tv Conflict Zone - Guest Karin Kneissl Deutsche Welle September 19, 2018 7:30pm-8:00pm CEST
with the reminder. we have to comprehend what has taken us today. and. good opportunity for. starts oct third on t w. this week conflict zone is in vienna to talk to all strength foreign minister. she was nominated for the post by the n.t. immigration and right wing party f b o although she is not a member of the party but to the f p o's policies met serve use and how does all of this affect all stressed place in europe.
think now is the will come to conflict so thank you very much so let's start with australia relationship with the russian president vladimir putin is a close ally of syrian president bashar al assad a mass murderer of his own people both have hundreds of thousands of civilian lives on their conscience how do huge shots put in its role in this infernal. when russia started to intervene in syria that was the official date was thirtieth of september twenty fifteen. state as it's happened named itself than was proceeding towards a kia and the remember very well special and why of the united nations doesn't it mr a warning against mass exodus from latter kiya if the i ask what stopped massacring something our south is replacing the mass murdering of the i s with the support of russia we are now twenty eight team and we were aware and we
saw what happens in syria with full support me and russia but my action is again how do you judge today i let you judge roll wilson from what we have we have not only mr putin and mr assad in syria we have a proxy war that started in summer twenty eleven with a number of stakeholders and russia is one of those give it a very important one mr assad couldn't continue his mass murdering without mr put in perhaps iran is also necessary but we are now in europe and put in as a very important player so again how do you judge put ins roll in this infernal i see russia as a partner in syria and we have said that several times we have said that and it's not only me it's the european union that has stated that and during our last e.u. council meeting here in vienna two weeks ago we said we have to take a pragmatic approach in terms of working together with syria other leaders in
europe in the world also in europe are condemning mr bolton's roads what is the position of the foreign minister. and that is not only my position we have to cast various instances also inside the european union that we have to work with russia in staying inside if you have magic argumentation but behind such an argument asia it is very important to understand. and you have values so firstly i think there has to be a judgment do you condemn it or not and after this then a discussion can happen do you condemn has to put in its role in the middle east and especially in syria yes or no i am not here about condemning i am you are now you know i'm not condemning how many sent thousands of so i allies are done now and i will they were and they were killed by various various actors and also also russia also russia yes so this is a childish way to condemn russia we have conned damned whatever has happened in
syria where alliance is the shah if you are not a ghost i tell you so put in i mean i did you invited rush if i didn't put into your wedding last month and he came why did you invite him to see it for interviews it was a spontaneous act i had met him beforehand we had had a long exchange of. ideas of how we see certain things also in the middle east and he had an interest in my alice's and when he and that's why he's come to you whether to continue to have an analysis about you know international problems do you whether. we also discussed syria so it was not a private meeting it was a private meeting with discussions about syria we also had a very profound counter yes well why didn't you invite merkel. i in why did cherami hand he had no time you were dancing and hugging this tapout putting and why you did that you knew that he is a partner of syrian dictator. both have blood on their hands you didn't have
a guilty conscience no i dance with such a man who is also suppressing his own population is but excuse me. then in that case shall we shake hands with the chinese government shall we shake hands with a number of elements you see don't you think there is a difference between shaking hands and dancing is our game on why most important pride days in your lie. hugging i understand in a different way than you might understand it i didn't how can we dance yes and i have danced with several men in the lottery last symbol i'm going to see a wedding what i have a symbol for example for people who are suppressed and rush you know it was a private even the s. and there is a difference and that's why i understand you have to dial guys you have to meet with the dancers but it is your wedding and you have danced with dance with him exactly yes let me put you in russia is also on the e.u. sanctions because he and their ex crimea and ukraine yes and we have condemned that
and we keep our sanctions and force on that austria had a lot of diplomatic trouble after put in so-called private visit during chancellor sebastian cause a visit to a crane from the foreign minister pablo your colleague klim pm described this invitation as a serious mistake do you agree you know what i know because i know why it's intended and i don't regret it and there was there was this one message can wait by in a in a private meeting that hat but otherwise i mean only or in formula that none of my colleagues whom i had come here ten days after my wedding was discussing that as a result of this is diplomacy you know you but you're also very diplomatic yes but you can if you if you don't like certain things you can say it all you can about you but about where you are but yes and you don't necessarily have to while on the contrary i got concrete relations and from god and seen with mr putin i don't know
what ican cry too late perhaps because you had a wedding imagine that yes the e.u. were adept at sanctions against russia the f.p.o. we supported. the annexation is against sanctions do you back the f.p.o. position we are part of i have been governor and was no we we the government i'm speaking here in my capacity as member of the government and to be the austrian government have based our coalition contract on keeping in tandem with the european union whatever regards the sanction regime so so use that read we have sanctions of course have i ever said anything else the party which nominated you for the post of foreign minister big stream wired to internationalism and immigration of p. or has a five year cooperation agreement with putin is united russia party do you as foreign minister approve of doing deals with the party that helps of stay in autocratic
system i don't comment what parties to i don't comment what deputy said because i mean eighty two you are not a neutral notion you know but they nominated yes and since you also started in france i am a follower of want to see you when it comes to separation of powers and what that putin is to it's up to the deputies to control me it's not up to me to tell the deputies what i do is up to you to have an opinion and such an international issue yes so and i ask him and i'm lucky and i think i am not nominating you don't know i don't comment it's interesting that you're so shy to to give a comment about how i deserve a party yes but i'm absolutely sure shy only that i like to see where the society it was. about mr putin you're more shy about the ad now i'm not shy on all that i like to speak about things which i have in my operated have let's look at me gratian in germany a compromise was stuck between uncle and merc
a city when the bavarian sea is on sending migrants back at the border also to australia as it happens good idea. this idea was not discussed with your saying government beforehand and after water had a series of talks and right now the council of ministers of interior is once again trying to handle that in such a way that we are not stuck with quotas we are not stuck with the reform or at the border but that we try to rein went the entire system in a way that is adapt for the situation said we have the practice all very pretty out of the club practices i was i was at the border and they are rejecting germany is rejecting to austria the austrian government has criticised as you mentioned the deal and promised to take measures to protect australian its people how exactly well what you're talking about are in use from early june we are now in a different subway the difference that the difference is that actually
a charming government has not implemented what they had announced you have spoken of austria taking in refugees after the second world to what from chickasaw of archaea and hungary cloaked a buses full of the elderly the sick and children vote not men with pent up testosterone what do you want to tell the world as a foreign minister by focusing on migrants with up to stop can you please and there's a pent up testosterone. you said the sick and children this was afterword work too and now not men with pent up testosterone i never said that sorry i said that we have i said in october twenty fifteen i wrote the essay for an austrian daily corti plaza based on my book which i offered you beforehand and in my book you can go through the annotation list will find all the sources are on the problems related
to young men who are trying to create a status and it's a fact that in most times of crisis it's women and one rebel who are among the refugees because most of the time you have the man staying behind fighting that was the case in bosnia that was the case in world war one and two now we have a different situation around eighty percent of those who arrived in twenty fifteen twenty sixteen are young men between the age of eighteen to thirty and that this can create a problem i think that as a matter between eighteen and thirty let's say austrian man if he is less pent up with testosterone why did you use this metaphor in relationship in my gracious but . you take one phrase out of a larger context and he doesn't he just explain what is behind us but what is behind that you take one phrase and you don't continue the entire solve the problem is regarded as and i said that in my book and i said that in that very essay that
regard less of the cultural as noble it as background regardless of that at all instances in history you had young men when they are able to create for themselves a status that while lance can follow we had in the middle ages we had it the crusades were one way of channeling out testosterone and that you can also read it in christian missionary to use such a biological argumentation in relationship with migration but you said also that those refugees quote are not people from next door people who share our culture is this a valid reason to refuse to help refugees to survive in the mediterranean and to send them back that they don't share as you think our culture it is definitely a problem when you go into iran for instance and i've been in iran over the last twenty years on a regular level young man from afghanistan who have brought up in iran where more
problematic than ref i wanted to just really different issue when we took for instance refugees in one nine hundred eighty from poland. it was a different issue with the refugees from hungary in one thousand fifty six and it is a fact that when you come from and i've been teaching in some of these courses and i'm a serve have been translating for the first half of twenty five you see that intellectuals who are coming from syria or wherever and i thought i saw very few intellectuals i saw. i met and i was translating for about eight months and i met very few intellectuals they were maybe five percent you met normal people does it mean that they don't have our culture and well i why i because you like the international organizations sorry man i. don't i mean you are you are all the time interrupting so i would just conclude my phrase liar because you dominate the whole thing it's your it's your position that your heroine you can survive or you will then i would
i would be really delighted if i could have just three minutes to develop three minutes is not that we are here in an interview yes and into i've done many interviews in my life but to create so then we are both professionals and first members one is that most of the young man i had been translating for were not of interest they were not to urban citizens of syria because the urban cities of syria had left syria already in the ninety's eighty's because of the political situation that we have or they had remained behind because they were trying to migrate to the last two three there was a handful of them where my from there was but there was a very low percentage most of those who we currently have for instance in various assistance programs now have. a level of education which is basic we do not have to hire a number of academics and this is empirical evidence since in this ministry we are
also in charge of integration and we have seen the fact is about fifty five percent of those who came since twenty five. are recipient of social assistance i am not of the medical thought that i'm aware of that international and u.s. asylum law and the geneva convention don't demand that refugees share of the culture of the receiving countries ice is simply not a growth area but it's that doesn't mean we we took the refugees i just said it was a difference whether you take people from hungary or whether you take people from afghanistan it we also took. after sweden the highest number of refugees per capita this is so it does no conflicts in this in this argument is it possible that we are talking about islam asked if islam belongs to austria you said muslims yes islam no what's the difference the difference is that muslim citizens as
individuals who have made their way in austria whether they came from iran whether they came from my geria they have adapted to austria and they consider themselves first of all as austin citizens and secondly as muslims the other thing is that western muslims yes and that's why i said muslims yes is allowed as an islam is a part of their identity as you just may have shut it's a different story whether you have islam as a legal and normative concept that dominates everything and whether you consider yourself first as a member of but most of more say that islam is a part of your culture though i've learnt a christian is part of austria just as christianity correct. christian is part of what was just as christian and then the meantime we also had enlightenment where we don't ask people what is their religion so why do you ask if somebody is a muslim i don't ask anybody so how do you judge i learn judaism is part of your
country there were some years it was not so clear just as jews are today a part of your country muslims as you said are part of your country but not islam and why specifically this religion is taking out of your general because i myself i believe in secular ideas and i don't ask anybody what is their religion i simply don't ask don't you think that you are and eyeing muslims all strewn muslims and saying that their religion is not a part. you have seven hundred thousand but all straight muslim yellow and we have also all thousands of them who consider themselves as liberals and who don't want to be suppressed by a normative system that they don't identify with so we got the argument the argument is the following secular ideas i don't ask anybody what is your religion i'm simply interested what is your what is your commitment to citizenship i have i
have a last question about that look seven hundred thousand people austral are muslims ten percent of your population more or less they're saying my identity is my nationality my sexual point of view my education and my religion who are you being a representative of the state to tell these austrian peoples your religion is not a part of my country islam no because i only interested in the individual and not in the larger concept of a normative sister. let's talk about another subject one of the most important pillars of the e.u. are democracy and the rule of law another country poland is changing its traditionally most european member states see. that as an attack on the rule of law and have led to the e.u. to launch legal proceedings against it do you agree with the move while my colleague from the government with the bloom is currently presiding this council
meeting so you better go and ask him about it teeters because he's the one he is the one with which our position of austria because we are in this council meetings presiding. interrelation so it's not a matter of whether i agree on this things it is that austria as member state as currently j of the european union is presiding exactly these meetings so i will have the but if i don't understand your if you do you know what i will i will i know i'm sorry they are not slightly i question it was not our generic question things right now i was perhaps not clear like any other i wouldn't oh don't judge questions i don't johnson but you do so i will be more precise. do you think that what the polish government and the hungarian government are doing is a destructive way. that democracy is decreasing in these countries
do you believe that there are for their own population and democracy a bad example. what do you call other number in the case of hunger the case of poland it was a decision by the european commission to start such an interest in the polish government will pay interested in a judgment by the european court of justice in order to have a clear cut find them and we are currently jaring the meetings in order to discuss how certain issues could be resolved in such a way that they comply with rule of law this is the role of austria in that meeting right now and these meetings are chaired by my colleague who is in charge of the e.u. affairs last while it comes to hungary we had there or here it was not a european commission here it was the european parliament and inside the parliament we have different factions and there was a majority vote to also introduce such a procedure and this procedure will most probably also be chaired by our colleagues
in process and therefore also by the austin government what is your point of view about hungary's prime minister orbán. was elected several times once in a ninety nine to stand again eight or ten years ago and. the way he is running his country or whatever i am not commenting because i don't quite want to be commented by other colleagues and i've said various instances that these questions are questions i am not interested in answering because if you had asked me that question ten months ago when i was just an analyst just a commentator yes because i have commented it but i'm not interested in commenting i can understand that you are not interested but you can understand that we are interested you have to listen to the foreign minister and you will have to get on
every who is heading at an hour you know the question is i'm not sure you believe that there aren't other lot do you believe that in the e.u. one country can decide to do whatever the country wants and it's not also your cup of tea i want to quote the report on which any piece based the decision listed about hungary a dozen problem areas including the independence of the judiciary freedom of expression right of migrants and refugees corruption the rights of minorities including roma and jews and you don't think that small comment is necessary everything is going on in europe this is the europe you want to represent us and the democratic europe with human rights and you believe that hungary is representing this too sorry but i'm not in charge of now deciding on who does what in hungary this is up to our common effort that we are currently
undertaking in order to. come back to certain procedures so i want i want to ask this question more general advice do you think that the u.p.a. union. is under good conditions in regard to democracy human rights judiciary not. the fact that we have a strong debate of on the rule of law i think it's irritating because as far as a member of the moment you're trying to european union you have to comply with the so-called copenhagen criteria that were developed in the nineteen ninety s. and here it was all about rule of law we currently have inside the european union various working groups we have the topic of rule of law on council meetings and this in itself i would say is is an irritating development because we are not speaking only about hungary you can start the same discussion on by area on romania
and on many other countries i agreed that's why a lot of countries are not representing the levels we discuss that these would be the levels of europe but practically at this show goes to air you will welcoming foreign ministers in sport and one of the most important sorry excuse mr your long form inside spoke on the twentieth of september to be the heads and state of the government the foreign ministers were here ten days ago i wipe them i will not i when i said will you i meant your government yes then you represent your government and i'm not i if i was going it's not a for a minute that i didn't know that the prime minister not in my west as well but he ok maj and i then just a billionaire. what you thought of bricks of records yes we will discuss that strongly i had several foreign ministers of the united kingdom here. very good working relationship with jeremy hunt and we have a lot of friction inside european union but we do not have any friction when it
comes to prick said highly creative put hugh john and michelle band he got the mandate according to the directives of march twenty seventh team to negotiate on behalf of the e.u. twenty seven and we support him here where we can. with the press it will be a cold bricks and we don't know yet eighty ninety percent of it was stroller cream and. agreed upon the remaining ten twenty percent deal with sticky question of ireland also ireland with the so-called backstops solution who will. taking customs control and this i myself i would go to ireland because i'm aware of the political dimension when it comes to the irish on both sides of the borders i think and i was thank you for being on conflict so for the face to the old. to
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this is here we do is only a firm girl in the head of a key you so much in salzburg austria the chancellor there sends a positive signal to britain over breaks that. we want to do everything possible to avoid the heartbreak could simply be used and ready to compromise but we also expect that from the u.k. . in.