tv FOX News Sunday With Chris Wallace FOX News August 17, 2014 11:00pm-12:01am PDT
[applause] sunday is next with guest host shannon bream. with don't miss the interview with rick perry. thanks store watching. i'm shannon bream in for chris wallace. a state of emergency is declared and a curfew enforced in ferguson, missouri, after protests over the shooting of an unarmed teenager continue. >> if we're going to achieve justice, we must first have and maintain peace. >> we're all talking about the same concerns and the same passion. the frustration in your home is in my home. >> we'll have a live report and analysis from ferguson. then texas governor rick perry hits the campaign trail in iowa. ramping up speculation about another presidential run. we'll talk with governor perry
about 2016, his battle with president obama over immigration, and that new indictment. it's a fox news sunday exclusive. plus, iraq's prime minister steps down as the u.s. retaliates against violent isis attacks. >> we will continue air strikes to protect our people and facilities in iraq. perhaps most importantly, we're urging iraqis to come together. >> what does the formation of a new government mean for isis in iraq and u.s. engagement. we'll discuss with two members of congress. ron johnson and eliot engel. and hillary clinton sparks a political firestorm after criticizing president obama's foreign policy. our sunday panel weighs in on clinton's efforts to distance herself from the president. all right now on "fox news sunday." hello again
u.s. air strikes in iraq are ongoing. the current operation said to be a joint kurdish iraqi and u.s. campaign. aimed at freeing the mosul dam from isis control. we'll talk with two members of congress in just a moment, but first, fox news senior foreign affairs correspondent greg palkot from the city of erbil with the latest on the operation. greg? >> reporter: shannon, fox news has learned the u.s. jet fighters and unmanned drones continue to hit isis positions around that dam today. and what is clearly the opening up of a new front in the war against militants. kurdish fighters are on the move, advancing with iraqi forces on isis militants in an
attempt to retake the strategic mosul dam held by isis, there are fears they could let it burst or blow it up with devastating effect. in a coordinated action, the u.s. launched nine air strikes saturday against isis positions at the dam. a local commander told us the terrorists can be beaten. >> absolutely. >> absolutely? >> absolutely. >> that's the note. this, as the humanitarian crisis builds. 400,000 refugees fleeing into one northern iraqi province alone. 1.5 million are across the region. relief workers are coping to catch up. >> they need food, they need shelter, they need medical support, like medical supplies. and then they need help because they're traumatized. >> ethnic minorities are still reeling from details of friday's massacre in a village near mt. sinjar. some 80 men and teenagers will killed by militants, some at close range.
at least 100 women and children were kidnapped. you can not even say they're animals this refugee says. even in the jungle, animals have laws. they don't abide by any laws. they are really monsters. he called them monsters. there are, in fact, new reports of isis militants killing men and kidnapping women. u.s. officials tell us that they are investigating those reports. back to you, shannon. >> greg, thank you very much. now let's bring in two key members of congress. senator ron johnson, a member of the foreign relations committee, and congressman eliot engel, the top democrat on the foreign affairs committee. welcome to you both. >> thank you, good to be here. >> morning, shannon. >> i want to start with a question for both of you and i'll address it to you, senator johnson. you heard about the tension we have in iraq. at what point do you feel the administration has to come to congress for any type of authorization? >> it's a good sign president obama is beginning to act.
a couple weeks ago, president obama did invite about eight or nine members of the foreign relations and armed services committee into the white house to speak with his council about a new authorization for the use of military force, which i think is pretty long overdue. they're finding out trying to act militarily with the current authorization in place is becoming tenuous. it's a good sign president obama is recognizing the fact he's going to need authority to deal with this new asymmetric threat. we just heard from greg palkot. isis method of diplomacy is beheading, crucifixions, mass executions or live burials and enslavement of women and forced marriages. these are evil people. i'm glad president obama is finally beginning to act. >> congressman engel, same question to you about getting congress on board. >> i think congress has to play a role in this. this is the way our constitution works and i think congress is really tired of presidents just
going in by themselves, so i think there has to be consultation and an assent from congress, but i do agree with the senator. i think what is going on in iraq is horrific and it warrants a response. we cannot just put our heads in the sand and pretend it doesn't exist. if we let isis to get bigger and bigger, they'll plot attacks on us. >> here's what ben rhodes said when i asked him what the long term strategy is regarding isis. >> provide assistance and equipment to those iraqi forces who are taking the fight to isil so we can squeeze them in the space they're operating in and ultimately address that threat that they're posing not just to iraq but to the region and to the united states. >> senator johnson, you heard him there specifically mention a threat to the u.s. what do you think needs to be our long term strategy? >> we need to defeat them. we had deputy assistant secretary to the state in front
of our committee on july 24. he said isis is far more capable of manpower, resources, and fighting effectiveness than what we faced in 2007. they're funneling 30 to 50 suicide bombers into iraq every month. he said they could easily funnel those suicide bombers into western nations. we need to be highly concerned about this. this threat is a gathering storm. it's not going away. like congressman engel said, we can't bury our heads in the sand in this one. we may be war weary, but isis/isil is not war weary. they're highly organized. they are highly trained. they have been very patient setting up this caliphate, and their long term aim is to use that base of operation against the west. >> congressman, we have seen them break through the lebanon border. there has been great operation, we know, in syria. there are very big concerns about aleppo. what is your concern about that immediate situation in syria with regard to isis?
>> well, the syrian opposition, the free syria army, whom we should have armed two years ago, is facing defeat, and they have called on us to bomb isis outside of aleppo. i think we should consider doing it because this is one war. it's building from syria into iraq. the border is obliterated. there's no border anymore, and we need to fight isis wherever they rear their ugly heads. you know, when we, years ago, when the russians were thrown out of afghanistan, and we just sort of looked the other way and didn't really focus, al qaeda, the taliban, allowed al qaeda to plot against the united states and that culminated in september 11th, 2001. if we allow isis to get stronger, if they take aleppo, it's the end of the free syria army and also would mean that isis would have essentially a no man's land in syria through iraq
to plot and plan attacks on our homeland. and frankly, our european allies should step up to the fight. they are geographically much closer to iraq and syria than we are and i don't hear many good things frankly coming from our nato allies or the european union. they need to step up also. we're all in this fight together. >> and what i'm hearing from both of you is that you do feel there is a significant threat to the u.s. long term if isis isn't stamped out. now, they do seem very motivated. they don't seem that they're slowing down in any respect. can either of you envision a point where we are, despite as war weary as this country is, that we are putting boots on the ground or getting more heavily involved there so we don't have to confront them here? >> i don't think we're going to put boots on the ground like we did before in iraq. i don't think anyone wants to do that. we do have some boots on the ground now, and frankly, we have to do everything we can to repel isis. i don't think we have the luxury
of putting our heads in the sand and saying it's over there and we're not going to do it. i think what we're doing now is effective and we have to do more of it and ultimately we may have boots on the ground. it's not something i want. we have bad choices and the worse choice is to do nothing. >> the president campaigned and was elected on his part to get us out of that part of the world. a lot of lives were invested, a lot of treasure invested so what is your take on where we go from here? >> unfortunately, president obama buzzed out of iraq, and that was strategic and historic blunder and we're seeing the results of this. right now, what the president has to do is assemble a coalition of the willing. we have to realize there was a german and an australian suicide bomber the week of july 24th. that's what brett reported to us. we have seen the first american suicide bomber set himself off in syria in may. so this is a growing threat to america. and we really do need to, like
congressman engel said, we have to assemble nato, strengthen nato not only to handle what is happening in syria and iraq. but also what's happening in ukraine and eastern europe as well. >> i want to pivot to ukraine and russia. that's been heating up. conversations about russian convoys across the border. ukrainians saying they have taken out some of those vehicles. reports that a ukranian jet was shot down. i want to look at a new poll out this week. 74% of those surveyed said president obama has not been tough enough on russia. 77% say that putin does not take president obama seriously. congressman, are the sanctions working there? is our strategy with respect to russia with the advances of president putin, is it working? >> well, i think that the nato alliance is being tested by putin. you know, for the past 15 or 20 years, the equation for nato was always that russia was kind of a partner, that we sort of didn't need to look at russia as an
adversary. that's clearly not the case. putin has indicated he's an adversary of the west, and therefore, the whole equation of nato has to change or else nato is dead. what it really means is the clause in the nato agreement, that every country has to spend 2% of their budge and defense has to be enforced. i think putin is a bully. if you don't stand up to a bully early on, you have to stand up to them later on. we saw that. i don't like comparisons to hitler, but in 1938, some of the people said, well, just give hitler czechoslovakia. he's worried about protecting ethnic germans, if we do that, everything will be all right. and then we saw what happened. now we're saying just give him crimea. or maybe a little bit of eastern ukraine. he's protecting ethnic russians. you can't allow this bully to do
that. the way we deal with putin now is going to set the stage for the next 25 years because he's going to be around for a long time. if he thinks we're paper tigers, he's going to continue to move with impunity. >> have we missed the opportunity to deal more forcefully with him? where do we go? >> let's hope we haven't missed the opportunity. i have been hearing administration officials saying they want to offer an off ramp to vladimir putin. he's not looking for off ramps. he's looking for on ramps. we should have complied with the request for small arms ammunition immediately. we should be very overtly, very visibly saying we're going to honor the memorandum, we're going to help asssure the territorial integrity and the governing independence, and as congressman engel said, that's the way you have to treat a bully. we have to beef up nato. defense or foreign minister
sikorski in poland said the polish-american alliance is useless and it could be counterproductive because it creates a false sense of security. that's the wrong way for our allies to think of america, but because of the lack of result, because of the weakness we have shown, that's the way our allies are viewing us. we have to show far greater strength of resolve, and we need to secure ukraine and defeat the russian aggression into ukraine. >> thank you both for joining us. >> thank you, shannon. >> have a great day. >> you, too. up next, what does maliki's resignation mean for u.s.
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the situation on the mountain has greatly improved and americans should be very proud of our efforts, because the skill and professionalism of our military and the generosity of our people, we broke the isis siege of mt. sin jar and we helped save many innocent lives. >> president obama praising the u.s. military operation in iraq before making clear that our involvement there is not over yet. it's time now for our sunday group. syndicated columnist george will. usa today columnist kirsten powers. liz cheney and amy walter from the cook political report. good sunday morning to all of you. the president in that moment, in those remarks from martha's vineyard sounded like a teeny bit of a victory. we have accomplished our humanitarian mission, but it is clear -- >> it's not over.
but to be able to say we have done something. i said we're going to have very strict parameters around it. it was successful, and now we can move on. it continues with a sort of whack-a-mole strategy from the white house which is confront the crisis while it's happening but do not get much more engaged than that, trying to keep the u.s. out of anything that is more direct than that. >> you heard the congressman and senator we had just before this. both saying that we have to do something decisive with respect to isil and isis. nobody wants to think about getting too involved, but it may require that if we don't want them to show up here. >> absolutely, shannon. isis has to be fought, they have to be defeated. they can't be contained. even this limited objective the president set out for himself, we now know that you had yazidi slaughters after he declared it had been a success. the longer the president waits to take true offensive strategic action, the harder that fight is going to be ultimately, the bloodier the fight is going to be, the costlier. the fight is coming.
and secondly, the more likely it is that we're going to experience, unfortunately, potentially a mass casualty terrorist attack on the home land. it's clear isis is telling people in the intelligence community briefed reporters and said isis knows a war with the united states is inevitable, so it's coming. and for the president to be saying things like, i want a solution in iraq that has no victor and no vanquished, which is what he said last week, you know, i think frankly you're to the point now where this is a dereliction of duty on his part. he's unwilling to take defensive action to defeat isis and is watching this threat, which is a grave threat potentially of historic proportions grow by the day. >> kirsten, how does he sell that, though, to the american people when he has been the one saying the u.s. is too involved in too many places and we need to come home? >> he has to sell them on the facts. i don't think there's a lot of disagreement over the threat that isis poses to the united
states and poses to the people of iraq. and if he's going to come out and say i care about humanitarian issues and i have to come in to save people from a humanitarian crisis, there's a lot more work to be done because he's incorrect when he says that he has somehow dealt with the humanitarian crisis. there are hundreds of thousands of refugees internally displaced people, refugees in their own country, right now who don't have food or water or shelter and are under threat by isis. so i think he would have to sell that, and look, i think americans have shown that they're pretty supportive of these air strikes. even 65% of democrats in the fox news poll supported the air strikes. i don't think it's correct to think americans won't support something. they don't want a full-scale ground war but they support what he's doing so far. >> george, can we neutralize isis? >> from the air? i doubt it. yugoslavia was born in 1918 and died a few years ago of internal contradictions. there is nothing compared to those in iraq. iraq was born in 1920.
eight years ago, the senator from delaware, joe biden, suggested partitioning iraq along sectarian grounds. well, it's doing itself now, the question for liz and kirsten and everyone, who's going to take back the cities of fallujah, tikrit, and mosul? the iraqi army? what is the iraqi army fighting for? the iraqi state? the iraqi state barely exists now. a leader of the kurdish fighters said there's an asymmetry in the motivation. the isil people want to die and go and have lunch with mohammed. our people want to fight and go have dinner with their families. those are the kurds whose have built a nation and know what they're fighting for. what would the iraqi army be fighting for? and absent that, who will take the cities back? >> george, you're right that it's a complete disaster and a sectarian mess, but i think the security of the nation requires that we focus on what is the direct threat to us. and part of the problem in the
president's policy to date is he has been saying, well, we have to wait until we have a political solution before i'll take action. we've now had a political solution. maliki is gone, but what we learned with the surge, for example, is the military action, demonstrating to people we will be there, we will be fighting with them, is critical. at the end of the day, you know, granting everything you just said about the conditions on the ground, isis is a direct, immediate, grave, strategic threat to the security of the united states of america, and the president as commander in chief has an obligation to respond to that. >> also, i don't think it's the iraqi army. it's the kurds and their point that they're not as diabolical as isis, but they have said they want to fight them. refugees are being able to flee, they want to protect them, and they're armed, and they have been asking for this for years, in the last few months have been aggressively asking for help. >> it's one thing to defend kurdistan, it's another thing to
russia as that continues to heat up. there are new polls, as we >> they may not understand the nuances of what's happening in ukraine ain crimea, where do we go from here? >> we go to the specific questions. it's one thing to say he should be stronger. it's another thing to say what should we do about it? let's be blunt.
20% of americans say they have no opinion on ukraine. not nearly 20% of americans could find ukraine on a map, let alone crimea which once upon a time was part of ukraine and is now conceded as departed. these polls are very limited information. >> well, we will continue our discussion, but not on international affairs. we're going to take a break here. when we come back, we'll talk about hillary clinton. she sparked controversy when she criticized president obama's foreign policy. was it part of her 2016 strategy. plus, what would you like to ask the panel? go to facebook or twitter@foxnewssunday. we may use your question on the air.
are you talking with the president? >> yes, absolutely. looking about it tonight. >> they continue to agree on a broad majority of issues on the country even if they have a occasional difference of opinion. the president invites her counsel and friendship, and that is why he is looking forward to seeing her. >> and that is eric schultz downplaying any problems between the former secretary of state and the president even if she is criticizing his foreign policy. and it with was so awkward this position that hillary was signing the books and caught in the moment with that question saying everything is fine. >> and they were apparently at
this party for vernon jordan's wife, and they were dancing on the dance floor and having a blast together. so, you know, allegedly nothing is wrong with them, but it is pretty clearly as much as she has said, you know, that shes has reached out to the president to assure him that she didn't mean anything about it. but she is differentiating herself from him, and very clearly, this is is not a subtle statement. i think that it is pretty harsh statement for her to make about his foreign policy, and yes, she has already, i mean, we all knew that she wanted to arm the sooner rebels, but that way she attacked the president over the foreign policy philosophy is a much bigger attack than just disagreeing on maybe one particular country. >> and just so people know that a little bit of what she had to say in the interview as far as the u.s. moving faster to arms, and the syrian rebels fighting assad, and she said, it has left a vacuum where the jihadist have filled. and the fagreat nations need
organizing principles, and don't do stupid stuff is an organizing style. >> this is not just something that flew out of her mouth. she has been sitting here on the book to plant the flag posts in 2016, and when we come back to say, gosh, is she positioning in 2016, and she could say, no, no, i told you in 2013, 2014, and i told you on the book interview and this is where i stood trying to get that laid out now and then when we go into 2016, we have the markers set. >> and we have an interesting comment from facebook, and this is coming in phil hosstead who said, why did she turn around to apologize to obama for doing so after she made these remarks. and liz, if she is trying to
differentiate herself, was it more than she thought? why did she apologize for it? >> well, it is washington game. e she has two problems. one is substantive and one is political. we are are watching the complete and the total collapse of the obama foreign policy, and you are watching and you have the secretary of defense basically saying that the world is a disaster right now. and so, secretary clinton is in a position where she has to try to differentiate herself from that and that means to differentiate herself from herself, because she oversaw this policy for four years, and that is very difficult, and not the mention benghazi which she has yet to answer for, but the political problem is that she is attempting here to move right. it is going to anger those on the left. she is going to lose what support she has from those on the left of her own party, and she is certainly not going to gain support from those on the right, from those in my party who will say, we have seen it
before. we know that for example from bob gates' book that secretary clinton has a his are the of taking political positions, and overruling national security issues because of her own political gains, so it is a tough complicated situation for her, and it is probably beyond her capacity to maneuver. >> and we got it from twitter, and bob says, why does hillary behave like a whistle-blower who had no involvement in the e events taking place in her tenure as secretary of state. george, does that ring true? >> well, that is truly the question. she is differentiating herself, clearly, but going on to define herself, a nd to put it poe lightly, how clever is she looking like she is doing? it is never clever to look clever. and remember in bob gates' memoir he was so dismayed when she said in front of obama that she had opposed president bush's surge in iraq for complications with obama in the democratic primaries, and you have the
world, what 18 months after she leaves secretary of state exploding, and that is the word of the president's own secretary of defense. and she can't can really say that everything was fine and then it suddenly exploded. >> and let's also be clear. we are focusing on the foreign policy as we should be, but for the bigger problem for her going into 2016, this is not so much about the primary, but the general election is distancing herself if the economy is not doing as well than distancing herself from what is happening overseas. so the bigger issue in 2016 as it is with every presidential election is how do feem feel about the economy. that is a tougher balancing act. voters are going to attach every democrat to what is happening with the president, and finding a way to differentiate herself to say, another four years of a democrat in the white house is going to be a bet ter economy
because why, and having an answer for that question. >> and we have a poll that may sound light hearted, but there is some truth, a nugget here, and the fox news poll about who you would rather spend your summer vacation with. hillary and bill, 42%, and michelle and barack obama at 25%, and 27% say neither. but hillary and bill out there, and is she aware that the two of them it seems are more likable than the current president, but when you are in office, you are the one who is making all of the tough decisions. >> part of the summer vacations is based on which one is going to be more of a circus. >> and you know that if you are hanging with the clintons, it is going to be a circus. this goes to bill clinton as well, also. we were talking a about this before to the extent that people look at him and look at how he has behaved and continues to
behave and not that it should blame hillary for that, but more, do you really want that person living in your white house again? >> i would say that though that nobody would have predicted this in 1999, but a poll out of nbc/washington "wall street journal," and bill clinton and related to other world leaders, he and the pope, the pope, tied for terms of approval ratings, and nobody would have predicted that in the height of the impeachment scandal. >> is he a plus or the minus for her? >> who? >> bill. >> plus. >> and if they had done be with obama, because if you take bill out of the equation, you might get a different number. >> and here is a plus until people think of him wandering the corridors of the white house sort of fancy free and bored. >> bored being the key part of the phrase. >> and thank you all today. and that is it for the panel. chris wallace will be back next week. have a great week.
we will see you next sunday from right here in washington for "fox news sunday." obey that ane protestors go home. we'll watch it, huckabee starts right now. >> tonight on huckabee, a week of chaos in ferguson, missouri as police clash with protestors and across the country cops are looking and acting more like soldiers. the militarization of police in america. tragedy on the race track. 20-year-old kevin ward junior struck and hit by stewart. >> it is the culture of car racing and that is a eye for eye culture. >> the governor responds tonight. >> and iraq's