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tv   Business - DW Debate from the Sustainable Development Impact Summit in New York  Deutsche Welle  October 4, 2018 7:15am-8:00am CEST

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follow in a very warm welcome to the door it's a valid debate at the world economic forum sustainable development impact summit in new york i'm sorry kelly today we're having a look at what should be done in an increasingly unstable geo political environment in order to achieve the united nations' sustainable development goals which aim to promote peace wipe out poverty and protect the planet by the year twenty thirty how can security strategies be better aligned with those development goals the challenges are great issues like climate change are increasingly seen as exacerbating conflict as communities clash over vital resources sometimes even being displaced. well look at the challenges and possible solutions joining me now i have a very distinguished panel the c.e.o. of the world bank crystal and ago gave up the secretary general of the organization
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for security and cooperation in europe thomas graham. the president of the enter american development bank luis are there to latino and the african union special envoy on women peace and security into d r thank you so much to all of you for joining us here today ladies and gentlemen please let's give our panel a very warm welcome thank you now before we can talk about possible solutions i just like to get all of your assessments of the current situation because the united nations says the following about violent conflict it says that the number of global conflicts that reach the threshold of war that's more than one thousand people per year dying because of battle battle deaths has more than tripled in the past decade and crystal i'd like to turn to you now because we know that the world bank that your mission is really
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to to lift people out of extreme poverty those people are increasingly living in conflict prone areas. what worries you the most about the state of security in development right now i would add to these three the very significant concerns one is that in the world we can celebrate. the decline of extreme poverty over the last twenty five years a staggering one point two one billion people have been lifted up out of poverty in that same world in sub-saharan africa and in other parts of the middle east in particular that the conflict affected extreme poverty is growing and it is growing with a troubling speed so if we have to meet this goal of end the extreme
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poverty we have to worry about peace is security first and found foremost secondly we need to recognize that when there is a conflict then many other problems that are very severe for example but they mix right now in the democratic republic of congo there is yet another. way. and what is on the way of stopping war what we can see is that this. lack of security ease hitting people was in twice entry times and the third thing that worries us tremendously is what you mention the beginning vulnerability to climate change countries that have. least to contribute to climate change very often.
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the most to suffer the consequences of it and yet we are not balancing investing in mitigation which is hugely important we also investing in the station so conflicts what they do for health like a federal case sion lack of social services. and climate then when you have this poisonous cocktail then the result these children we mean men with life since they were state and i'd like to perhaps a bit later we can talk a little bit more height about how you address that potential devastation but first i'd like to turn to your thomas because as a regional security organization the o.s.c. a has been very early very heavily involved right now in eastern ukraine where
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we're seeing the tensions between russia and the west on full display and so i'd like to ask you what concerns you about security and development right now but as you say violent conflict has come back to europe. in the fifth year of. this conflict. and this is very much top of our agenda and you know you see. because it creates tremendous suffering it kills practically on a daily basis it kills people civilians combatants but it also undermines very severely the trust and confidence among. the key stakeholders of your planting in duration security luis are there to back to
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turn to you now because we know that your bank is one of the large or rather the largest long term lender in latin america and the caribbean what are your concerns about security and development how do you see it progressing right now in your region that in american there went the period of in the one nine hundred eighty s. which was typically denominated as the last think because this was a time when you found many countries restructuring their heads with very little will tweets with many countries in recession for long periods of time and there must have been during that period alone. then or to a financial crisis the paradox is that during that time the crime rates were far lower than they are today in fact latino america to be which has roughly about eight percent of the world's population has roughly forty percent of the homicides of the. that it's a very astonishing number and if you look at it you know it just between the year
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two thousand and now it's almost in the last twenty years it's almost two and i have million this which is you just to put it in comparisons that's five times the number of people who have lost their lives in this syrian civil war or twenty five times that of iraq so this is perhaps the most difficult issue left in american governments after the in fact when you review what you know to be called polls are done much of the focus of people is not about jobs but their economic situation but rather it's about issues of security and the surrounding issues of transparency and so as a result we as a bank have had god you know to participate in this we cannot do as a development bank gazing surrounding the fence but certainly everything around you know helping to create citizenship helping to work with. police forces in how they
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are ball are nice in working with communities in working with the way people are put in jail. you know the whole brisson population is dealt with but this is a very serious issue and certainly it's an issue that is yes across the emerging world but nothing less acute as it happens in the primary. intent like to turn to you to answer this next question because we know that you focus on women peace and security on the african continent you're very much often the voice of the voiceless. what keeps you up at night when you think about security and development i think it's. i have spent most of my life in conflict zone because. you know when we took a bite conflict the first country then you look at things africa unfortunately. but i also say that when you talk about this d g you don't know if the face of
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african women or a young african men that's the reality so for me is that when i wake up and i see the people suffering i say to something can be done something can be done when we look at. this nexus between discussing between net peace security and development for me in the middle there the human being let me give you one or two example. i recently visited. last year i went to nigeria in northern nigeria this year with. i mean my met the prettiest gee we did a joint mission to go to lake chad by saying we did take joy and michelle and we went on to so to see other places like chad but also new shares
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and the situation of the people the young people and the women in those camps to see what needs to be done those country are really investing as i could see lectured by sand or decide. they are investing a lot on the military and when we look at tutu and the military there little they happy maybe four percent of their g.d.p. should be invested what then that on to people needs the men who was the one supposed to be in the mix and bringing the fish and selling it outside their job is no longer because it doesn't bring anything. so you found them roar with who. book.
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because they don't drop their nor longer unique upand the women that do one went to need a small board so we need to invest in development seriously. and investment i'm not just saying just give them the small investment like we see with t m divisions traffic you don't we used to see parties really investment because they really invest when for me this country you have sun. say victory. because we can do that is possible great investment on the infrastructure and this new technology and this is something that i think that we want to explore further in our conversation also i think that there there there is currently investment i know that germany and
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france for example best in the region involved there but first we'd like to actually turn to a poll that we conducted on twitter we actually wanted to gauge the mood and see perhaps what was important also for others when it comes to. what do you think is most important to create global political stability and here were the answers check this out forty percent of people said empowered civil society. a lemon percent of people said strong diplomatic ties and forty nine percent said global economic stability and into i mean really to your point you're talking about investment and i'd also like to ask you about that because i mean that that's also very much what you do how do you see global economic stability create contributing to political stability perhaps you can give us some examples of some success stories where you've seen it work and how perhaps those lessons can be applied and
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extrapolated upon well it's certainly going to mix the east the road towards other forms system really the country that we see in the precision creates tremendous response to say that the many years to call it this is where i was saying earlier about the the decade of the two got a long long time until societies were able to bring trust back again so it's critical to have not only the economic stability but the also society and the wider society to be believing and trusting institutions and this is i think probably the biggest that we have to be i think knowledge ease or we can augment that and make governments far more transparent but this more and more it's made empowered citizens and i see it you know certainly around love in america that
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they'll sell a form cell phone penetration the numbers of smartphones people to the have no boundaries through their through the technology that they are offered and as a result they want to learn more and there is a huge demand for knowledge but at the same time there is still a lot of lack of trust in institutions where there's the lack of trust come partly from crime partly from corruption and this is at the heart of what creating the. sense of unity that societies the. powers both economic growth an equally strong you know she would say so you've got a technology there and you part product trust and thomas perhaps i can ask you because we've actually seen technology as a tool in eastern ukraine for example very powerful one in order to promote this information for example and so i'm wondering what opportunities you might see to
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build trust. all i think should start be diggin a serious attempt to listen to each other try to understand acknowledge differences . identify areas where interest converge and then try to cooperate on those areas. where we see this converging interests and so try to rebuild trust and confidence in then but of course at some point in time and this takes us back to ukraine devo have to also come to terms the situations if we want to. systematically. tackle this distrust issue i want to talk a little bit more about moving beyond crisis response to also talking about crisis prevention and turn to you. because selena how do you promote that
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culture as a leader but the. obvious statement is that. to have. a conflict prevented in human suffering an economic cost is much better than to have to lift treat the economic case is very clear one dollar in prevention sixteen dollars saved in the for the economy but then the question is how can we build this culture of prevention and it goes through two things one the concentration of financial resources in countries that are at the brink of a conflict and the determination to stay engaged be there there is simply no substitute for that could reach of conviction and fine nation resources
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to be paired with this character of convictions that could. make the difference between a conflict exploding and a conflict actually receiving we have seen that happening we also have seen seen the. critique ali of different parties coming together and this is my second point it is about partnerships of course your screen tell told the something that is the fact the play they have to be people that luckily they feel strongly about achieving peace right and that even gauge with the empowerment of bottom up civil society organizations we mean corporate thieves this is hugely important but then we need to have the development community the human he thought and community and political security community all coming together we have
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been for far too long fragmented things you would have the development cycle actors people like me who say let's see when the conflict is over we will come and do very good development and then you would have the humanitarian community that is there struggling but would say this development people they really don't understand insecurity we have no space for that kind of fragmentation we ought to come together and also benefit from new technologies that actually allow us to see the invisible to pick up what comes from social media as a signal that something is going wrong then you could better hope to see well see we invest some people. we don't help on the infrastructure we don't give support to a member state but you seem fair some to people because even if we want to prevent
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i think that is where we had that missing link and that's where investment should be when we talk about and i talk about energy because i think we need to be up there west to talk about the investment in really investment bring the like to do all investment bring water to the people investment how do you do that though in some areas where you might have bad governance for example how do you get around that you know i was listening to the debate this year of the head of state fifty five was saying to we are going to fight corruption so i said my good yes they will fight corruption but less empowered the people because even power the people lead the people will be the one custody and of that policy that they have signed and it's great that they didn't say we are going to fight corruption and
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signed the policy but the accountability mechanism you should put it in the people of the in the hands of the people the women and the young they will be demanding and with their media and now you can ask their children you can go out and talk about accountability so empower the people and that is where the difference even when we talk about prevention i have seen now in africa when we have come to elections so much violence into our election not just africa but elsewhere how do we want to prevent those is give the tools empower them help them see make sure that this civic action be part of the parcel of that there will comparisons. and in the quantum and tell us a little bit more about women being involved in that process how important is that how do you see progress on that as an issue you know. i always say that when you
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give to power to do women you can see the difference. great difference because you bring a mob round you bring our own issues we bring our humanity well i'm not saying that the men are not because we need to be working together and in men's but they're the women not the one that guardian of the society especially in our culture enough to come so i think the message that i'm hearing is that more can be done if we are working together and therefore. lose money and i like to ask you what examples are you seeing in your region do you see opportunities for n.g.o.s private sectors governments even different regions for example because obviously there's a lot to be learned from latin america as well to work together more the question on there is actually around the geos and foundations here in this year through the
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shrub foundation we have worked very closely and basically highlighting those people who are doing great work and you know there's a lot of social innovation that's taken place in that in america things like the so-called conditional kustra for programs which were focused on the notion that you have kids who were you know were in the labor market and their age. with government programs basically focus at the fact that not only do you want good health for their children their mothers especially but equally to transfer money from the government such that the completed high school programs and through that there's been a lot of. social innovation taking place for instance a big movement led by businesses in many countries to improve the quality of education to do it in you seeing you know really you know open classrooms ways
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where you can have what they call reverse classrooms for the children do their homework in the class with the teacher on then. here through most of online courses different. parts of the teacher training. so there's a lot of things that have been you know a whole host of areas where there's been a lot of social innovation in the area for instance of micro credit lots of things have happened there in the ways of how to monetize and turn remittances which we are probably one of the regions of the world that received the largest amounts of remittances and i'm talking here hispanics or latino americans living outside of loving america be the united states or europe so it is around programs like this working with the civil society the we have found very successful problems and we do work and do a lot of effort to reach out to those groups to bring them along side programs that we're doing with government do you find that you have enough dialogue though with
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other wheelchairs with other organizations would you like to see more of that for example cause i mean you're highlighting some success stories here i think that you know people might be interested in that know definitely we certainly you know we we work a lot across of course with the world bank but equally with regional development banks for instance we're doing helping supporting something that africa their own bank is doing in trying to bring investment to the african continent we're bringing a good luck in america has to be fired of the in focused on energy there's a lot of renewable energy solutions that have been developed in that in america so certainly you know looking at everything that has been done for instance around the location in asia there's a tremendous amount of expertise there are things that have been done around the areas of logistics again from asia bringing those experiences throughout the americas elise kind of cross-fertilization across not only only policies but equally how different groups who are in this space can work together
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a fascinating assessment of how it's working on the development fund thomas i'd like to turn this now to ask you how it's working on the security front in terms. collaboration in terms of seamlessness because i was recently listening to general john allen the former coalition commander in afghanistan speaking and he really emphasized this seamlessness that is necessary the communication between development and security how the two go hand in hand are intertwined and it's difficult to make meaningful progress on one without the other do you think that we are getting better at that today is that communication getting better i would certainly very much support this i think it was made secretary of coughing on. the recent no security without if you will of. i think that shows this. already. many years ago show since brooch of trying to link security
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and and development i want to talk now about money funding how you achieve the sustainable development goals and with that i'd like to turn to you christina because i know that you used to run. the budget in europe for humanitarian efforts. and right now and you perhaps you know the numbers a little bit better than i do so please forgive forgive me if i don't have them exactly. aid right now is something in the hundreds of billions the cost of achieving the sustainable development goals i know it's a big poster outside it said that it was seven built trillion a year that's a very big gap isn't it. a huge gap it is also a tremendous opportunity for those of us who work in development finance to rethink
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how we use the billions and it has become a popular slogan for a reason third being frome. billions to trillions by using public money to create the enabling environment for private investments to flaw we have this interesting solvable problem on the one hand we have in the hands of people businesses countries trillions in savings that are sitting idle i was just a so surprised that cash that we keep at home or under the mattress maybe in some cases top those some five trillion dollars so the question the solvable problem me to create the incentive and the. platform for this money
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to flow into the developing world what is necessary for that well there this is not a. miracle it is very straightforward one you need in countries policies that give the investors certainty that they invest what they best in is not going to be nationalize. bone it's. lost so bet is very important for countries to do to create that certainty for the investor too we need good projects we need projects that you can actually see from the beginning of from beginning to end how we did structured what we did do how it is going to be procured and implemented and then three we need to have the confidence of the people in the
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countries that this investor is not going to come and just rip them off. so in the end when you look at it it is all about trust and conditions for many to move so institutions like ours the development banks we are fast transforming into a transmission lie that create this conditions for trust we have for right now on our books at the bank seventy two projects that we structured that dealing with institutional weaknesses the project itself bringing private investment including from pension funds from long term investors are we there yet not quite i really had it in the right direction yes for sure. but with a better how do we get there no i look just to build on what we saw you know was
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saying another way of saying these we basically have a platform that reaches countries in terms of their development needs but clearly there needs to be more and we need to multiply and think that we are for every dollar that we put in of our own financing that we can bring some of the thousands and billions of dollars that are there are trillions like you know it's eighty five dollars sitting in private pension funds managers insurance companies and the rest what we need to do is to begin to. create all of the instruments that paid the money moving through our system and i think from the perspective of the owners of those. savings there's a tremendous up in tight to do good. with your save so beyond development
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assistance you feel that the private sector is willing well i definitely think the private sector. has a tremendous interest in being in there's some issues of risk that we still need to continue to be smart in how we need to we mitigate you know are you giving a loan to a con to be. you know in u.s. dollar denominated their dories of the local currency there's a big difference you know who takes that foreign exchange risk you know you've got to understand those risks of the private sector see which ones of those you can help me to give by using what we call blended finance which is using some of the development finance resources and with that multiply what we're doing so this is what we are all collectively wrestling with but i think we are as we said in a correctly say we're in the right direction but we're way behind where we should be i mean. if i if i if i may just to a very quick additional point so that one is examples because your sake ok is this
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really happening take solar in africa it used to be so expensive that it didn't really make economic sense but then we build this kind of platform in which we aggregate the all projects possible and we said to the private private sector here is certainty they will be consumer and there would be that minimal price and guess what the cost of delivering solar in africa has collapsed it is now so cheap that it is abundant and the question is how to continue to scale it up one example to we mean so we know we mean our fan past the in terms of paying back money they borrow so we are now you know a phone could be a device to spread hate and anger but the phone can be
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a bank and well we have done is smart simply increase small. credits for women and the printers and i and you can see how that transforms communities and makes that link between your savings and a woman in. say kenya makes that link possible and says this is for the two when they really bravo to germany germany created the so-called compact with africa any dissolve about that good policy is more investments and then to see not in your head or is it ok to make a national when we're talking about the partition of germany and and i just want to mention because you recently convened i know the second forum for the africa women leaders network and this was done with the support of germany we know what we're
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talking a lot about what more can be done we talked about where one money could come from and i'm just wondering from your perspective also. who would you like to see more done from i mean it isn't is it a matter of investing more in africa from from which from which areas which are like to see. when you ask me this question of where do we want europe to come in is to building the skills of the african but also allowing african migrants to facilitate that came back and to be part of the class one mission of our continent some country have a huge growth rate many of them we could see because we are building infrastructure port it's airport and so what look also use builds the capacity of the
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people when it comes to als when you've come to education with did come to you name so this is what we need to learn from europe. so we think that europe and africa to go back to debase it either we say that colombia issues let's go back in could be europe reason or for that let's also transform our industries this more we don't have those small and medium entreprise and there it's growing now with the young people but listen vests on that saw so many calls on this stage and i'm really hearing this for just more to be done generally speaking and thomas therefore i'd like to ask you because you know as the o. a c. a you very much have this need to respond to crisis very quickly and there is a call right now i think it's fair to say that the o.s.c. do more than the have thirty grow up over the year is. an
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impressive toolbox in terms of. conflict prevention that is what you refer to. us where you would in reaction. we have tools for instance to prevent minority related conflict by commission national minority. we have. to see in terms of preventive diplomacy that these one offer and then of course the tools to manage conflict. make sure that the conflict does not spin out of control that the stupid people we're currently doing in. but also you know call a cop out. in church or. insurance mr but then we also try to bring these conflicts closer to resolution here you need tools on the wall but you also need political parties if you want to resolve these
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conflicts and then thirdly. we have also tools that i would argue fall into the category of peace building. and that is very much contribution to building strong institutions democratic institutions. in the area of the rule of law. which again i think then come to you to an enabling environment for economic activities for investment that is always see on offer at the end of the day it depends. on participating states to call on these tools so you cannot impose particularly not. the conflict management tools on the anybody so it's a matter of political will in building up political will as well and ladies and gentlemen i'd just like to say that for our session i would like to leave us on
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a positive note perhaps we don't have so much time left but in the time left that we do have i like to ask all of our catalyst two questions what's on your wish list and what do you think that we can achieve together this year in terms of security and development so wish lest what can we achieve this year this is our action plan because we're moving from crisis response to crisis prevention because selena. number one on my wish list is conflicts are often protracted they they flare they come and they flare again our attention tends to be with a short span fixie stay focus for as long as he takes so they can be sustainable peace but i just kind of building on the same i
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think the fundamental issue is that sometimes we know problems are happening and we're slow in reacting to. and as we are slowing reacting to them they only get worse of saying the same in a different way what we said you know was improve speed so definitely the speed we have for instance right now be humanitarian crisis in venezuela people leaving and going throughout the hemisphere of the world bank that are fascinating fund to support people who are going largely from syria to jordan and to live with you know this is a the big problem the more you let it fester the more these problems become big and secondly i think the capacity to to get that focus and the week we auction of governments to deal with these problems becomes essential what can we achieve within the next year i hope that we can continue to keep this focus on the need.
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these development issues you really have to think out of the box but work together thomas i'd like to ask you what's on your wish list what do you think we can achieve in life and political leadership. political leaders that are ready to reinvest in a rule based global order being strong multilateral institutions into what's on your wish list by reshoots to make sure that all african member states have a plan of action i started with twenty two but if i am able to get war african women people countries women contributing being part of mediation in prevention women leaders in all spheres of life i think we will get so many wishes to make sure that that agenda of women peace and security is a widespread enough and on that positive note i would like to say i hope that we
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have had a bit of insight today on the importance of security and development and i think we have some hopeful message messages that we are. leave which today you've been watching the door to bella debate at the world economic forum in new york many thanks to our panelists here today and we do hope for progress on these issues thank you joe. thank. you. enjoy the conflict zone with tim sebastian. i'll be challenging those in power asking tough questions demanding. as comes rigs intensify i'll be meeting with key players on the ground in the sense as i'm. cutting through the rhetoric
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holding the powerful to account for the conflicts of. conflict zones like zone victims of the region spondee w w. w come to learn from but and let's go right to our correspondent me is in central istanbul and we have our political correspondent you're in the studio you're watching the w.'s why from berlin. it's all about the perspective closer to. a good day. i'm not going to think. well i guess sometimes i am but i stand up and whip it up and meet a german thinks deep into the german culture of looking at the stereotype clad but if you think you see from the pentagon i don't blame. you needed to rethink this
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grandma. it's all about ok the new i'm rachel joins me from the gym. indeed you. post. this is d. w. news coming to you live from berlin the aquarius sales for the french court of law are say after his registration is canceled it could mark the end of independent missions saving migrants from drowning in the crossings broke africa will take you live to a member of the crew also coming up. indonesia finally accept foreign aid after
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last week's earthquake six days all the survivors are still waiting desperately for help seventy thousand people.


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