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tv   Neil Gorsuch A Republic If You Can Keep It  CSPAN  September 14, 2019 11:00pm-12:11am EDT

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and then wanting the left to succeed and then to say that the most radically progressive people are the ones you want to organize with even all of you guys don't agree on all of that. >> what about libertarianism quick. >> going up at a republican household that my parents were libertarian. they were pro-business and said yes that is what i am and then to reason magazine and now i work there. >> panic attack. thank you for joining us on book tv. >> thank you.
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>> ladies and gentlemen please welcome supreme court associate justice to one - - justice gorsuch. [applause] >> good evening everyone i
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have the honor of being executive director of the resident - - ronald reagan institute. thank you for coming this evening in honor of the men and women in uniform please stand and join me for the pledge of allegiance i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america. into the republic for which it stands one nation under god indivisible with liberty and justice for all. and before we get started i like to take a moment to recognize to begin with the board of trustees pete wilson and his terrific wife gail.
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[applause] from north carolina former congressman retired but just as busy as ever. [applause] so now to tonight's program ladies and gentlemen it is my honor to invite fred ryan chairman of the board of trustees of the reagan foundation to our stage. [applause] >> good evening welcome to the reagan library. thank you for joining us for what we know will be a fascinating conversation. we are honored to have as our
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special guest this morning justice gorsuch it is generally understood after to be confirmed to the supreme court you never have to answer questions again that you don't want to. [laughter] instead you get to ask the questions. by justice gorsuch we appreciate your making an exception for this evening's interview. [laughter] i promise i will do my best to make it a better experience than the senate judiciary committee. [laughter] i know that's a faux pas. [applause] if you see a copy of his book you will know he has two collaborators his former clerks. we are pleased to have david in the audience tonight. we are honored he is joined by his grandmother who is very special to us.
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bill lear who has been at the reagan library for more than 20 years. [applause] >> you should never underestimate the power and influence to bring a supreme court justice to the supreme court library. [laughter] in 93 and 94 to serve as a clerk as kennedy as reagan's third and final appointment to the high court. thirty years later would be the first clerk to serve alongside his former boss as a fellow supreme court justice. it is no secret what they wanted that legacy to be.
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it should interpret the law do not make it. that the principles of law are based on the constitution. it is a users manual for the interpretation of our constitution and if they stray too far from the constitutional principles. the title of his book is a republic if you can keep it. that phrase is how franklin was said to answer questions of how it was created at the constitutional convention he was trying to convey just how fragile our liberties are and how vigilant the citizens must be to preserve them.
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is never more than one generation away from extinction. and then to preserve the constitutional freedom for the next generation please welcome justice gorsuch. [applause] >> justice we are honored to have you here on the day of publication of your book. >> i am still happy to be west of the mississippi. [laughter] thank you for having me it's been something i have been looking forward to so thank
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you for a wonderful tour. >> your book opens with an interesting series of events with washington on your announcement of your nomination to the supreme court and reminds me of the screenplay of an action novel can you share that with us quick. >> to say it was unexpected doesn't begin to capture how it felt to me and my family. i have a few stories to tell page will just share one. we had to sneak out of our hometown in colorado and sneak into the white house. they took us in through the kitchen you probably know this better but there are still
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scars from the war of 1812. bullet holes and fire marks where it had been burned the president was gracious enough to lend me the use of the lincoln bedroom as an office for the day. while. i sat writing my remarks for that evening at a desk where the gettysburg address sits. the president gave my wife who is an immigrant from england the use of the queen's bedroom across the hall. she was allowed one phone call. [laughter] but it had to be somebody back in england. not america so she called her dad. dad you will not believe it. it is going to be neil and it's about to happen. he said i have stayed up. late for the announcement he
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said i have been watching your television programs over here and there's another fellow who they caught on tape driving to washington so it will not be you. [laughter] in-laws. right? [laughter] she said dad i am in the queen's bedroom. i think it will be neil and he said honey but the other guy could be down the hall. [laughter] so that is a feel of what it was all like. >> leaving your home in colorado was a little bit of a covert operation. >> it was and i tell that story in the book. but really just the big shock
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was the loss of anonymity. i was a private citizen in colorado now all of a sudden everywhere i am recognized. i must say everybody who comes up to me who has something nice to say. [applause] they may say i voted for the president or against the president but i wish you well. lover country. i love our courts and i love our constitution. if i look for lauren that day they may tell me a joke. [laughter] that one moment that really captured it for me taking planes back and forth to all the senators in washington. i didn't know about that.
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i didn't bring enough so i had to go out and buy shirts. i was feeling sorry for myself for no good reason that we were in the plane with a bit of turbulence and sitting next to a little girl who was six years old. she didn't know or care who i was but she was scared and said may i hold your hand? and i said of course. it reminded me of my girls that age and then the flight smoothed out and said would you like to draw? [laughter] and we spent the next two and half hours drawing and coloring. that was my favorite two and half hours through the entire process. [laughter] [applause] but the sweet part was after that happy moment her mother
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had been behind us and i did not know that and she had recognized me she made sure a thank you note was sent to my office two weeks later it was drawn by that little girl. to stick figures in front of an airplane to say thank you for the fun. that is what america is about. and that is what i got to see when i lost my anonymity so when god take something away he gives you something in return and that's what i got to see. it's a true privilege. [applause] >> you did a previous book on a different subject. [laughter] but what inspired you to write this book especially with this election with the quote. >> to the confirmation process i wanted to say something
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about america and the constitution. the confirmation process changed a little bit. back when reagan nominated scalia to the court, my predecessor, the great man smoked a pipe during his hearing before the senate. [laughter] how many want to see that again? that mather clerk the justice from colorado his lasted 15 minutes that's about how long it lasted with the tenth circuit the first time the second time was a little different. [laughter] and during that process i came to feel some basic things about our country and we all need reminders. we all do about the wonder of our constitution and how we
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live under it and how all of us have a role to play in our republic. it's not supposed to be run by a small group. it is we the people those of the first three words of the constitution. somehow it became a process something judges are just like politicians wearing capes rather than robes. if we rule a certain way we must like that person we ruled for or disliked that person we rule against. and as my experience as a lawyer and judge to the judges i have admired know that the law is not politics and judges are not supposed to be politicians. and our constitution is the greatest world - - liberty we
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have ever known is a great privilege to do nothing more than to uphold that and pass it down to the next generation. that's what i wanted to write about because that's my experience with the law. and to offer folks a peek in my life of how a judge thinks to see how different it is. politicians are elected to do your will judges are not electe elected. it's right there in the federalist papers number 78. that's it i wanted to talk about. [applause] and when i dug into it further i came to learn we don't have a problem 30 percent of americans can name the three branches of government.
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about one third can name one of them in 10 percent think judge judy serves on the supreme court. [laughter] i respect judge judy. i like judge judy. [laughter] that she is not one of my colleagues. [laughter] i wanted to talk about these things and i was joyfully able to do it with two of my wonderful law clerks and david is here but let me brag on them for about ten seconds. this young man comes for a family of mexican immigrants and holocaust survivors. he saved up his pennies as an undergrad to achieve his dream
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to attend harvard law school which he did and graduated first in his class. [applause] and janie is every bit as special her family escaped communism in czechoslovakia. she came here and went to harvard got degrees in statistics, physics and then went to law school clerked for me and just a soda mayor. those of the people that i write the book they are joy to work with you give me hope for the future thank you.
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>> both of them served as your law clerks and you have a simple rule that you give them can you share those rules? >> the judges rule and the constitution. very simple. do these two things that we would get along just fine. i don't care how you come dressed i don't care what hours you work. i like to see you from time to time. [laughter] to rules. please don't make anything up. just follow the law as faithfully as you can. that's the judges job. help me with that. second figure out what the law is what the original meaning was and apply that to new circumstance. rule number two when people start yelling into you that
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you are a terrible person if you don't make stuff up or they may not invite you to their cocktail party refer back to rule number one. [applause] >> getting into your book one of the major themes is separated powers and the dangers to blur those powers so why is that so important? >> we all know first amendment rights the fourth amendment rights and the bill of rights and how they contribute to our liberty but if we don't appreciate enough separation of powers and how important it is to our liberty. many countries have wonderful bills of rights. north korea is my favorite.
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[laughter] it promises all the rights in hours and wore. free education. healthcare. and even my favorite the right to relaxation. i don't know how that's working out for the political prisoners in north korea but the point is madison knew this when he wrote the constitution that those are just promises. he didn't think we needed the bill of rights if we got separation of powers right and that men are not angels and the key to your liberty is keeping powers separated. by one third of the federal government which is dividing the power. what happens when we ignore the separation of powers?
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i know that sounds academic and wonky and it did to me learning high school civics. but as a judge with a day in and day out cases i came to see what happens when you blur the lines of separation of powers. what happens when the legislative power makes laws to transfer to the executive branc branch? madison wanted lawmaking to be really hard with the two houses of congress responded to different electorates and to make them the fulcrum of the legislative process with a special power to protect themselves that's how we fought minority rights.
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what happens if you put into the hands? that was to apply the law and what madison had if you make it through the difficult process it should be vigorously enforced. to decide against management by committee so take out 435 elected representatives in its place? i don't want to exaggerate but what happens if it is delegated? small business in colorado mom and pop type. was a good size business but
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with medicare fraud. meant to comply with all the rules in the place at the time that they promulgate so many new rules and laws that are forcible in the sanctions that they cannot keep up. and those responsible only to the president. academics stopped counting years ago. and then the power to judge. and i have veterans who came before me and immigrants who came before me. when i look at the law they
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deserve to win. we have doctrines that say independent judges should defer to the interpretation of the law. by the executive bureaucrat. so even though i think veterans and immigrants should win the social security benefit should when i have to look the other way. what happens to the right of the independent judge or your right to participate in the lawmaking process? it is supposed to be a republic. are those branches coequal? >> i hope so to make do they always consistently maintain the same or over time. >> one can question by virtue of what has happened and what
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the framers had in mind. with that legislative power and that judicial power. >> to introduce those concepts with those concepts mean. >> now we are getting wonky but yes this is important to me but the term original is him had not been uttered by any of my law professors at law school until justice scalia showed up one day to give a lecture. he introduced it to me.
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this is not something i even fully embraced or understood later when i became a judge original is him is a simple idea. and as they are originally understood from the time they are adopted. that's it. talking about statutes or contracts into put it down on paper and then that is called the amendment process directed by we the people.
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so the written is of the constitution and they rejected that. and then to see real cases and real lives if they ignore or override the original meaning of the words on the page. and this is called the living constitution. as a judge your rights are often taken away here is a couple of examples. you have a right to a jury trial in criminal cases. you have a right to accuse your accusers. but the supreme court has said you're right to a jury trial
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sometimes gives way to a judge instead you can try your case. your rights are diminished and sometimes you don't have a right to confront your accusers. sometimes a piece of paper written by a police officer can be introduced as a key evidence against you to send a person away for 20 years or more. the united states supreme court took a lot of rights away from a whole class of citizens of the japanese-american citizens could be rounded up and detained. with hostilities on the second world war. with any due process and then to do something important.
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to help the war effort. and then the most obvious example is dred scott. so white persons have the right to own black persons as slaves in the territories of the united states. that was guaranteed by the due process. that clause is not there they put it there. and thought they were averting a civil war that judges make pretty rotten politicians. and they start exercising the legal judgment they got it
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wrong contributing to a civil war. now i just had a birthday with the old people in washington. [laughter] but the nation of 330 million americans. it is republic and it is for you to keep. >> critics of original and some say they cannot accommodate important supreme court decisions to segregate american schools can you explain how this decision could reflect the originalist approach? >> my friend has written the definitive article and why it fits with the original meaning of the constitution. looking at the 14th
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amendment says equal protection of the law. over my fireplace in my office the first justice he is a soul the center in plessy versus ferguson who realized that was not consistent one - - consistent with the original meaning of the constitution. i don't doubt that he's popular back home but segregation is not equal protection of the law equal protection of laws could be the most radical in human history and with those conservative results and i say rubbish.
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[laughter] and look at this last term of everything that i wrote conservativism you bet but does that lead to liberal results? not at all. so you're right to have your cell phone data kept private and originalist in the carpenter decision might be more protective of their rights that a living constitutionalist. double jeopardy. we would only to dissent in that double jeopardy case this year. [applause] on the originalist grounds.
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your right to confront your accusers and have that jury trial of five / four decision to uphold that right is that liberal or conservative i don't know but it is in the sixth amendment. people have been selling that line i have a bridge and want to sell you. [laughter] >> you discuss the first amendment as well as the spirit of original intent why did the founders believe press freedom was successful? >> i thought all those freedoms were essential for i wouldn't say it's my rule to pick or choose you may have your favorite. >> the first is high on the list. [laughter] >> but my job is to enforce all of your rights and not pick favorite. >> do you think now 230 years after the first amendment the intent was realized?
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>> the supreme court is not a bad institution it is a fine institution made up of wonderful people my colleagues are delightful i know people like to focus on different cases but i think sometimes we need to step back and focus not just on the forest but on the trees so let me give you a few facts 50 million lawsuits filed and i'm not counting speeding tickets. as the american spirit. in the federal system 95 percent are resolved in the trial court without appeal. i was a lawyer a long time for
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quite loved being a lawyer. you help people solve their problems. but they accepted that as reasonably just and they accept that. recent panels of three on the tenth circuit you can't do anything about the third person. 20 percent of the continental united states and two time zones and utterly diverse court on any metric going from johnson through obama we could reach unanimity on those that got appeal 95 percent of the time.
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okay. what about the supreme court? i said do you realize we hear 70 cases per year? those of the hardest cases in the country where the lower courts had disagreed on the issue that's why they had the same as people in new york and everywhere in between. that's our job to do a circuit split. fine. seventy out of 50 million. think about that and the liability and predictability it is incredible now at 70. okay. there are nine of us. not three anymore over 25 or 30 years by five different presidents all across the
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country but we are well represented. [laughter] of those 40 percent are resolved unanimously to ever hear about that? 40 percent does that happen magically? heck no. it we managed to have unanimity through hard work and fun along the way. people say fine. good for you but what about the others? i say first of all that number has been more or less the same since the second world war. the only thing new is that
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nothing is new only then result appointed eight out of the nine justices. [laughter] >> let's talk about the five / four that's about 33 percent of the docket nothing to get excited about. the last term there were ten different combinations of justices on the 54 decisions. >> we love to hear about you and your colleagues on the court. >> okay i got a couple of good ones.
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so what makes this place work is mutual respect and fun sometimes. we shake hands every time we meet. a tradition going back to the 1h century. we have lunch together. there is lunch in the lunch room together their argument days and conference days and that's a lot of days. we go out to dinner together like normal people and there are some traditions and we break them once in a while justice sotomayor came in one day and had a good run and a robe on with pinstripes. [laughter] and the new york yankees emblem we are in the robing room getting ready to walk out and my colleagues are like will she walk out there like
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that? [laughter] we get lined up to go out and somebody says are you really going to go out like that? she said no but i was waiting for somebody to ask. [laughter] we have a tradition of a junior justice has a dinner for the next new justice of the supreme court so just as kagan through a fabulous dinner for me and louise and had indian food she knew a great chef he came in and cooked up a storm. it was fantastic i had a tough row to hoe when justice cavanagh came on board. i had known him for 40 years i wanted to throw him a good party but i also knew he was a
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meat and potatoes kind of guy so the dinner would be pretty boring so i had to do something in the entertainment department after dinner i said to come down to the great hall he is a huge baseball fan that nationals are the presidents of the giant foam headset art 10 feet tall. it's crazy and my wonderful assistant jessica went online and found that you could read one. [laughter] so we hired two of them and as everybody walked into the great hall i gave him a checkered flag and we had a race. wasn't sure how that would go over. [laughter]
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but i figured it was better to ask for forgiveness than permission. [laughter] >> i cannot resist to go back to 50 million cases being filed. are there too many lawyers in america? [laughter] >> i talk about access to justice in the book and i do worry when lawyers graduate law school unable to afford their own services. they are way too expensive and it takes too long to get to trial then you don't get a jury. look at how many criminal laws are on the books today. anyone over the age of 18 could be a federal criminal and has broken a federal criminal law yes i worry about access to justice yes i worry
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about access to justice very important subjects so to reflect the new citizens and what they play value shared by president reagan so how is your experience as a judge shape your views and as the husband of a naturalized citizen? >> i worry when 60 percent would fail then naturalization exam my wife had to take when only 30 percent of millennial say it's important to live in a democracy. and i applaud the groups like presidential libraries who try to do something about civic understanding.
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because i don't know how you run this government if you don't know anything about this government and if you don't care. talking to young people who say i'm a citizen of the world i am torn on that. that means i recognize and respect the dignity of each person, but you say there's nothing special about the united states of america, the constitution you have been bequeathed, our republic , think again we can have an incredibly special gift in the constitution. jefferson said if you expect ignorant people to maintain a
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republic something that never was in history and never will be they are special things in a checkered record in the court of history ours is already the longest written national constitution in history we need to make sure the people, all of us, not a criticism of anyone but to all of us to recognize that yes we have our problems come i'm not here to tell you we don't but we also have a great gift and an obligation to make sure everyone realizes they have a great gift and there's responsibility that comes with that great gift. [applause] >> nearly 70 percent of
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americans has a major civility problem putting aside politics do you feel the level of civility naturally waxes and wanes but is that the cause to be uncivil like the internet? >> i think their institutions in our country incredibly civil i think the courts are some of those places there is a lot to admire as our republic is supposed to be raucous that's it makes us strong with a marketplace of ideas all voices can be heard. you only speak at a place you know you have a right and it will be protected and recognized so that is a testament to the rule of law
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and we all know we have a first amendment right to speak. but if you ask me whether we all could do better, all of u us, maybe just a bit. social media today i worry when young people say they are dissuaded from public service in the way we converse with one another and those a talk by moving their kid from school because of it so yes i worry about civility. washington had a great example. he was forced to write out and hand 100 rules of civility the jesuits lay down in 1595.
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there are good rules some of them are funny in my favorite says something like do not be so enthusiastic in your speech. or come so close to the person that you are debating that you can hit the other man's face with your spittle. [laughter] just say it don't spray it. [laughter] it there was a time when we had manners and we talked civics and there was a time when civility was not a bad word are not considered too timid. i think we have to remember those with whom we disagree love this country every bit as much as we do.
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at nova go back to washington's rules. it's pretty simple you will have a lot of regrets in your life. he will do a lot of things you wish you hadn't and say things you regret. things left unsaid and left undone but you will never regret being kind. [applause] >> you point out the important to have good men and women pursuing public service president reagan made no secret of his views of what has become the judicial confirmation process this is better suited for campaigns and elections than supreme court nominations. do you think the process is working today the way the founders intended?
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>> do you think i will touch that with a 10-foot pole? [laughter] >> i can try. >> i will not touch the confirmation process. the judges need to stay in their lane. i'm now one article three. i'm happy to be back home. [laughter] but i will say to young people out there look at people like david. they are not afraid. don't be afraid. [applause] we need you. we need your ideas, participation and help and somebody has to run the zoo. [laughter]
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why not you? >> and the words don't hurt that much if you know you're doing something more important than yourself and what life can you live that's more worthy than to carry on our great constitution in this republic? no better way to live a life. [applause] >> in your book you include tribute to those kennedy and scalia what are the elements to their legacy. >> starting with justice kennedy and later had the opportunity to become his colleague the first time a clerk ever had the opportunity to serve together his legacy
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for me this is what we were talking about just now you will not meet the more courteous man of professional values to inculcate of our profession today a great teacher of civics and a gentle man. i will tell you a story about him that this is the man so when i became his colleague he said i like to work at home and at the home office he said and if you ask they could even give you a fax machine. [laughter] i was a law clerk 25 years
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earlier and i remember that fax machine. [laughter] 's i wrote my first opinion for the court after hours late in the day the justice got wind i circulated the opinion from the law clerk so he wanted to write that and use that fax machine but it broke. said he had the law clerk drive it out to his house i quickly got back a handwritten note first opinion to the supreme court of justice kennedy and justice's goliath - - justice scalia. a lion of a man but docile and private. fearless originalist unapologetic and i'm happy to follow in that mold so
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although we agreed we had our disagreements he came out fly fishing with me in colorado one time. we have very different approaches. [laughter] i would suggest and i know this river and if you walk over there and unfurl your line behind that rock you will catch a trout. he was the son of queens he starts over there with all the enthusiasm and slaps his line of the water as hard as you can as if it will make the fish hungrier. and then he says i thought you said there were fish there. [laughter] as indeed there had been.
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[laughter] i have a wonderful reminder of justice scalia in the chambers when he passed the cisco leah was kind enough to give the mentos from his office there is one thing left over was a giant elk head that he had named elroy he had secured on a hunting trip in colorado with one of his former law clerks. mrs. scalia did not want leroy in her house. so she made the former law clerk page you take it back to his house it sitting in a giant crate in his garage occupying space if president
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trump and he nominates you that we have a gift for you. [laughter] and honesty i foolishly discounted that at zero. [laughter] and of course six months later how the world works i get a call from the cisco leah who says we are about to have the first scalia law clerk reunion since he has passed will you be my date for the night? of course. about halfway through dinner my buddy with a big grin on his face. [laughter] rolls out a gigantic crate presents me with lee roy.
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very happy to have them watch down over my law clerks because we have something in common. we are both native coloradans. [laughter] and stuck in washington the rest of our lives. [laughter] and neither one of us will ever forget antonin scalia. [applause] >> speaking of your former boss taken me up to the top floor to show me the basketball court which is above the supreme court chambers which is the highest court in the land. [laughter] do you ever sneak away to shoot some hoops during the day? >> i like to row and ski and do a lot of things.
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occasionally i will go up there and have some happy memories of their my old boss white who is now forgotten but i would like to remember him a little bit of justice from colorado their special places and that is one of them. and is one of the great athletes of the day highest-paid nfl football player leading rusher, i don't think that will happen in the supreme court. [laughter] anyway he had a mean game of horse now when he was younger hughes to elbow the law clerks now by the time i got there it was horse he was so good he had a shot over the back of his head he could make nine
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times out of ten it didn't mind taking your money when he did. [laughter] the other place i think of him is done on the first floor on the supreme court of the united states really it's a basement with not a lot of windows and then when you're gone to hang your portrait there. your portrait there. . . . . identify probably about half of them and said something that really shocked me he said he too.
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[laughter] and then he said something depressed me at the time and he said that's the way it should be and that's what's going to happen to me too. you know as a son of colorado i thought that was terrible and unbelievable. this guy was not only starting nfl player scholar he was a war hero. south pacific. he was one of jack kennedy's best friends he helped segregate southern schools with bobby kennedy. he served on supreme court for 31 years. how could anybody forget justice white? i walked allways now, and a lot of tourist during that portrait with no idea of who they're looking at. and i think what justice white was saying it was joyful and not impress i have but judge rule was upholding the constitution. not changing.
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that's up to you if you want to do that. upholding constitution and passing down the welfare legacy and joy of living a life and greater service than yourselfst that's what he was trying to teach me day so i think about that a lot. when i walk through the court -- and -- the court we're just about out of time i have a can couple of more questions i want to get in. one is in your book you talk about how porkt important your family is to you including daughter and dedicated to your wife and daughters i'm father of daughterses and many more here it shall and here's a question for you when they have the occasional argument that take place between siblings, how do you -- >> each has -- it happens. flesh how do you render your judgment? >> my jurisdiction doesn't extend that far.
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[laughter] okay. well, speaking of young people we have young people here tonight and i'm sure you are encountered by young people from time to time and if they say to you i'm interested in a future career which college major l should i choose do you have any advice that you offer to them? >> i say find something you love it will leave you where you want to go. and everyone says it is absolutely true. right if you find something you love to do, work isn't work. you'll never work a day in your life. my grandfather's taught me that. they love their work one was a surgeon grow imof he come home and get down on knees and pray for the patient he had surgery on. he loved his work. man of great peat my grandfather pulled himself up working only
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cars in denver. very humble beginnings he started a law firm during the great depression. great picture of him once now colorado boulevard -- on a donkey with a twin brother going school. dirt road back then. great, with great men own qhiewz shouldsers i stand and i would say do what they did. i followed their footsteps find something you love. and everything else will work out just fine. [applause] one other thing. on that if we have that. this is corny but this is -- speaks to young people and i care about used to teach and i love teaching young people, and i used to teach professionally legal professionalism in ethics now that is not an oxy moron i promise. [laughter] and along these lines to answer your question at the end of the semester i would ask kids to
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spend five minutes writing their obituary how they like it to read now they've snicker at the beginning and probably deserve a few of those. but after five minutes the room was always deadly quiet they have really -- come to greps with the question. and then i ask a few brave souls to read out what they had written and some would. not one of them said i was the richest lawyer in town. or i i had any name on door oi brought in the most clients or i had the fastest car or biggest house every one of them spoke about being useful to their community. to their family their friends, some spoke their faith . and i asked my student do me a favor. hold on to that stick it in your desk drawer. and when you're feeling blue, or you have doubts whereby your life is going, take a look at
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that. ask yourself how you're doing on those metrics the ones that really matter. flesh and i follow that same advice myself. there's encryption on a tombstone ins boston they found in the burial ground and serve many of our founding fathers buried lawyer has now forgotten a beautiful inscription about being dignified in public life official this public life and mild in affectionate at home. that speakses to me. i keep that in my desk drawer and i look at it often. copy of it is in the book. >> i won't ask about your obituary but in closing tech kaidz when historians write about the court and your tenure on the court what do you hope they'll see? >> very little l and that's it how it should be. that's not my again my rule is -- hand down what i found and
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keeping or constitution is hard work we need great men to found it and we need it in civil war great men to keep it. we need good people. we love this country to give tear lives over to it service to keep it for the next generation. and if i'm forgotten, i would say i did my job just right. [applause] on behalf all of us here thank you for this incredible opportunity to spend time with you and thank you for putting together this incredible book which even those of us who barely fit and made it through law school find to be quite useful i'm sure even for more who want to get a great standing of the scootion and its application today. so thank you for making time for that. [applause] thank you so much.
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on author interview program afterwards, the federalist ben interviewed michael malice about far right politics in america. here's a portion of that program. >> absolutely no agreement across this subculture other than who the enemy is and what the nature of the enemy is. there's those who favor in police state, about there are those who are complete anarchist and those who are internationalist in the sense of you know i'll be a citizen the world not in the left sense but don't own to a particular nation and there are those who are ho america first, very proud americans to take our countries back. so across this you're going to have very little agreement other than who you are against and that's what's interesting because the press would like to
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be painted the same and whereas you set down people in the group and say well what do you want? you have some type in favor of returning but the stewart so it shall it is really hilarious when you deal with any subculture, how many different fractions there are and people on the right think that left is and you have hillary and bernie and jill stein they genuinely loathe each other. to watch this and other afterwards pralses in their entirety visit our website, booktv.org. and click on the afterwards tab at the top of the page. booktv continues. next, addresses the issues of immigration, identity, and religion in his latest novel about a nigerian family move to utah. then pulitzer prize winning historian david recount pioneers who settled northwest territory
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and later tonight, advise columnist you gene carol discuss her experiences with sexual assault check your program guide for a complete schedule. >> our interviewer is rebecca carol a cultural editor of special projects at nyyc develop and produces and host a broad array of multiplatform con at the present time including live events, podcast, and revels weekly conversation series on race and culture from morning edition. rebecca is also the author of several interview base book about race and blackness in america including the award-winning sugar and rough. her memoir surviving the white gay is forth coming from simon and schuester she'll be speaking our teacher author and nigerian author and won the prize for american writing in

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