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tv   Americas Newsroom With Bill Hemmer and Sandra Smith  FOX News  March 13, 2019 6:00am-9:00am PDT

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>> me and we'll have karl rove and talking about the college scandal and what the next transcript to drop from those private closed-door meetings. >> we'll be back on the couch in studio f tomorrow. >> bill: thank you very much. breaking news now. two big stories we're watching. paul manafort due in court for his second sentencing hearing in a week. before the day is over he may get 10 years added to his prison sentence coming as we learn new developments on the clinton email matter. new transcripts revealing lisa page admitted that the f.b.i. considered charging hillary clinton but the obama justice department shut it down. much more on that coming up inside of "america's newsroom." meanwhile the breaking news on the biggest college admission cheating scandal we've seen to date. the actress lori loughlin will turn herself into police this morning.
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how the rich and famous got their children into famous universities. i'm bill hemmer. welcome to new york city. we're back in the shoe box for a day today. good morning. >> sandra: good morning. i'm sandra smith. authorities indicting 50 people from parents to administrators and coaches and felicity huffman also charged as reaction pours in for the operation varsity blues. >> we believe all of them, parents, coaches and facilitators lied, cheated, and covered up their crimes at the expense of hard working students and taxpayers everywhere. >> it is disrespecting my hard work i put in. just because you're rich doesn't mean you can do whatever you want, right? >> molly line broke the news yesterday. back in boston today. >> good morning, bill. many of those ensnared already
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made their court appearances. one of tv stars lori loughlin will be in court today in l.a. best known for helps popular role in a sit com full house. she reportedly flying back from canada yesterday expected to face a judge. they're in l.a. on mail and wire fraud charges. we'll have a crew at the courthouse. her husband, the fashion designer, made his appearance yesterday. the cheating scam broadly involved parents, ceo who paid william singer a combined total of $25 million to cheat the system through fake test taking and improved scores or fake athletic prowess. now, usc important in this case as we're speaking where loughlin's daughter ended up going to school. the youngest daughter the rising social media star does
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some blogging, makeup and fashion stuff this case drawing a lot of attention with postings. she said she was interested in attending college for the parties and back tracked on that tweeting in part i would way rather be filming but an education is super important for me. she also said she pursued a higher education because of her parents wanted her to head in that direction. remember there were two routes this scam took fake tests or fake sports. according to the court records in this case loughlin and her husband agreed to pay bribes totaling hundreds of thousands of dollars in exchange for having their two daughters designated as recruits for the usc crew team even though they didn't participate in crew. >> bill: molly line watching that. next hour dr. bill bennett is our headliner and we'll put questions to him coming up in
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our 10:00 a.m. hour. >> sandra: another top story this morning. we're waiting to learn paul manafort's fate. his sentencing on federal conspiracy charges in washington expected this morning as new transcripts come to light renewing questions about the f.b.i. and d.o.j.'s handling of the clinton email investigation. catherine herridge following the stories for us. good morning. >> good morning. this is the second and final sentence for the former trump campaign chairman paul manafort and it brings to an end the most public and high-profile prosecution that was brought by special counsel robert mueller and his team. the issue for the federal judge amy jackson berman today is whether the sentence here in washington will run back-to-back with the 47 months that manafort got in virginia last week for bank and tax fraud convictions or whether it will run simultaneously. the max they're looking at in washington, d.c. is a decade and in a pre-sentencing memo
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the special counsel pressed for something very serious, quote, manafort chose repeatedly and knowingly to violate the law. garden variety crime such as tax fraud, money laundering and bank fraud or other laws he nevertheless was intimate with such as the foreign acts registrations act. his actions were bold even under a spotlight as the campaign chairman and later while on bail from this court. manafort's legal team has always maintained that he was the subject of prosecutorial overreach and that these crimes had nothing to do with this underlying question of russian collusion. here is his lawyer. >> most importantly what you saw today is the same thing that we had said from day one. there is absolutely no evidence that paul manafort was involved with any collusion with any government official from russia. >> the thing to watch today is whether the special counsel
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will also press the judge so that manafort will give up his remaining fortune of $11 million because he violated a plea agreement to fully cooperate with that investigation, sandra. >> sandra: what are you learning about who told the f.b.i. and the f.b.i. lawyers to stand down on the hillary clinton email investigation? what's the latest on that? >> well, at the heart of this breaking news this morning, sandra, is something called 18usc793 subsection f. what we showed to our reporting at fox news it's a gross negligence statute to be applied to hillary clinton. what we learned this morning is lisa page, when she testified under oath last fall, she shed new light on whether there was advice from the justice department under the obama administration not to pursue this gross negligence statute. we have a tweet from congressman john ratcliffe, a republican who led that line of
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questioning with lisa page. he says that page testified that there was advice from the obama administration's justice department that this statute was too vague and that it was not sustainable and that it should not be proceeded upon. we've also had a tweet from the president this morning reacting to this news saying he believes this is evidence that the obama administration justice department was a broken and corrupt machine. what's important here when we think about the gross negligence statute, sandra, is that it did not have that requirement for intent and it was f.b.i. director comey who said consistently he wanted to find intent in order to pursue any prosecution of hillary clinton and her team, sandra. >> sandra: a lot to take in there. thank you. >> bill: want to bring in louisiana republican senator john kennedy who serves on the judiciary committee. you listened to that report. i'll play for you july of 2016, james comey when he ran the f.b.i. >> i know there will be intense
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public debate in the wake of this recommendation as there was throughout the investigation. what i can assure the american people is that this investigation was done honestly, competently and independently. no outside influence of any kind was brought to bear. >> bill: now we have the indication that d.o.j. perhaps said take a knee on this one, senator. what's the truth in this? >> i don't know, bill. but we better find out. i mean, this is just disgusting. 99% of the men and women at the f.b.i. and at justice are good people. but you've got a small minority over there, or you did, maybe you still do. most of them appear to be anti-trump though i'm sure there are some anti-clinton but they'll act from their political beliefs. then they want to go out and sell books. i listened to andy mccabe on sunday. he acts like butter wouldn't
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melt in his mouth. everybody forgets he was fired from lying to the f.b.i. and getting involved in politics. now this with lisa page. look, these people have hurt badly the premier law enforcement agency in all of human history. and we're going to have to work really hard to build back the reputation of the f.b.i. because it is a well-deserved good reputation for most of the agents there. >> bill: is it your sense bob mueller is trying to wrestle with this? >> i hope so. if he doesn't, i hope that chairman graham, the head of the senate judiciary committee will. we have to lance this boil. it is okay to have political beliefs. this is america. but if you work for the f.b.i. or the justice department, you cannot act on them. and at the root of this problem you have a select group of people over there who think they're smarter and more virtuous than ordinary
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americans and that ordinary americans aren't smart enough to choose for themselves so these people at the f.b.i. the small group have to put their thumb on the scale and guide the american people to make the correct choice. give me a break. the arrogance. >> bill: we'll see paul manafort in a moment. what do you think this week is going to reveal? there is a lot of action on the legal front, senator. what is your sense of that? >> i don't have any sense -- mr. manafort convicted of back fraud and tax fraud. there was no evidence of any collusion with russia or any of that but bank and tax fraud are serious offenses against the american people and he always played on the margins. i have think i've called him a sleaze. he is. i don't have any sympathy for him. >> bill: last point on this resolution, emergency declaration on behalf of the president. you came out with a surprising comment yesterday. you said you thought the president was going to lose
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before. now you're not so sure. what changed? >> i'm not sure. there are a handful of republicans who want to support the president and they believe in border security, but they believe that the national emergency act is unconstitutional. and my point is okay, you may be right, but in the meantime the president is not using any power that he doesn't have. you know why he hasn't? congress gave it to him. maybe congress shouldn't have, but the cow is out of the barn and i think what the president is doing is well within his power. i'm going to vote to support him and i think he will win in court. in the meantime if we want to reform the national emergencies act, i like to think the president would join with us and try to improve it. that may be a way to get more republicans on board. i'm not predicting it will happen but i'm more optimistic today than i was yesterday. >> bill: good to have you back.
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like butter in your mouth, right? that's the line of the morning so far. until that is topped. thank you for your time, senator. >> sandra: now to breaking new details on the boeing investigation. black boxes from the latest crash being sent overseas as new reports reveal u.s. pilots complained anonymously about issues with the same boeing max jet in recent months. details on that ahead. >> nancy pelosi definitely wants to impeach the president. they just want to find more evidence. she is staking out a position that ultimately i think she will come around if they do, in fact, find their mythical animal that they're looking for on collusion. >> bill: there it is. congressman devin nunes says he thinks nancy pelosi will still try to impeach the president. we'll ask congressman harley root on that. >> sandra: former aides to ronald reagan wanting to set
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the record straight after congresswoman ocasio-cortez suggested the former president was a racist. we'll speak to one of them in a bit. >> i would challenge all of you to pledge yourselves to building an america where incidents of racial hatred do not happen because racism has been banned not just from the law books, but from the hearts of the people. when you retire will you or will you just be you, without the constraints of a full time job? you can grow your retirement savings with pacific life and create the future that's most meaningful to you. which means you can retire, without retiring from life. having the flexibility to retire on your terms. that's the power of pacific. ask your financial professional about pacific life today.
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impeachment. she didn't want to move forward right now with impeachment. >> bill: some democrats pushing back on the talk about impeaching the president after speak en pelosi made headlines opposing it. we have a freshman in congress. thank you for being here today. what do you think -- do you favor this move on impeachment or not? >> we need to give mueller and other investigations to do the depth they deserve. you want to get all the way through and see if you have actionable items. >> bill: here is the headline from "the new york times," one of them. if not trump, then who? pelosi fuels impeachment debate with long implications. you saw that story. what did you think of that? >> the question there is what is right and what's wrong. i used to be a republican. this should not be a republican or democrat question. this should be a question of right or wrong. and if the president has
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committed wrongs that rise to the level of impeachable offenses i hope all members of constitution would do their constitutional duty. >> bill: you used to be. what happened? >> i left in 1997. >> bill: some time ago then. you moved to california. did you hear what steny hoyer said the other day? the 62 new members of congress, of which you're one and only three seem to get all the attention. do you agree with that? >> i do. i think there is too much focus on the extremes of both parties and i was elected by the voters of orange county because i brought a pragmatic message that we have more in common than what separates us. so i came here to legislate and i'm hoping to work with members of both parties to do just that. >> bill: what do you think about those who get all the headlines all the time? if you've got a moderate message you aren't getting any oxygen, are you? >> actually we're getting that message out and it is clear the democratic caucus has moved to the center. we reason we got the majority
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was because of folks like me who turned districts red to blue on that type of message. i'm hopeful the media will continue to focus on those opportunities on where we can work together. >> bill: a lot of red in your district, you admit that, right? 50/50 in orange county, correct? >> exactly, yes. >> bill: why don't you bend tom perez's ear, head of the dnc? who is really afraid of chris wallace for a debate during the primary season, huh? >> that's above my pay grade. >> bill: would you invite if you were given an invitation to come on and have a debate on our network would you take it, sir? >> i would welcome the opportunity. >> bill: why are they afraid of that then? >> you would have to ask them. i don't know what the decision making process was. i wasn't in the room when the decision was made. that's not what i'm focused on. i'm focused on doing my job. >> bill: is there a chance to revisit that? >> that will be between fox and
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dnc. >> bill: put in a word for us, okay? harley, come on back, freshman democrat from california. thank you for your time. >> sandra: police in california arresting an illegal immigrant in the murder of a san jose woman. what ice is saying about the suspect's record and why this crime was preventable. we'll have details on this next. ♪ ♪ this simple banana peel represents a bold idea: a way to create energy from household trash.
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want more from your entejust say teach me more. into your xfinice remote to discover all sorts of tips and tricks in x1. can i find my wifi password? just ask. [ ding ] show me my wifi password. hey now! [ ding ] you can even troubleshoot, learn new voice commands and much more. clean my daughter's room. [ ding ] oh, it won't do that. welp, someone should. just say "teach me more" into your voice remote and see how you can have an even better x1 experience. simple. easy. awesome. >> bill: breaking news. terrifying scene from overseen. in nigeria a three story building collapses. rescue teams racing to find children thought to be trapped underneath the rubble. building collapses are said to be common in that part of africa due to a lack of regulatory oversight over new construction.
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>> one of the important crises we faced was racial discrimination. it stirred our nation to the depths of its soul was dr. martin luther king junior. let us not only recall dr. king but rededicate ourselves to the commandments he believed in and sought to live every day. >> sandra: that was president ronald reagan in november 1983 at the signing of a bill to make martin luther king day a national holiday. the 40th president back in the news this week after democratic socialist ocasio-cortez that many of his policies were rooted in racism. >> a perfect example of how special interests and the powerful have pitted white working class americans against brown and black working class americans in order to just screw over all working class
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americans is reaganism in the 80s. >> sandra: mark weinberg is a former aide to president reagan. you are passionate about this. this is a man you spent a lot of time with and you were in the room on several occasions where the president heard someone calling him a racist, how would he react? >> he would be angry. i knew this man well for a very long time and i can tell you he did not have a racist bone in his body. it is unfortunate that this congress representative is spending her time perpetuating old myths and telling lies instead of serving her constituents. >> sandra: you said if she bothered to do her homework she would have found otherwise. what about his policies can you tell us benefited all americans? >> she would have found out that the economic growth during the attorney general
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administration caused employment to raise for all segments of our society, african-american and hispanics around them and ronald reagan was the first president to appoint a hispanic to the cabinet. she would have found out he was raised to treat people on the basis of who they were, not what color they were. and that when he was a football player in college he took two black players to sleep in his home because the hotel that the team was staying at wouldn't let african-americans stay there. that's what she would have found out. >> sandra: as a close observer of politics, why do you think she went there on that stage over the weekend? >> because it generates publicity. there are a lot of problems in the country that should have her attention. airplanes falling out of the sky, people cheating their ways into college. a lot of things going on and this congresswoman should represent her constituents and quit telling lies, 30 year old
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lies about a former president. >> sandra: let's get to a bit from your op-ed. you write. ocasio-cortez is entitled to advocate for whatever position she wishes no matter how antithetical they may be to american values and our way of life. that's the beauty of our system but she is not entitled to lie. no one in public office is. she owes ronald reagan and the public an apology. >> sandra: she sure does. she is taking cheap and dishonest shots. she should do her job. >> sandra: you look back at the economy during the days of reagan and how his policies created an economic boom and we look at the growth today and wish for some of the numbers that we saw as far as economic growth during those years. >> that's exactly right. the economic growth during the reagan administration benefited all segments of society. >> sandra: fascinating to look back at that. you know, just broadly speaking
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before we let you go, you know, ocasio-cortez ok said these things on the stage over the weekend. there is a lot of things being thrown out there. >> we should get it right. ronald reagan didn't have a racist bone in his body. he came to washington to do his best for all people and members of congress should do their job. >> sandra: you are out there to set the record straight and you wrote this piece with your colleague craig shirley. >> bill: 28 past. a second sentencing hearing about to underway for the former trump campaign chairman paul manafort begins in moments. he sbrerd the courtroom a moment ago in a wheelchair wearing a suit and tie. do you remember this? have a look here. >> i did not email any classified material to anyone
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on my email. there is no classified material. >> sandra: hillary clinton denying any misuse of a private email account while she was secretary of state. newly released transcript asking one big question. did the justice department shut down the f.b.i.? >> bill: also two actresses, now the faces of the largest college admissions cheating scandal in history. we'll dig into all this with a former u.s. attorney andy mccarthy who is on deck next live. my dream car. it turns out, they want me to start next month. she can stay with you to finish her senior year. things will be tight but, we can make this work. ♪
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sentence in the neighborhood of about 20 years. that's pretty much what you are looking at given the guidelines that are involved for the kind of financial fraud crimes, particularly money laundering, that's involved. the judge will have an option to run whatever sentence she imposes concurrent or consecutive to the sentence that was imposed last week. i've always said this was really supposed to be one big prosecution. it was manafort who elected to try the tax cases in a different jurisdiction that he was entitled to. it is one big case and we can't evaluate until the real sentence is until we see the one bottom line result today and whether it's concurrent or consecutive i think it will be around 20 years. >> sandra: he is about to turn 70 years old. you've said we're looking at basically a life sentence for paul manafort.
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family and friends have begged for leniency. this judge, amy berman jackson can give him a maximum of 10 years that you just laid out. why is she expected to be harsher than the last judge? >> well, it's not really -- i don't think it's a question of being harsher. manafort signed a plea agreement when he pled guilty in the district of columbia, which called for a sentence within the federal sentencing guidelines of 210 to 262 months. that's about 18 to 22 years. and that was contingent on his accepting responsibility by pleading guilty and cooperating with the federal prosecutors. since then, what they say is that he lied to them. they broke his cooperation agreement and they don't have to stand behind the adjustment for accepting responsibility, which could zoom his guidelines up to as much as 320 months.
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so a lot of this is not so much a function of this judge being harsh, that's what the sentencing guidelines are and that's the plea agreement he agreed to when he pled guilty. >> sandra: what is the significance of his sentencing and the implications of it? >> well, to my mind the significance is really the substance of the prosecution more than the sentence that manafort gets. the sentence that manafort gets is extremely important to him. i think as far as the country is concerned, the importance is that the prosecution, after two years of really going pretty hard at this guy, was unable to come up with anything in the nature of a link between the trump campaign and the kremlin. and what i continue to point out to people is what -- at the end of the day after all of this with mueller convicted manafort of was being an agent of ukraine. he never alleged he was an
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agent of russia. the two things simply aren't the same. >> sandra: some of what we've heard heading into the prosecution of the case in the fileings said his sentencing -- he wrote. his defense team argues he should be sentenced in a term of imprisonment significantly below the statutory maximum. in their words they said this case is not about murder, drug cartels, ponse scheme or collapse of enron. so what -- to what degree do you think that the judge will take in those words and the fact that he has had family members, his wife has written letters calling him the rock of the family, they've relied on him for years, how much will all this play a part in the sentencing we're about to see? >> it will play somewhat of a part. sandra, to talk about sentencing below the statutory
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maximums is almost nonsensical in this -- it's in the hundreds of years. i've been talking about the sentencing guidelines, the realistic framework that he'll be sentenced. as far as all the pleas made for the defendant on behalf of the family members, you know, that's something that federal judges and all judges hear in every single case. i can tell you after 20 years of being a prosecutor, sentencing is the hardest thing for a judge. it is an unpleasant thing for even the prosecutors most of the time who push for people to be sentenced. it is just a difficult thing. but at the same time, he has got to be sentenced with something that approximates what people who have multi-million dollar fraud and money laundering convictions across the country are sentenced to. that's why the guidelines are in effect and that's why i
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expect it will be around 20 years. >> sandra: we're told right now the judge is explaining the counts so we're going to get this news trickling out of the courtroom as we get it. we know special counsel weissmann is in the room and manafort's team is in the room. he was wheeled into the courtroom in a wheelchair wearing a suit. we're getting this news as it comes in. andy mccarthy, i know you'll stick around with us on the breaking news and when we get the sentencing we'll bring it to everyone. andy, thank you. >> bill: illegal immigrant arrested for murder in california by the name of carlos suspected of fatally stabbing a woman a month ago. he has a long criminal record with multiple ice detainer requests that went unanswered. jonathan hunt picks up the story live in l.a. on that with details today. jonathan.
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>> bill, 59-year-old woman was in her home alone with her dog and cat on the night of february 28th when this man broke in and then stabbed and beat larson to death. the man was arrested monday night. he is in the country illegally. he had been detained by the department of homeland security near mcall en, texas, in 2013 and was deported. he came back to the u.s. since 2015 has racked up a string of convictions including burglary, battery, drug offenses. at least six times according to the san jose police chief immigration and customs enforcement placed detainers on him. a request to hold him in jail longer so he could be questioned by immigration officers. according to the chief, those detainers were not honored because of california's so-called sanctuary laws. >> those undocumented residents who are not violent or serious
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criminals should not fear the police. but when we have violent or serious offenders that are preying on our community we must have the ability to protect our residents. >> the president of the san jose police officer association was more outspoken saying in a statement quote, if you are an undocumented, violent criminal, you do not deserve any legal protection that allows you to continue breaking laws and harming women, police officers and others, there is no moral justification to protect someone this vile from serving their jail time and being deported. we must work to fix these laws now so that public safety officers can protect everyone who lives in our communities regardless of their immigration status. and acting ice field director said, quote, how many more people have to be killed or injured before california lawmakers will open discussions to revise the state policy
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prohibiting local law enforcement agencies from working with ice to apprehend dangerous criminal aliens? bambi larson didn't talk much about politics although she is now at the center of this political debate. bill, friends said larson was just sweet, beautiful, a friend to everyone. always smiling. >> bill: what a memory. thank you, jonathan hunt on that story from los angeles today. >> sandra: an nfl trade sending shock waves through the big apple. the giants trading wide receiver odell beckham junior to the cleveland browns for a draft pick. he signed an extension with the giants. their gm saying at the time they didn't resign him to trade him. bill hemmer has something to say about that? >> bill: that's a big move. browns are beefing it up. maybe cleveland is turning the
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corner after so many years. he is not the only big trade. there is a lot of movement now with key star players and moving teams. it will be really interesting come the off season. off to cleveland we go. off to boeing. fallout continues after the deadly plane crash in ethiopia. what we're learning from the cockpit voice recorders. the president weighs in on that. joe biden is back. listen here. >> i appreciate the energy you showed when i got up here. save it a little longer. i may need it in a few weeks. >> sandra: joe biden dropping a big hint at the big rally yesterday. so what would that mean to an already crowded democratic field? our a-team will be here to discuss all of that.
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but out of an abundance of safety concerns and common sense i think it makes sense to ground the aircraft until we have better information. >> bill: we have heard from several lawmakers urging the government to ground the 737 max 8 jets and american pilots also had problems with the plane. we have an aviation attorney with us. it has been some time. that's good news. biggest headline of the morning is that the black boxes from ethiopia will be flown to europe. >> sandra: not a problem. ntsb is on the ground there and so they are probably involved in that decision to send it to the nearest place. i think what they're trying to do is get as much data as they can early. >> bill: faa put out several statements. here is one of them. they continue to review extensively all available data and safety performance from operators and pilots of the 737 max. thus far our review shows no
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systematic performance issues and provides no basis to order grounding the aircraft nor have other civil aviation authorities to us that would warrant such action. they talked about the home market suggesting in each individual country they have to make the decision they feel is best. what do you think of that judgment? >> i think the faa and ntsb know more than we do right now. they aren't releasing anything yet. they know more than we do. their focus is no longer on the aircraft as much as it maybe on other outside factors including crew training. we have had this aircraft flying in the united states for a few years now. we've had reports of a few little incidents with it but the pilots in every event were able to overcome them by circumventing the system. there is a non-normal checklist they go through and they do that. >> bill: on this website where the pilots can file anonymous complaints and issues there were complaints about this. how significant is that? >> not necessarily complaints. the system we're talking about
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is run by nasa and it is an avenue whereby pilots can give their input into anything that was unusual in a flight and what they did to prevent anything bad from happening. that's all we've seen. we've seen two of those reports over the period of a couple of years that this aircraft has been in service and that for us tells us that there really hasn't been that big of a problem. no one else has thought to report anything similar. >> bill: dallas morning news did a report. that's where these comments came from. what they describe and i think you well understand this, if the plane loses lift under its wings during take-off the nose begins to point upward and the inclination for a pilot is to reverse that movement. >> right. >> bill: the system is built to do it itself. if the system is doing it and the pilot is doing it, you have two x on the movement down toward the earth. >> what we're done. this is similar to the tweets
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we've seen from the president. what we've done is taken a lot of the control out of the pilot's hands at some point in flying these days. and given it to a machine. when the machine reacts the way it does and the pilot doesn't understand it, you have a conflict. and so very often what you have to do is simply take that system out of the loop. that's what a pilot should be trained to do. they should be trained to quickly disengage that automatic. >> bill: if you're boeing and not sure all these pilots flying all these planes in all countries around the world have done the proper training. >> there is the rub. >> do you err on the side of caution? >> boeing offers training -- transition training to each type of aircraft. they did sell this airplane as not necessarily needing a great deal of extra training. but some of these smaller airlines in some of these other countries don't take advantage of that and they don't necessarily transition their
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pilots onto the next step. this system in this aircraft is not so much different than the ng systems which have been flying for many years, the most popular aircraft there is. >> bill: i hope we don't have to talk for a long time. >> i do, too. >> sandra: as we know right now in court paul manafort, the president's former campaign manager, is awaiting a second sentencing in washington, d.c. a live look at the courthouse there. judge jackson is going over the sentencing guidelines we're being told. the latest from inside. there are arguments about whether or not he was the leader of a conspiracy. that would add more potential time and whether or not he has accepted responsibility for his crimes which could mean less time. she has reiterated, by the way, the most he can get today is 10 years. but no clarity on that yet. we're awaiting that. we'll have more on the other side of this break. stay with us.
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>> sandra: britain's parliament dealing another major blow to theresa may defeating her second brexit plan but a new vote today could be a test for british lawmakers 16 days before the u.k. is set to leave the e.u. >> this really is another heavy defeat for may. and her brexit deal. many people say it's dead in the water. it has major implications not just for the u.k. but also for the u.s. and relationship between the two countries. may lost that vote yesterday by 149 votes. a major rejection and it leaves the country in chaos with europe shaking its head asking what the u.k. wants. after that defeat may offered parliament options moving forward. >> does it want to hold a
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second referendum? does it want to leave with a deal but not this deal? these are unenviable choices. >> the first option on which they'll vote today is whether or not to accept a no deal brexit. that would mean a clean break just 16 days from now with no divorce agreements in place. that would be an economic disaster though some say. others cheer it. they say it would bring the u.s. and u.k. a lot closer allowing a free trade deal between the two countries with low tariff to agriculture, gas and so much more. the u.k. rules and wrecklations are covered by e.u. and if they were to pull out they could openly trade with the u.s. and many other countries. president trump has championed that kind of deal. we wait to see later today
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whether or not the u.k. parliament approves of it. >> sandra: really something to watch. thank you. >> bill: at this hour paul manafort is back before a judge. second sentencing in one week happening right now. the judge saying a moment ago she still finds the former campaign chair did, in fact, give false testimony. brit hume is going to join us for some reaction on that coming up. the actress felicity huffman one of 50 people charged in the biggest college cheating scandal we've seen to date. former education secretary dr. bill been -- bennett weighs in on operation varsity blues coming up. speaking of insane, have i not taken a vacation in 4 years? i should probably do that, and get a new car. how about a road trip? or tokyo? well i've got to celebrate, because now i'm going to be debt-free even sooner. and this is why i sofi.
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>> sandra: paul manafort facing a judge in washington, d.c. right now in his second round of sentencing in a week. he is facing up to 10 years on counts of conspiracy. meanwhile stunning developments on the clinton email investigation as we learn former attorney lisa page admitted the f.b.i. considered charging hillary clinton but the obama justice department ordered the f.b.i. to stand down. >> it's okay to have political beliefs. this is america. but if you work for the f.b.i. or justice department you can't act on them. these people over at the f.b.i., the small group had to put their thumb on the scale and guide the american people to make the correct choice. give me a break. the arrogance of it. >> sandra: we'll have much more on all of that just ahead.
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first brand-new reaction pouring in on operation varsity blues being called the largest college admissions scandal ever. welcome to a brand-new hour of "america's newsroom." wednesday morning i'm sandra smith. >> bill: i'm bill hemmer. new studio today. don't adjust your tvs at home for a day here. good morning to you. federal authorities now charging dozens of wealthy parents are bribery and fraud for allegedly buying their children admission to elite colleges and universities. among those named tv actresses felicity huffman and lori loughlin. the f.b.i. breaking the case yesterday during our program after a massive nationwide investigation. >> make no mistake, this is not a case where parents were acting in the best interests of their children. this is a case where they flaunted their wealth, sparing no expense to cheat the system so they could set their
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children up for success with the best education money could buy literally. >> bill: dr. william bennett former secretary of education, host of the wise guys on fox nation and fox news contributor. great to have you back. thank you for accepting our invitation. one of the main points you're making here, bill, is how much interest this story has captured. why do you think that is? >> even bigger than the odell beckham story, bill, at least to me. i think to you as well. but seriously, the most interesting thing about the story is the interest it is generating. how big it is and how much it matters to the american people. you step back and wonder why, because people know in their hearts that people who have resources have advantages. that's what resources means, you have advantages. in the case of their kids they can move if the public schools aren't good to an area where the schools are good or they can buy a private school
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education, tutors, summer programs to enrich that resume. but i think what shocked people here was the outright fraud, the cheating, the degree to which people will go to advance their children's interest and that's rigging the system and the american people react viscerally to that and they're correct to react viscerally to that. >> sandra: you wonder if it's the tip of the iceberg, the u.s. attorneys office and irs made this office yesterday said they're still looking into other parents who have done this, other coaches and universities that this does effect. >> you have the hollywood dimension, which helps with the headlines. but you've also got some ceos, some very established people who were involved in this. and again, remember, i was secretary of education and i did a radio show and i do a podcast now. the thing i get calls from and notes from the most is from parents seeking advice about
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their kids' college. what would you advise, where should she go, where should he apply? to americans college is the way up. the way to upward mobility to succeed. to think that the system is being gamed to this degree i think really shocks and disturbs people. i have to say based on the evidence, i think i know this pretty well, it is not the most important choice -- most important factor in a person's success. it has to do more with the persons ability. the s.a.t. scores are a better predictor than where you go to college. factors of grit and determination. your ability to set a task for yourself. these are more important. but a fact is a fact. the fact is americans care deeply about where their kids go to school. >> bill: one thing that strikes me. this world is faux for so many.
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you can make it so based on technology. there are reports that some of these head shots were photo shopped onto the body of other young athletes and they would use that in order to make the pitch that they should be on the rowing team or whichever avenue they chose. you think a lot about the millennial generation and the technology that collides in their life on a daily basis. you can live a life that's of your own making and it is all online. >> entirely false. >> and it's phony. >> yeah, that's right. here the system was used, gamed by this mr. singer, the guy who finally went state's evidence here who went to parents and said i'll do this. and what do parents say. this guy says we'll put your child's head on a water polo player even though the child has never seen a water polo game but that will get the child into stanford.
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it is entirely cynical and very discouraging to a lot of folks. yes, there will be more. susan is right. there will be more people involved and i think we'll hear more about this. the other thing is if i can for a second, this plays into a deep worry the american people have, i share that worry. we see it in politics. this was appealed to by donald trump and bernie sanders. is the system rigged? do you remember when donald trump said is the system rigged? bernie sanders asked the same question. in his case it was right. people believe that america is about equal opportunity. no privilege. bill clinton, work hard and play by the rules. this is a clear violation of the rules and people are really mad about it. >> sandra: really mad about it and you don't have to look far whether in your own neighborhood or at work and talking to somebody who sits by and you work closely with. parents are stressed to the nines when they've got kids that age or high school where they're trying to get them into
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these colleges, bill, and it is a stressful situation and the parents and the kids. and there are people who are working night and day to try to get their kids to these schools. carroll ross penned a piece. college cheating scandal should make blue collar families absolutely furious. this has made everybody realize that if system is and can be rigged. >> can be rigged and the obsession of parents fnlts we live in a comfortable neighborhood in a d.c. sub urds. i remember hearing about a parent from a great pre-school for 4-year-olds. that feeds into this school and feeds into this prep school and feeds into harvard. the pressure is on the 4-year-old. parents need to step back a little bit on this and realize this is not all of life. but look, the game needs to be fair, the rules need to be observed and i'm glad these
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people will face the law and justice. i hope they will. >> bill: bill bennett. thank you for being with us today. >> sandra: breaking news out of the paul manafort sentencing hearing happening now. the judge will give paul manafort credit for accepting responsibility for his actions. he still may get a 10 year maximum sentence. unclear if there will be a concurrent or consecutive sentencing. we're waiting on those details as we learn more. griff jenkins is live for us in washington >> good morning. this is very fluid. you're right. we're getting a little bit of guidance from inside the courtroom. discussion over whether manafort was the leader of a conspire that would add more time to the sentence or whether or not he accepted responsibility for his crimes mainly making false statements, which could mean less time we're told that jackson has accepted his plea that he takes
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responsibility. we're not sure exactly what that means. now, initially jackson was reminding the court the most he can get today is 10 years and that the reason for that is that manafort, who has already been sentenceed to shy of four years for tax evasion and bank fraud is facing up to 10 years today because of two counts. number one conspiracy against the united states and number two obstruction of justice. each carrying a maximum of five years and as you mentioned, whether or not it will be concurrently meaning at the same time as the first 47 months or consecutively meaning one after the other is a big deal. manafort turns 70 in three weeks. we're also told that the government, the lead prosecution, has been arguing over whether or not manafort will continue to owe more money up to $6 million to the i.r.s. the government trying to press that before this morning began. the prosecution calls his
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actions bold and stress manafort knowingly violated multiple laws, manafort's defense team maintaining throughout their client was not guilty of collusion and that the government was overreaching but really what's happening in that courtroom right now is quite telling and certainly there is an option where it could lead to more than 10 years. but we just don't know at this point. one thing is how will washington react to all this? you had senator john kennedy in the last hour made a very interesting perspective weighing in on what he believes with regards to mr. manafort. listen. >> i don't have any sympathy for mr. manafort. there was no evidence that any collusion with russia or any of that but bank and tax fraud are serious offenses against the american people. he has always played on the margins and i think i've called him a sleaze and he is. i don't have any sympathy for him. >> as we wait, we anticipate perhaps this could go on in the
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next hour or so. soon we will know just how many years paul manafort will spend in jail. this is the most high profile prosecution of the mueller investigation so far. >> sandra: that continues right now. the latest we saw is judge jackson invited each side to speak. as we learn more we'll bring it to everybody. griff jenkins in washington >> bill: 11 past. more fallout from boeing. some u.s. pilots complained at least five times in recent months about problems with the boeing 737 max 8 jet. that's the model of plane involved in two deadly crashes in five months' time. countries across the globe grounding boeing flights. the u.s. is not one of them and neither is canada. we pick up the story live in washington >> the faa and boeing are holding fast resisting the tremendous public pressure to ground the 737 max 8 in the united states and canada. senior official efs at the faa reportedly held long meetings
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about the max 8 and stuck to their assessment based on data that the airplane is safe saying in a statement thus far our review shows no systemic perp form answer issues and no bases for grounding the airplane while legislators on capitol hill are calling for the u.s. to ground the plane. >> given the fact that u.k. and singapore and other places decided to ground the airport, it makes sense for yours to do the same. >> the 737 max 8 should be immediately grounded until the faa can assure us that they are safe. >> investigative source tells me that ethiopian investigators who recovered the black boxes on monday have just now within the past 12 hours acknowledged they don't have the laboratory capabilities to examine the flight data and voice recorders and shipping them to europe, probably britain, france or the
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netherlands. if the records had been turned over to the ntsb here in washington the data would have already been printed out and investigators would be on the path to find out what caused the accident. my source acts what took so long? what are the ethiopians hiding? the faa maintains the plane is safe but is telling them changes need to be made. pilots voiced safety concerns about a boeing 737 max 8 with one captain calling the flight manual inadequate and almost criminally insufficient before the sunday crash. five pilot complaints in all. a former ntsb official tells me the pitch problem associated with the plane's automatic pilot is easily corrected by turning it off two switches on the center console by the pilot's thigh easily within reach.
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>> bill: looking for answers, doug mcelway in washington >> sandra: the paul manafort sentencing hearing, the second in a week continues in washington, d.c. this morning. we'll continue to bring you breaking news out of there as we get it. what we know right now is that the judge has laid out the two counts against paul manafort conspiracy to commit various financial crimes including tax fraud. the other count charged with a separate conspiracy to obstruct justice by tampering with two witnesses. each hold a maximum prison sentence of five years, the max he could get today is 10 years. his side is laying out the case for why the judge there should be more lenient on him. he has had family, friends and colleagues write letters to the judge. another big question we're waiting on is will this sentence run concurrently with judge el yils's sentence last week of 47 months? we are waiting on news to come out of the courtroom and bring it to you as we get it.
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>> bill: a potential bombshell in the hillary clinton email matter. a released transcript said the d.o.j. ordered the f.b.i. to stand down on that case. if that is true, why would that be? brit hume is on deck with his take next. whether it's two years, four years or thirty-two years like myself. one of the benefits we as a country give our veterans is eligibility for a va loan for up to 100% of your home's value. so if you need money for your family, call newday usa. with automatic authority from the va, we can say yes when banks say no. call 1-833-844-6708. ( ♪ ) dealing with psoriatic arthritis pain was so frustrating. my skin... it was embarrassing. my joints... they hurt. the pain and swelling. the tenderness. the psoriasis. tina: i had to find something that worked on all of this.
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>> sandra: more news coming out of the d.c. federal courthouse. we're hearing robert mueller's team is arguing for a stiff sentencing. brit hume is fox news senior political analyst. good morning to you and thank you for joining us this morning. i'll tell you what weissmann just said. this was a sophisticated scheme to avoid a duty all americans have, which is to pay taxes as we await this sentencing, your thoughts. >> well, i don't doubt that's true. of course that's true. it is also true that manafort undoubtedly committed these crimes. he has acknowledged doing so. but there is one thing that's also true, none of this whole prosecution of him and the alleged crimes of obstruction of justice that he committed during the investigation would have happened had he not served as donald trump's campaign chairman. the main effort here, as the judge in virginia pointed out, was to squeeze him to try to
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turn him against donald trump and have him give up the goods. we don't know -- he didn't give up the goods because he didn't want to or didn't have any goods. he is where he is today because he made the mistake as it's turned out for him of serving as trump's campaign advisor because you don't have that, you don't have this investigation. in fact, the extent there had been an investigation it was lying dormant at a u.s. attorney's office in virginia. so what revived it was his presence at trump's side for a period during that campaign. he is living to regret it. >> bill: what's interesting is the newly discovered documents that lisa page gave under closed-door testimony with republicans in the house and they are related in a significant way if you want to tie the original sin to the dirty dossier and it went on from there. ratcliffe is a republican from texas. steeped-in-law. he says lisa page confirmed to me under oath the f.b.i. was ordered by the obama d.o.j. not to consider charging hillary
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clinton for gross negligence in the handling of classified information. next one, the newly released transcripts of my interview with lisa page indicate peter strzok had no evidence of collusion between the trump campaign and russia prior to the launch of the f.b.i. and special counsel investigations into the matter. i know we're going back in time here but we're trying to nail it down. apparently the transcript said ratcliffe is asking lisa page you are making it sound like it was the department that told you, because the prosecutors were telling you we're not going to -- she interrupts and said that's correct. and ratcliffe concludes by saying bring a case based on that. are we about to find out that there was no hard evidence or hard facts in the very beginning? and if so -- how do you characterize it this 2 1/2 years later? >> this does suggest that they didn't have much to go on when
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they started this. other than maybe that dossier and some miscellaneous tips they had heard. beyond that what's interesting is the idea the justice department made the call to not prosecute on this. you remember in the famous james comey news conference when he said he said no reasonable prosecutor would bring a case on these grounds. and remember he didn't use the phrase gross negligence. that's drawn from the statute. he said i think extremely careless in the handling of classified information by hillary clinton. a lot of people complained when comey took it upon himself apparently according to his own words to make the decision there would be no prosecution. we all -- a lot of us thought that's a decision left to the department of justice. well, this exchange with john ratcliffe and lisa page suggested indeed the justice department did quietly and perhaps secretly make that call and comey was not telling the truth not for the first time
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when he said that it was his call to make. because the justice department was compromised. well, the compromised justice department, because the attorney general had the famous meeting with bill clinton. the compromised justice department seems from this testimony may indeed have made the call. which may have been the right call but maybe by the wrong people. we'll see, i guess. >> bill: two points to be made here. if ratcliffe is right d.o.j. said lay off on the clinton investigation and the second point he is making there was no evidence of russian collusion to advance the investigation. >> that's right. and it strikes -- now that we await the mueller report and we look for hints from that investigation and all that has become known through the efforts that have been congressional committees times three and investigative reporters by the dozen these many months has indicated there
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still isn't any serious evidence of collusion, and it doesn't appear as far as we know that any such charge or claim of conspiracy or -- will be brought. although i do think, bill, that mueller is going to have to say something about this collusion question because part of his original charge was to investigate that very thing. and so i think he will have to reach some conclusion about it whether there is any criminal involvement or not. we'll know what he found and did not find on that very count. and it looks as if they didn't have much to go on to start with and may soon find out they don't have much to go on at the end, either. >> sandra: it brings it back to what's happening in the d.c. courtroom right now with paul manafort awaiting his second sentencing, brit. this punishment will bring an end to the special counsel's most public legal battle that we have seen. what conclusion should we draw from that? >> well, it would seem based on the efforts they've made to
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pressure manafort and to revive a case that appeared to be dormant for the purpose of prosecuting him and there by pressuring him, that he was in their view on the question of what trump did with russia is they thought was the big duke, the big witness. and they made huge efforts here. they caught him in some other things. i hold no grief for paul manafort. i always looked at him and his dead eyes with a view he might not be the right person if you were looking to have a political consultant. and the things he did are criminal and he has admitted them. i think in the end it may have turned out that, you know, he didn't do anything with regard to collusion with russia and perhaps mr. trump didn't, either. and then the question arises, will the president, who clearly has doubts about the validity
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of this whole case, pardon him? the white house isn't saying, as you know. that's an interesting question. >> bill: think the answer from sarah sanders was we're not at that point yet or just to paraphrase what she said. he will make a call if and when we come to that. brit, great to have you back on. stand by. we're waiting on the manafort answer here and thank you. >> okay, buddy. >> bill: 26 past the hour. deep divide among democrats over impeachment. >> the speaker is absolutely right. in its absence an impeachment becomes a partisan exercise doomed for failure. >> when we see evidence of impeachable offenses we need to start the process to remove the president. >> bill: house speaker pelosi advising her party to back away from impeachment and why most of her membership is falling in line. >> sandra: joe biden, does he
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have what it takes to beat president trump? our a-team is on deck with all that. >> he is all but certain to run and i'm hopeful that he will. us as people.
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fine for some things. but for you, one pill a day may provide symptom relief. ask your doctor about xeljanz xr. an "unjection™". >> sandra: developments coming in on the building collapse in nigeria. people pulling nearly two dozen children from the wreckage happening at a school. at least 100 children were there at the time of the collapse. we're going to bring you more on this as we get it. >> the president says every option is on the table to deliver to the venezuelan people the freedom they deserve and have wealth under their own feet. >> bill: secretary of state not ruling anything out. the cause of promoting democracy in venezuela. also talking about ending the rule of disputed president niclas madonna. he is hanging on so far proving
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to be tougher to crack than most people thought. gillian turner live at the state department with more from there. good morning. >> good morning. the humanitarian situation on the ground inside venezuela continuing to deteriorate rapidly. today is day seven of a major power outage, water shortage and medical supply shortage that's ravaging the country. >> i should say that this does not represent any change of u.s. policy toward venezuela nor does it represent any reduction in the commitment we have to the people of venezuela and to their struggles for democracy. >> president trump's envoy emphasizing all these actions are directed at one person and one person only, madonna. maduro. >> the crisis that affects the
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country has political and institutional causes, not a natural disaster. the solution needs to be peaceful, political and democratic. we believe that no military development from inside or outside of the country would be acceptable. and the solution cannot be and should never be impolesed from the outside. >> as the political stalemate between maduro and his opponents continues to drag on the trump administration is keeping the threat of military force firmly on the table as an option. the european union is starting to speak out against that option. >> thank you, gillian turner from the state department. more to come on that. thank you. >> i appreciate the energy you showed when i got up here. save it a little longer. i might need it in a few weeks. [applause] >> sandra: joe biden dropping a strong hint as he weighs a third bid for the white house. let's go to our a-team.
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steve hilton is here host of the next revolution and richard fowler, fox news contributor. great to have you both here. all right. very cozy in studio n just for the day. we've moved on from will he or won't he? almost a certainty that he will. can he beat donald trump, though? >> first of all i want to say it's still not a firm yes. the endless contemplating and ruminateing and hinting and teasing. if you're going to do it, get on with it for god sake. the big point is if they end up nominating joe biden seems to me democrats will have learned nothing from 2016. what people wanted in 2016 was a change from the establishment. i don't believe that desire for rejecting the establishment has gone away since 2016. if anything it's gotten more. there is no one you can imagine more of an establishment creature than joe biden.
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he is so swampy he makes hillary look ethical. >> that's quite a statement. i wouldn't go that far. here is what i would say about vice president biden. number one, i think what you see from all the candidates in the field is that even though he has not announced he seems to be operating from a floor while other candidates are operating from a ceiling. most candidates get to 15 and stop. 10% and stop. joe biden seems to have a little more than that. also i think going to joe biden's favors he has the money. it would be favorable for him. the third thing to speaks to why it could be good for the democratic party. a lot of democrats nostalgic for the obama years. joe biden was a big part of that for democrats and critique how he will fare in the new democratic coalition. the fact that president barack obama picked him to be his vice president would speak to some
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of the folks as part of the obama coalition. >> bill: his point is all the energy is on the bernie sanders portion of the party. >> polls don't reflect that. >> the primary voters will go for bernie in a big way. >> they don't want the establishment back and i don't think the country wants the establishment back and they don't want the obama years back. >> bill: breaking news, watching manafort stuff all morning law. kevin downing is addressing the courtroom. the attorney for manafort and we believe manafort will address the court. dethat last week for a period of five minutes in court. we'll see what we learn from inside the courtroom. jake gibson and others. >> sandra: get your thoughts on that, steve. a short time ago he was wheeled into a wheelchair into the courtroom. he is awaiting his second sentencing. now he faces up to a maximum 10 years in prison based on these
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two counts. whether or not it's concurrent with sentenced with last week we don't know yet. we're waiting on that. your thoughts as we await this second round. >> i've been very clear about this aspect of the paul manafort situation coming under scrutiny today. the foreign lobbying and registration and so on. i have think that he is one of the worst examples of everything that people hate about washington not anything to do what he did with president trump but his previous life as a lobbyist for foreign governments. not just him across the other parties, too. tony podesta, the brother of hillary clinton's campaign manager is also up to his neck in this sleazy stuff. i think it's right it's punished severely. >> i would agree with that. the president of the united states who speaks to the swampyness of the presidency
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and why joe biden goes well in the general election is because he speaks to an administration that wasn't as swampy as this one. >> all the stuff with manafort is well before donald trump. nothing to do with the trump administration. >> was he not the chairman of his campaign? >> that's not what he is on trial for. >> sandra: he is making the case none of the counts against him now. >> you know who you are by the company you keep. >> bill: the judge ruled manafort breached his plea agreement by lying. manafort admitted that. prosecutors haven't disclosed why they considered those lies to be important because they want to continue the investigation which would seem to indicate on the mueller matter why the lies were important. were they deep or shallow lies? did they pertain to russian collusion or have nothing to do with it? there lies the critical question in the courtroom right now. steve. >> the underlying question is there any evidence in any of
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these proceedings that there was any kind of russian collusion at all? the answer is no. the lying if that's established was about something else. there wants collusion. >> my point is we don't know what these lies are. it could be a major fill in the blank. >> that's number one. collusion isn't a crime. we'll have to see where the mueller team goes with this investigation. what we've seen so far donald trump national security advisor guilty of lying to the f.b.i. foreign policy agent -- there are a bunch of liars surrounding this president and it is problematic for the president to go into this election season. >> sandra: we're tracking the breaking news here. the latest we brought to you is paul manafort will address the court shortly as we await this sentencing in washington, d.c. as far as the mueller investigation is concerned, where do you think things stand? it seems like the speculation is on a daily basis when that
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will be out. >> you have to look at the way the democrats are behaving. they've given up hope that the mueller investigation will prove what they've been saying for the last two or more years, which is there was some plot between donald trump and vladimir putin to overturn the democratic process in 2016. they've given up hope the mueller investigation would prove that and that's what they're saying whatever happens with mueller we'll keep going with our investigations and the congressional look into all this because they know that mueller didn't actually deliver what they wanted. >> bill: we aren't being rude, we're just trying to follow along. >> sandra: we're getting updates. >> bill: we were talking about brit hume and the pardon suggestions. what sarah sanders said the president has made his position clear. he will make a decision when he is ready. we're watching the courtroom and when there are developments you'll hear them.
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>> sandra: elizabeth warren doubling down on her call to break up the big tech giants. money man charles payne is on deck on that. >> i believe in markets but it is when markets have rules, when markets have a cop on the beat to make sure that the giants aren't gobbling up everyone else and eliminating competition. check it out, our unlimited plan on the brand new samsung galaxy s10. oooh. premium entertainment on the infinity screen! people have seven different premium entertainment
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>> they are huge, they have market dominance and behave like monopolies. that's a big part of the reason they need to be broken apart. the platforms will still be there. what will be different is that the companies that are selling on those platforms will be in a real marketplace where they compete straight up. >> bill: senator elizabeth warren explaining her thoughts of breaking up the big tech. charles payne to explain this. she has allies on the republican side as well. what do you think?
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>> first of all, they were in a real market place when they were created and out performed their rivals and peers. business takes care of itself, right? a lot of businesses over the history of this country we thought they would have to break them up. one time sears dominated retail. doesn't anymore. they have been bad actors as well. it makes the companies easier targets. i would be surprised that there is an administration that go after amazon and google. one administration. it won't be this one but could be the next one or the one after that. >> sandra: how is this going over on wall street? >> you know, until wall street thinks it's -- that it could happen it is noise back there. something to pay attention to. i think the thing is that these companies ironically are doing
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more damage to each other in a good, competitive way. amazon right now is taking google's search business because they collect so much data on us and all of a sudden microsoft is growing their cloud faster than amazon. if you just let the marketplace take care of itself these companies are going after each other. there have been smaller players out there. the hottest stock this week is etsy and way fair, stitch fix up 25%. you can compete in this world. >> bill: if i knew you better i would think you were a capitalist. ocasio-cortez went after the head of wells fargo yesterday. it was a tweet that relates to facebook. just because a monopoly business happens to be online doesn't mean it's good. facebook may have its own problems but is looking like our society. our democracy has a facebook problem. how did you read that?
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>> i think those social media platforms reflect society. they don't dictate society like the notion that russia could use social media to sbai the election. they have use it to stir up anger or animosity that already exist in this country. one doesn't drive the other. she is completely wrong there. i will say she made some comments yesterday with the ceo of wells fargo that people are saying outright nuts, crazy. she brought up oil platforms, cageing children like animals. she was crazy like a fox. the next part of this progressive phase to dominate commerce is called deplatforming. first you villainize the industry where you can argue we starve them of capital. banks should not be allowed to lend money to oil pipeline company because the oil pipeline could leak. we should not be able to lend money to a for-profit prison
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because -- as crazy as the headlines may seem there is a method to all this. there is a report out in usa today called pollution inequality. pollution is created by white people but mostly affects blacks and hispanics. there are a lot of angles they're going at this. while people are laughing they have a plan in place to try to turn the corner. >> bill: i believe you and i breathe the same air. >> i think so. yours is hotter than mine. i had to get you back. >> sandra: dow up more than 100 points. charles payne, thank you. >> bill: back inside the courtroom. paul manafort addressing the judge in the sentencing phase of his second trial in less than a week. trying to read the tea leaves and pick up what we're getting from jake gibson inside. catherine herridge on the outside. stand by and we'll let you know what we get after this. >> tech: at safelite autoglass,
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>> bill: we're getting information from inside the courtroom. manafort addressing the judge here saying in my previous address to judge ellis, the judge from last week, i said i was ashamed and take full responsibility. at the time it was not as clear. i'm sorry what i've done and all the activities have gotten us to today.
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the words of paul manafort. >> sandra: his statement is ongoing but what we also did hear prior to paul manafort speaking, entered the court in a wheelchair this morning. he is standing to make that statement. what his lawyer made the case here, kevin downing, he asked judge jackson to consider the harsh process when imposing this sentence. he noted the intense media attention and noted that but for a short stint were his words as a campaign manager paul manafort would likely not be here today. >> bill: interesting comment. the short stint as a campaign manager would not be before you today. can be harsh, downing argued, the media attention he called it out of whack. if we did not have a special counsel, he continued, the media attention around us that results in a harsh process for the department. i hope the court can consider that harshness. we appreciate if the court would consider that in the
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sentencing today. we're about to find out how much longer manafort is sentenced to prison today. >> sandra: catherine herridge is outside the courthouse. as we learn more and await further word from paul manafort in that courtroom, what more can you tell us? >> so we just heard from paul manafort. he has addressed the court. he was in his wheelchair. his team has argued that his health has suffered considerably during the trials and his detention. he said he would do something today that he failed to do last week, which was be very clear and accept full responsibility for his criminal actions that led to the two sentences. in addition right now, we have just heard from andrew weissmann, the lead prosecutor for the special counsel, and he has made the argument that paul manafort is a chronic offender. he has never learned from his
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past mistakes, weissmann told the court. manafort failed to pay taxes in excess of $6 million. every american is required to pay taxes. and that he is making the argument that he really should face a very serious and harsh penalty in this case. the other headline that we've had, and i want to take a minute just to explain it to folks at home, is about a central figure who appeared in this case, constantine kol imnick. he is a russian-born political consultant. what paul manafort's lawyer has told the court is that in sealed records there is evidence that the state department in ukraine worked directly with manafort and constantine during this lobbying period. the reason that matters is that anonymous sources have alleged that constantine has ties to russian intelligence. so the statement from kevin
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downing undercuts this idea that constantine was the prifsh ot point that might ultimately show coordination or collusion between the trump campaign and russian officials, sandra and bill. >> sandra: as you were reporting, we were getting more of paul manafort's statement. he just said in that courtroom making his case for no further sentencing than he has already received. i'm the primary caregiver for my wife. she needs me and i need her. this case has taken everything from me already. my property, my cash, my life insurance. please don't take us away from each other than the 47 months imposed last week. judge jackson taking a break we're being told. will deliver her sentence when she returns. she said it will be around 10 past the hour. that should come in shortly. >> bill: go back to the point
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you're making about this russian connection. what does that say as we try to read between the lines in all this? >> well, if you are a supporter of paul manafort, what they have maintained is that he has been the subject of selective prosecution because of his role in the trump campaign as chairman. and as kevin downing said to the court today, if he hadn't been campaign chairman his criminal activities. he is not down playing that. but his criminal activities might not have brought the same consequences as they are today. constantine again, anonymous sources describe him as being tied to russian intelligence. the implication there is that he would be the pivot point between the trump campaign, manafort and russian officials. that wasn't proven in this case nor was it proven in the virginia case. what kevin downing has said
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today is that there is evidence that constantine and manafort worked directly with senior state department official efs -- officials in the ukraine which would undercut the idea he was tied to russian intelligence. >> sandra: let's bring in andy mccarthy. thank you for standing by with us as we now await the judge to formally come back and announce her sentencing. the second for paul manafort this week. he just ended his statement by saying i ask for compassion in your sentencing. i promise you, if you do, you will not regret it. after laying out his case that he will be 70 years old and he is his wife's primary caregiver. what are your expectations when that judge returns a few moments from now?
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>> i still think it's more likely she will give him closer to the top than the bottom of the statute range that is at issue today, which is as you pointed out a number of times, 10 years. i spoke before about the sentencing guidelines. they far outstrip the statutes here and that's the upward pressure in the sentence. if i could, sandra, could i mention something about constantine? i think this is really important to the collusion narrative that has been talked about for a long time. he was reputed to be linked to russian intelligence because he was educated in post soviet era russia in a school where they train people who worked as translators for russian intelligence. the connection back then was clear. the problem is and has always
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been it's like 20, 25 years ago. and everybody that we worked with back then had some connection or another to the soviet union because it was breaking up. in the meantime this guy went on from that job to work for 10 years for the international republican institute, which is basically a foundation that gets american taxpayer dollars to promote democracy around the world that was mainly run by senator john mccain for a number of years. and i think what they're trying to stress here today the fact that this guy may have worked with the state department is another thing that puts the harpoon in the notion that just because he was in a school 20, 25 years ago that was connected to russian intelligence doesn't mean that today he is a russian spy. >> bill: which would put the harpoon to the collusion argument. that's the point you're making. >> yeah, if it needs any more
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harpoons, yes. >> bill: we went over this half an hour ago. your legal interpretation of this. the judge ruled that manafort breached his plea deal by lying, correct? manafort has admitted that in his sentencing today. prosecutors have not publicly disclosed why they considered those lies to be important. suggesting they want to protect an open investigation. what does that mean, andy? how do we interpret the depths of a lie and the degree of a lie and to what it pertains? >> the materiality standard for lying in these purposes is a very low bar. the way the cooperation agreements are written it gives the prosecutor really unilateral power to determine whether somebody is being truthful or not. so it really doesn't tell us a great deal about how important these lies are. the one thing i would stress, having looked at this thing
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more carefully, is because of the way mueller charged this case, a lot of this tinkering about the guidelines doesn't make any difference. what mueller did here was take a money laundering conspiracy and rather than charge it under the money laundering conspiracy statute, which would call for a 20-year penalty, he charged it under a 50 year catch all conspiracy provision. with witness tampering what mueller also did was instead of charging it as witness campering, he charged it as conspiracy to witness tampering that reduced it to five years. we're in the rare situation where the guidelines sentence, which is the sentence that people normally get rather than what the statutory maximums say, the guideline sentence here far outstrips the two statutes that are before the court for sentencing. so while the guidelines might have called for a sentence in
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excess of 25 years, the maximum he can get under these statutes is 10 years. so a lot of these adjustments that we're talking about would be very important if what was driving this sentence was the sentencing guidelines. but here because of the way mueller has charged it and capped it at 10 years, it really isn't going to have much impact. >> sandra: each of the two counts carry a maximum five year prison sentence as you are laying out. what are the implications overall as we await the robert mueller report, we don't know when that will formally be released, could be any day, any week now. we don't know, andy. what can today tell us are the implications for that? >> i still think the most important thing about manafort's case is that it didn't establish any link as brit hume was saying before,
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any collusion-type link between the trump campaign and russia. and that after all of the investigation that was done -- and i think we can all fairly say that manafort was really the eye of the storm here. he have is the one they most aggressively went after. he is the one identified in the steele dossier as the nexus between the trump campaign side of the so-called conspiracy and the putin side. they went after him very hard. the most they could come up with is tax fraud and he is an agent of ukraine. >> bill: andy, there is conventional wisdom in wash shall suggesting when the manafort deal is over and done with that could happen within the next 30 minutes. they'll resume court in five minutes based on the guidance inside the court, do you think, as others do, that the mueller report could drop as soon as today? >> i don't know if it will be as soon as today. i have think it could be as soon as friday.
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i don't think mueller is going to step on the news of manafort by issuing the report. and i don't know that the report is that imminent. and even if we knew that, bill, as we've been pointing out, we don't know what it is. so we're still dealing with all of these justice department provisions which say that you are not supposed to outline publicly the offense against uncharged people assuming that, as i do, that the president will be uncharged, mueller's investigation is a counter intelligence investigation, which is classified. so there is all kinds of classified information issues that would cancel against disclosure. so i think there is an awful lot to work out in terms of what the report actually is according to the regulations, it is only supposed to be a confidential report from the special counsel to the attorney general. and then how much can you
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disclose being faithful to important justice department provisions about protecting uncharged people and classified information? >> sandra: you will stand by for us and thank you for that. we know judge jackson is taking a break right now and plans to deliver her sentence when she returns. that could be in the next couple of minutes. she said 11:10 eastern time. >> bill: marc thiessen is with us, fox news contributor. marc, welcome to the program here. we're on wait mode in a moment. what's the sense of what you've been hearing so far today? >> this is a very sad case. paul manafort was -- is a very talented political operative who chose to use his talents to become very wealthy and work for some very nefarious people including pro-putin ukrainian officials. this has nothing to do with
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donald trump or russia collusion. i think as andy correctly pointed out. the fact is that actually in the summer of 2016 when news broke about illegal payments in the newspapers, the reason that trump fired him is because of what he had done -- trump fired him because of the things he has been indicted and now convicted of. it is hard to turn this around and say it's now some sort of evidence that trump was engaged in some nefarious activities with russia. he should have known better than to hire paul manafort. i think it was a lapse of judgment on donald trump's part. he was a client. i worked back in 1989 long before he started working-it was one of my first jobs in washington i knew paul manafort and trump was a client. he should have known better than to bring him into his
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campaign and make him the public face and public spokesman of his presidential effort and quite frankly manafort would not be facing sentencing today if he had not raised his head and tried to make a comeback and become the public face of the trump campaign. it's a sad story all around. >> sandra: kevin downing was making the case of this intense media attention that this case has received noting that but for in his words a short stint as a campaign manager paul manafort would likely not be here today. >> bill: marc, in the 30 seconds we have left, what is the play for bill barr as the attorney general? he gets the reports, maybe he makes it public, maybe he doesn't. maybe he puts aspects of it out. what is the tug-of-war with d.o.j. and the special counsel do you believe? >> i think that bill barr has to follow the law. really, the politics of it should be irrelevant from him.
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the justice department should be -- follow the law and be above politics. quite frankly it sounds like unless there is evidence of a criminal conspiracy with russia, the mueller report might be exculpatory for donald trump in a lot of ways. remember, what this is all supposed to be about is the question of did donald trump engage in a criminal conspiracy with vladimir putin and the russian government to steal the 2016 election. it seems increasingly likely the mueller report won't provide that kind of evidence. it's a vindication for donald trump because that's what this whole thing is about. if democrats want to turn around and try to impeach him for other than conspiracy with russia it will backfire in a big way and why nancy pelosi is trying to tamp down impeachment talk. she doesn't want to protect donald trump but protect democrats. she knows it will hurt the democratic party if they try to do that. >> bill: stand by, okay? >> sandra: thank you, marc, we're awaiting the final
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sentencing for president trump's former campaign manager paul manafort. judge amy berman jackson will be giving her sentencing a short time from now. we await that. we'll be right back. ed money fo? newday usa can help. we earned a lot of va benefits with our service. but the va home loan benefit is a big one. if you want to use it to get cash, call newday usa. and don't let less than perfect credit hold you back. even if you've been turned down for a va loan by your bank, call newday usa. they've been given automatic authority by the va, and they can often help veterans when other lenders won't. by re-financing up to 100 percent of your home's value, you could take out 50,000 dollars or more. you could use that money to pay credit card debt and other expenses, plan for retirement, and get back on your feet financially. need money for your family? call newday usa right now and use the
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thithis is the invitationo a higheto lexus sales event. lease the 2019 es 350 for $379 a month for 36 months. now thru march 31st. experience amazing at your lexus dealer. >> sandra: a judge in washington, d.c. is about to deliver the final sentencing to paul manafort. he faces up to 10 years in
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prison for two counts. he just gave his statement in the courtroom a short time ago saying he was ashamed of what he has done. he takes full responsibility. he wishes he could undo the past. he is upset with himself. he is asking for compassion in the judge's sentencing. we're awaiting that. let's bring in nicole, a former assistant u.s. attorney following this with us this morning. >> judge jackson is wondering, after the sentence he got from the other judge, how will it impact the sentence he will get here. one of the most interesting thing judge jackson said was that on the conduct that related to the conduct he has already been sentenced on she would give concurrent time. she is constrained by a 10 years sentence and can only give him up to 10 years and
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make some of that concurrent to the sentence he is already getting. he wouldn't get any more time. it would run the same or she could make it consecutive meaning he would do more time. very interesting that the person who asked that the sentence not be any greater than the 47 months was not any of the lawyers in the courtroom it was manafort himself. he said judge, when he was pleading for leniency in a way he didn't before judge ross. he talked about his wife. he said please don't make me do any more than 47 months i'm already facing. >> bill: on those points i take full responsibility. i was ashamed. let me be clear, i accept responsibility for the acts and on it goes. how much of a difference does it make for a judge? >> it is different for every judge. most judges would say that's a real moment in the courtroom. i've done many sentencing. where a defendant really looks like they're taking responsibility and taking it personally and recognizing what they've done and the impact of
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what they've done on both -- if there are victims or on their own families, i think it is very important to judges and i think it does sometimes make a difference. you see here she has taken a break before coming back with her sentence. everything that everyone says about her is she have is a very considered, thoughtful, methodic person and is she caning off what she is going to do. >> sandra: further what his lawyer said. we wouldn't be here unless he became donald trump's campaign manager. >> i think that's something that you really heard judge ellis focused on. the fact that the special counsel was building this case by putting pressure on manafort to flip, right? but if you think about how enterprises, whether gang enterprises or organized crime enterprises or prosecutors you work your way up. you build a case against one person, they flip and you move your way up the chain.
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and i think here they did that with -- you can see that's what the special counsel has been doing. and certainly i think that there is some truth to what manafort's lawyer says. >> bill: have they reached a dead end or have they reached the end perhaps? >> it is hard to say. i think it's hard to know what's going on. everyone says we're nearing the end of the report. news reports about the mueller report about to come out. but there is a lot of the record even here that's sealed and they say because of ongoing investigation. i don't know. >> bill: what do you think about that? >> i think it signals there are other matters go than on. if it were totally over and the extent of all the investigations have hit a dead end, maybe there would be some cause to unseal those documents but because they remain under seal for reasons related to ongoing investigations it says there may be other evidence and other people out there. >> bill: or could not be.
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>> exactly. >> bill: and then you would have to ask yourself the depth of that potential crime or non-crime. >> true, yes, absolutely. >> sandra: we have heard the president i believe last week he told reporters he felt very badly for manafort were his exact words. what options does the president have here particular life if the judge leans toward the heavier side of the sentence. he is almost 70 years old. he turns 70 next month. >> the president has said a number of things, one of them being he won't consider whether to give any pardons until after all of this is complete. certainly it would be on the table. the president can pardon individuals convicted of federal crimes. it would certainly be on the table. >> bill: sarah sanders said he will make a decision when he is ready.
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>> right. she is not ruling it out. it is a possibility it sounds like. >> sandra: that's an interesting angle to discovering. manafort's lawyers. we're trying to piece this all together. thank you for the added information on this. the judge said she would be returning to the courtroom to deliver the sentence. around 11:10. she is taking a little longer. we just heard from paul manafort himself. he have is asking for compassion in this sentencing. interesting to hear you say that's a very real moment in the courtroom where the judge hears that. she has taken a break and she will return. and i know bill just asked you, but the judge certainly just heard a very passionate plea from paul manafort before she took that break. >> that's true. usually it's interesting that these two cases, he went to trial before judge ellis and received what many people are calling sort of a lenient sentence. he pled guilty before judge
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jackson and sometimes defendants who go to trial they end up receiving what can be considered a tougher sentence instead of the crime being on paper where they pled guilty, the judge is very familiar with the crime because they've heard from witnesses and victims. but here what judge jackson has in front of her was the evidence of the witness tampering that he pled guilty to trying to impact testimony from prison. that was something that i'm sure she is going to consider in her sentence. >> bill: the words from manafort. i'm remorseful. i take responsibility for these actions. he said that repeatedly today. i'll be 70 years old and i am my wife's primary caregiver. this case has taken everything from me already. my property, cash, insurance, please let my wife and me be together. i ask for compassion in your sentencing. i promise you if you do, you will not regret it. how does the judge hear that? >> what the judge hears him
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saying is i recognize i made a mistake here, i take responsibility for my mistakes. what he is really saying is i won't do it again. i won't do this again going forward. >> bill: here is the judge. >> sandra: court is back in session. >> bill: this defendant is not public enemy number one but he is not a victim, either. now we're starting to read the tea leaves based on the message from the judge's words here, nicole. >> sandra: the judge is speaking now. just give us an idea what's happening in the courtroom now. she just returned. what sort of timeline. will she come right out with the sentence? >> usually she will speak for a while and the sentence will be the last thing she says. how it's gone this morning. they decided the guidelines that would apply. there was argument over what the different guidelines were, whether he would get acceptance of responsibility. the judge found he lied to the special counsel's office and breached his plea agreement. it has been worked out.
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now what you hear coming from the bench is the judge making findings that is going to serve as the basis for her sentence. talking about the reasons for the sentence she is about to give. >> bill: thank you, nicole. stand by. these words -- the defendant is not public enemy noumber one. why does a judge address the courtroom in that way? catherine herridge is outside the courtroom. what are you hearing? >> what the judge is doing is laying out her arguments, bill, or her supporting evidence for the sentence that she is about to deliver. just based on what we learned so far what he is saying he is not if you will, a violent criminal who deserves a lengthy incarceration but she is also saying that he is someone who committed significant crimes and for that this morning he has taken responsibility. these are crimes that relate to bank fraud, tax fraud and also foreign lobbying violations
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that pre-date the 2016 election and manafort also took responsibility for witness tampering in the post-election period. you remember he was out on bail in d.c. and virginia and the allegation, which the judge agreed with, is that paul manafort attempted to tamper with witnesses and one of the critical issues that blew apart his cooperation agreement with the special counsel. what we've heard as you mentioned from manafort's team is that he is someone who was singled out because his position with the trump campaign. he is also someone for whom his entire family relies as a breadwinner. just for some context, manafort has either paying or giving back in real estate in excess of $24 million and the special counsel team in the sentencing memo want him to pay back a further $11 million which would essentially wipe out his family. i will just go down to my
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iphone a second to see if we have a further update from the court. the main issue here as you've been discussing with the guest is whether this will be consecutive or concurrent. in other words, will the judge in this case have the sentence add on to the 47 months that he got in virginia, or will they decide that it will run at the same time as this prison sentence? the other point that i just want to make is that we've also had -- let me just bring this up here. judge jackson has said the question of whether there was any collusion with russia was not presented in this case period. therefore, it was not resolved by this case. that's an interesting choice of words because she says that this central allegation of russia collusion, which was the foundation for the special counsel investigation, was not in her words a matter that was answered one way or the other by the court. her word was it was not
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resolved. manafort's team has made the argument that a central part of this case involved a russian-born political consultant, and what we heard from kevin downing, manafort's lawyer today is that there is evidence which had until this time that it undercuts the idea he was tied to russian intelligence. >> sandra: interesting stuff. catherine herridge on the breaking news. i want the repeat that. judge jackson said the question whether there was any collusion was not presented in this case, period. therefore it was not resolved in this case. and she began when she returned from the break to deliver the sentencing by saying this defendant is not public enemy number one but he is not a victim, either. the sentence has not been delivered. judge amy berman jackson can give manafort up to a maximum of 10 years. he will be sentenced on two
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charges. conspiracy against the u.s. and conspiracy to obstruct justice with tampering with witnesses. we don't know if the judge will decide on concurrent sentences or one after the other. we await all of that from that d.c. courtroom. >> bill: nicole is with us -- the defendant not public enemy number one addressing the question about collusion, was not before this court. what are you reading between the lines of the words of the judge in the courtroom, andy? >> i think she wants to stress that she is just going to sentence him on the evidence that came out in the case before her. i also think it's interesting that rather than simply leaving it at that was not an issue that was before me, she took pains to say that it hasn't been resolved one way or the
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other. which means that she is not ruling it didn't happen, either. so i guess she is tamping down on that side of the argument as well. i have think what she is mainly trying to stress her is she is going to sentence manafort on the bases of the crimes proved that he pled guilty to them and that evidence and not a potential that he was involved in an espionage conspiracy. >> sandra: interesting to read through all these reporters in the courtroom trying to feedback what they're hearing and we continue to report what we are getting from our reporter inside that courtroom. others are reporting these words in addition to what we just told you judge amy berman jackson was quick to say when she returned that today's sentencing will not incriminate anyone in the ongoing investigation. went on to say what we already know on conspiracy, collusion. this was not presented in this case and not resolved in this
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case. we're still awaiting the sentencing. >> sandra, one thing that judges are careful to do during sentencing, especially when it's a situation where there is a whole sort of outer layer of uncharged conduct that is hovering over the case is to try to make the record crystal clear that i'm only sentencing this defendant on the evidence that is before me, not on any innuendo or on any things that haven't been proved that i haven't made findings on. she may just be trying to strengthen the record in the event there is any proceedings on appeal down the road to make it crystal clear that she is not sentencing based on collusion with russia or any information that is bouncing around out there. >> bill: you heard our conversation with nicole in new york. what is your sense about the level of contrition that he has clearly shown before the judge today in words? just in the last 30 minutes.
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>> i thought nicole was absolutely right that when a defendant actually expresses contrition and remorse to a judge, and if it's done in a convincing way, where the defendant looks you in the eye and convinces you that look, i've been broken by this, i'm changed by this. that is something that can have real impact. i thought it was telling as nicole said, that the judge, rather than impose sentence there and then, decided to sort of take a break and gather herself, go into chambers and decide what she wanted to do. >> sandra: all right. andy mccarthy, stand by for us. bring in bret baier. he is live in studio. wonderful to have you here, bret. we're awaiting the sentencing. in anticipation of that, the judge has been speaking. what are your thoughts so far? >> one, that this judge, like
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the previous judge, makes clear as andy points out, that this is not about russia collusion. this is a different case and they stipulate that up front. two, this is a different manafort in this case. this is a far more contrite, apologetic. he was not like that in the last sentencing and he was criticized roundly because he didn't apologize, yet the judge gave him 47 months and that was criticized across the legal community and pundits. i think it will be interesting to see whether this is concurrent or consecutive sentencing and where we go from here. this week everybody is on pins and needles in washington waiting for the mueller report to drop, if it is going to drop this week. >> bill: on your program, this is all part of the game as you rightly know, what was the logic to suggest, after manafort's second sentence, that the mueller report would follow in suit? >> there is a lot of thought on
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capitol hill on lawmakers who i think are mostly guessing because the mueller report we just don't know the inner workings very well. there was a lot of thought that once this sentencing was finalized, it would be the wrap-up tying with a bow and then if there are indictments they would come down friday concurrent with the report. there is some indication that may not happen. so we're still in the wait and see mode and we'll wait and see. >> sandra: seems like that's the case. so this is the d.c. courthouse. as far as laying out exactly what is happening it's interesting the look at social media and how many questions i've received about why he is in the courtroom in a wheelchair? that's not the first time we've seen him in a wheelchair. he and his legal team have put out statements saying his health is declining and he certainly made that case in the courtroom a few moments ago. he will be 70 years old. he is his wife's primary
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caregiver. this case has taken everything from me. my property, my cash, my insurance. he pled with the judge to please, let me wife and me be together. he asked for compassion in this sentencing and he promised, his final words, if you do give me that compassion, you will never regret it. talk about a different paul manafort than we saw during the campaign days. >> it's very different. he has been through a lot here. let's not take away from what the allegations he was facing, what he was convicted on. pretty serious stuff. 47 months is -- for a man that age is a lot. but in the sentencing guidelines it was very small on that first sentencing. if this is somehow added on in years, you are talking about for a guy that age, almost a life sentence. depending. and that's important.
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>> bill: i want to bring you back into the conversation, nicole. kevin downing -- downing is heads and shoulders above manafort. what he said but for a short stint on the trump campaign paul manafort wouldn't be in this courtroom today. >> that's probably true. >> that is probably true. i would concede that. >> it is probably true. i don't know how persuasive it is. as i said, he did commit these crimes, right? he pled guilty to them and was convicted. yes, the government might not have focused on him, the individual, if he had not been able to cooperate -- >> bill: he was the campaign manager for four months, i believe. >> from march to august. >> sandra: judge jackson ongoing. prior to anyone thinking about a special counsel the d.o.j. was already looking into this matter, she says. he lied to his own lawyers and lied to the u.s. government. that first lie was november of
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2016. before the special counsel. this disregard for facts, i'm just going to spin this -- forgive me for reading this the way it's written. this has continued the witness tampering is what she was just talking about. she has not issued her sentence yet. she goes on to say the defendant began reaching out to witnesses to remind them that all the work was being done in europe and he acknowledged it but isn't being straight with me about it now. he pled guilty to the crime of conspiracy to violate the law which judicial proceeding, this one. she goes on to quote nicole i'll go to you. they worked in europe. he really hasn't accepted responsibility for that offense, she says. >> this is what i was saying before. normally if the defendant has pled guilty they are in a better position before the judge because their crimes are really on paper as opposed to going to trial. the thing the judge is focused
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on is after he was arrested and after facing the two indictments, he has pled guilty to this, he attempted to tamper and influence witness testimony. from the reports coming in from the courthouse sticking with her. it would, right? he was a defendant sitting in her courtroom in a proceeding in her courtroom trying to affect how witnesses were going to testify. the fact she is focused on that, not a crime he was sentenced for before judge ellis, means that she is -- it's signaling and hard to tell that he will be sentenced to jail time on that part. >> bill: bret, reflecting on the campaign a moment ago here a period of four months or six months. i have to figure out the exact dates. how do you think the white house is viewing this right now within the west wing? i know sarah sanders was asked about it yesterday about the
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pardon issue. he will get to that decision if and when that time comes. >> the president has weighed in and asked about this. has said publicly that he didn't feel paul manafort was being treated well. has said the crimes have nothing to do with collusion, and he then goes on to his -- what he normally says, there is no collusion and he has not ruled out a pardon for manafort. neither did sarah sanders. as we look at all of this, that's in the back burner, as you see what the sentencing is going to be. clearly they have not ruled it out and they're asked about it almost every press briefing every time the president takes questions. >> bill: her words were he will make a decision when he is ready. >> that's basically we'll see. >> sandra: we're getting a live look outside the courtroom at the u.s. district court in washington, d.c., nicole.
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when the judge does deliver the sentence in the courtroom, do you expect the attorneys to come out and talk to reporters and talk to the cameras? >> i think probably not the special counsel prosecutors but i would think the defense lawyers would come out. and give their reaction to the sentence. you know, really no reason not to at that point. but i would certainly expect them to make some statements. >> sandra: what does it tell you the amount of time passed. she walked back into the courtroom 15 after, maybe 20 after the hour. going on almost 20 minutes since she walked back into the courtroom. typical so far? >> not unusual. sentencing is the most important not surprisingly, you know, court appearance for many defendants, for every defendant, right? it's the moment where all of the facts are before the judge and their fate will be
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determined and it is not unusual for a judge to speak for a while about the reasons underlying their sentence. this is where she is going the lay out the record about the things that she considered and the things that she is not going to consider. >> bill: think about this week here. legally we had an update on general flynn yesterday about his trial date. i don't know if there -- they didn't set one. >> it's floating. >> bill: you have the manafort deal now. i think you have something with roger stone tomorrow. and what is forthcoming in his case? >> we don't know. again, it hasn't been laid out exactly how it will unfold. they are looking for time there as well. >> bill: the point is this week is consequential. >> you have michael cohen on the hill dealing with the possibility of lying under oath again and the charges that he did. you have in the bigger picture
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the lisa page transcript and what came out from all of that. and how that tracks with what the f.b.i. and jim comey said under oath. there is a lot of pieces to this puzzle that we're trying to put together realtime. >> bill: john ratcliffe steeped-in-law, republican from texas and he is hot on the trail of all of that. quite telling when he tells us what he has found out with regard to lisa page and whether or not to order the special prosecutor based on collusion or not. you guys want to stand by? >> sandra: the sentencing could happen at any moment now. he faces two charges, possible maximum sentence 10 years. paul manafort, the judge is speaking in the courtroom in d.c. now. we'll be right back. with usaa, different generations get the same quality of customer service that we have been getting. being a usaa member, because of my service in the military,
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>> bill: 11:43 east coast time.
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the judge about to deliver the sentence for paul manafort. nicole is with us in studio and bret baier and catherine herridge outside the courtroom and andy mccarthy is also here. what is your assessment at the moment? >> you know, i think she is obviously very concerned if she has gone on for this long to explain a sentence which really shouldn't -- i don't think it should take much more than a few minutes. she is very concerned that the appellate record shows that exactly what it is that she was sentencing him for and making clear that she was not taking into account things that were not proved in the case before her. i think the fact that she highlighted the obstructive conduct, the witness tampering
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is obviously a bad sign for manafort. a funny thing about federal judges. i notice terrorism cases and all kinds of awful cases people come into the courtroom and no matter what they're charged with the judge is usually open minded but the minute you start messing around with their proceeding they get awfully hostile about that. it is not surprising to me that that particular bit of conduct is something that irks her. >> sandra: you were suggesting she could go on an hour, nicole. >> it depends on the judge. i've been in sentencing proceedings that have gone on for an hour, hour and a half. especially in a case like this where andy is right. she will want to make the record of what she is not considering, russia collusion. and what she is considering is it sounds like from what the reports in the courtroom a considerable amount of time on
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the witness tampering. i agree with andy. judges don't like to see that. she moved on to some of manafort's arguments about why he should receive leniency. she knows it will have an impact on his family but said that's true of all defendants. >> there is also, isn't it true that judges in this situation like to lay down the ground work. they like to have the transcript so they know it will go to appeal. it is being report evidence she is saying the pre-sentence filing stressed the impact on him and what it meant to him. and as far as what was filed in paperwork. but the remorse that he said in the courtroom she said was absent, completely absent from what was submitted to this court. she is going to say here is
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what you gave me, paperwork-wise. i understand what you are saying, but -- >> sandra: before his verbal apology. >> bill: catherine herridge standing by. what do you have from down there? >> my assessment so far is that the judge is laying out the ground work for what may be a fairly stiff sentence or consecutive. back-to-back with the 47 months in virginia. in laymen's terms she believes based on the evidence that paul manafort has been gaming the system his entire career. it was not an isolated incident that all defendants have a family surrounding them and that they also pay the price for their decisions. and also i just want to emphasize again the issue of the witness tampering. just a little more background on that. the witness tampering had to do
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with outreach by manafort and this russian-born business consultant and it was reaching out to two individuals via phone calls and text messages and the use of encrypted apps to emphasize that their work for former president of the ukraine, who was pro-russian, was very focused on europe when that was apparently not the case. so shaping the testimony of this witness was the allegation and foundational piece of the witness tampering. the judge seems to be very methodical in making her argument, which counter balances what we heard from manafort. and his legal team. >> sandra: if we give you a second to look down,, the latest from our reporter in the courtroom. the judge quoting manafort's
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defense saying that but for the special counsel he wouldn't have been charged and that argument falls flat. saying i'm sorry i got caught is not an effective plea for leniency, katherine. >> the judge is saying. put the special counsel to one side. when you look at the evidence before us here in washington and then also virginia, these are just out and out crimes that relate to tax fraud, bank fraud, hiding money, and the judge said earlier that this was a gaming of the system that manafort had done over many, many years. she said there was no reasonable explanation for a pattern of deception and that he had huge amounts of money. he had so many homes he could never live in them and more suits than any man could also wear. so it goes to the idea that you
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don't get a special exception because you have been put under the microscope by the special counsel. the law in this case is very clear on what the fallout is for bank, tax fraud and these financial and foreign lobbying crimes. >> bill: interesting, catherine, thank you, everyone, stand by. we'll squeeze in a quick break. waiting on the sentencing here. but for the special counsel you would not have been charged, that argument falls flat. the latest word from the judge inside the courtroom. back in a moment. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪
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from a judge in virginia. he faces up to 10 years in a courtroom in washington, d.c. today. facing two charges. let's bring in bret baier on studio here in new york city and nicole joins us as well. all right, bret. we're still waiting on the sentencing. it comes down to the judge listening to the final words of paul manafort, making the case that his health is declining. he was pushed into the courtroom in a wheelchair. did she make her decision before she heard his final statement we don't know. it is taking a little while for her to deliver this. >> i just don't think the things we know that she said don't look like it lines up well for paul manafort. judge jackson says court is one of those places where facts matter. a judge doesn't say that until she is not happy with what is coming before her. she suggested that he lied to her in that court essentially.
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and so i wouldn't be surprised if this is a bigger sentence than we think. >> bill: we were talking about the difference between the two judges this week and last week. >> i think based on their statements judge ellis during the trial and afterward seemed frustrated with the special counsel's office. people in the courtroom said you could feel the tension and that he was unhappy sort of with them and with the case. in contrast, i think when you look at what judge jackson has been focused on the last 15 minutes is really manafort's failure to take responsibility for the crimes and has gone through the witness tampering in detail. she has talked about how, you know, the fact that his family would be impacted is not something beyond what other defendants are feeling. and she talked about how it sounds like for one or two
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sentences about how he failed to submit to her a written letter accepting responsibility and how she has defendants who aren't as educated as he is do so. so that must be something that's also bothering her. so it seems that she is really outlining all of manafort's transgressions. >> bill: she said saying i'm sorry i got caught is not an effective plea for leniency. doesn't sound like a judge that will cut him a lot of breaks. >> sandra: she seems offended that because the special counsel brought this prosecution it should count in manafort's favor and he should get a break for that. i have think she has rejected that defense. >> sandra: judge jackson saying the defendant is not public enemy number one but not a victim either, bret. early on when she returned there that break said the question whether there was any collusion with russia was not presented in this case period.
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therefore, it was not resolved by this case. she laid out why no one would be incriminateed based on the outcome of this particular case and the charges against paul manafort. >> let's take it a step back on that issue of collusion. there was a lot of hope in the folks who watched this and wanted this to lead to paul manafort flipping and talking about colluding with the russians, that this was going to be it. this was going to be the moment. it is not. it is not in this case. it doesn't have to do with anything about this. the judge made that clear. so did judge ellis in the other case. there were people who looked at michael cohen's testimony on capitol hill it was the john dean moment of watergate. it was not. in fact, it may have made things harder for folks who were trying to tie things together with the trump campaign and russia because of all of the lies that previous life he said and now he is being challenged and alleged now. when it comes to the issue of
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collusion, conspiracy or whatever you want to call it, we haven't seen it. we don't know what we don't know from mueller. we haven't seen it. this case will be interesting in one sense because obviously he committed crimes and he is going to pay the price for them. but it is separate from all of the other things. >> bill: may of 2017 mueller is appointed. we're a year and 10 months down the road and a lot of folks are watching today as they do every day wondering what's up. and we sit here and we wonder the same thing. what's up? at the end of the day today, do we have any better indication as to what that answer is as to what is going on here? >> in terms of russia collusion? >> bill: all of it. >> until we see the report and until this is wrapped up it is really hard to say. i think the special counsel kept a tight lid on things which makes it hard to comment. >> which is a rare thing in
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washington the supreme court is good at it but everyplace else stinks about keeping things quiet. >> bill: is that the way mueller operates? >> i think so. the leaks have been minimal. i can't remember big ones. and i think capitol hill is horrible at keeping secrets but mueller has been pretty good. >> sandra: all right. thank you, nicole and bret. nice to see you in studio in new york city, sir. 6:00 tonight special report. >> we'll know what's up by then. >> thank you. >> sandra: there will be continuing coverage on all of this as the news rolls on. we just heard paul manafort in a courtroom awaiting his sentencing saying he takes full responsibility for his actions. not to say i'm sore see -- he is sorry for what he has done and asking for compassion from a judge about to sentence him. >> bill: he has reached another moment of truth twice in one
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week. you'll see it and hear it as soon as it begins. we'll see how long the judge talks. for sandra smith and nicole and bret and everybody else i'm bill hemmer. see you we will see you tomorrow. >> sandra: 's p25 starts now. >> harris: we are waiting sentencing for paul manafort as the former truck campaign chairman apparently has pleaded for mercy today in the washington, d.c., federal court. this is his second and final round of sentencing after he was hit with a 47 month sentence in virginia court last week for tax and bank fraud. this is "outnumbered" you're watching. i'm harris faulkner. here today, melissa francis. national security analysts and fox news contributor, morgan ortagus. syndicated radio host and fox news contributor, leslie marshall. in the center seat, right on time with today's news that's all about legality, fox news senior judicial analyst, judge andrew napolitano. a host of the liberty file on the fox nation. we will talk with everybody in a moment. let's cover the breaking

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