tv Making Money With Charles Payne FOX Business March 21, 2017 6:00pm-7:01pm EDT
the dow closing down 237 points. healthcare reform worries remain with the reveal vote coming thursday. much more with making money * with charles payne next. charles: we are monitoring judge neil gorsuch's nomination hearing for the supreme court. our experts are on deck to help break it down. president trump's deal-making skills are being put to the test. he put direct pressure on gop law makers before thursday's crucial house vote to repeal or replace obamacare. it comes after sweeteners were added to the plans by the:main architect last night. 43 pages of amendments included.
a medicaid block grants flexibility. optional medicaid work requirements. and protecting against health savings abuse abuse for things like abortions. sources are telling fox news president trump warning house republicans if they don't quote get on board they will lose their seats in 2018. congressman mark meadows appearing unfazed tellg fox news the freedom caucus has 21 no votes and that's enough to kill the bill. even though the stock market sold off, president trump remains confident. >> we had a great meeting and i think we'll get a winner vote. charles: joining me now to discuss, tammy bruce, rich lowry
and boyd ma they on. moderate are saying so far this is enough. tammy: this is where donald trump comes in as an individual. there has been a lot of changes and amendments made or offered. then there are effectively the threats. when he said they will have trouble in 2018, he doesn't mean they will just be yelled at. he says he will be active with the people who have been supportive of the bill. when you look at rally, it's unusual to see a rally from the president where he talks about legislation and what's going to happen thursday. that's a unique die naij and that go to the core of the constituency. he will be active in that regard. the freedom cauc h been very
consistent in what it is they have been concerned about. they are not going to vote as a block as they indicated. but when you have got 21 vote, they understand there is an arty want a little bit more, and i would expect this to pass thursday. charles: i should note that dave brad said there are potentially 50 votes. 20 conservative and 30 moderate. earlier today president trump said to mark meadows who is in charge of the house freedom caucus. he said i think mark meadows will get there, too. then he looked over and said, mark, i'm coming after you. eric cantor was part of that new guard, the young guns, they are going to revolutionize washington, d.c. but they became part of the establishment. i'm not sure -- he's in a
position where he's going to vote his conscience versus falling on his sword for president trump. how do you see it? >> i think they are clothes on getting this vote. the word is they are 9 votes short. a day and a half out usually that's gettable for a house leadership. paul ryan is making a bet this will be more like the close votes speaker pelosi had when she was speaker. pelosi's got through. why? because she had a president of her own party behind her. and they are depending on trump being the closer as ryan has repeatedly said. there will be a carrot and a stick. some of the provisions you talked about. the stick is jock lahr. but maybe at the end of the day not a funny threat made toward some of these members. you don't want to end up in his twitter feed. charles: one thing we all
noticed is some of those democrats are committing political suicide. you look in the aftermath of the obama years, and democrats lost senate seats, house seat, governorships, all becse everyone backed his agenda. you may have se republicans willing to take the rap for a donald trump. maybe they are hoping if it doesn't go through thursday they can go back to the drawing board with him heading it up rather than paul ryan. >> i think that's what you are going to see. though it will be washington as usual. there will be a lot of fake fights the next 24-48 hours. then you come down to the false choice. you accept this or grandma is going over the cliff and there will be blood in the streets. no one is talking about this bill in terms of healthcare outcomes. i haven't heard a single member of either party talking about
the merits of the bill in terms of healthcare outcomes. you are seeing this is starting to drive a evening between president trump and some of his most important allies. some of those freedom caucus votes were the first to get on board with him and endorse and support him down the stretch. you have the leadership. this is a lack of leadership in the senate as well where they are tribal to cobble this together and arm muscle it through. if donald trump really wants to show as president the art of the deal and how to lead. he will tap the brakes on this and say let's get it right rather than let's just jam this thing through which we criticized the democrats for which lawn thanked obamacare. rich: if the bill passes the what it is now, they will spend years trying to fix it. if it's defeated thursday it
will be a knee capping of president trump's first term. tammy: they set it up where you have the expectation of more tweaking. you have two other segments that are supposed to come. so it won't be a surprise as eight was with obamacare. charles: i don't think a lot of republicans are confident in those two phases. for the key parts that makes this more of a free market deal than it is trite now. tammy: i think there is an honest reason to be concerned about that. but the key elements people want, that the core constituency in the streets want, and the people supported on the street who have donald trump's back who will insist on those things happening. i believe they can because trump is different and he will structure this differently. but they almost have to continue to tweak it because that's what
obama continued to do. they will have to continue to deal with regulations and rules and roll those back. it will be and natural process. it's a matter of making sure the new things that happen are beneficial to the nature. rich: tom price acting administratively is a black box. charles: he has written repeal and replacement -- we have enough -- we know enough that tom price is ready to hit the ground running. rich: there is no doubt his heart is in the right place, but does he have the statutory authority to do this stuff. and getting stuff through the senate with 8 democrats supporting you is a fantasy. charles: rig now thr republicans are sayingo. >>he republicans are showing you can get people to like
something they hate by offering something that's worse. i used to deal with my kids -- charles: is there a way to put through a bill right now that instantly curbs premium hikes? that's a major key sticking block for a lot of the conservatives. and the other part of that that was patched up a little business last night. their premiums 1,700. according to the cbo they will go to $27,000. i think they would need more work there. is there a way to instantaneously reverse those two in less than 48 hours? >> i don't see that happening. we have to come to grip with the fact that obamacare is going to end, whether it collapses under its own weight or repealing it. the important thing is what do we do to make it bert and get to
something. the irony is the republicans may end up owning the very thing they fought against for 8 years is absolutely ridiculous in terms of a political maneuver. and there is plenty they can do and just tap the brakes and you will get outcomes that all of donald trump's supporters will get on board with because it will get the healthcare outcomes. if we don't start talking about healthcare outcomes and what this means to hard-working americans, all of this is warn as usual. it keeps the status quo. they keep the power, money and influence when it comes to a big segment of our economy. charles: president trump using a lot of the tactics that he's known for to try to corral these votes. a big discussion how effective it is. but we understand this is maybe
charles: earlier today president trump reportedly warning gop house members many of them will lose their conscious today seats in 2018 if they vote against the gop replacement bill. these voters are in a position where many say they will have to vote their conscience and ego or go with the president and support paul ryan who many of them do not want to support at this point.
joining me to discuss, ron christy and scott brown. scott, you have been the de facto guy who even during the primary process tried to bring the party together. there is some major philosophical issues going on. we know president trump is an amazing negotiator, but some of these people may be wedded to mayor beliefs so much they even reject him on this one. scott: it's not their beliefs that are important. it's the beliefs of their con stibt went. i know many much their constituents want them to solve the problem. obamacare is failing. in order to start the tax cuts we so desperately need, you have to get this because you have to stiewlts money you save from obamacare to deal with the tax cut. i would argue they have to do their job. if they have a specific proper
whrement bill, they need to knock on the president's door. i's all ears. and there is a second phase and a third phase with filing addition at pieces of legislation. i think it's a no-brainer to get the first phase through and sit down with the authority to sit down and address their other concerns. charles: i think what they are saying is they think they would be doing their constituents a disservice going with this plan because for many of them it's obama light. and there is going to be a defactor mandate if you drop coverage for 6 months and have a 30% penalty. and tax kret -- tax credits reay are subsidies. scott: speaker ryan made incredible concessions. but just to say no, no, no n't save the problem.
many much their constituents are paying higher premium and higher deductibles and gets less care and coverage. they to think you are going to unwind something that's been in effect tore 8 years and do it in two months is not appropriate. that's why you have the second and third phases to address that, and they have to realize that. charles: mo books from alabama says i think if we pass this, we'll lose the majority. his idea is passing the wrong letting nation would mean certain doom for the party. >> i think that's right. these members of congress are in a precarious spot. the conservatives say the bill doesn't repeal the obamacare quick enough and it costs too much. and moderate are saying you are taking weigh away 20 too much of
a safety nept and elderly on education. the congressman points is a strong one. paul ryan knows how to count votes and kevin mccarthy knows how to put legislation on the floor that can pass. i think the house is going to take one vote. they will try to get to the senate, and if they get over there, i don't see two or three more whacks at this point. scott: i think that's even interesting observation. i'm talking about the next shot with secretary price using his authority as a secretary to make changes as president trump did. you have authority within the regulations to address the concerns the exong men and be senators have. you need to ma sure wher they send forward, if it's within the reconciliation, reconciliation framework. if you go over that, the house or senate parlimentarian will
say you exceed your reconciliation authority and it will right out of order. you have to have a expert framework to move forward. then you take the second phase with secretary price, then if there are things like cross-border competition, you do that in the third phase. charles: the f.b.i. is beginning an investigation into trusting collusion with the trump campaign. my next guest says it could be more invasive than we think, and perhaps the f.b.i. inadvertently admitted to wiretapping trump tower. we'll be right back. but at t. rowe price, we can help guide your retirement savings. so wherever your retirement journey takes you, we can help you reach your goals. call us or your advisor t. rowe price. invest with confidence.
campaign connections with russia last july. surveillance of certain people in the campaign, the de facto wiretapping of trump and trump tower? congressman pete hoekstra joins me. it struck me as i listened to the comey hearings and all the people that could potentially continue to be the target of an investigation. certainly there were enough people surrounding president trump, then candidate trump that you could have had de facto wiretapping of trump tower. >> they could have surrounded donald trump with all the people he comesn contact, and never gone directly afr the candidate, but in effect gotten a huge part of the conversations that he may have been involved
in. the f.b.i. started an guess nation of the russians and maybe the trump campaign in july. july, august, september, october, november, december. perhaps 6 1/2 months. no one asked the director who are you surveilling. under whose authorization or direction. maybe it wasn't fisa. maybe it was something else. who did you capture. what happened to those records. and all those times of things. we used to call it 20 questions to get to the trite information. these witness sometimes are so good. comey said we have no information that donald trump's tweet was accurate. but, wow, take a look at everything else and say, yeah, but man, these guys are under heavy surveillance. charles: another part that was unnerving for a lot of people,
certainly myself, this notion of unmasking americans. and the ability of that going from potentially only 20 people at the nsa to more people at the f.b.i., the cia and other main intelligence agencies like the department of justice. this thing is a sieve. almost anyone has the ability to unmask anyone. >> this is a decision apparently president trump aloud in the last days of his administration. foreign intelligence that accidentally eve ensnared ameri. he even krlsd the authorization for people to have access to that kind of information. for them not only knowing the conversation, but what the name of the person was who said those things.
it created a huge sieve. this is where the intelligence community has to be careful. if it breaks its trust with the american people, it's a goner. some people yesterday talked about this saying we are going to need to to reauthorize some of these cap it built at the intelligence community. it will make it hard to make it through congress. charles: coming up, the gorsuch hearing underway. and not without tough questioning from democrats. let's take a quick dip in before we go to commercial break. >> -- is not properly represented and a history of clients in that area. >> referred him for dismissal from our bar. >> you believe respect for the courts is important. >> senator, the independence and integrity of the judiciary is in my bones.
>> i'm going to return to this topic, maybe not in this round, but later because as you well know also, although judges may be attacked, they have no way to defend themselves. we know that as officers of the court. and everything we ship has something in common. whether it's expedited overnight... ...or shipped around the globe, ...it's handled by od employees who know that delivering freight... ...means delivering promises. od. helping the world keep promises. i just had to push one button wto join.s thing is crazy. it's like i'm in the office with you, even though i'm here. it's almost like the virtual reality 's reality.
>> the next topic, i remember, this is just my recollection, he expressed concern that our country's nuclear ar armaments are old. >> has anyone in interviews with you, you mentioned one conversation with steve bannon, i understand you met with other advisers, has anyone else ever mentioned roe v. wade. >> no, senator that is it. >> no mention of that case or abortion in any of your concern visions? >> not to my recollection, no. >> what about with officials of the heritage foundation who may have discuss the supreme court with you. >> to my knowledge, senator, from the time of the election to the time of my nominee, i have not spoken to anyone that i know of from heritage. maybe i -- shake someone's
hand, but no one they am aware of. charles: the live connecticut -- i guess, democrats have been trying to box supreme court nominee neil gorsuch to a corner all day long. i want to go to former clerk for late justice scalia. ed waylon on this, it is fascinating watching the hearing. it feels that the nature, i don't know the folksy nature of gorsuch and his answers have overcome most of the animosity, that would normally be dripping off of the sleeves of the democrats, but they are still trying to box him in and frame him in a certain way. >> they are trying, to but i don't think they have scored a point all day long, judge gorsuch judge gorsucjudge
gorsuch is composed. i don't think that anything is sticking. charles: one big concern seems to be, will he have the abilitthe abillbility to ever go against president trump. more than one occasion, he said no one is above the law. are you satisfied with his answers with respect to those questions? >> absolutely, and i think that everyone knows judge gorsuch knows he is a very independent judge. the aba, when they reviewed him, giving him highest rating recognized that. i don't think that there is any actual basis for concern that he would do anything other than rule on the law in cases involving whoever the party is, including the president. charles: the most agonizing point i could see.
alphonse madden versus amtrak trucking that i saw. basis of his la law, it of tough, a man who was caught in a tough situation, he felt he was freezing to death, he made a decision to be safe. and came back did a job he was supposed to do initially and still fired, at the time neil gorsuch with the company, they fired him. >> they gave mr. madden protection, that sta statute applied when a trucker refused to operate his vehicle for safety reasons. he drove away, contrary to direions of his employer, one uld have all sorts of sympathy for mr. madden's plight.
but that does not mean federal law confirms on him the right not to be fired by his employer. >> before i let you go, someone who clerked for justice scalia, do you neil neigorsuch is the right person? >> he say very worthy successor. he is understanding of the law, has been shaped by justice scalia. he writes with force and clarity and verve, he is a very deepeninger, i -- deepeninger, i believe that justicer scalia would be proud. charles: for more on the supreme court hearing, tammy bruce and rich lawrie are back. dave, let me start with you. again, you know it is one of those things we did not get the clearance thomas showdown
if you will, but they tried to box in neil gorsuch along lines of someone who may be for big business, against so-called little guy. someone who may be against women's rights. those sort of things. and again, i think that everyone says that the dems did not lay a glove on him, they could be building a public relations case to be used in future. >> what do they have so far? they have nothing. this is not going to happen. the republicans have 11 out of 20 members on senate judiciary committee, they will get judge gorsuch through, i wish he was witness in some of my questions. he is winning, and winning and winning, he is going to senate
floor, he will get 60 votes, if he does not, republicans will likely go to nuclear option and make it a 51 vote situation, where a majority will rule, and judge gorsuch will be justice gorsuch by the time this is done. charles: that is the gamut too. do democrats over play their hand on someone is qualified. or do they hold their powder for someone who may be more contentious. >> the democrats always over play their hand, my never know what to stop, they always go to far to. we even have cabinet members that have not been approved. at the same time, does it matter ithey useuclear option now or a second one? it doesn't matter.
i think that democrats don't want to make it seem as though they are treating donald trump like he is a real president. he nominated someone real for the supreme court. he has, and he does. and he will do it again, he will do it at least three times. so, for the democrat -- this is really an expose on how they are throwing a tantrum, they are clutching their pearls so hard they are turning to dust, and the world is moving past them. i want them to behave this way neil gorsuch even gave an eye roll. >> blumenthal was going crazy he wanted to get in there, because "cool hand luke" was like go ahead. something of a public relations case, when major
issues come before the new court, they can say, we told you so. >> i would under line the word, trying, they have failed, anyone paying least bit of attention to the hearings has seen someone who is knowledgeable. and disarmed and with patience. i think they will lose either way on this one, if they are smart, maybe there is smo something wrong with the next nominee.hing, best thing about gorsuch, former contributor to national review. charles: never heard of it. >> coming up. the dow and nasdaq with worst day of the year eevolving about uncertainty about health
charles: the trump train comes to a grinding halt as drama buds over thpotential failure of the american health care act. known as obamacare replacement. if the bill fails, the ramifications would be wide and far. replacing obamacare is the linchpin of trump agenda. they say it had to come before other parts could be achieved. in addition to almost a billion in tax savings,
removing roadblocks to small business growth, and lowering federal debt, passing of the bill would have been first part in other parts of president trump's agenda. a belief that wheels of commerce would be lubricated with lower taxes. and fewer regulations. i don't think wall street cares how the final obamacare package looks, they just want it over and done. i personally look for companies that are growing to top line organically, they have pricing power, they are taking market share. lowering taxes would have an instance impact, huge on bottom lines, some models suggest automatically increase s&p 500 up almost 10% at 20% rate, and 13%, if you can get rate to 15%. beyond fact this first prod
mark -- broad market decline in 60 days, key trump stocks took it on the chin. things associated with the wall and infrastructure. they got hammered. then stuff associated with dodd-frank financial reform, goldman chs down 2.3%, and indexes, bigank index down almost 5%, regional down more than 5%. market was due for a pullback. i have been trying to prep everyone with my market comment carry, but those who have just in the market, you think this is tough, i'm not sophisticated. you will blow it by taking unnecessary losses, that said here are your worse case scenarios, right now i think. to down side s&p 500 2.8%, 3%, call it 2278, that has to hold.
the dow i think that key number is 20100, that is 3% to down side, these are worse case scenarios, i love it when stocks go on sale, i admit that modeling a sharp reversal lower sentiment would make it difficult, but i do see a majority of president trump's policies going into effect. reality of washington is that there is sometimes no such thing as smooth sailing. the key is note to panic -- not to panic, ride it out, i believe this is the beginning of what is going to be an amazes ride to the upside, do not panic. in the next couple of days, i will have buy on weakness. >> coming up. art of deal playing out. we'll be right back. gorgeous tr. oh, did i say there's only one special edition? because, actually there's five. ooohh!! aaaahh!!
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charles: you remember the corn husker kickback? we know that white house is right now lobbying -- health care rebuttal thursday, no secret this president trump likes to win, the question is how far is he willing to go? rejoining me, ron christie, former senator scott brown, we had breaking news, representative dan donovan, republican of staten island saying that changes offer by architects of plan last night do not go far enough to help new yorkers. i found that interesting we got a sweetener in there chris collins, upstate new york worth $2 .3 billion, state of new york will pick this up.
senator brown, are we going to see this kind of horse trading to make it happen? are these going to have to happen? >> oh, i'm shocked that they are doing horse trading. i mean really? i have always been -- >> we did hear a lot of criticism though about the corn husker kickback and things like that. >> mm-hmm. >> the criticism is they rammed it through reconciliation. buineality, you have the federal governme using unfunded mandates on to the state, and state passing to that counties. i congratulate those congressmen and women, fighting for their districts and throwing it back to the state, this is all went legislative sauce a sausage
makes process, good for them. charles: some people were not happy with the way you voted senator brown. i don't' to take you too far back. but i don't know if -- but some people felt, did you feel a certain type of pressure between the party, your constituents? what motivated you? how does that play out with respect to thursday? >> well i do not vote on obamacare as you know, i was not there before it happened. but what when i got there we made every effort to try to fix it. have taken votes that i wish i could do differently, bottom line is you hope you can get foot in door, and through amendment process, back when harry reid was in charge you could not bring a bill up. get the bill in there and work it. and try to make it better, that is where we were sent to do, to get good legislation. i am not against legislation, i am against bad legislation.
charles: is that the point right now? that president trump needs to you know talking to these house republicans, if you can just get this thing moved over to the senate, that is a grand slam. we'll put together the changes everyone is clamoring for we'll make it happen. is that the pitch? >> i think it is. and speaking with white house officials today, white house feels very confident they will get 218 votes they need. but donavon from staten island is a gd friend of mine, he is put in a very difficult spot, that goes to former speaker of the house, tip o'neill who said all politics is local. have you dan donavon, and a number of up state members from new york, saying this is not going enough for my state, my constituents as it relates to medicaid. white house and congressional leadership will have to work hard to ensure if we could get it out of house to senate, where it has a better future. charles: all right, thank you
. charles: judge neil gorsuch, nomination hearing for supreme court still under way. democrats, they are apparently set to block president trump's pick from being confirmed but gorsuch isn't being rattled at all. he's handling the pressure with relative ease. ed, let me start with you, again, you feel very confident. i think everyone does who's watched this, that neil gorsuch has handled it perfectly. nevertheless, we know the democrats have come in with their predermined goal, and i didn't get a chance to ask you, is this the moment where enough of them get on board and say listen, no politics at this
point, or is this the time when the republican party will have to use the nuclear option? >> well, the big decision for the democrats is to decide how they want to lose this. will they simply let this go without a filibuster effort or will they filibuster and trigger filibuster abolition? as a conservative, i would love to see the latter option, love to see filibuster fight abolition, that would pave the way for the next one or two or three justices that the president will nominate. charles: adrianna, one of the things that we heard a lot of questioning revolving around the issue of roe v. wade, of course, it's a very contentious issue, something people thought we would never revisit. i'm not sure if we will, but if there ultimately are three donald trump appointees in the supreme court, it's a possibility. do you think that will be where the democrats make their, take their stand? >> i think they should.
i think they should take a pass on blocking judge gorsuch given his stellar 20+ year record. as you know, he's highly rated by the aba, and the democrats unanimously put him into the 10th circuit. so you can't ask for a better supreme court judge. so they should hold their powder and if they use a filibuster, wait for another potential appointee who's more conservative that they have an issue with down the line, because as you mentioned, there could be at least two more open slots coming up with ruth bader ginsburg being 83 years old. she's got medical issues and justice kennedy he's up there in age. so they should know when to hold their power and fight -- powder, and fight when it conflicts with their values. charles: real quickly, david, is there a chance that perhaps gorsuch gets on the bench and doesn't necessarily always come out with decisions that maybe republicans think he will that the point?
>> he could be a spoiler, like the chief justice roberts did on the obamacare issue. you never really know once they get on the bench what's going to happen. the bad part for the democrats is gorsuch is 49 years old. so we're going to have -- charles: he's going to be there a long time. lou's next. lou: president trump and conservatives nose-to-nose on the fate of the speaker's health care bill. ahead of a critical vote thursday. president trump on capitol hill today where he lobbied house republicans for about 40 minutes, warning of political consequences if lawmakers vote against the legislation. and president trump singled out one of the bill's chief critics urging his support. >> i like rand paul, i think he's a good guy, and he's speaking from the heart. but i think we have a bill that's going to be negotiated. i really like rand and i respect rand but