tv News Nation MSNBC May 8, 2013 11:00am-12:01pm PDT
developing news out of cleveland, ohio. gina dejesus, one of the women held captive in that dilapidated home, a few miles from where they were abducted, is expected to arrive home no her own family for the first time in ten years. by her own account, dejesus was on her way home in 2004 when a man in a van pulled up and offered her a ride, beginning ten years of torment. we expect the cleveland police department to repeat a summary of what the women told them. it is a nightmarish house of horrors, according to police. the women were bound if chains and ropes in separate rooms throughout their captivity. police sources also say that women have told them of repeated sexual and physical abuse as well as multiple pregnancies and miscarriages. just hours ago, amanda berry and her 6-year-old daughter were welcomed by cheers as she returned home for the first time
of the home belonging to her sister, beth. a chaotic scene emerged as beth gave a short statement saying thank you for support and to ask for privacy. some neighbors claimed that police were called several times over the years to ariel castro's house after women were seened chained maked naked in the back. suspects say they too are shocked by horrible allegations and are asking for forgiveness. >> this family is suffering a great sadness to know that these girls have suffered at the hand of family members of ours. and we would certainly like to say to those three young women that we are so sorry for everything they had to endure. >> nbc news craig melvin joins us. craig, i know there is a lot of activity on the scene and we are also waiting.
we are told that gina dejesus could arrive at her family's home very soon. another similar scene as we saw earlier with amanda's home with the balloon os and folks waiting for this moment. craig? >> reporter: again, we're waiting on gina dejeesdejeeenin. there is also a prayer vigil expected at any moment. formal charges are expected between new and 6 of okay. we are expecting formal charges in the case, we are hearing that kidnapping and rape will be the two most prominent charges. at this point it is unclear whether all three castro brothers will face the charges or if it is just 52-year-old ariel castro. he is the man that investigators say is the mastermind, the ringleader, if you will. you referenced some of the neighbors complaints off the top of the broadcast. i want it bring in israel lugo. he is one of the neighbors who called 911, is that right? >> yes, sir.
>> 2011. >> 2011, say november. >> what did you see and what did the police tell you when you called? >> i didn't see anything. my sister came over and said she saw a little girl and lady and the little girl in the lady's hands and they were upstairs stretched in metal. you can't see nothing through the house. the house god boards on the window and paint, and i couldn't see nothing. i told the police and said there was suspicious going on up in the house. >> you called the police? >> yes. >> when did they say. >> maybe 20 minutes went by or something like that. a cop car approached the house. they got out, they really pounded on the door, pound, pound, pound. >> police pounded on the door. >> no answer. they flashed the light inside the drive way, didn't see nothing. got back in the car and left. >> that was in 2011? >> yes. >> have you heard the reports over the past day or so from police who have said that there were no -- there were not ult ip el calls to 911. >> yes, i heard.
>> what is your response to that? >> that's a bunch of bs. >> all right, israel lugo, who lives about 40 yards away. one of the neighbors again who claims that he called 911. in addition to waiting for the formal charges and awaiting for another news conference this afternoon, we are also told that investigators are going to be talking to the plea women who were held captive about ashley summers. ashley summers would be 20 years old now. she would have been 14 when she went missing. ashley summers lives in this neighborhood. at this point investigators are not saying there is some sort of definitive connection between summers and the castro home. but they do want to talk to these three women and ask them whether at any point they may have seen ashley summers. but as you mentioned, we're starting to hear some of the preliminary interviews with the three women. they paint a very grim pictures. one of the details, that is probably most striking, according to police, these women
did not see a single adult outside that home for a decade. a decade. according to police. >> thank you very much. let me bring in crime reporter egoda. there is a lot to go through but there is information, including gene gentlem gina dejesus, was casually walking home and someone approached in a van and asked if she wanted a ride. ten years later she is finally coming home. >> ten years later. you saw it earlier today when we saw amanda was going to speak out when she was brought home. she is now with her sister. fortunately, which is actually a good thing, she decided not to speak. and sort of absorb what was going on. her sister came outside, addressed the media. now we have another, gina, she is coming home, thank goodness. that is a wonderful outcome, ten years later, unfortunately. so long of a time. i do want to mention, i did pull
a report earlier from ariel castro's ex-wife, a domestic violence claim. what is outlined in this report is simply unbelievable. it goes from saying that her ribs were broke -- her nose was broke twice. her ribs. she had a knocked out tooth. blood clot on her brain inop rarl. dislocated shoulder. not once, but twice. he also threatened to allegedly kill her and her daughter a number of times. and this was in 2005. also in this particular report, she claims that he would keep the children, he would go and abduct their children for long periods of time. that's 2005. these other abductions, 2000, 2003, 2004. >> the new york post is reporting that arii ariel castr daughter is behind bars, after attempted suicide and attempting
to cut the throat of her daughter who was 8 or 11 months old at the time, in this violent attack witnessed by family members. >> that's right. there is that report that is out there. she is apparently incarcerated. he does have other children. another son, anthony. who said that he has spoken out and said i was at the house as soon as just a couple of weeks ago. i was not allowed inside. he did have contact with his father. i have dissected ariel castro's page where he has gone on social media and basically said that i have five grandchildren and it seems like a happy person and was uploading pictures of his base guitar. >> this is on his facebook page with you are saying? >> yes. very active in the community. so he was a presence. it is not like he was a recluse and someone that stayed on the inside. this is someone who would go out and be in public and go around people and be with his family. and you know, correspond with other people. so the fact that these young girls -- and if there are other
people missing women that are connected to this case, it would not be surprising at all. and again, just as craig melvin mentioned, awaiting the charges to come down, investigators have 488 hours to file particular charges. once they come down this evening, they will be arraigned tomorrow morning and then it'll be sent to the grand jury. >> hang on. i want to bring in peter krause. he is on the scene there. peter, first, let me talk about this police investigation. we just had a guy on, israel lugo, who says that in 2011, he didn't actually see someone in the home, but one of his relatives saw a woman holding a child pounding on the window and that 911 was called by him. not by someone he knew, personally he called. what can you tell me as it relates to police investigating, if there were any missteps? >> well, i can't substantiate
that claim at all. i have heard the claim by the neighbor that was seen. but like i say, i don't think the police have any report of that, so i can't substantiate that. what we do have is fairly new information that, which we posted on cleveland.com, as to the way these women were held in captivity. we recently learned that the 6-year-old child was born in an inflatable bathtub while in captivity. we have learned that the women were sometimes taken from the home in disguises by ariel castro. we have learned that the women were kept upstairs and downstairs, that some of the doors had holes in them where things could be slid through without opening the doors, such as food. that there were locks on many of the doors and that sometimes ariel castro -- >> hey, peter, let me stop you real quick. i want to hear your report. can you tell me what is happening behind you? we hear applause.
what is going on there? >> i believe that's a vigil going on. they want to move down the street in front of the house. i'm not sure they can do that. they are holding an impromptu vigil right now. i assume, in recognition of the women rescued and perhaps others. >> back to the details. the women say and your paper is reporting that they were taken from the home in disguise. what else can you tell me about those details? >> well, we don't know the nature of those disguises. all we know from our sources, two of our reporters have reported on cleveland.com, that sources have told them this is the case, that ariel castro would sometimes take the women from the house and that they were in disguises, but we don't have detail of what kind of disguises they were.
and also we understand the child was sometimes taken from the home as well while the women remained in the house. >> and regarding the birth of at least the 6-year-old child, that happened in the home and the police report indicates there have been multiple pregnancies and multiple miscarriages, now that we learned from the police report itself, right? >> i have not -- i don't know where the source of that information is about the multiple miscarriages. i heard that rumor as far as i know that is unsubstantiated. i'm not aware of that being on a police report. >> okay. this th is coming from police as i understand it directly. that's part of the report they are putting together that has come out. i believe it is not a rumor. it is information that's come out from the police report itself. let me good to michelle segona, if michelle is still there. michelle, are you still there? >> i'm here, tamron. >> some of the details pete oer just pointed out for example, and it reminds me of elizabeth smart and the man that took her.
was walking down the street and would have hefr cover her face and she was simply too afraid to do anything. this may be a similar situation with these women in that they were taken out of the home in disguise, hiding them in plain sight. we heard the same thing with elizabeth smart. >> yes. elizabeth smart and even j jaycee dugard. she would go out in the yard and phillip even took the children that jaycee has and even to the campus of berkeley. again, i understand politically correct, these three men have not been charged yet. these are alleged incidents, i understand that. but it almost appears from past incidents that they get this sense of entitlement. that they can just, abduct these women, and just take them out in broad daylight and just have them be someone else. and then bring them back into
the home. >> michelle, perhaps the fear, we know elizabeth smart from her account and talked about how she would walk past people hoping this would get a glimpse of her and she was consumed by fear of what would happen. >> same thing with shawn hornbeck. and even after michael devlin kidnapped dawn omby, they are in fear. they are in fear because they are threatened with their lives, their family lives are threatened. their families' lives are threatened as well. they are threatened with food. threatened with all types of different things. and so they do become attached, unfortunately, to the abductor. and there is a connection made there. and at this point from what we have learned so far, it anears these men may have been the only person that they knew, that they knew and depended on to get food or resources or anything of that nature. of course they will obey. we may learn more about, i cover
so many of the sex slave cases. and so how these women and the mind-set that goes into all of this, and how they are brain washed and taken under and held captive. >> all right, thank you very much. peter krouse, thank you as well. we will bring you developments as the police bring it. next on "news nation" -- >> these witnesses deserve to be heard. on the benghazi attacks, the flaws and the accountability review boards methodology, process and conclusion. >> what we have seen over the past two weeks is a full scale media campaign that is not designed to investigate what happened in a responsible and bipartisan way. >> testimony on capitol hill right now into the benghazi attacks. self-described whistle-blowers giving their version of what happened. and join our conversation on twitter. you can find out on tamronhall
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developing now new reaction to an emotional and heated capitol hill hearing on the attacks in benghazi. the hearing is continuing right now and has now been going on for about three hours. three self-described whistleblowers are testifying before the house oversight and government reform committee. the hearing is the latest in a long running and bitter dissput between the white house and congressional republicans who accuse the administration of a cover-up. but ranking member democratic elijah cummings of maryland has a response to those allegations. >> what we have seen over the past two weeks is a full scale
media campaign that is not designed to investigate what happened in a responsible and bipartisan way but rather a launch of unfounded accusations to smear public officials. let me be clear, i'm not questioning motives of our witnesses. i'm questioning the motives of those who want to use their statements for political purposes. >> soon after one of the witnesses referred to, eric nordstrom, delivered his opening statement. >> the committee's labors to uncover what happened prior, during and after the attack matter. it matters to me personally. and it matters to my colleagues, to my colleagues at the department of state. it matters to the american public for whom we serve and most importantly -- excuse me.
it matters to the friends and family of ambassador stevens, shawn smith, glenn dougherty and tyrone woods who were murdered on september 11th, 2012. >> joining me now, pennsylvania congressman, democrat and member of the committee that held the hearing today, thank you so much congressman for your time. republicans have said these witnesses will bring to the table new information that, in a sense, would make the case that they have attempted to make and that this is some type of cover-up. was that proven today? . >> tamron, it is nice to be on the show. i have to say, i am a proud member of the house oversight and government reform committee. this has is work that all of us, democrats and republicans, take seriously because it has broad, broad jurisdiction. we look into every kind of
conceivable misdeed or misstatement made by the government. that's part of our job. and so, i came to this hearing this morning having heard the press accounts, things that were leaked to this news agency, that news agency, listening to those things, i expected a real bomb shell to come out today. and i lit rlly sat on the end of my seat, listening for the bomb shells to come out and tamron, they didn't happen. there was no news today. there was nothing to do that we didn't already know about. now i want to tell you, i honor all of us on the panel, we honor the sacrifices made by these witnesses, their commitment to our country, and the truthfulness of the testimony as well. but really there wasn't anything new that we hadn't already seen before and that hadn't already been rehashed again and again. so there isn't much news today, tamron. >> it is interesting you say that republican bob corker, top
republican on the senate relations committee was also asked about this hearing and if there was any more that could be revealed and he said that he was fairly satisfied in his words. i've been able to read all the cables. i've seen all the films. i feel like i know what happened in benghazi. i'm fairly satisfied. senator bob corker, republican out of tennessee, his comments there. if there was no bomb shell in your opinion today, what do you believe was or is the motivation for yet another hearing led by republicans? >> well, you know, we have all heard the expression making a mountain out of a mole hill. they don't do that in washington today. they make a mountain out of nothing at all. >> is that fair to say that it is nothing at all? are there still legitimate questions to ensure that this never happens again? it seems to some, i'm sure,
called here a mountain out of a mole hill. lives were lost. and improvements, i'm sure, need to be made to make sure this doesn't happen again. >> you are totally right, tamron. the fact is, those have already been developed, the accountability review board went through everything. they were quite critical of the security measures that were in place in benghazi. and steps have already been taken to improve those situations. so the point is, sure, it wasn't that there was nothing at all to begin with. but those things have been called over. they've been combed through. and changes have been made to remedy these situations. so, we are really, and just to make sure i completely mix my metaphors, we are really beating a dead horse once again. and really a complete waste of time this morning in my view. >> congressman matt cartright,
thank you for your time. i appreciate it. >> you bet. >> thank you so much for joining us, pj, greatly appreciate it. >> sure. >> you heard congressman cartright there, he was waiting on the edge of his seat, boj shell, big revelation, that perhaps would have people saying, hey, we need to pause and look more. we know that state department was certainly scolded for access. we've heard a lot of this before, but was there anything game changing from the whistleblowers today, in your opinion? >> i think it is surprising that after eight months we are arguing over talking points. we did lose four americans on september 11th and whether it is four americans in benghazi, 4,000 in iraq, we should continue to ask questions over what could have been done better and what lessons do we learn from this. i want it pick up on something you said, tamron, a minute ago about trying to make sure this
never happens again. security is vitally important but it can never be 100% without compromising the ability of the people, with doing what they were trying to do. even tripoli or benghazi. with the overthrow of khadafi, and moving around to try to influence libya, he understood the risks better than anybody else. so we are going to lose good people in dangerous situations. whether in conflict or post conflict situations. and we should always try to find out, can we provide the best security as possible. >> that's in any terror attack. we are looking at boston for example. we know there can't be a camera on every corner and we will never be 100% secure as civil n civilians. so you know as a diplomat in an area of great conflict, there are risks. but if t is legitimate, especially given things that came out in the review of the state department's actions to tick a step back and certainly
have hearings and certainly have a, a level of critical thinking when it comes to this. but i think what happened now, pj, with these hearings, it comes off to most people. and i have talked to republicans and democrats who are not on the extreme who see this as political gainsmanship. especially when you say, witnesses were going to come and bring it and this will be a game-changer and it goes up like a lead balloon. >> sure. we have used today's hearing for whistle-blowers, and mr. nordstrom testified openly before. mr. hicks testified before the accountability review board and i think the third witness offered himself to the board but for whatever reason i don't think that he testified before the board. it is hard for me to see, there is a matter of testimony where
mr. hicks gave a compelling account of what happened during the course of the attack. that's important stuff for people to see and here. there is an element of this that is legitimate. as you see, a lot of it moves into politics. certainly the ongoing discussion about talking points and what i think is a real canard which is the actions of a cover-up. >> pj crowly, thank you for joining us. still ahead, from down the trail it back up. >> i'm one perfect man saved by god's grace but one who has a conviction on the importance of doing something about spending in washington, d.c. >> mark sanford gives a round of victory interviews after last night's big win. i'll talk with nbc senior political editor mark murray about the election's big take away. ♪ [ female announcer ] from more efficient payments. ♪ to more efficient pick-ups. ♪
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to former south carolina gov governor mark sanford's win. the newspaper called him the new come back kid following his 2009 extra marital affair but before the congressman heads to washington, he has it appear in court tomorrow to face charges of trespassing at his ex-wife's home. joining me live, nbc political editor mark murray. i think that is of cower the irony of all this here. mark sanford had his victory lap this morning but he is in court tomorrow. it is the yin and yang of his political career. >> this is mark sanford dating back to 2009. he was considered as someone who might challenge president obama in 2012 race. then he had the appalachian trail, the affair with the mistress and as after couple
months ago, people thought he would not win the republican run-off to get the republican nomination. he won that and faced adversity against democrat elizabeth colbert bush, he ended up winning. one thing for sure, he will be back in washington, d.c. >> one thing is for sure, his relationship with his party will be interesting in that the republican establishment pretty much abandoned him as far as money and support. he was asked about that this morning by matt lauer on the today show. let me play it. >> democrats took shots at you, your own party walked away from you in terms of support for your campaign. so who are your friends? >> my friends are the voters who were up last night, the district and i will have plenty of friends in washington, d.c. i look forward to working with republicans, democrats, you name it.
>> he goes in owing nobody and as far as how he moves ahead he will work with anyone. is this a different mark sanford or is he still, i guess the more strided conservative that his supporters would like to see? >> he does go in owing almost no one. he won this race by shimself. mark sanford was able to win by himself. so in some respects he could be a free agent. though i wouldn't expect him aligning with dem krts at all. but one thing that mark sanford has to look forward to is 2014. that's when he would be up for reelection. i wouldn't be surprised if he tries to -- if he gets a credible opponent on his right in a primary fight. >> just a quick follow-up mark, immigration reform, as i understand it, tomorrow we begin the mark-up of the bill. is that case? >> this is tamron. it'll be a long journey.
probably won't have a conclusion until july or august. but this is the big committee action where you are adding and voting on amendments then you end up having a vote at senate judiciary committee maybe several days after the fact. if that goes, it would move to the senate floor. this will be a long wild ride. >> okay, mark murray, thank you very much. we will talk with you tomorrow, mark. thank you. right now the dow is around record territory after closing above 15,000 for the first time ever. we will talk with cnbc's tyler mathisen about where stocks could go from here. for a final . this is for real this time. step seven point two one two. verify and lock. command is locked. five seconds. three, two, one. standing by for capture. the most innovative software on the planet... dragon is captured. is connecting today's leading companies to places beyond it.
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has been covering this story for us. diana, were you there. >> reporter: yes, as you said, there is a verdict in this case. they will read it at 4:30 eastern, 1:30 pacific. they could go with first degree murder, second degree murder, manslaughter, hung jury or she could be acquitted. >> this jury consists of eight men and four women and they've heard testimony from jodi arias personally in great detail. she describes her relationship with her boyfriend at the time as one that was violent. she claims she killed him in self-defense, diana. but this case has captivated so many people following trials in the courts and because of the jury. she stabbed him 22 times. cut his throat. shot him. went to his home to do all this and maintaines it was because
she was the victim of do mest uk violence here. what are some of the reactions in and around there now that we know a verdict has come down? >> well, you know, i've been hanging out outside the courthouse this entire time and talking to spectators an find oing out what they have to say. i can tell you the vast majority of people outside the courthouse are convinced of her guilt. they will not be satisfied unless it is murder 1. they have told me they feel as though the prs koutor juan martinez was travis alex and are's voice from beyond the grif and that he was doing justice for travis alexander and they will not be satisfied unless jodi arias gets the death penalty. i've ahad a lot of exchanges on twitter. this has been discussed over social media and many people that reached out to me -- >> i think we just lost diana -- we hope to get her back -- we had technical issues there. but the breaking news now is that there is a verdict in the
jodi arias trial. we will hear that verdict at 1:30 pacific time. that's 4:30 eastern time. about two hours from now. diana is back to us. let's go back to closing arguments. that's the last time we had you on and we spoke about the difference if strategy from the prosecution to the defense and what they presented in their final, i guess, day with the jury. >> this was their last chance to leave a lasting impression on that jury p. this is a jury taking notes, paying attention to what they have been saying. i watch had jurors as they watch the prosecutor and defense attorney and they were hanging on every word that each of those gentlemen said. let's talk about prosecutor juan martinez. what he did is he came out softer. he was talking about having respect for the memory of travis alexander. he was walking through through every detail of the crime scene, try oing to leave a lasting impression that jodi arias is a manipulator, liar and killer. the very next day we heard from
ki kirk nurmi who painted a different scene. he was more folksy. he was talking about what kind of person jodi arias was. about the kinds of things she suffered through out her life. about her relationships and the way travis alexander treated her. we were told about graphic texts. we heard phone sex recordings, all designed to make it seem like travis alexander was not so innocent himself. he wanted the jury to see jodi arias as a battered woman suffering from ptsd who acted out of self-defense. we will hear what this jury ultimately close to believe but they have a tough task ahead of them. right now three women on death row here in arizona. jodi arias could be the next. this is a jury that took its time and yesterday i heard back from people on twitter, why don't we have a verdict yet? what is taking so long. i respond, this is a death penalty case.
they need to deliberate this. they have one shot to get this right. and the whole world is watching. >> let me put you on hold, diana. another breaking story. gina dejesus is in the vehicle her family is arriving. you hear the cheers of people in front of her family's home. she have been reunited with her after ten long years. gina was 14 years old. walking, when she was offered a ride according to police, by a stranger, casual offer for a ride. and she was never to return again to her family until this day. ten years later. she is now with her family. not very far from where she initially disappeared. you see the balloons there in front of the family's home. and a number of media personnel, media folks behind the yellow tape and neighbores who have come to get a glimpse of gina. we are expecting to hear from a sister or family member. you see the em bris there.
you can imagine for these many years they wondered if she was still alive if they would ever see her again. a young girl, 14 years old, a teenager, kid, who vanished wut trace from her family. she was also the focus of a national search, america's most wanted actually did a story on her disappearance in hopes of getting any kind of clue as to what happened to this 14-year-old girl who was walking. and in a twist in this story, gina dejesus is actually friends or had been a friend, one of the suspects, primary suspect, in this case, his daughter. in fact, ariel castro's daughter was interviewed for america's most wanted and talked about having seen gina the day of her disappearance. one of the most bizarre twists in this story that is already inimaginable. i'm not sure if -- you see someone raising their arm in a yellow hoody there. being hugged by the woman. in the orange t-shirt.
and assume that is gina dejesus. hopefully we can get confirmation. but from the body language and you heard the cheers and the individual raising her arm to the sky, it would be my best guess that is gina dejesus there. we expect to hear from this family. as we get more details. the police report and news information, new information obtained by nbc news, these women, including gina, were kept in separate rooms, chained and locked in those rooms, according to reports. they were raped and physically abused over ten years. multiple pregnancies and miscarriages as a result of these years of torture in this home. more neighbors are now saying that they saw suspicious things. for example, neighbors say they would see one of the suspects bring in loads of food and he was supposed to be living in this home alone. and they would see him bring in food and wonder why would one person need to bring in so much if he was there alone.
these strange things, now that people are processing in hindsight, but prior to the next door neighbor charles ramsey seeing one of the survivors screaming for help, screaming to be saved, these women were trapped in a living hell in that cleveland, ohio home. this is the scene right now. we also saw the similar scene at amanda berry's home. her sister came out a couple hours ago asking for the family's privacy saying they would talk in their own time and when they are able to. jaycee dugard also talking about the life adjustment that these women will experience in different ways, trying to reclaim the life stolen from them. we are also awaiting formal charges of the three men under arrest but not formally charged in this case who allegedly were part of this disturbing story in this neighborhood in cleveland.
we don't know exactly if all three brothers or if one will be formally charged today but we are awaiting a new development in that part of this investigation as well. throwing in the mix, at the top of this hour, again in green there, lime green hoody, we believe that is gina dejesus being hugged by her family and escorted to her home for the first time in ten years. we spoke with our own ken griffey jr. melvin spoke with a neighbor who says in 2011, one of his relatives saw a woman in the top window of the house of horrors, as it is called, beating on, pounding on the window holding a child. he claims that police came to the home, looked around and left. all of this is part of the investigation as to how this could go on for so long. but the great news today, is that two of the women be gene gentleman dejesus and amanda berry are with their families, safe inside the homes of their families. you can only imagine what it is like for them and what has been an unimaginable story that
unfolded. it seems like rapid speed. that we are getting details of just how sad and heart breaking it has been for them for ten years. craig melvin is standing by. craig, we saw that video of the person, a very petite person, in that green hoody. as i said to our audience, my guess is that that is gina. just from the body language there. what can you tell me is going on at the scene? >> you know what, we are actually about ten minutes, 15 minutes from that scene. but i tell you what is most striking about this, tamron, is again, as we reported earlier, based on the initial conversations with the three women who were being held captive, they have not seen an adult outside that house in roughly a decade. so for gina dejesus to arrive home to this type of homecoming, to the balloons, to the flowers, to the cheering crowds, this is, one would imagine, this is
overcoming to say the least. and perhaps you can also hear behind me in the background here, tamron, there was a vigil earlier at the top of your newscast. there is a second vigil that has popped up, if you will, outside the castro home here in cleveland. pastors, community leaders, the salvation army, children, elderly, they all gathered here. they are praying for the neighborhood and praying, they said they are praying for the families, for these three women as well. and there is a special prayer for charles ramsey. of course, the neighbor who was eating his mcdonald's when amanda berry came knocking. >> craig, i will get you to stand by. federal law enforcement officials say investigators are a long way from figuring out what went on in the house. federal officials acknowledge that chains and other restraining devices were found there but say it is far from clear when and on whom they were used. and they have asked about reports of several pregnancies
and beatings resulting in miscarriages and officials said quote, we've heard that. some of the girls, some of the family members, we are trying to sort it all out. that is new information from a federal official who is working on this investigation. now let me take you back to the other breaking news story, the jodi arias verdict. we will hear the verdict at 4:30 eastern time. i have got karen desoto, attorney with me, as well as diana alvear. i think a lot of people grapple with this and people at home, attorneys if you will, will you look at facts of the case that travis alexander was stabbed 27 times. shot in the head. his throat slit ear to ear. his body found in his shower. after the investigation police discovered that it was jodi arias. she never denied killing him but she said it has all been a
self-defense issue for her. when you read the details of this, the salacious relationship on and on, i think that's a part of why people have been captiva captivated. but as an attorney when you look at this case, you have to wonder, how does someone beat a case when the details of how you murdered the person so graphic, and so vicious. >> you know, tamron, it is interesting. i think one of the reasons cases like this are so intriguing is because the defendant in this case is young, she's pretty. there are a lot of salacious details like sexting and role playing and with the ever-ending confessions and now the self-defense, which i can tell you as an attorney from experience, self-defense an battered wife syndrome are probably two of the most difficult defenses. because juries have a hard time believing in those and the battered wife syndrome is psychologically very hard for
people to understand why you wouldn't just walk out of situation or get away from the situation. as an attorney, i can tell you, anyone who stabs, shoots and slashes somebody in such a manner as this you would think is a slam dunk, right, tamron? but as we have seen from a lot of cases like we thought, like casey anthony for instance, we thought for sure there would be a verdict not in her favor there. all you need is one juror to believe maybe she was under some type of infloueinfluence. there is a lot of lesser included defenses. so that's one reason, tamron, it might be taking so long. because there is manslaughter, second degree, a lot of things for them to mull over and go over. >> to your point, the jury will consider or did consider first and second degree murder or manslaughter against arias in this case. and in closing arguments, karen, her attorney, jodi arias's attorneys, admitted that sometimes he doesn't like her. which is a strange thing to say. but he went on to explain just because you may see her as a
person that is not likeable or certain things in her personal life that she participated in, were not necessarily things you would find appealing, that that does not mean that she murdered this man and that she is just a vicious killer. >> it is very hard in a case like this tamron, especially when the jurors were able to ask 200 questions. it is very hard to separate the actions from their credibility -- >> let me get to you pause. i want to explain that. it is something unique to arizona where the jury can actually ask questions of the defendant. >> yes. another reason tamron why this case went on forever is because in arizona the jurors are allowed it ask questions. other jurisdictions only allow the jurors to ask a limited amount. there is only a few in the country that allow jurors to actually ask questions. in this case, there were over 200 questions which is very intriguing to attorneys and to the public because it is always interesting to see what jurors are asking. but that is one of the reasons why this case took so long.
she was on the stand for a very long time and then when you do have a situation or you're in a jurisdiction where you are allowed to ask questions, you then, both sides, get to then again rehabilitate their witness by asking the more and more questions which let it play on for another few weeks in this case. >> diana, are you still with us there in phoenix? >> yes. >> let's talk about jodi arias and at least her confession. she did not initially confess or initially say this was an issue of self-defense for her, right? snrs fz she did not. at first she claims she didn't realize travis alexander was dead then went on to make up a story about two masked intruders that came into the house. and was so full of details about this story. even saying they pointed a gun to her and pulled the trigger and it went click and nothing happened. and she was able to get away and she got away as far as she could and didn't go back to help travis. all this went by the way side
two years later when she decided to claim self-defense. when you hear the defendant talking about different stories, different things and then saying, that's not the case. this is self-defense. it is that much harder for the public to accept that. let me tell you be in the court of public opinion, at least here at the courthouse and on twitter be she is guilty. and the people at the courthouse say they are not leaving until the verdict comes back as murder 1. on twitter it is just blowing up. people saying, this is the verdict we have been waiting for. it is interesting how it case is discussed on twitter. i covered casey anthony and i remember being in orlando and having multitudes of people there standing with signs and posters saying they wanted justice for caylee. that hasn't happened here. >> jodi arias stole her grand parent 25 caliber pistol, rented a car in redding, california.
she turned off her cell phone. brought along gas cans. just in case she ran out of gas to get there. the details of at least the planning here before she got to travis alexander's home, and killed him, are stunning. and when you talk about the self-defense plea that she is making or a claim she is making i should say, it does not gel easily when you lock at her actions, leading up to it. >> no, tamron, you're right, in the sense that jurors don't like holes. if you are going to argue obviously the prosecutor is arguing premeditated. it is very hard to argue self-defense. you're right, it doesn't add up and jurors don't like holes. but again, tamron, i can tell you from experience it takes one juror that is convinced that somehow she was under the influence of him, he was a
mormon and the sexting going on and it just takes the others to feel story tore her and put her to second degree, one of the defense strategies and put her on the stand. a lot of people say, why would you put them on the stand. well, if you knew your client is cooked, no pun intended, you put them on there an hopefully they can bond with the jury and maybe you -- >> that's what some people said happened. it humanized her with the jury when she was giving her testimony. thank you very much, karen. thank you diana as well. you were both fantastic. joining us with this breaking news verdict in the jodi arias trial where we should be hearing that around 4:30 eastern time also breaking news out of cleveland, ohio where two of the women trapped in that house of horrors are back with their family. we will continue to follow this. my friends at the cycle are up next.
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it'll be read in an hour and a half. that 4:30 eastern. and we will bring it to you live here on msnbc. first to the unfolding and fast-moving story out of cleveland. moments ago, gina dejesus who went missing nine years ago at age 14, moment ago arrived home. you can see neighbors and media arrived outside to greet her. earlier it was a chaotic scene as amanda berry and her 6-year-old daughter arrived home. amanda was expected to come out but instead her sister can came out. she briefly thanked the public and media for their support and also requested privacy. any or all of the suspects in the case, throw brothers, will likely be charged today. in fact it could happen at any time. we are learning a few more grizzly details about what they allegedly forced amanda berry, gene gentleman dejesus and michelle knight to endure as well as possibility after fourth wo