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tv   Risk and Reward With Deidre Bolton  FOX Business  January 5, 2016 5:00pm-6:01pm EST

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david: the new apsays it can different between four distinct crying sounds, hungry, tired, in pain or wet diaper. >> i made excuse for this. i could have used it last knight. 1:00 in the morning baby crying. oh, well. went back to sleep. david: risk and reward starts right now. >> we don't beat bad guys by taking our guns. we beat bad guys by keeping our guns. i will rescind every executive order barack obama has entered. >> you're supposed to cajole, get people in a room, deal with them, you have republicans, democrats, all these people, they get elected to do this stuff. you're supposed to get together and pass a law. he doesn't want to do that because it is too much work. so he doesn't want to work too hard. he wants to go back and play positively. >> the right to worship freely and safely. that right was denied to christians in charleston, south carolina. [applause]
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that was denied jews in kansas city. that was denied muslims in chapel hill. and sikhs in oak creek. so gun lobby may be holding congress hostage right now but they can not hold america hostage. we do not have to accept this carnage as a price of freedom. [applause] deirdre: president obama seeking to expand back drown checks on gun purchases and tighten rules for some semi-automatic sales. this is risk and reward. i'm deirdre bolton. in another set of executive actions, the president called out congress and gun lobbiest. >> i want to be clear congress needs to act. the folks in this room will not rest until congress does. [applause] deirdre: my next guest says the president can not bypass congress. alabama congressman bradley burn with me now. congressman, you say the
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president refuses to follow the constitution. wants to unilaterally change laws. the president says it is not a plot to take away everyone's guns. do you believe him? >> of course i don't believe him. he does want to take away people's guns. he has been very clear about that since he started office. go back to what he is talking about today. he wants to make a new criminal law on his own without passing a bill through congress. the constitution does not allow him to do that. now he can talk big when he has big media event like this. but at end. day under the constitution he can not do it. if he tries to do it, this will end up in court the once again a court will tell him, mr. president you've gone too far. it is time for congress to act as well. everybody needs to understand we have a president on this issue who is not serious, if he was we would talk about mental health policy reform. and homegrown terrorists.
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mass shooting events are not coming because of residents using their guns. deirdre: we want to play the video clip for people who may not have followed it closely as you did. >> it wasn't the first time i had to talk to the nation in response to a mass shooting. fort hood, binghamton, aurora,op oak creek, newtown, the navy yard, santa barbara, charleston, san bernardino. deirdre: so, congressman, speaker of the house paul ryan says none of the changes that the president is proposing would have prevented the san bernardino mass shooting. what can be done to reduce violence in the u.s.? >> two things. first, the vast majority of these mass shootings are the result of a person with a mental
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illness get as gun and does something totally irrational. i understand this my grandfather was shot and killed by a mentally ill person that got a gun. wasn't any reason for it. let's deal with mental illness with regards to those type of mass shootings. not penalize people for using their guns legally and peacefully. secondly in san bernardino, we're not doing enough to go after these homegrown terrorists, those lone wolves are being incited by isis. we're not doing enough to keep isis warriors getting into this country. let's focus on the root cause of these problems instead of going after something part of his liberal grab bag of ideas that is not going to solve anything that will end up in court, cost a lot of money and get us nowhere. deirdre: speaking of costing money, texas representative john culberson, he chairs the appropriations panel, worning attorney general loretta lynch yesterday he would use every tool, i'm using his words now, at his disposal to immediately restrict doj funding if the
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department proceeds with new restrictions on constitutional rights. he was on neil cavuto's show earlier. >> yeah. >> i will not permit the department of justice or atf to spend any of our hard-earned tax dollars to interfere with our second amendment rights. deirdre: congressman, sorry. as far as making that connection, between protection of people, mental health and taxpayer dollars, sound like you connected the dots is? >> well unfortunately the administration puts us in this position where we have to use power of purse to stop them from doing something unconstitutional. we want to continue to fund our law enforcement agencies appropriately. when they step out to do things that are unconstitutional think put us out there to stop them from doing so. one of the most important weapons is power of the purse. that is withholding funding for agencies that they are doing something unconstitutional. i hate it comes down to that but
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that's where we are. deirdre: congressman, thank you so much for the time. congressman burn, joining us there from capitol hill. president obama says there are ways to reduce gun violence consistent with the second amendment. >> i believe, in the second amendment. it's there written on the paper. it guaranties a right to bear arms. this is not seen as an infringement on the second amendment. this is not a plot to take away everybody's guns. deirdre: gop presidential candidate marco rubio disagrees strongly. >> it undermines the second amendment. it will do nothing to keep people safe. barack obama is obsessed with undermining the second amendment, a protection our constitution recognizes and defends for us. and he is looking for any way possible to undermine it. he has been doing this forever. deirdre: judge andrew napolitano, fox news senior judicial analyst with me now. so judge, who is right,
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president obama, senator rubio? >> i think the argument in support of senator rubio and congressman burn is by far the stronger argument. basically what the president wants to do as congressman burn said is make up a new criminal law. he talked in his speech -- deirdre: that is unprecedented, right. >> it is not unprecedented, but it is unconstitutional. other presidents tried it and never succeeded. in this particular case what he wants to do is require anyone who transfers a gun, whether it's a gift or whether it is for value for someone else has to get a license to the federal government in order to do that. if they fail to get the license or fail to conduct the background check on the person they're giving gun, they are committing a fell -- felony. that felony doesn't exist. congressman burn is correct, president wants to create a law. can he do that, no? only under the constitution congress decides what is against the federal criminal code, not the president.
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deirdre: so the president is skating on very thin ice here? >> thin constitutional ice because the president wants to assume to himself the power of writing laws. in this case the very law that he wants that i just described was rejected by congress three times. so he can not say the law is unclear. he can not say that that the need is new. he can not say it is emergency and congress doesn't have time to look at this. all he can say i want the law different than what congress does. you know what? he is in the wrong branch of the government if that is the way he feels. deirdre: he feels he has legal authority to act. >> he has legal authority to spend money on mental health which he is going to do. he has legal authority to hire more fbi agents which he says he will do. he has legal authority to broaden size of database for background checks. he has legal authority to hire more bureau tobacco, firearms d exosivagen. heoes t ha leg autrity impe relatis oneopl ke g a lenser ifou, u dot yore gng tgo t
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jail he absolutely can not do that. the first person that they prosecute or soon as they promulgate the rule, the first person adversely affected by it should challenge what the government has done and that challenger will prevail. deirdre: judge, in addition to giving us this legal insight you're showing us the guide lines would be like next to impossible to enforce? >> one of the reasons they would be impossible to be enforced they can not be enforced in 12 1/2 months left in office. to hire 500 federal agents would be nearly impossible in this time period. to spend money on mental health and have that expenditure be effective to put up this, to t succeeds him, we'll systemit have this battle in 2017. if republican succeeds him, i think to a person the republican president would sign an executive order rescinding the ones he is going to sign later today. deirdre: judge, thank you. >> you're welcome.
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did you like that thin constitutional ice? deirdre: i like it. trademark it. >> 12 degrees outside. ice. deirdre: there you go. judge andrew napolitano, thank you as always. experts such as the judge say president obama's executive actions, even if they somehow get put into place, you just heard the judge say they're illegal, will be tough to enforce. in part because of this mental health evaluation that would be part of the purchase process. psychiatrist dr. keith ablow with me now. he says the president is kicking a hornet's nest. so doctor, with these ideas of potential new gun control rules, i mean doctors will be able to report some mentally ill patients to the fbi. to me that means people with mental health issues stop going to the doctor, right? >> that's a huge risk that people who really need help and who could benefit from enhanced services like more inpatient hospitalization, more access to medicine, more access to
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psychiatrists which are proper ways to spend money in mental health to beef up the system. those folks may say look, i will not risk interacting with a mental health professional. i could therefore lose my firearms. so i think it's a big, big mistake to shift liability to mental health care provide is and erode the confidentiality with which we deal with patients. >> doctor, i also have to assume almost every single psychiatrist would be really frightened about getting sued, meaning you treat somebody, you think somebody is fine. a year-and-a-half later, perhaps, that person reed reaches inflection point and somehow comes back to you or one of your peers? >> absolutely. likelihood will be when in doubt, since social workers mental health workers, psychologists and psychiatrists will not want the liability, when in doubt you say i should call the fbi. after all this person is depressed. listen there are 15 million or more depressed people in america right now.
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there are 60 million people each year who suffer with a diagnoseable mental illness. the president's using this to try to take guns away, by that calculus from a vast, vast swath of the population. the vast, vast, vast majority of the folks who are depressed they can have guns. they're not out to kill anybody. deirdre: i just want to bring in one of donald trump's comment on the mental health issue. hold on, stay with us, doctor. >> all they want to do is blame the guns. it is not the gun that pulls the trigger. i don't like it. right now they have plenty of rules and regulations. they should look at mental health. we should build institutions for sickos, we have sickos all over the place that is the problem. deirdre: there is this conflict. i assume for you as a doctor, as far as patient doctor confidentiality above all es, right? >> absolutely. the cases the president cites to
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put forward his ideas are not subtle cases. these were very ill people. who in a better system could be treated. we already have the right to hospitalize folks against their will when they might be violent toward others. so the bottom line is, we don't need new rules. we need a better mental health care system. the last thing we need is to erode the confidence and confidentiality between doctors, social workers and psychologists and their patients. deirdre: it is a stressed system as is. dr. ablow, thank you very much. grateful for the time. >> thank you. deirdre: with the effect it had on the market gun stocks are soaring. smith & wesson up 11%. ruger rallying more than 12%. highest levels in more than a year of the both companies up more than 10% so far since the first day of trade. lou dobbs will be with me to talk about the latest oregon
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rancher standoff. crickets today at the new york stock exchange. gerri willis is back with what you need to know on the markets. it's the little things in life that make me smile. spending the day with my niece. i don't use super poligrip for hold, because my dentures fit well. before those little pieces would get in between my dentures and my gum and it was uncomfortable. even well fitting dentures let in food particles. just a few dabs of super poligrip free
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ser rain e li call liberty mutual liberty mutual insurance. deirdre: chinese stocks spur ad global selloff on monday, the worst trading year start since the crisis of 2008. today u.s. market closing pretty much unchanged. telecom utilities bright spots. gerri willis, a bright spot herself with me now. what is the most important thing, most important element. reporter: i think it was china. government came in and pumped markets $19.9 billion u.s. what i'm reporting there.
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forget numbers domestic i. it is about what is going on there. deirdre: the dow crossed unchanged line 71 times today. what stood out to you, winners and losers. reporter: we'll start out with losers. goldman sachs, apple. what do we have. you guys have -- deirdre: winners up first. we're starting optimistic. walmart, dupont and nike. >> nike back to 2015 winning ways. as you know, they were a big stock last year and walmart was a leadser. now it is up for two days in a row so that is very good news. look at losers for just a second here. goldman sachs, apple, disney. big names everybody knows, some trouble there. let me tell you, it was sort of a crapshoot would happen. back and forth over break even line. deirdre: there are numerous analysts getting more bearish on banking stocks. jpmorgan going to post earnings soon. maybe that was part of goldman's
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pressure. oil, another huge story we talked about all last year. seems like it will be a theme this year as well. >> i think so. it was down again today about 2%. keep an eye on the sector. lots of people lost the jobs in the sector last year. it will be interesting to see how the sector shapes up as the year goes on. deirdre: gerri willis thank you so much. joining me there. we're watching cybersecurity stocks. but one warning, first known hacker-caused power outage has occurred. thoses of people in the ukraine left in the dark literally after hackers infected the country's electrical substations with malware. cybersecurity expert david kennedy with me now. he knows how they did it. so, david, how easy would that be to effectuate here in the u.s.? >> actually it is pretty easy. what we call the industrial control systems or what makes power for our grid is actually very vulnerable. it has been documented a number of years there are issues with our power grids.
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for hackers to actually infiltrate that, nsa, as well as a lot of other agencies, russia, china, a lot of other countries already hacked into the power grid. just a mater of whether or not they want to impact us or not. >> the david, i also heard people say in the u.s., our infrastructure is so old and creaky and parts of it are actually very outto date, that in a weird way, it actually makes the u.s. harder to hack, sort of like, electric windows versus ones you have to roll up s that true? >> i will be honest, harder for me as hacker to break in stuff that is older. at the same time i don't know if that is necessarily true. it is easier to knock them out a bit what happens. that is 100% true we're using ancient technology for our infrastructure. hackers can infiltrate these. it easy to shut them down, get access to the networks.
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there is the a lot of connectivity with the internet and these systems. much easier for hackers to have access. >> mean hackers are just sharing information? so that is to say whoever brought down the system in ukraine may already be sharing his or her plans with others? >> s absolutely. hackers learn from each other. this malicious piece of software has been known to be existence in 2007. there are upgrades to it and different changes and features. it gets better and better over time. hackers share those type of things with each other and get better hacking as well. deirdre: david, compact to explain exactly how they did it. >> sound good. deirdre: we want to bring you breaking news on capitol hill, the house rules committee beginning to meet on a bill to repeal obamacare and defund plan planned parenthood. this sets up the bill for debate tomorrow. when we come back, bill chill ton dramatic pause after
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pressing question of donald trump has my next guest if our former president has lost his political touch. >> donald trump, says your past is fair game. i have got to ask you. you keep coming up on the trail with him. is it fair game? at ally bank no branches equals great rates. it's a fact. kind of like reunions equal blatant lying. the company is actually doing really well on, on social media. oh that's interesting. i - i started social media. oh! it was my...baby.
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deirdre: one reporter did finally get bill clinton to respond. >> donald trump says your past is fair game. you keep coming up on the trail with him. is it fair game?
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>> republicans have to decide who they want to nominate. i'm trying to help now the democrats in the country. i think hillary would be the best president, and i think there's always attempts to take the election away from people. deirdre: my political power panel is here now, democratic strategist michael, republican strategist hadley heath manning. love him or hate him, expert communicator, is he losing his political touch? >> not at all. i'm happy to see bill clinton out there. he, in many respects, is still one of the standard bearers of the democratic party, and no one understands the political infrastructure across this country better than bill clinton. so the fact that he'll be out there campaigning for hillary, building party organizations across the country, you know, i'm looking forward to that on the campaign trail, and i know a
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lot of folks are. deirdre: he seemed a little slow on the pickup there. >> probably really tired. it looks like it was a great rally, but i expect him to be out there in force for hillary in the coming months. deirdre: hadley, what's your take? >> i wasn't sure if he were hesitant to aaddress his past -- address his past or trump he was trying to avoid. they'd rather keep trump focused on the gop primary, watch republicans fight against one another than to engage in any way at this point. deirdre: hadley, i'm so glad you mentioned donald trump, because established candidates want to end this voter intrigue with outsider candidates. chris christie attacked trump full on last night, we're going to play it for our viewers. >> show time is over, everybody. we are not electing an entertainer in chief. showmanship is fun, but it's not
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the leadership that will truly change america. deirdre: so, hadley, based on what you just said, do you think chris christie doesn't have much to lose so, therefore, he feels like he can attack directly? >> well, that may be the case but, ultimately, what christie's talking about and what other establishment candidates are talking about is they're scared looking at the poll numbers. but the number one most important question is, do these poll numbers for mr. trump translate to voters at the polls, at the caucus in iowa or at the pri their -- primary in new hampshire? we're going to find out in coming months. deirdre: all right. speaking of donald trump, fox news' bill o'reilly accused him of dodging a foreign policy question during the interview last night. here it is. >> if you were elected president, are you going to take military action against iran? >> well, i would want to help saudi arabia, i would want to protect saudi arabia, but saudi arabia's going to have to help us economically. they were making, before the oil went down, now they're making half.
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but they were making a billion dollars -- >> yeah, but you're dodging my question. would you take action against iran militarily if you were president? >> depending on what the deal is, i would have to do that. i would defend certain groups of people over there. deirdre: basil, from the point of view of democrats, which candidate seems the easiest to beat when you see hillary clinton and her group, which is the candidate that poses the biggest competition? >> i don't know -- well, donald trump, just to go to him for a second, i think presents one of the most interesting contrasts between any democrat, frankly, and the republican party. but i think there are elements of all of the candidates, whether you talk about jeb bush who's going nowhere, chris christie who, you know, we can talk a lot about sort of his policies in new jersey there which present incredible contrast to things that hillary clinton has talked about here in new york. but there are other candidates particularly on issues of labor where there are tremendous
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contrasts. and, look, the fact that don trump can't talk about foreign policy and isn't particularly articulate on that issue, i don't think any of his voters really care. but the question is, do they actually go out and vote. and so if he's going to be the standard bearer of the republican party going into these presidential elections, then frankly, i don't think any other republican candidate is a match for any democrat. but their biggest competition is going to have to be pulling donald trump down and trying to negate everything that comes out of his mouth. deirdre: all right. thank you both, basil, hadley heath manning, thank you for the time. be sure to tune in to fox business for this year's first gop debate, thursday, january 14th. the oregon standoff is something its fourth day. one of the armed organizers spoke with pox last night. -- fox last night. >> i have six children, a beautiful wife, i have a wonderful home, i have a business, several employees.
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i'm not here to die, i'm here to defend my freedoms and my liberties. deirdre: his full comments in a minute. father and son oregon ranchers have turned themselves in, now facing more prison time. lou dobbs says why is no one defending them? he is my guest after this. ♪ ♪ >> it wasn't the jury's fault -- >> why the hell isn't -- [inaudible conversations] the state of oregon standing up in the government for these two guys? or stop to find a bathroom? cialis for daily use is approved to treat both erectile dysfunction and the urinary symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently, day or night. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medicines, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, as it may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. do not drink alcohol in excess. side effects may include headache, upset stomach, delayed backache or muscle ache. to avoid long-term injury, get medical help right away for an erection lasting more than four hours. if you have any sudden decrease or loss in hearing or vision, or any symptoms of an allergic reaction,
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>> the federal government does not have authority to come down into the states. that is for the people to do x that is clearly stated in article 1, 817 of the constitution. deirdre: a spokesperson for the oregon movement spoke with megyn kelly last night. the lockdown is entering its powrt day, protesting prison sentences handed down to two of their neighbors, dwight and steven hammond each getting five years. they set fires on their own land that ended up spreading to federal land. jerome rosa with me now, welcome, sir. you say the situation is a classic case of double jeopardy. what do you mean by that? >> good afternoon, deirdre. thank you for this tremendous opportunity to be able to explain this tragedy that's happened in oregon and fox news for having us on.
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the situation is the hammonds were tried and convicted, and they spent their time. judge hogan originally in the case mentioned this is a sentence that shocks the conscience. it's a common sense thing. the time must meet the crime. and we see this as an opportunity to be able to show the country the injustice that has happened to these fair people. deirdre: so, jerome, why do you think the judge wanted to make such an example of them? >> you know, there's a long history there, and there's no telling, there's many reasons that could be behind that. the oregon cattlemen support the legal process that is going on in our country, and we realize that change needs to happen in the laws in the country right now. and so we're working hard with our legislators and throughout our local governments to try and improve thises process. why they singled out the hammonds, we hope that's not a
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case of just making an example out of them, because this is an issue that'll face our ranchers across the united states. deirdre: i know that some of the protesters have said we are in it for the long haul. what is the silver lining in this situation for you? >> well, the protesters that came to oregon were not invited to come to oregon, and the family did not ask them to come to do this. they are trying to do the right thing, peacefully turn themselves in. so it's a difficult situation at best. but we want to try and resolve this situation in a peaceful manner. deirdre: jerome, thank you so much for the time, thank you for sharing your insights, executive director of the oregon cattlemen's oh, -- saddlemen's association. right beside me is lou dobbs. i am so glad you are here because you are wondering out loud why no one is defending them.
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>> more than that, i'm calling out the entire delegation to the state government of oregon. they are an embarrassment to the state of oregon. all who remain silent about the plight of these two men, father and son, the hammond family. and by way, just to be clear, they have nothing to do with the bundies who are using this right now for their own purpose. and i think everyone should be calling them out for making, trying to make a profit -- deirdre: make that distinction because as jerome just said, the family didn't ask for the protesters to come. >> they did more than that too, deidre. they said get out of the way, go home. you're not speaking for the family. they've got lots of folks, including the cattlemen's association, i talked with the president -- john to o'keefe -- last night. these are good, hard working, salt of the earth americans. and the court system and the u.s. attorney, amanda marshall, they insisted on the resentencing here. and it is, this administration,
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this politicized justice department that is absolutely crushing this family. deirdre: because from what i understand legally domestic terrorism -- >> they tried them under domestic terrorism for burning a few acres, the ranch is 12,000 acres, it's insane what this judge has done. deirdre: i understand what the prosecutor said -- >> we've got enough devil's advocate. let's get somebody from hen on this. deirdre: somebody saying they were burning the land not to protect it, as they claim, but buzz they had done some -- but because they had done some illegal -- >> let's assume they had done which was carry out an illegal deer hunt. the penalty is five years in prison? what kind of idiots are running the justice department in the state of oregon, and where are the absolutely gutless delegation in congress and the senate from the state? i mean, they should -- every
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single one of them, seven of them. five congressmen and two senators from the state of oregon should be ashamed, mortally ashamed. deirdre: what happens next? is there any move forward on this? >> you know the pathetic part of this is the only quick solution to this is clemency from the president of the united states who is driving against the interests of ranchers. and, by the way, 62% of the state of oregon is owned by the federal government. this is a conflict that's been going on for decades in the west. more than half of the west is owned by the federal government. they work together. somebody decided they were going to appropriate the land of the hammonds, and it's that straight forward, and it's that simple, and it's that dirty, and it's that political. deirdre: lou dobbs, great to see you. you'll have more on your show, i am sure. catch lou this evening at 7 p.m. he is going to be all over this story, as you just heard, and more right here on fox business. there is new information connecting isis, new jihadi john
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to the business of which -- and i'm not kidding -- find out how. also, a source telling fox a group of 17 detainees could be released from garon tan mow bay as -- guantanamo bay as early as this week. it includes multiple bad guys and al-qaeda supporters. details next. ♪ ♪ if youthen you'll know howouth, uncomfortable it can be. but did you know that the lack of saliva can also lead to tooth decay and bad breath?
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deirdre: the search is on for this terrorist, he is there in an isis terror video. some refer to him as the you jihadi john. british officials believe he may be a muslim convert from the u.k. who left the country. fox news military analyst retired major general robert scales with me now. general, five supposed british spies, rather, were executed. this suspect's family say he became radicalized after converting to islam to marry his wife. when you hear of these moves,
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for example, he left the u.k. apparently under bail, how can we do better? >> well, right now, deirdre, there's not much we can do. i think this so-called jihadi john 2.0 is just emblematic of what the global problem is. here's a guy who doesn't have roots in the arab world who, i believe, is a u.k. citizen, and yet the long reach of the isis propaganda, the lure of this successful insurgency is so great that it would draw a guy like that to jump bail, go to syria and become the new spokesman for isis. no, i'm afraid, deirdre, what we're facing as far as terrorism is concerned, just as an example, it's a very bad year, 2016. deirdre: a young boy who may be his son is identified by his grandfather in making extremely violent statements. unfortunately for that young man, already being brainwashed. that just underlines your point. general, where do we stand
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largely in the fight against terrorism? seventeen more detainees are set to be transferred anyway from guantanamo bay as soon as next week. >> right. deirdre: is this the right timing to be winding down guantanamo bay? >> oh, work, absolutely not -- gosh, absolutely not, deirdre. first of all, in spite of what the administration says, gitmo is no longer the great propaganda coup that it was. gitmo's been discounted in the arab world. they have bigger fish to fry along with saudi arabia and iran and isis and the civil war in syria. the second thing is anyone they release from gitmo turns out to be a rock star in the middle east. they're already setting up their, you know, their appearances on local middle eastern television to turn them into heroes. and so they may not return to the fight, but they're still going to become a sort of human propaganda coup for isis.
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so for those that are watching tv in the middle east, they see these guys walk free, and all of a sudden they say to themselves that, again, the global satan is losing. deirdre: general, thank you. retired major general robert scales. floods are plaguing parts of america, blizzards are in texas, extreme cold settling in on the east coast. jeff flock with me on the economic effects of our crazy weather. ♪ it's a fact. kind of like ordering wine equals pretending to know wine. pinot noir, which means peanut of the night.
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deirdre: automakers are reporting record sales fueled in part by low gas pries. adam shapiro is with me now. adam, last year a banner year for cars. >> a banner year. gm is estimating it will be for light vehicles and trucks, the whole shebang, 17.8 million.
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last record was 2000, 174 million. but here's the key, low interest rates, cheap gas and a good economy, if you want to look at it that way, were propelling the sales. deirdre: what about this year? be oil is certainly still low. a few more questions about the economy, and it seems like rates are going higher. >> i called rebecca lindland, she said to me we have ready financing, great product, we've got a good economy, and we have really old cars out there. there's a lot of pent-up demand, in my discussion with her from kelly blue book, she made it clear that the recession was so hard on the auto industry that people held back buying cars. the average age of a car on the road today is 11.4 years, it should be around 9 years. so that pent-up demand is so great that she expects it could carry into this year as well as next year. in an average year you get 15-15.5 million cars sold.
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deirdre: all right, well, that would be fantastic for the automakers. adam shapiro, joining me there. turning to flooding, another big, national story. the death toll is rising to 24. the mississippi river is flooding towns throughout illinois and missouri. jeff flock is at a barge terminal in illinois. jeff, how is this affecting shipping, how is it affecting local economies? >> reporter: i tell you, it's really shut down shipping along the illinois river, one of the significant tributaries to the mississippi. back behind me the sun's set already, it's a little hard to see, but barges back there beginning to back up. i tell you, if you look out here across the way, you see a barge being loaded, maybe you see off in the distance there it tilting back as grain gets loaded into the back of it first. they're loading barges, but the barges are not able to go anywhere because a 50-mile stretch of the illinois river has been shut down, the water's just too high, throwing barges through that part of the river
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could potentially overtop the levees or cause problems. the current is very high at the moment, so we've got a shipping halt on the illinois river and restrictions on the mississippi, so everything from coal to copper to chemicals, all kinds of grain, fertilizer all stopped at the moment. nothing moving, deirdre. of. deirdre: jeff, thank you so much. jeff flock joining us there from a barge there in illinois. well, another emotional issue, a surrogate mother refusing to abort one of the triplets she is carrying. the genetic father says he only wants two kids instead of three. she is suing, and is this unconstitutional? big question. is she in breach of contract? our legal experts will tell you. ♪ ♪ [vet] two yearly physicals down.
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dierdre: a surrogate mom is refusing to abort one of the triplets she is carrying. she says she is the legal mother of the triplets. she is seeking custody of at least one of them, thinking it can be spared from abortion. sharon, glad to have you here. as a surrogate, what are her rights? >> not being able to review the specific contract she signed because it's private in california. the law does require that they do address certain elements, one is parentage. the man contracted with her is the legal parent of the children no matter how many there are. so she has one or if she has
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three, he's the father. if he only wants two of those, then he would have the right to adopt out the third child. she could file for adoption. or he could keep the child himself. but it's a company kateed messy, emotional issue. dierdre: we'll read from one of the briefs, the california surrogate law could violate due process and equal protection rights under the u.s. constitution. that is claiming the contract with the biological father is head-on it seems with california law. >> i think that the contract -- the contract can't trump constitutional issues. the surrogate mother has the right to have the child. that's her 14th amendment
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right, due process right to privacy, to decide what she is going do with her own body. the u.s. supreme court addressed that in 1973. he cannot force her to have or not have the kids. if he's threatening -- he's going to ruin her financially, i believe -- dierdre: i don't mean to cut you off. it seems like scene outright threat. the father said i will ruin you financially if she refuses to abort one of the fetuses. he cites a provision in their contract that apparently he says he had the right to request a quote unquote reduction. >> there is a provision where they can address the right to reduce the number of fetuses. she was implanted with three embryos.
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he only wanted twins, but all three of the embryos developed into fetuses. contractually he has that right. but what are his remedies in terms of breach. i think the remedy would be he doesn't to pay the additional $6,000. dierdre: thank you, "making money" starts right now. charles: 2016 is going to be a tough one, could we face a recession. the oregon standoff, some are calling it domestic terrorism. really? but what happens next? ted cruz goes after a border ad linked to the economy.

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