tv Media Coverage of Ferguson Missouri CSPAN October 18, 2014 8:04pm-9:56pm EDT
louis association of black journalists, and the national association of black journalists, my name is rob butler, and i'm the president of the nabj. notes,e of housekeeping we do have a twitter, you can write your questions to us, we also have cards if you question of the end, and we will go to the panel and then we will go to your cards. panel.to introduce our to your far left is mariah stewart, she is a ferguson with huffington post, she started covering ferguson right after her graduation. [applause] mariah is christopher,
rafford, andrred -- his photos have been shown on national television, mr. bradley rayford. and some of you may have already known our last panelist, her social media reports really drove the media coverage, not just locally, but nationally. how many followers did you have on twitter at that time? >> first i started with 1500. and now i have 13 -- 30,000. >> twitter really does work. before theney situation, and she covered
ferguson wallcovering -- while planning for her wedding. , by the way, i was not invited to. >> you could have come. [laughter] >> well, ok. [laughter] of town hall lot meetings here, talking about police, talking about city leaders, talking about voting, talking about not voting, to let me ask you each, your perspective. maria, i will start with you. media did dothe the best we could, well, i know i did, and i know a lot of the people appear did. >> you were out there. you have probably seen some of the coverage of ferguson, did you see any of the coverage, you
were out there a long time. yes, i did to the coverage. the only thing i would have to -- say negative about the media coverage was the view of public officials when it came to press conferences or meetings, some of the reporters, cameramen, were nasty. coverage, as overall i think we did a decent job. chris, you actually directed the of the coverage, but results of the protests, what you think? >> well, i think in many ways, the jury is still out on how the media, how we, covered the ferguson situation. is a wide and ever-growing range of issues. out anasn't just ab
officer and an 18-year-old, certainly it was a fatal shooting, it was an incident -- it may have been a crime -- it was something that may have been a reaction to that, but then what happened, in my view, oh by double all kinds of deeper -- in my view, opened up all kinds of deeper issues, and is fascinating to look at the ways that reactions very, depending on background. everything from the use of proper use of force amongst police to the proper way to is a protest,ere which is a constitutionally protected right, why the way, to assemble and to the titian, and to protest, and all the way to disparity in sentencing, to find, to criminal fines, two small legal matters, this crazy
system you may not be familiar with here. there is something like 80 different court system in -- systems in st. louis county. it is crazy. it is a crazy, unfocused, izedorized -- balkan system within the state. of the get to all issues, but i can get to many of them. and it is certainly important. about your think coverage of ferguson? >> whenever we think how well the media has done, it is clear that most people in st. louis think that the media has done badly. there was a survey the other data shows about 70% of people thought the media had made things worse rather than better. not necessarily
agree with the majority sentiment there, but i agree that some of the things that christopher just finished pointing to our ways in which helped,a has really this includes local, but the national media has really helped to focus on issues, like the bla alkanized core system, police profiling of african-american -- court the need for system, police profiling of african-american citizens, the but the mostlity, important issue, the conversation about race. this town never really has quite actually had, i think. those are way in which i think the media has done well. question, i mean, i have said in some of our
stories what a great job the done, there'shas photographers have brought for just a amazing images, and they are very brave in the way they have covered the story. i have been pretty critical of some of the parachute journalism , there was a new republic reporter the first week who went into a barbecue place and whiteiewed about five folks who had very negative feelings about african-americans, and that was her story about what was going on in st. louis. the new york times had a story the covers,unday of and i think it was called "the circle of rage," in that st. louis was encircled by these segregated suburbs, and it didn't really quite get things right. for example, they portrayed ferguson is having -- as being a
segregated community. at a person i know out of stanford actually pulled out the census statistics that said that ferguson is one of the most integrated communities, if you look at the entire boundaries of the city. i thought that some of the citizen journalist did a really good job, i don't really know if that is even quite the right word, patricia is probably one of them, antonio did a very excellent post, i thought, and they all had a point of view, but they were reporting from the scene. i quoted in the journalism review, i quoted a young journalist named ryan schuessler , who was working for al jazeera america, and he was very put off by the way journalists tended to make the story about themselves. cameramen making jokes about
where michael brown had die, cameramen who were yelling at people in the community to get , thef the way, chris hayes msnbc guy, who was out there with the people, but he was actually behind a wrought iron i thought he had quite a number of good points there. , andwant to go to britney bradley, so bradley. i one of the least experience guys appear. -- don't say that! ok, it was fascinating to watch an international story enfolded front of me. i have never seen so many journalists in one spot in one time. what kind of bothered me a little bit is that we were becoming the story.
the actual story was being overshadowed by how the police were arresting journalists, by how journalists were getting in i think itetimes, so is important from now on that we learn from the situation and that we learn to report the story and not become the story. , like bill said, there is a mixed review from citizens in the area about media coverage locally, and i do believe that the best was done with the resources that they had. with a situation, things can be done differently but the story was unfolding at such a high pace, it was such a difficult thing to please everybody. however, like i said, things can be done differently, so i hope this will be a learning situation, not only for the police, but for the folks in the andnalist industry to learn do things to philly. >> -- do things differently.
>> so britney, you are out there early. you were one of the first people on the scene, right? >> it is really funny in a bradley and i sit next to each other, and he was the and myapher taking my -- photographer was taking my engagement photos, and he said wait a minute, what is this going on? and my fiance say, you are not leaving, and i said i think i am! story bradley and i covering the story, and i think that you hit it straight on. i am not one to really pick sides or anything, but i know it was tougher me not to stay out of it, because i am a reporter, and i can emotionally remove myself from situations, any situation that i cover on a day-to-day basis. but a lot of people thought i
was trying to become the story just because i was putting out so many instagram posts, because i was out there in the mix. my station is a very brand driven station, we are always watching out for you, we are trying to beng and an emotional brand, and when you put that brand into what was an extremely emotional national case, it almost becomes like i am the emotional reporter, so you have to take a look and i have to take a look at myself and how i was covering and how i needed to step back as far as our brand had just, you know, i andlutely was reporting, the people said that reporters were trying to become the story. and to forget, there were reporters who were trying to take this as a claim to fame. vendors out on the
street trying to sell t-shirts, so they are out there trying to make a profit as well. how did the media cover this, did we get it right? it is such a broad question, there are so many media outlets, and i have never seen anything like it, as well. or both of us, it was the biggest story that we have ever covered in our entire careers. i can only look in myself and how i covered it, and what i think i did good and what i think i can improve on, and go from there. >> patricia, you're out there in the middle of a, and you are doing double duty, not just as a public official, but also you were blogging about what you were seeing. so when you look at the national coverage, and -- also, there is also a difference between national coverage and local so from your perspective, how did things go? newshave always been a
connoisseur, i have always been keeping up on what is going on. @patricialicous, and because i get such a diverse view of the news, i read the local, i read the nationals, i look at the international pages, i think it is cute to see you guys been so hard on yourself, but there are so many types of ferguson stories that were covered, and some of them were done well, and some of them were not. toeftly want to give kudos the local coverage of that was here, because i know, just like from myself, that i had to school on a lot of the national media on how st. louis worked. they did not know that. i know that the crisis situation, people just kind of imping, that i would like --
would certainly hope -- in the future, any crisis situation, when the national media comes in, they have to do some homework. that way they can start getting the story right. some people report, and i had to say, no, no, no, you don't understand. they have the state police in a county police mixed up. there is a huge difference on what was going on, and it changed the entire cone of the the coverage continues to go on -- because it -- you can tell which kind of news organizations were reporting, and who was trying to get a right. who was asking the tough questions, who was doing their homework, who was doing the deep digging. as far as coverage of the story, i think that -- i mean, i think there were people who are trying to become part of the story, but the ferguson story is a
violation of first amendment rights. if they don't care about how they treat the media, imagine what they are doing to the people who actually live here. so what is considered being in the way to the police versus to the media versus to the people, and i think that was important. ? up please unlock up national reporters and have them talk about that experience just so they can get a taste of what they are dealing with in this county and what the ferguson police are really like. there may have been some people who projected themselves, but what has really come out of it is some really eye-opening experiences and whoa, what is going on out there? what is all of this anger all about? just thecame not shooting of a young man and leaving his body out in the street for foreign a half hours, it became the under's -- for
four and a half hours, it became more than that. dirtyame st. louis laundry. this is not new to anybody who is living there. >> mic ring you saying that we should not have been surprised that we were seen journalist arrested -- am i hearing you say that we should not have been surprised that we were seen journalist arrested, is that what i am hearing you say? >> that is exactly what i am saying. >> i have never been threatened by arrest. one time a police officer came up to be, but that he saw my microphone on, and i think that is what saved me, but you are saying that this is not a surprise. are quite brazen and they do not appreciate and respect authority.
see you guys get a dose of what it is like and see for yourself. you think so? >> i was very surprised. i knew some of the reporters who got arrested. yeah, it to be back. i turn on the news, and i was like, what? what is that? >> i think the original story covered a lot more deeper stories. not only was this kid shot by a police officer, now you have the the police towards the citizens that pay their salaries. no you have the response of the police toward the media people who cover the stories, and now you have the response -- now you haven't covered the racial undertones in st. louis. this uncovered so many more stories that went beyond michael brown.
this was all because of mike brown. >> i have mentioned this before, did the media sometimes drives the protests. when a tv camera shows up and when a microphone doesn't, people goes crazy -- people go crazy. that thomashe night the tank engine showed up in the middle of it selling something, and some local well-known homeless advocate and minister showed up to raise money, and i am not sure if it was for the t-shirts being sold, yeah, absolutely, there were a lot of people trying to manipulate the media. and me in the media, and i think we can all agree on this, we hate eating a part of the story. that is not white we are there. it is not part of our goal. even the thought that we would be a part of the story just makes us extremely and comfortable. but the phenomenon that you
describe is undoubtedly accurate. and it will continue to be accurate. camera orl see the the notebook with a microphone, and they will act in a way that they would not otherwise have acted. and that is unfortunate. >> you know, i agree with christopher, that in general, reporters don't like to be the center of the story. but, i have to admit, i have the same reaction that bradley was describing earlier, that reallyes reporters were happy to make themselves part of the story. the day that those two guys were mcdonald's, ie had really divided feelings. because on the one hand, i felt the police in general at that point and the way they were handling the protests and the way they were handling reporters were up by lady the first amendment, on the other hand, i felt as though -- i looked up a huffington post, and it said
world war iii headlines about these two guys getting arrested after they basically refused to donalds on police orders. i mean, suddenly, the story was about those two guys. i found that sort of offensive, to be honest. like at that point the story took off. it should of taken off when it was saying something about race in st. louis, not about two reporters who got themselves arrested at a mcdonald's. >> any questions from the audience, you can tweet to @fur esonmedia, and do it has a cards?- do we have some we have a question? nationallked about
versus local media. how much do you think this would have been -- how much less of violence do you think there would have been if it was just the local media? do you think the national media drives this? arrive, itg boys changes things. now you have the big trucks, congrats crowds, the fixers, everything. >> it was local at first. the national media's attention was social media. cameis where your story from. so to see the tweets and the the videos that were out there, you can't help but be like, oh my gosh, what is going on? they came out there, they were live streaming, what was going on at night, the reporters and the photojournalists, we were all out there running together
and it was amazing. first, locals were there and the response was through social media. that is what got a big. not forget, what tipped me off even about the story, as i was not even at work when i found out, it was social media. it was not reporters, it was people who had seen this -- seen these images, they were all over instagram and all over twitter, so it really is not just local media that has started this whole thing, it really is how social media really took a part of the story. were you can also quickly, and the news had not even come on yet. >> i believe that picture of mike brown lane on the ground with blood on the street, and daddad with the sun -- his
with the sign saying his son had been executed by the ferguson police department, you cannot miss that, no matter who you are. you knew somebody who knew somebody who share this picture. you could not avoid seeing a those pictures, so, the fact that those pictures were out there made those stories bigger than they were now. and theret the video, were other people who lived in the neighborhood who were out who are still instagram and still on facebook and they are still capturing these moments that we miss while we were sleeping, i mean, local media did their best to cover the story, but i think people in the area and in st. louis quickly picked up on that and shared it with the world. shift --e seen a because remember, the used to be a time when there was a big story, it would be on page one
and that is why i like working in the radio, you can get a story on the air arediately by telephone -- we seeing a shift, in fact, how much pressure is there to get it on the web as soon as possible? , intense pressure for all of us. right, iine, you are am old enough to remember, when i started in this business you had a deadline and it was probably around 5:00 or 6:00, and you could take your time and get everything right, double check everything, rewrite it, submitted again, and then go home, and then the story still does not go out until 6:00 the next morning. those days are long gone. deadlines are all the time. here is a point that i want to make about this. trisha is exactly right. and she was one of those people,
by the way, who is getting the word out on x -- out on social media. was is not a metaphor, she doing it. she was tweeting and taking photographs and sending them out that is a huge element, and it is much different than it was. however, if you just got your term and i use the loosely, about ferguson from social media, you would have quickly seen things of that were just not right. in fact, not only were they not right, they were dead wrong. was a rumor that was spread, like wild fire again, rather world again, literally, that a police officer in question had suffered a fractured eye socket. you probably saw that, right? and someone mocked up a fake picture put it on twitter, right? we never ran a word of that
until we could track it down, and we found out it was false. we were very happy that we had not had done that. the difference there is the journalist -- and i know there jb journalists, young, --rt, inspiring journalists you have to save us here, our society that has this trend of just spreading rumors and just breading opinions about things. and not getting to the fact. because traditional journalism, as wizened and is sprinkled as it seems to be, it still holds the tradition that the most important thing is the truth. so you don't report things that you jesse on twitter. you going you check it out. and you figure it out. and you check your facts. because you are still competing against all of those folks. so it is fascinated does he how
it developed and how will continue to do so. >> the citizen response to the media presence was acceptable -- exceptional, so what is that say about the desperation of citizens to have eyes on a dire situation? um, i guess a citizen don't think- i, i, a citizen journalist is going to look at a story or something happening the same way that i would, because i'm in search of the truth, i am impartial, i am taking my feelings and my emotions out of this, and i'm just trying to find out what happened and how to get those answers, and i don't think -- i think citizen journalist -- i think they can answer their own
emotions, and then their job and my job are very different, to me. >> that was the next question. what makes someone a journalist? because we hear from citizen journalists all the time. those of us who went to school for journalism -- and some of the purest say, if you went to school for, it doesn't matter. i do believe in that. you tell the real story, that is a good question though. that is a very good question, what makes a journalist? but i believe the fact that you want to tell a story from the perspective that is not your own. i, i i think i agree. we don't want to be so exclusive about who gets to qualify for the club of being a journalist,
that we turn up our noses at citizen journalists who, i do know, maybe -- maybe they are recording events from a buterent point of view, um, still, if you are trying to figure out what was going on in thestreets of ferguson, knights of all of the protests thell the right, you -- tweets of antonio french and patricia were really crucial to figuring that out. we had killed the proud -- kelsey proud putting together all of the most responsible tweets that they found from patricia from antonio french, from dispatch, from photographers who were on the
scene, from st. louis public radio, from reporters on the scene, and really to get the whole picture, it required the eyewitness accounts of all of those folks. i mean, i asked her trisha before i came out of your -- i said, are you a journalist or are you a politician? and she say, both. [laughter] >> i think before the days of twitter and facebook, the people we would the considering citizen would be the people that would come to us for stories. citizen journalism evolved from a need to have another perspective. reporters, in order to do their job, they have to have some kind of relationship with a person or the entities that they are reporting on.
sometimes, everything is not told, so there are other people who say they do not have anything to lose, and i am going to put it out there, and what i have to lose? and it is a different kind of reporting, and sometimes, different things cannot be told at the time that it happens with journalists because of those relationships. so it is a kind of a balance the hit, and i think that that is important in giving people the full picture of the story. it is the voice that they would not have before. unrest, ihe night of would to the post-dispatch that state to read the accounts, and often the chronology of the story was based on statements and what the police said. were just, the events not factual. for example, statements are when police moved on, when they fired there,s, and having been
the repetition of these falsehoods was disconcerting. didn't the police department have somebody on the scene those late nights? why were those police statements taken a police value -- face value? >> i can try to address that. that is a good question. why do we does public police say in the paper? whaty don't we just put police say in the paper? i have been asked that many times. policed to ask the questions, but you do not need to take it at face are you, you don't just have to believe it. that is like asking a politician a no offense, patricia -- question and putting it down a walking away. it can't do that. however, when there is an
incident and it involves police and a reporter was not there, the reporter must check with police or the reporter is not doing his or her job because the police were there. that does not mean the police are going to tell the truth. and we know that over the years, sometimes in certain crucial situations, and sometimes police don't lie, but they don't quite tell the truth. beyond just the official statement. seelook on twitter and you with the photos what people are actually taking them putting up, that is a piece of evidence. that is a testimony. that is an eyewitness account. an ethical think journalist takes all of these factors and figures this out in the time allotted. and that is the key phrase. allotted."
we do the best we can. that is an old saying, journalism is the first rough draft of history. and that is exactly right. papernot what is on the or online right now, or any other number of websites and news organizations. it is not necessarily the total story. in fact, it isn't the total story. that it is the best that we can do for now. >> another question. there are a variety of examples with how the media trays suspects -- portrays suspects killers, and is there any way to stop these kinds of per trails -- portrayals? how recon bagels stereotypes in the media -- how are we
combating those stereotypes in the media? i for myself -- for myself -- think you noticed that, i do believe it is an oversight, most of the time. don't think often of the words are used to describe certain people and certain situations, but i do believe that it is up to the people who are watching and viewing those particular avenues of media, whether it is online, broadcast, or even on social media. it is important for those used to be spoken up, it is oftentimes, media only cover stories or produce material that they think people want to see. if i am the editor of a paper or a news director of a tv station, i'm going to try to provide for
my community, and in my community is saying that black or we describe black people as being a way worse than goinge suspect, that is to happen because people are speaking up, otherwise that is immaterial. remember coming you do have a voice. during the ferguson coverage, we were literally out there nonstop, 20 for hours a day, until many i've our viewers t else isut that, wha going on st. louis? towe looked at our newscast figure out how to make it more neutral, and that is because viewers called in an e-mailed us and shared their opinions with us. >> this is a question along the same lines.
black men whoese are unjustly murdered, hawaii was a michael brown the flashpoint of media concern -- but why was michael brown the flashpoint of media concern? i'm also local i am also national, and that when you have pictures and a community out there taking photos and putting them on social media, and it becomes a story, i mean, the first word that we got was a guy trying to give himself up and saint doshi, and he was shot six times. that is the kind of story that they to say wait a minute. say wait aes you minute. that's what makes it a national story, in my view. say that itng to was the latest in a series of all of these other events, and i
that four and a half hours he was allowed to lie on the street, and that was not required by any police procedures, so i think those were two factors that made a blossom into this big story. made is a bigt national and international story was the fact that it was an unarmed black teenager shot by a white guy. that is from my perspective. he was also laying on the ground for about four and a half hours. you have the response from social media, and then you have police response and the people's response so all of those things made this an international story in that order. think? you you are a young journalist is getting into the business. what is your thought on this?
a st. louis has always been hostile environment between police and citizens. everyone has the story. you go to these town hall meetings, everyone has a story to tell or they know somebody who has been directly affected either this relationship here. so everyone was emotionally attach when it finally happened here. and it has happened here before. upuess people were bottled and is broken loose. like bradley said, the reaction that this community had come that is what this put this story -- what put this story over the top. i talked to some protesters who said that if trayvon martin , we would've done the same thing. why hasn't the media
identified this excessive police brutality as a failure of different systems? we know that there is trouble with police all across the country, i know we have seen it. i -- i am not sure if it is because of defining -- declining systems? >> this is something -- they are -- may i say? something? i think whatever responsibility in the media to cover the stories, and people know it the power of the words that they use. i am not going to let anyone get away with something that they don't understand regarding how blacks are per trade in this media, we know the power of words, i remember about a year or so ago, a station said they were going to stop using the "on "on the northside," or
the southside," when describing a murderer. -- was that the post-dispatch? they said that they were going to give the street address now so people could figure it out on their own. i think a black media, they have several stories about excessive force and police brutality. voices in theose mainstream media and in the editorial rooms and writing a lot of the op-ed's, we are not going to hear about of excessive force or police brutality. but in our neighborhood, our police station will -- our radio
station will. >> i was a reporter that was ways saying "police are ioking for a man," and when talk with my police contacts, one of the officer said, "brittany, we are looking for this black eye, i want you to -- guy, i want you to put that description out. i don't want you to sugarcoat it. this is what i looking for. and this is what i need to look out for. if we are going to be on the same team, we need to look to work together. " you are i respect what say, i believe there is another side to that story. if i want to talk about
something, i want to make sure that i have a plan to change what i am talking about, so, a lot of times there is often not enough african-americans applying for police jobs, there are not enough african-americans applying for elected positions, there are not enough african-americans applying to media jobs, definitely. if we want to -- if the voice of the african-american community to beto be heard, it has african-americans who stand up and be the voice. nabj is very big on diversity in the media. not just on the air, but also behind the scenes, because your media coverage is not determined by the reporter on the field, it is decided by the news managers. i can tell you in st. louis, on the last report on media diversity in the media rooms, there was almost none.
can think of most one person who was an executive producer and -- >> she is gone. >> she is gone, so now there is nobody. 's missions,of najb is to improve this for african americans and african american journalist. when i look on tv, the last stations,looked at tv and 12% of the news management soe people of cover your it that is african-american, latino, and native american, that is just 12%. i have no problem if you have no diversity in your newsroom if there is no diversity in town, if you have a white town and you have nobody in color -- nobody
of color on your staff, i'm not going to saving. but if you have a large african-american population and you have nobody of color on your staff, that is something in these to be talked about. there are a lot of questions coming in. thank you very much. i think this is one story. two stories emerged after the story -- shooting and its aftermath. the story of a man who had his skull crushed, and this came from fox, and now we are told that six young black men were killed in 18 hours after michael brown was killed, and the stories were not reported. we are did these stories come from, is the story concerning six killings and urban myth? did michael brown suffer a crushed orbital eye socket?
i heard that too and i do not know the answer to that. no, i think that is referring to the officer. >> darren wilson. that thewas rumors of officer suffered a crushed eye socket after the conflict with michael brown. somebody went to the extent of getting an x-ray of somebody else, somebody else's eye socket, and when out there and saying that this was the officer's. six black men killed in the 18 hours, i have not heard that. i do not believe that that is true. i know that we write about every homicide that occurs in the st. louis area. lottimes we don't write a about everyone, but we write about everybody and we keep a count, and it is definitely part of the news report, and i am
sure that others do the same thing. i don't think that is the truth. after thember right shooting, maybe like the day after, there was a lot of rumors floating around social media that somebody else had gotten killed? every time we got between and we would go to that location, and there is nothing there, sorry, false alarm guys. so it might have just been rumors circulating again on social media. >> and it is a six black man, and it did not say where. this brings up another issue. the officer. some of the put his address at his house on the air. right or wrong? >> wrong. kfpk did and they apologized. i think they put the officer potentially endanger. that is my opinion.
-- in danger. that is my opinion. shona house and not by the ever so, with that have been -- had they shown his house and not his address, would that have been appropriate? mean, i love to get justice for things, and justice for me is doing something that is just. but that is not doing something that is just by's showing -- by showing his house or his personal belongings. so that is wrong. >> i have covered a lot of officer-involved shootings, and i don't know any officer who took part in a shooting or fired a shot, because that never relates. was amber there discussion in this newsroom, are we even going to report this?
and so, you know, going so far is to find his house and stuff, even his name coming out was, you know, something for us. -- i think his name almost had to come out. everybody knew who he was. i knew who he was. people were telling me who the police officer was when i got there. i even had the media wanting me to confirm, and i would not confirm the officer's name, but everybody in the community already knew the officer's name. i think it is really important that the name come out. as much as i think it is wrong to take a picture of his house, i think it is absolutely important that his name come out and i think his name should have come out sooner. in cincinnati, we had a lot of problems about 12 years ago where there was a similar kind of shooting of a white officer shooting an african-american young man. one of the things that they have is that they immediately
released the name of the officer who was doing -- who was involved in the shooting of a citizen. i think that is the way it should be. >> i think in oakland and in san francisco, they released the name. i know that -- i was reading the nationalone of media -- or maybe was facebook, i don't know -- and it was about the post-dispatch trying to find out whether or not michael brown had a juvenile record, and they did a pra for that. is that correct? >> yeah, it is absolutely correct. one of the things that we did and we continue to do is to find out everything we can find out tragedy, incident, the and what happened, and also the ramifications that we are talking about. so in the course of that, we have launched an incredibly robust effort.
i mean, almost everybody in our newsroom, and i think we are still the largest newsroom in a st. louis region, and all most everybody in our newsroom in some way has been involved in reporting what happened to michael brown, what were the cause it was his, what happened afterwards, and all of the various trails of the story that we have been talking about. one of those -- one of those pursuits was reported because of one of those false rumors. one of those false rumors floating around and being spread around on social media was that michael brown at the time of his death eighth some kind of homicide charge. i think it was second-degree murder. it was a very specific and very false, i might add, murder -- rumor. we never reported that. but upon figuring it out, we realize that michael brown was 18-year-old when he was killed. not open.le system is it is not typically open.
was the person is no longer alive, their records tend to be released. so we quite routinely, as part of our journalistic effort to figure out everything we can hey,e out, went and said we want to see every record that brown,on michael and we were told no, you cannot do that. we would do that every week, at least every month, and we filed a lawsuit, no, actually the law says that you need to release that, this is public information. just like that officer, it is public information and it needs to be released, and i will tell you a story about the name of the officer in a minute -- so we were not trying that. we were not trying to do or warp -- two besmirch the story, we are just trying to find the truth. and so that was part of it. now i will tell you the story about the officer.
we're talking about how it took them a couple of name day -- couple of days to release the officer. aboutow what we found out the name after it had been released? incredible he, his name had disappeared from the internet. found out that it's like he never existed. now that's interesting. how did that happen? i don't know for a fact, but somebody within their and swept out the information from various websites. you can employ a company to do that. and we strongly suspect that that is what happened. that is right, if that is what happened, and if it is what happened, and we find out about it, we are going to definitely report it. >> when i expect you are doing a pra for all expenditures during -- a public august
records act for all spending that was done by ferguson the month of august, would that show it? >> oh, absolutely. >> >> i do believe -- from any situation from a pr perspective -- you want to cover yourself. to say that ferguson did not do a cover up, to deny that -- any kind of situation you are going to have to make yourself a little bit better. it is fact. they cannot deny that. any person that does their job right npr will make ferguson
look better. there is definitely a cover-up that is going to be exposed. >> in the lawsuit regarding the juvenile record -- is there any juvenile record? >> we are not even sure that there is a juvenile record. must be clear. had said we will not release the record, but we will tell you that he did not face a major felony. in fact, he did not face as an -- he wasuvenile never charged with felonies. there were lesser crimes that he might have been charged with. they are continuing to keep that secret. >> have they done the same thing for the officer? chargese any other against him? any other allegations against
him? >> the one thing that is on this record that they have made public is that he won an award. that is out there. we have a team of investigative reporters, and among the chief task is to find this out. they will continue to work it. the 80 inch story last sunday was a story of how it was that michael brown's body lay there minutes,hours and 15 according to the official records. that was a product of the investigative team. the previous sunday we had a lengthy story on the front page, and it was talking about witnesses who saw the actual shooting, and how they described it here he we worked on getting those witnesses for weeks, trying to convince them to talk to us. these efforts are going on. we are not stopping. we are continuing.
>> we have a question that comes up on twitter. it has to do with talking about michael brown being accused of strong arm robbery. why was it labeled "strong arm robbery?" video asked from the though he was pushing the store owner. correct the police put it out there. >> i think it means the weapon was not used. strong-armed versus armed. strong-armed means with a physical presence, there was not a gun or knife. >> you were going to say something before. that -- i was say mad with you guys for going after the juvenile record. -- i'm not going to
say you -- as they were trying to dig up dirt. they cleaned the officers record. michael brown and his family did not have that opportunity. to go and try and get a record that is closed just because he --dead to make him look like it did not sit well. it came out really bad. i don't know if that is something moving forward that kid,e -- what you did as a that is what you did as a juvenile. that should be closed. any records, we need to take a look at that. [applause] robbery,rong-armed using that term "strong-armed robbery" -- that might be the
legal definition. there wasems like this attempt to make what happened in that store more than what it was. it had nothing to do with why he was shot. it comes off as another smear attempt. that outraged the community at a tremendous level. that was extremely a responsible. that is when people called for chief since job. jackson's drop -- job. >> it would be unethical to -- or to change the terms used by the police department. department put out
a report that it was a strong-armed robbery, it is the job to report facts. potential police report that says there was a strong-armed robbery that happened, you have to report that. it is up to the people watching that -- you see the video. just because you see the words strong-armed robbery does not mean you have to see that as a strong-armed robbery could you have the option to have your own opinion about it. as far as people in the media who have to do what their training says -- to be non-partial -- >> i'm going to play devil's advocate. we have been saying this over and over, we are in search of truth. people are asking is what's happening, what's going on, what don't we know. this is not adding up. we don't know what led up to --s, but we know right now
and the reporters kept asking the police, what happened? we cap asking that. -- an never forget interview outside in the park -- we were like, why are you telling us this? but she said, well, you guys asked for it. we were going to hold it, but you are asking for it. thenot saying that was right decision. my job is to find the answers, to find out what happened, to what led up to what he was doing earlier in the what police knew that we did know. was everybody happy with what they found out? no. i'm just playing devil's advocate. >> i thought the way in which the police handled the release of that video with a poor. obvious he trying to play wilson --r officer
they were just trying to drag michael brown -- make him look bad. on the other hand, i think it is potentially relevant to what happened. ifdepends on whether we know officer wilson knew about the robbery at the time that he and michael brown heather altercation. one way and the other as well. that, it know about goes to the state of mind -- it and to wilson state of mind michael brown state of mind -- it could be relevant. it could end up in a court trial. >> michie says he did not know about the robbery before. i remember asking him. >> that she said at the time
that wilson first told brown to get out of the street, that he did not know about it. time heated that by the the time the altercation occurred, and this is the reason that wilson had backed up and further engaged in. i am saying there are different accounts. the account about him knowing about it, if it is true, then it is potentially relevant information. >> i think it is important for citizens to be involved in government or any kind of civil job, because the video was released. the initial story was that the officer and counted michael brown because of the video. the retraction was made that he did not know about it. that shows you that cannot be too trusting of certain things.
at face to take things value, but maybe you research beyond what is told to you. you have to be your own researcher. dissect to be ready to what is told to you. don't take things in you. a lot of times, people have allowed the media to be the voice. that is true. at the same time, you have your own voice, all mind own ability to find out about things. if you want to know what happened in north st. louis, do your own research and find out what really happened. >> have they released the police audio? that is what i heard. they released the video. then they said, he did not know about the robbery. later he did know about it. had they released the police radio calls or the 911 calls? there is no indication that the police radio was recorded.
we don't know if that existed what was released was a guy was making a recording for his lady , and in the course of romantic recording, it happened at the moment of shooting. heard the gunfire. that is reputed to be that shooting. i cannot tell you for sure that that is what that is. i did see reports that someone had authenticated it. i am not sure. is -- what you call it -- , because itue to it shows that there were two different burst of gunfire. that is interesting. there was a burst, pause, and another burst. the bullets came fast, boom,
boom, boom. it does that mean the opus or is guilty or innocent. it is interesting. it is information. may i get back to patricia? she was expressing her anger and frustration at our decision, and i heard other people agreeing with that, that anger. i want to say, i hear you. i would never try to talk you out of your feelings about something that we did that you feel is wrong. that is your feeling. that is valid. i'm not arguing, ok? i will say this. if we start deciding what kind of information the public should never really see, the careful. -- the careful. who decides in the end what the information the public does not see. guess what, it is the government. you start to say, don't let them see that. what you're actually saying is,
don't let us see that. then they can say, we will not release the name of the place of -- police officer. this is what government was to do. this is the natural inclination of government, to keep stuff secret, because it makes them look bad. or they are afraid that it will make them look bad. what we want to do is get the information out. i'm not negating your feelings about that. i am just trying to explain where we come from on that issue. also think there is a time and place to release information, and sometimes it is out into the public, and other times it should be done through the the proper processes. what inns up happening is that you dirty the potential jury pull. people are watching the news. when they get called to jury duty, they are already shown whether it is relevant or not.
there is a time and a place for need to go and we through the proper channels for some of those things. that way we don't mess the -- mess up. had hada officer wilson four complaints in the last six months. i am making this up. this is not true. i am making this up. don't put this on twitter. pretend that officer wilson had faced for different complaints of using excessive force in the last six months. lets just say the police department decided to -- that that information could poison the jury that his hearing that case. we better keep that secret. after all, we want to be fair. that would be a complete injustice to keep that secret. that might be relevant. do you see what i'm saying? >> we are talking apples and oranges. a juvenile record that is closed
, while somebody is living, should not be open just because they are dead, and shown to the public. >> another question coming. a ton of questions appear. there is a lack of trust between the public and the police, but also between the public and the media. how does this coverage change that relationship? will anything change this dynamic between the public and the media? >> the coverage has not change the public's mind much. they think the media has been, according to this poll, they think the media has hurt more than help. we have a long way to go to make people think we are doing a good job. >> i will say it again.
you have the power to control what you see. if you are not liking what is going on, you can do something about it. >> i saw a question on twitter that i want to ask. it had to do -- i don't want to get it wrong. where does your integrity come -- i got to find a question i can ask. i panelist mentioned the role of social media in the national story. twitter #on ferguson showed a spike when the washington post -- at what point in the narrative of mike brown's death and following arrest to the story truly become national? did the treatment of reporters
spark national coverage? we have already cover that. they let him lie on the ground for foreign half hours. six times. for -- i understand the coverage is still continuing. i don't see much more national coverage on it. >> i still get press calls. i want people to know that the say the world, i the world is still interested in how we are doing. while everyone has left, i get , whetherry other day it is from national reporters or international reporters, wanting to know what is going on. guess it is not blared across screen and on twitter all
the time now. people are checking in. i don't want people to get the impression that the media once to get their pictures and have taken off. is the next that? when you guys doing? how did the council meeting go? next protest that is plan? the interest is still here. it does not feel like much after what we have been through. us to startto see moving forward from this. with huffington post is to continue coverage on ferguson. as you know, ferguson is the case study of america. national media has learned about. the big news people are gone. there still needs to be coverage on it. i will continue it. will be there. we will see what happens. we need to know how ferguson changes after the verdict, after everything, so that every city in america that is going to this
can no what to do when it happens, or how to heal. >> i don't think this is a story that will die down soon. just to give you a look into my life as a reporter. i am a general assignment reporter. every morning we are taking a look at what is happening in the city, and it is the bigger story -- today i was doing a double shooting outside a church. for that community, that was the big story of the day. that does not mean that i'm losing sight of what is going on and ferguson. i'm keeping berry close tabs on what's happening. are keeping me updated. i'm still following everything. if tomorrow i need to be in ferguson, then i will be in ferguson. if the other story is something else, i get it. i'm willing to do that. >> i don't think this story is going to die down. just last week, there were all
sorts of segments on national public radio about the actions to try to change the way fines are given out. there were several stores in the washington post about the handling of the grand jury. i think the national focus is there. inc. of all the stories out there still to do. there will be all the developments in the criminal case. whether there is an indictment. if there's an indictment, there is a trial. there is a federal investigation. the attorney general has announces pattern and practice. the investigation will go on for months about police practices. -- that is on the police end of things. what about the whole big issue of race? don't we want to look at the schools? coincidence that one of the school districts
wasn't unaccredited school district from which michael brown graduated. we are doing everything we can be doing in those schools to educate our students. there are a million related stories. >> i just realize this. in my story today, all the people i interviewed were people that had come from ferguson and moved to get away from the protests. now they are living in riverview , and there is a double shooting. at the beginning of my package, i'm talking about ferguson. ferguson was still coming up to the newscast. it is not going to die down soon. >> this is a question for christopher. how does the media educate the public about where to go to get a fair and unbiased, nonpartisan
news coverage? about the false reports found online and social media? what are you doing to reach young audiences who consume their news on social media? >> that is a great question. it is a complex one. we can talk a lot about it. seen insay that we have our society in the last five journalismtional challenged. mainly for economic reasons. the business model of journalism, i'm sorry to use the coarse language, but it is in crapper. o young people, there is an increasing tendency to say that if there is big news, it will finally. my friends will link to it. it will come to me.
we react? do one, i would say the most important thing we can do is reaffirm our principles of ethical, traditional journalism. reaffirm the search for truth. are thehat is left blowhards on fox news who want theive their opinion, and other people are the blowhards on msnbc, then where are the facts. how do you find out what is real? there has got to be for our society a place to go for actual information, radio station, television station, a news website, etc.. like public radio, like the post-dispatch, they exist to provide that unbiased information. we are trying to get much better on twitter and facebook. as i said a minute ago, that is where people expect to find
their news. they don't want to go searching for. it needs to be there for them -- wheny wanted in late they want it instantly. we push it out there. we push it out on facebook and twitter. -- learnay this it what we are doing great you don't have to agree with that. you can be angry about it. i totally get it. i'm thrilled that you're angry about something we did. that is good. you care. you are in it for you are living this life. that is what we have to do. >> this is for bradley. -- theire point of view -- thisoint you made mindset is why citizens are blaming -- i don't get that.
is --you mean that that you say it is not up to you to factheck the media -- check the media. i disagree with that. it means you are a person who is easily controlled. it is not up to the media to always backcheck. i tell you the bathroom is on fire. are you going to believe that? are you going to go and try to find out? it is up to you to not only check things, but also get it from a different perspective. >> it is a relationship. you grow a relationship with a reporter or news station. you have a trusted relationship.
i know they will give me the facts. if you feel passionately about that, then you are fine. if you see something randomly on twitter, and you don't know who this person is, who tweeted it, if the picture is accurate, maybe you do need to do a little digging. >> i wanted to give one example. ,he fourth night of tear gas they said it is not teargas. there were people like me and other people out there saying, no, we know what teargas is great we have experienced it. this is the fourth night. these are not smoke bombs. this is teargas. this is a lie. this is not right. all of a sudden, the story changed. there is a place for citizen journalism and people using social media to say no, you did not get that right. usyou have police telling
that it is not teargas. you are going to report what you think is true. that is why it is important for you guys to fact check. the police are saying it is to guess, and the media is saying teargas, and you are out there saying hey, it is to guess. call the station and say that this is what it is. you only have to smell that sweet smell of tear gas wants to know it is teargas. do media outlets allow readers to comment on stories? there is a history of racist comments on any stories involving african-americans? . >> i completely agree with the premise of that story. some commentators clearly have opinions that they need to keep
to themselves. i wish they would. that, we allow comments on stories. that includes some comments that this me off. i don't get to pick and choose the comments i like. i don't have time to do that. some stories of a thousand comments on them. we don't have the personnel to go through them. however, abusive behavior and program -- profanity, we try to get rid of those. is a tough question. do they affect our editorial decisions about what we cover and how we cover it? absolutely not. >> i would disagree with you. newspaper has a responsibility to take the racist comments off. it has every ability to do that. if they don't have enough people to do it, then hire some more people.
>> i would agree with that. if somebody is being blatantly racist, i would love to live at all. we do that. we have people tonight who have killed how many? 10,000 all comments? ap don't want to see that crsap on our website. the reason to kill it off is not just because i disagree. when you get antisocial behavior, i agree. after donald sterling had his rant, and i was interviewed, and they asked me if i think it is a problem. it is absolutely a problem. there was a time when it was not politically correct to put the n word out there.
for their race, gender, or sexual preference. social media has changed that. people can hide behind a false , and i thinkunt people's true feelings come out. when people tell me wait -- we are in a post-racial society, i say reader comments. >> we do force people to use the real names. we don't let people just have a pay name or no name to comment. i guess those people are proud of the racist comments. what exactly do the images of the convenience store show? do generals believe the robbery took place or something else? some people are saying that that may or may not be michael brown.
i think maybe that is where that comment may have been coming from. was people say, no, he wearing different socks. how did he have the time to leave the store -- or different shoes and socks -- how did he have the time to have a different pair of shoes? i think that is where the question was coming from. i heard that a lot, is that even him? i have heard that being asked. >> national media has been more aggressive in covering underlying issues that local media failed to cover, why? is true.ot sure that >> i disagree with that. what happens is -- i took a great look at the stories that we have run concerning ferguson, michael brown, and the associated events since august 9. what is today? the 17th. we have written something like
250 polling stories, and we have published more than 200 photographs in the newspaper. thousandad more than a photographs, videos, etc. online. we are just getting started. like i just said, the last two sundays -- sunday, if you are , that iss paper reader are showcased a clear that is where we put our best work. we give its a lot of space and attention. the michael brown story continues to be our focus on sundays. it will continue to be for the foreseeable future. >> this is regarding michael brown -- not michael brown, darren wilsons police and family . they say wilson was nearly beaten to death. i remember seeing a couple of weeks ago -- there was somebody
who talk to him and gave an account of what actually happened. the media play this up. this was on the national cable channels. i forget who this person was. it was a friend of michael brown. it was a secondhand account of what happened that day. are you responsible for putting that on the air when you don't know who this person is? they could be making it up. >> you are talking about darren wilson. woman who talk to a female friend of darren wilson. it is already thirdhand. i don't -- i guess i don't really think that it is responsible to use that. i was reading it because -- at that point, we did not have any
kind of idea at all about what the police account was. i credit for background information. i don't think that writing a -- wouldut that was have been responsible. if you're going to write that story, you have to say that this withoutrdhand account firsthand knowledge. i think it is a pretty good rule for journalist just it with what they can figure out firsthand. report ank to unofficial tweaked or retreat -- retweet. >> i think it is important. you can if it is true. >> how you prove it was true? >> let say michael brown was
wearing a red shirt the day he was shot. that is a tweet. if you look at pictures and videos and see that he was not wearing a red shirt, that is how you do it. a tweet or instagram make it me off, but then i will try to investigate it. there would be times where i ret weeted somebody because i trusted them. >> they can be wrong. first firstthe place that news is reported. almost all of the news about what was going on ferguson was first reported in a tweet.
i got the idea of how powerful it is. aboute a pedestrian story why they could not order wilson to be arrested. with 100,000 hits. tweets or call for two magnifying power of journalism. >> this is a question i have myself. what coverage or action will take place if there is no indictment? will the media and politicians pursue this? is, will youi have have noticed when the indictment is coming down? , and they have
pushed it off to january after the election, right? >> there are so many unknowns .ight now it is not even responsible to speculate what can happen. i don't want to think that he is not going to -- just from what , there should be enough to have a trial. i don't want to assume that any rioting is going to start again. there are people on both sides who will be upset regardless if he gets an indictment or does not. we don't know what will happen. we don't know where people will come from. we don't know how they will be feeling. it has been hard to try to think of a contingency plan for what if, because you cannot plan for everything. is on the minds
of just about everybody who cares about the public safety. we are going to different scenario analyses. we are trying to be prepared for anything. >> i just register or yesterday that if there is no indictment, he is going to release the transcripts and audio of the grand jury with approval of the judge involved. he will do that immediately. that is. that is highly unusual. i don't know that it will convince anyone. i'm sorry? was how areion people supposed to trust the transcripts. >> there will be transcript and audio. at some point, you have to trust something.
generally, court reporters to provide accurate accounts of wheres said in trials they are recording. that is what would happen. thenere is an indictment, an interesting question is, maybe the judge would open the two tv. dean at the university law school says, that would be a good idea. there will be that potential backup. i don't know if the combination of the transcripts of the grand jury and the audio the grand on the promise of the federal government to pursue the case will be -- keep people from
wanting to be out in the streets. know -- even we though the grand jury is extended to january. dass -- the patch aboutispatch had a story the grand jury yesterday predicted wrapup before january the >> who else? what they have said is that they are putting -- and this is controversial in itself -- they are putting all the potential witnesses, video, and everything in front of the grand jury and letting the grand jury make a decision. them withot providing a narrative, here is what happened, that you would normally expect a prosecutor to do with the grand jury. ,here are some people who say like a washington post, list --
columnist, who says this is a fix. any prosecutor who wanted to get an indictment would be providing a narrative and honing the facts in a way to get the indictment. then again, i talked yesterday to a guy who used to -- david rosen -- prosecute police cases. he think it's a good idea that they let the grand jury here on the evidence. apparently he will provide more legal guidance at the end of the grand jury once all that maduro is before them. that is the back-and-forth of it. >> when the curfew was in effect , most supporters went into the press playpen, a roped off area far from the action. can you talk about this? >> we did not all caps lie with it.
comply with it. there were a lot of times that i did go there. there are some reporters who wanted to be in the savior -- safe area. that is where our equipment is. that did not stop us from going down into the neighborhoods and getting the story. >> the reference to after midnight, the reason why i stayed there is because i don't have a lawyer. police have guns and tear gas. stay in the media area. as a student, you don't want to
be arrested. a similarthrough experience. i was not connected to a major organization yet. i did not have a press pass. all i remember is a policeman saying i cannot help you if you are out of those ropes. i was scared. i did not know what was going to happen to me. >> if it is after midnight, and there is a curfew and your outside the media area, the first amendment will not give you from getting arrested. -- i did not a year to the curfew. adhere to the curfew. other journalists were. because the juicy story was when they put you guys in the
pen. >> i believe that was a police tactic. it is obvious. they were exposing some of the police actions. they said hey, why not put them all in an area away from the action so they cannot report. >> ferguson avenue by the mcdonald's and the ferguson liquor mart is where the police line has been. they moved the line somewhere else. they push the crowd away from the media area. journalistsveral who did not adhere to this. they knew were the stories were going to be coming from. they were hiding in bushes.
i was crazy to be out there. a good story, be prepared to hide in a bush. the first people who i saw what a bulletproof vest and gas mask on. especially the photojournalist. i am surprised how they put themselves in the line of danger to get that shot. i got mad with you over the media request. photographers, they made me buy the paper. stay inind up having to the media again, please know that the real good stories are going to come from you hiding in bushes, putting on a gas mask, bullet-proof vest, running from the please yourself, and possibly being arrested.
[applause] internationale journalists are accustomed to reporting from baghdad and beirut. this is america. >> photographers have to be able to get the photo. you have to get close. you have to be able to get that. i'm a radio guy. in order to get the sound, i have to get close. what are you doing about it? for the police and say that this is your area and you have to stay here, it was not a crime scene. how can they get away with that? >> you have to remember that the governor of missouri made the curfew law.
they gave law enforcement the right to arrest anyone who violated the curfew. on the ground, the commanders on the ground, said you journalists can stay here. you cannot be on the streets. you have to stay in this area, right? i think what bradley was saying is buried -- in his home. the choices are, obey the guy with the gun or you get arrested, or worse. those of you out there who are thinking about being a journalist or starting to be a journalist, this is real. this is what journalists do. we have had a couple who have gotten decapitated because they were reporting. think about that. you mention our photographers but we had one photographer who was taking a picture of the looting and focused on his job, and one of the looters stopped
and looked at them and said, what are you doing? there were other words besides that. approaching, and the photography said it is ok, your face is covered. the guy backed off. later he got knocked down and kicked. it is real. it is not easy. verdict -- the one in oakland with a guy was shot on the train platform -- one of my friends was punched by a guy. it happens. being a journalist nowadays, you can be respected, but you're taking your life into your hands by doing this. warning, butinute my watch says it is five minutes before we end. as much research
been done under and wilson? -- record his arrest is an arresting officer -- you have been trying to get this information? >> that effort is ongoing predicted not help that they had time to discover the record. believe me, it is continuing on. >> has the media told a novel of officer wilson story to be considered balance coverage. major investigative journalism, the biggest one in the region, we have done everything we can do. it is not over yet. the story is not going away. towill continue until we get him and understand his record, all record, not the cleaned up record. >> why is it ok to tell children that wikipedia cannot be used as
media usesut the twitter, instagram, and facebook as a source. ? >> we covered the, right? wikipedia, you don't know who put it out there. that person that wrote whatever they did on wikipedia -- if it i can research to put this out. i can do some more investigative -- and we don't just run with it. with wikipedia, you don't know who put it out there at all. >> what would it take for the media in st. louis to cover other important issues, like the guy shot in california? now think my focus right
-- my focus right now as -- generalnd simon assignment reporter is what is happening here. he was choked before the michael brown shooting. local coverage is local. -- ifis national coverage it is me, i will spend my money covering local. there are plenty of national people. only -- the only one to cover the date officer wilson testified. ferguson --s using .iven recent events >> you want to keep all the
information to that one hashtag. >> as an easier way to keep up. >> i'm trying to find a question we have not asked yet. can the media still be considered on by their coverage? -- can the media still be considered unbiased by their coverage? why does it seem that the media footage does not cover events that general residents are able to cover? sees it, but the media chooses not to cover. we all make decisions on coverage based on journalistic experience. you might think it is a big station, weradio asked, who cares. as opposede street to the market, we will cover
what the market wants. >> i don't know who that is. one who wasthe killed in the city holding a knife. >> we covered it. >> we wrote about it extensively online and in print. >> what makes that a different story is that he did have something in his hand. that then found out same situation happened on the south side. there was a black officer and a white guy. we did cover it. to the extent of ferguson? .o really
it was the emotions in the protests, so of course we covered it. >> if you can respond to the medical examiner on the news stating that the reason michael brown's body could not be picked up was that there was fear of life from the crowd. i guess they were -- did the crowd prevent them from picking up the body? >> that is a controversial statement. the fact that he laid there for a while affected the crowd. by saying the crowd was -- that is worse. that is my opinion. they made it worse by letting him sit there longer. i think there have been clear
statements by police experts that there was no justification for him to lie out there for that. period of time. >> we have run out of time. i would like to thank my panel. [applause] thank you very much. >> next, a discussion on voter id laws and their potential impact on next month's election. after that, another chance to see a town hall meeting in st. louis focusing on how the news media has been covering events and ferguson, missouri. >> on the next washington jennifer duffy looks at the 2014 campaign for u.s. senate seats. former u.s. surgeon