tv After Words with Dana Loesch CSPAN August 26, 2016 10:54pm-11:54pm EDT
plate. if i can tell them a story that gets them to sit down. this is amazing.g. the way that i do it when i write what i want to read and i love to read and i love a good story especially nonfiction a cl story. also a tremendous privilege to be paid to tell great storieso that are all so true. i don't have the imagination to make them up but i'm good at finding the things that actually did happen. >> host: the young lawyers first case and oliver morris and then the o.j. simpson and 96, the vast conspiracy that brought
down the president and came out in october of 2000. it came out in 2001, the nine inside the order of the supreme court in 2007, the obama white house and supreme court from 2012 and the latest book of the kidnapping, crimes and the tri trial. thank you for spending three hours here on c-span2 book tv. >> guest: what a treat. thank you for you and the terrific callers. >> host: come back any time. >> here are some feature programs this weekend saturday at 10 p.m. eastern on "after words" the presidential candidacy of donald trump is the subject of the latest book in
trump we trust which argues moderates, conservatives and democrats should support him. she's interviewed by tucker carlson editor-in-chief of the daily caller. >> i think that he's a genuine patriot and he looks around and saw so many things going on he could fix. in his opening speech he said something to the effect if we don't stop this now it's going to be too late. >> sunday at 7:30 the washington bureau chief moderates race in america a panel discussion on race in relation to the news, politics and culture including an examination of the rise and racial incidents and possible solutions the next ten eastern antonio martinez and the product manager talks about his book
chaos monkeys that gives a perspective and examines the future impact of online marketing and social media and this weekend the "washington post" reports on america's nuclear arsenal in iraq and afghanistan and the international vice president of the movements to increase worker's wages. now "after words" with dana lash who discusses flyover nation you can't run a country you've never been to which she argues the coastal elitists are dividing the country and don't understand the impact their policies have on america's heartland. she's interviewed by guy benson. this is an hour.
>> host: dana loesch, we are sitting here tell us about flyover nation. >> guest: when i was in college going for my journalism degree i had this idea to write to the american novel and thought i come from such a place where my family lives and every one has all these stereotypes about flyover country so i had a part of it written and then as we started barreling towards the political environment and climate and the whole thing saying we heard from president obama this idea we have from the west coast and east coast they are a bunch of backwoods hillbillies and whenever we practice animal sacrifice or whatever it is we do and all that stuff we have these stereotypes but none of it is true. there's a lot of issues flyover nation has defenders a lot of issues we look at incredibly differently and so part of it is
explaining that perspective through itself that's come from the midwest or flyover nation that we look at issues and also it gets into just sort of how we are tired of being kicked around and taking off his tiny and it explains why so many people have kind of risen up and why this cycle is as weird as it is and why we can't even trend or predict anything or anticipate anything anymore so it explains all of that. i was in the middle of writing this book with the comment about the new york values have been and you remember how everybody was so angry and i think the people here are cool but people in new york do not get made fun of the way people in flyover nation do. people do not get viewed or look
at in the same manner. they wanted everybody else to defend them and i was sitting here with the rest of my family thinking we are always made fun of and a people that are passed around and underestimated and taken for granted. we are expected to show up in fooandvote and just be there whr we are needed. you don't get to be angry. we've been downtrodden enough you don't get to be angry. let me show you what we've been through for my entire life and even before that. so i went back and added an addendum to the buck when it was already written and have gone through i called my publisher and said we have to add this because the perfectly explains why i wrote this book. >> host: the title makes sense to me it is on the center-right flyover country, flyover nation for the uninitiated in the
c-span audience how would you determine flyover nation, who is a part of that? >> guest: it's the area between the new york and la when you go from new york to la or wherever it's that huge expansion of patchwork that looks like a cloud whenever you look down and you have no idea what's going on. it's the small town america mom and pop shops middle-class america farmers and union workers. i have an uncle that owns the quarry. it's everyday people that are not on the coast. a value family and have differing values i get into in the book as well because they look at a number of different issues but it's all those people that don't get the attention the coast gets. >> host: we will get to the politics certainly that you are in flyover nation. tell us about your story that
brought you to the studio with your second book. >> guest: it is a weird one, too because i always wanted to write but i never wanted to be in front of the camera. i went in kicking and screaming. i wanted to be behin it to be be scenes and do my thing. that's what i wanted to do. but where i come from all my family lives in missouri and we have a huge family and 24 cousins just on my moms side so we are a pretty good family but it's a close-knit tight family. there are literally 301 people, there is one restaurant and a quick mart where all the action happens and if you want to get some snack cakes or the next best thing it's like the generic
version but everybody knows everybody. i was raised by a single mother who left the country to get a drug and you can work in a school or at the hairdresser or if you are lucky get a job at the bank but spare your work at a restaurant features and work in the quarry. that's about it. everybody isn't striving to have something. there is no we have to keep up with the joneses. people are just happy with what they have being out on their property able to go fishing in the river. it's just a scaled back way of life that's so completely
different. my mom went to the city to get a job and i went with her. i was isolated and alone and it was weird because you would think that wouldn't be the case but i found being in a big city is the easiest way to feel the loneliness because you were isolated by all these people you don't know. so in the city no one cares what your last name is or what your family does. nobody knows if you resemble each other or any of that stuff and back in the small town where my family came from everybody knew everybody. we all knew who you were and what your family's last name was. it was just different. then eventually i stayed in the city long enough to go to school and i loved going back to visit family and kind of reconnecting to get away from everything.
we moved to dallas and i liked it there. everybody still thinks it's like the wild west in dallas. texas counts. but i think it's a different aesthetic. the lifestyle is different. i have friends from la and when they would visit st. louis and i took one of my friends actually down to where some of my family lives and they were like it's a whole other world. we have to get a camera crew because it's a whole different world. you don't have stoplights down here where do the kids go to have fun? it was beyond their comprehension and pretty downsized and relaxed.
but i think i like to take that sort of aesthetic with me because what i do is as you know you live in dc in the beltway now you don't seem that way. you tend to have that vibe where you appreciate flyover nation and the people and that sort of relax slow-motion living freight lack of a better way to describe it. i like to visit new york i couldn't live here i get claustrophobic. i can't see the sky. in dc i drive pretty much like everybody it's pretty to look at and great to visit but there's something i'm missing in new york and even in la.
we've had the chances we could have moved to new york or dc and i just can't do it. i miss the way of life in the country and isolated from the drama. did you hear what haven't? i didn't come i'm in the middle of the country. >> host: staying with the personal i think what may be intriguing as they are familiar with your work on fox news and you are a regular on the show for example you have your own program and you are known and i don't think you woul that you wd disagree as a bit of a conservative brawler. in flyover nation there were passages that were extremely personal i wasn't expecting a few and you sort of alluded to the single mother situation. was that difficult to write about and be public about in a broad audience?
>> guest: way back when i think it was 2001 i wanted an outlet to write about stuff i wasn't writing about when it was freelance and i wanted to just write whatever and have fun with it. most of it is still up there. i explored a lot of the online and i think it does inform people where i come from where i guess my tone, why i take the tone i take just because what you see is what you get. i don't put up a front if i go on television or -- you've been out with me before, you know. it informs the reader where i come from and kind of how i operate in why i'm so passionate about certain things.
why am i passionate about the family in it because i've seen firsthand what happens and i've lived through that. all these issues i've lived then in some respects. my husband and i weren't married and i was in college and had every pressure and every invitation in the world. you can go ahead and continue freelancing and continue on this path in college. this is the best time to have a baby. i'm very frank about it and i think tha that all so people ree to a story that relates to if you are open about your experiences people relate to that because i think a lot of hearts and minds are more easily changed when you are reaching out to people and trying to
connect so it's like i'm not perfect this is where i come from and these are the decisions i've made and why i view things the way i do so maybe you can see it from my way for a little bit. >> host: when the public sees someone on tv they must have a perfect life and no one is perfect. you go through that in the book and open with a reference to the famous but from years ago what's the matter with kansas where he couldn't figure out why people in kansas with those republican. talk about how that shaped flyover nation and was this shape has a reputation for a conservative comeback? >> guest: it wasn't intended to be but that is one of the things in my mind when i added it to the people and writings i just wanted to tell offhand sort of push back against.
so much has been said about we can't understand why someone would vote thi go this way or ud why people would think this way. i disagree with the reaction and the values. for the lack of a better way to put it i guess you could kind of say it was like responding to this in the same vein. [laughter] >> host: you made reference to this and i want to explore it more deeply the disconnect and the polarization. your book is out. we are still reeling from the
terrorist attack at a nightclub and it was inspired by ice is and we are still tracking down all the details. there was a poll that asked whether it was more about islamist terrorism or domestic gun violence in the country was split down the middle with republicans saying terrorism, democrat saying overwhelmingly guns. how do you address that massive canyon that represents not just things we believe that also the premise on which we approach issues? >> guest: this is a problem we have in the country so badly people want to be right and they don't care about the actual debate. you were afraid it was split right down the middle. it shouldn't be that way.
of course i believe that whole situation was a terrorist situation no matter how you look at it but i wish that instead of people just kind of taking the party line, they could learn that as a variable from the discussion and look at the basic fact of the matter of a person who is i and profess to believe the system that is completely incompatible with the culture of this is this is a person who prd belief system that is intolerant of everything. he doesn't like western culture or christianity or any of the things here in the united states people are allowed to be who they are and worship however they want to worship a. it has a lot to do with the political rhetoric and it seems in so many ways not just so much people in flyover nation although they are targeted you
have this back and forth and right and left pulling them in one direction or another and it goes back to we need you to show up a certain way or support this particular issue but that divide is kind of scary because now politics, the sad thing whether or not he will be able to be equally defend ourselves against a major threat and the attacks are increasing whether we want to realize it or not we don't live in this perfect kick hi kid a sunshine world where we don't have to worry if we go out to a club or we go to a baseball game we don't have to worry we don't live in that world any more. and unfortunately we have to protect ourselves at home because not enough is being done overseas. that is the situation with some people thawe havesome people tho acknowledge because that means getting up and sacrificing another part of the narrative and if the that they would rathe right on an issue. if they would rather win the argument van to address what is
happening and be correct on how to handle us. >> host: to people who don't live in flyover nation don't understand this and have deep-seated misunderstandings. there is a bias with what you are characterizing. you talk about the church and guns and military. how would you explain the country as you said how do you explain the misconceptions and how do you try to correct them in the book? >> guest: there are these stereotypes about flyover nation america. the people that have a genuine interest and understanding of what makes flyover different from the west coast or east coast those people when they visit are like this is amazing i took a road trip with a friend
in indianapolis. my friend passed away that he wanted to pull off. we went to this amazing place you could get deep-fried anything and he thought it was the most amazing thing in the world. you get a deep-fried air and deep-fried anything. this is amazing. >> host: what is something that you've eaten? >> guest: what haven't i. i got one as a wedding gift and not even giving you my husband and i deep-fried everything. >> host: did you ask for one or do they know you? >> guest: i think we registered for it. i think i have had a deep-fried twinkie and every vegetable. i think i did a deep-fried pizza
roll. i'm trying to think what we have and deep-fried. it's all delicious. it's horrible for your health fits all the vicious. >> host: it's almost like some on the left were some people in the coastal elite however you would describe them look at christians from the heartland as almost this sociological phenomenon. explain what the church has day-to-day. what is your relationship and what does it mean to your family? >> guest: in growing up, the churches because there's three where my family lived you can go out in the parking lot and see
the other two from the parking lot. it's the funniest thing. but when my grandmother was on hospice it was the church. they sent someone to be with my grandmother. my uncle was a drug addict and was buying influence from jacksonville broke, completely broke. he had nothing and it was the church that stepped in to make sure that you have a respectable funeral. in flyover nation the church is in there for you because we are all imperfect and especially when you live in a small town like that, that imperfection is on display every single day. the church is there to assist.
the churches i've attended have baby showers for teenage unwed mothers and my father-in-law and hospice deals with aids patients on their death beds who are professing faith in christ and so this is -- i've seen the action. that's the church i grew up with. it helps keep the community together. it's not the way that it's made out to be. and if there has been a lot of effort by the progressives in the east coast, west coast and the beltway to divide people to be the divide between the church and the people. i feel badly for the people that fall for it and for the people that have a bad impression of the church.
i wish they would come to flyover nation and is it in action. >> host: we are having a delightful conversation. i don't want the potential readers to be misled. you don't shy away unsurprisingly from some hot button issues. you made a few comments earlier about abortion. you get into the physician-assisted suicide and right on page 27 physician assisted suicide is a term for euthanasia more plainly a very late term abortion. is that fair, because an abortion i am pro-life and part of the argument is the human whose life is being and it has no say in the matter whatsoever. but in many cases, the physician's assistance, someone is making a case for themselves
and their lives based on the the circumstance isn't that an important distinction? >> guest: i think it is a distinction but it's not a club playing one because a way that i look at it it's not their decision to make. it's not anybody's decision to make. i can look at this from a christian perspective, too. you are eliminating him from the equation when you say i think i'm done now. it's if your life impact someone else's. my uncle had a drug addict who came in from jacksonville and died in st. louis. he had seen a drug addict tend to have drug addict friends. it was on his deathbed it hit me and i saw what he was doing with
his life. for that reason i view it differently. that isn't the decision to make. >> host: another front in the cultural war at a small establishment in indiana. talk about what happened in some of the themes you get at in flyover nation. >> guest: i >> guest: it was a more apropos story. you have a reporter from bloomington who went down to find some sort of christian mom and pop shop. they were getting -- that was
basically allowing people to. there are limitations. if you are actively engaging in the discrimination he will run afoul of the law. if it is a wedding ceremony and you don't want to get your artistic skill or labor or expression, then that's understandable and that's what it was about. but this reporter went out of her way and went to this little tiny small-town out in the middle of the street she saw some crosses on the wall. in the proprietor of the cash register at that day she asked her what you cater a gay wedding
and there were no services exchanged. it is a hypothetical question. they said we serve customers every day that's one thing. but the act of a wedding ceremony goes against what we believe as christians so we probably wouldn't participate in that. can i buy some fudge rounds and stack them up for a wedding cake or something like that it's just weird they went to a pizza shop and i wrote about this too. i'm sorry in from the ozark and we would never cater a wedding pizza. our neighbors threw a block party in st. louis and they had a bottle service. no one is going to cater their wedding with a pizza.
so that became a big sloppy. all of a sudden they were asked the center of all of this maddening debate and they have to close up shop for a hypothetical question and it was maddening because not only was it something that never actually happened, there was noticed a mission that took place except the discrimination against christian proprietors. this is more than an issue of whether or not you are serving a cake at gay wedding or photographing a gay wedding or giving pizza to a reception. can the government come in and say no, no, you don't get to determine how you work in who you provide your services to. that is exactly it, it's about association.
this is about the indentured servitude and people are too involved in peace identity politics to realize what path they are being led down in this argument and that is the scary thing about it. you saw someone else to prove a narrative she was building. that's why the people in flyover nation have had it. >> host: one of them was the media and that was the villain in the overall. in the mainstream media you talk about the deep distrust of the media among the american people.
is there anything you can do to regain its? >> guest: i don't know if there is. the irony is part of the media and just the term i still don't like it but it is what it is. there's never been a biased media because ben franklin wanted to talk smack and it's the american way of life. some people are more committed to give the story while minimizing their editorial input as much as possible. in fact, i could appreciate if someone in flyover nation it's the same way we don't care if you are republican or democrat. don't pretend you are not. don't pretend you don't have a bias delivered in a story to us. they see it on cbs, the anchor
person you used to invite into your home when things hit the fan and h you wanted to hear a trusted voice, we don't have that anymore. people don't desire that anymore because they don't trust the media. these people thought they could do some sort of a job informing them of what's going on and they don't do that anymore. you have cbs that violates federal law where it concerns gun purchases because they want to lecture people about gun control and documentary filmmakers who don't expect people to have lives and biases or preferenc preferences one war another over an issue that don't pretend to be objective. that's why nobody trusts the media in particular. >> host: part of the critique you have this chart here where you have salaries listed in the top news anchors and the
millions of dollars annually. i was interested in some of these numbers like really, but i did have this thought we believe in people learning the market and it seems like it is the left that obsessives with the unfair gains and millions of dollars of people. do you feel like you might be borrowing from the left playbook over the media? >> guest: we are not the ones trying to shame the 1%. we are not trying to go after them like the wall street coverage and the same media personalities out there making it as though it is horrible if you are a business owner today i don't you increase your wages to $15 an hour.
i love that in the united states of america there are people that can make millions of dollars a year. i don't want to take anything from them. it proves you can still be within the united states however those same people don't want anyone else getting up to their level so they are demonizing all the things about capitalism. capitalism has raised communities from the ash and they want to be able to keep the fruits of their labor. ..
>> the same fall guys that they want to blame for every thing and there's an argument that conservative hostility or conservative rather on lgbt issues has contributed to a culture climate where there is hatred and therefore we should watch what we say on the right. do you do that a little bit on the flipside of the black lives matter and mayor diblasio and sandy supply blood on their hands, is the right guilty of this too?
>> guest: particularly when it all sharpton, there is nothing that i recall that anybody on the right has ever said that has incited anyone to burn down a fashion mart and has gone on to antagonize an increase of violence and hope that that rhetoric will plant the seed that has earned some violent protests. we speak speak out against that is what we do. and comparing that anything that is ever been said about a gay and lesbian rights has welcome i don't know, no one talks like that on the right. to say things that would be be-michael every side has its french. you have - mike there something that are probably not acceptable for sec regulated broadcast but that's for another day. c-span thinks you very much for that. that is not a church or faith,
that is that entity reminds me of, i don't know him and to bring this back to shore, but real quick the the movie poltergeist three where they have a guy the big cat and he led the colt, that's who he reminds me of, the poltergeist from poltergeist three with the hat. anyway the cult leader. >> let's just go with the reverend. >> i haven't seen a but back to shore, when i see some of the things like black lives matter activist, i've seen i've seen their protest, they are violent. i do not know what their objective is. when they go on protest you want to have an objective. you want to gain attention for something but at the same time you want to advance what you're fighting for forward so you can gain another step from that. i do do not see where black lives matters doing that. i don't see were causing violence is doing that are running down cops is doing that. unless the goal is chaos in the maybe that is another discussion. >> host: all a black lives matter?
>> guest: i've yet to see an example of not. >> host: there's an assertion you make in the book that our leaders are political in class, they hate us. quote. >> guest: i don't like politics. >> host: the democratic leader harry reid who talked about deli in washington dc, usually take your shots at democrats for republicans are not spared either in "flyover nation". the revolving door of get out and get voted out by the people and then make think as a lobbyist influence in the situation that you used to be a part of. is that part of the disconnect that drives people in flyover country just up the wall about washington? >> guest: it is. it is one of the reasons why we are in the position we are in with the political climate. the republican nominee is one
giant redheaded middle finger to washington dc. people are fed up and don't know what to do. they want somebody who is going to take a mallet to the whole system. regardless of the consequences. they have lost faith not only with the way that washington works but they have lost faith in the vehicle that they have believed in the toll for so many years this is going to be the best way to get your conservative ideals into practice in washington and that's the republican party. they have seen seen the republican party compromise on budgetary issues, on taxation, there seen them compromise on issue after issue or not do anything on issue after issue. they've seen issue. they've seen the leaders of the republican party fight with some of the more grassroot members of the republican party. they look at that and you think who inheres representing us anymore. it is inches i hated them. they they have gone so far outside of the system. there are discussions as to whether the nominee they have is part of the system but is not a
politician for sure. it is not the politician in the way that we have normally gone about electing politicians. >> guest: i get so many calls everyday on my radio program where people, and it's a conservative audience and its skewed young and female, and i have never in the past couple of years, i've noticed a huge shift. people are equally angry and sometimes more so i republicans because they expect the stuff from democrats. one color that i expect harry reid to betray me or nancy blows a. i did not and should not expect it from the republican party leaders. i people who called in and said they were left the republican party because they don't want to feel like they're being betrayed in the same manner that they have been with democrats. so there finish and they don't want to hear anymore. they're not they're not even abaci when
they're open to hearing anything else about it. that's a tough position to be. you asked me earlier what the media can do to regain trust with folks. i think that the least of the countries worry. it's it's going to be what the republican party can do to regain trust. >> host: to what extent, we both work and the conservative media world, town hall and all of the various associations. to what extent do we, as a community or an industry fuel to call of bit bear responsibility of setting expectations to republican said they're going to repeal obama care and obama care still the law. they won the house, the one the senate, they voted to repeal obama care, these reconciliation, got to the present desk and vetoed and it's a lot. that's where the constitution works. do we bear some responsibility my people are so angry because i thought things could work in ways that they cannot? >> guest: i think you're right.
i definitely feel i am, completely. i've been blogging for long time. i think there are people who are straight journalist and i've never claimed to not have any bias. but there some people who want to mesh that activism with journalism. i have done that as well. i've gone out there and have protested 2009. it 2009. it helped create the departing my town in 2009. i think some of it focusing on popular soundbites and not focusing enough on solution contributed to that. and contributed to one of the reasons why we are in this position in the first place. i think it helps set a bar for higher expectations as to how washington d.c. works. that's not compromise or forfeit. and i told people this for long time, this is a marathon not a sprint. i think i think people as you mentioned a high expectation, people think that is in
washington can get done in short order, and they can't. it's not how the system was designed to work. it's not a flaw the system it takes a long time to get things done washington and particularly when you're looking at the solon operation of a political party and having that impact washington as a whole. that takes a long time. it takes more than one, two, three election cycles. people don't have cycles. people don't have the patience for that fight anymore. i think the rhetoric we have heard has contributed to that. >> host: one of the buzz phrases that has percolated on your air, on our our blogs, for years now is american exceptionalism. you have an entire chapter in flyover nation defending american exceptionalism. the famous or perhaps infamous quote from president obama where he said i'm sure the british exceptionalism and the greeks which was downplaying the whole
point of american exceptionalism. first part of the question is, why do you feel it was important to have an entire chapter about why america is exceptional? the second part of the question is dealing with the republican nominee but first let's talk about the issue itself. american exceptionalism, why did that warrant in a tire chapter? chapter? >> guest: i feel that whole discussion has been let absent largely in the past eight years. it almost seems as though we are supposed to be ashamed to be an exceptional, that were supposed to be ashamed of having a country that is really a beacon to the rest of the world, freedom dies in america, where, where do people go after that. nowhere. this is it, european countries are also free, they have a lot more limitations, but the united states really was this great experiment in exercise and republicanism and independence. when you lose that, where does that go? we have been made to feel
ashamed of frankly just world back to back to world war champs. we have been made to feel bad about being great, about being a a great nation, that is not nationalism or not blatant patriotism. we are great country. >> guest: i hate that were so badly, it's honest though, what nation on this earth has done more for other countries or done as much for the countries as the united states? we step and we give aid to everyone. and i think we step into much and that's another discussion. we are everywhere. i went on vacation in the caribbean a few weeks ago and when i went down there we chartered a boat and were going to go fishing. i don't know if the captain and first mate thought that i we going to far out and they said the u.s. coast guard comes all the way down here.
we're in the west indies. there were like the u.s. coast guard and they said yes. they are everywhere. you guys are everywhere. i would have to admit there was a part of that that went, you know, we are. i really felt that way. we are an exceptional country and we should not have to feel bad about that. we should have to feel bad about being great and if people want to raise themselves up to a different circumstance or not they have that choice and they have the ability to do so. there's nothing wrong with that. it is that refusal to acknowledge or celebrate what makes this country great that it's frustrated a lot of people. i think it into particularly with the military when you look at who sends marvin sons and daughters in the military's service, it's flyover nation. disproportionately. we send our sons and daughters to go probably serve and to fulfill these obligations and what our government asks of them overseas and elsewhere. when we hear their endeavors and
like their spoken down to and as bad as if they acknowledge what we do is good, keep americans safe is good. that makes people in flyover angry. they have sacrificed a lot. i've known families who have sacrificed more than one child out of their family. goats are families. i know families who have had everyone of their children serve. when we are supposed. when we're supposed to feel ashamed of our accomplishments and a shame to be in it is optional and everything their values have one for this country, that's another reason why this book needs to be written. >> host: a presumptive republican nominee slogan is make america great again. there's something underlying which is perhaps we have lost some greatness or greatness altogether, donald trump was asked about american exceptionalism and his response was not exactly the same as president obama's but some striking similarity in their
posture on this. is that just a face palm moment for you? >> guest: when i heard the slogan for the first time and i was trying to think, is this in response to obama of the past eight years? because this president and he has gone on apology to her's. he has apologized, where has he not gone, everywhere has he not gone, everywhere he has gone his apologize for country. and apologizing for country he would make some remark when he was in egypt to talk about the accomplishments of the arab world. almost as if just like the united states and everything the united states had accomplished. when you do that on an international stage it does sort of feel like you are trying to reduce america to not being so fantastic. in the past eight years with the passage of. >> host: is like cutting us down to size. >> guest: it does. with the on affordable care act a lot of the
things they been making on guns, america is not as free as it was eight years ago, that's for sure. as ashley after the on affordable care act and dodd frank. it's it's not as reason was eight years ago. i think there is a certain truth and recovering some of the life that we had lost. in terms of whether or not as a country we have lost that animating spirit that drives us towards freedom. that drives us towards independence and drives us toward everything that made the country great, whether or not we have lost that, i don't believe that we have. there are too many people in this country that still believe in the entire reason the country was founded and they believe in our constitution and everything the founders believed in. i don't think it is lost but i do think it has been obscured by a lot of the antics we have seen
from the past eight years. >> host: when i picked up flyover nation one of the things i was was cursed to see and i was thumbing through, flipping through, through, how much are you going to talk about your relationship with the trump campaign. what i didn't know was that the trump campaign in the early stages reached out to you to possibly be an on air surrogate for them or to speak on their behalf. you decline. explain what explain what that interaction was like i'm in your relationship with trump and how that seems to have really declined over the last number of months. >> guest: i have always, this even goes to lee it all the politicians out there, i was with them as being different people. almost as if when someone announces their running for office i feel antagonistic
towards them. even if i do do agree with them on those things because i feel like we should kinda be. if i don't want to have a cozy relationship with a politician, i don't really care for friends, i'm not i'm not there to be friends with them. i don't do any that stuff her friends. honesty does not make you friends in washington, one that. but i feel as though i need to be antagonistic toward and not unnecessarily so. but i want to ask a question. i want to know what formed the opinions you have. i want to know what changed you. when you look at what people have changed it's a great tool of witness, it's not because i'm tried to do it as some sort of gotcha, if you change money mentally on an you change monumentally on an issue i want to know what mode your heart mind because when you talk about that, who knows how many people you might reach out to and how that might resonate with so many people. it. it is an amazing tool for witness. there's a saying that god
doesn't call the equipped, he equips the call. how great of a tool with that be if he could talk about it. that is. that is what i have always wanted to hear. from trump on different issues, just drop all the other stuff in look at people and just be real with that. that that would resonate so much with people. a few years ago his camp had reached out because we have a mutual friend, good friend friend of mine that worked with him. they wanted to me to introduce him for a cpac and i was unable to because i had other engagements. the year before last i introduced him and met him and he was very nice and very amiable. i got along with him and his folks and his staff. i never had a one-on-one with anyone on his staff where was particularly contentious.
i've just never been particularly preferential in any candidate. i've gone after ted cruz on a couple of issues pre-hard on that and a number of issues. i've gotten a lot of pushback for that. that is just, i think you're supposed to do that and you should do that. i've never had any ill will towards anybody running. >> host: you did been an essay in the national review among many prominent conservatives of white - mark. >> it was on policy point. i had a few policy issues and i wanted to know where does this candidate stand on this issue, what changed him on this issue. i wanted to know more about this issue before i can come to a decision to make a decision. i just don't really think i can do this unless i know what is happening. so i wrote that out, i would do that again. i would do it for any candidate where i felt like i still had have more questions or concerns about, what are
about major issues here were talk about sipping court nominations, we may actually, we could stand depending on how the election goes, to lose our right to carry semi- automatic rifles, that is where we are right now. we could lose reciprocity because of what happened in california. so these are huge issues. it is not show friends, show business. we have the business of the country to attend to. i wanted to i wanted to have these questions answered. >> have they been? >> guest: on some respects. on a couple of issues that have been, whether or not it's been to my satisfaction is one thing, but i think it could be made more clear. >> host: so tumor points on this, because it's all anyone ever wants to talk about the. >> guest: i will interrupt you and say, i view what is coming
with hillary clinton in 2016 it absolutely terrifies me as someone who is protected by a firearm, to lose that ability, i don't get scared or intimidated in life but that julie does terrify me. >> host: and your previous book, hands off my gun. with trump in this episode since he did lent her name to that effort a national review to that so-called never trump, your forceful critic of him on television and elsewhere. >> guest: i'm never, ever anything. anything. i've never for anything and never never anything. >> host: never hillary? >> guest: i will go that far. the two issues are my make a break issues. guns are my make a break. >> host: i see the criticism you've endured and those been critical from the right on the principle of trump. the attacks especially directed at all women pretty nasty.
the idea behind the attack is that you have been accused and this is the rich irony of being an out of touch elitist because your critical of trump. here you have written "flyover nation " which is the antithesis of that. you not sitting around at cocktail parties in manhattan. >> guest: i've never been to a cocktail party in manhattan. i've been to one cocktail party in d.c. and i was really tired went back to my hotel went to bed. >> host: is that a weird feeling? you're the anti- that. you have literally written the book on this. yet because of concerns over the canada personality that assumption is be made about you. it is an attack on your motives i feel like. how would you respond to that? spee2? >> guest: i get people's anger because i've been there. in 2009i protested outside elected official offices quite literally. i do get the anger. i
think some. i think some people are at different stages in this marathon that i am. everybody starts at some point. we are setting up a political battle that our kids and grandkids will be fighting still. that is the privilege of living in a free society is that you must constantly attend to this. we're just getting it to the next level. this is not one to be decided in our lifetime. were not going to get everything we want in our lifetime. it's a generational battle. a generational battle. progresses have been working on for generations. as a result of anything some people are at a different point in the marathon than others. when i first really got involved in politics it was before 2001. i was not for george bush i was raised in a family of hard-core democrats. as pro-life and i have always been unequivocally pro -- i have my life protected by god.