tv Forbes on FOX FOX News October 13, 2012 8:00am-8:30am PDT
♪ countdown to catastrophe. live from our nation's capitol. dick >> indeed we are in washington this week. a lot of people say what the heck are you doing in washington and just for the great room service of your hotel? partly. but there is a crisis coming that no one in the main stream media or maybe i am a nerd here. hello, we have a major crisis
coming and we whistle past the grave yard and say it would get settled. i know you are focused on the presidential race and who occupies the building behind me and whether the guy in there gets kicked out and a new guy gets in. you might want to look at the bush tax cuts. they expire in the end of the year and at the same time hundred worth of spending cuts come n part of the sequestitration cuts that you heard about. i want to put that in perspective. they are slowing into growth spend all is said and done, you will have much more going to government than you do today than in dollar terms. all that hits the fan at the same time you have tax hikes and capitol gains and etscet raand all hitting the fan at the same time. that is a big story. you know and not worried about
it or you don't know and the main stream media left you in the dust. and pat buchan an is paying close attention and we always whistle past the grave yards. they say don't worry about it one of the days it may not happen. thelma and lowis may go over the cliff. >> that was a horrible movie. you say that it is more real and possible than we think. >> i think so. let's take the hypothis that barack obama. tax cuts for the millionaires and billionaires will go up to a million dollars. i don't think they will raise it to -- >> joe biden may have been tipped it. he tipped it.
it is the shummerplan . tax cuts will be gone and barack obama if someone passed the extension they will be gone. if mitt romney is reelected and you get a republican senate you will have an extension of one year of all of the bush tax cuts while governor romney works on the tax reform. i think we will get hit with is a pay roll tax cut that we got several years ago. they cut it from 6-4 that is a $1,000 on a family. >> we have gotten used to that. and no one is mentioning that. and a $2000 on a family making a thousand. this is tremendous hit and my understanding that both parties agreed that has to lapse. but at our economy of 1.4 that
a tremendous growth. >> it is slower now than when the president justified pushing back the rate hikes. >> you cannot let taxes go up. >> isn't there more justification now? >> if you took economic reality and you took even the democratic idea of economics. you don't raise taxing on an economy that is slowing down to one percent. >> chuck schumer will not entertain that. we mentioned that when biden had that. they had changed the math to make it more palatable. you are saying it wouldn't fly >> if president obama gets reelected. he cannot let the tax cuts for the millionaire billionaires go through for another one or two years and i think he will stand his ground. >> he will say i am reelected
and all of his forces behind him. >> it looks like some republicans would let that happen. >> what would happen, he would veto it and all of them would die and he would say you want them back? give me back all of the tax cuts except for the millionaires and billionaires. >> it is different if mitt romney is elected. i heard this expressed as well but if he doesn't get a republican senate. if he doesn't get that it makes his job more difficult. >> i think the democratic senators and republicans have 49 and 20 democratic senators up in 2014 and said extend them from one year and they are conservative states and i think they would go along with governor romney. could they do it in the november/december period or do it right away. >> ronald reagan said not only
tax cuts, but what represented a big tax increase and closing of a number of loop holes that this president has taken to mean that the gipper was for raising taxes. but he closed loop holes because reagan thought it was a sin to use that to avoid paying taxes. do you think that closing loop holes and getting rid of credits and allowance. >> not if it is revenue neutral. that is the key. when i heard about that. we were in japan for an economic summit with the president and someone called and said they have a deal and take the top rates from 50 to 28 percent and i yelled take it. i said tell them we'll take it. >> we look at the numbers. >> it is a big are number. >> and get rid of an awful lot of these things. you take a deal like that any
time. >> who said -- you are a pragmatic guy. >> i used to be a supply sergeant. you are a giver and not a taker. >> and pat buchanan one of the finest speakers of the conservative mope e move a hell of a writer, too. >> my senator from my state joins us. to pat's point of getting rid of the loop holes and credits and breaks that prevent some from paying taxes or paying less what do you make of that and how open are republicans for making them if they are a deal blocker. >> republicans have been open to that since day one. that's the ryan budget that we passed out of the house. >> you my talk to tea party colleagues because they don't like that. they take it as a tax hike. >> most of the tea party folks
that i talk to and as long as you bring down the marginal rates at the same time as you do away with the loop holes and deductions, you are doing the right thing. >> i am sorry, because as you know. i am trying to coddle together a deal to save america. because that is my job. do you think that if you had a situation like that where we are going to get democrats and all of the breaks and allowances don and we'll reconvene to pat's point and look for a way to simplify the tax code and get it leaner and less complicated that could be a deal approach. >> if you do it all at one time. not piece meal. do away with the decluctions and credits and next year later on. we'll lower the marginal rates. that is not a deal. i know being in office you never get to the next year.
it has to all -- >> you would like it etched in stone? >> no one on the republican side is going to risk that. >> here is a news flash. no one in the democratic side. and that is not a deal. and that is the cliff that we are talking about on december 31st. >> we have gone over the cliff in some sense and maybe we are using the wrong terminology. we hit the cliff and gone over it on spending and debt. six trillion added to the debt and we'll see that over the 10-year period. >> you guys were not innocent bystanders. >> i certainly was not part of that. i pushed back on a number of the spending proposal this administration and the prior administration. we have gone over that cliff and now we are coming to as you said a wall. the wall is all of the tax
increases that are going to come. a paaverage family making 50,000. they will see $2200 increase in taxes. single mother making $30,000. she will see it go up by a $1,000 . we are hitting a wall and higher taxes because of the administration. >> congressman, thank you very much. you hear a lot about the automatic cuts and the past point and he wrote about it eloquently. the sequestitration cuts. for a congress unable or unwilling to come up. and now they are backing away and those cuts are come they include defense cuts. former lochheed martin ceo and what he makes on that and judges that can be lost.
welcome back everybody. from our nation's capt cament. the president in that house behind me and mitt romney preparing for the debate because he wants to move in that building behind me here. the president will leave shortly to get ready and studying for that very debate. part of this debate, i hope it is mentioned in the upcoming debate in hofstra university is what we are approaching for the end of the week and year. we are continuing to pile up debt at the expense of four billion a day. all of the bush tax rates expire i want to develop time to the spending cuts that come n they are opting for the rate of growth and what is the big deal. are they big cuts? if you are in the defense industry and the money you
thought you were going to get and it is it shaved by 50 million and you have to cut somewhere and you likely will have to cut a lot of jobs. norm augustine said it result in millions of jobbings. my question is how rapidly that happens? >> it will happen rapidly . the thing that has to be said first. it is troublesome that our congress would hold national defense hostage because of the inability to make decisions and that is kind of where we are. >> do you think it would be a bigger travesty if they nixed the whole deal and there is a greater threat to the economic security if the world thinks that we are not true to our financial worth? >> the impact is enormous. what we are talking about will raise the national debt a few million dollars . if you look at the impact on employment over the years. we have 1.2 trillion out of
the budget over 10 years and probably a couple of million jobs overall . i think -- >> when you said a couple of million. a lot of defense contractors money they budgeted for programs and weapons is gone and they have to stop. this project is done and you are going to go and this facility is going and you got to go? >> exactly. in the defense industry which is a metamorphis sort of thing. it includes accountants and companies that build airplanes . on the order of a million jobs goes fast f. you are running a defense company, the biggest challenge you don't know what is going to happen and if you can plan or curbian those things - cushion these things. if we are told on january 3rd that the budget is cut to the depth you are talking about. you will have to act quickly and not very efficiently. >> we'll talk about how
everyone is so sure that is going to happen. they say been there and done that. and we always thought and you were saying that doesn't always happen. people ask me if i am a pessimist or optmist. pessimist is the optmist with the knowledge of facts. >> what is your biggest fear. >> our biggest fear that nothing is happening and something in january and looks like a continuing resolution. >> at the early point when you warned about the lay offs. how big are the numbers getting to be? >> they could be a million jobs. >> and that would be fairly immediate. >> money stops and the jobs stops. that alone would trigger a recession. >> i need to say that i am not one that supports spending on national defense because it creates jobs. jobs, these are good people
who deserve jobs and the reason you spend money on national defense is for national defense. i tramped in 111 countries in recent years and everywhere you go in the world you can find ample reason to worry about our situation . we are not the most popular country in the world, i have discovered that. >> i want to get your perspective and appreciate you coming here . what is going on in the middle east and places like libya and cairo and when we see the anti-american protest and they are fermenting. >> we are not popular years ago. >> but riot after riot what happened? >> you can sort of see that what was happening. part out of the jealousy. we are fortunate and we have been and i hope we will continue to be. you go to the middle east and i was in israel four or five
months ago now. and i was in egypt a few months ago. and the situation could blow up overnight. >> what about joe biden telling paul ryan to calm down about the iran threat and they are years away . ryan said no, it is worse than you think . benjamin netanyahu and not meeting with president obama. what did you think of that? >> one thing i can say. people in israel are very, very serious. they have been through tough times in their lives, most of the thopethose people and their parents have and they few view it as a time to make a choice. what happens there is a big worry. you have north and south korea and taiwan and china and afghanistan and iraq and syria. people think it is a friendly world it is not a friendly world. if is not jobs and defense. it is defense i worry about. >> always a pleasure to see you. >> he warned about the stuff
we are now seeing come to pass. you might ronald reagan mentioned a bit here. he was famous for a lot of thingings including getting the big picture right, but he was a great negotiator and i rather 80 percent of the loaf than no loaf at all. he was a giver and a taker and he knew when to push his hand and when to fold his hand. is that the problem on both sides now? that they forget the gipper's basic approach to negotiating? someone gives and someone gets, everyone wins. after this. bob... oh, hey alex. just picking up some, brochures, posters copies of my acceptance speech. great! it's always good to have a backup plan, in case i get hit by a meteor. wow, your hair looks great. didn't realize they did photoshop here. hey, good call on those mugs. can't let 'em see what you're drinking.
you know, i'm glad we're both running a nice, clean race. no need to get nasty. here's your "honk if you had an affair with taylor" yard sign. looks good. [ male announcer ] fedex office. now save 50% on banners. nah. [ dennis' voice ] i bet he's got an astate agent. they can save you up to 30% more by bundling your polies. well his dog's stupid. [ dennis' voice ] poodles are one of the world's smartest breeds. are you in good hands?
>> we had a bit of a crisis on the break. it is not shining well on my hair. this hair is a work of art, come on. welcome back from our nation's captital. powers at be not here. we have tried to have a conversation with you on this show and electronicically on facebook and our website . questions, i am a fast typest and a lot of you have been mentioning basic issues. john writes. let's have a flat tax so all americans and limited deductions on high income earners and a bottom 50
percent pays no income tax is unfair. >> your point is taken. lost in the argument about you know, whose nose is out of joint because you offended retired and military types and who genuinely done a lot for the country. they are offended as looked on as a teat of the government. leaving that aside. we have to wonder where half of the americans are not paying income taxes at all. many pay pay roll taxes and others pay in the system. when i got out of the grad school, that figure was 22 percent. and not paying income taxes and how the heck did it double. neal you yust got out of school a few years ago. and decades. and that is the point. ronald reagan's. with the limits that you are
in a government where we are now looking at very few paying the freight for it we have to do something about that. >> i think we do. but let me tell you. powers at be are not in washington. as long as you are there, powers that be are in washington. >> i have you on the phone. >> enough said i got you on the phone. we talk about a simplified tax code and i think it is the way to go. >> i think that is what paul ryan should have said to joe biden. he voted for 50 to 28%. and the democrats led the fight over the years and kerry brown he wanted 100 percent to pay income tax at the exact same rate and came in second in the primary in 1992 in the democratic party.
everyone knows you should have a low rate flat tax for economic growth and/or fairness. it is the right way to go. >> i'm sorry. but everyone having skin in the game. >> exactly. >> they are not looking at the poorest among us. but if you have a stake in the game you are interested in the game and you have a personal vested interest in the game. >> of course, it is all of our country. it is not just one group's country. everyone should support the count reap as a whole. no one made a better off deal by pulling americans down. americans are better off when we are all better off. we share the taxation. low rate flat tax and that's the way to go to create prosperity for all americans. i don't understand the talk. it is just crazy. >> and the fiscal cliff. >> and it really is one.
>> what worries me and people are surprised why you liked bill clinton, the democrat, he stimulated business. people focus on hike and rates for the richest. but he immediately was cutting invested related rates. >> capitol gains. >> people forgot that. but that's why these rates, it is not so much across the board income rate hikes. i am not a fan of them. i am worried about the business ones. dividends are taxed. we are talking about something for a surtax from the rich could be 44 percent. if that doesn't inhibit the invest leads to something bad in the stock market. >> it has led to a deal. but what i didn't hear in any of your commentaries people have shifted income in 2012. as bad as this year looks, it is much worse than it looks
because people are shifted income out of 2013 12 . that cliff is going to be serious. >> you are quite right. we are seeing that in youtube fund redemption. they are taking their money out in large part in preperationn for that. that is the quiet under the surface stuff. we see more of that on year's end? >> we extended the tax cuts and much smaller ones than now. there was a huge drop in gdp to 2010 to 2011. and even though we extended tax cuts. people prepared ahead of time. i am looking for a bad 2013 no matter what happens. >> so let's go to another scenario and there are so many different ones. president is reelected and deal a republican senate .