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tv   Michael Nelson Trumps First Year  CSPAN  February 19, 2018 6:15am-7:49am EST

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tns administration followed a different course. that is not the fault of the congressional republicans were the fault of the democrats. it is on the president. for my essay for the first year project as bill mentioned i wrote about the new johnson's role in the passage of medication in medicaid inmate 65 from which i draw six general universal guidelines for a new president can advance a legislative agenda. you can find them on the crucible volume in the lobby. [laughter]
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the specifics though if johnson's particular tactics are less than important than the overall point of the essay which is the political scale, policy and message discipline and overall vision of the president can be a crucial and critical fact or in how congress reacts to a first-year legislative agenda. the legislative contracts between johnson's first-year record, we gave him a pass on not and it reflects a lot about trump's limitations and also those of his administration, specifically an inability to develop a coherent policy for iraq designed to achieve a set of broader goals into guy and when necessary, push towards those ends. start with trumps personal act, something that touched on it goes beyond interest in the nuances of policy. the deficit made this overarching goal of developing the agenda and a vision
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difficult. the president compounded this problem by failing to surround himself with people who could make up for his own deficits. self-knowledge matters a lot in any of the straighter and nowhere less than staffing executive office of the president. three results. one was the decision to open the administration agenda of the deal of space travel ban which inflame the opposition and immediately became tied down in the courts. the second result was a trump up for two mitch mcconnell and paul ryan on legislative priorities. under this deference came the decision to pursue obamacare repeal rather than focus on infrastructure. i see this as a critical first year mistake because they shifted the administration's focus permanently away from a serious effort to meet the subsidies needs of its core voters and address the underlying crisis of our politics i talked about a few
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moments ago. infrastructure is the key. it would've been popular. it would've made trump seemed like a strong, vigorous candor presidency claimed on the campaign trail he would be. it would've shown you is following through on his promise to help those who had been left behind by conventional politics, not least it would have divided the democrats i'm pretty well commenced. trump was unable or unwilling in this pulled him into a situation where he was pursuing their priorities rather than his own vision their best interests. wants to repeal push was launched the more solitary consequence of trump's last coherent agenda even in the framework of health care repeal, trump could only follow, lacking even basic comprehension policy issues for new health care policy could be so complicated, remember? lacking the basic comprehension
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he could not say republicans from a situation they have not developed a viable replacement for the affordable character in which they had badly misread the public text of the issue. i've long argued the affordable care act is a fundamentally conservative solution, the dilemmas of our health care system. we can argue the details, but that it court, the aca is is a structure that increases coverage by bringing more customers to private introvert, private companies, private businesses and by expanding a 50-year-old legacy federal program, medicaid, that is run through the states. these used to be conservative principles once upon a time in the bush administration. a stronger and more sophisticated version of president trump might have recognized for what it is in pursuit a more limited version of repeal, place an individual
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mandate with a strong arm of continuous coverage requirement, moderate adjustments bse subsidy frameworks and regulations, more discretion to the states, particularly for cost control in medicaid implementation come a point explained brilliantly by the way of the patent schools center affiliate. and at that point, and unleashed trump common sense and not to convince his voters, his face that he was repealing the affordable care act. let him do what he does well. celebrate rhetorically that cleared the korean move on to the next item on the agenda. infrastructure on a more moderate form of the aca reformed rather than repeal would've done more to address real problems than a million nation that drew voters to trump it would also have begun to develop a true governing coalition that might've redefined or political moments and even had staying power.
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i'm aware of the possible contradiction here. i'm arguing that trump has not acted in a sensitive manner to address the core problem of alienation, and the politics is not working for voters. of course the voters, his face remained mostly supportive. this is not actually a contradiction when we look at the full record. it is the tragic aspect of this missed opportunity of the first year. trump has suffered his face something. a form of identity protection and he represents the politics to create against minorities, immigrants, protesters robert mueller and out into mccabe from against install that they do not like. we saw the same shameful remarks after the event shared in charlotte salomon august 11th and 12. we saw a reconfirmed in his
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comments two weeks ago in africa were immigrants should come from. this is the tragedy. the choice access the president of a faction to lead in anger, but not to address the real and substantive issues that led to his election. trip is governed as iran, the point of leadership style that set off both set off foes than encourage divisions among the public. the result is a base that remains mostly loyal and angry, but also it determines motivated and very likely permanent opposition that simply can't be won over and perhaps most notably the political motivation of women which is in the end of the first year. we will see in november. in the strategic truce or perhaps by its very nature, trump in his first year has further divided rather than helped the nation.
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take a course correct? perhaps in part. in the early months of your two in his recent steps on trade although i find them highly problematic in some of the same ground identified to suggest a refocusing of economic issues. but the chance for trump to be a transformative president, to change the nature of our politics lately depending on the first year of funding johnson said and it is now like that first year almost certainly gone. thank you. [applause] >> finally will turn to mary kate cary. i listen to the first episode of her podcast this morning and
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it's fantastic and is now available on itunes. so check it out. >> thank you, stefanie. i would like to second what was guian said earlier that i read just as the first year project is launching and it's been an absolute joy and i want to thank bill for including me and all of this and it's been a fascinating experience. i thought what i would do is start with my essay that i wrote in august of 2016 about the changing media landscape in political news and how the next white house could capitalize on not and then talk about how that unfolded over the course of the first year. so what i found in august of 2016 was that much of our news content in politics now comes to us through newsfeed that i referred to us by friends, socialist dreams, filtered references, algorithms, browsers
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and often just personal relationships. that is very different than coming to us even five years ago. my recommendation amongst many with a somewhat naïve but optimistic set of recommendations looking back now, for example, one of my recommendations is the next white house should prioritize influencing traditional news outlets in its first year. margaret brennan has a great graduate of the university and is now the white house correspondent said we should emphasize traditional news outlets because that would emphasize the need for nuanced analytical coverage of policy initiatives because youtube and snapchat, she did not see twitter, but she might so left could be good at generating --
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but not deep analysis and deep analysis in any media for deep analysis. i would say that has certainly been true this year. so, i had recommended that the smart move would be for the white house to increase, not decrease the number of presidential press conferences. in that recall the obama administration is having fewer and fewer press conferences and i thought that was a strategic mistake for this reason of cultivating traditional news outlets. one of the first things to trump white house press team did was expand the number of seats in the white house press office and include skype seats for local media studio to participate on a rotating basis at white house press conferences, which is better because more and more americans turn to local media as a more trusted news source whether political news. i also thought that administration officials, whoever won the election needed to provide content that matches all of these new digital media
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platforms. for example, for example, videos that would go on to youtube, longform writing for the link then. more people go to link stand to read articles and essays by people whose name is right asked to their work and you can immediately check their credentials and see if it is something you'd be interested in is trustworthy as opposed to going on to link stand to find a job. there was a lot of people posting behind-the-scenes photos, for example, on instagram and live streaming, things on facebook live. all of those things you have to match your content to that particular media. you wouldn't say to a longform essay picture reading out loud as a youtube video 45 minute long. know it's going to match that. you have to match the media to the message. the last thing i recommended was that spontaneity and then script
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moment, anything other than that frustration talking points delivered on a teleprompter are wildly popular. now they're even more wildly popular. trust in government right now was an extremely low, so i think the best thing the white house can do is try to reach as many americans as possible who are not necessarily visitors to whitehouse.gov and never will be. how defined as people are not sending up on the white house website to get your message? how do you get your supporters to share your message to people whose minds might be changed. in many ways, white house communications strategy is really old-fashioned public outreach and coalition building, but now it's peoples hands on their phones. as guian said, white house strategy and communication is not traditional under this president by his nature and the
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nature of his personality and that will not change in 2018. what i wanted to do today that is new and different from that essay as i did some research into how have things changed since the election in terms of political news and communication let me share quickly a couple of statistic in the speechwriting business when someone has a statistic to recall a cocktail pressure because it makes you drop your drink. as of august of 2017, 43% of americans report getting their news online now. that is only seven percentage points lower than 50% who get their news on television. in 2016 he was a 19-point gap between those two in his platforms, television and online and that is not decrease to a seven-point gap. so what has happened is fewer
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and fewer people are watching television. more and more people are getting on their computers and their phones to get their news. mobile devices are increasingly preferred. nearly two thirds of u.s. adults who get their news both on a mobile and computer -- excuse me, are increasing from 56%. so people get their phones -- that has some laptops and telephones now. the mobile news use grew the most between people ages 50 and 64. young people were out of there, but older people are returning to their phones for news. two thirds of americans get at least some of their news on social media. again, driven by substantial increases among older americans. twitter saga largest growth in 2017 just as the election is that 15 percentage points, the number of americans on twitter now has the largest share of users of any social media
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platform, the report getting their news from twitter. 74% of people on twitter are getting their news from the air. so big picture, in the united states we have a record high in terms of the number of people getting their news from social media, whether people are trust in the news is a different question, but we are not number one in the world. we are number one in terms of the percentage of our older population getting their news on social media and we are number two, excuse me, for getting news online. that is all courtesy of view. the other thing that struck me in this research was that i said earlier, we are not number one in the world for the percentage of people who get their news from social media. ahead of us in terms of advanced
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industrialized economies, south korea, canada, australia and sweden all have higher percentages of population getting getting their news from social media. south korea 20% more south koreans and americans are using social media several times a day. that is shocking to me. amongst emerging and developing countries, following countries more people get their news on social media than united states. lebanon, argentina, vietnam, turkey, chile and brazil. we are at 39% of our our population and south korea set the top 57%. what this shows is that there is a tremendous opportunity in the coming year for president trump to use its global reach because there are more people in other countries who have access to president trump's twitter feed that americans are using. so far, most people would say his use of twitter has been
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divisive and at times very polarizing, but if he were to change the tone of it, he could do tremendous good in terms of changing america's image abroad and that is a tremendous opportunity for him in the coming year. as you look at what i would call the difference between teleprompter trump and twitter trump and the former writer for george h.w. bush and the difference to me is quite jarring at times. i did a little research, something called trump twitter archive.com on the internet and it has all of the tweets he's ever done. since taking office, he has issued roughly 2503 over the last year and on this trump twitter archive, you can type in words to see how many tweets have those words. the most that i could find was under fake news 153 times, 98 in second place, russia and then
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there are a number of other word that our various for fifth place. number three that is not sensitive, but i think it's funny because it's become a catchphrase in our house is sad! he finds that his theory does the oscars football playoffs, whether that should be on fox news, global warming and the russia investigation. if you want to see the lighter side of trumps twitter feed, google sad! the flipside though,, is this is a fact gain his approval ratings in just 26% to 1500 americans polled by the economist said that trump's use of twitter was appropriate. so the majority think it is not appropriate. by the end of the year in office, the hill reported he spent about 40 hours on twitter. he took the time for those 2500 tweets. a staggering 59% of the polls
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did approve of the near daily tweets to his 45 million followers. i do think he is not going to get off twitter. i think he realized that this is a direct pipeline that he will not walk away from that it's a bigger following on twitter than the number of people who watch the nightly news anymore. general kelly, chief of staff was asked about this and last week it was how he was bedtime undermined his legislative strategy by going on the twitter and contradict whatever white house strategy it is. general kelly responded he often asks me, i'm thinking of reinforcing whatever the messages are the tweets. what do you think? general kelly would say absolutely. there's enough fast enough. he's his own and in this regard and he feels very strongly that he's able to reach the american people in peoria, montana in
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central wyoming through his tweets because he does not feel he's getting a completely fair shake from the media. i think the reverse at least on my side of the aisle of the island so you can understand why he thinks he's not getting a fair shake. my hope is a speechwriter is that his tweets will start to parallel his rhetoric and his speeches and his legislative agenda. despite the best efforts of the speech writing staff who i think are doing a very good job, there is a tremendous opportunity in the coming year for him to build coalitions and as mike noted there is an opportunity, not just to solidify his base, but expand it, to change peoples minds and to broaden the governing majority in this country. i think this coming year, given these numbers have tremendous opportunity for him if he chooses to take it. on that note, some questions. thank you.
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[applause] >> will trot out to audience q&a. before, i want to press mary kate on one piece of her first year i say. i need to read this because i just found it so straight game. when talking about the changes in technology and the fact that more and more americans are taking is from not just the internet, but using mobile devices increasingly, she notes if it wants to win, the first to do a master transfer the start to build trust and support among voters. if not from the administration risks being left behind by an increasingly media savvy alike to read. >> i'm curious, mary kate, in an excerpt where you know that the white house must master trends
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that both build trust and support among voters, how do you position trump here? in one regard, as he noted he has mastered this. he's mastered the use of social media. he knows what to say. e-mail who he's talking to, but on the other hand, what are the effects on public trust? >> i would have to say the whole fake news phenomenon is not surprising to me because the numbers have been there for a long time. trump is not necessarily the cause of this. in some ways he's a symptom of it. the eroding public trust in the media has started a long time ago before he ever came on the scene. the same pew research that i was siting on social media use does touch on people whose trust in traditional news sources in the
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u.s., this is fascinating to me, the u.s. is one of the few countries now with the governing party supporters are less satisfied with the news media than are non-supporters. so in this country, that would mean republicans, only 21% of republicans feel the news covers politics fairly. 55% of democrats think they cover it fairly. that is the largest partisan gap, 34 percentage point difference in the world. there's only two other countries where the governing party and they stressed more than the non-governing party. the second country that does that is israel, which is understandable to me. australia is third and those are the only three. the striking number of news sources that are trusted, local media is the highest. national news coverage second, president family third. social media, those around the 70s and 80s of people who
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trust them. social media, only 5% of those polled trust the information from social media. last year it was 4%. they left from 4% to 5%. so that is shockingly low end i think that explains why he thinks it is okay to continually hound of fake news come in naming reporters by name, networks by name. i thought the fake news awards wasilla dies. i'm glad it came from the republican party instead of from the white house, but i did not think i was hoping things for either of them to be doing it, but certainly the president in the middle of the government shutdown to be worrying about that i thought was misplaced. >> so in the interest of time, we will open up to audience q&a. alfred has a microphone in his hand. if you have a question for the panel, please raise your hand. we will take to questions at a
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time and wait for offered to come with the microphone. we will start appeared. >> this is really a question for guian mckee. trump's failure to deliver on the promise of infrastructure is deplorable and for all of us, not just from space. deferred maintenance of bridges and roads is a ticking timebomb. but in terms of the base, just the other night i heard union boss on television. might have been from illinois. talking about the promise of carrier that there was this very ostentatious trump success in persuading carrier to stay and not fire all these people. since then, that particular company has gone and fired,
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something like putting people out of work. what's interesting in light of your comments as he didn't talk about trendsetters to come true in infrastructure. he talks about keeping american companies at home and keep them from going abroad. so i wonder, is that comment an outlier or does this sort of represent the feelings? he was specifically been asked whether the tribe voters were disappointed by his performance in that respect. >> i don't think it probably is an outlier. i wrote a little bit about the carrier episode when it happened a year and a half ago, in 2016. my sense than is that it was an effective short-term strategy the sense that while, he actually job owned into keeping these jobs, but this is not some
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thing that can be sustained from one company, let alone across the economy. the other aspect with manufacturing jobs that are bigger than any president. to put that much focus on your capacity to retain a particular sector of employment that faces huge headwind is a very risky move. the upside i guess who's he can claim every good jobs decision that happens, but in terms of god specific, low skilled manufacturing, it's going to be really hard to sustain that in the united states and he is in a position where for people like you members, at least to a
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degree. >> you say that trump has mastered social media. the only day i have seen him do a lot of is twit -- tweets. [laughter] that was intentional. i'm sorry. i don't see him doing much in any of the other social media, certainly not facebook for i don't know what they'll be a bizarre, but i haven't seen them on any others. could you speak to that? >> let's go to barbara. >> thanks to all of you for your amazing comments today. they say the old adage is you never get a second chance to make a first impression.
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presidents come unless they have these oddities where they come in and carry out an ex-presidents term usually don't get a second chance. they have a first year. you know we have the state of the union address coming up very soon. if this president called you into the oval office. he calls and asks you a normative question, what should i say to the american people? what would you tell him? >> i completely agree with you that it's been overwhelming on twitter that it's been active in social media. again, a missed opportunity to use these other platforms to go on whitehouse.gov. that to me, i understand him
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wanting to do things differently than obama. their attack six that they would be wise to follow up on the white house website. a videographer that follows the president everywhere. behind the scenes video and photos you have somebody from unemployment and there's a lot of places to go, things to share with friends -- and i miss presentations to talk about the difference between the number of
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agencies given in the number three seed is issued, for example. on the white house website, speeches are no longer separate editing you can click on and scroll through. it is simply statements. you click on it, speeches are mixed in. it's 186 pages long and you have to go page by page, looking for anything listed as speech. i thought there's got to be a faster rate. i shoot my friend an e-mail and i say can you tell me how many speeches the president gave in his first year at and she immediately wrote back and said sorry, we don't have that. i thought how could nobody be taking that? they are doing things differently from the obama than the ration and i certainly disagree that the obama policies, but i also think there were some tactics that were used and surprised scott stopped and there's an opportunity to bring those back and try some of the people out side of the space
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from a sort of changing minds in broadening the coalition. >> mike, would you say about the state of the union? >> as far as trump relying on twitter, two advantages he derives from that as opposed to doing facebook on whitehouse.gov and all the other things one could do. you know they're going to look if i know what donald trump thinks. you don't have to go from one site to another. twitter is the way he will express his in the short, punchy, 140 character, 280 character is short and that seems to be a medium in which he is very comfortable for the quick puncher counterpunch. i don't blame him for doing what is most comfortable doing and making it simple for people to find out where he is. as far as as far a state of the union, the great question, barbara perry, last year he gave his state of the union, which
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most people thought was like a regular state of the union address that a regular president would give them people were commending him for that. and then in coming days that the peaches come forward with speed praise for that sort of quality, it was bang, bang, bang, tweet about this, tweet about the other thing. the advice i would give his first of all know about your agenda for the coming year. this is an annual speech meant to set the agenda for congress and the rest of the government for an extended period of time. know what you want to accomplish during the coming year and don't just give this speech, they give the speech as part of a coordinated strategy of articulating the message and then reinforcing the message. that takes a kind of reining in of one's own tendencies to do what donald trump apparently does everyday and that is get up in the morning and turn on cable
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news talk, react to it in the go straight from here to his right index finger to his phone to us. because it is react to, because that is what he sees or hears on "fox and friends" for morning show or whatever, and it's not part of a coordinated effort to articulate a message, there reinforced that message. something announced, the praise that donald trump case for a state of the union address was kind of the praise you give for your 8-year-old grandson who draws a picture and you say that is so beautiful. when donald trump gives a speech from a teleprompter, it is so obvious is just reading from a teleprompter. this is not something he is comfortable doing. in addition to twitter, his main
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form of communication with the american people is to have these campaign style rally's in states that he carried in the election. i don't even know if he has a text, but if he has the text, it is just a bare -- i don't know why it is there. stream of consciousness. he feeds off the support of this crowd has been twitter. twitter is not his effort to reach out to the people who don't support and, nor are his speeches. his communications are to solidify the base that he heard he has been in that sense, you started out with 46% on election day. he had no honeymoon period, which was in part his salt, but also in part the democrats fault and then it got down below 40 and since then it's been pretty flat. people chose sides really early
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in the trump president be. they chose up sides whether for or against them and what he's done so far come again in the absence of crisis and recession, who knows what will happen when those events occur, which they are bound to. consolidating that 35% to 39% is something he's been able to do and that is enough. that's enough to keep republicans in congress scared enough that they don't do what they would like to do, frankly and that is defied him and get mike pence and there, but they are afraid to do that because the voters who will pass judgment on the primary election or 35% of the whole country, but 70% of the people who voted in the republican primary. so as long as he can keep that base solidified, which he's doing through twitter in his stream of consciousness rally style speeches, he's probably okay for the coming year.
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before his midterm elections in november, the most consequential in history. if he loses that republican congress and the republican senate when there's 26 democratic seats on the ballot in a republican seat and still loses, which is conceivable. that could have been. i expect republicans in congress will smell blood on the water. we will come back next year. >> do you have anything to add? saying something like mr. president, i know you love the attention of the american people and i know a quick way for you to garner support among 60% of the american population. tell them you can step down immediately.
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[applause] >> seriously, though, let's say he really did call me, i would say, of course i don't think it likely that he will otherwise you would've asked sister barbara you would sister barbara yuba navassa's profound question if you thought it was something likely to have pity. i would say he should say to the american people that i know my first year has been deeply divisive and i know that america's prestige has been reduced around the world. i think those things are very unfortunate and they're going to dedicate this to you here to addressing these trends and this is what i'm going to do.
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>> if you can get that in, he might. >> ettore panna last week to president comes legislative director if he had any hints on what the president might say the state of the union content once and he said yes they will be infrastructure. as far as my personal advice goes, he's uncomfortable on a teleprompter. he's not gotten in trouble for anything in his speeches. the u.n. for example he had rocket man. the speechwriters are giving him material that is very good and
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very standard rhetoric. you can tell from his delivery that it's not crazy about being on a teleprompter. his speech last year was one hour on the dog. that was shorter than the trend over the last few presidents have been longer and longer state of the union addresses and as we saw, fewer and fewer people are watching television. in order to meet the audience where it is, i would keep it shorter with a shorter attention span of people who are watching. second, most speechwriters for state of the union addresses are the fun part of the speech is ready and absolutely shameless a path lines and trying to see how many times you can get people in the room to stand up and give a standing ovation. the partisan side of doing not his to try and get one site to
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stand up and get the other side to sit on their hands. but if you were being public spirited any unifier, you would want as many times as possible where both sides to do. i would say in these polarized times we want as many as possible where both canada at the third understated the union of the union for me as i believe grace beaches are made of great stories and the only way to get some stories that the state of the union are those people is that up at the first lady in the gallery. some presidents in the past have used those as an opportunity to score political points are not people in the seats that illustrate their partisan agenda. the better ones i think if you're as old as i am in diving into the potomac river, he was the first one president reagan ever did to start this tradition and lindy scott was a civilian
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who is sort of a first-rate hundreds saved lives diving into the cold potomac river in pulling people out. we've had a tremendous number of natural disasters this year for everyday everyday americans have done heroic things and those are the kinds of people i would put in the gallery this year so everyone in the room can stand up and salute them and it's an opportunity to be unifying and drop what's great about our country. >> when i was a kid, there was nothing else on. we were all showing the president over time you could watch the president, espn and then along comes the video cassette players. you could put in a movie and since then, the audience that the president has been able to command by giving that kind of
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speech or any kind of speech has gone down, which to me is fascinating about donald trump because getting our attention has not been his problem. cable news essentially went all trump, all the time during the campaign not because of any political agenda, but because they saw the ratings going up and therefore advertising revenues going up and hasn't stopped. political scientist or president trump speech and then reinforce your point. that's the kind of things we don't watch is when the day after the speech resorted to endure the fact that the president is a long policy speech and then what basketball player will he attack through twitter for something like that. then we are back on its wavelength. this is a guy who was 71 years old. i am 68 so i kind of know what that is like.
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he has been successful certainly in his own mind. by postmasters sees a successful at everything you've ever done in the business world, entertainment rub and lo and behold he runs for president. this is not a guy who will change his ways no matter how good our devices. he's just not. i think we've got to accept the likelihood that he is going to grow the office will make the manner he will learn on the job. this is the guy we elected and he hasn't changed one bit. >> i will keep it brief. i don't think an election is the state of the union address and i don't think this one will either. i should say similar to mount that he should think through his strategy really over the next few years as he's trying to motivate their base or is he trying to reach out a little
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more to broaden it in the speech would reflect that choice. >> thank you, all. bill has one more thing to add, but i want to note, please join us outside. we will be signing books, so feel free to join us. >> i want to close by giving a lot of things to a lot of people that were involved in this in addition to all of the people here. i think pretty much every scholar at the miller center contributed in some way assets everybody on our communications team, developing team, administrative team, it has been terrific to see the whole team together and that extends to our governing council. we've created a first-year advisory council for the project. mary kay was part of the bipartisan team of armor administration officials from democrat and republican
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administrations. every time we found one we had to find another to go with them to partner in peril with them. that the president is that he's really helped coordinate the sand again jeff chadha stirs in the back in stephanie really played air traffic control. the last program i noticed people have been asking what comes after first tier and it is not something here. but we are going to be launching here in two weeks or a beacon house on february 5th desire new research undertaking, which will take the floor for the next three years or so and we are calling the presidency at the crossroads and will vote act passed presidential history of great moments going back to the founding era crosscheck sonja civil war era and the 20th century. cite the progressives in world war i, the great depression and world war ii and the 60s how civil rights and vietnam and in the current moment where big domestic challenges couple up
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with challenges and how different have imagined for better or worse or continued making a u-turn. we will be taking not often february 5th. barbara perry and i are guided to host jim lehrer on our governing council and walk with him since he was there when george washington was president. actually, jim service in governing the presidency actually goes back to november 22nd, 1963 when he was a reporter in dallas when his plane landed and began a career where he's governed every president since then we are delighted to have some of the biggest decisions he's seen in
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his lifetime. we hope you'll join us on the late afternoon of february 5th with that, i want to thank the panel and we'll see you in the background signing books. [applause] [inaudible conversations] >> he was here that we spoke with kelley fanto deetz about her book "bound to the fire" about the cooks of southern virginia. >> i decided to write a book about

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