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tv   Conflict Zone  Deutsche Welle  July 18, 2019 12:30pm-1:01pm CEST

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he stopped in time. and i asked him to do a reserve or didn't make any and then i killed many civilians i mean. come becoming my father while. i was a student i wanted to build a life for myself. but suddenly life became our kind of song. providing insights global news that matters d. w. me for mines. we can make china a peaceful country if you ever said no to beijing yes many times i'm telling you the facts why don't you list the politicians in taiwan being out campaigning in presidential primaries ahead of next year's election with the topic of relations with china very much on the agenda i guess this week outside the capitol. chose
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she way who's been seeking the nomination probating policy. as china pushes with increasing reunification and the taiwanese continue to reject its. party to offer. the way welcome. thank you very much for inviting me. you said the only way to resolve antagonism between china and 2 i one is to talk and to love. to know your lover china that is threatening taiwan both verbal and militarily and holding a sword over your head continually how do you love what world does your impression actually if you talk to some chinese in mainland china as long as you don't support separation from china they are not treat you like that they are not attack you
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don't say the wrong thing other was right and you know you are normalize that you think that's a normal way to live the power across 180 kilometers of the straits as to you if you say the wrong thing you finished was doing i don't think it's that serious you have exactly 0 keep saying i think you have to talk to each other if you try to visit china so call the china we call the mainland ok we are taiwan our mainland we together is that china is a one china war if you think the threats from china is so serious to taiwan why do european people all the people around the world are all the members up in the end try to work with china try to have dialogue with china try to solve problems it's true that you know that as well as i do it's not a human rights record is there we can disagree we can do that too apart from trade
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what exactly this democratic time i was having common these days with one party communist china you have free elections yes you will change your party in power they don't you have independent courts they know you have a free press they don't you can speak out against abuses of power and they can't what on earth have you got in common with mainland china. i think we should emphasize differences. go there work with them be their friends be their brothers and change that instead of being their enemies go there walk with them you can change them like what do you were doing with them now what are you going to do a country about human rights what i'm not going to announce that you can change them what on earth is the evidence what you see the trade surplus china with malin rights you see a lot of changes in hong kong recently why china is not using force to press down the demonstration why the compromise why because they seek opportunity
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to prove they can change they came pruitt will come on to hong kong a little later i want to go into some detail on that but the serious issue is the military pressure from china is that even 2 years ago your government's national defense report highlighted concerns that chinese military activity near taiwan posed an enormous threat to security in the taiwan straits now just a few days ago you had washington saying that china stepped up its pressure seen the largest increase in military activity around taiwan for 20 years and you think that's meaningless why us say china is going to interfere at a lecture in tell you why and sold us as coming here to interfere in taiwan is a lecture you happy with these bullying turnouts because that's what they are i'm not happy about bullying thing but i'm not what i was doing i'm happy about you know we can do persons with each other we can ask the china to make changes we are
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the only people on earth believe that we can make that happen we can make china a peaceful country where you look back at the history who are the invaders who are the invaders japan right who participated the wars in asia. if you want to live in history do you want to live in the now i want you to live in the present in modern design sure people i want you i want to make history clear who are the invaders ok if you want to be someone's enemy then they will be your enemy if you want to be someone's friend all if only i didn't as you have if only. let me tell you one thing while think why us is selling out of 16 to taiwan instead of 35 and the us is selling at 35 to korea to japan to singapore to other countries why the united states gave the galley island to to japan instead of taiwan
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it was our territory why the us is doing that to taiwan this show. vice president of the taiwan foundation for democracy said last month that moved on to more taiwanese feel their nation is now under. threat and you seem to be out of touch with that feeling totally luci you don't feel i'm very i think a lot of the reality i feel the reality i know how to deal with the chinese in mainland. i know the facts i know you have to give you'll do them you don't have to deal with them as a politician i tried to deal with them when i was the mayor here at the the big city mayor i work with the city in one gene i try to communicate with them i try to work with them try to ameliorate carbon emission environmental issues education issues will work with them about
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a dozen matic front where they continue to squeeze you where they ramp up the pressure where they try to persuade countries to drop their recognition diplomatic recognition that you did that you not curiosity china didn't remember this you lost indian 28 teams for the right to chinese russia you are now back in a 2nd using engine fake you you recognize china you don't recognize the the republic of china you will recognize me because you and i'm going to be about republicans and we were talking about china is taiwan we were there representatives of china before 971 and the u.n. i talk. about in history and this is going to be artistic you know i'm telling the fact we consist here the are we seeing this is here and that's what you called the taiwan but you never knew i couldn't that is the hour see here you recognize the p.r.c. writes what in the e.u. when i read an article recently we hear 21 china policy as regards to taiwan
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and hong kong and ice i think you should be defined like this we are here to one china policy as regards to mainland taiwan hong kong and a mock up. you are not talking about china that continues to thwart taiwan's participation in the international organizations like the world health organization and interpol for instance you want to be members of those organised want to china and i want you to help us is trying to stop it why you agreed. if you know being asked why do you never criticize your maybe i just as i must pay attention everybody when you say that everyone no no men trying to do you really want to i didn't say that we've read a lot of i have a bunch of science to express my opinion about china is no toys are going to set up this is wrong this is what tell you i have here one more thing the un the e.u.
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even germany you recognize the p.r.c. you don't recognize the scene and i truly hope one day you recognize the hour see you know how to participate doubly h. o. ok i and you see the chinese on the lock about you know what we did not do their best they should try to talk we were talking as what we should try to those results i didn t. intend to such great reality that candy did that candy tried to talk to mainland china time they tried and sounded trite yet they tried to do let us put is a magic show especially today h. o. and i see a or mr cho beijing is clearly losing patience with taiwan and while you dream of some vague love in between taipei and the mainland china is crystal clear what it wants from you and that's reunification and it refuses to rule out the use of force to get it doesn't it and you live with that and you
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normalize that on a daily basis ok in our constantly saying to the not you can unfasten you couldn't possibly constitution ok there is only one china policy. and that includes mainland taiwan hong kong and in my car that's in our constitution we should buy it by our country's constitution right you're being told by xi jinping as you were in january unification is an inevitable requirement for the great rejuvenation of the chinese people he said taiwan should accept that it must and will be reunited with china whatever talks you've been having with china hasn't got them out of the vat idea and how many people in taiwan want that reunification under 3 percent do or about that are going to worry about what the rand paul think about you don't know you've already got people up i think but don't worry about their threatening words you're going to stand up to those threatening words what we stand up to you won't
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we stand up to that but you know the remember iran must and we're ok we're knighted with china who doesn't want to marry have you tried to take a lot of our constitution have you tried to take a look of loss to show you our laws what china are saying in our laws and in our constitution we want a peaceful relationship we want to unification. the people who go through the people in our law and the constitution people they didn't it doesn't matter what their country why i don't want them to try to amend the constitution that's your perception our people here want to have a peaceful relationship with the mainland and we want to make money we want to do business together we want to have a democracy in the future in mainland china but not. against them not taking down s. and anime trying to be their friends and a tragic change them by participation perhaps like what you do and where do you go
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that's working so well as to the reality of it is mr joe the beijing's push on unification puts your party the kuomintang into a very difficult position doesn't it your veteran china expert suchi actually said that he said she didn't ping took away all the space for ambiguity and that puts us the kuomintang in a very difficult situation that difficulty being that your party is being told get on with this by china and you don't have a policy of standing up to it do you do have a policy. i declared adds i claim that i want to unify china i want to unify under taiwan the last young chance 23000000 people want taiwan against the courage it was made i believe that in my capacity i did see one sentence it's fantasy you have to remember there are 3 that happened. in the world you have to understand history in the world what's happening now unification
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separation yes yes that's the process unification separation separation unification. that's a track of the history but there is one thing very important not i also learned wrongs never mind the track of why should you try because your story is just words is the track of your users it's the fact the question is what people want to know human nature is that the vast majority of your population do me a favor wants unification to me of a time or have you ever stood up to china i stand out if you ever said you answer them i stand up for the republic of china have you ever said no to beijing yes for many times what's wrong with human rights issues yes really yes because when i was active was. actually acts and they happened so that was 30 years ago i'd be told them i had 2 years whenever i went to china i told them you need to introduce democracy to your society or they're listening you know the u.s. attorney so was he the 1st of the brightest crackdown in 25 years taking place on
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human rights activists human rights watch reported last year human rights defenders continue to enjoy arbitrary detention imprisonment and in force disappear yes and you say nothing about. have you heard i said anything about that i get just now i even told them i even told them because you don't know my history the only way i have the many dialogues with them i told them you have to improve that's human rights that's international standards of treating your people i told them to ok i have to tell you one thing if you don't participate if you don't join them if you don't treat them like they can improve their nothing good is going to happen you know what i did live here it's a fine line between that and the peace movement isn't it yes it's a very fluid and fine line it's very ambiguous but you have to do that from your heart. people know that but never spoken up for the tiny taiwanese democracy
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activists leaving che it's more than living chait's more than 2 years since he was forcibly disappeared you haven't heard of him believe me chair it's more than 2 years since he was forcibly disappeared by police in china's province and charges subversion of state power he's a citizen of taiwan you don't talk about you don't even though he's now you know he's in terrible conditions human rights groups around the world have been campaigning for his release you know one of our governor sentenced to 5 years in jail can't get phone calls can't get letters 4 times his wife was prevented from from going to china to visit. and you know his rights are being around 20 years ago i tried to talk to chinese commoners to release an espionage suspects a lady who just got married and it was released recently i talked to our
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government. when calming down was the ruling party and they didn't step in they didn't try to rescue her she was sentenced to death however in jail for 20 years and just a year ago she was released probably just at the in this year she was released and look what the people here have done to help human rights you know we should try to work together and we should try to talk to them and what the government here do let's talk about hong kong again you mentioned earlier the view interview and you were you were praising china that they have shown restraint with the demonstration not praising them for that who started this in the 1st place ok that's the law right. for what the demonstrators will tell you that it
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was a constant erosion of their freedoms under the one country 2 systems for me that forced them onto the streets anywhere the denial of universal suffrage the kidnapping of booksellers the banning of a political party. the prevention of elected legislative council is taking their seats because they didn't like the politics that constant erosion of freedom under the one country 2 systems that's the system that she is offering you one country to notice them i suggest you take a look what's been happening here in taiwan in the arrow see the ruling party p.p.p. who claimed they would protect human rights there is a minority no i have to tell when it embarrasses anything happening here that's the reason why it's so embarrassing because our ruling party is trying to marshal law here doing something even worse and there is one law are related to national
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security you know that's what they are doing here our ruling party here in of course we created size the hong kong government especially the council tried to establish a law which your hong kong residents disagree and it doesn't trust sold that little utilities casual back to you the chief executive you carry land the chief exec she's beijing's appointing russian history they are pointy even so-called elected by some hong kong representation of a. more ask how can people. that's come from people is there democracy is serious system ask hong kong people we come back to the question and this is the one thing is important they withdraw the last draft right they've suspended it they said it was not they still there then said they have said it's deb's and said they would drop because they did something wrong there in the minute
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i think there's something proceeding with it but not now that's that's what's happening before now they say their words. you're satisfied it's over now i'm not satisfied about that i'm worried about what's happening here in taiwan and the one country 2 systems formula that she jinping has offered to taiwan we do ads read the that or that's not going to happen that's not going to happen then you mean hong kong is not going to have a different systems from china system isn't the last thing i think the system what should exist because that's the the window shop for chinese they should to show that improvement of democracy to the world how consistent is the show isn't give don't try to violate that it's going to embarrass them just to show isn't a lesson that you should take away from hong kong is that china doesn't live up to its promises of democracy isn't that the lesson i think and i think talking and
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one thing i love china i don't live up to the note on this i do think we should try to change then we should try to improve them you should 1st say no to them well how do you know i didn't say no to them i've doing that i've been doing that for so many years every time i visited china i talked to them. i say improve your system especially a democratic system and they step up their interference was there let's look at the propaganda war that's being waged against taiwan a study by the university of gothenburg in sweden said you're one of china's major targets for spreading disinformation happy about direct interference well i think the article you all see so called taiwan should be more more opened to outside world especially western society or avoiding we question are doing is just
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information campaign here while china is trying to do that but other countries also try to do that too i think we should take active actions in solving their problems well they're open society but not open enough to the outside world to take a look how many english speaking channels here so take a look about how many how much international media are existing here in taiwan we're not exposed enough to the outside world however the politicians here tried to close the door china trying to close you know we are one we. know should we or you know we we emphasize local lies ations so much instead of internationalization that's what you don't want to see more than here is who do you know when you really miss ourself 1st you don't want to admit it now we want to improve ourselves too we also want to improve china remember i want to take active
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active process active approach to china to make china change this idea that you can make sure the chileans which frankly is pretty much of a long shot why should people vote for your. walk if you're selling fantasies like that why no we're not selling fantasy. be realistic it's a difficult competition. one of you trying to realize what p.p.p. can do p.v.p. is the one who can't see lois really election why don't you take a look what we're fighting for where fighting for true democracy here and good b.b.c. ruling democracy while trying to build up a peaceful relationship with china with the mainland we're trying to create a better society here we're trying to introduce your systems your values
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here to taiwan we're trying so hard to do that if we want to convents of people here that camp he can rule this country perfectly well then we have to respect the democracy we have to open our society to the outside world we have to be honest to our people the bad by our ruling party is cheating our people well the bad news for you is that a plurality of taiwanese 45 percent don't identify with your party or the ruling d.p.p. to take a look take a look at you're right you're right they don't trust the parties here yeah they don't trust us they don't trust them they don't trust our party you're not saying anything that they think is relevant what i believe they're what they are saying its relevance we realise the fact already people don't trust the parties here people don't trust the politicians here which is why i would trust you i mean you you said in the 2nd probably debate we're going to have some problems you claim that the number of time when these people below the poverty line was believed to be
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around 3200000. which is suppressed simply not true which is simply not true it's true that if you research on no taiwan proportionally contains fewer people living in poverty than any other country and you know nobody of almost no time no i mean i met them in less than 2 years all of them to us and to me patients leave you know when i was to me here in time the county. they are around one quarter of the students can afford their lunch that's one quarter if you times that proportion to the total population here in taiwan and tell me in fact a number right balance hello i'm telling you the fact that's not the facts that's the fact i'm telling you the fact why don't you listen almost no time when he is live on less than $1.00 u.s. dollars a day that's noble part out of the doubt that is that really the heart of poverty
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that's growing all over the nation and part of poverty is different or really might have been a relative of the unity of not knowing who yes relative to every minute yet that's my definition and ubiquitous as my donation you live in so i can tell you if any student cannot afford their lunch then he's and his family is living in poverty that's my definition if it all goes wrong here in taiwan and she jinping loses patience and somebody says something they shouldn't say and china looks as though it's moving towards an invasion would you fight for taiwan or not where do your out some of loyalties lie with the child loyal to our country the republic of china well loyal to our constitution. you would you fight your showing yes yes yes yes date violates our constitution to preserve and protect our people
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and defend our people i'll fight against china so she way it's good to have you thank you thank you for.
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the book. freedom of movement. it's a reality that affects a number of private. businesses. what opportunities to secure flight.
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benefits what's the potential for abuse. and 13. loko to the girl next new to. the good line of stewards. with exclusive. must see concerning starting. to be curious minds. do it yourself networkers. subscribers don't miss. howes if you don't know. where i come from the goal is that to get to cisco it's just like with chinese food so that's
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a measure of where i am bilious reminds me of home after decades of living in germany chinese food is one of the things i miss the most but by taking a step back i see things in a ton of different terminology many of fluids 1st as undergo nations that exist as a part of the law which haven't been implemented in china pads and you undock up china it's a poor one knowing if their foot isn't safe but if you have a ride to another that is this is their job just under so much how i see it i doubt the supply enough of my job because i tried to do it except maybe a day by name of the uninsured and i wore the attitude that you.
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this is did abuse line from trump's racist taunts against 4 minority lawmakers browns his republican base i am. his supporters say stand back will trumps riffs on race helped him win another term in the white house also coming out those calls are worrying undocumented migrants
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who've made their homes in the u.s. we have a special report on one mother forced to make a difficult choice. classical.


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