tv Making Money With Charles Payne FOX Business May 17, 2019 2:00pm-3:00pm EDT
the president pardoning him. he will react. first time he had a chance to do so. pass it to charles payne. phenomenal job on capitalism, socialism thing, i understand no idea you were a socialist but out standing. charles: socialists love me, neil. and money. neil: they do. >> thank you and i appreciate your participation. neil: you were fantastic. charles: a lot of feedback from yesterday's special town hall. i'm charles payne. this is "making money." a lot of breaking news. stocks are whipsawing, goop pelling on one hand with the uncertainties of u.s.-china trade war and amazing economic strength and confidence. as the united states and canada agree to eliminate all tariffs that the u.s. imposed on steel and aluminum products from canada. we're waiting to hear from president trump on this. concerns ramming up that stalled trade talks between the
two largest economies are turning ugly with china's sabre-rattling. what they are say about surviving a prolonged trade war. how the u.s. is responding with its own tricks. a day after our cap salism versus socialism town hall, the experts are here to continue the debate how much is too much. why the public scorns ceo but celebrates when a rapper buy as jumbo jet. that and more on "making money." ♪ charles: trade negotiations between the night and china appear to be stalling as chinese officials are reportedly saying that the u.s. isn't sincere about moving forward with talks. china's government saying today it will roll out quote, responsive measures when necessary to u.s. trade, to u.s. tariffs but the u.s. is making moves to pub forward with the usmca deal. president trump is reportedly in talks with canada and mexico to lift the steel and aluminum tariffs.
hillary vaughn is in washington with the latest. hillary. reporter: charles, we're just getting new information that the u.s. and canada have called off tariffs. the white house announcing that they are lifting steel and aluminum tariffs against canada. they will go away in less than 48 hours, removing 25% tariff on steel and the 10% tariff on aluminum. canada will be removing in exchange all retaliatory tariffs they have put back against the u.s. in response to the initial round of steel and aluminum tariffs. looks like the president is really putting trade fights with not only canada and mexico but europe and japan on standby while china remains in the hot seat. the white house also announcing a tariff cease-fire with the eu and japan. the president calling off auto tariffs for six months, hoping to turn around a deal in that time frame but that tight deadline is not sitting well with automakers. the american international automobile dealers association blasting the move saying they
are forcing trade negotiations which will spark uncertainty within the auto industry but while the white house is waiting to crack down on car imports, negotiations between china and the u.s. have stalled entirely. the eu trade commissioner, chiming in today saying a lot of the trade tensions that we're seeing ripple across the globe are china's fault. >> we do have tensions today and many of the tensions in the global trading system can be traced back to china and the different approaches we're taking to address those tensions. because we play by a set of rules and china has been taking advantage of that, blurring the line between the state and private sector. reporter: china has high demand before they even come back to the table to talk trade with the u.s. they want the u.s. to cancel all tariffs that they have enforced against china, and commerce foreign ministry spokesperson saying this morning they're looking for the u.s. to back up tear words with deeds,
something they think was missing in the latest round of talks. charles? charles: hillary, thank you very much. i want to bring in fox news contributor liz peek and heritage foundation chief economist steve moore to discuss this. steve, let me discuss with you. it is interesting, china on the rhetorical side digging in their heels but by the same token every single day this week we saw more economic data showing they're in a world of hurt and they don't have a lot of alternatives because creating more money just hasn't been working for them either. >> yeah. they're talking tough right now, charles, because they don't have a lot of alternatives. tear economy is being mitt by the tariffs t was hit hard about it 10% tariffs. the 25% tariffs will do at least double the damage to their economy. so a lot of this talk, i still think you know, it is a bobbing and weaving between both sides right now. it is a lot of brings manship. i still think, charles, i've been betting this for a while,
in the next three to six months there will be a deal that will not be a great deal but it will ease these tensions and by the way it is a big development i think that the europeans according to that tape that you just played are on our side on this and they should be because china is the bad actor here. i think they're a threat to the trading system not just between the u.s. and china but with european countries and so on. one last thing we need to get the u.s. canada mexico deal done to continue to isolate china. it increases our bargaining power. nancy pelosi bring that trade deal to a vote! charles: i do want to say before i go to liz, i don't think the europeans would have joined us before the tariff war. in other words a lot of folks are saying hey, we should have done this differently, we should have unified the allies. i like the way they salivated over the belt and road money. i'm not sure we would have a lot of meetings, six month in
geneva, we'll meet in brussels, we'll meet in australia. i don't think we have fought this fight. now makes it easier for them to get on board. >> totally right. our interests in europe are totally aligned, reason we put tariffs on initially remember one of the arguments was whole transshipping thing. china was getting steel and aluminum dumping import into the country via some european countries. they are also hurt by that dumping. they would like to join us. i think all these moves that we talked about so far today are very constructive. we do need to isolate china. that is what this is all about. charles: what do you make of some of the comments overnight coming out of china? one said if anyone thinks that china is bluffing it would be the most significant misjudgment since the korean war. no power can stop the chinese people from achieving their dream. talks about the hardships china overcome from opium wars to sars epidemic and floods, killing a
million people, they have history of overcoming bigger challenges. is this the bravado you february in these talks? >> yes. charles: or does this point to being a longer timeline? >> both, possibly. what is interesting they have been making those kinds of nationalistic and bellicose statements for several days in the chinese press but haven't been doing so in the english language press. like they have been stirring up furor for the domestic audience but not overseas. they are at risk. both sides bring on nationalistic tools and all of sudden we're not speaking to them. everyone thinks we're in a dangerous place right now. charles: steve, you said the deal will not be that great. why not? >> i think for example, on intellectual property it is so difficult -- they will sign something, charles. they will say we will never steal anymore intellectual property. they passed a law last year that they will not steal intellectual
property. one of the problems when i talk to our trade delegation you just can't trust the chinese government. they don't keep their word. they don't have western standards of property rights and your word is your bond. so i don't think we'll get a great deal with them on intellectual property. they steal intellectual property from each other. companies within china. i think what you're going to get at the end of the day is some agreement where they agree to buy a certain amount of petroleum and certain amount of agriculture products and manufactured products. by the way other thing caused trade deal we thought we had in hand couple weeks ago to go south, chinese don't want enforcement mechanisms. i talked to trump. enforcement is everything because you can't trust them. charles: liz, steve, thank you very, very. the market initially opened much lower. we were indicating down 200 point because of china's tough talk on trade. but a bigger risk is probably china's economic free fall.
i want to bring in sure vest ceo rob luna and kingsview asset management cio fox news contributor scott martin. guys as much as we talk about these tariffs, every single day this week we see evidence of china's economy imploding. today i guess the biggest evidence is baidu. the google of china, first time they lost money in 15 years! the stock is down six -- 16%. the stock was getting crushed, rob. i think there are serious issues in their economy that don't have anything to do with our trade tariffs? >> charles, you took the word out of my mouth. baidu, why it is so important it is really hard to trust the data we're seeing out of china. everyone is very skeptical. but when you look at company like baidu now cratering, like you said they haven't reported a loss since 2005, the google of china, this is uplying weakness we're seeing in the chinese economy. they will rattle the sabre over
there. i don't think they will bow down at any point in time. that being said i think it is in their best interest to get a deal done as your last guest was saying. probably not in the next three weeks or months but, five month. charles: their economy is sinking rapidly. many economists say they won't do 6% growth this year. there is the trade battle we have, but also solutions or lack of options for a solution. their debt levels are astronomical couldn't right now, probably will get higher. >> they're rising, charles, to stimulate the economy. obviously still doing currency manipulation out there as well. government has its hands at attempts at growth there. you're right. as rob luna said the evidence is there in the stocks. would i say baidu is one example. alibaba, again, you had good numbers recently, still can't seem to rally very hard amidst the backdrop of china weakness. to me they have to figure out
their trading stuff. i love the news out of usmca. that something we can put in the rear view mirror going forward and focus on the china deal which i think is session to help the s&p 500 recover from the reese fall. charles: we're all on the same page. two days ago i tweeted on twitter, we're okay with china and now we have to resolve usmca. rob, this morning one of the reasons our market made this remarkable reversal, up 23 is not much but on a friday afternoon it is. sentiment went to 15-year high. it absolutely surged. component, american consumers expect things to get better over the next six month that bodes very well for the market, doesn't it? >> it does charles. if you look at the numbers. look they have jobs, they're starting to earn more. that makes sense it will happen. 200 not a big deal. what is really impressive, charles, this market had reason
after reason this week to sell off. it is held above the 50-day moving average. we're right in this range. we're a few% off all-time high. with this type of high and resilience from the market, if you're an investor in u.s. stocks that should give you some convict shun here. charles: scott, how do you see this playing out? the big intangible everyone will acknowledge there could be a tweet on sunday that could send the market up or down a few hundred points. there is a certain anxiety hard to build in any sort of investing model particularly short term, right? >> there. as you know from our previous conversations, charles, there is stuff that works. there is shelter in the storm, given uncertainty or sunday night tweet risk or "saturday night live" tweet risk whatever we call it, uncertainty could push the s&p up 20, down 20, should be mitigated in holdings in gold like we have, gdl and utilities. those are areas in the market
have been very strong, rate have gone down panic sets in that limits your volatility exposure. charles: real quick, scott, are those hedges or primary positions for you? >> the utilities is more primary but hedge is gold. when there is panic out this they buy yen and that is one you can look at in times of panic. charles: rob, scott, thank you gentlemen very much. we appreciate it. later on in the show we'll wrap up our week long look at capitalism to socialism. including reaction to our town hall yesterday. next, how president trump want to shake up our broken immigration system by letting people in on merit. open border proponent say all immigrants are created equal. congressman andy biggs gives his take next. >> we will keep our communities safe. americans can have complete and total confidence under this plan the borders will finally be fully and totally secure.
this passed, and we hope to get it passed as soon as possible. [applause] charles: president trump unveiling a new immigration plan, one favoring, younger, high-skilled, quote, totally brilliant workers. today president trump took to twitter blasting the bad hombres that they will be sent back home, and asking for democrats to help. under the plan the country would award same number of green cards a million a year, but 57% would be awarded on merit as opposed to current 12%. joining me republican congressman andy biggs of arizona. i should point out to the audience this, is something canada embraced a long time ago. that they actually have a higher percentage of immigrants coming into the country as percentage of their population, because everyone is comfortable with the system and there are not any controversies. >> that is exactly right, charles. it flips on the here what we're doing now. you know, let's face it, it
makes for the betterment of the country if you bring in people who want to be here, number one, but who are highly-skilled and will step in and contribute. that is really what it is all about. it is merit-based and president trump is on the right track. charles: presidential candidate kamala harris is saying exact opposite. we can't allow people to parsing, pointing fingers, creating hierarchies amongst immigrants. talking about the beauty of the words spoken in 176, say we're all equal. should consider anyone coming into the country is the same. >> you and i both know what that meant, all men were equal, we're equal before god, we're equal before the law and we're treated accordingly. that doesn't mean you can play the piano as well as i or vice versa or i can do your job as good as you. when we want to build this country up, make it the best so everybody has the opportunity, bringing in the highest skilled
workers to help out, those people we need here in this country, that will make all of us excel and have, have growth in our own lives. that is what it is all about in a free republic we have. charles: that isn't to say people with family relationships won't be able to have folks come over. this is one area they're being very unreasonable. although lindsey graham had problems with this, with respect to the dreamer situation is not being addressed here. is this opening to include another attempt at a grand bargain? >> i'm not sure that it is yet. i'm not sure that's really where we will get to with this yet because that is, we can't even agree on what the daca or dreamer population even looks like. so it is kind of like that transportation infrastructure we can't agree with that means, either. so i think what the president is doing is trying, is the best way. the fact that he is also keeping the border security as a
priority, i think that is important as well. charles: right. >> so i think he has struck a right balance here. charles: speaking of balance, i want to ask you about attorney general bill barr. he spoke with fox news about why he is ininvestigating the origins of russia probe. he spoke with bill hemmer. really an amazing interview. what are your thoughts here? it feels like the pendulum is starting to swing here? >> i think you're right, charles. people say look, how did we even get here? we went two years there, was no collusion. the mueller report said there was no collusion. charles: congressman. i have to interrupt you. we'll dip into president trump. appreciate your comments. we'll have you back on real soon. i don't think the immigration situation is going away. >> usa! usa! usa! >> well, thank you very much. i feel like home, realtors, realtors.
great business. we love that business. [cheers and applause] i love that business. every time i go down in this incredible beast. you know what the beast is, world's most incredible car. it is really not a car but an army tank that rides better. that is something. i'm always looking at real estate. i never get it out of my blood. it is in our blood. sit down if you want. sit down. i tell you to sit down, otherwise they will say he got to standing ovations. fake news. [laughter]. the crowd didn't like his performance. i had that the other day. they just wouldn't sit down. so they said, it wasn't one of his better speeches. he got no standing ovations because they never sat down. it was one. we love you people. i know they were telling me, john, this is a record. they have people here, people in all the ballrooms all over this beautiful hotel. there are people outside,
closed-circuit. somehow you people know real es stay, so you know you have the best location, right? [cheering] i'm honored to be here with the hard-working men and women who help millions of families live the american dream and that is so true. the incredible members of the national association of realtors. they i know very well. i want to thank my friend, he is my friend, my competitor for a while, but he was still my friend, secretary ben carson for his tremendous leadership. [cheers and applause] he is a great guy. when i put him in charge of hud, first of all he is a very smart guy, very adaptable. i said, ben, what do you know about real estate? he said not much. how would you like to head hud? within a short, didn't take you
long, ben. he got some of the smartest people in the business doing a great job. everybody is talking about i. thank you, ben, great job. [cheers and applause] i also want to thank the president of the national association of realtors, john smabe. where is he? where is he? hi, john, please stand up. thank you, john. great job. thank you, john. [cheers and applause] popular. where is ceo bob goldberg? bob, thank you, bob. [applause] respected guys. vice president tracy casper. [cheers and applause] vice president. i just met tracy. great family. thank you, tracy. and your entire team for everything that you do to support realtors around the country. i guess that includes me. [laughter]. i took a little sabbatical for
eight years. you know -- [cheers and applause] but i miss you. but i miss you. but we get you one hell of a tax cut, didn't we? [cheering] the regulation cut may be more important. we did, we did regulation cutting where you couldn't build jobs, you couldn't build anything. you have a puddle on your land and they considered it to be one of the great lakes of the world. you would have a puddle, if it formed more than twice a year. a puddle. we used to call it a puddle. they called it a lake. lake restrictions. i had it happen to me in bedford, new york. i was building a development. i was building luxury beautiful house, great area. that's right, new york, new york. tell you they might be screwing up new york. we got to be careful, right?
taxes are going high. they're doing a mansion tax now. you know what that is, right? they want to be your partner. that is not good. the mansion tax i just heard about that one. the environmental stuff was very tough of the was getting worse and worse every year. i had this beautiful piece of land, 216 acres. i was going to do something with it, i'm glad i did this, because i could help more people. but tracy, they had a little area where water would sort of form when it would rain. all of sudden i found out i can't build on the land. does that make sense to you? i can't build on the land, because it was considered for all intents and purpose as lake. how do people find out about the lake? my consultant told them because this way you have to use your environmental consultant, longer, pay them more money to get you out of a jam. isn't that nice? i fired his ass so fast.
[laughter]. true story. true story. true story. [applause] i would see them up in albany. what are you doing here? they were making it more and more difficult. you had to hire a lot of people. that is what we're getting rid of, we're getting rid of a lot of regulations. frankly i had great business leaders talking to me. if they had their choice, we have the biggest tax cut bill in the history of our country and we also in that bill got included anwr, one of the great oil site in the all the world, in alaska. we got rid of the individual mandate which is by far the biggest problem with obama care, the individual mandate. [applause] where you paid a lot of money for the privilege not to pay a lot of money for health care. how about that one? this is the only thing, you paid not to have it. you paid a fortune not to have it. and we got rid of it. we're doing regulations.
regulations frankly may be the biggest reason for our tremendous success as a country over the last 2 1/2 years. maybe bigger than the tax cuts. it is incredible what is happening. i just left louisiana. we're building -- [cheering] you know what i'm talking about. building a tremendous lng terminal. lng refiner. it is $10 billion, one of the biggest in the world. it must be a mile long. i have never seen anything like this. it's a building, all pipes inside, all pipes. no space. all pipes. they didn't use any space, ben. i have never seen anything. it is incredible. $10 billion, 10,000 jobs, louisiana. now they will do more of them. if you look over the last 40 years, i don't think we built a refiber-opticry or certainly -- refinery and built very few of them. we have a lot of refineries going up in great locations. it is really incredible. nobody ever thought we would see a refinery built. we worked with the epa and
worked with people that were really stopping them. these people were in the process of getting permits for many, many years. we helped them. we got them very, very quickly. they have invested tremendous amounts of money. it is sold out. it is sold out for 20 years. it is all sold out. that is no different than an office building. you sign a lease and you get your financing, right? these people, they sign with countries and they get their financing. but i think it is bigger and probably even better if you want to know the truth and they're happy and it's a lot of people that are working. we did that, but we did many of them. we did the pipeline as you know, the big pipelines, keystone xl pipeline. right? [applause] that was dead. 48,000 jobs in the dakota access pipeline. charles: president trump speaking to the national association of realtors. we'll continue to monitor his speech. meantime i want to switch gears to a story that is sparking
outrage across the country. the college board is planning to introduce a quote, adversity score for the s.a.t.s. this will take into consideration 15 factors on socioeconomic background of students, not just the test results. joining me a university of wisconsin associate professor. professor, thanks for joining us. many are saying this thing feels so arbitrary. it will do two things. it will reward folks. hold on a second, we'll dip into president trump. >> without the imposition of tariffs or major tariffs, big difference. [cheers and applause] as you foe canada has been for years, we have a great relationship with canada and the prime minister. we have a great relationship but they have been charging us extremely high tariffs as much as 285% or more for our agricultural products which is an absolute barrier. essentially a barrier. in other words, when you pay 285, guess what, you know what they're saying? we don't want your business. it was a barrier to our farmers
being able to do business with them. to our farmers being able to sell product in there. so that deal is going to be a fantastic deal for our country. hopefully congress will approve the usmca quickly. then the great farmers and manufacturers and steel plants will make our economy even more successful than it already is, if that's possible. which it is possible. [cheers and applause] we could have the greatest economy in the history of our country. we could have look at the unemployment numbers, the best since 1969. and -- [applause] n very short period, assuming we go a little bit further, it will be the best in history. the unemployment numbers are great but the employment numbers are even better. we have the most people working today than at anytime in the history of our country. we have almost 160 million people working. [cheers and applause]
many of those people are -- charles: president trump talking about one of the big news items, the night and canada perhaps resolving their issues over trade. the usmca helping that move along by removing those steel tariffs on their imports. want to get back to the professor. professor this, s.a.t. news is really shocking to many people. your thoughts on this? >> yeah, it is shocking. on the up with hand this is an attempt to end around what the supreme court is likely to do about race based preferences in colleges. this is the progressive educrats to instill the in these tests before the supreme court might quash the whole thing. the other thing your listeners need to know, the man in charge of s.a.t.'s, david cole man, man in foxnews.com article says many students out there who may have scored badly on the test but accomplished great things. david cole man was one of the
chief architects of common core. nobody remembers that. if you think what common core was for elementary, middle, high school, a way of social justice, lowering overall standards to make education for equitable in the minds of he had you kratz. that is what happens to the colleges. if you infuse it into the these kinds of tests, these kind of questions, then the universities will take a lot of kids, not on basis of academic achievement or merit, but basis on their sociological circumstances. what that will do make universities much less competitive in terms of education and skills and much more uniform the way they go about their business. charles: i would also argue you're not really helping a student by putting them in college if they're not prepared for college. we know the dropout rates are sky-high particularly for community colleges. it is almost mean-spirited thing. some folks say how do we fix the problem? some kids going to school, didn't eat breakfast, came from the house and didn't have
heating even though it was 10 degrees in their city or town? >> one of the ways you fix it, pre-k, graduate school level, emphasizing real education in the school. stop with the social engineering. stop with huge standardized answers to local problem. let money flow to kids who need it. schools who need it. get all of this sociology out of the schools. we educated kids really well for 120 years in this country without any social engineering. you focus on kids as individuals and stop treating them as some common standard kid. charles: why do you think progressives are okay with this blatant discrimination against asian students? whether it is on the high school level, which we're going to see in new york city with stuyvesant high school or implemented asian students will be ones losing out? why are progressive okay hurting them despite their efforts? >> they're offended a minority group in this country shows you can succeed without preferences.
it gals them that a minority group shatters all the narrative all minorities need their help or they can't succeed. they are ignoring asians, that they exist, in reality asians performing so well, come from similar background and live in similar neighborhoods to latino and black kids. their narrative that white culture is so racist that kids can't get a break. charles: i love what you say. >> thank you. >> our week long look at capitalism versus socialism. both sides are presenting their closing arguments and it is next. >> european socialism does not work. i'm an example of that. in the 1970s, that was when i was in england, don't know why you're laughing sunshine, but i'm telling you. ♪ the lexus es.
how do you determine the durable value of a business in the transportation industry without knowing firsthand the unique challenges in that sector. coming out here, seeing the infrastructure firsthand, talking with the people behind the numbers creates a different picture. once i know what a business is truly worth, we can make better informed investment decisions. that's why i go beyond the numbers. ♪
♪ charles: welcome back. stocks all over, trading in a tight but crazy range, right? investor continue to have worry on one side with respect to the u.s.-china trade war and how long it might be. nevertheless the s&p 500 on track for its second straight week of declines. we've rebounded nicely but also keep in mind overall the s&p is up 14% for the year. the big loser on our side of the ledger, deere, their shares dropping after second-quarter earnings missed. they lowered their out look in part to the trade war and weakening agricultural sector. i would note this sixth consecutive quarterly miss suggests this is more than a tariff issue. party talks broken down, opposition labour party talks with prime minister theresa may have gone farce they can with weeks of negotiation. they need to agree on terms for support of brexit that can win support in parliament.
the new deadline is in october. the american economy is firing on all cylinders many thought the crisis of 2008 would leave us crippled forever. how has capitalism fueled the fire? jackie deangelis joins us to wrap up the week of capitalism versus socialism. reporter: charles what a week it was. we looked at some different sides and had a constructive conversation around the two issues but today i want to look here at home to make the final point about capitalism. so many people look to the financial crisis, 2018 and 2009, they say it was a large capitalist fail but others would argue that it was actually fueled by policy that wanted to, was aimed at increasing homeownership. so the policy and the banks, they worked happened in hand with this problem. in his book, the power of capitalism, he calls it politically-correct lending. fast forward. as we know the stock market went down and then slowly rebounded
and came up. president trump inherited a bull market that was nearly 10 years old. a lot of people said it was time for recession, the cycle was over. what do you have happening in this country right now? an amazing period of growth. markets are thriving. you're looking at gdp from the first quarter 3.2%. very impressive. unemployment 3.6%. the lowest we've seen it since 1969. the corporate tax overhaul is helping fuel the growth. so there is a lot of people out there saying this bull still has a lot more room to run as a result of these policies, as a result of the capitalist system moving forward. actually a lot of the folks that were calling for recession are not doing that anymore. so, lots of arguments for socialism these days, charles. but lots of arguments as well to keep the system the way it is. charles: jackie, thank you very much. we appreciate it. while wages are soaring across the country there is still a major gap between workers and ceo pay. in fact one of the big issues that has propelled this
capitalism and socialism debate which we'll continue in this moment. i want to bring in magazine editor, publisher, author of the socialist man necessary toe. and a former bain capital managing director. author of the upside of inequality, ed connor. the perfect pair here. let me start with you. yesterday we had a riveting live town hall. there were passionate arguments presented on both sides. you're the author of the socialist manifesto. what would you tell people who feel like this american system is the best? >> i think capitalism has worked producing wealth in abundance but it also foreclosed what we can do with the wealth an abundance. endsmillions of americans are saddled with medical debt, working harder and harder than our parents and other countries we're not making enough. we have financial stress and pressure. people deserve certain necessities of life to be guaranteed as social rights and not bought and sold in the market. charles: ed? >> median incomes are 30% higher
than germany for example. germans have high every test scores. we work longer hours than they have. if you make adjustments per hour basis of given level of capability american earning 20% more than european. sweden tried to implement socialism, they're earning 20% less on test score adjusted basis. charles: median. that takes in bunch things, add them all up, you come up with a median. people say latest on ceo pay, gap stores over four year period, ceo was paid $21 million. the stock was down 21%. fluor, the ceo got 24% raise. the stock was down 37%. ceo got 32 million, stock was down 30%. system supposed to be based on meritocracy, these stocks are crumbling. companies are floundering and ceos are getting big, big pay. i presented this question to lou dobbs. you will be shocked what he had to say. take a listen. >> the fact of the matter is ceo
pay in this country is out of line. the employee is watching management soar in compensation while workers have a, just a disadvantaged part in that ratio. it should be much, much less than 500 to one. historically the number is anywhere from 20 to 25 times as much. and, that has to be addressed. the idea its in alignment between shareholders and management is just specious nonsense. charles: ed, what do you say to people this is crazy, it is nonsense and it is unfair? >> you have to look at pay of ceos relative to the top .01%, our most talented entrepeneurs. what you find their pay is comparable. they make about $12 million a year on average. i can't speak to specific companies. charles: you're cool even with 12 million number with average person making 42,000. >> if you want most talented people in america where the opportunities are much greater than rest of the world, high
wage world, if you want them to work in our most valuable companies, companies that pay the highest, invest the most, get the most productivity gains, about $12 million is what you would have to pay a person in the .01%. if you go to europe the pay is less than that, because we have created five times as many companies valued over a billion dollars than europe has. france hasn't created a company, a big company since the 191970s? charles: what do you say to that. >> we have country declining life expectancy of lower income people of all places. >> could put an asterisk, a lot come from the heartland, fentanyl epidemic that leads to a different subject. >> it is socially created epidemic. charles: if ceo pay was lower we would not have people overdosing in the heartland of america? >> i would not necessarily say that if we have stronger unions. stronger union density if we preserve manufacturing jobs shipped abroad. charles: those jobs were shipped
abroad. the folks went through deep sense of depression. let me ask you, unions in the private sector, they have had an opportunity, right? at one point we used to have commercials look for the union label. there was a time we needed the unions. the private sector, americans in general have rejected unions. so why should they embrace them now? >> now in fact majority of young people say if given to chance to join a union they would join a union. americans have been faced with regressive labor laws that made it more difficult since the late 1940s to join unions in this country than any other advanced capitalist country. charles: you think unions are a answer? >> i think unions are a huge part of the answer. charles: ed, finally, i think the corporations that buy back billions of dollars in stock while closing stores and firing people are making a huge mistake. i think when you're paying a ceo 70, $80 million you have to lay people off or you're not giving race raises making a huge
mistake. you say it must be to keep preeminent? >> i sit on board, it is crazy for us to hold the money bank account what we've done for many, many years because of tax laws. when the tax laws change we free up the money bring it back to the united states. we want to release it to the shareholders let them reinvest. charles: what about employees? will you release any to the the employees? private sector private placement markets all the money is flowing back in as investment. that investment is creating jobs for employees. charles: ed, bhaskar, thank you very much. coming up hot tech unicorn making its debut. most americans have never heard of the company. in fact we have three big ipos out today. >> no society has created the opportunities and provided a rags to riches type of existence for as many people as our system. ♪
translate here at home. susan li joins me. rob is back as well. susan: i want to talk about pricing for ipos. i spoke to luckin executives at the nasdaq. needless to say, they were happy with their debut. they are up 47% but they say look, we left some money on the table. they want investors to get in on day one and feel like they got in on the action and it also helped drive demand that they didn't overprice their ipo because there was enough demand for all the shares on offer. there was more demand than expected. they offered more shares. i think this goes to show if you price your ipo correctly, there's enough demand, there's a positive market, you will see a day like this. charles: they face some issues, right? they're not making money. i guess their path of profitability is easy to articulate. this rapid growth has come at a cost. susan: 18 months in existence, they quadrupled their losses in the first quarter. but it's kind of like the amazon, everyone wants to use the amazon example with their business.
yes, we can suffer in the short term, not make money, pile our business in with money, then eventually we will make some profit when we gain enough market share. in this case, they argue that there is really high growth rates but at some point, they do need to prove they will make money. charles: an example of that is pinterest, their shares plunging more than 11% amid disappointment, it's the first post-ipo earnings report for them. everyone really has been excited about this company but the weak sales continue. they surprised a lot of people, caught them off guard. rob, those are the pitfalls our viewers have to be concerned about with a lot of these names, whether they have heard of them or not. they come out, sometimes they have a great ipo, sometimes they don't, but the first six months are like a mine field, aren't they? >> yeah. it's a tough market. quite honestly, investors are starved for things to invest in. if you just look at the wilshire 5000 index, that index in 1998 got up to over 7500 stocks. it's down to 3500 today.
there's been a huge compression in supply. investors are looking for anything new, whether it's pinterest, luckin, but again, to your point, you have to be careful. look at luckin, for example. this is a company that only did $125 million. you talk last year in revenue, so when you talk about high growth rates when you are coming from that low a base, of course it will happen but they are burning through a lot of cash, they are trying to undercut starbucks. i don't know that it will be a successful company long term. again, be careful with these investors -- charles: by the way, there's another technology company right at this moment up 51%. having debuted twice as big as luckin. it gets back to the point, some companies get depressed, some are known, they get hyped up. it's really tough to know on day one. susan: beyond meat valued themselves at $4 billion. charles: i have a theory on that. i really think there will be a big, big premium doing what people perceive as a social
good. i think beyond meat is the first example of that. susan: health, wellness. charles: thank you both very, very much. always appreciate it. we'll be right back. -driverless cars... -all ground personnel... ...or trips to mars. $4.95. delivery drones or the latest phones. $4.95. no matter what you trade, at fidelity it's just $4.95 per online u.s. equity trade. no matter what you trade, at fidelity can't see what it is yet.re? what is that? that's a blazer? that's a chevy blazer? aww, this is dope. this thing is beautiful. i love the lights. oh man, it's got a mean face on it. it looks like a piece of candy. look at the interior. this is nice. this is my sexy mom car. i would feel like a cool dad. it's just really chic. i love this thing. it's gorgeous. i would pull up in this in a heartbeat. i want one of these. that is sharp. the all-new chevy blazer. speaks for itself. i don't know who they got to design this but give them a cookie and a star.
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now's the really fun part:m car. choosing the color, the wheels, the interior. everything exactly how i want it. here's the thing, just because i configured this car online doesn't mean it really exists at a dealership. but with truecar, i get real pricing on actual cars in my area, i see what others paid for them and they show me the ones that match the car i want, so i know i can go to a truecar certified dealer and it'll be right there waiting for me... today, right now. this is truecar. charles: folks, the dow holding above the positive line and the big news right now, usmca may be closer because now the u.s. and
canada are going to get rid of those steel tariffs and maybe that takes us one step closer. liz claman, a lot of things going on beneath the surface. liz: yeah. guess what? i've got my shovel. we are going to dig beneath the surface and get our fingernails dirty. good to see you. thank you very much, charles. yes, we have a deal, ladies and gentlemen. six months after the signing of nafta 2.0 in buenos aries at the g-20 where neither canada nor mexico looked completely thrilled, the u.s. has, in just the last hour, agreed to do what both the leaders of mexico and canada had asked the u.s. to do, and that is break down the steel and aluminum tariff barriers between the usmca and its ratification. reports say the 25% tariffs on incoming mexican and canadian steel and 10% on aluminum will go into the history books within 48 hours. president trump addressing the decision at a speech before the national association of home builders in was