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tv   Discussion on Recovering the Columbia Space Shuttle  CSPAN  December 30, 2018 11:15am-12:03pm EST

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matthew and ron harris discuss policies and then at 8:00, michael looks at members to have nixon administration who challenged the 37th president. after that on book tv's afterwards program at 9:00 p.m., economists stephen moore discusses economic politics of trump administration and many who reflect on friendship and rise in american politics, that all happens tonight on c-span2's book tv, 48 hours of nonfiction authors and books every weekend, television for serious readers. reminder that this weekend's full schedule is available on our website, booktv.org.
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>> everybody gets quiet. >> okay. >> hello, good morning and welcome to recovering the colombia space shuttle at the 20th annual fall book literary festival. we appreciate your attendance today. thank you for coming out. for more information on this festival and other programs throughout the year, please visit fall of the book.org. this festival is a nonprofit that is funded exclusively through donations. one of the ways to help is through the group friends for the book, to learn how to support the festival go to fall for the book, fall/friends. please remember to silence your cell phones and thank you in
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advance for filling out our surveys that you will find on your seats. these will help us to improve the festival for the future. after the event all of our office books are available in the lobby just outside this room and our book signing for the office this morning will be in the lobby as well. so onto this morning's event. recovering the colombia space shuttle. michael and jonathan h. ward take us on a powerful look at a shared national disaster and its legacy. their book bringing colombia home the untold story of lost space shuttle and crew is story of the colombia disaster and recovery and inspiring message it holds. michael was the last launch director for the space shuttle program at nasa's john f kennedy
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space center and responsible for overall shuttle launch countdown activities until the end of the program in 2011. in november 2004 awarded the prestigious award. jonathan h. ward works to bring the thrill of space program to life for general public as solar system ambassador and as a frequent speaker on space exploration topics to interest groups and at regional conferences, previous two books are, rocket launch, the nuts and bolts of the apllo moon program at kennedy space center and countdown to moon launch, preparing apollo for historic journey. please help me in welcoming michael lineback and jonathan
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ward. >> thank you very much. let's see, i think i will stand up here and jonathan, you can join me or stay -- >> i will hang out here. >> you'll hang out there. >> okay. >> welcome, everybody, good to see some old friends. i haven't been back up to northern virginia for a while. it's always good to get back to my roots. we will talk about colombia and the accident that we dhash -- the accident that we experienced in 2003. i thought what we would first do set expectation, we have about an hour together. we will talk for 45 minutes and have questions and answers at the end. as we get through if we get into something that's bugging you, raise your hand, we are very informal, and we will answer questions if necessary. if i use an acronym that you're not familiar, if i get into shuttle speech, i try not to, i
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fall back to thelingo of launch team and i will try to avoid that. let's not go any further than necessary with a misunderstanding. jonathan, any words and i will do -- >> i wanted to say it's been a real honor to work with this project with mike, mike and i started working about colombia about 4 years ago and originally a story about mike's team that work today recover the space shuttle after the accident and as we talked to more and more people, the story grew as the saying goes eventually and ended up being -- becoming what we now think is the definitive story about actually what went on in the ground here and being more than the story of a couple hundred people, became the story of 25,000 people who became involved in search and recovery and where -- we try today to wre
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about it. >> and that's the expectation we hope y'all realize and take out of here, is that in times of need americans can really pull together and we needed help back in 2003 when we lost colombia and good folks in east texas and the people that responded on our behalf really it was just outstanding efforts so it was a tragedy, we lost 7 astronauts, 7 of my friends, we lost space shuttle colombia and end of space shuttle program. one of the outcomes, recommendation from the investigation board was that we should retire the space shuttle because it was unsafe system which i can agree with or disagree but we won't get into that a whole lot but did fore
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tell the program, but really the end of the space shuttle program. we haven't been able to fly american astronauts on american rockets to the international space station since the end of shuttle program in 2011. so let's get into it, real quick summary the accident that we are on the the same page, back in january 16, 2003, a crew on board, rick and his crew, about 81 seconds into flight if you recall the shuttle system, big external fuel tank, two boosters and orbitor, hit the leading edge of left-wing of orbitor. we didn't know at first or really even through the whole mission how bad the damage was. at the end of the mission it was declared no risk to orbitor or crew after an investigation on the ground with the best
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information we had which proved to be inadequate and we declared orbitor safe to come home february 1st. of course, some sort of a gap, breach in left wing and as orbitor was entering atmosphere the hot plasma gas, oxygen got inside and melted the left wing of colombia from inside out. started happening over the coast of california and we lost communications and lost ship over texas, east of dallas. initial debris was 250 miles long and 20 miles wide, we didn't hurt anyone on the ground that saturday morning. let's see two searchers die in helicopter accident, didn't hurt anybody in the accident itself but in search of recovery we lost a helicopter and two members of 5-member crew. the largest search ever in american history of any type
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over the next 3 months and we will get into more statistics on that. over a 100 different agencies helped us recover orbitor and astronauts. we never did a full accounting of the number of people that would have been impossible given the circumstance but we have been estimating all along about 25,000 people helped us over those 3 months. debris was picked out there in deep woods of east texas and shipped back to the kennedy space center to put the orbitor back together and to learn from what was left of the orbitor what happened to it, so we could fix it and fly the orbitor again. we were in the middle, we were in the beginning stagings -- stages of the space sequence so we needed to fly again. debris right now is all cataloged.
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it's in big cubic building at space center. i'm proud to say right now there are 3 people in the united states that have their doctoral degree based on studying debris from colombia. huge success. and then iss was completed and shuttle system was retired. mike and willy, dave, elon in the back, laura and kc. >> one thing to point out is that this elon ramon who is the second from the right in the back there, the first israeli astronaut to fly so tremendous amount of security around this mission. very diverse crew as you can see and casey on the far right, she was the first indian-american woman to fly in space so quite a diverse crew. >> you know, put that in context too, this mission in january of
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2003 was 16 months after 9/11 and so the country was still responding to those events and the shuttle system, the shuttle launches became something that -- that it went from a cool american icon launch to a cool american icon launch with a target on it. we had to deal with potential terrorism of the shuttle system as well. okay. here it is. that's the best view. i have to stay here to use the microphone. that's the best view we had on the ground of the foam hitting the edge -- leading edge of colombia. we had other cameras, one was inoperative that day and one out of focus, what you just saw was the best view on the ground to study what happened to the orbitor obviously it doesn't show where on the ship the foam actually hit.
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it was about this big, size of carry-on suitcase, 1.2 pounds, that's all. have you ever used that spray in insulation around pipes at home, goes in wet and expands, dries, the outside, external fuel tank was covered with foam very familiar to that, a little fancier but similar to that type of foam. very lightweight and very good insulator, another view hitting the edge of the wing. >> one thing to point out even though the foam was lightweight, it was less than a found as it fell off space shuttle, it was so lightweight and slowed down rapidly. it only weighed a pound you were hitting 5 miles an hour and there was a pretty big impact. >> there's our ground track on landing day coming over the
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coast of california. we lost communications over dallas with the ship. and the ship never made it much east of the louisiana-texas border. >> one thing to point out when space shuttle fires its engines for reentry it can only come down at one place and that's the place halfway on the other side of the earth from where it fired the orbit and so the decision had been made to land colombia at kennedy space center that day. fired engine over indian ocean and only place to come down because of the way -- because it's a glider as it comes to atmosphere. >> i remember like it was yesterday. it was always my habit as launch director to attend landings and that was the best part of my job, to see astronauts get off orbitor and looking them wobble in 1g, i went to the control
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room that morning and jonathan described that one and went driving out to runway where colombia should have landed and didn't come home. what we have been calling parallel confusion for those of us in florida waiting for colombia to come out of the sky and land right in front of us, it has to -- as jonathan said it has to come to florida. couldn't land anywhere else. .. ..
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>> here's a visual and auditory example of the parallel confusion mike talked about. here's a picture of an interest in at the shuttle landing facility runway. mike would've been off the screen in this picture but you see the clock says ten minutes until landing. at this point she did know it and nobody at kennedy new columbia had already broken up at this point. they were still standing there waiting for the ship to come back. as 916 thymic approach that would have heard sonic booms. they didn't hear those sonic booms and watch this countdown clock behind her countdown to
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zero and start counting up. normally the would've been a spatial on the ground and there was no space shuttle and nobody knew what it happened or where it was. at the same time this at her deafening silence was going on at kennedy space center here's t people east texas were hearing.
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>> that was in texas. people were having breakfast. with 816 thymic local time in texas. the sounds were just unbelievable. one fell stepped out of his house expecting there was an atomic bomb had gone off in houston about 100 miles away. sounds like they've never heard before. courage, compassion and commitment, land day out they became recovery. the orbiter broke up at 40 miles high. it was going 12,000 miles per hour. totally different than the challenger accident. if you remember, the challenger accident exploded on ascent, about a minute after liftoff. this one was coming home, broke up at 12,000 miles per hour. local residents with the first responders. most of them probably didn't even know we had a space mission going on.
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it just didn't mean anything to them. don't take that wrong, but it just wasn't something that was part of their daily activity of knowledge. they just didn't know. so they became our first responders. they were fighting the debris on the ground. they found our astronauts. when we got there that night we establish some priorities for them. one was to protect them from our debris. we still had toxic fuels coming out that some of the tanks that made it to the atmosphere. the pyrotechnic devices that had not fired, explosive devices separate different things on over it. that was number one, , protect e local people. number two, by our crew confided astronauts and didn't find the the critical debris to help us figure out what happened to the orbiter was our third priority. john? >> this is an area showing you about where the accident area was during come just east of dallas all the way across into
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the fort polk louisiana area. it was initially about, about 200 miles long, 20 miles wide that debris of the show was coming down. this is people find it on the ground committed after the accident, pieces ranging from the size of hatches or tunnel segments, bits and pieces of twisted metal pictures one of the fuel tanks they came to in the backyard of some houses. some of these fuel tank still a toxic gases in them and they're still venting when they came down. it really is amazing. mike, tell them what sean o'keefe sent in your office when he saw the film. >> we left the edge of the runway not knowing where the orbiter was. the administrator of nasa and center directors and other debt he said let's go to my office which was three miles away. we turned on the tv and refer
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saw that scene in seed of the orbiter, you probably have seen, the streaks in the sky. sean o'keefe put his hands on my desk and stared at it and said i want how many people on the ground were just hurt. we had no idea at the time we didn't hurt anybody. >> amazingly fortunate felt over relatively unpopulated area of the state at a time when a lot of people were home rather than at school. there was a piece of pipe through the roof of a schoolroom, and had been a school day somebody might've gotten injured but that was the closest that anybody came to getting hurt from this. >> lighter pieces slow down in atmosphere more quickly than the heavy stuff and landed farthest west in the debris field. this hole in the ground was created by one of the pumps of one of the engines on the shuttle. the pump looks sort of like a beer keg. it's about that size and about
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that shape, very, very massive. it hit the ground going mach two, 1500 miles per hour. berry bury itself 12 feet down e mud. the only reason, there's another part of an engine, that's called the power had with oxygen and the hydrogen come together and actually fuel the confession. the only reason we found the piece was a kicked mud on the side of trees in the middle of the forest, 20, 30 feet up on the trees. what is that my doing there? start to see little craters. so the heavy pieces went farthest east, and the lighter pieces stay at west. >> this is this is a picture soe local search and rescue that mike talked about, the local people being the first responders, within an hour to after the accident, the first remains of one of the crew were violent near the town of him feel. it became a rapid mobilization. one of the things that surprised me when we doing the research for the book was the extent to
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which even the smallest towns in rural america have an emergency response system that truly well set up so that people can respond to emergencies like this. when they immediately ordered their incident system, had everything set up, and they were out there already sort organize searches within several hours after the accident. this is what the train look like. they are were very thick, piney woods, lots of briars, two-inch long thorns on them. people who went in there got their there close shredded pretty rapidly. it was up to the local folks who knew this area like the back of the hands to lead that search and recovery effort for the first couple of weeks. and it turned into actually a huge volunteer effort. this little town of hemphill texas only has about 1000 people, and over the course of the first 24 hours the
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population of the town tripled as searchers came into the area, news crews came in, volunteers from all over started showing up. there was only one of two places in town i could feed people, one thing was called at fred's that was run by women who also happen to be the wife of the vfw hall, vfw commander. he suggested that opened the vfw hauled up to start feeding some of the searchers. she started making phone calls to the church groups, and withe course of a couple of days they had a huge heating operation up and running where they were feeding upwards of several thousand searchers every day. over the course of the first 12 days of the search and rescue effort while there were looking for the astronauts remains, we figure some of between 30,000-50,000 neos were served by volunteers, completely all brought in by people donating the food themselves from the local community. it was just an amazing effort and response on their part.
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>> that goes back to the expectation, the local people out there just rose to the occasion and did what was right. there was no game plan for this certainly. they did what was right. here's the final debris field and the location of our seven astronauts. before you ask him were not going to talk a lot about the astronauts. i will tell you that when the crew module of the orbiter lost compression, lost its oxygen, the crew died very, very quickly. so they didn't suffer, but they also came down over that large of an area. >> and nasa did recover all seven of the astronauts were returned to their family, and the first five are found within the first three days of the search and there was a time of the more of a week that the last two were found. so there was a real sense of urgency to try to bring those
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last two crew members home to their families. again, one of the great success stories here is that the crew were recovered with dignity and returned to their families for burial. >> as each astronaut was found, we had a member of our astronaut office there with them. we had clergy with them, the local undertaker there with them, fbi and state police. it was only after the astronaut friend was done with his or her silent prayers for his or her fallen friend, was then the body removed. it was done very, very tastefully as jonathan says. >> one of the things to think about that usually amazed me was how we care for people in times of grief who also the very important job to do. if you can imagine being an astronaut and having to go out in the field and recover the body of one of your former
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crewmates or one of your classmates, one of your good friends, extremely traumatic type of work for them to have to do, and a set of a rule that no astronaut could be work on this recovery operation for more than three days at a time and they had to then go and go through some psychological counseling afterwards to help them through that. we even provided, the government even provided psychological counseling for the people from kennedy space center who came out to help find pieces of columbia because columbia was like like a thief member of the crew for the people who work at the kennedy. they lived with the orbiter everyday that it wasn't in orbit, which was 95% of% of its lifetime. but then pushes it was just liy lost a friend by going after and find bits and pieces of the shuttle to bring back again. >> we had teams set up at the kennedy space center, one team would process and do the testing on columbia. another team would do it on
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endeavor, discovery, atlantis, like that. so the team that processed and launched columbia took a special feeling towards it. when the pieces were coming back, i can't tell you the number of times where an engineer, myself included, would see the debris coming to the reconstruction hanger and just couldn't deal with it. had to walk out, couldn't see t because it was like -- is impossible to describe the feeling that you get after working on a spacecraft for your whole career, and then see it come back in the condition it was in. there are some statistics for you. an enormous area was searched. the final search area, i think we have a slight on that coming up. >> we will look at and a second. so there's some statistics. again, largest ground search of any type in american history.
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astronauts found, returned to the families. their mission became our mission. when we lost the two searchers in a helicopter crash, we walked, folks, we walked an area where the debris was most concentrated, and then on either side of that long rectangle we flew helicopters, low altitude helicopters, looking down for debris that was outside the main debris corridor. and one day when a fuel system problem. one of the helicopters crashed and killed two people. one of them was a local resident, and so adopted the model, their mission became our mission, because now people that were helping us find the orbiter and the seven astronauts also lost one of their local people. it became even more personal to them. 38% of the orbiter was recovered. an empty orbiter weighs a little over 200,000 pounds.
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we found 38%. well, mike, what is the other 62? some of it vaporized inapposite. some of it is still out there. the pump i discussed, the beer keg pump that was 12 feet down, we had six of them on the orbiter, but only found three, so there are three of them out there still somewhere. never to be found. >> most of the debris they came back was smaller than the size of a quarter. so there were a few very large pieces but a lot of it was very, very small pieces that came back. >> physically the largest piece of debris pickup act was a piece of the belly of the orbiter about twice the size of that table. of a orbiter that is the size of a 737. >> this is another one of the things that really kind of surprised nasa i believe was like after the fall at your search was over, after the last
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of the crew had been recovered, nasa was made in trying to find the rest of the debris for columbia because we need to find out what caused the accident, and the people to get space shuttle program line again. they didn't want but volunteers in harm's way is some from the texas force service said we have firefighters who are trained to do great searching types of things, when you walk the line with 20 people at arms length from each other and your skin every square foot of the grant. we have firefighters were trained to do that. it's their off-season. let's bring them in. they traveled as self-contained unit. within a matter of days the u.s. force service that up four different camps along that debris quarter to get into one of the setup you. they rotated in several thousand firefighters at a time many of them came from native american indian reservations across the country. and the folks came out and state of intense and perform the searches every day.
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this is the helicopter crew that mike mentioned earlier, the gentleman in black is buzz, the pilot, and the gentleman in the yellowjacket is charles who was the local resident. this picture was taken a couple hours before the accident. they stop for refilling and lunch and they had their picture taken, and then that crash happened later today. the other three gentlemen survived with serious injuries, but that was a wake-up call that it was not worth putting human life at risk for debris recovery effort, so they scaled back the skill of the air search operations after that. >> we did water searches as well. remember one of the earlier slides at the border between texas and louisiana is a large reservoir, tva reservoir, huge. we are certain some of columbia is a net reservoir because pieces landed west of the resident at a couple pieces land
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east of the reservoir some fishermen who are out there one reservoir that morning to go fishing and what of the boats almost got swamped by something were large and heavy, hit the water and almost swamped the book. i personally believe it is one of those pumps. and other bits and pieces will like all around, almost like la hailstorm, debris coming into the lake. >> that the typical view of a very easy area to search. no thick trees, no tickets. -- thickets pick a gidget idea of what we did over three months looking for the debris. >> imagined these lines extending from here to dulles airport wide and used in all the way from there to philadelphia or new york city. that's about the size that was searched on foot, every square foot. >> so the final search every that we walked, physically walked, was ten miles wide and 120 miles long.
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so think of that. ten miles wide, 120 miles long was walked, from me to him. it took three months and almost 25,000 people. bittersweet victory,, reconstruction revealed the cause of the accident. we followed national transportation safety board to recommendation to establish two teams to study it. one team to look at the debris only and i forget what happened to the orbiter based on what was left of it, and another team out of johnson space center to look at all the data, all the pictures, all the telemetry that came down. if those two teams concluded the same cause, well then, you had it not, you are pretty certain to the actual cause determined, and we did. preserving, learning from columbia i mention we have every bit of columbia stored in the vehicle assembly building back in florida. we can access anytime we want,
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lend it out to institutions. it's helped design a new seat for spacecraft of the future. one of the findings was the seats in the orbiter when it went into a flat spin, the seats couldn't take that and so the new seats in the spacecraft, the boeing and spacex are building now in part are based on findings from columbia is seats. what else, johnson? >> let's take a few looks at the pictures here. >> there we go. that's columbia. that's the space shuttle about two-thirds of the way through the recovery. i mention it took three months to do all that searching. this is about two-thirds of the way through. it's in a hangar. we took over a hangar back at the kennedy space center. what you're looking at is the orbiter knows towards you and upside down -- nose.
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at the very forefront, that is the very nose cap of the orbiter, right end end of the r and the wings i like this in the belly in the middle turned upside down so we could study the burn patterns and the breakages of the different components, et cetera. >> every piece that was picked up out in the field was gps tag. they tagged it, back to it. i was old and up into a complex database and senescent it were every single piece of the shuttle came down. that helped tell the story as more and more pieces of the space shuttle came back. they were able to do an analysis like this. this is a picture of, the red is pieces of the left-wing and blue is pieces of the right wing. the spatial strumming from upper left to lower fight so you can see the pieces of the left wing were found for pieces of the right wing. this shows the accident started in the left-wing and that's what fell apart first.
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they were able to do this kind of data again based on what was picked up and identified in the reconstruction hangar. that data was sent back to people in the field, if they found pieces of something that was interesting, of particular interest like we're trying to find the avionics and close to the black boxes on the spatial, conservator search in is there because we found some of the pieces that were close to inside the space shuttle. >> could we go back? if you notice in the upper left corner of that slide there is doubtless. if the orbiter have broken up one minute earlier, it would've come down in suburban dallas. the results would've been totally different than what we experience. they're probably would've been injuries on the ground. the response by the people in suburban dallas, i'm not besmirching the by any means but would've been different from the response by the good people of east texas. and so from a luck standpoint,,
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we were lucky were came down with did. next one, those are tiles. you've all heard about the tiles on the shoulder. that's a tile table we built so we could study the tiles up close and personal so to speak. the large rectangular area is what's left, the opening for one of the landing gear doors. of course the orbiter landed like a glider as jonathan mentioned. the area of concern, etc the gentleman in the white shirt and a blue jeans, that is about where that foam hit the wing. you can see we got very few of the tile back. that tile table didn't kill him with more tiles. that was about it. in a younger time, the leading edge of the wing, okay, the foam hit the leading edge of the wing. that's the shape of it, it's made out of material called reinforce carbon carbon tickets
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essentially and really, really tough and fancy fiberglass. it is woven and it's impregnated and pressed and baked and it's about an eighth of an inch thick, very, very hard, very brittle. we wanted to see what was left of the pieces of the left wing, the leading edge of the wing in context to the other pieces. and in relation to the pieces right next to it so we built those frames and inserted the pieces of reinforced carbon-carbon here we got back and that allowed us to see the outside which would amend the outside of the wing, and you could walk around behind a look at the inside of the wing as well. at the same time. it proved to be very valuable. the only ex-boss, orbiter experimentation box, every aircraft you line has a black box, voice recorder and dated. data. we had one on columbia called
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the orbiter extrema tatian box. it's magnetic tape. levels of the orbiter to have it because it was the first orbiter built and a collected data during asset and during reentry. that's all it did. didn't data on orbit at all. temperatures, purchase, vibrations, that type of thing. we found that box in the condition it's in and that proved to be completely invaluable to the data team to study it. only the two out of honest about tapered. the rest of the tape at all the data we wanted. >> mike hello to the room in the vehicle assembly building and this is the columbia preservation office with mike who is the file that runs that 50 runs the apollo challenger columbia lessons learned program for nasa and i just want to show you a few pictures. no photographs are allowed inside it other than a day this
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is open to the press. nasa strongly encourages every new employee at kennedy space center to walk through the columbia room and see the consequences of making a decision or not make a decision, how every person can affect what goes on and effective what happens to spacecraft. here's some of the bits and pieces of columbia that were recovered and reconstructed. on the left is what's left of the airlock and the time of the lead back to the space lab module that was inside to get into somebody thrusters in the background. some of the avionics boxes that were twisted and burned and melted, again, is such, for lack of a better word, miraculous that the extrema tatian box arrived in the shape he did because some of the other pieces that were sitting right next to it were melted beyond any kind of usability. some of the tanks they came
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back, and -- >> i'm just wondering why -- [inaudible] >> primarily for a matter of good taste, i think, is they wanted to make sure the material was use public. >> we didn't want getting out. crew families had a lot to do with it. we consulted with the crew families, ask them what to do and what not to do. >> go head. >> we got to up quickly, but again there is this debris loan program mike talked about that it does allow was to be able to study the material they came back from columbia, learn from it. it represents ten times as much material as of came back from uncontrolled reentry before so it's a really valuable scientific learning laboratory. again, as mike said, three people got their phds as result of studying columbia is debris so far.
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>> if you go to the kennedy space center visitor complex, and atlanta's building, anybody been to the atlantis? it's very impressive. on the first floor of the building are pieces of challenger that is on the left of the picture, a sidewall of challenger from the 1986 accident. the window frame from columbia on the right. in that area also are memorials to the 14 astronauts the died in the shuttle program. so what open for questions i believe. yes, sir. [inaudible] >> it better be a good one then. >> actually two questions. one is how soon were federal authorities alerted after those local police calls? and secondly, could you say something more about the phone
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that came up? where did it come from and how was it remedied in future flight? >> we had a meeting come to answer the first question, we had a meeting at the launch control center one hour after the accident, and all federal agencies and a lot of the state agencies in taxes were tied into it. fema had a large site in it, environmental protection agency because of the hazards. nasa course had the fbi because it was a death investigation. they were all involved in that so thin it out all federal agencies were contacted. within 20 minutes of accident the president was notified. our administrator called president bush from office and told him what it happened. the phone itself came off. as the orbiter attached to the side of the external tank about the nose, it's connected to the tank with a struct. where that struck goes into the external fuel tank that was covered with foam to keep ice from forming because it's in a a very cold region on the tank.
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that foam is poured on and cut by hand and that's a piece that came off. the fix for that was removed that foam entirely from that connection point and wrap it with he did just like you have at home. here again, nevertheless, nevet tape instead the phone to keep from ice from forming at that location. any other quick ones? >> how much you think that cut off extending the shuttle? you said you only to go to 2011 thymic have a stop at burkey think i'm at for the program would've gone. >> we were are fully prepared y until 2020 your columbia we came home would've gone through a major modification to allow to go to the space station. and so we had all plans in place until 2020 2020 least because e time was the estimated duration of this international space station international space
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station break that's been extended to 2024. the shuttle was still flight we be fly until 2024. and since the shuttle was retired in 2011, we have been relying on the russians to get to the international space intee station and you saw what happened two days ago. now we have no way of getting there. >> we have commercial crew program that two major entrants, bowling and unita launch alliance have iraq at the barfly next you with astronauts on it finally and in spacex, space explosion corporation will fly next year so we have two providers for astronaut access to the international space station on american rockets come should start fly next year finally. >> thank you so much to our speakers. books will be on sale in the lobby and it will be signing at the table. i i do so much. [applause] thank you ..
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