and friends."
[ laughter ] according to the article, trump's aides are desperately trying to come up with any solution except for the obvious one. i'm sorried the president is alone and isolated. well, go and hang out with him. [ laughter ] uh, i've got that root canal i've been putting off. under those exact same conditions, melania seems to be thriving. >> they could do play dates, right? that's what you do with your kids. they should set up play dates for the president. >> that's a great idea. i hope they're listening. that's great -- you're a solution factory. >> sand box. >> why not? >> kids love the sand box. at the end of the monumental two weeks, what do democrats do now? "new day" continues right now. >> i did say to him, ambassador sondland, gordon, i think this is all going to blow up. >> ambassador sondland said the president cares about big stuff.
big stuff like the biden investigation that mr. giuliani was pushing. >> the american people know this has been a partisan process from the start. >> to relate to you what we heard, what we saw and what we did. >> like any good show trial, the verdict was decided before the trial ever >> trump has waged war on this country in a way no leader has. >> we are better than that. we want to welcome our viewers in the united states and all around the world. this is "new day." it is friday, november 22nd. 6:00 here in new york. it's been quite a week. >> yeah. absolutely. >> i think that's safe to say. >> everything we've learned it's been two weeks technically. >> but it feels like it's been aeons. we've packed so much into these eso weeks.