tv Face the Nation CBS August 6, 2017 10:30am-11:30am EDT
captioning sponsored by cbs >> dickerson: today on "face the nation." congress and the president have left town, we'll look at what's been left behind. and what could be done outside of washington. it wasn't moving day at the white house but time for some renovations. including an oval office redecoration. while the president is off to his new jersey golf resort for 17 days as a working vacation. mr. trump wasn't talking but behind the scenes his new chief of staff, john kellys working to make order out of chaos, assuring attorney general jeff sessions' job is safe but letting others go including brand new communications director anthony courtroom. embarrassing transcripts of telephone conversations between the president and world leaders
made it in to the "washington post." there will be consequences said the attorney general. >> i have this warning for would-be leakers, don't do it. >> congress is also gone for the month of august back home in wisconsin, paul ryan said the house isn't getting any credit for what they have done. >> it's about what the president tweeted. >> productivity was also on the president's mind as he fired a parting shot at congress in the form of, yes, a tweet. our relationship with russia is at an all-time very dangerous low. you can thank congress the same people that can't even give us health care. one person in washington who is not going anywhere this summer, special counsel robert mueller, he's convened a grand jury in his investigation into possible trump campaign collusion with russia, an investigation that is gathering steam but still mocked by the president, this time on the campaign trail in west
virginia. >> have you seen any russians in west virginia? or ohio? or pennsylvania? are there any russians here tonight, any russians? >> dickerson: no one raised their hand in west virginia but we did hear from russian president vladimir putin who reported in from his vacation in siberia. we'll talk with senate intelligence committee republican tom cotton. then we'll ask former homeland security secretary jeh johnson about the administration's effort to stop the russians from tampering with the election. plus two governors working together, colorado democrat john hickenlooper and ohio republican john kasich, they will tell us about their efforts on health care with washington frozen in dysfunction is it up to them to fix the country's problems. analysis on all the nice and thoughts on what congress could actually do while they're on vacation. it's all ahead on "face the nation."
good morning, well can come to "face the nation" we begin with arkansas senator tom cotton he joins us from minneapolis. senator, welcome. i want to start with something that people are watching now, what you on the intelligence committee have been investigating, potential russian efforts influence american actions. what's happened is the national security advisor h.r. mcmaster has been under an assault in the digital space. "new york times" reports that on friday, on social media, 600 twitter accounts linked to russian influence operations at one point had hash tag, fire mcmaster. what do you make of all that have? does it look like what you've been investigating during the election? >> john, good morning. first off i think h.r. mcmaster is a great american. there are not many generals highly decorated in two different wars and phds
about civil military relations. i was happy to bring him to the president's attention in february. pleased that he chose him. glad to know that they're working very well together. i don't want to comment on specific report from the "new york times" but i will say that russia has a long history of using disinformation, deception, subterfuge and espionage to influence western democracy that happened in our election, when russian intelligence hacked into the e-mails and released them. happened in 1983 when russia intelligent service were behind the protest against deployment of nuclear force to western europe. no surprise that russia continues its efforts to manipulate western democracy in way of discord and disagreements between our countries in nato and within the united states or any other western european countries. something that we must be on guard against. >> dickerson: do you think the russians are involved in what is obviously some kind of operation to hurt h.r. mcmaster as
national security and push him out. >> it shouldn't surprise any american to know that russia use its money and its intelligence service to fred disinformation, to try to divide political opinion within the united states, any western european country. that's one of the techniques that russia has used for decades, during the cold war. >> dickerson: given that rush is' ongoing threat, you signed on to legislation to sanction russia, is there more that the administration should do? >> well, russia remains an adverb terry of the united states. we have some overlapping interests, it would be better if our relationship was better but relationship is not good because of vladimir putin. there are steps that we should be taking that we took under obama administration. for instance, providing defensive weaponry to ukraine.
i encourage president and administration to take a look at those steps. i know they are doing so through deliberate careful national security meetings. >> dickerson: you support -- decision on that with respect to arming the ukrainians? >> i hope so, john. i hope there's other steps that we can take to try to strengthen nato's defenses against rush a. for instance, russia is conducting a major military exercise on their western border on nato's eastern border. i've supported the efforts to send more of our troops to eastern europe to try to increase the permanent presence there to make it clear that russia that we'll stand by all of our nato allies and they can't take steps that will intimidate orw3 interfere with nato's member countries. >> dickerson: another thing administration is looking into is the situation in afghanistan. i want to ask you couple of questions that the president appears to be asking. whichs first of all after 16 years why is it still in the u.s. national interests to be involved in afghanistan, where
you served and fought? >> john, everything is the place where which we were attacked 16 years ago next month. it's the one place where we successfully ejected al qaeda from. today, though, it's still see resurgent threat from the taliban and al qaeda but also islamic state as well. we don't want to see what happened in mosul in 2014 when islamic state took over that city, happened in kandahar and let that space become an area from which terrorist extremist can plot and launch attacks. >> dickerson: do you agree with the president who reportedly said he believes that the u.s. is losing in afghanistan? >> well, making enough progress in military terms you're not winning sometimes you are losi losing. we've seen talibannd and associated terrorist organizations make gains in recent years. it's time to stop those gains and roll them back. there's a lot of different
techniques to do so but we cannot allow afghanistan to once again become an ungoverned country from which terrorist organization can launch attacks against united states and our citizens. >> dickerson: you and i during the campaign talked about congress' role in overseeing the president. i wanted to get your thoughts about three things that congress been before left town. vote on sanctions which the president did not like also in the senate took measures to make sure no rees appointments. finally couple of bipartisan efforts to make sure that the president can't fire the special counsel. what do you mike of all of those actions with respect to seems to be congress is trying to constrain the president. >> those are all very different kind of actions. on the sanctions legislation, i supported that legislation because russia and china are adversaries and north korea is racing towards having a nuclear armed missile that can strike the united states. the recess issue goes back to the obama administration, i can tell that you junior senator i
signed a roster earlier this year that was choosing when i was going to be in washington, d.c. during a recess to preside over a short session of the senate to ensure that there wasn't a recess appointment. that simply congress taking responsibility seriously. we did it under the obama administration, it's it's happening under the trump administration as well. finally on the two pieces of legislation, i don't see them going very far. the independent counsel statute 1970s is a disfaster we have executive ranch which the power of all the agency reports to the single elected. those are all very different kind of actions. but congress is a branch of government, in my opinion for decades congratulations guess has ceded too much authority. we should exercise our constitutional responsibilities seriously. >> dickerson: all right, senator, we'll have to leave it l. thanks for being with us. now that congress and the president are taking some time off we thought we'd take the
opportunity to get outside of washington and see what some governors are doing to find solutions to the many challenges facing the country. joining us now are colorado john hickenlooper and ohio republican john kasich. governor, i want to start with you, the two of you have joined together in an effort to try to fix the health care problem that in washington so far congress has not been able to fix. there are lot of plans for fixing health care is this a problem of people not finding the right plans or political problem? >> i think it's more a political problem. the key here what governor kasich and i have been talking about get a bipartisan group of people together, include some governors, the people who have to implement these plans and look at how do we stabilize private markets. how do we deal with these, look what they have been doing but there's some basic remedial
steps that can improve our health care without throwing everything out the window. >> dickerson: governor kasich, one of the ways that you build a bipartisan agreement is one side gives up a little, the other side gives up a little. we've seen in washington both sides say they don't want to give up much of anything. give me your sense of what republicans should back down on and what democrats should back down on just as a preliminary good faith effort to show that people are on the health care question, committed to work can together. >> john, look, before we get to specifics, i love working with john hickenlooper, it's terrif terrific. i work with ron delams on the b2 bomber. i was able to work with tim petty migrate friend from -- and what john hickenlooper and i are doing at the present he's going to have his staff and my staff, we've had preliminary conversations, because john and i are becoming friends. they're going to sit down and look at the difference and one of the problems is that there
are some in the democratic party that think the whole system needs to be changed at once. there are some in the republican party that say, look, let's let the market work, drive down health care cost but we're going to have to make a commitment, serious, significant commitment to those people who are left behind. so i think democrats are going to have to get to the point where they say let the market work, bring down the cost of health insurance and republicans are going to have to admit there's going to be a group of people out there who are going to need help. these are some philosophical differences between the parties, but if you have a good spirit and you understand that the system is beginning to meltdowns on the exchange side jeopardizing health care for many americans, i'm hopeful we can get there. john and i are going to start with our stap before we build it out. they may have to have couple of meetings in chicago, john and i may have to get together, may we can get there, maybe we can't but we're friends. as a result that have i'm
optimistic that we will get somewhere on this whole thing. >> dickerson: governor hickenlooper pick up on that with you. governor kasich says you're friends. in washington they may not have the same kind of friend relationship so it comes down to policy. one thing democrats have protected is? idea of the individual mandate, in other words, people have to buy insurance even if they're healthy because it spreads out the risk, that in theory democrats believe will keep prices down. that is something democrats say it's got to be in there, republicans in washington say, got to come out. if people aren't already chums how do you fix that problem? >> well, regardless whether they're friends, i do appreciate governor kasich all the work he's done. he has -- he knows the federal budget better than probably any governor in america and really does understand some of the finances. there's always a way to find a different approach. so in terms of a mandate, the key here is to recognize when you let healthy people not be part of the pool you're going to concentrate people with serious
health issues. much more expensive insurance risks into the market. that's of course going to raise the cost for everyone. however we deal with that, whether it's a mandate or re-insurance type pool that's where we can sit down and o as governor kasich said, there are different philosophical approaches but no reason why we can't bring them together and find compromises. >> john, here is the thing to remember it's not just friends but when people understand one another, when they respect one another, as john sus said there's a way to define these things and way that doesn't mean you have a winner or a loser. and i'm reminded of that sign that ronald reagan had on his desk which the congress ought to think about. he said, if you don't worry about what gets the credit it's amazing how much can be accomplished. i think that's what's missing in washington right now. john and i are not hung up about who wins, who loses, who gets credit, who doesn't because as governor you can't spend a lot of time doing. that although we have governors
that get very partisan as well. built at the end, american people want things to function, they can function if you don't worry about which party gets the credit or which politician gets the credit, it can work. now, i can't guarantee you that hickenlooper and i are going to agree but i'm hopeful. we'll do our very best to come up with something to spread it out wider, it is a final thing. you want to solve problems whether it's immigration or whether it's issue of health care. you got to grow your majority from the middle out. you got to exclude those who are on the edges, because they're disruptors not in a positive way in many cases. you got to grow hit way and that is how you get things done. >> dickerson: we'll take a short break here, we'll be back in one minute with more of our conversation with governors kasich and hickenlooper. stay with us. . [burke] fright-ning bolt. seen it. covered it. we know a thing or two because we've seen a thing or two. ♪ we are farmers. bum-pa-dum, bum-bum-bum-bum ♪
per roll bounty is more absorbent, so the roll can last 50% longer than the leading ordinary brand. so you get more "life" per roll. bounty the quicker picker upper. ♪ ♪you are loved ♪ >> dickerson: we're back with our governors. governor hickenlooper let me start with you picking up on what governor kasich was saying. talk about how the politics of this will work.
your staffs are going to get together but then walk me through how the politics of this are going to work that it's going to change the situation in washington where, again, everybody who started from the friendship that the two of you have built. >> well, i think the plan is that we begin to look at how do we get to that -- those solutions. really, stabilize the private market, how are we going to get to the re-insurance or high cost. as we do that we'll try to include more governors, republicans and democrats make sure we're balanced, at some point obviously we need to work with the senators. people like alexander who is talking about looking at a bipartisan solution, i think we'll be surprised at the number of senators that are willing to step back, all right, let's roll up our sleeves and work on a bipartisan base. >> dickerson: governor kasich, you are a member of congress, when you were in congress and
governor came in with a bunch of great ideas, would you have listened, are they likely to take what you're saying and -- >> we did listen to them. when we were balancing the federal budget in '97 we had a lot of advice from tommy thompson the great governor of wisconsin. john engler the great governor from the state of michigan. we did listen to them. it was important. my sense on this, john just mentioned lamar alexander, what he wants to do, patty murray will help on that the democrat senator. tom carper from delaware has been unbelievable in terms of his looking trying to solve this problem. dick durbin and i, democrat leader and i have talked there's a lot of politics but i'm worried about people. i think there is a hunger in the congress, at least in the senate to try to do what they went to do, which is solve problems. you can't solve immense difficult problems without both side. we couldn't have balanced the budget in '97 had not clinton
administration and republicans agreed to make some compromise. we never would have reformed the military like we g goldwater, a democrat to give power to commanders in the field. these are major deals, john. since republicans are in the majority they get to call the tune, that is i've said before when you call the tune democrats have to be included in the choir for a meaningful role. look, they know it's failing. they know this is not working down there. and if we can overcome some of the partisanship and lamar alexander i'm told left the leadership because in leadership you got to be really partisan. he left the leadership because he wanted to reach across the aisle and get more things done. godspeed to him. >> dickerson: what you are trying to do is essentially model behavior here for what bipartisanship looks like for the senate and the congress in washington? >> well, that's part of it certainly. other people have reached out, representative who is one of the
chairs of the problem solvers group in congress, he reached out to me last week, they are working on the same proposals, same ideas. the idea is that if we can get governors of the both parties to work together and maybe we are modeling some behavior, but it starts in congress, senator came up when we had the national governors association summer meeting in rhode island, he came up and spent a morning discussing the ins and outs, details of health care changes. again, we all agree, democrats agree, there are improvements that need to be made. but we don't want to roll back coverage for a lot of people, we don't want to -- the imperative to stabilize these private markets. >> john, let me tell you, another name that needs to be mention asked charlie dent offer in the house, doing a terrific job bringing people together. this is just insurance. at some point we've got to deal with the underlying problem that is caused by rising health care.
that's going to require dramatic bipartisanship, looking at a way to preserve the development of pharmaceuticals yet to be able to stem their costs. we've talked about entitlement. we're going to drown our children and grandchildren in debt which is going to kill our economy if we don't begin to deal with medicare, social security, medicaid, all the entitlements, start to get this problem of rising debt under control. so this could be a good start. john and i aren't looking for credit, we don't have any magic stuff here. if we can contribute, people can see what we're doing and we can interface maybe we can get something done to stabilize these markets which would be good for millions of americans. >> dickerson: governor hickenlooper, other issues which governors can work together like what you're trying to do on health care? >> oh, sure, almost anything. look at all the major challenges, look at the need to reinvent the way we do workforce
training. two-third of our kid are never going to get a four-year college degree, we really haven't been able to prepare them to involve them in the economy where the new generation of jobs require technical capability. we need to look at apprenticeships, look at all kinds of internships. that's the kind of thing that republicans and democrats can work on together. go down the list all the economic development. it's not republican or democratic issue to say we want better jobs for our kids or make sure that they're trained for the new generation of jobs that are beginning to appear. those are issues where we should be able to roll up our sleeves say, all right, may disagree about this or that, but all agree that we want to make sure that everybody has chance to earn their own future. >> dickerson: governors, i'll have to leave it l. thanks to both of you for being with us, we'll be back in a moment with thoughts how congress might get more accomplish understand they stayed home.
for her compassion and care. he spent decades fighting to give families a second chance. but to help others, they first had to protect themselves. i have afib. even for a nurse, it's complicated... and it puts me at higher risk of stroke. that would be devastating. i had to learn all i could to help protect myself. once i got the facts, my doctor and i chose xarelto®. xarelto®... to help keep me protected. once-daily xarelto®, a latest-generation blood thinner... ...significantly lowers the risk of stroke in people with afib not caused by a heart valve problem. it has similar effectiveness to warfarin. xarelto® works differently. warfarin interferes with at least 6 blood-clotting factors.
xarelto® is selective, targeting just one critical factor interacting with less of your body's natural blood-clotting function. for afib patients well-managed on warfarin, there is limited information on how xarelto® compares in reducing the risk of stroke. don't stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase risk of stroke. while taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. it may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. get help right away for unexpected bleeding, unusual bruising, or tingling. if you've had spinal anesthesia, watch for back pain or any nerve or muscle-related signs or symptoms. do not take xarelto® if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. tell your doctor before all planned medical or dental procedures... ...and before starting xarelto®-about any conditions, such as kidney, liver, or bleeding problems. it's important to learn all you can... ...to help protect yourself from a stroke. talk to your doctor about xarelto®. there's more to know™.
>> dickerson: summer vacation has hit washington. politicians getting out of town have for careful, though, not to look like they're enjoying themselves too much. the white house, which treats the president's golf outings like a state secret, wouldn't say what the president did yesterday but thanks to social media, we found out soon enough. the president took a break from golfing to tweet out that his 17 days out of washington are not a vacation. this is one instance where the president parts ways with vladimir putin, russian president this week was bearing his chest, engaging with fish and man spreading across siberia. congress is gone until after labor day. they had promised to stay until they passed health care legislation but left within they failed m. might be outraged why should congress get a month off when they don't do their work. maybe that's backwards. an old theory holds that air conditioning ruins congress, members no longer had to flee the washington heat to spend the summer back home.
the long vacation forced them to bond with their constituents. harder to do now because it's hard tore hear constituents through you'll the manufactured outrage. fed bipartisan pundits, fundraising built on alarming people and apocalyptic social medium the bubble now travels back home with members. but if congress stayed home longer, members might have time to run into people who aren't permanently aggrieved. the silent majority who simply want results are fine with honest compromise and would like to stop being made anxious by the partisan outrage complex. so, congress should stay home as long as it takes to get fortified with that spear rita sent many to washington in the first place. once they return it will help them fight the heat. back in a moment. this is a car protected from storms by an insurance company that knows the weather down to the square block. this is a diamond tracked on a blockchain - protected against fraud, theft and trafficking.
this is a financial transaction secure from hacks and threats others can't see. this is a patient's medical history made secure - while still available to their doctor at their fingertips. this is an asteroid live-streamed to millions of viewers from 220 miles above earth. this is ai trained by experts in 20 industries. your industry. hello. this is not the cloud you know. this is the ibm cloud. built for your business. designed for your data. secure to the core. the ibm cloud is the cloud for enterprise. yours. ♪ ♪
>> dickerson: we turn now to p president obama homeland security secretary, jeh johnson, welcome. thanks for being here. >> john, thanks for having me on the show. >> dickerson: let's start, president trump system in need of new homeland security secretary what should he be looking for? >> i won't recommend anyone in particular. but three thing come to mind. first, dhs is the third largest cabinet level department of our government but it is the most decentralized ranging from aviation security, immigration, maritime security, secret service, fee ma and counter terrorism, of course. we need to continue the management reforms that i and others initiated in the last term. i know john was very dedicated to that, i hope the next secretary is dedicated to that. also we need a national champion
and a national spokesperson when it comes to cyber security. dhs is charged with the cyber security mission and cyber security has to come in my judgment the other cornerstone of the department's missions along with counter terrorism. we need someone to champion and drive cyber security policy for the government. and we need to continue to focus on countering extremism here in the united states. and that was something i spent a lot of time on i know john kelly was very dedicated to it as well. >> dickerson: john kelly, you talked to him, you know him, how do you think he'll do as chief of staff? >> well, judging by the first five business days so far so good. john is a marine. and he is dedicated to his commander in chief's mission, whatever that mission may be. i don't believe john is a political animal, he accepts the mission and he follows it and
will do it energetically. >> dickerson: let me look back at the russia question and you put out a statement in october of 2016 letting the country know of declassified information, were you surprised that the reaction to that information that it wasn't stronger? >> good question. here is what i was surprised at. jim clapper and i issued that statement on october 7th, friday october 7th, 2016. a lot of things happened on friday october 7th, 2016. including the release of that "access hollywood" video. the very same day. so when we were drafting that statement, we thought this is unprecedented that the united states government is accusing a super power of interfering in our election. but it was literally below the fold news that day because of the release of the "access hollywood" video. it did not at the time get the attention that i and others thought it would and should.
>> dickerson: but there were other dates after that. people gotten complacent about russia at that point? >> no, i don't think complacency is the right word. i think in the heat of the campaign there were lot of things going on, lot of charges back and forth. we thought it was critical that the american voter and the american people know that there was a super power attempting to put his thumb on the scale of our american elections, before the election occurred so that the american people could know what was behind a lot of the activity that we much seeing. there is still, however, a threat out there to our election infrastructure that this administration needs to address. >> dickerson: do you wish you had done more in retrospect? >> a lot of people like to ask those questions like that. any time you take on a tough issue, people say, should you have done more, done it sooner, why did you do it at all? i know that in the summer-fall
run up to the election this was a front burner item for me, for the president, for our intelligence community. we took actions in the fall and in the last few days of the administration. now on to the next administration to carry forward a lot of the things that we did. >> dickerson: the fbi was monitoring on election day, were you a part of that process, monitoring for fake news on election day? >> the department of homeland security very much was on alert on election day and in the days leading up to it along with the fbi and we were very concerned. fortunately 33 states and some 36 cities and counties came to us before the election to seek our cyber security assistance. we identified a number of vulnerabilities in election infrastructure which were addressed. but that process needs to continue i'm concerned that we are almost as vulnerable perhaps now as we were six or nine months ago. >> dickerson: when you see these attacks on the national security advisor h.r. mcmaster, the
flood of twitter traffic, these stories are bouncing around, you look at that and say that looks like what we saw before the election? >> i'm certainly suspicious of a concerted effort directed at this one individual. i tell audience, i told congress in june, the cyber threat is going to get worse before it gets better in this country. bad cyber actors are becoming more aggressive, more ingenious and more tenacious, that's why we need a national campaign from the president, from the next secretary of homeland security to really address this property. nothing would surprise me at this point in terms of their capabilities. >> dickerson: you said election are still vulnerable. we had hanging chads and long history of election issues, why so hard to fix the election system? >> well, part of it frankly in my judgment is our politics. when i engaged state election officials last summer about
helping them with their cyber security, we got a lot of pus pushback from local officials who said this is our domain, this is our responsibility, we don't want a federal take over. i had to repeatedly say this is not a federal take over we're here to provide assistance if you ask. i'm glad that a lot of them did. there is that dynamic that makes it particularly challenging. >> dickerson: final question, when you are at the department of defense you were the top lawyer there you dealt with leaks a lot, give me your assessment of what attorney general sessions said about going after leaks, is he drawing the line in the right place and what does he need to balance? >> the leaks right now are really bad. i've never seen it this bad. there should be a concerted effort to identify and go after leakers, the one note of caution i give the attorney general what i tell younger lawyers, bad facts and bad law. before you decide to take on
journalists, reporters and perhaps subpoena their sources, be aware that the courts are going to get involved and that has potential for making bad law in this area. >> dickerson: secretary johnson, thanks very much. >> thank you very much. dickerson: we'll be back in a moment with our panel. stay with us. no, please, please, oh! ♪ (shrieks in terror) (heavy breathing and snorting) no, no. the running of the bulldogs? surprising. what's not surprising? how much money aleia saved by switching to geico. fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more.
itwhat's possible.nk rethink the experience. rethink your allergy pills. flonase sensimist allergy relief uses unique mistpro technology and helps block 6 key inflammatory substances with a gentle mist. most allergy pills only block one. and 6 is greater than one. rethink your allergy relief. flonase sensimist. ♪ >> dickerson: joining us now is "usa today's" washington bury chief, susan page. reihan salam executive editor of the national preview, jennifer jacobs covers the white house
for bloomberg news. and jamelle bouie is cbs political analyst. jennifer, i want to start with you going to the white house. a new chief of staff, one week, secretary johnson seemed to have good reviews. what has chief of staff kelly put in place and how are things changing. >> a lot of big things, it is going well in the first few days. the big things include taming tweets, loyalty and leaks, trimming some of the walk-in culture in the oval office. fostering a feeling of inclusiveness, feel welcome in his office. as well as sense of profession professionalism. on the tweets, he's not vetting every single tweet that the president puts out but trump issued a willingness to come to general kelly to run his tweet ideas by him and kelly is not discouraging him from tweeting, it's the opposite. he has suggested some tweet ideas to drive the narrative, trump has been open to those.
he has taken some of kelly's advice and ignored orbits of it. but he seems to be listen to him on that. on the staff, he called an all-staff meeting on friday in the old executive office building more than 200 staffers showed up some of the staffers told me that he explained his expectation for them. he said, listen, here are your priorities, it's country first. the president is second. your own personal desires are last. he stressed work ethic, he's been getting good reviews, the staff feels like he's open to their ideas and he's also really tried to discourage anything that would embarrass the white house or oval office such as profanity-laden tirades. >> dickerson: reihan, this is the first step it sounds. but what's next in terms of getting the administration back on track? >> you get the sense that there's an try to turn weakness
to strength, you keep your enemies off balance. the problem that you keep our allies off balance and so what kelly is trying to do is bring some clarity and consistency, he's a public servant, isn't necessarily aligned on every issue, if there is clarity, driving home to trump and those who are most aligned with him that this is actually helpful. the idea keeping everyone off balance has actually worked against you rather than for you. you need buy in on that. the focusing on three or four core issues, messages, that is going to help you in the long term. >> dickerson: jamelle, reihan described the way it's supposed to work. but buy in on consistency as the president believes and his allies, those who like him say his greatest quality is that he's a person of chaos and that he knows how to operate in cha chaos. that's his instinct. hopefully kelly has been able to
convince president trump that chaos is not serves him or his administration well. i think one challenge kelly may have going forward is trying to control information flow, that it's clear that the new chief of staff wants to make sure that the president gets only good, reliable information but the president wants information that can confirms his biases and solicits information that is quite bad. there are competing things happening, i'm not entirely sure general kelly will be able to control the information flow in a way that actually serves the president well. >> dickerson: speaking of information flow, some of the information he didn't want flowing were the transcripts that came out this week of the president in his conversations the president of mexico, prime minister of australia, what did we learn about the president in those conversations and is it unfair to even be judging them because these are supposed to be private conversations. >> i do think they were extraordinary leaks, we have
seen this, secretary johnson said leaks in this administration we've never seen before. and in modern times. that's a concern within the administration but what we learned in these leaked transcript was that the leaked versions of these conversations were right and white house versions much inaccurate. it's one more thing that undercuts the credibility of the white house in taking their word when they say things happened. the white house said the conversation with the australian prime minister was not contentious, we know it was quite contentious. and with the members an president we see the president of the united states saying this big campaign promise i made on building a wall and make mexico pay for it is the least important thing that we'll talk about, politically i need you to back me up. i think they were illuminating but i can understand why the administration and some foreign policy hands who are not particularly allies of president trump are concerned about the fact that they were leaked.
>> dickerson: and allies or people the other end of the line have to know this. >> there are things that are secret for a reason i think private conversations between world leaders historically would be one of those things. >> dickerson: jennifer, any downside, any risk, cause for the leak about the wall where the president said, this isn't as such an important issue but politically it might be, you may not have to pay for it at all, do you think he pays any penalty? >> i do know some republicans pointed out that he was more interested in calling the media criticism of how going to pay for it than the actual wall policy itself. >> dickerson: jamelle, i that seemed reasonable, you say we got to arrange this behind the scenes, we'll work it out together but don't put me in a box out in public. did we learn anything? seems like the president was1eñ trying to negotiate.
negotiating, did we learn anything about his negotiating talent? >> in the conversation with the mexican president, that exchange actually was sort of point in favor of trumps negotiating skill trying to figure out a way that no one has to lose face here. but the conversation with the australian prime minister i found very disturbing, not only because of that, it showed profound ignorance of the issues at stake, australian prime minister is patiently trying to explain to the president that -- who these refugees are, what the issue is and the president doesn't seem to be able to grasp it and keeps on retreating back to campaign slogans. while i'm sympathetic to the idea that these conversations needed to be private, it was good that we as the public saw this, because it is worrisome that the president cannot seem to hold cogent policy conversation with another head of state in a serious way. it is also true that the
conversation was a real master class in how very successful -- approach to immigration has worked and proven doable. what he said is, look, i will be happy to take central american refugees from the united states. we're making very clear we will notable september anyone from one with clarity and consistency. what happened in australia is that the -- they were forced with that. why, because it was clear and consistent both in a way donald trump came away from that experience one hopes that turnbull figured out a way to talk about this issue that has achieved a surprisingly broad consensus despite having pretty contentiousness. >> donald trump was taking that message -- >> it's very -- member of the administration he has elevated most it is john kelly. what distinguishes john kelly. he's taken the most contentious
aspect of the trump domestic a he general darks one of the most contentious, immigration, able to talk about it in a fairly plausible way in which he emphasized i'm talking to the front line folks, the officials in department of homeland security and border enforcement this is still contentious it hasn't stopped being that. he managed to be clear and consistent. if this is what john kelly manages to get through to the president and i think it's possible that he will, that will be a very big marked change. >> dickerson: jamelles you about another thing that kelly did this week, got rid of anthony scare much aye. the public reassurance for general sessions that his job was not in danger. sending signals to the attorney general of course but maybe to others as well. putting him in the dog house, not sure how to describe that. his criticism of the attorney general rattled republican allies on the hill. very much attempt of the staff
to say, listen, he's not going anywhere. these relationships are secure and we need to be able to begin to work together to get something through. it is worth noting that we're in august of the president's first year, there's no major legislation that the president has signed. and that i think has to be weighing on both people within the administration and on the will. >> dickerson: jennifer, h.r. mcmaster, there was this blooming in -- i don't know which corner of the internet to claim all of these stories were coming from but they came fast and hard over the last week. what do you make of it, the president came out defended his national security advisor, helped people understand the tea leaves and why this is important. >> yeah, that's exactly right. general kelly did encourage trump to stand by mcmaster just to see him behind jeff sessions, it's true, reporting is true that there is a little bit of a conflict between mcmaster and steve bannon, trump's chief strategist. some people in the administration see mcmaster,
got some philosophical, professor type who preaches, talks down to the president, he irks some people. but i've been told several people have said that kelly is neutral on him right now he's waiting to see how he fits in with the team, how he fits in with president trump so he's standing with him. >> dickerson: the president this week got -- everybody got good news on the economy, unemployment at 16-year lo lot about the stock market and record times in the last month. is the success of t forgotten mn that the president said his campai ao? >> this strikes me as a serious mistake, sus mistakes as well as political mistake. it's analytical mase mist corporations may well do -- may do well at the expens if you have a tight labor market that is bad news for corpor ofits. i think -- certainly saw very
robust and healthy corporate >> dickerson: tight labor market means higher wages. >> exactly. i think it's a fixate on that. there was this theory idea of the investor class. people have 401(k) andthis is ag when the stock market does well the country as a whole does well. the truth is there's not very much every for that, there's not very much evidence that every a 401(k) oftentimes very tiny, has some appreciable affect how you look at the economy. but emphasizing the value of everything a tight labor market. talking, we're not going move to a hard money policy at the fed. we actually want more robust growth even fit means more inflation in the short term. that's the kind of policy that would resonate, that would also be more sense fribble his perspective. he really depend on obama-trump voters. this was a small sliver. electorates but all important in flipping states in the blue wal.
those are the voters who are falling away from them. those are voters who don't respond terribly well to an economic message that seems fixated on how well the stock market is doing. >> dickerson: plus, susan, what goes up can come down. >> dangerous in that way. we blame presidents when things go wrong in the economy whether they deserve it or not so they get credit when the economy does well with the record stock market in these very low unemployment rates. we've seen the president's approval rating erode into the mid 30s which is really a catastrophic level historically for a president at this point w. would it be if he didn't have a booming stock market and low unemployment. he has been quite fortunate in the fact that the economy, hasn't -- not everything is fixed but economy -- we haven't had a very serious foreign policy crisis to undercut him. that will happen on one front or the other at some point. what happens to president trump at this point. >> dickerson: jamelle, picking up on the point about democrats, that white working class voter.
a piece in the "new york times," when the president appeals as he appears to be on cultural are issues to his base, nothing to do with the economy s locked ino the president that when the whesident is talking about this week or talking about reducing legal immigration. at a hold on those voters and democrats have rolled out a new approach to them are back. >> i think it's bf analysis of e electorate last year suggeste te appealed to them on these cultural issues, on immigration, on perceptions but also blurredn on infrastructure, on the economy. hillary clinton proposed billion infrastructure plan, should, should be a trillion dollars. for these vors culturally conservative but want active government th magic mix for them. it's a real threat to his standing with thosehe is not dee
economic side. i think some of the them stay because he's delivering on cultural side. i don't think it's an accident that approval rating in the 30s. he's rolling out policies on affirmative action and on immigration. but the economic part is important, too. >> dickerson: we'll have to end it l. thanks to all of you. we'll be back in a moment. fios is not cable. we're a 100% fiber optic network. and with the new fios gigabit connection... you get our fastest internet ever. with download speeds up to 940 megs - 20 times faster than most people have. switch to fios gigabit connection with tv and phone for $79.99 a month online for the first year. plus hbo for one year and multi-room dvr service for two years,
>> dickerson: we pay tribute to a man who was an important part of the 62-year history of "face the nation" and a friend to many of us here at cbs. bob villerlli died last sunday at the age of 86. it started in the mail room at cbs in new york in 1953. became a producer and then a director. he traveled the world for the network but was based here in washington. in this building, for almost 30 years. he directed history from the cbs control room major events ranging from the 161 mercury flight which led to the first man in space to the funerals of john k. kennedy and martin luther king to the watergate
hayracksings. from our "face the nation" control room in the washington bureau he led this broadcast for 22 years. vit will be missed but his view of history will be preserved forever, right here each week. new charmin ultra soft! it's softer than ever. new charmin ultra soft is softer than ever... so it's harder to resist. okay, this is getting a little weird. enjoy the go! with charmin!
presentation for crepe erase, g is a paid the number one anti-aging body treatment system for crepey skin! (male announcer) that can deliver stunning results on your arms, your legs, your hands, your chest, and even your neck! (female announcer) featuring legendary actress and crepe erase success story, jane seymour! (soft music) crepey skin makes me feel...old. (cindy) i am really sick of looking down and wondering what happened to me. (belinda) i feel like i'm missing out on life because of my skin. i want a change. hi, i'm jane seymour. have you ever had a moment in your life when you find something that changes everything? well, my epiphany was an anti-aging body treatment system that actually made my skin look years younger! it's called crepe erase,