tv Campaign 2018 Indiana Senate Debate CSPAN October 14, 2018 6:58pm-8:01pm EDT
c-span's "q&a." >> indiana democratic senator joe donnelly faced republican and lucyr mike braun brinton for a debate in the senate race consideredder w. the the 2018contest of midterm elections. the cook political report rates as a toss up with recent polls giving senator a slim lead. and welcome to the first of two u.s. senate debates sponsored by the independent nonpartisan indiana debate commission. live froming to you the student activities center on campus northwest in indiana.
individual human rights so we can pursue happiness on our own terms without government interference. second, we need to protect individual economic liberties so you have the right to earn a living without the government regulating and taxing you to death. third, we need to leave this world a better place to our kids. polluters must be stopped. i dream of an america where everyone feels comfortable and welcome, where you feel free to be yourself. they want to tear this country apart. i want to bring our nation together. please allow your friends and invite them to follow me at #ilovelucy. anne: now we will hear from senator donnelly. mr. donnelly: i love lucy, too. thank you so much for having me here tonight. this election is about, who do you trust to have your back in washington. since i have been senator, we have had 70 consecutive months , every single month, of increased job growth. i was the final vote to save health care. if you have sickle cell, if you have diabetes, if you have a child with asthma, i saved their health care. not mike. mike increased taxes 45 times
while in the legislature, the largest tax increase in indiana history. at his company, the deductible in his health care is $10,000, which is completely unaffordable. he has, every time, tried to take away pre-existing conditions coverage and supports a lawsuit today that would do that. additionally, he wants to cut the defense budget and he was against a raise for the troops. mike, you need to do more than take off your tie to gain the trust of the people from india. mr. braun: thanks for hosting the debate, and thank you hoosiers for tuning in. i am mike braun, a lifelong hoosier. i'm a job creator and a political outsider. i am running for this because i'm fed up with business as usual in d.c. running for the senate should be something that you do where you bring something to the table. and career politicians say one thing and do another. i moved back to my hometown, took on tough issues like health care.
held premiums flat for 10 years. so, when i get there you can count on me to do things. he has run a campaign of negativity because of his record. wrong on the iran deal, wrong on health care, wrong on almost everything, including judge kavanaugh. when you send me there, you can count on i will stand up for hoosier values. and you're going to need to look for local leadership and trying to change the dynamic of a broken system. thank you. anne: thank you. and we start with the supreme court. first, i want to preface, this is from the indiana debate commission, this question. division and animosity in washington and around the country is at the highest level that many people can remember. in fact, some people think it is not been this polarized since back to the civil war. so, candidates, the country just emerged from a bruising fight over the nomination of brett kavanaugh to the supreme court
, it was a fight over a fight across ideological lines that highlighted the growing metoo movement as well as the demeanor of judicial nominees. so what lessons did you take away from this battle? and i start first with ms. brenton. ms. brenton: and thank you to the indiana debate commission and all the people carrying this. i will tell you what i learned. i learned it does not matter if you wear red or blue, they want control of you. the division is not over civil rights or any good issue. it's really over who gets to control this country. and you can see that whether you are on this side of the island aisle or that side, the complete focus is on controlling the tax dollars that flow from
people. what needs to happen in this country is we need to come to a baseline of love and harmony, and we need to take away the issue of them trying to control us. it is us versus them. mr. donnelly: i voted against judge kavanaugh because of concerns about his impartiality and concerns about his judicial temperament. but i voted for justice neil gorsuch, president trump's pick, because on the test i have which is about judicial temperament and impartiality and qualifications. -- judge gorsuch covered all of those. i have been through 77% of the nominations. 62% of the time i've voted, i've voted with president trump. so, my job is not only to determine the nominee, but to protect the court. and justice gorsuch met every test. judge kavanaugh had concerns about impartiality and judicial temperament. mike was for judge kavanaugh on the first day. if president trump put up bugs
bunny, mike would have said he should go on the court. our job is to put people on the court were qualified. mr. braun: so, this will be a clear separator between me and the senator here. when you had a judge with his qualifications, there's no doubt he will not legislate from the bench. he is not going to do the things that courts have done for a long time. very well-qualified. but i think what you should have gotten from the recent spectacle there is that the democrats, including joe donnelly, will do or say anything when it comes to their political interests. it is a blood sport. and as long at is it is like that, you are going to have decisions made not on what hoosiers want, based on what chuck schumer wants. you want someone who leads and thinks independently. joe has been there for 12 years. considered the least effective democratic senator because he
never sticks his neck out. he blows with the wind. in this case he made the wrong decision on judge kavanaugh. anne: rebuttle is on an as-needed basis and the candidates are going to indicate what is very important to them. ms. brenton, you were first up. ms. brenton: thank you. as a female it is important i stand up here and stand for women, that we should look believed when we come forward. but just because we are women doesn't mean we automatically are telling the truth. what i see here is a lot of partisanship. i have had my metoo moments. when i looked at this to the lens of logic i asked myself, would judge kavanaugh be the kind of judge will uphold the constitution? he is a co-author of the patriot act. he is no fan of the fourth or fifth amendment. i would have been no from day one. mr. donnelly: mike, you say you are to protect pre-existing conditions, and at the same time you support a lawsuit to take it away. you say you are for lower taxes, but you voted for the highest taxes in indiana history. you say you are for the troops,
but you are against a pay increase for the young men and women. i was for justice gorsuch. i have been for almost 80% of the judges. but we are not there as a copy machine. we are there to help to make the best decision. mr. braun: i want to make this clear. when you have a senator like this that keeps repeating falsehoods, it is a sign of a campaign that's circling the drain. i want to make it clear, i would never be for not covering pre-existing conditions. i have done it in my own business. the senator gave us obamacare, which has no choices and is falling apart. that is what you get from a career politician. when you have a leader, someone who does things in the real world, you can hold premiums flat for 10 years. and my insurance is good and much better than the failed obamacare plan. anne: i would like to ask that we all try to stick to the question at hand.
we are going to get to a lot of the issues that you just mentioned. just a reminder, and that is not against any particular candidate. we do have our first voter here, and we are so glad we do. the first member of our audience to ask a question. she is a business owner. mr. donnelly, you will be the first to answer her question. have at it. >> if elected, will you commit to carrying out the will of the people, even if it means going against your own party? mr. donnelly: will i go against well, i go against my party all the time. i went against my party when i voted for justice gorsuch. i have gone against my party, rounding up all the democrats to go for right to try when there were none for it. and i was able to rally all 50 so we make sure our children got health care. that we had right to try. that people in difficult medical situations could get coverage and life assisting medication.
so, that is a regular for me. i have been with president trump 62% of the time. that is what we're supposed to do. i do not think it is about party. mike could not even name a single democrat when he did a forum in indianapolis. he may have googled a name since, but at that time he could not name a single democrat to work with. i have passed 45 pieces of legislation and each one had a republican partner. 23 with president trump. so count me in. mr. braun: ok, very clear, it is his record we are litigating this evening. and when you try to turn attention to other issues, it means that you are probably embarrassed about your own record. i want to make it clear, he voted for obamacare originally. he voted against its repeal. he voted for the iran deal. he voted against tax reform. and for any enterprisers, that was the one that made a lot of
difference. and then here he voted against judge kavanaugh. he says for other reasons, but he did it because he takes his marching orders from chuck schumer, the same guy who has been running his campaign from afar. and when you will do that you have a record that says you are the least effective senator, my goodness. why don't we give a chance to other people who have done things in the real world? i took on the insurance companies when nobody else would. may not be the perfect plan but it is a great plan. and i held costs firm for 10 years and i will know more what to do to reform health care than a career politician that gets briefed from the lobbyists. anne: 15 seconds, would you commit to carrying out the will of the people even if it means going against your party if elected? mr. braun: i would. the key thing about a leader is you think independently. if you look at my record, i have done that when i was in the state legislature, i'd have done it in my business. and a record speaks for itself.
joe has gone there, gotten cozy for the perks in the pay. he has not lead. that is the difference between me and him. ms. brenton: it's going to be an awfully long evening if we simply listen to them repeat their commercials back to each other. thank you. let me answer that question. the libertarian party is a set of political beliefs and ideals and we look for the lenses that are simple. we demand all of our freedoms all the time. we want to return to constitutional values and restrictions because the government is supposed to have a muzzle on it. that is the purpose of the constitution, to allow maximum freedom. please read the ninth and 10th amendments for more. when i go against my party? yes, absolutely. but i don't believe i will have to. because the lens we look through is not left or right. the lens we look through is one of being fiscally conservative and socially accepting. to be able to allow people the
maximum freedom with really just two things in mind. don't hurt people, don't take their stuff. other than that you are good with me. anne: you indicated that you would like a rebuttal. mr. donnelly: yeah, mike talks about effectiveness. he ought to talk to the veterans of north-central indiana who have a brand-new v.a. health center we all worked together on. the veterans who will be getting a new center in the next year or two. he ought to want to talk to laura and jeff, whose son has muscular dystrophy. because we worked together we could pass right to try legislation that president trump personally thanked me for and said what a great job we did. he should talk to justin phillips, who we have worked together on to stop the opioid scourge across our state. we have gone from place to place to end it. that is effectiveness. anne: let's go to our next voter. this is william of monticello. he works in customer service.
and he has a question. >> who is your role model in politics and why? anne: this one we start with ms. brenton again. ms. brenton: you know, i'm often torn about who would be my role model in politics simply because there are so many different people that you could admire. and not only for the right reasons. for example, i admire president lincoln. why? because when a woman said to him, president lincoln, you have to destroy your enemies, his answer was simply, madam, i am going to make my enemies my friends. does that not destroy my enemies? he had some other issues as well. i guess really the question becomes is there anyone worth admiring? the last politician of modern days i really admire was john f. kennedy because he took the stand and he said we are the greatest country in this world, and what we are going to do is put a man on the moon in 10 years. we don't know how we are going to do it, but we know we are
going to do it. and that sort of inspirational leadership is to which i inspire. anne: producers are telling me that mr. braun, you should have gotten the first go of that. so, you can answer next. mr. braun: so, role models. i am doing this from the outside. when you have so many career politicians there it is hard to find them. i will give you one not there anymore, tom coburn, a doctor from oklahoma. what i loved about him, he was never afraid to bust the government. the government that joe has been for the past 12 years has given us trillion dollar in debt. he was honest, he would speak up. that is what you will get out of me. i signed a term limits pledge. i think the problem with our country is we get people to go there for the wrong reasons. start calculating their vote to get reelected like a senator here. and whoever gives them a campaign contribution. ron johnson from wisconsin,
thank goodness, outsider businessman. small businesses would have been left out in the cold when we did tax reform. he stuffed up, i did not hear this senator's voice because he never speaks up. he never speaks up. ron johnson i respect. i look forward to serving with him. mr. donnelly: mike, you may want to know, ron johnson was my partner on the right to try legislation. he and i were the two senators that president trump congratulated and said what an awesome job that we did. if you would like me to pass on that you like ron, i will let him know. my friend, my mentor, my hero in politics, john mccain. john mccain, who spent over five years in a hanoi prison cell. john mccain, who fought for his nation at every turn. john mccain, who when he ran for president, his motto was country first. that is what this should be about, is our country. it is about how to make it for our children and grandchildren, we leave them a safer, stronger america.
and in life, it would be my dad, and father hesberg from the university of notre dame. he said when you go there, do not do what is easy, do what is right. and i have followed that advice every single time. mr. braun: ok, great example here. he talks about right to try. great piece of legislation. everybody was for that. the tough ones are when you have to stick your neck out on a major piece of legislation and you have to be willing to buck your party boss chuck schumer, who i think tells the senator what to do on all the important legislation. if he was friends with ron johnson, why wasn't he speaking out on tax reform. that was the biggest piece of legislation for small businesses and individuals. when you believe in keeping more of your own. that is when you want a senator to speak up, not on something that everybody thinks is good. ms. brenton: you know, as long as we're on the subject of right to try, let's talk about right to try cannabis. let's talk about not doing study
after study to determine the effectiveness of cannabis. i have great news for you. it has been studied for about 10,000 years. how many people have ever died of a marijuana overdose? it is the exact same number as have been gored to death by a unicorn. zero. anne: mr. donnelly, quick rebuttal. we really want to cover all these issues. mr. donnelly: i will. look. i was against tax reform because it exploded the deficit by $2 trillion that our kids are going to have to pay for. mike got a wheelbarrow full of cash in that tax reform. he got a huge tax cut. debois county, and the kids of posey county are the ones who are going to have to pay for it. anne: we're going to move on to climate change. we will receive more questions on this than any other topic. u.s. scientists just said yesterday the world has 10 years to get climate change under
control or face dire circumstances. right here at purdue, researchers have projected our average temperature will rise five to six degrees by midcentury. this question was put in by lee, a retiree in bloomington. very open-ended. he asks, what actions, if any, should the u.s. government take to address climate change and global warming? we're going to get back on track here. mr. braun, you get to start. mr. braun: thank you. climate change. steward of the environment. i am again going to bring talents to this discussion, because i have been a steward of the environment for a long time. started the ecology club back in high school. that is unusual to hear from a conservative. i have been a steward of managing land in a way that i understand the real issues. all of us want clean air and clean water. but you have to have common sense. you cannot do what the democrats did and start picking winners and losers by trying to pop up
industries that may be part of a long-term solution, but that is the way government works. and when you try to pull the rug out from underneath other industries, and again, that is the way big government and bureaucrats work. when you learn in the real world you know the way to do it. and we now have got energy independence, and that has got to be always taken into consideration while you are keeping the environment in healthy condition. i have lived it and that is why i'll know what to do. mr. donnelly: you cannot trust mike to fight for lake michigan. you cannot trust mike to fight for our rivers. i wish you were still in the ecology club, mike, because we need it now more than ever. look, i am all-in for american energy. ethanol, for our farmers. they are having huge struggles with tariffs right now and their prices have gone down. we need to make the ethanol
market more available. for wind, for solar, for clean coal. if it is made in america, we want to use it. we want to make it so we have a cleaner environment. we have a sacred obligation to our children. to everyone watching out there, to turn over to you a planet a country and a state and a lake in a river in the ohio river that is cleaner today than when we first found it. and that's our job, and that's what we're supposed to do. ms. brenton: you know, the problem is with corporations and government regulations, which actually give permission to the corporations on how much they can pollute. i have been boycotting nestle since 1993. why have i been boycotting them? they are a horrible company, and as senator donnelly just alluded to, they are draining lake michigan and selling it to the chinese. this is ridiculous. we need people in washington who stand up for what is right. and will offer real solutions. for example, we need a global cleanup effort to get plastics and dirt out of oceans.
we need to seed our photoplankton so they can actually clean up the ocean for us. we need hemp. oh my gosh, did i talk about this two years ago or what? we need hemp, we need hemp, we need hemp. we need hemp because it fixes carbon. because we don't need ethanol. that is another government boondoggle. we need hemp. anne: did you want a rebuttal on this? mr. donnelly: i just wanted to say, look, we are indiana. we fight for our farmers. ethanol is a clean fuel, it's an extraordinarily good fuel. it is something that makes money go in the pockets of our farmers instead of those in saudi arabia or the middle east. i will fight for men and women in the farm every time. mr. braun: ok, quick rebuttal. when it comes to energy independence, where were democrats and where was the senator? president trump came along and now we are an exporter of
energy. and i think the big difference in this debate and in the accept the, do you things of the past. the senator has been running for office or serving in it for almost a career. mr. donnelly: that is just not true. that is just not true. i have spent more time, lots more time in the private sector than in public office. and you know that. anne: mr. braun has 10 more seconds. mr. braun: if you did not get people in there that think differently, expect more of the same. i'm going there because folks have been there a long time and have delivered us these results. he is part of the problem. anne: ok, we're getting off track. ms. brenton you indicated you wanted a quick rebuttal. ms. brenton: i think i may be the only one standing up here that has an organic garden and recycles and does all that good stuff. here's what i know. i know that we have some of the richest soil in the world, and
we're wasting it on corn. we could have a much better crop that is already pesticide resistant. we don't have to keep these on our playgrounds or our corn. we need to protect the hoosier environment and stop polluting it. anne: we have another audience member with a question. a student at the university of notre dame. >> do you believe the central holding in roe v. wade that women have a constitutional right to an abortion, is correct? ms. brenton: of course. start with the women. if any of you have read my biography, it is probably not a stretch for you to understand why i am pro-life. i have given birth to 10 human beings. and now i'm a grandma, too. so when you ask a question like, is a particular supreme court decision right or wrong, you have to ask who we are protecting. if we do not protect the smallest, most helpless individual, then we are on a downward slide into euthanasia
and killing off our old people so that social security does not go bankrupt like it already is because it is a trust fund. the question is should we or should we not have roe v. wade. that is a question for the supreme court to answer. and all of you that have been worried about kavanaugh, you can keep worrying about it. he will probably not be strong on that. mr. donnelly: i do not have a litmus test on that, but i will tell you this. i am a pro-life senator. i have every single time made sure that federal funds were never used for abortion-related services. and i believe in a stance that protects all life. but i also believe it is important that for our moms, for our sisters, for our wives, for our daughters, that we have exceptions. i believe exceptions in the case
of rape, and in the case of incest, and in the case of a mom who may lose her life because of the pregnancy. i was on a stage six years ago where they said richard murdoch was extreme. but mike is actually more extreme, because he thinks he should be in the middle of a decision for your wife or your daughter when their life is at stake. and i just do not think we have any place in that discussion. mr. braun: you know, i am 100% pro-life. and when it comes down to just trying to nurture life in general, take us from where we are currently, all i can tell you is i got the endorsement from the indiana right to life, the national right to life, the susan b. anthony group. and this gentleman here has an f rating. so, when he says he is pro-life, i do not think you can have it both ways. i would never demonize anybody that disagrees with me. and, you know, i'm open-minded in the sense that anybody can have their opinion, but you cannot have it both ways.
i am the one being endorsed by the organizations where they know where your heart is. anne: senator, quick rebuttal. mr. donnelly: it is not having it both ways to make sure that your daughter, or your wife, when they are given the most tragic news -- and i see doctors in the audience -- the most tragic possible news that they could lose their life in this pregnancy. that is not our place to tell that woman or that family what to do. mike, that is not our business, and we should not be in the middle of it. and it is the family's decision with their pastor. ms. brenton: just a quick note. i faced this decision as a woman. here is what you need to know. it's no one's business but the person whose body it is. we must each have absolute control over our own bodies. if we do not have freedom in our
own bodies to accept or reject any medical care, then we don't have any freedom at all. anne: our next question, a warehouse supervisor also in our audience and here to ask it herself. >> hi. my four-year-old son was killed at a babysitter's house when they left a fully loaded handgun unsecured and easily accessible to children. my daughter, who was seven at the time, walked in and had to find her brother. we have no legislation to hold irresponsible and negligent gunowners criminally liable in situations like this. it is a little interesting to note that more than 60% of school shooters got their weapons from their own home or that of a family or friend. would you support and would you sponsor a bill passing safe storage laws, also known as child access prevention laws? anne: senator donnelly, you are first on this. mr. donnelly: well, i believe in the second amendment, but i also believe with rights come responsibilities. and the storage law is something that we need to look at.
what we also need to do is stop the gun show loophole as well. that somebody who leaves the prison right here down the street, they can go out as a felon and get a gun, go to a show, pay $500, get this gun or that gun or an ar-15. you can come from the big house in michigan city and get a gun. i was at noblesville west that afternoon. i was with the families and the police. and we have to make sure that on this kind of issue, things like no fly, no buy -- if you are on a terrorist watch list you can still get a gun. we have to make it that there are some standards that we have to be responsible, that not just rights but responsibilities as well. and the things you are talking about, we have a red flag law -- i am sorry, it is just such a complicated issue.
and it is not a one minute anne: thank you for not making me use my mom voice. [laughter] anne: my daughter said, use your mom voice. you can do that. mr. braun, your chance to answer. mr. braun: any violence or tragedy with a gun tears at your heartstrings. i mean we all agree with that. , when it comes down to how you actually solve the problems, i would look at school security being something that -- indiana. i was part of the state legislature. we have done a good job there. the other thing you have to look at would be whatever mental health comes into play. i think we can get a lot of cues and we don't do anything with it. when it comes to things like storage and so forth, i think the places where we have tried to use gun laws generally impact the folks that are law-abiding. i will be for anything that proves effective to keep guns out of the hands of criminals. i am going to always be there to
defend the second amendment rights, because so often, politicians and liberals end up going there, not the source of the problem. i was the individual here that's getting the nra endorsement and proud of it. because i think they want to make sure your second amendment rights are never infringed. ms. brenton: as one mom to another, i am sorry for your unimaginable loss. i see my own five-year-old flashing through my eyes and i am grateful my husband and i are responsible gunowners who keep all of our guns locked. i think that is an important as senator donnelly says with rights comes , responsibilities. we should not have to pass laws to do this, people. this is common sense. to have someone as trusted as your babysitter that created such a tragedy is unbelievable. i am going to call a little b.s. on the gun show loophole. because i have been to gun shows. i bought guns at gun shows.
and they have always done a background check. second amendment, very strong on the second amendment. it is absolutely important we understand the reason the second amendment is there is liberty. never forget the reason we have the second amendment is because the political attitude of the day was one where we were fighting the global superpower of the day. should that ever happened, god forbid, and our country we need , to be able to stand against government. anne: senator donnelly, quick rebuttal. mr. donnelly: our children ought to be able to go to school safe, study safe, come home safe. over 90% of hoosiers think the gun show loophole should be ended. over 90% of hoosiers think that no-fly, no buy should be in place. think of a terrorist who is not allowed on a plane, but can buy a gun right here. i am so brokenhearted for you. and i saw your t-shirt with your child on it. and boy, just as adorable and as
beautiful as your child could possibly be. anne: we have another voter. let's turn our attention to international affairs. this question will be asked by a professor of political science, and she is director of the honors program at indiana university south bend. you are on purdue territory. [laughter] >> good evening. in his recent address to the u.n. president trump praised kim , jong-un of north korea for his courage and for steps he has taken including cessation of nuclear testing, release of american prisoners, and return of fallen american soldiers. do you believe that kim jong-un is prepared to dismantle north korea's nuclear arsenal and engage in unilateral disarmament? and what would be the most successful policy course the united states should follow regarding north korea? anne: mr. braun. mr. braun: interesting, because
all the problems that were laid at our doorstep were problems that were created over many decades. the senator has been there for 12 years. the obama administration basically had the policies that took us to the brink in several cases. i think it is very clear that with a new dynamic, regardless of what you think of the president's style, we have got movement on issues that there had not been any on a longtime. long time. my opponent here voted for the iran deal, and that is where you gave them a huge amount of cash, lifted things off of their shoulders, and thank goodness that was redone. when it comes to north korea, i think he has changed the dynamic , and i'm glad he has. we have never been this close to actually something being done. and that is what you are going to get out of people that i think think a little differently. career politicians, and the folks that have been there long time, that is the difference
between what i hope is a new breed of politician. on his side of the aisle and mine, to do real world solutions, including fixing things on the foreign front. brenton? ms. brenton: thank you. when i look at trump and kim jong-un and what is going on in north korea, does it remind anyone of the austin powers movie where they are putting the nuclear warhead in the volcano? and it ended the earth? am i the only one? we have cartoon characters for world leaders. i think north korea can do better, i think we can do better. abdul asked me what i thought about trump, and i said i really appreciate the fact that he is a cowboy. when you think about america -- there is a great book called "culture code," and it talks about america in respect of being cowboys. i think that posturing by president trump lets the leader of north korea know that he may find himself at the end of one of our nuclear warheads.
that does not please me. i do not agree with it, but i do think the implied threat is there. i have been working with foreign exchange students now for a couple years. some from predominantly muslim countries. that has given the absolute hope that teenagers around the world are working for a better world. anne: senator donnelly? mr. donnelly: this is actually the perfect reason why you cannot trust mike braun. in regards to iran, they were one month away from a nuclear weapon. they had the materials, they had the technologies. we pushed them back over 10 years. and if iran had gotten a nuclear weapon, we would have wound up in conflict with them. you know will would have had to go? young men and women from richmond, angola, maryville, westville. they would have had to go and fight. my job is to protect this country and stand for it every single time.
make sure that every threat is turned away. i cannot believe i have to stop. anne: the league of women voters are doing my job for me and i thank them for me. rebuttal, you have indicated, mr. braun. mr. braun: in talking to -- the irant deal was up there with voting against tax reform. when you take a country that has been belligerent, that its mission is to destroy israel and to export terrorism, and to deliver them $1.5 billion in cash and give concessions up to $150 billion, that is not a good deal. how can you trust people that have never been trustworthy in the past? that dynamic is changing. and the senator says he is for what has been done before -- anne: you need to wrap. that was quick. i mean, you responded like that. thank you. senator donnelly, you want to rebuttal as well. mr. donnelly: think of what ike just said.
iran is now 10 years away. they were one month away from a nuclear weapon. if they had gotten it, our kids , our kids would have had to go fight another war. that is why the iran deal was done, to make sure all children -- our children did not have to go to war, to make sure our kids could stay at home instead of having to take after tehran. brenton, rebuttal. ms. brenton: very quickly, what you just told me is they were one month away, now they are 10 years away. you kick the can down the road, not handle the problem with a real-world solution. that means our children and grandchildren will still deal with this and that does not please me at all. we should keep american troops in america. while we are busy defending the borders of other countries our , own border has holes big enough to drive semi trucks full of illegal aliens through. ridiculous. never caught anybody at the airport. sorry, homeland security, but i am getting real sick and tired of "may i have your papers, please." i have a question on foreign affairs. let's talk about american
leadership on the international stage, including our relationships with our allies. how would you defined where we have been, where we are, and where we are going? ms. brenton: the first and we have to do is go right to the founding fathers playbook. friends to all, allies to none. it is the entangling alliances which brought us into world war i and world war ii and the vietnam war. it is the entangling alliances which put our sons and daughters, husbands and wives, brothers and sisters at harm. american troops should not be fighting those wars. why in the world are we giving money to foreign governments? so that they will be at peace. $10 million a day to israel? how do we even do that when at home we have people who were not eating. food security in our country is absolutely an issue and we should be talking about feeding our own people first before we start handing out money to foreign governments in the name of peace. it has certainly bought us no peace.
mr. donnelly: i support president trump's efforts. i want him to be successful. when the president is successful, the u.s. is successful. that is what this is supposed to be about. senator richard lugar, a hoosier icon, i was found to be the most bipartisan center serving in the -- senator serving in the u.s. senate. we want to work together so that president trump is successful. but i would also tell you this. we have to make sure that our military has everything they need to be successful at every turn. that they have the equipment they need to be safe. that they are never, ever in a fair fight. you cannot trust mike because he wants to cut defense spending. directly against what secretary mattis says. that the first and biggest pay raise in nine years, he would have been against. we want to stand with our men
and women who, if we do go into conflict, that we have the back. anne: mr. braun, our relationship with our allies. mr. braun: it is clear it was not very leading up to it, and one reason was they were not doing their fair share of the burden. president trump came along, and where have you ever heard the discussion about their paying their fair share, the 2% they were supposed to do. that has changed. -- thank goodness he is taking on some of this stuff that others were either too politically correct or just unwilling to do. so, i think what we have got is a new dynamic based on someone thinking outside the box. when it comes to military spending, we had more veterans per capita here than in any place in the state. i will always be for making sure the military has what it wants. and what about the v.a.? where has the senator been? been tos the devotion take care of our veterans? mr. donnelly: check the new facility in northern indiana.
mr. braun: check what you have done up to this point, and finally now you're getting , common sense things done like not having to travel 150 miles to get a basic checkup. you have been there 12 years, you could take credit for it, but you have not had one original idea in the time you have been here. mr. donnelly: you are clearly struggling on this one. i served on the veterans committee for six years. we were able to get a new facility in north-central indiana. we have a new facility going up in indiana. a new facility going up in west central indy as well. i have been to all of these facilities. i have been to v.a. facilities time after time to make sure our men and women have what they need. we just passed new legislation that provides our veterans if they are more than 40 miles away and coverage at home. just send the bill to the v.a. i was also the sponsor to make sure that if there is a problem with the bill, it does not affect the credit at all. anne: we're moving on now. we have another voter question , this on education.
onewe hear from lisa a , technology specialist with the office of the registrar at purdue university. lisa? lisa: thank you. what, if anything can congress , do to increase higher education degree attainment while reining in excessive student loan debt? mr. donnelly: one of the first things we can do is make sure we protect our pell grants, which have a maximum of $5920 and are extraordinarily helpful for middle-class families. it can make all the difference. i am also the sponsor of the bill. a great school and our state, they have a policy they send you , a letter at the beginning of your semester and it tells you exactly how much you have borrowed, tells you how much you will borrow, tells you what your payments are and what they will be after you finish school. student borrowing dropped 20% after they did that. that is a phenomenal idea that we are working to get into law
right now. i'll tell you this when mike was , in the legislature, that was before he quit and went home, he voted against an in-state tuition freeze. what could be a more -- could be more important to know that tuition is not going to go up? that is about as important as it is going to get, to know that your kid can finish school without tuition increasing. mr. braun: career politicians speak in platitudes. i want to cite a specific example of mitch daniels. when i interviewed him first year on ways and means, this is how you fix the cost of education and the fact that it is now going up at a higher rate than the cost of health care. and that is sad. i asked mitch -- i am proud you frozen tuition at purdue for the third year. i said what will you do to keep costs actually down? and like somebody that has done something in the real world, he rattled off three things that were impressive. make sure we buy things right across all locations. that is what somebody in
business would do. make sure we look at our benefits program, make sure it is sustainable. that you are not only getting good coverage, that you are also going to be able to afford it. and then, he said i want to make , a four-year degree a three-year degree. that is going to be the difference between somebody like me and somebody that has been there as part of the problem. you think out-of-the-box, and if you come away with anything this evening, that should be at. -- it. ms. brenton: can we talk about free-market solutions and take out the government involvement? everything government does makes us poorer. it is like to take a leader out of blood in this arm and put back 10%. it is insane. government is picking winners and losers in our higher educational system by guaranteeing student loan debt that you can never bankrupt out of. it's an absolute scam. it is a gift to banks that they can be so profitable on the backs of everyone of us.
i have been doing mortgages since 1996, and here is what i discovered. you think we had a crisis back 2010, -- and 8, 2009, in 2008, 2009, 2010 you ain't , seen nothing yet. when i tried to get young people qualified, have the american dream and the homeowners, they cannot qualify because their student loan debt is higher than a mortgage. it is absolutely insane. we need free market solutions and i tell my own children to consider trade school because they are not outsourcing electrical jobs jobs to china. mr. donnelly: mike had a shot to help every family in indiana, but you cannot trust him to do it. -- could not trust him to do it with an in-state tuition freeze. i want kids to finish in three years, too. that would be awesome. but the fact is, not everybody does. but i'll tell you what, if you freeze tuition for all of them, it helps them in year one, year three, year four. and maximizing pell grants does as well. if your pocketbook. it is our kids pocketbooks. it is saving money, and that is what we should do. anne: you are up for the next
question as well, but rebuttal, mr. braun. mr. braun: when it comes to the cost of education, we all want that to be great service and low cost. the difference is going to be, the senator has been part of , now student debt that has gone , to $1 trillion, part of a system that has delivered us all these annual deficits. can you really trust someone that has been there, and do you deserve to have a shot at it when you have been part of the problem? all i am saying is if you want more of the same, joe is your guy. if you want people that are going to really fix things, that have done it in the trenches, you ought to try something different. anne: pre-existing conditions, they were mentioned right off the bat. so we have a question from the debate commission in that regard. there is an important battle underway to take away patients care for pre-existing conditions. do you believe insurance company -- companies should be required to give such coverage, and if so, do you believe the company's should be able -- companies
should be able to charge higher rates to people with those conditions? mr. braun: great question. i have spent 10 years in my own business taking on the issue of the high cost of insurance. 10 years ago, health insurance companies kept coming in, you're lucky, it is only going up 5% to 10% a year. i did it before obamacare, and i want the public to be absolutely clear about this. i would never be for any replacement of the affordable care act unless it's covered pre-existing conditions, and did not have any cap on coverage. to get that to be done and to be sustainable, you have to do things like we did. we broke the cost curve. my insurance costs less, far less, than the comparable obama policy. that is because government always wants to do stuff, but they never worry about the cost of it. until you get entrepreneurs and people that have done in the real world i would not count on , career politicians to do it.
they have delivered us the mess. anne: ms. brenton. ms. brenton: the problem with health care, just like anything else, is we are disconnected from the cost of it because there is an unseen hand in force moving in our markets, one which we cannot control, except that -- at the voting booth, by the way. if you want something changed, something new, you have to vote for lucy, though for me, support me because i'm the only one who , will get rid of this crap. government inserted itself into health care in the 1960's. prior to that, we had doctors coming to your door. now what do we have? we have out-of-control costs, aspirins that costs $1000 each. of course it is difficult to have that conversation of a pre-existing conditions when we are still worried about $1000 aspirins. the whole system must be overhauled, but it is clear that government is not the one to do that. individuals in the free market must be the ones who make decisions about their own health care. there must be no government force in this.
no government mandate to buy anything, because the next thing they will be mandating is when they should buy ford over chevy. and who wants that? mr. donnelly: i stand here and all there you people of indiana to tell you i was the deciding vote that saved coverage for pre-existing conditions. for that young girl who has asthma, on the bus in fort wayne, who needs an inhaler. for that child who has diabetes in marysville and needs insulin. and mike, i can hardly believe that you could sit here or stand here and tell everyone you are for coverage for pre-existing conditions. there's a lawsuit right now, right now texas versus united , states, that is trying to take away coverage for pre-existing conditions, trying to reimpose caps, and you support it. stay and stand here tonight and tell us you will denounce that
lawsuit, you will denounce that effort on pre-existing conditions. i was the deciding vote to make sure that that child in lawrenceburg who has arthritis can get the medication they need, even though they are part of a single family. that medication is $2000 a month. everybody gets a shot on my health care. anne: mr. braun. mr. braun: so, you can see he got riled up here. and the reason is obamacare. mr. donnelly: darn right i did. mr. braun: those goals the affordable care act had in place, 100% for. but it has got to last. you cannot just solve something without worrying about how to make it sustainable cost wise over time. i am always going to cover pre-existing conditions and no cap on coverage and i'm the only one here that had the nerve to take on the insurance companies and get it done. you have delivered us obamacare, which is falling apart, despite it was doing good things. it is not lasting. anne: ms. brenton. ms. brenton: what is this really about? this is really about the old
parties, whether they wear a red jacket or a blue jacket trying , to force you to do something that may not be in your own best interest. should we even have a government that is able to use government force? it is the tip of the government's gun, which is in your face, demanding you buy health care. this is just one example of a product. it is a slippery slope. we have to take back our power as voters and vote out people who will steal from your pocketbooks and force you to buy things not in your best interest. anne: we had the tyranny of the clock here. we have a final question we need to get to, so you get to start, mr. donnelly. mr. donnelly: can't you give me 15 seconds? she got a rebuttal. 15 seconds? hoosiers, clearest difference. he won't even denounced the lawsuit that will take away coverage for pre-existing conditions. i am the person who kept the final vote to make sure your child with asthma can get their inhaler. anne: final question, mr. donnelly, you start. give us your best --
>> i'm side. final question. anne: final question. this is a 30 second question, short, sweet and to the point. , this is the closing, yeah. your best elevator pitch on why you have earned the votes of your fellow hoosiers. mr. donnelly: promises made, promises kept. fighting for your health care when others want to take it away. fighting for your jobs, 70 consecutive months of increased job growth. fighting for our veterans, for our pows, for our mia's. fighting for our country, faith, family, community, country. d, or aboutbout r or red or blue. it is about the red, white, and blue. mr. braun: so, what you want to take away from this is, do you want more of the same. if you are happy with business as usual and results we have had, here is your man. look at our records closely and do not listen to chuck schumer, the guy that has been running his campaign with negative advertising and lies.
look at our record from when we started years ago and what we have accomplished. i have done things in the real world. this gentleman is a career politician. that is part of the problem. anne: ms. brenton. ms. brenton: i am the only outsider. i don't have a $90 million net worth. i am not part of the 1%. so if you want something that ifnges in washington, d.c. , you want someone who is unabashedly for the constitution , who demands all of your freedoms all the time, someone who has never raised taxes on you and never will, that is not in my track record. these two gentlemen are part of the problem. here is the problem, and here is your decision. we can either drain the swamp or we can send in another alligator. anne: we want to thank the candidates for being here. we want to thank the audience in -- and our voters. those of us at home, tomorrow is the last day to register to vote. so many issues we could not get to. there is another debate october
30 from indianapolis if you want to tune in for that. mr. donnelly: we want to thank the moderator. great job. anne: thank you. [applause] anne: pbs 39, thank you. and on behalf of the indiana debate commission, good night. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2018] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] coverageampaign 2018 monday. republican congressman david bratt will debate democratic challenger abigail's hamburger in virginia's seventh district u.s. house race. easternrts at 6:30 p.m. on c-span and c-span.org and on
our free radio app. and two arizona house members debate monday. democrat kiersten cinema faces martha miceli for this seat opened up by retiring republican senator jeff flake. watch live monday night at 9:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. c-span, your primary source for campaign 2018. with election day less than a month away, on the control of congress in question, see the competition for yourself on c-span. watch the debate from key house and senate races. make c-span your primary source for campaign 2018. >> monday night on the communicators, jeff cohen with the association of
communications officials talks about emergency communications and what has changed since the 9/11 terrorist attacks. he is interviewed by john handle. >> the challenge is when someone is inside a building. apco has been championing dispatch ball locations, which means the door to kick down. if someone is behind an apartment door or office suite, to sends to know where the responders, and that is a very tough technological challenge. in 2015, the fcc adopted an order which was groundbreaking. it was for the first time applying requirements on the carriers to determine a caller's location inside a building. if followed a lengthy did wheren that apco we negotiated with the four major carriers and the industry representatives. we called it a roadmap. the fcc basically adopted it,
and it put us on track to get a dispensable location. right now, they are testing dispensable location technologies, and we are hopeful that those will produce the results -- good results. >> watch the communicators on c-span2. bus is traveling across the country on our 50 capitals tour. we recently stopped in columbus, ohio. novemberorward to midterm elections, we are asking folks which party should control congress and why? >> congress should remain in republican hands after this next election. a couple of reasons for this. itsibly the largest one is has been stated that if the democratic party takes control, they will go out of their way to stymie any of the president's
proposed legislation for good or for ill, and if we want anything to happen, any legislation to pass, i think we need a congress that stands behind the president, even if it is pushing through some of his less thought-out ideas. >> i want to see the democrats controlled the congress and the senate. i think that it is long overdue to remove trump. he seems to be getting dementia and possibly worse. he seems very erratic, dangerous for the country. that's why i want to see the democrats take over. voices from the states. part of c-span 50 capitals >> here is what is coming up tonight on c-span. q&a is next with political commentator and author tucker carlson on his new book "ship of false."
-- fools." campaign 2018 coverage at 10:00 as republican john james, and iraq war veteran faces democratic incumbent debbie. this week on q&a, fox news host tucker carlson discusses his book "ship of fools: how a selfish ruling class is bringing america to the brink of revolution." >> tucker carlson, author of the book "ship of fools." tucker: mrs. raymond was my first grade teacher in california and the school year of 1975, 1976. she was the liberal