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tv   PBS News Hour  PBS  May 17, 2019 3:00pm-4:01pm PDT

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captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc >> woodruff: good evenin i'm judy woodruff. on the newshour tonight: thousands march in hong kong, to protest a new law that stokes fear that it will silence critics of china's government. en, investigators determine an electrical transmission line was the cause of the d cdliest fire ifornia history. plus, democratic congresswoman tulsi gabbard discusses her run for the white house, while mark shields and david brooks analyze the latest in the presidential race and and, game over. methe smash hit hbo show "f thrones" comes to an end this weekend. we examine what made the show such a sensation. all that and more, on tonight's pbs newshour.
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aluminum tariffs on canada and mexico in a bid to ease trade tensions with its north american neighbors. president trump made the announcement this afternoon. canada and mexico will, in tur scp planned retaliatory tariffs on the u.s. in washington, mr. trud he hoped the move would clear a roadblock to passing the u.s.- mexico-canada trade agreement. >> that deal is going to be a fantastic deal for our country, and hopefully congresse ill approve s.m.c.a. quickly, and then the great farmers, and manufacturers, and steel plants will make our economy even more successful than it already is. >> woodruff: canadian prime minister justin trudeau called the move "terrific." meanwhile, president trump also said that he is delaying for six months a decision on imposing tariffs on imported cars and auto parts. that will buy more time for trade negotiations with the
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european uon and with japan. missouri has become the latest state to approve a restrictive abortion bill. its republican-led state house prssed the ban on the procedure at eight weeks onancy. it allows exceptions for medical emergencies, but not in cases of rape or incest. the state's republican governor has pledged to sign it. and an investigative report released today by ohio state university has found that a former team doctor sexually abused at least 177 male students over nearly detwo des. frchard strauss abused athletes at least 16 of the school's sports teams, along with students at other health facilities, between 1979 and 1997. he took his own life in 2005. the report also said that school officials were aware of theti alles, but did little to stop him. we will have more onhe findings later in the program. taiwan has become the first
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place in asia to legize same-sex marriage. the self-ruled island' legislature voted overwhelmingly today to approve the measure. thousands of people gathered outside the parliament in taipei to await the vote. they waved rainbow flags and celebrated in the streets after the bill passed. >> just now, a law passed saying we won't be using the term "same-sex marriage," but just "marriage," which means that we can get married. this means that when we get married, we use the method of marriage and not civil union, so there is no hostility. i think this is very important. >> woodruff: mainland china, which claims taiwan as its own territory, is under communist rule and far more conservative. back in the u.s., the house of reesentatives today passed sweeping legislation to extend civil rights protections for t.q. people. it bans discrimination based on gender identity and on sexual orientation. the bill passed largely along lorty lines, with every democrat
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voting in favor, with eight republicans. a similar bill faces long odca in the republed senate. president trump is expected to veto the legislation if it arrives at his desk. former white house national security adviser michael flynn has told the special counsel's office that people connected to the white house and congress tried to influence his cooperation with the russia probe. that is according to a courtli that was made public thursday. meanwhn an interview with fox news today, attorney general william barr vowed to get to the bottom of the russia investigation's origins, and said that so far the explanations have been "insufficient." the treasury department defied today's bpoena deadline to hand over president trump's tax returns to the house ways and means committee. meanwhile, the democ chairman of that committee, richard neal, said today he'd rather appea mr. trump's returns than pursue contempt charges.
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weeks-long talks between britain's governing conservative party and opposition labour party collapsed todaing more uncertainty to the country's exit from the european union.la ur leader jeremy corbyn and prime minister theresa may both said the discussions were frank, but fell short of finding agreement on a withdrawal deal. >> we've negotiated in good faith and very seriously and put forward a lot olef very det arguments on trade relations, on customs, on regulations, all those issues, and i think that's the responsible thing to do. >> these talks have been constructive, and we've made progress. b there han areas where we have been able to find common ground, but her issues have oved to be more difficult. >> woodruff: the new deadline for britain's exit from the e.u. is october 31. and stocks fell on wall street toda amid reports the u.s.- china trade talks have stalled. the dow jones industrial average lost more than 98 points to
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close at 25,764. the nasd fell 82 points, and the s&p 500 slipped 17.tr tor maker john deere pulled the s&p's industrial sector down, after reporting weak sales from farmers wrtried about exs. that triggered fears the u.s. trade war with china take a toll on other major u.s. manufacturers. still to come on the newshour: thousands march to protest a new exadition law in hong kong. bestselling authored herman wouk has died. his literary agent said hepa ed at his home in palm springs, california. wouk woern the pulirize in 195 for the "cain muty." herman wouk was 103 years old. still to come on the news hour, how long was the ohio state university leadership awarema
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thousandrch to protest a new extradition law in hong kong. r vestigators blame an electrical line using california's deadliest fire. and, much more. >> woodruff: we are learning new, disturbing descils about the of another college athletics sex abuse scandal. as john ng tells us, this one at ohio state university. and a warning: t story contains explicit language. >> yang: judy, the school says the abuse took place in the 1970s, '80s and '90s by a physician who was both a tea doctor and worked in the student health center. the university also found that school officials knew of allegations as early as 1979, and for nearly two decades, did nothing about them. the physician, richard strauss, left o.s.u. in 1998. he committed suicide in 2005.l in an em students, faculty
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and staff, university president michael drake apologized to those who were abused, and said: "the finngs are shocking and painful to comprehend. our institution's fundamental failure at the time to prevent this abuse was unacceptable, as were the inadequate efforts to thoroughly investigate complaints raised by students and staff members." this is the fourth major investigation of an o.s.u. coach or advisor in recent years. are joined by we mike thompson, news director at wosu public media. it is independent of the university. mike, thanks for joining us. the report says this abuse took place in the guise of medical exams. what more can you tell us about what e report found? >> the report found that the abuse started right after richard strauss began his tenure at ohio statn he started 1978 and the abuse started right after he arrived. he woulexame student-athletes. he would examine students on campus.
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all of his vicms, according to report, are male. and they would be under the guise of a physical exam, of a routine physical to make sureth they could plae sport they were playing or if the patient came in, the atete came i complaining of an injury and the abuse allegations include excessive fondling or asking athletes to strip come pollnauty d for unrelated conditions, like there would be allegations of excessive fondling of the genitals even though the athlete was being treated for cauliflower ear. >> yang: and it says these complaints, officials knew about allegations of complaints in 79, but what happed to them? why was nothing done? >> the report says at first coaches and administrators in the athletic department and the studvit health ses were first aware of the complaints about richard strauss in 1979, but they really didn't do anything about it. they changed some of his work conditions ov the course of years, but the report found that these complaints occurred
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regularly for the net 20 years. and the report says that some in the athletics department just dismissed these as unfounded rumors. but it was well-known according to his accusersac anrding to the report that dr. strauss was unusual in his examinations and some athletes were even urged to steer clear of him. so it was well-known according to the accusers and the report that dr. strauss was doiapng opriate things with athletes and students in the health servicewhs. >> yang: does the report say about what they found about whether or not coaches orsi ant coaches knew? i ask because this is gettening some aon in the political world because an assistant wrestling coach at the time from 17 to 1995 is now representative jim jordan, a republican from ohio, founder freedom caucus, ranking republican in the house oversight committee. >> yes, the report says the coaches knew. the report does not name any coaches by name. they say the head coach of this
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team, the head coach of that team. an assistant coach with this team or cope a or coach b. oddly none of the coaches are named in the report even though congressman jordan has told the "washington post" that this completely exonerates him, he's not named. no coaches are named in the report. in favorable or negative light. coacheseport says that were well aware of at least abnormal behavior onhe part richard strauss. >> yang: and he -- strauss wa suspended from his role asea tm physician and from working in the student health center in 1996. what was that it finally triggaed that? > student who went to the student health center complained of inapproiate fondling and he complained about that, and that went to the unerty officials, it went to o.s.u. human relations and r, and they ok action and they quickly suspended him. they lost his role as a team physician and also with aud nt health services. after a quick investigation, he still remaiulned on the fty of
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ohio state university. but then he celt up a men's clic just off campus and continued to treat o.s.u. students the report found that the o.s.u. officials did not stand in the way of him setting up this men's clinic despite the allegations against him that dated back to the late '70s. >> yang: mike, what's been the reaction on campus today? well, as bad as the report is, thega invesrs' report, is i don't think it's surprising to folks who have been following this story for the pas ar. these are all things we have yard from accusers over the par. it's now in block and white. we hear the university calling inexplicable and inexcusable. now it stets the stage for a possible legal sem down the road. >> yang: mike thompson from columbus, thank you. >> thank you. >> woodruff: tensions are ngsing in hong as protesters take
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ss the streets. at, a new law that allows extradition of suspected criminals to china. nick schifrin reports on fears that it might lead to silencing critics of beijing. >> schifrin: idowntown hong ng, the protestors, and the brumellas they hold to symbolize resistance, fill a city street. last month, more than 100,000 demonstrated peacefully. in a city that's long valuedpe indendence, thtr say a new exition law can be used to shackle them to mainland china.( translated ): once this law has been passed, it won't matter if you are an average person or a foreigner coming through hong kong, there will be a possibility you'll be taken and sent off to the mainland. ( marching and chanting ) >> schifrin: they demonstrated in march outside the local government headquarters. they describe the law as "rendition," allowing chinaap to kidnnd imprison any hong kong residents or visitors accused ofri significant--
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and any hong kong leading activists critical of the chinese governme, like joshua ng. >> perhaps in the worst scenario, activists mimat be jailed iinland china, even though they are permanentng hong koesidents. >> schifrin: buthe people's republic of china is fighting in. one week ago, pro-g lawmakers brawled with pro- democracy lawmakers, and 52-year-old gary fan ended up on the floor and on a stretcher. other activists were convicted last month of public nuisance charges. several of them ended up being bussed to jail. the new hong kong lacould also have implications for the united states.is a group that a congress on china said the law could "allow beijing to pressure the hong kong government to extradite u.s. citizens under false pretenses."g china is urgthe united states to stay out of it. >> ( translated ): it is wrong to tr and interfere in hong kong's affairs in any way.n: >> schifhe hong kong streets haven't been this full of protesters since 2014. the umbrella democovement
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started in response to beijing's oncision to vet candidates for hong kong's electi thousands of demonstrators gathered in the streg s, brandishineir namesake umbrellas to protect from pepper spray. those were heady days for the student activists leading the pstro >> the ongoing occupy movement will for sure generate sufficient pressurin the government. >> schifrin: but many have since given up. on a busy street in hong kong, a door thaonce led to a bookstore of resistance, is covered by a paper sign indicating it's closed. owner lam wing-kee fled to taiwan, fearing he could not avoid forced extradition. >> ( translated ): it is making hong kong into a very dangerous place. anyone could be extradited. there is no longer any protection, no sense of personal security. >> schifrin: for his part, joshua wong is defiant, urging his fellow activists to remember the optimism they felt during the 2014 demonstrations. >> no matter wha thappens, i hot people will have, will never forget the spirit of the
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umbrella movemcot, and we will inue to fight for free election. >> schifrin: this week, a delegation of pro-democracy leaders visited shington, d.c. they met with secretary of state mike pompeo, who "expressed concern" that proposed law changes "threaten hong kong's rule of law."d e of those people who met with pompeo is martin lee, the founding chairman of the first pro-democracy party in hong kong, and a leading attorney in the democracy movement. thank you so much. welcome to the news hour. >> thank you. >> schifrin: what is your message this week as you've been meeting with u.s. officials here in washington? >> it's an urgent message that unless the u.s. government comes to our assistance, hong kong will beasng a very draconian law which doesn't only affect hong kongitizens. things are going terribly long, and our legislature is about the ram through a piece of legislation which, in fact, hurts the welfare and the
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well-being of a lot of your citizens, 85,000 of them, living or working in hong k. because once the law is passed, any one of thecould be transferred back the china for trial, on trusmed -- trumped up charges of corruption or whatever which they will allege you have committed many years ago. >> schifrin: why the whites? why are you asking for the united states' help? >> i believe the u.s. government is the only governmen will take the lead. i don't believe the british government will take the lead.ko so hon of course will continue to fight against it. this is dreadful. y cause if we cannot even protect the saf people living in hong kong or visiting hong kong tas arist, how can hong kong continue to be an international city? >> schifrin: the chief executive of hong kong who has backed these changes to the
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laws, of course, says that look, there e loopholes in the law that prevents the extradition o criminals, real criminals, and that this legislation is required. what's your response to that? >> it's not a loopholat all. it's a fire wall separating our system from the mainland system. >> schifrin: mainland china, hong kong versus mainland china? >> indeed. that is china's own policy regarding hong kong. s.ey introduced a policy of one country, two syst our system is separate from them. >> schifrin: let go through other arguments the chief executive makes. she says she has reduced the number of people who can bed dragto this and she's raised the bar, that only people who have committed offenses punishable by three years rather than one year as it originally was. does that reasse you at all? >> she can increase it to seven inars, because if they concoct a case in mainland , it can be murder. there is no safety at all.
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if you can believe the chinese system, judicial and legal system, fine, but we don't. ntat is why even today there is no arrangeetween hong kong and mainland china for transfer of fugives from justice. >> schifrin: the last argument that the hong ko chief executive makes is this law would only be used to prosecute real criminals andnot prosecute anyone for race, religion,ationality, or more to the point, political opinion. that does not reassure you? >> of hecourse. ifwant you, they will bring you back on a trumped-up charge of murder o rape or corruption. >> schifrin: we just heard the spokman for foreign ministry in beijing discussing how the u.s. should stay out of this, as he put it. by coming here, do you fear that you're allowing him to make that argument, that yoare coming here asking for the u.s. and allowing the argument to be ma that the u.s. is meddling? >> well, in fact, back in 1984,
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when the british government entered into this joint declaration with the chinese government, under which hong kong and the new territories would all return to china, the chryese government worked hard to lobby for international suppt, and they lobbied th u.s. government to support that agreement. how can they ask you to stop interfering? they asked you to support the one country two system, and your government still does support it some how can they tell the u.sin government, your own business. >> schifrin: what do you want the u.s. to do? what can the u. really do against beijing's push? >> i would like the u.s. government and oer governments ord indeed the hong kong government to suus, to support hong kong people, and the legi it's a bad law.. if it passed, nobody is safe. honk conditioning cannot be ther
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safeor again. >> schifrin: martin lee, fartherring of the democracy par any hong kong, thank you so much. >> my pleasure. dr >> wf: wildfires in california have been brutal these past few years. this week, state invesrs say the camp wildfire-- the deadliest in a century-- was byused by equipment owned pacific gas and electric. toamna nawaz has our look he company's role. >> nawaz: the camp fire killede 85 peod burned down most of the town of paradise to the ground before it was eventually brought under control. fire investigators say the utility's 100-year-old transmission lines snapped last november and created small fires that spread and turned into the camp fe. state officials also say p.g.&e. has caused multiple fires in 2017 as well.
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the company is facing lawsuits, potentially criminalharges, and filed for bankruptcy protection in january. russell gold is senior energy reporter for the "wall street journal," who's been covering this. he's also e author of a new book on renewables called "superpower." russell gold, welcome to the news hour. 100-year-old transmission lines. whato we know about how pg&e was run, what they were doing, what they failed to do that led to th devasting fire? >> well, what we know is this im a transion line that was built in 1921, and before a recent story in the "wall street journal," we asked, when was the last time it was inspected, when was the lastime you had climbed up it, the company s unable to really provide an answer. and basically this is a company which has had many problems ove the years, going back to 2010 with the pipeline explosion in san bruno and then continuing forward.
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it seems like every time they have an issue, they get it taken care ofse, something pops up. so they're almost playing whack-mole trying to keep up with all the different problems they're having. >> nawaz: you've seen thobose ems you just mentioned. state officials saying they're behind multiple other fires, as well i that unusual for a utility like this? >> there are actually considerably mor fires started than even other california utilities. we looked into that. but ne of the biggest problems is that in the past you might have a situationhere a utility -- a tree will hate line, the line will go down, and it will start a fire, but northern california right now is so dry and has been through so much drought over the last five years that the fires are jus devastating. and really pg&e is playing catch up. i would venture to say that neither the company nor the regutors really were prepared for the frosties -- feriocities of the fires that we're seeing
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and are struggling to try to figure out what to do. >> nawaz: so they have a new head, right? bill johnson stepped into the role relatively recently. he's already testified before lawmakers about this. what is he saying? what is the company's response to these findings? >> well, so he said pg&e has accepted responsibility. they expect to be found camp fire. for th what pg&e is doing right now is they're talking about really a multi-year plan to harden thei system, to cut down tree to, try to get this sitti under control. but in the meantime, one of the things they're talking aboutrt doing, sg this summer, effectively starting now, and certainly the fall fire season, is they're talking about turning off power to enti cities or half of counties when the conditions are conducive to fires, because they are saying, look, if we cannot guarantee that our equipment is not going to cause aire, it's not going to have a problem and cause a fire, we're just going to ture n uip off. so what we're going to face this
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fall and what the communities in northern california are going to face could be two to five days without power. >> nawaz: so we mentioned there could be potential criminal charges? the district attorney is looking er the report. what do we know about ty for the fires they have already been linked to? .. well, in&e. california there is something called inverse condemnation. what that ians very simplys it does not matter if pg&e was negligent. if their equipment started theey fire, re liable for the damages, and that's property damage, thas lawsuits, deaths. so they are facing billions and billions, $20 billion, $30 billion already. and now with the camp fire, the most deadly of them all being associated with pg&e, pg&e being blamed for sparking it, just massive liability. that's why they declared arbankruptcy earlier this they're still a profitable company. this is a utility. they can collect res if you want electricity, but the amount of liabilities they're facing are just so large that
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essentially they said we can't go on like this. >> nawaz: you mentioned some of the stuff they will be willing to take,f some oe things they're already trying to do. preparations are under way for the upcoming re season across the region. are people confident that the steps that they're taking now,e hings they're doing, will they be able to safe for this upcoming fire season? >> no, there's not a lot of confidence right now. and you hear that from people that you interview who live northern calfornia. you hear it from state regulators. you hear it definitely from ste politicians. the loss of confidence in pg&e and pg's ability to operate safely is really stunning. so essentially when you talk to people in places like napa county, sonoma county, whh went threw deadly wildfires around san to rosa in 2017, they does it make sense to you to turn off the power on windy days when the cditions are ripe for fires, they basically say, yeah, we don't have confidence that pg&e will be
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able to -- that their equipment will not spark more fires, so it makes senseo deenergize those lines, even though it will come as a great inconveence to the public. >> nawaz: troubling findings there. something to watch, russell ld, senioring joyeporter at the "wall street journal," thank you. >> thank you. >> woodruff: she is the first fmale combat veteran to ror president. hawaii representative tulsi gabbard served two tours of duty in the middle east before being elected to congress in 2012. and she joins me now at the table. and she ins me now at the table. welcome to the newshour. >> good afternoon. >> woodruff: we should also say you are the second youngest person in this race, 38, oy 38 years ole. what i want to ask you first is the last election, you were a big supporter of bernie sanders. >> yes. >> woodruff: he's still runninga he's running in 2020, but you're not supporting him.
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you're running on your own. why now are you better qualified to be present than he is? >> it's the expertise and the experience that i bring to this job. the most important job that a president has is to servas commander-in-chief, to keep the american people and our country safe and secure. and so the experience that i ing of serving a soldier for over 16 years, ofdeploying twice to the middle east and serving in congress now for over six on both the armed services and foreign affairs committee have brout me that experience and understanding about the issues that face our country and our national security and the cost of war. so i can walk in on day one to do that job as president and commander-in-chief. >> woodruff: so it's an international focus. you'retressing commander-in-chief rather than the multiple duties of a preside t. >> there any different issues that we face here domestically, and you'll hear a lot of the other candidates talking about that, but what is often not addressed i fact
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that our foreign policy, the cost of these continued wasteful regime change wars that we have been waging nowor slong has a direct connection to our domestic policy and ourbility to invest the resources that we need to in things like healthcare, education, infrastructure, and so on. >> woodruff: let me quickly asyou about a couple things. iran, right now there is a lot of attention being paid to whether the trump administration is edging closer to miliry confrontation with iran. what would you be doing differently? >> a nber of things. first, it's important to make sure the person people understand that a war with iran would be far more costly and far more devastating than anything that we expericed in iraq. what we would see is a devastating cost on our tops, my brothers and sisters in uniform, a cost on the civilian people, both inran and across the region, worst refugeise cris across europe, as well as a strengthening of terrorist groups like isis and al-falih,
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al-falih, -- and al qaeda, further undermining our national security. it woul td essentially ma war in iraq lo like a cake walk. >> woodruff: so you wouldn't have pulled out of the nuclear deal? >> i would not have. i think trump needs to recognize that his strategy fau has been counterproductive and a failure. as president i would reter the iran nuclear deal, negotiate with iran separately on the other issues that we have, and find a diplomatic way atto de-escthese tensions that we have. >> woodruff: let me ask you about syria. you were criticized by number of democrats two years ago when you met with syria's president, bashar al-assad. as you know, he's seen as a utal dictator oveseeing the torture and killing of hundreds of thousands of civilians in that country. if you are elected president, would you sit down with bashar al-assad agai what do you think it would accomplish? >> i think it's foreign for the sake of tiour country's al security, to keep the american people safe, and the pursuit of
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peace for anour presidend commander-in-chief to have the courage to meet with leaders of othr countries, whetey be adversaries or potential adversaries, in order to achieve at peace and security. i think it's important now for trump toeet with the iranian president, so that we don't face this situation as we arenow where we are walking dangerously closer and closer to war with an. unless we are serious and have the courage to hold these conversations and have these meetings, the only alternative is war. >> woodruff: russia, would you be tougher on russia than this administration or not? you talking about the importance of avoiding any sort of nuclear confrontation with russia, which obviously everybody wants, but what would you do differently? >> as we loot k at this thr nuclear war and a nuclear catastrophe, nuclear strategists say we are closer to the potential of alear war now than ever before. so it's important for us to make sure that we are de-escalating tensions with nuclear armed
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countries like russia and china and build those relationships that are based more on cooperation rather than conflict. deal with the issues that we have, but also recognize in situations like north korea and our goal of denuclearizing the korean peninsula. it is in our interest interest to work with countries like wssia and china to achieve that goal. druff: quickly, let me ask you about the mueller report. you have said in estheans you thintsdemoceed to move on, there was no collusion proven and in terms of obstruction of justice, we're now learning that people representing president trump, conedgress, contad flynn, -- michael flynn, who was advising the president to, affect his cooperation with investigators are. you confident there was no attempt at obstruction of justice? >> no, no, not at all. iave never said that. my statements and my point has been my support for the mueller investigation was to investigate whether or not the president of our country colluded with
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russia, colluded with a foreign country. the mueller report here was no evidence that that collusion took place. i think t's important for us. congress will exercise its oversight over the president and the administration. >> woodruff: but obstruction of justice -- >> on obstruction and other issues that are being raised. t i will tell you, out on the road as i'm meeting with people in different states and different communities, they're not talking about the mueller report or they're not talking about what's happening in washington. what they're saying is why aren't you guys focused on bringing us quality healthcare, on bringing us quality education, on dealing with th crumbling infrastructure that's threatening so many people in this country. >> woodrhaf: speaking of we looked today at your website, running for president, and y have been this campaign since january. there is no place on your website that talks about the issues, that talks about your positions on the issues. just curious about why that is. >> there is a website tulsi tulsigabard.org that people can
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see my issues. on my presidential camp we're working on rolling out my vision for where i will take c thntry on a whole host of issues. that will be rolling out in the fuf:re. >> woodruickly back again on the mueller report. do you think congress should drop its investigation, its attempts to learn more?o. >> >> woodruff: about what was in the mueller? >> no.t i do. >> woodruff: all right. we will leave it. there congresswoman tulsi ucgabbard, thank you very. we appreciate it. and with that, we turn to the analysis of shields and brooks. that is syndicated columnist mark shields, and "new york times" columnist david brooks. gentleman, hello. so you listened to the conversation of congresswoman gabbard, david, to you first, how much of role is foreign policy going the play in this election? >> at this moment i don't think a primary will. i was a foreign correspondent in the early '90s covering europe, africa and the middle east. i remember when the clinton campaign started, suddenly all
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my stories disappeared. when clinton came new york people said, something is happening right here. right now the focus of the voters' attention is the crisis right here. i think that's the way it is. it could changwith one foreign policy crisis. right now this is a mestically focused nation. >> woodruff: congresswomhe gabbard, yod her say, mark , she's very focused on the world. she said mistakes have been made. is that a way to capture voters' imagination? >> if david is right and a crisis does develop, and i think we can see crises brewing at this point. george h.w. bush, i thinkt's fair to say in 1988, his own military experience were strong credentials in his election. john kerry's nomination in 2004, and barack obama being the only democratic candite who had opposed the united states war in iraq, that was his calling card that. was his credential.
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so if, in fact, it's there, it becomes central. if it isn't. it wasn't in 1992. >> woodruff: quickly, david, a lot of comment right now about how the president has handled north korea, venezuela, iran. do we see that beinu a plus or a for the president? >> well, i say they're minuses. he's frayed all of our alliances, which makes our issues harder. his general posture is ofne extreme bellicosity with no convincing idea if he will do anything aut these things some i think we're not very close to a war in iran.nk i thi he is loathe to do that. he would be crazy to do that, but he is responding to a situation, which is a tough situation. if the intelligence reports are true that rathenians told their militant armies that they control in the region the targ t americann that's something any american president is going to respond to. i'm not sure you can respond as well when you have no allies or you can respond as well as when
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you already walked out of the iran deal. you have sort of left yourself in a hard place and the tng that worries me is the administration seems to think iran is on the verge of folding and if they just up the pressure and get more erratic that iran otll fold. most experts do think they're close to folding an we hered be in a situation things spiral. >> woodruff: mark, let's turn to a domestic issue that a lot of people ar talking about right now. and that is the anti-abortion movement movilng essentiy through state after state in the last few months time pose even stricter limits on abortion. in the case o, alabae strictest limits in the country, basically saying all abortions are illegal. gctors could go to prison. what do you see ing on here? what is this movement say to you? and do you think one political party or another, it's a serious issue, but setting the issue itself aside, does one political party or another stand to lose
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from this? >> yes. yes. i would say that, first of all, the isssue itself thorny and unresolved in the country and remains so after some 45 years, unlike the country's moved considerably to the left on guy rights and on same-sex marriage, abortion has been stuck in the galle polls ask the sam question annually. do you consider yourself pro-choice or pro-life. the most recent, 48% of themselves are pro-life. 48% pro-choice. but the gallup poll said there is a consensus on this thorny, difficult issue on three aspects, the life of the mother, abortion should be available and option in the case of the life of the mother, and 71% of those who identify as pro-life say iou ld be. so 7 out of 10. and the same thing, by a similar majority,ot quite that high on
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the question of pregnancy as a result of rape or incest. so i would say in answer to your question, judy, that politically this is i don't want to say a suicide pact for republicanubs, but rcans are very much on the defensive. and if it were to put them in a position where all thosc e democrause seats that were won in places like pennsylvania and new jersey got a lotto her, uphill for republicans the win back. >> i'm not sure. new yoy started this b passing a very liberal abortion law which went all the way through the pregnancy. virginia had one that thwas proposed didn't end up gig anywhere. ose polling that i look at has threeitions. one, do you think abortion should always be legal. you get 27%. should never be legal 18%. should be leg, which is the european solution, which is just legal first trimester, harder the second, . that's 50 or 55%, as mark says, habeen very stale since roe v. wade. but the problem is we took it
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out of politics, so it couldn't get to the moderate position. now theremists have taken over both sides. and everybody is speakingfrom these extreme positions. >> yang: >> woodruff: right now it is e restrictive side that's having success in slip after legislature. >> well in the red states. >> i think david, both in e rginia and new york, the democrats weren unfavorably and unfortunately and i think wrong as a party of infantside. they really were. ralph northam, that's what got him -- >> woodruff: the proposal that was put forward. >> but now i think it's noit question tha the republican dominant position. that's why kevin mccarthy, the republican house leade tried to distance himself. he realizes, this is a killer in suburban america. america remains pro-choice and anti-abortion. >> what the n.r.a. did to the gun issue they're doing to
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abortion. >> woodruff: i want to come back to 2020. we did have a couple of new people thmp into the racs week, including the mayor of new york. we now have 23 democrats eand ma'm forgetting somebody. >> david is about to announce. >> with mark as my running mate. >> woodruff: but for a numbers in there, the polls are showing and granted they're early, joe bide pulling ay. that came out last night or toda and it shows when you ask candidates who can beat president trump, joe biden is way out there. 49 to 38. you see these other numbers, bernie sanders 46 t but it seems to be the who can beat trump that is the question and in another poll, people who are asked top qualities for t democratic nominee, 73%, beaevtg y other quality that matters. >> new ideas was down to 47%. de for a lot of voters --
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>> that's a newa. >> trump has been a daily nightmare. they just want him to go away for the sake of the country some bide seemlike the most stable who can do that. the thing that rikes me out the polling data is how the democratic party, how the democratic voters break do there's no divide on gender lines, which is surprising to me. there's in divide on race or economic lines, education lines. those divides don matter. age matters. so biden does extremely amwell g voters over 45. moderately well among middle-age voters and not so well at all among young voters some that age divide, the younger voters want systematic change, and the older voters who don't want the party to get too far left and who want some stability and restraint. >> judy, iate torain on anybody's parade at this pointi, judyhe 1992 when it was an open seat for the democratic ntial nomination, bi clinton was at 6% and running in fifth place. at that point in 2004, joean
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liebmas leading. >> woodruff: i realize there is a danger in bringing up polls. >> the thing i would be concerned about if i was donald trump, donald trump is consistently at 40%, 41% in those polls? if the docrats nominate someone who isn't under indictment detox or suspicion of dealing with foreign dynasties, i mean, you know, they're almost in a position of strength. >> the generational thing will last. we saw that with bernie against hillary. there is a generational divide on the left these days. you see it in your workplace. somehow there will be an ole person who is a young person's candidate. we don't know who that will be. but that divide is the permanent future of the democratic >> i'm not so sure. >> woodruff: you're not so sure about the divide? >> i'm sure about the division.a i'm not sure each side will have a candidate. i think that's what i mean. >> 60% of voters over 45. >> that'drright. >> wf: but is there a
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message that's coming through to the younger generation? i'm not sure what the cut-off point, iwhether it's or 35, as we said, but is one of these or more of these candidat aes maki open appeal to young people? >> bernie and waelizabeten. war when has had a good week. >> woodruff: and bernie i sanderss in his 70s. >> it doesn't matter the age ofd the ate. it's the emotional tone, the message of anger ande fed uss, the systems have failed us. that's the warren sanders message. >> anybody who watched bernie sanderin 2016 was just overimpressed. i was, by the youth of his audience. it was a young, i many cases idealistic, passionate, but also ornful of the political establishment. so i think that's a truth of our politics right now.
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>> woodruff: including the candidate we talked to tonight. she was a huge bernie supporter in 2016. pete buttigieg is 37. she's 38. i guess my question is are we going to see just a sort of naked appeal to young people or are we -- david,ou're saying we're already seeing it. we're seeing it in bernie sanders' message. >> you've is idealism. youth is a framed. it's a state of mind. it's a perspective on the world of what's possible. i think that's the themes you'll be hear rather tjust, oh, boy, you and have the same rthday. >> it's angrier, though. indo '68, t know if he was playing to idealism or anger. this is -- we have lived through iraq. we've learned through a financial crisis. we've lived through trump. this is no working for us. it's an imimpatience.
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let's have some steadiness andn let's what we're doing in an obama era. >> woodruff: it says joe biden is the one who can expect somgse slinnd arrows coming his way. >> abslewly. no all right. david brooks, mark shields. thank you. >> thank you, judy. >> woodruff: finally tonight, o for the millioviewers around the world addicted to "game of thrones," winter iswe coming thiend. jeffrey brown is here to look at the television phenomenon as it concludes its lo run on sunday night. it is srt of our regular a and culture series, "canvas." >> brown: dragons, white rglkers, and ravens. yens and lannisters. seven kingdoms, and one iron throne to rule over them. to follow every reference, you'd
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have to be tuning in regularly to the vast fantasy woof hbo's "game of thrones." but the thing is, millions of people have. npr television critic eric blggans: >> this is a moderkbuster, so 17, 18, 19 million people watching on a single nr ht is a lot r modern tv ecosystem. >> brown: add many more throug streaming and online services, and this "game" became an international phenomenon, turning its cast, many of whom have grown up before audience's eyes, into celebrities, and inspiring board games and product placement; tourist sites around the world where the show was filmed; fan-made artificial intelligence prediction models to gauge possible endings; and enough viral buzz on social media-- including from the white house--
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to make this the water-cooler discussion ow of the age. deggans says the timing was just right. >> it came along at a time when geek cultuulre r pop culture. shs that are about sword and sorcery or about zombies ouor t superheroes-- have now beme huge mainstream entertainment aples. so you take a high quality tv show in a genre that's veryed popular now, bn a book that had a wide constituency, and you pour in millions and millions of dollars in production to make it look amazing, and you wind up with a phenomenon like "game of thrones." >> bro: the best-selling book series was "rge r.r. martin's" a song of ice and fire," five volumes to date, brimming with detail and storylines that grabbed readers. michelle hope, a fantasy boowo editor, has ed with martin and other award-wiing authors. >> the author makes it seem believable and visceral withth e sensory details. and so as we move through this story, we kind of trust the
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author to tell us believable artails about this new world, so that when dragon introduced, or zombies, or a face-swapping assassin, we're like, yeah, i can pictat. >> brown: beginning in 2011, show-runners david benioff and dan weiss brought "game of thrones" to the screen, filming northern ireland and locations around the worldbuwith an enormdget that allowed them to create mini-movies in every episode, and give agenerys, the mother of drs, jon snow, and a zillion other characters a new life. >> we knew that there would be some resistance at first to the idea that a show set in this genre, as opposed to a genre like a crime drama or a western or what have you, could be serious drama and could be worthy of the same kind of entention as those other dramas. >> brown: the au built, along with the critical acclaim, an astounding 128 emmy nominations and 47 wins,
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incl ing three years as outstanding drama series.th michelle hopinks people saw something more than the other- worldly. that's something that's powerful about fantasy, because we can see these really familiar problems in our own world, in a rt of slightly detached fantastical setting. and so we then have this shared world, the shared vernacular, to talk about these issues, with these sort of fake characters,we anan talk about problems in relationships and problems in society using the shared ctext of "game of thrones" and have actual conversations about things that make us angry, or things that make us feel something. >> brown: fans d get angry along the way. the show was criticized early on for its gratuitous-feeling sex, and brutality against women, including rape. eric deggans thinks the proderlistened, and changed their portrayal of women, who, in the last seasons, emerged as
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among the strongest leaders.nd but hethers noted another blind spot, in the lack of diversity and fully-realized r characters of colo this made-up world. >> you have a fictional place, cu know, given that this is a made-up continent,ouldn't there have been more people of color that were a part of this society, in the same way tlot people of are now a part of societies all over britain and europe and america? they might have had more courage, given the success of movies like "black panther" and s,anchises like the "aveng that have lots of people of color involved in them now. >> brown: this final season has also brought a new roundntf bewildermend even anger from many fans, as slowly-developed storylines and charaers come rushing to their end. the television version moved beyond george martin's novel two seasons back, and not everyone is happy with where t t producers haen it. fantasy editor michelle hope, though, is very happy that
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millions of potential readers and viewers have now discovered her world, where she says they'll find plenty of other fresh and diverse voices and visions. and i think there's room for tons and tons of diversity infa asy, because we can imagine whatever world we want. and i'm excited to see, because of the popularity of the genre, like, lots of authors coming to it and taking a stab at it, and telling us what their world is like, and how their characters i navigate throu. >> brown: in the meantime, on a sunday night in may, winter will have come and gone, and, perhaps, we'll find out at long last who sits on the iron throne. for the pbs newshour, i'm jeffrey brown. >> woodruff: was that really jeffrey brown? i think it was. you never know. at's the newshour for tonight. don't forget, "washington week"
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later this even on pbs. i'm judy woodruff. i'm judy woodruff. have a great weekend. thank you, andood night. >> major funding for the pbs newshour has been provided by: >> kevin. >> kevin! >> kevin? >> advice for life. life well-planned. learn more at rs.aymondjam. >> bnsf railway. >> consumer cellular. >> home advisor. >> babbel. a language program that teaches spanish, french, italian, german, and more. >> supporting social entrepreneurs and their solutions to the world's most pressing problems-- skollfoundation.org. >> the william and fra hewlett foundation. for more than 50 years, advancing ideas and supporting institutions to promote a better world.le
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at www.h.org. >> and with the ongoing support of these institutions and frnds of the newshour. e this program was made possible by rporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions to your pn statom viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by newshour productions, llc captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org >> you're watching pbs.
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"amanpour & company" here's what's coming up. >> president trump takes his fight squarely to china, barring huawei from doing business with america. i'll speak with jim sciutto, author of "the shadow war." plus alabama'sovernor signs the most restrictive abortion law in the couakry. i'll s to the doctor on the front lines and thet femin warrior gloriain s

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