tv Special Report With Bret Baier FOX News May 13, 2013 3:00pm-4:01pm PDT
building. >> eric: we will leave it there dana, this is a huge story. we will leave it there. >> dana: elvis story. >> eric: a.p. story. reporters wiretapped. >> bret: this it is a fox news alert. this is bret baier in washington. there are busy news days and days like today. president obama weighed in on scandals like benghazi and the irs targeting conservative groups. breaking news on a potential third scandal. this one involves the justice department and the associated press. chief intelligence correspondent catherine herridge here with breaking details. >> the president of the associated press confirms in a letter to eric holder the department of justice seized records from more than 27 phone lines assigned to the associated press and journalists affecting ap bureaus in new york city. hartford, connecticut and the house of representatives. the letter states that the
extraordinary action was taken without advanced notice to the a.p. or journalists affected. in possible justification for overbroad communications of the associated press and its reporters. these records potentially reveal communications with confidential sources. we regard this action by the department of justice as a serious interference with the a.p.'s constitutional rights to gather and report the news. while the justice department's investigation and its apparent connection to the a.p. have not been publicly disposed by the department. the letter came from one of two u.s. attorneys assigned in june of last year to lead criminal investigations into national security intelligence leaks. in a statement made today the u.s. attorney's office said quote we must notify the media organization in advance unless doing so would pose a substantial threat to the integrity of the investigation. because we value the freedom of the press we are always careful and deliberateive in seeking
the right flow of information. blocked the aggressive prosecution strategy. >> we have tried more leak cases i-brought more leak cases during the course of this administration than any other administration i was getting many membered by the left for that two weeks ago. now i'm getting hammered by the right for not going after leaks. makes for interesting -- it makes for an interesting dynamic. >> today the white house press secretary jay carney referred all questions to the justice department. >> bret: we know about the a.p. in this letter and we don't know about other news organizations. >> just the a.p. >> bret: more on benghazi and irs scan tells coming up. but now to tonight's other breaking story. the jury has spoken. it said guilty on three counts of first degree murder. 72-year-old abortion doctor kermit gosnell is guilty of murdering three babies born alive after botched
borings. that is the headline in the blockbuster verdict for one of the most gruesome and sensational trials in recent memory. correspondent shannon bream has a live update tonight from philadelphia. again, a warning, her report contains some disturbing language. good evening, shannon. >> good evening, bret. after weeks of testimony dozens of witness' and 10 days of deliberations the jury came back with a verdict today that seemed to come as enormous surprise to the man in the middle of the controversy. guilty of three counts of first degree murder and dozens more felony and misdemeanor charges of abortion doctor kermit gosnell convicted of killing babies after they were alive at his clinic following botched abortions now waits to see if the jury will recommend life in prison or the death penalty. >> i would say the jury did the best job it probably could. justice would mean what comes out of this is we start looking really closely as to what the women's movement doesn't want to too which is protecting the health of women. >> gosnell's attorney jack
mcmahon says quote no one was cheering for his client and likened the defense' effort to sammon trying to swim upstream. >> am i disappointed, yes. am i testimony glad the jury gave us a fair shot? yes. >> distancing themselves from gosnell and attempting to cast blame on laws restricting abortion and deteriorating to the way they did gosnell's clinic. eric fer ferraro said the case has made clear that me must have and enforce laws though protected access to safe abortion. limit -- marlin stutzman, who wrote a last piece last week for "the washington times" revealing that his mother considered having an abortion while pregnant with him. gosnell case should be a wakeup call for better supervision of abortion clinics. >> i think we should have some sort of government
oversight. some congressionalover sight that actually looks not only at this particular clinic but brings attention to these sorts of clinics that may potentially be operating anywhere else. priest for life added the guilty verdict shows that the law recognizes a point at which the right to choose must yield to the right to life. also shows that abortionists don't know where that point is such laws must be strengthened in every state. penalty phase of this trial will start next tuesday. jurors will have to determine whether or not to it recommend life in prison for gosnell or the death penalty. he never took the stand in his defense during the trial. i asked his attorney today whether he may testify next week essentially pleading for his own life. that decision has not been made. bret? >> bret: shannon bream outside the courtroom. joining us is republican senator mike lee of utah introduced a he is are lucien calling on congress to correct abusive unsanitary and illegal
abortion practices and sherrilyn yost. we did contact planned parenthood and naral declined to provide spokes people. they about provide staples. you heard from planned parenthood in shannon's piece. naral said. this quote: justice was served to kermit gosnell today and he will pay the price for the atrocities he committed. we hope that the lessons of the trial too not fade with the verdict. anti-choose politicians and unrelenting efforts to deny access to safe and fair abortion care back alley butchers like kermit gosnell. it's a peak before row v. weighed made legal a woman's right to make her own choices. your thoughts about this trial and its verdict. >> do you know, bret, it's really fascinating to me because we have been fighting the abortion industry for decades over clinic regulations. this abortion industry is
unregulated unsupervised and unrepentant. they keep saying today the national abortion federation says nothing he needs to be improved in abortion clinics. what kermit gosnell's clinic shows that was the face of legal abortion. there are 15 investigations going on right now into legal abortion clinics across this country that have unsanitary and terrible conditions for women. we really are asking today how many more women have to die before we get serious about looking at what this industry does to women. wrets bret senator, you see a legislative path here? >> yes, i do. it's a path that involves greater scrutiny across the country into this industry. you know, this case really is about much more than just one man. it's about an unaccountable industry that is far too long been given free prey to pray upon the vulnerable and the innocent. last week i filed a resolution that would call on governments at all appropriate levels to look into this practice to look into the fact that this is occurring to. look into the fact that the late term abortion industry
in america is not only dangerous but something that preys on the innocent and the vulnerable. >> bret: you heard these statements. they say this is about one man. they say this is about one clinic. you know, planned parenthood says you need to protect access to safe and legal abortion and that's not what kermit gosnell was. >> what i find especially remarkable about those statements is that they somehow try to make a causal link between regulation of the abortion industry and this kind of thing. but, the evidence doesn't support that at all. in fact, the evidence suggests exactly the opposite of what they are saying. this is what happens when you allow the late term abortion industry to operate without any fetters, without any regulatory review. this is the kind of thing that results. >> bret: the media coverage picked up towards the end of this case. we obviously covered it from a long-time during this trial. what do you think about that and how this all played out and how it will play in the big picture about the abortion issue?
>> i think it's really troubling when you see the news reports that when we do polling right now after the trial that some americans have still not even heard of kermit gosnell which would never be the case of any other trial with this revel of sensationism. we really need to be sure that the lessons coming out of that trial is that we have been able to look behind the secrecy that the abortion industry sod a avidly protects to see what's going on. in this country reregulate veterinary clinics more than abortion clinics. what has happened in this clip nic is the logic call outgrowth of that. >> such explosive issue. it is so -- well, it's just a personal issue for a lot of folks when they talk about it. as a political issue, where do you think it is? >> well, i think regardless of where any of us might stand on the issue of abortion, either as a personal moral choice or from a political standpoint, i think we can all agree that no one ought to allow this practice to
continue. the practice of unsafe, unsanitary and humane late term abortion practices that result in an environment that's very hostile to the interest of vulnerable women and children. >> bret: okay. senator, charmaine, thanks so much. >> thank you. >> bret: still to come brit hume on how the president is handling a handful of scan tells. the president fires back on benghazi and and the irs. written by people just like you. no company can pay to be on angie's list, so you can trust what you're reading. angie's list is like having thousands of close neighbors where i can go ask for personal recommendations. that's the idea. before you have any work done, check angie's list. from roofers to plumbers to dentists and more, angie's list -- reviews you can trust. i love you, angie. sorry, honey. available out there. i knew devry university would give me the skills
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>> bret: president obama is trying best to circle the wagon administration. as we mentioned at the top of the show. wendell goalie has the latest tonight. >> answering questions with the british prime minister, president obama expressed outrage at the two main issues bedelving him in recent days, claims the irs targeted tea party groups for extra scrutiny and the administration scrubbed the talking points on the
benghazi consulate attack a politically damaging information. on the irs claim mr. obama was as unsympathetic as harshest critics. >> if you have got the irs operating in anything less than a neutral and nonpartisan way, then that is outrageous as independent agency the president says the irs has to have absolute integrity and people have to feel it applies to the law in a nonpartisan way. politically independence should shield the white house from criticism. some conservatives don't buy it? >> a inadvertent. just some odd underlings in cincinnati who did this and there was no political motive whatever involved. now, the get is how stupid do they think we? >> columnist george will noted one of the things richard nixon was itch peeched for was using the irs against his political enemies: meanwhile mr. obama's outrage over continuing questions of benghazi was aimed directly
at political opponents. >> the fact that this keeps on getting churned out frankly has a lot to do with political motivations. >> he ridiculed criticism of u.n. ambassador susan rice's inaccurate account three days after the attack. >> who executes some sort of coverup or effort to tamp things down for three days? >> and he brushed aside a decision by an aide to former secretary of state clinton to remove references to earlier attacks and islamic extremist groups from the benghazi talking points why have had folks challenge hillary clinton's infederal government yi at this. >> republicans say they don't know the real story about benghazi and still pushing to talk to some of the survivors. >> the administration has been stone walling us. we know from the testimony last week that those rn the ground had very different information offered than we what we saw even in the accountability review board report. >> senator ayotte says the report was not enough. she wants benghazi
investigated and some of her colleagues want former secretary clinton to testify before it bret? >> bret: wendell goler live on the north lawn. thank you. the president is calling for full accountability in the irs scandal. mike emanuel has new information about additional items. someone may have to be accountable for. >> a time line obtained by fox news reveals the irs examined more than groups with tea party or patriot in their name. a leader of a tea party group wants to know who is behind it. >> i don't know whether it came from the top or the or not. no way a couple of low level employees out of cincinnati, ohio, had this much influence and would effect so many groups across the country. literally it was coast to coast. >> pro israel group called z street filed for tax exempt status in december of 2009 and then its legal counsel received odd questions in the spring of 2010. >> the irs agent assigned to our file told her that we were delayed because the
irs had to give special scrutiny to organizations connected to israel. >> in june 2011 the internal revenue service began looking at organizations focused on government spending, debt or taxes and advocacy groups focused on making america a better place to live. in january of 20121012 specialists told be look on groups limiting government, constitution bill of rights and more. this confirms the suspicions of conservative lawmakers. >> if you use constitution, bill of rights, patriot, or tea party you were likely to have a very rough time where apparently if you used progressive or move on you were not. this kind of targeting is what we knew before the election and now we have proof. >> florida republican senator marco rubio sent a letter to jack lew and says the irs cannot operate with a shred of the america's confidence. therefore i strongly urge that you and president obama demand the irs commissioner's resignation
effective immediately. the senate majority leader says there should not be a rush to judgment. >> no one should jump to conclusions. but we should all rest assured as soon as we have the inspector general's report the senate will quickly take appropriate action. >> there is some question about what the white house knew and when it knew it. press secretary jay carney says the white house counsel's office was aware april 22nd. today president obama says he didn't find out about it until news reports on friday. bret? >> bret: mike emanuel on capitol hill. thank you. brit hume on crisis control obama style. next, the president comes out defined on benghazi. [ shapiro ] at legalzoom, you can take care of virtually all your imptant legal matters in just minutes. protect youramily... and launch your dreams. at legalzoom.com we put the law on your side.
>> in his most extensive remarks on benghazi in months. counter offensive of starts. his administration's conduct in the affair by mainstream news allegation of his own that republicans are manufacturing a scandal for partisan purposes. one with no there there. tonight a fair and balanced look at the facts from chief washington correspondents james rosen. what we also know is clearly they were not in a situation' adequately protected. president obama retelling of the benghazi story and how and why it resurfaced to consumed precious time during his news conference with the british prime minister was highly selective. to begin with, mr. obama argued that he has been characterizing benghazi correctly from the get-go. >> the day after it happened u i acknowledged
that this was an act of terrorism. >> but the president's words in the rose on september 12th were vague not explicit. >> no acts of terror will ever resolve the acts of this great nation. >> in an interview with "60 minutes" the president agreed had steered clear of the word he trumpeted all along. >> this morning you went out of way to avoid the use of terrorism in connection with with the libbian attack. do you believe this was a terrorist attack. >> it's too early to know how this came about what group was involved. >> on later wednesday september 15 matt olson head of the terrorism center testified before the senate that benghazi was not a protest gone awry. >> i would say yes they were killed in the course of a terrorist attack on our embassy. >> today the president took credit for olson's appearance. >> i sent up the head of our national counter terrorism center matt olsen up to capitol hill and
specifically said it was an act of terrorism. >> number one, he didn't send him to the hill. he was called to the hill. number two, he referred to it as an act of terrorism not in his prepared testimony but in response to a question. and i remembered quite well, i'm sure others do too, it was a firestorm on chill -- capitol hill because finally someone in the administration had said straight out this was an act of terrorism. >> what's more the president spent the weeks after olsen's testimony in campaign season continuing to steer clear of the terror label. >> do you have information indicating that it was iran or al qaeda was behind organizing the protest? >> well, we are still doing an investigation so i don't want to speak to something until we have all the information. >> what do you say? >> well, we are still doing an investigation. >> um-huh. >> now, we don't have all the information yet. and so we're still gathering it. >> the president asserted today that confusion reigned when the intelligence community completed its earliest assessments of the benghazi attacks. >> and nobody understood
exactly what was taking place during the course of those first few days. >> in fact, the cia station chief in libya cabled home on september 12th that benghazi was a terrorist attack and as "the weekly standard" and abc news established last week the first version of the cia's talking points on benghazi drafted september 14th that islamic extremistso with ties to al qaeda participated in the attack. >> and so the president can't have it both ways. >> however, president obama did disclose for the first time today that the talking points delivered by his u.n. ambassador, quote: pretty much matched the contents of the president's daily brief. the highly classified intelligence compendium he receives each morning known as the pdb. the "wall street journal" reported today it wasn't until september 22 that the tdb was updated to delete all references to a protest on 9/11. if that's true g.o.p. lawmakers will want to know why the tdb was so different from cia's draft talking points which instantly identified al qaeda affiliates as the
perpetrators of the attack, bret. >> bret: james, quickly as our resident historian we do have cleaning up to do. >> earlier it was stated that president nixon was impeached due in part to the alleged abuses of the ifers under his administration. president nixon was never impeached. house judiciary owe proved three of five articles of impeachment but the president resigned before those could be taken up by the full house. one further note the so-called nixon enemy's list. president nixon never ordered it or saw it chiefly products of aide john dean and chuck olsen. >> bret: long before there was dr. phil there was dr. dr. joyce brothers. she died of natural causes. brothers was a frequent guest on talk, variety and game shows from the mid 1960's on. played herself in many movies and tv shows. dr. joyce brothers was 85. we'll be right back. we went out and asked people a simple question:
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toare you still sleeping?rs. just wanted to check and make sure that we were on schedule. the first technology of its kind... mom and dad, i have great news. is now providing answers families need. siemens. answers. >> bret: bottom of the hour. no grapevine tonight. these are the headlines, a jury in philadelphia has found abortion doctor kermit gosnell guilty of three counts of murdering babies born alive. gosnell acquitted of a fourth count. he was also found guilty of involuntary manslaughter in the overdose death of a patient. prosecutors are seeking the death penalty. president obama says he is outraged at revelations the
internal revenue service, the irs targeted conservative groups for added scrutiny. he says the irs should not be perceived as anything less than neutral. and, the president says, there is no there there on benghazi. he labels the renewed scrutiny of administration actions during and after last fall's terror attack a side show. it would appear the president is falling two different playbooks in dealing with these twin sandals. senior political analyst brit hume is here with thoughts on that. brit? >> hi, bret. two methods of dealing with the public relations crises that now beset the obama administration. the president seems to be trying them beth. one is take charge mode in which a leader acknowledges that wrong has been done, says it's unacceptable. pledges to get to the bottom of it and make it public and set it right. this is where the president seemed to be going today varding the irs's targeting of those conservative groups. the other method is duck and cover in which the leader admits no wrongdoing, claims the whole matter is overblown and tries to blame somebody else. this is where the president
has gone from the start on benghazi and where he went again today. we learned last week that the cia's talking points on benghazi went through 11 rewrites at the behest of the state department and white house, which basically converted them from true to false by stripping out all references to terrorism. nothing new here, said mr. obama today adding the dubious claim that he himself had called it terrorism from the start. well, if that's true, then why did he permit his u.n. ambassador susan rice to recite those bogus talking points on five sunday programs days later and for her to add the bogus claim that it all stemmed from internet video? it may be late in the game for mr. obama to switch to take charge mode on benghazi. but duck and cover sure isn't working either. bret? >> bret: there is a potential third scandal now with this a.p. story. what are your thoughts on this? the justice department and what is happening with a.p. >> well, there had been a kind of bonded trust that existed between this administration and most elements of the mainstream media on benghazi last
week, we could see that begin to fray for sure. you could see suddenly you had elements of the mainstream media breaking new important developments on this. this a.p. monitoring that went on, telephone monitoring i think can only add to the fraying of that bond. and that is something that has been a precious asset to this administration. and if it disappears, the atmosphere in obama's second term will be very different from the atmosphere from his first. >> bret: we don't know if it goes to other news organizations or not. >> bret: we don't. and what the a.p. is claiming there is a justice department guideline on this sort of thing when it comes to the media, which is that any request for information must be narrowly drawn. the a.p. is saying tonight that that was -- that that was not the case here and clearly violated that guideline. if that turns out to be the case, of course, well, the administration either way is going to have some explaining to do. >> bret: okay, brit, thank you. >> you bet. >> bret: what do you think of the president's response on all fronts tonight. follow me at bret baier.
the brothers accused of holding three men captive in his cleveland home say his life was a mystery to them o'neil and pedro castro tell cnn they have no sympathy tore aerial castro. the two brothers were taken into custody but released when investigators say they had no evidence against them. the obama administration has appealed a morning after pill that conception pill be sold to girl of any age. today was the center to refile. the underlying lawsuit now has 10 days to respond. stocks were mixed today. the dow lost 27. the s&p up a fraction. the nasdaq contained 2. terrorist skies to president obama. we will talk about it with the fox all-stars when we come back.
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call 888-545-5973 or visit trifexis.com. you don't have to go to extremes to protect your dog from parasites. you need trifexis. visit our website to save up to $25. available by prescription from your veterinarian. >> you got the irs operating in anything less than a neutral and nonpartisan way, then that is outrageous, it is contrary to our traditions. and people have to be held accountable and it's got to be fixed. so, we'll wait and see what exactly all of the details and the facts are. but i have got no patients with it i will not tolerate it and we will make sure that we find out exactly what happened on this. >> bret: the president today answering questions after talking alongside the british prime minister. that about the irs. allegations that the irs targeted tax exempt tea
party groups and grouped base on ideological political leanings. we will start there. a lot to talk about. let's bring in panel steve hayes senior writer for "the weekly standard" kirsten powers columnist for the daily beast and daniel heatinger editor of the "wall street journal" editorial page. dan, what about this and the extent at which it goes and the president's answer today? >> well, on the irs, it was really kind of interesting, bret. he says he wants accountability, but it was interesting that he said essentially the same thing he did about benghazi. we have to wait until we find out what was going on. well, with the irs, i think we know what was going on. and, yet, the president seems to have inclination to push things off into the clouds so they sort of fade away and impact is lessened. after this week, bret, the impact of benghazi, the irs, and finally this a.p. announcement. it is not going o. way for barack obama. >> bret: kirsten, the statements are flowing from
capitol hill, democrats and republicans. >> this is everybody's great fear whether you are a democrat or republican and politically active this is the kind of thing that could happen that the irs could target you. one of the problems is that when the irs came out originally and said this is low level issue and then the a.p. has since reported people at a higher level knew and then they asked them to change it from tea sarty to, you know, thing like limiting government and constitutional bill of rights. come on. you are still targeting them. there is a lot to look into here. i think. >> bret: focus on government spending, debt, taxes, advocacy groups focused on making america a better place to live. >> republicans. >> they said it wasn't political. clearly ideological. this is one of the things we need to find out and dan is right. there has got to be huge investigation about. this and people on capitol hill, republicans and democrats, tripping over themselves to get in front of this so that they could be seen as leading the
charge on this. i mean, i think the real question ultimately will be who is a senior most official in the u.s. government who knew that this was taking place? we don't have a clue right now. but i suspect we will learn probably pretty quickly. >> bret: let's turn to the other scandal he talked about today and that is benghazi it was much different tone for the president. >> the day after it happened, i acknowledged that this was an act of terrorism. and what i pledged to the american people was that we would find out what happened, we would make sure that it did not happen again. suddenly, three days ago, this gets spun up as if there is something new to the story. there is no there there. so the whole thing defies logic and the fact that this keeps on getting churned out, frankly, has a lot to do with political motivations. >> okay. so the president went through his time line there
today. we wanted to take some time just to play a couple of sound bites, just play them as they happened chron logically so you could listen to them. >> no acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation. alter that character, or ellipse the light of the values that we stand for. >> mr. president, this morning, you went out of your way to avoid the use of the word terrorism in connection with with the libyan attack. >> right. >> do you believe this was a terrorist attack. >> well, it's too early to know exactly how this came about, what group was involved. but obviously, it was an attack on americans. here is what happened. you had a video that was released by somebody who lives here, sort of a shadowy character who is extremely offensive video directed at mohammed and islam. >> making fun of the profitt mohammed. >> making fun of the profitt mohammed.
this caused great offense in much of the muslim world. but, what also happened was extremists and terrorists used this as an excuse to attack a variety of our embassies includinged one, the consulate in libya. >> we have reports that the white house said today that the attacks in libya were terrorist attack. do you have information indicating that it was iran or al qaeda was behind organizing the protest? investigation. still doing and they there are are going to be different circumstances in different countries. so i don't want to speak to something until we have all of the information. what we do know is that the natural protests that arose because of the outrage over the video were used as an excuse by extremists to see if they can also directly harm u.s. interests. >> i heard hillary clinton say that it was an act of
terrorism. is it? what do you say? >> well, we're still doing an investigation. there is no doubt that the kind of weapons that were used the ongoing assault that it wasn't just a mob action. >> um-huh. >> now, we don't have all the information yet and so we are still gathering it. >> there are no words that excuse the killing of innocent. there is no video that justifies an attack on an embassy. >> bret: okay that last one was the president at the united nations. okay, steve, he also said that the talking points matched what he was getting in the presidential daily briefings? >> right. let me add one thing to that long list. on september 20th, jay carney gave a gaggle, which means no cameras were president in which he called the attacks a terrorist attack. he was asked by the others in the gaggle, is this the first time the white house is using that? according to the pool report written by mark land ler of the "new york times" carney acknowledged that it
was. whatever the president is saying now it's not what the white house was saying then and not what jay carney was saying then. two big things coming out of the president's remarks today. he said that the talking points were a side show. one, you have the issue of manipulating the talking points. it's clear beyond any dispute that what happened was a manipulation of the talking points. we now have the documents, we have the emails. this is clear. and i am totally befuddled as to why the president of the united states echoing jay carney would claim that reporters aren't seeing exactly what they know that they are seeing. and i think this is doing tremendous damage to the credibility of the president with reporters who have been in some cases i think cheerleaders. the second is the misrepresentation of what they have said about the talking points. this has been going on now for literally months and the president, i think, doubled down on that today saying in effect yeah, we didn't have really much to do with this. we now know that that is not true. >> brit: kirsten. >> what i don't understand
what the president is doing to a certain extent you could argue that he wasn't really involved in a lot of this stuff. but he is so centrally involving himself with these repeated lies. i'm going to call them lies because they are lies. they are on tape. nobody thought that he called it a terrorist attack. last night i was -- i went and looked up at the "new york times" how they reported it the day after. they never referenced that we have had a terrorist attack against the united states. on september 20th, however, they run a story that says libya envoy's killing was a terrorist attack. they say until now white house officials have not used that language in describing the assault. that is september 20th the "new york times." at what pint president don't believe your lying eyes. >> brit: if -- >> bret: if the brief matched talking points that's. what the president did was force john boehner's hands on the select committee.
extremely different than for boehner to appoint the select committee and sort all of this out. >> bret: didn't he also kind of challenge reporters by saying there is no there there? >> exactly. i think that phrase is going to come back to haunt him. jay carney has been taking it in the neck across the political spectrum for making these indefensible claims. i think jay carney's myspace talking point came from his boss. where else could it have come from. his boss reiterated it today. >> bret: okay. next up. the verdict is in. the doctor is guilty. we will discuss the gosnell decision. i've been taking a multivitamin for years. centrum silver. both of us actually. our pharmacist recommended it. and that makes me feel pretty good about it. and then i heard about a study looking at multivitamins and the long term health benefits. and what do you know? they used centrum silver in the study. makes me feel even better, that's what i take. sorry, we take.
think when all is said and done, i don't think our jury system, these people take their jobs very seriously, again, i don't think they are influenced by that maybe they are, i don't know. i think when you look at this jury taking two weeks, am i disappointed? yes. am i satisfied that the jury gave us a fair shot? yes. >> bret: dr. kermit gosnell's attorney. the jury came back guilty of first degree numbered and dozens of other first degree misdemeanor charges convicted of killing babies in his abortion clinic following botched abortions now. wait to see what the sentence will be. kirsten you have followed this from the beginning and your column kind of woke people up a bit in the mainstream media your thoughts on this verdict and what it means. >> i think that he was found guilty as he should have been. his attorney had been trying to make the case to the jury this is what he
was paid to do. he was paid to kill these babies and why would he be found guty of this. gosnell looked befuddled and surprised that this is considered murder. so, i think that, you know, certainly an important thing for us to at least all be able to agree on the fact that sning a baby's neck after it comes after a mother's body is a heinous crime. >> since 1973 when the supreme court decided roe v. wade, abortion choice has been a pitched political battle in america. one side fighting with the other. by and large political battle happens at conventions and so forth. what we saw here in this verdict was this subject becoming really think for most people and whatever -- wherever one stands on either side of roe v. wade, i think a lot of americans are stepping back and saying i would like to take a second, large look at what's going on with the issue of abortion. what's going on in these
clinics? when are things taking place. i think the subject has been opened up in a way that a lot of people are going to be willing to set aside their politics and find out the reality of this subject. >> bret: steve, the fact of the matter was no matter what your i'd obligor was on the issue of abortion, whether you are pro-choice or pro-life. the facts of this case were gruesome. tough to read and listen. >> to very. it did effect people. >> no question about it a reporter covering the trial very closely up in pennsylvania. this has made me pro-life. hinge point in public discussion debate about abortion. because you can't really go back. you are going to have, i think, people like planned parenthood fight what i think is this coming national discussion. they put out a statement today or a tweet today in which they didn't even mention the babies. they didn't even mention the babies. they said they were glad that the women victims
were, you know, vindicated. i think it's not going to be a debate that comes easy. you still have people who are not going to want to acknowledge what happened and the fact that this is more common than many people think it is. the associated press wrote a story today of they wrote of the fetuses rather than the babies. they were babies. the complaint says they were babies. they should be called babies. >> bret: eric ferraro of planned parenthood wrote in the jury has punished for his crimes. make sure no woman is victimized by kermit gosnell again. this case has made clear that we must have and enforce laws that protect access to safe and legal abortion and we must reject misguided laws that would limit womennens options and force them to seek treatment from criminals like kermit gosnell. kirsten? >> yeah. i would love to see a conversation come out about this. mostly because what i have found in doing reporting on this is how misinformed most people are. even pro-choice people. even those i know who are
very actively pro-choiced were arguing with me saying, no, you can't just get an abortion up to 24 weeks for any reason. you can only do that up to 12 weeks. it's like no, you can do it. this is wrong. in pennsylvania for any reason you can do that i just think people don't really understand what the laws are and what really people are allowed to do in this country. >> bret: quickly, down the road, does this change the debate. >> it completely changes the debate. a question is will a group come forth that will allow this debate to occur. >> i'm very skeptical that there will be no a real debate on it? >> absolutely no question it changes the debate. >> bret: that is it for the panel. stay tuned for something light on a heavy day. st week, , and even next year. for seeing your business's cash flow like never before, introducing cash flow insight powered by pnc cfo.
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thanks for inviting us into your home tonight. that is it for this "special report." fair, balanced and unafraid. >> shepard: this is "the fox report." brand new revelations that the obama administration was snooping on journalists. the justice department admits it secretly obtained reporters' phone records. plus, the philadelphia abortion doctor found guilty of murdering babies. next, a jury will decide whether he will die for his crimes. first on fox this monday night. the head of the irs found out a year ago that staffers were targeting conservative groups. that's the word from the irs itself the head of the irs is a political appointee. he serves at the pleasure of the president. another apologized