tv Charlie Rose PBS September 5, 2017 12:00am-1:01am PDT
>> rose: welcome to the program. it is the end of summer and, as we prepare for the next season, we bring you some of our favorite conversations here on charlie rose. tonight, all about sports. we talk to golfer sergio garcia, tennis player maria sharapova, olympic swimmer michael phelps and basketball coach mike kryzewski. >> so he's in competition, right? okay. when you're on a court, like, you feel things. so i'm saying, like, you're in a race, how do you know where other people are? >> rose: yeah. eally. do y'all swim? do you know who's swimming next to you? >> rose: do you know if you're winning? >> you can feel it. obviously, when you're in a pool the middle lane is the fastest lane so you have the next fastest people next to you. so you have a sense of where
things are. some strokes you can feel the splashes. >> that's crazy. isn't that nuts? ( laughter ) >> rose: sports for the hour, next. >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: sergio garcia is here. he is the 2017 masters champion. last night he won the green jacket in dramatic fashion
defeating justin rose in a playoff. here is a look at the winning putt. >> and after so many years -- once and for all for sergio! ( cheers and applause ) >> it was a hard week, but it was one very, very enjoyable and i will never forget and i get to call myself master champion. that is amazing. ( cheers and applause ) >> rose: the title was garcia's first in what many consider the four major tournaments of the year, the masters, the u.s. open, the british open and the pga. yesterday also marked what would have been the 60th birthday of the first spaniard to win at augusta national. pleased to have him at the table for the first time, welcome sergio garcia. >> thank you very much. >> rose: congratulations. you said your voice was horse. i said stayed up too late?
you said, no, this, screaming. what are you screaming? what's the feeling? >> it was pretty much just saying -- i think it was pretty much all in spanish. it was just saying yes in spanish and come on. but it was definitely the hardest scream ever for that length of time. and that's why my voice is like this. >> rose: but the fans were behind you all week. >> yeah, they were amazing. i've always felt very loved everywhere i play, obviously, but at augusta, they've always cheered me on. they've always been very -- you know, very high-class, you know, very -- very respectful, not only to myself but everyone. i felt like this year even from the practice rounds on, everyone was really behind me and it
definitely helped me to push on and get a little bit of that extra energy that you need to be able to achieve something like that. >> rose: reading a little bit of what you said sense the victory yesterday, you kept saying i was calm, you know. you had some bad things happen to you. >> yes. >> rose: and some really good things. >> yes. >> rose: but you said, even at the worst, i was calm. it didn't make me crazy. >> yeah, and that's probably the difference between standing here with you with the green jacket today and maybe finishing second or third. because i played -- on the front nine, i played great yesterday, and i probably should have been, i would say probably at least four under par, and i was two under par. i missed three or four really good opportunities. but i knew i was playing well. i wasn't panicking. i was just, like, just keep doing what you're doing, they'll
drop. don't worry. i bogeyed ten, nine, eleven and that was a moment to get a little worried. but i was, like, you're still close to the lead and playing well. i felt very comfortable. so the par on 13 was massive. that par putt not only because it kind of felt like a birdie but because it got me back in a positiveway. i made a good putt that i needed to make that helped me play 14 great, made birdie. >> rose: and played 15. and played 15 amazing. that second shot i hit, it was probably the straightest 8-iron i ever used. >> rose: how many yards. 19 yards downhill. >> rose: a bit further than mine. >> a little bit of adrenaline. >> rose: this is the approach at 15 we just talked about. take a look at it.
>> really high, hard, accelerating follow-through, try to get it up in the air. almost holds it out in the fly! ( cheering ) i don't know that sergio knows how close that came to going in. >> the great thing about that is it left me a nice little left-to-right straight-up putt. >> rose: how many yards, ten? no, it was probably about i would say 12 feet. if it would not have hit the flag it probably would have been closer, 6 to 7 feet, but a downhill left-to-right break so a tougher putt, but those little things that you say, oh, i hit
the flag and it went a little bit farther than it would have, yeah, but it kind of worked in my favor because it left me an easier putt to hold. >> rose: and then you were back in it. >> yes, i birdied that hole and both got to 9 under. we both hit great shots on 16. he made a great birdie and unfortunately i didn't hit a very good putt there. but same thing, i didn't freak out. i was, like, you're still playing great. you have two holes to go. you have to make one birdie unless he makes a mistake or maybe two and see what happens. he bogeyed 17. i made a good, solid par. then on 19 we hit two great shots and both had chances of making birdies. i think we both hit great putts and none of them broke the way we thought, we both missed it
just on the right-left yeah. >> he hung it out. as i said, it's flat. >> rose: now, were you outdriving justin most of the day? >> yeah, most -- yeah, most of the day. i think it was a combination of i was swinging likely nicely, and i was going after it with my driver. i hit some really nice drives. at the same time, justin was hitting the ball well but, you know, his back problems he was having, a couple of drives he didn't hit it as long as he can hit it because he can hit it as far as me pretty much. >> rose: 220, 230?
yeah, depends on the situation, but about a 300 carry and then depends on the roll. >> rose: there is another picture i want to show you. this one. did she make a difference for you in terms of confidence? this is your fianceé. >> yes, angela. yes, she definitely has helped. there's no doubt about that. i think her and my whole team have been working hard to, you know, make me better golfer, better person, and we've all -- you know, we've all put an effort, and she definitely has put her little bit in it. >> rose: you grew up in a relatively small town in spain. >> yes. >> rose: your father was a caddy, your mother ran the pro shop. >> mm-hmm. >> rose: were they both there? yes, they were. >> rose: at the masters?
yes, they were. >> rose: and tell me the first thing your father said to you, victor. >> victor, yeah. he could barely say anything because they were both crying. i mean, everybody was crying. you know, my dad, my mom, angela, her parents were there, too. so everybody was very, very emotional. but i think my dad, firm correctly -- if i remember correctly, he gave me a big hug and he said, you know, you've done it, so happy, so proud of you, you've won the masters, this is just unbelievable. >> rose: you have said the triumph was a demonstration of my mentality and my character. what did you mean? >> well, i said it throughout the week. i said it that sometimes there at the masters and in some of the tournaments, like my frame of mind hasn't been where it
should have been, you know, have been like we were talking before, not accepting things, letting things happen, trying to force things. so that week, last week, i was much better at that. i was much better at committing to what i wanted to do, of calming myself down and accepting what was happening, good and bad. so not getting ahead of myself when i was making a birdie or an eagle or whatever. >> rose: do you have a pro who is an instructor or is he more physical and in a team that travels with you having to do with -- >> yeah, i mean, when i talk about team, i mean, angela, i mean, obviously my dad that is also my coach. >> rose: oh, he is. yeah, my whole life. he also played a little bit on senior's tour and he's also a
professional. my mom, my managers, my caddy, everyone that helps around, my whole family, angela's family, everyone that, you know, brings something positive to the team and to me, so it helps me to play better. >> rose: well, i hope you win the grand slam. >> thank you, that would be great. >> rose: promise you will come back to this table. >> i will. >> rose: all right, great. thank you so much, congratulations on mastery of the game. >> thank you. >> rose: maria sharapova is here. she is a five-time grand slam tennis champion and one of the world's highest paid and highest profile athletes in. january she tested positive for a heart medication recently banned by anti-doping regulators, disclosed the infraction during a news conference in march. >> i wanted to let you know that a few days ago i received a letter from the i.t.f. that i had failed the drug test at the
australian open. i did fail the test and i take full responsibility for it. >> rose: in june the international tennis federation banned sharapova for two years. today the court of arbitration for courts announced it was reducing her suspension by nine months. they ruled the penalty went too far for a violation that was committed unintentionally. sharapova is cleared to return to competitive tennis in april in time of wimbledon and the u.s. open. pleased to have her at the table for the first time. welcome. >> thank you so much. >> rose: tell me about the reaction that came from switzerland. >> friday morning was a beautiful day for me, my family and my friends and just the thought of coming back. i was in my bathroom and i received the note from cass, and i just screamed down to the first floor to my mother that
i'm coming back, and it was -- yeah, you know, the last seven months or so, i have been really strong. i knew that i had to, and then she came up and she ran up the stairs and i gave her a hug and all of a sudden i was just so emotional. everything let go because something that i wanted so much, i was having another opportunity at it. >> rose: they have said clearly, and they've said a number of things as a result of the investigation and the report that they had today, they said that they rejected the core argument you were significantly at tolts fault for taking a substance to enhance performance, that you did not try to hide the use, that you took it in good faith over a long period of time. so the question has to do with their motive in part. how could they believe that this, in your words, ce served a 24-month suspension? >> well, i got a 24-month suspension, but they wanted for years for me, charlie.
>> rose: they wanted four years. >> the i.t.f. wanted to ban me for four years. and i went through the i.t.f. hearing, which -- in front of an arbitration that was chosen by the i.t.f. so i'm in a hearing knowing that the people i'm speaking to -- this was four or five months back in london -- the people that i'm speaking to were chosen by the people that i'm actually in a fight with. so i'm not sure that they call that neutral. that's not neutral. cass is neutral and that's what cass awarded to me. >> rose: do you think they were trying to make an example of you? >> i never wanted to believe that, but i'm starting to think that. >> rose: someone used the expression tall poppy. >> never heard that expression. >> rose: well, i think it's e minds of some, an example, in , say, doping has no place and suggesting, in fact, no matter
how strong and how celebrated the person was, you know, if they thought they were using drug enhancement, they'd take them down. >> right. it's hard for me to speak for them. i think that i mow what i was fighting against and i was fighting -- well, i was fighting for my right to get back to the court by making an honest mistake but i was also fighting an organization that wanted to ban me for four years and that was wrong. that was wrong because they didn't do their part. i from the beginning came out two, three days after i got that letter about the violation. i came out to the world and i explained my story, and i'm proud of that. >> rose: because you wanted to control your own case, you wanted to make sure that -- >> no, because when i saw that, i wanted the world to know. there was no way i was going to tell people i'm injured or just wait this out or pretend it's something that i'm not, this is
it. >> rose: you wanted to take command of it in a sense. >> yes, and i owed it to my fans, fans that wake up in the middle of the night to watch me play that supported me that have died through my matches. i owed that to them, yes. >> rose: there are two aspects to this. number one, as you were going through this, did you find people who you expected to support you didn't? >> you know what i learned is i think i've always been an athlete that i've said this from the very beginning of my career, i never personally had a role model when i grew up. i watched television but there was never a person who i said i want to be just like them. and as i've gone through my career and young girls and boys would come up to me and say i want to be just like you, i would say, no, you want to be better than me, dream to be better than i ever was. but during this process, i really realized how impactful my
career has been towards millions of people and how i've impacted young girls and boys and older generation that have watched me from a 17-year-old girl till now, how much they admired me. the amount of people who stopped me in the last upseven months is more than i've seen ever in my life and say i hope you get through this, you deserve to get back. you never deserved to get punished like this by the i.t.f., this is wrong, many people who i didn't know in different industries e-mailed me, contacted me, showed their support. that's when i realized, maybe i was a little naive about my accomplishments and how i've inimpacted so many people's lives and inspired them and it made me realize that, no, you set an example and that's why i was proud of the fact that i
came out and i was able to say that. >> rose: your sponsors and those who you had endorsement contracts with fully supportive from day one or did they pull back and say let's see this through? >> my sponsors have been incredible. i must admit, it was difficult in the beginning because none knew until my announcement -- >> rose: didn't know about it until you came forward. >> didn't know about it until i came forward, until my press conference. so from that point of view, it was a shock, as i'm sure, from everyone. i wanted it to come from me and not anyone else and that's why for three days only a small group of people knew about it. nike had a tough statement. it was hard. i had been with them since i was 11 years old. >> rose: what did they say? i don't remember word by word, but it was aggressive that they had been through a lot with athletes and i took it personal because i have a lot of pride in being part of their family, so
it took a little bit of time to speak to mark parker about what happened. >> rose: and then when you told him? >> we had a great conversation, and he's been amazing, and, yeah, all my sponsors have been rose: so you will not lose any sponsors because of this? >> i hope is not. >> rose: but the interesting question, too, is, you know, a remarkable career, but to be away for 24 months could have had -- i mean, you're in what 29, yes? >> i am 29. >> rose: you're 29. don't say it like that. >> rose: well, no, but you have a remarkable career. but this kind of absence, if it had been two years or four years, could have had an incredible impact on your career. it could have been over. >> absolutely. my career was never going to end this way, never. from the first day i got that
letter, that is when i started my comeback. i started my comeback in march. >> rose: did you ever doubt you would be sitting here today feeling very good about the future? >> i never doubted that i would be back. i certainly had tough days and negative days and i went through the ups and downs is that and who did you depend on when those days were bad. your mother? >> my mother. my mother. >> rose: and your tell me. my mother, my father and my team. a very small group of people. my coach has been amazing through this whole process. people -- i feel there are people in my career and in my life at this time for certain reasons, and one of them was this. >> rose: let me talk about the career. you were born in chernobyl. >> i was. >> rose: and then -- my mother was pregnant with me for eight months about 30 kilometers from the explosion. >> rose: and you left
chernobyl. >> left chernobyl. that was in belarus and we fled to russia while my mom was pregnant and i was born in russia, i was born in the north in siberia, and when i was 2 we moved to sochi, a much warmer place. >> rose: so you started playing early. >> i played when i was four. my dad played recreationally, and someone said i had talent. i'm not sure anyone could say that of a 6-year-old girl but they said there is an exhibition martina and i was hosting in moscow with another 200 kids and said why don't you be part of it? my father and i went. i was on the court with hundreds of kids. it was chaos. she was feed ago few balls to the kids, having a little chat. i'm not exactly sure what
happened but the next thing you know i saw her coming up to my dad and having a conversation, and i think what she said is she thought i had talent and we should do something about it. a year and a half later we were on our flight to miami. >> rose: on your way to see nick balatari. >> yes. >> rose: and he didn't take you at first glance. it took you two years. >> yes. ocked on everyone's doorof unexpectedly, here's a 7-year-old girl, she wants to play tennis and she has this dream, and eventually, i've never been back to russia since to live. >> rose: you've never been back? >> not to live. >> rose: your mother came later? >> yes, i came with my father. he got a working visa, and i joined him at the time as someone could with that type of visa and my mom couldn't come for the first two years. i couldn't go in and out of the
country. >> rose: you simply had to communicate in whatever way you could. >> at that time i believe it was just regular mail. >> rose: when did you know that you had the right stuff, i don't like to ever knowyersly that because that's what keeps me motivated, that's what keeps me on the edge. i never feel that i'm great. people ask me the question about legacy, and grand slam champion, you have been number one in the world, and i go to a tournament as if i never won it, because i -- no, i always feel that i have to have that edge in a way where i inspire my own self and that's how i do it. >> rose: well, you've won roland garris twice.
>> that's where i won my grand slam twice. >> rose: how do you see your game. >> i haven't thought about my game in a while. >> rose: so this preoccupied you since you got the phone call from them? >> yeah, well, i have been very occupied. i actually haven't been home that much. i've traveled a lot, i've done things that i never had the opportunity to do and in a time where i never -- where i didn't know what my future would be or had so many questions, i actually felt leak i had a schedule and i had a plan and i never knew what weekends felt like and for the first time i actually know that, oh, there's a saturday and there's a sunday and i'm actually looking forward to those days, whereas, before, your mindset is so different, the weekends are grand slam finals and that's what you're working for, so that perspective has changed and also in terms of
training, i have been training in a very different way where i'm not training for a tournament. i'm not training for -- to get back in a few months. i was just training for myself. >> rose: and what's that like? i felt so good because you're doing it for you and to feel good and i feel that how i set the taupe was the day after i had made the announcement, it was a very long night. as you can imagine, i didn't get much sleep. i signed up for a spinning class at 8:30 a.m. i knew that might have been wishful thinking but at least if i sign up, i won't be able to get a refund. so i'm going to go for it. and about 7:45, i called my coach and i said, i don't think i'm going to make this class because he was in town with me. and something -- and he's, like, okay. obviously, it's understandable. but at 8:00 a.m., i got out of bed and i was, like, i'm going. i set the standard for myself
that i was going to push the limit and i was going to push myself and i went there and for an hour of that class i was miserable because i was -- i had no energy. i had one of the longest days in my career, but i pushed through it, and i felt like that set the tone for my body, for my mind, and ever since i have been doing different workouts, i have been training differently, and it's all been for me. >> rose: so you feel like some of the best tennis may be ahead of you? >> i hope so. i know that today, yesterday, i got the best gift i could have got for my 30th birthday. >> rose: you had some reason to believe that they would reduce the suspension simply based on what they'd done in the past. i'm sure john, your attorney, said they've done this in the past and with some variety of occasions. >> but you never know. you never know. that's -- look, the i.t.f.'s
tribunal in the past has been overruled by cass in the last six times including my case. so, yes, you can be optimistic and hopeful and all those things -- >> rose: but it's your life and career that's at stake. >> yes. and you can go into it thinking, yes. i went into the cass hearing with a different mindset. i went into it as, you know, what, this is my career on the line and i'm going to do something about it. yeah. i think it was more of an internal feeling. >> rose: do you feel like it's a fare description of you to say -- be defined as tough in the face of adversity, that somehow the kind of life that you have lived has given you some of that stuff? >> i believe so, and i've never used the word "rejection" in my life. i don't believe in rejection. i don't believe in nos. i just get through it.
i was born to be a warrior, and in tennis and in my life -- >> rose: how were you born to be a warrior? >> because there is something, when i've had challenges in my life, i've persevered, and that's not just in me. i feel that whether you're a tennis player or in another career, when you have challenging moments in your life, my first one in my life came when i had shoulder surgery. i was out for a year, and there is something during that period that builds -- you don't know it's happening, but it's something inside i don' of you t builds. it almost becomes an immunity to pain, almost, and during that time, i was training, i was doing everything i could with no knowledge that i would ever go back on the tennis court after shoulder surgery with no one that i could look to that ever came back and won a grand slam after shoulder surgery. but i went through it, and i
just -- day after day after day i grinded it out, i kept going. when i went back on the court and playing tournaments and making errors and losing matches maybe i shouldn't have lost and people were saying she's never going to come back, nothing phased me, because something i built inside of myself, the strength that i built over that time got me through that, and for me this is another example of -- >> rose: that's my point. when you go on the court against serena, in your mind you think you're going to win? >> of course. ( laughter ) >> rose: yes. why would you go on the court if that's not the way you think? >> rose: some people intimidate other people. she's won more of the recent matches one on one than you have won in a significant way. >> yes, in a huge way. but that's -- as a competitor, you can't think like that when you go out on the court. you should just leave. you should book your ticket. >> rose: if you think you can't win. >> of course. >> rose: you don't want to be on the court regardless of who's
on the other side. >> you shouldn't. >> rose: but some people can intimidate because of the strength of their game and, in fact, you did that to people. >> i think there's a certain -- there is definitely -- when i walk on the court and a lot of times i feel that i have a great edge and i haven't even hit a ball, and it's a great feeling. >> rose: because you have confidence in what you can do. >> yeah, it's a confidence that transitions into -- you see, in tennis, it's different. a little bit maybe than other sports, but you don't have to be the best version of yourself every single day. you just have to be better than your opponent on that day. so if that means that you're better than your opponent by being mediocre on that day, that's good enough on that day. >> rose: and when you lose, what do you say to yourself? mmy opponent happened to be
better than i am this day? >> that's one of a few things. >> rose: what else do you say? i'm tough on myself. i expect a lot from myself. i do. what do i train for if i don't. >> rose: and so what do you think you can do in tennis now? wind grand slams? you've won every grand slam. you've won the u.s. open, the french, the wim down, the australian. that puts you in the hall of fame right there. >> i hope so. >> rose: well, of course it does. so what are the career objectives now? >> it's to continue that, to -- i don't think of a particular title, i don't think of a particular trophy, i don't think of a particular tournament. of course the grand slams are special and especially when i've had the amazing opportunity to hold all four. but when i go in the middle of nowhere to play at a tournament
and it's a smaller event that's maybe not covered on tv, my attitude of the way i enter the court is no different than when i go out and play the finals of a grand slam. so, of course, i want to say, yes, i want to win grand slams, but it doesn't matter if i'm going out and playing an exhibition. you know, i still travel with my team to make sure that i'm doing the right things. >> rose: who's on your team? my coach. my physical toach and hitting partner. >> rose: there's a saying, if it doesn't kill me, it will make me stronger. does this make you stronger? >> i believe in that saying so much. i do believe it. there are a lot of things in my life that have made me really strong, and i had a very tough upbringing. i moved to the united states as a young girl with my parents. we didn't have much money. >> rose: with one parent. yeah, with one parent.
with $700, with no knowledge of where we were going in the united states. we went through that. i became -- i was living a dream and basically my parents paved the way for me to realize my dream and my potential and i'm writing that, and i've gone through a lot and this is part of my journey, and there's no doubt in my mind that, as i said before, i started my comeback in march and i'm coming back in april. >> rose: thank you for stopping by here. >> thank you for having me. >> rose: we turn now to a remarkable conversation between two fascinating individual performers, michael phelps and mike kryzewski are two of the most successful and highly decorated competitors in sports history. phelps achievements as an olympian are unprecedented, five olympics and 28 medals and 23 gold medals. no one has won more basketball games as mike kryzewski, better
known as coach k., led duke to five championships. in august, led team u.s.a. at the rio olympics where he won three 2k3w08d medals. i recently sat down with michael phelps and coach k. in chicago at the b.d.t. global summits and talked about olympic memories, what it means to be the bestics and the strategies they utilized to achieve the remarkable performance. here is that conversation. i start with you, coach capital. -- coach k., what's the x coach k -- i start with you, coach k. what do you do to tell
basketball players how to be better. >> start with the juggler. >> rose: michael taught to swim. >> he has it and you're in constant search for it. i think the great players and teams that i've had the honor of coaching whether it be for the united states or duke. it's much more than physical and it basically said they do not -- that person or that team does not have a point of failure. they have interruptions which knock them back, but they will never accept failure, you know, in training, in competition or whatever. so they're just woven a certain way where they see -- and in whs
grant hill or lebron james, bryant or a number of guys that i've had to coach that have it, i think that's -- pi have to say one thing -- certainly, they're talented and all that, but it's that thing inside of them and sometimes you have to help them find that that then gets them, and all of a sund they go past the limit they thought they had. >> like the buttons. yeah and all of a sund there's another button that they -- and i just want to tell all of you, it's a really an honor for a coach to sit next to him. i've coached more great players because i've coached u.s. team for 11 years than anyone in the history of the sport, and when
you're around greatness. he -- he is as great an athlete that has ever been placed on this planet because he has done et not just for one period of time, it's crazy that he's done it for fiveo links. really -- five olympics. really, in the history of the sport in this entire world -- >> thank you. look, i'm not just blowing smoke, and he's a maryland fan, too. ( applause ) he's got the extractor. >> rose: and the olympics have been around a long, long time. ( laughter ) and to have more than anybody in the long, long history of the olympics says something important. >> yeah. >> rose: so what do you think mean, it's along the samee -- lines as coach said. i competed with my coach for 20 years. if you look at sports today, you don't find many athletes that are with a coach for that long. you don't see it, right?
>> no. i was trying to think of another athlete who's been with a coach for that long and, you know, bob and i started at 11 and, from 11 to about 18, i -- you know, he would say jump, i would say how high? when he first met me at 11, he told me in four years i could make the olympic team. i stopped playing la crosse, baseball and started focusing on swimming. i trusted him and four years later made my first team. x months later, came back,t. worked my tail off, broke my first world record at 15. kind of after that, we got to 18, we went to michigan. we were at michigan for four years. that's when i started realizing i could talk back. i never had that before. so we kind of played with that a little bit, and i'll never forget in 2006, he let me do it my way and at the end of 2006, i
was not the happiest camper. so 2007, 2008, we kind of changed it again, and i can probably say it today those are the two best years i had in my career of 2007, 2008. so i started trusting him again. of course we have our battles. it all goes back to he's pressing my buttons. we grew together as we both changed. you know, some of the obstacles i went through in my life and the changes i went through in my life, he had to change on sort of how he approached me and how he worked together and i think that's something i saw over the last two years that made us work as well as we did. these last two years in my career, i i couldn't have asked for a better finish. this is what i wanted in london. i wanted closure on the spoorntd my career and when i hung up my suit, i wanted to hang it up the way i wanted to hang it up, not how i was -- in 201, i just felt
like -- in 2012, i just felt i wanted to get through it, didn't really care. taking a year and a half two, years off, kind of deciding things on my own, i think helped me learn a lot. and once i came back, i knew i had to do it a certain way and i had to do it his way. >> rose: was he there for the struggles? >> of course. you know, growing up in a single family home, i had a lot of father figures in my life who helped me through things, and he was one of them. you know -- >> rose: but didn't see your own father much? >> i went through a phase where i, you know, probably saw my father five times in 20 years, and that was a struggle for me. but now we are finally at the point where we are friends and we're building a friendship again and i think, you know, i'm so very thankful for, you know, the things that have happened in my life that brought me to the point where i am today because this is how life should be. >> rose: and you can build the
relationship. >> it's amazing. you know, it's amazing to have him not only a part of my life but a part of my family's life as well and he's able to see and get to know his grandson. >> rose: after 2012, did you think you were going to come back in 2016? >> for him? >> rose: no, you. he should have come down. >> rose: because i thought you said this is it. >> we both said that. right. for him to be with one coach that long is incredible because you're going through different stages. i coach 18-year-olds who become 22-year-olds and they leave, and when i starred coaching the olympic team, 11 years ago, wow, it's different. and the thing that you had with your coach and something that you all want to build all the time is shared vision where you have shared vision and, at times, like when you're 18 or something, he saw a vision for
you that you couldn't see. >> right. and that relationship whether it be in business, family or in coaching is the thing i like the best and, for me, it's not just a shared vision with a particular player, it's a shared vision with a group, and we try to manifest that in the olympics a certain way, and i do it a little bit -- not a little bit -- a lot different way with my duke team, but shared vision is a really important thing. >> rose: michael, you have said you wan wanted to change -- your goal is to change swimming. >> it's happening. at 15 i just had this dream of completely changing the sport both in and out of the pool. i thought that at that point that i wanted the sport to have more attention because i think as a national team we're
probably the most dominating national team in the world and, you know, for me, kind of growing up in that sport the things i was able to see and do in that sport changed my life and, you know, for me it also, now, sort of being out of the pool, that's where sort of the next chapter in my life is happening. in 2001, i started working with the boys and girls club of america, and children under age 14, drowning is the second highest cause of death. so i started working with them in baltimore in 2001. in 2008, i opened up my foundation. kids to live healthy and active lifestyles, but also teaching kids water safety. that's the only reason i started to swim. my mom put my two sisters and myself in the water specifically just to be water safe, and this is what it turned out to be. >> pretty good. ( laughter ) not bad. >> i guess it turned out okay.
>> rose: all of sudden parents all over america are throwing their kids in the pool. >> especially the short-legged kids. ( laughter ) that's amazing. >> rose: also what you've done is inspired people. kady la decky, you're her inspiration. >> for me, this olympics, i felt like a dad. i honestly did. because i had been on the national team for so long, but also sort of i feel like my role changed on this team. you have the story of katy, god, when she was 10 and we have a picture together. another girl on the team smaliga, i was, like, i had posters up of you as a kid and now i'm on the team with you. ryan murphy, same thing. a couple of these guys you have
pictures they got as a kid. for me i was cool being able to see them and watching them grow up into the people they are now because now for me, i am retired -- technically not retired, but retiring soon, i haven't signed the papers -- but i'm retiring, so it's nice for me to be able to see the younger generation kind of taking over and, you know, i always think back to, also, the first gold medalist, the very -- i guess the second night for me was the four-by-100 free relay and being able to swim with two rookies. i'll never forget this moment forever. we're on the podium listening right before the national anthem starts and the two rookies are in the middle and they didn't really know what to do. so i said to them, guys, i was, like, you're allowed to smile, you're allowed to sing and if you want to cry, just cry. i would say halfway into the
song, i hear just somebody crying out of the side of my ear and i look over and ryan literally let everything go. and i think that was such a cool moment for me because, you know, to be able to represent your country at that level is the greatest thing in the world. you know, for me, that's one of the biggest things that i will mess, retiring from the sport, being able to wear the stars and stripes and represent your country like that has been the greatest part of my career and these guys are taking over and it's such an honor to see. >> rose: you have said before you are retiring. >> i'll say it again and i mean it this time. ( laughter ) i have a beautiful baby boy and a family we're starting with nicole and boomer and i'm ready and i think this time i'm actually ready. i think in '12 i kind of forced it. before, i was able to finish any career the way i wanted to. >> rose: by winning the
200-meter butterfly. >> oh, my gosh, when i saw chad shadow boxing in the ready room -- ( laughter ) -- i was kind of, like, what the hell's going on? but i wanted that race really bad after he beat me in '12, and being able to come back and take that race and win a couple of more -- i don't know if i'll ever wrap my head around 28 olympic medals, 23 gold. i just started wrapping my head around eight from beijing. this started with the dream of winning one olympic medal. i had the first one in 2004. i'll never forget that one. but being able to have this was -- almost doesn't seem real. >> it isn't. . that's why he's the best ever. i'm telling you. it's crazy. >> rose: talk about two things, one -- i mean, he talked about pride in america, but the idea of pride is a positive
quality, a sense that i'm doing this for something beyond myself. >> right. what we try to do at the olympic team is, you know, each of these guys are knicks, lakers, cavs, and they're proud to be that. who are the proudest americans? to mist our military because they not only protect and serve us, they put their lives on the line. so we incorporate that. it's important for each of our guys to hear and see, but the most important thing is for them to feel, and if you feel, then you get it in here and then you own it. and, so, we do wounded warriors come and visit with them, we'll go to arlington cemetery. as chair of the joint chiefs, a good friend, he spoke, and we
actually joined with the m.b.a. to help a group called taps, tragedy assistance protection for survivors, it's not funded by the government, but families who've lost a brother,tister, mother, father, and in each of the cities we played exhibitions, when we did a national anthem, a taps kid was with us. in chicago, we had a ceremony in practice privately where about 70 of them were there, and a number of them lined up at half court, and then our whole team and coaching staff did, and they have buttons with the picture of the person who was killed, and they gave us their buttons. >> rose: both of you have experienced failure in terms of you having injure and your back and going through a very rough patch. the same thing for you. tell me about that. what are the lessons to be
learned from that struggle? and the sense of recognizing that you are not all powerful? >> for me to become the person who i am today, i found myself in the darkest possible place that any human being could go, and that was the worst three or four days of my life. sort of not really wanting to be here anymore, that's where i really got to. for me to get to that point, it's like a downward spiral staircase, express elevator investigate down. and i put myself on that. for me, being there and being able to come out how i did, learning a lot about myself, learning a lot about how i work and, you know, for me, there were so many things that i didn't want to let out and, you know, when i went through my
struggles, i literally came and i said, you know what, everyone's going to see the real michael phelps, and that was the coolest thing for me to be myself and not worry about it if i'm going to get judged this, that or the other. just be who i am. it was the hardest thing in my life. honestly, i've had ups and downs throughout my whole entire career, and if you asked me today would i change it, i wouldn't. >> rose: you learned from it. one thing, thankfully, nobody got hurt in any situation, but i'm able to be the person i am today and, for that, i have better relationships. i have better friendships. everything is -- honestly, it's ten times better. i'm happy almost every day, and it's just great, you know, being able to, you know fork, for me g able to see my baby boy every morning is amazing and just being able to travel and just
enjoy myself, life today is how i wish life was for my whole life. >> rose: mike? yeah, well, i think we all have times where you're down, whether it be physically, emotionally, mentally, and, you know, i go back to being a cadet at west point, and a number of things i learned but the two most important things i learned was failure was never a destination and that you're never going to do it alone. >> i think the biggest thing is i know if i'm prepared, nothing else matters. if i've done the work, i mow whatever happens is -- >> rose: 100% of the time are you prepared? >> no. >> rose: and if you're not prepared, why not? >> let's say it this way, i'll put it to you this way, in 2008 i was probably not working at 100%. i probably had won those eight gold medals on about 80%.
i broke my wrist six months before olympic trials. so i was literally in a cast two days after i broke it and we had to try to figure out how i was able to get pressure back on this hand. >> rose: yeah. and that was right before trials, so i had to do it again at the olympics. so, i mean, i think this time, in 2016, was probably the first time where i've gone into an olympics completely giving 100%, being at every work out, sleeping the right amount, doing the right things away from the pool. like a couple of coaches say, nothing good happens after midnight. i'm in bed before midnight. all of those things i did before going into this olympics because i knew i had to do it the exact way. so i think that's -- if you have, you know, obviously -- and i think coach, too, if you have the combination of mental,
physical, emotional toughness, if you have every one of those, that's what makes you great. >> rose: on behalf of this audience, our great thanks to two great champions, michael phelps and mike kryzewski. ( cheers and applause ) >> rose: for more about this program and earlier episodes, visit us online at pbs.org and charlierose.com. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org
[ bells play tune ] [ theme music plays ] -♪ i think i'm home ♪ i think i'm home ♪ how nice to look at you again ♪ ♪ along the road ♪ along the road ♪ anytime you want me ♪ you can find me living right between your eyes, yeah ♪ ♪ oh, i think i'm home ♪ oh, i think i'm home -today on "cook's country," bridget and julia make the ultimate arroz con pollo. jack challenges bridget to a tasting of store-bought whipped topping.