tv Meet the Press MSNBC March 10, 2014 1:00am-2:01am PDT
breaking news this sunday morning -- terrorism concerns and that missing malaysian airlines jet with 239 dead. the latest from the white house on what the u.s. knows. good sunday morning. such a difficult way to begin the program this morning, more on the investigation into the mysterious disappearance of that plane and the questions about foul play give than two passengers were traveling on stolen pass ports. pretty rare occurrence. and new reports that the plane may have tried to turn around. plus the latest on the crisis in
ukraine with russia tightening its grip on crimea. russian troops are in control of crimea and the parliament there is calling for a referendum on joining russia. president obama has to consider whether vladimir putin has already won this standoff. so how does he prevent the russian president from going even further? i'll be joined by one of the president's top foreign policy advisers in just a moment. then i want to talk about the pope francis effect. this week marks his one-year anniversary, and now that he's captivated the world and the world is listening, what will the pontiff do with his remarkable influence? in a revealing interview, cardinal timothy dolan, the a h archbishop of new york, talks about sex abuse and same-sex marriage. plus, fight for the control of gop. interesting politics this week. rand paul wins a straw poll of conservatives this weekend after declaring it is time to elect lovers of liberty. can he unify the party and take his message to a run for the white house? i'll be joined by our roundtable, and they're already
here, nbc's andrea mitchell, ron fournier, ralph reed, founder of the faith and freedom coalition, and karen bass from my native california. first latest on this horrible crash on this malaysian air flight. tom costello is with us with the latest on the investigation into the malaysian airliner. tom, what have you learned? what can you tell thus morning? >> reporter: hi, david. good morning. night has fall en in malaysia and authorities there have suspended the air search. meantime the malaysian military says its radar indicates the plane may have attempted to turn back saturday but there was never any distress call. malaysian authorities are also consulting with the fbi looking closely at the entire passenger manifest to see who was on this plane and what were their true identities. yesterday we learned two europeans, an austrian and an an italian, were listed as passengers on that plane but, in fact, they were safe and sound on the ground. both had reported their passports stole en in thailand over the past two years or so.
then this morning we learned there may be, underscore may be, two more passengers traveling on false documents. they're converging on this area in the gulf of thailand in the south china sea, the plane's last known location. on saturday the vietnamese military spotted two large fuel slicks on the water. now, it's not known if those are in any way connected to this missing 777, but it's all they have to go on at this moment so the search is concentrating in that area. three americans are among the 239 passengers and crew members including phillip wood, an ibm executive from texas. the plane, a boeing 777 200 series, nearly 12 years old, considered middle age for planes, in august of 2012 that very plane lost the tip of a wing after clipping another plane on the ground in shanghai. now, while that wing was repaired investigators will want to know whether that repair in any way contributed to the crash. clearly this is eerily similar to the air france flight 447
which disappeared over the atlantic in 2009 while search teams did find pieces of the wreckage, it took two years to find the body of the plane on the ocean floor, but that of course was an airbus a-330. this is a boeing 777. the only other fatal crash involving a boeing 777 was last summer, the asiana flight in san francisco. investigators believe that was a result of pilot error. this morning we have no idea where the plane is, no signs of wreckage, it is dark again, and now nearly 48 hours since this plane went missing. david? >> a lot to learn. tom costello, thanks so much. let me get more on this story and the crisis in ukraine, joined by president obama's deputy national security adviser. he's been with president obama in miami this weekend. he's been involved in major foreign policy decisions for two decades and was at the table in the white house situation room this week as president obama determined the u.s. response to the crisis in the ukraine. welcome to "meet the press." >> thanks, david.
good to have you. >> let me start on that malaysian airliner. are you worried this could be terrorism and what fueled that worry? >> david, first of all, our thoughts and prayers are with the families and those who have lost loved ones in this accident -- in this incident. we have three american citizens who are on board, many chinese and taiwanese. second, we're actively looking into all the questions that this raises. the fbi, the national transportation safety board, federal aviation agency, all of them are heading to the area to help in the investigation. lots of questions have been raised. we don't have the answers yet. we'll get them. >> the stolen passports, the fact there were two of them on one flight, if you're hearing this at home, that's got to be a red flag for the government, for investigators. >> it certainly raises concerns. that's why we're act live looking into it. there could be different explanations for what's involved. we don't want to be ahe could f of -- ahead of the facts.
>> let me talk tact crisis in ukraine. since this started the president and his top officials have issued what seem like line after line, and putin seems to have crossed them all? why does the president and the united states have so little influence over this? >> i think we've seen the president mobilizing the international community in support of ukraine, to isolate russia for its actions in ukraine, and to reassure our allies and partners. we've seen the president put together a major international support package. he's invited the ukrainian prime minister to come to the white house on wednesday to further demonstrate that support. in terms of isolating russia, what we've seen as a result of the mobilized support is the financial markets in russia have hit lows, the ruble has hit a low, investors are wondering whether to get involved in russia because of the instability, and all of that is exactly real cost and a real consequence. now -- >> i just want to challenge you on this point because my question is we've said don't do this or else and president putin
keeps doing it and more. so why doesn't the president have a greater ability to influence what putin does before he does it? >> the president's made clear and so have leaders from around the world including in europe, where we're closely coordinated, that russia has a choice going forward. kit continue down the path it's on and face much greater isolation and much greater cost, or kit take the opportunity to resolve this diplomatally in a way that addresses its concerns but restores ukraine's sovereignty. >> but he's not listening, and i think people watching this want to know why it is that the administration can't exert greater pressure on him to stop him before he does something. >> the cost is already significant, first of all. second, the president's made clear that going forward in coordination with our partners and allies we have in place a mechanism with sanctions to raise the cost significantly. but this is really a choice for the russians to make. they have to decide whether they want to resolve the diplomatally or whether they want to face
growing isolation, growing economic cost. right now what's happening -- >> i'm sorry. go ahead. you finish. i'm sorry. >> right now what's happening is that secretary of state kerry is engaged with his russian counterpart, foreign minister lavrov, european leaders are engaged with president putin as the president has been. the president spent the weekend on the phone with chancellor merkel of germany, president hollande of france, cameron of great britain, the italian prime minister, the three baltic leaders bringing together, martialing the work of the international community to continue to exert and increase the pressure on russia to do the right thing. >> i've been reading this morning "the washington post" lead story about how russia is saying, look, if you're going to sanction us economically, we'll do some things. we'll stop inspecting nuclear weapons in russia. that's part of an important nuclear treaty. how seriously do you take that threat? >> look, we've seen those reports. the russians haven't said anything to us about that directly. we haven't seen anything change in their practices.
we've had arms control agreements with the russians and indeed with the soviet union for decades and throughout the ups and downs of the relationship each side has made good on its commitment, so we'd expect to see russia do that. >> so here's the reality, and that is crimea is a week from today going to vote on joining russia. if the crimean people speak and they become part of russia, is the inkron to veritable fact that the russian aggression into ukraine are will stand? >> david, first, if there is a referendum and it votes to move crimea out of the ukraine and to russia, we won't recognize it and most of the world won't either. that's that one. second, were that to happen, the isolation of russia, the cost that it would take would increase significantly where they are now. but you have to step back and put this in a larger context. russia had a government in ukraine that it supported and that started to take very aggressive action against its own people. that government is gone. the government that's more
oriented toward the rest of the world and toward the west is in place, and so what you're seeing is i think putin acting from a position of weakness, concern, that ukraine was leaving russia's orbit. the bottom line, though, is it doesn't have to be in anyone's orbit. if ukraine succeeds economically, politically, integrated with the world, that would be good for russia and good for ukrainians. >> the question, though, is whether all options, even military options, are on the table should putin go further. there are a lot of baltic states who are a part of nato, other soviet republics in this region who are scared, thinking putin is not operating out of weakness, he's doing what he wants to do because he perceives weak frns the west, particularly from president obama. are all options on the table? are you saying to president putin, go no further or else, military options are on the table? >> david, what we're doing is bringing the world together to exert significant pressure on russia and to exert significant isolation on russia. understand this -- when putin thinks about maximizing russia's
power, what he's interested in is making sure that it has economic influence and global influence. and his actions and the actions we've taken in response are undermining that influence, undermining his economic influence, undermining its geopolitical influence. if the only way you have to exert your influence is through coercion and bribery and forcing people, that is not going to be a way to extend your power. and i think what you'll see in the days ahead as this moves forward is tremendous solidarity in coordination led by president obama among the international community to xertd a price and a cost if russia continues to move forward. but it does not need to be that way. there is a clear off ramp for russia that will take into account its concern, get the international inspectors in, get the two countries, russia and ukraine, talking directly, and then head toward elections on may 25th. russia says it has concerns about the legitimacy of the government in ukraine. that can be answered with the election on may 25th. meanwhile, the president is mobilizing international support for ukraine and working to
isolate russia if it persists in this course. >> top national security advisor to president obama, thanks so much for your time this morning. >> thanks very much, david. >> let me bring in congressman peter king, who's on the homeland security committee, in the house, of course. i want to get to the questions of terrorism in this malaysian flight, congressman, but i'm still not getting an answer from the administration on what the best offense is at this point against russia to stop him in his tracks, him being president putin. he's already crossed the line. there are people in the region worried about him doing more, and he may ultimately take crimea back into russia. what does the u.s. do about it? >> we have to make it clear there will be firm sanctions. i think we should freeze the assets of any of the russian oligarchs in this country, people close to putin. we have to increase military support for the baltic states, increase military support for hungary and make it clear these sanctions are going to be enforced. we have to make sure the allies are working together. tough ironclad sanctions on
russia. there's no silver bullet. we have to sustain it and keep it going. i think first thing to hit home would be to freeze the assets of russian oligarchs and top russians in this country and throughout the western world. >> is energy our best policy against them? do we say we're going to lift restrictions on exporting natural gas, we want to be a partner where you get your natural gas instead of russia. is that how to apply pressure on russia? >> that has to be an integral part of it. we have to increase exports of liquefied natural gas. these countries like england and other, germany cannot enforce or rely on russia for the lng they get. the natural gas has to be -- we have enough to supply so many countries in the world, and we should right now start lifting restrictions, begin the exporting as quickly as we possibly can. again, that's not going to work in the short term but it can relieve some of the pressure and it can help each country set
their long-term policy to realize they are not going to be bound to russia for their natural gas. >> let me turn to these questions about this missing malaysian air flight. you spent a lot of time thinking about and investigating acts of terror and americans' response. you heard tom costello. there's evidence obviously that can be -- can go in either direction, we don't know, but you have a red flag here. you have two passengers with stolen passports, maybe it's more than that. that has to be a red flag for you. >> david, it does. i mean, first of all, we don't know, but you're right. this is a real red flag and a number of other factors. the fact that the plane has disappeared, that there was no distress call, no mayday, no signaling at all of any trouble. the that it came out of malaysia, which has been a hub for al qaeda activity prior to the attack on the "uss cole," there was a meeting in malaysia. virtually so many of the 9/11 hijackers went through malaysia.
so you put all that together and you have two people traveling with stolen passports on the same plane, this has to be looked at. and i can assure you that our intelligence people, our counterterrorism people are struggling, going through all the databases, trying to get the identification of those two who were traveling with the stolen passports. my understanding is we do have a facial identity but we don't have the full identity yet. all that has to be run to ground because, again, there's no -- we can't make any conclusions, but considering what's happened in the past and considering where this occurred and considering the stolen passports we have to consider the issue of terrorism and exhaust every possible investigative technique. >> congressman, when i first heard this, the thing that occurred to me, i mean, all these years after 9/11, that we have a much more integrated, international system of checking identities, checks pass ports, and when you put your passport through the scanner before you get on a flight, something would ping and say, hey, this isn't
right. do you worry that malaysia is not in sync with those protocols the way a lot of other countries are? >> david, there's a concern that unfortunately a number of countries are not as strict as we would like them to be. my understanding is, again, i don't want to prejudge this, but malaysia does not have the same security protocols that we have, and this question whether or not they screen the passport here and a question whether or not the stolen passport was adequately reported, if it was rorpted, whether or not malaysians checked against the interpol listing, so, again, a number of airports around the world do not have i believe adequate security procedures. >> i just want to ask you one question about politics before your roundtable talks about the future of the republican party. you've been outspoken talking about rand paul, who won this cpac distraught poll, not that meaningful in the scheme of things but gives him a bump.
you've been critical of him saying he appeals to the lowest common denominator in the party and you find it offensive. do you still think that now or is he a more viable candidate for presidency in 2016? >> the concerns i have are r still there. he's more about cia killing americans with drones as having cough knee in starbucks, who said the director of national intelligence should be in the same jail as snowden. our real enemy is al qaeda. we have to be concerned about russia. he was critical of americans several weeks ago saying we tweak the russians too much. when i say appealing to the lowest common denominator, he's trying to tell americans we can retreat from the world, that america is an imperial power, if we retreated the world would be safer. nothing could make the world more dangerous than if america did retreat, go back into isolationism. this is not the days of charles lindbergh. we have to be a strong and viable nation and cannot allow isolationists to take over the
republican party. that would be damaging not just for the party, more importantly to the country and the world. >> peter king, congressman, thank you so much. >> thank you, david. >> always appreciate it. coming up on the program, pope francis and the francis effect. he's going to mark his one-year anniversary this week. next my interview with archbishop timothy dolan of new york, a surprising this story that pope francis might meet with sex abuse victims in the church. >> i hope he does. lord knows i have and most [ garner ] there's a lot of beautiful makeup out there, but one is so clever that your skin looks better even after you take it off. neutrogena healthy skin liquid makeup. 98% saw improved skin. does your makeup do that? neutrogena® cosmetics. she tossed and turned and couldn't turn off her mind. it was hard for her to sleep, even one little ounce. then she discovered tide, downy, and bounce. soothing scents for your sheets, your pj's, too.
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>> welcome back. what a year it has been for pope francis as he approaches his one-year anniversary as leader of the catholic church. the pope created controversy a few days ago when he said no one has done more than the vatican to address the abuse scandals that have plagued the church for years. he said the portrayal of him as
some sort of superman is offensive i sat down with timothy dolan and his revealing interview. he spoke his behind about the pope, the abuse scandals and same-sex marriage. >> thank you for having us to your who em. >> you're always welcome here. thanks for taking me seriously when i said come on in. >> we're here, and what a year it's been for the catholic church and pope francis. what a reception one year later. pope francis giving an interview this week saying look, it's been a great reception but i'm not superman. he almostt= found it offensive. yet at the same time, that reception is something he would like to use for the benefit of the church, wouldn't? wmu church, wouldn't? he knows the power of symbol. he knows the power of audio visual aids as any good teacher does. i think he's saying look, i'm no better than anybody else but if this attention is coming my way, i'm going to use it and turn the attention to jesus and his church. i think he's doing a splendid job of it. >> it's not just the faithful
but the pope as a political influence around the world and in america. i'm curious to know what the agenda is for him now that he's had his first year, where he would like to dig in and have influence. there has been some criticism coming his way where he might say things that stir the masses worldwide begging questions about what he means and then there's a clarification. >> uh-huh. >> is there a plan of action to that? would he like to get some of these diabetics particular will i over social matters started? >> i think he would. once again, that might be part of his shrewd strategy. if if he leaves people wondering and guessing, a good teacher does that, too. we've all had good teachers that almost tease us. i wonder what he meant. i hope he clarifies, gets us asking questions and probing. >> but conservatives in america, some of the headlines, conservative u.s. catholics feel left out by the pope's embrace. increasingly fret over the pope's style. one commentator i read say the
pope is sowing seeds of confusion among the faithful. the issue of gay rights around the world, he opened the door to the idea of accepting civil unions. is that something you can see the church supporting? ing >> i for one, i haven't sensed that too much bristling among the conservatives. they honestly will say his style is a little different and might periodically cause us a little angst, but in general they too seem to be rejoicing in what you might call the evangelical fervor, the good interest in the life of the church. i haven't sensed a lot of massive discontent among the conservative catholics. he as you know, pope pran sis, has tried his best not to let there be a cleavage between him and pope benedict because there might be the tendency in some top character ca tour each of them and almost set up a bit of an anti-thesis. he keeps saying how much he loves pope benedict.
he quotes from him. he's a shrewd man. you know what his name is, upontive, that's what we call our pope which is the latin world for bridge builder. he's a pontiff par excellence, a bridge builder. >> there there be a point at which there would be an expectation of action, not just debate but to say he seems to be setting a course for the church that makes the church open to certain changes. >> uh-huh. >> maybe not done electrical changes but certain changes, be inclusion of women in the hierarchy of the church, changes with regard to the view of divorce and taking communion and even gay rights. >> uh-huh. there are some who have said that. you are right there are some even his admires who have said holy father, be careful. there seems to be a huge sense of expectation among catholics. we're a little worried their hopes might be dashed. i think we've got a pope that does not think in terms of winning or losing. i think we've got a pope who says i want to ask the right questions. i want to point people to the
right place where they can get the answers, namely not me but the church's teaching, our tradition, the bible, what god has told us. let me ask the questions, let me get the interest going. and then let's try to revive god's people to passionately reclaim the truth that god has revealed. i think this is his pastoral strategy. >> do you imagine the church might open the way to accepting civil unions? >> he mentioned -- i'm as eager as you are to read the full extent of that the interview. if i saw the reports accurately, he didn't come right out and say he was for them. once again in an extraordinarily sincere open nuanced way, he said i know that some people in some states have chosen this. we need to think about that and look into it and see the reasons that have driven them. it wasn't as if he came out and approved them. but he just in the sensitivity that has won the heart of the world, he said rather than quickly condemn them, let's see
if -- let's just ask the questions as to why that is appealing to certain people. >> would that make you uncomfortable? >> the civil unions? >> yeah. >> it would in a way, david, because i don't think marriage between one man and one woman forever leading to life and love, what's not something that's just a religious jack mental concern. you bet it is that and we -- that's how god has elevated it to making a camerament but it's also the building block of society and culture so it belongs to culture. if we water down that sacred meaning of marriage in any way, i worry that not only the church would suffer, i worry that culture and society would. >> the issue of sexual abuse within the church is still a big issue. the pope this week said the lath catholic church is perhaps the only public institution that has moved with transparency and responsibility. the church is the only one to have been attacked. >> a lot of people sense that was defensive because it was
also the church that was responsible for covering up this sin, for hiding priests, for faying to report, for introducing priests with a past pedphilia into parishes around this country among others. was that overly defensive? does the church have to do more? >> oh, the church will always have to do more as humanity has to do more. we're part of humanity. i was cheering the pope on when he said that. you'll find, david, i'm with people a lot. catholic people, there are three things that really tick them off about the sex abuse crisis. first of all that a priest who would dare claim to be an agent of god would act in such a hideous manner. number two, the bishops would have not reacted with the rigor and the scrupulous action that was necessary. there's the second. but thirdly, catholic people say but why is it the church alone that is being kicked around? this is a societal problem, a cultural problem. it afflicts families, every institution, every religion.
we're rather grateful that our church, which was an example of what not to do in the past in the last 12, 13, 14 years has become an example of what to do and why does the church keep being picked on? i was glad the pope said that. i think he's right on target. >> in the '50s and '60s child abuse claims were being investigate and prosecuted when at the same time this was happening in the catholic church was hiding it. the power of symbol here is to meet with victims. the pope has not done that. should he do that? >> he probably will. i would not be surprised if he would not. i hope he does. lord knows i have and most bishops and pastors have. benedict did. i would anticipate he would cell. >> the other other area of great potential sluns is thinking about capitalism in the world. to meet with president obama and it's interesting that in this regard, the pope and the president have been speaking about income inequality in the world, the president focused primarily in america.
there are conservatives in america who say no, no, no, there's not an income inequaliti program, there's an opportunity inequality problem here. rush limbaugh even calling the pope a marxist. how does he respond to that? >> he responded very charitibly as we've come to know and love in him. i don't know if i would have that much charity. i think that was terrible to refer to the pope as marxist and very inaccurate. the catholic wisdom is always right smack down the middle. we're always concerned about excesses on the left, which is collectivism, socialism, commonism and excesses on the right which is unfettered cutthroat capitalism. swfr in between is$gk the middl which will come to a fair, quitable just economic system. different popes have corrected either side. john paul as you might imagine coming from where he did, he was he was a bit more sensitive to the excesses on the left.
francis is more concerned about the excesses to the right. that's fine. they're both pointing us to a balance, a prudentialal way that allows freedom in the marketplace, economic prosperity, people to take care of themselves and their families. but yet, protects the rights of the poor and those without. somewhere in between those two there's the answer. he's shrewd enough to know i'm not an
on this question of the balance between civil liberties and freedom of religion? do you think there's an imbalance in our country right now? >> aim afraid there may. .keep in mind the distinction is a false one, right? as you would be the first to know because high among those civil rights would be freedom of religion. once again, we've got to achieve this balance. now, what we've heard, david, in the recent rush to what you might call more liberalizing laws on social issues, whether that be abortion, whether that be redefinition of marriage, you will hear the people immediately say don't worry. we will never impede religions from the complete freedom that they need to exercise their faith and even bring their values into the public square. so don't worry, we're not going to impede you or intrude. we hold our breath and say we're afraid we learned the hard way what becomes tolerated quickly becomes obligatory for everybody
and we feel frozen out. whether that's happened yet, i wouldn't go that far. i would have to admit a certain amount of trepidation that perhaps we're now moving in that direction. >> michael sam from your home state, football player, revealed that he was gay first in the nfl. you saw the celebration from the president, the first lady saying what a courageous step that wasn how did you view it? >> good for him. i would have no sense of judgment on him. god bless you. i don't think -- look, the same bible that tells us that teaches us well about the virtue of chastity and the virtue of fidelity and marriage also tells us not to judge people. so i would sayp) >> on the issue of same-sex marriage, you said the last time we spoke you felt the church was being outmarketed. do you feel that it is, that ey rapidly, that the church is going to feel the power of that change? it must change if it's going to keep people seeking god through
the church? >> here you ask a good question. you phrased it well. when you say seeking god and church, when people seek god, they want to know what god has taught. all right? the church's sake rid enterprise is not to conform its teaching to the values of the world. all right? as rapidly as they're changing. the church's saoxui tack is to call us to conform our behavior to what god has revealed. that is tough especially when public opinion is against us. it's against us in a lot of areas as you well know. you're right, from the more left side of society, we may be taking some sucker punches because of our views on the redefinition of marriage and the sacredness of human life in the womb. we're taking it from the other side whenps could to the rights of the poor, and the church more or less shrugs and says look, we don't take our agenda from the polls. our agenda is given us by the god who made us.
we must be faithful to him instead of what we're hearing from the world. that having been said, a shred pastor will know yeah, but one of the ways we more effectively pass on god's teaching and god's revelation is by being swhag sensitive to what the world is saying, what the world is feeling. and so francis esis reminding us look, if we come across as some crabby naysaying shrill, we're not going to win anybody. if we come across as a loving embracing mother, holy mother church who says come on in, we love you, we need you, we want you, and once you get to know us, then maybe we can invite you to the conversion of heart at the core of the gospel and then maybe we can talk about changing behavior. that's a very effective pedagogy. >> final question, beyond this first year, what must this pope do to help the catholic church remain relevant? >> yep.
>> particularly in america and throughout north america at a time when there is a big secular push around the world? what must he do? >> what he's got to do and he knows it, his first year has been good, he's got to restore the luster of the church. for us as catholics, our core belief and where we differ from others is that we believe that god is revealed himself in jesus and that jesus remains alive in his church. people today say we like god and jesus. we don't need the church. for us as catholics we're saying that's not how we understand god's design. pope francis is saying we've got to the restore the luster, the appeal, the intrigue, the mystery, the romance, the vin have itation to the church and he's doing it on steroids. that's his major agenda i think. >> your eminence, i always enjoy talking to you. >> happy st. patrick's day. >> thank you. >> all right. and you can see more of my interview with cardinal dolan including how the pope plans to strengthen the faith of
catholics and noncatholics alike on our website at "meet the press" @nbc.com. >> coming up, paul palin, christie, santorum, will one of these names be on the republican ballot in 2016? our roundtable weighs in with their insight and analysis on the fight for the soul of the gop. >> you may think i'm talking about electing republicans. i'm not. i'm talking about electing lovers of liberty. ♪ >> "meet the press" is brought [ woman ] i will embrace change... everything life throws my way. except for frown lines. those i'm throwing back. [ female announcer ] olay total effects. nourishing vitamins,
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the x1 entertainment operating system, only from xfinity. >> america is counting on the gop to get it right. and that's why the establishment can't blow it. >> that, of course, sarah palin the keynote speaker last night at the cpac, conservative political action conference here in washington. now to discuss all the week's politics, i'm back with and creeia mitchell, ron fourn year, ralph reed and congresswoman karen bass. >> i should say this first. we want to talk about the future of the republican party and the
gathering of cpac in washington is a about big deal for a lot of us who cover politics because we're trying to gauge to what extent the party is rebuilding and what the personalities say, what the messages an say about where the party is going. so here's the results from the straw poll as you look at ted cruz. rand paul on top again, 31%, ted cruz second. ralph reed, what does this tell us about where the party is? >> it tells you they want somebody who is going to be an unpol jet tick defender of undiluted conservative. what concerns them about for lack of a better term the establishment, i'm not a big fan of that term, but certainly the elected official wing of the party, the consulting class is that they sometimes unintentionally sometimes intentionally view the core principles of the party limited government, stronger families, a forward-leaning foreign policy and national defense posture,
lower taxes, economic growth as somehow a liability rather than an asset. sometimes they treat it like an albatross. you know, sometimes david when you see some of these leaders on programs like this, and they get asked about why the republican party stands for the dignity of every individual including the unborn, why they believe in the sanctity of life, it's like they get a hunted look in their eyes. so i think some of this is stylistic, but if the party is going to win, you're going to need to have two wings to fly. you can't just do it with one or the other. >> i noticed raf taking notes during your interview there. i think he laid out, the cardinal laid out the recipe for the republican party. the catholic church, the pope is trying to show how you can change a dying institution and revitalize it with empathy and hup milt and you can expand a religious tent, a political tent without undermining your core base. this is something you and i have talked about. can the republican party expand
itself without turning off the base. >> if you look at the list of candidates in the straw poll, i don't think that's expanding the base at all. if you look who attended cpac, there's a lot of work that needs to be done. >> exactly. >> there's still such a fight over what it means to be a conservative. so you mentioned the establishment. these tea party folks are saying look, the establishment is still too -- is clinging to compromise and the size and scope of government in a way that turns us off. >> i think rand paul among all of those who were present has expanded his base. he has a younger generational base, as well partly enhearted from his father but he is broadening his message. chris critz was invited. he is invited now as the head of the republican governors but he's not a player in that part of the party. i do think there's one person to pick up on ron fournier's analogy with what cardinal dolan was saying about a pope who is
sticking to core principles but presenting a different more humble and moisture broader and more inclusive image. that could be jeb bush. ralph and i were just talking about jeb bush has that different approach on immigration and education. >> rand paul just to follow up on andrea's point, cpac came out at the same time the pew research center did a good report on millenniaals, this rising generation. they don't fit meets toly into either party. they don't like either party. tend to be libertarian. they have a problem with president obama on the nsa stuff. they want a government more tech savvy and opinion not impinging so much on civil liberties. >> they're also more pro-life than older americans you see this cpac. you're going to see it as the field begins to shake out through 2014 and 2015. a lot of this is about connecting with voters and constituencies that haven't
always felt welcome in our ranks. the late jack kemp used to say people don't wear what you know till they know that you care. the republican party's got to do what francis is doing with the catholic church. francis is putting the poor and care for the poor and emiliation of the poverty where it belongs which is at the center of the gospel if people who are lower middle class who are struggling, who are poor, wanting to climb that ladder of opportunity but they're having a hard time grabbing thatr( they don't think had you conservatives and republicans have a vision for the future that includes them, their message will be badly damaged. >> but i do think if we look at republican policies if we look at the budgets over the last couple of years, there really isn't anything there that says we're going to reach out to the middle class. i mean, in fact. >> that's not true. >> we didn't evenenenen exte unemployment insurance. if you look at the diversity at cpac, there are 163 speakers. 35 were women. >> they don't want government to
be leading the way. this is about the size and reach of government. that's what the debate is about. >> right, it is. but you have to look at the room that they had which was talking about diversity. in that many roo, it was virtually empty. there were hundreds of seats. >> can i point out one thing? in fact, the most successful anti-poverty program since the great society is the thousand dollar child tax credit. that was part of the contract with america. we will advocated it when i was at the christian coalition. in 2011, the last year for which we have data available, there were 9 million people lifted out of the poverty. that's a fully refundable tax credit. that was our policy, bill clinton vetoed it three times it was vetoed three times and when mike lee just announced his tax reform package, i guess yesterday or the day before, what did he propose? taking that child tax credit to $2500, making it fully refundable. what you do, david, you get rid of the bureaucracy. you get rid of all this panoply
of government programs which are inefficient and give the funds directly to the people. >> i want to ask questions about politics. chris critz, is he done? or do you think the big money is looking at him and saying he's got time to come back. >> it's early to say that anybody's done. the golden brand of someone who is a nonpartisan or at least could work across party lines who was uncorruptible, who was politics unusual, that is very, very damaged. it is hard to see his road to the presidency is much tougher than it was. it was never easy because his brand didn't fit neatly into the republican primary. ironically he might have done himself some good with the>wr @& republican primary audience because he now can beat up on the media. it's hard to see, harder to see him become president than it was six months ago. >> thank god the media is still here. what he would would they talk about at cpac? >> we've got a couple minutes left. i want to address the crisis in
ukraine. and creeia you first, how do you make putin stop? do you think the administration has figured out the answer that? >> not at all. putin has not agreed to direct talks with the ukrainians. he can't get a meeting in moscow. the other thing is, there are reports that russia is attacking the kiev government with cyberwar. very sophisticated stuxnet type cyberwar. that could cripple their attempts to revive their economy and infrastructure. you've got military moves, crimea is effectively gone. i don't think germany and the rest of the europeans will help the u.s. isolate putin economically. and there is lobbying, intense lobbying from american business who have huge deals in russia worried about the blowback from sanctions, sanctions against russia will hurt them. the president doesn't have a play and lavrov according to some really well sourced
supports, lavrov the national security council and economic advisors were clueless about putin's decision. he made that decision with three old buddies from the kgb days. who is he listening to. >> karen, do you think the president is playing this right, that he's going to have to ultimately accept the cm russia's economy is particularly fragile. we saw a drop in their stock market. what came out of congress with us passing the billion dollar loan guarantee with the unity amongst the european nations, i do think that the president is playing it right. i think his leadership has been strong. >> ron? >> we were flat footed. one, this was the second successive president that has viewed rushate way they want it to be, not the way it is. specifically putin. we can talk about president bush year one. secondly, where was the cia, our
intelligence community? why didn't woo he know about this. >> divided. >> i'm wondering if our intelligence community should be spying more on russia and less on american people. >> we'll be back. more with our roundtable. first a "meet the press" moment from 2001 when joe biden praised george bush's meeting with vladimir putin, then a relatively new figure on the international scene. >> the president did, i think, two very, very good things by going to europe and by meeting with putin. by his engaging the europe the way he did and putin the way he did, it mañ! clear to europe
involvement in so many charities and causes he cares about so much. way to go, taunl. we'll be back with more [ garner ] there's a lot of beautiful makeup out there, but one is so clever that your skin looks better even after you take it off. neutrogena healthy skin liquid makeup. 98% saw improved skin. does your makeup do that? neutrogena® cosmetics. #. . female announcer: what will you get with your new sleep train mattress?
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the war in syria. one of the greatest humanitarian catastrophes of our time. snyderman joins me from lebanon on the third anniversary of the syrian civil war. nancy, good morning. >> david, there are over 5.5 million affected children from the syrian crisis, and over 500,000 of them have landed in lebanon. right now we estimate that there are 450 makeshift chaamps like this and the problems are real -- not enough food, not
enough nutrients, premature delivery and obviously very little education. i spent is the morning in a hospital and i saw in the span of two hours more birth defects than i saw in an entire four years of my pediatric training. the health crisis here are real. this next week we're going to be talking about the faces of the syrian children because they have been easy to forget. the fact that for most of us, our goals are very simple. shelter, food, education, and health. and we're going to focus on those four things this week, david. >> all right. nancy snyderman, thank you so much joining us this morning from lebanon. and i should point out the reports from forgotten, syria's children of war begin on tuesday on "today" and nightly news with brian williams and nbc news.com. back to our roundtable now. i ask all of you to think about what's happened on the program this morning and tweet those thoughts during the program you've been hearing as you've heard the conversation. the #is mtp.
we talked about ukraine. karen, when you look at syria and the impact on children, the catastrophe that is this story, is john mccain right, are future presidents going to have to apologize for our unwillingness to intervene more robustly? >> i don't think so. if you left it to john mccain, i think we would have troops on the ground in 15 different nations. so i don't believe that's the case. >> talking about ukraine and what we've learned, ralph, you tweeted the obama administration has no real answers on the crisis in ukraine. putin is laughing at the u.s. what if he ends up being more isolated at the end of this? do we get the last laugh? >> no, i think he will trade isolation for crimea first, maybe eastern ukraine, and more importantly, the ability to intimidate the other baltic states. and i think, look, i would acknowledge obama's options are limited but he better figure out which options he's going to pursue, do it robustly and project strength. that's not happening right now. >> andrea, as you were watching tony blinking concluded, he says
obama's isolating putin will see tremendous solidarity of the allies but germany is not fully on board. it undercuts the strategy. >> germany's not fully on board. and i think american corporations are not fully on board. i'm not sure that isolation strategy can work. taking it back to syria when i was watching dr. nancy's report, think we're relying on russia to be our partner in peace talks on syria? russia is now rearming assad and not a partner for us on foreign policy. >> i was thinking a lot about cardinal dolan. i tweeted he points to the shrewd strategy of the pope, says by asking pointed questions he gets people thinking about church's meaning. ron, what's interesting to me, you could almost apply this to politics and how he strengthens people's faith, not just catholics but non-catholics. come closer he says. get closer to god, strengthen your faith. and it doesn't mean compromise but it means a changing tone. >> it's interesting. this is something ralph and i have talked about. if you look at the republican party, there's examples of them pulling this off. you have mcdonnell got more
evangelical voters as a guy from the middle. >> thank you. we'll be back next week. if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." good monday morning. right now on "first look" -- vanished. the missing malaysian passenger jet. russian grasp. the future of crimea hangs in the balance. american fugitive. nsa leaker edward snowden holds his first live video conference. plus, promising news for anyone concerned about alzheimer's. and is this really what high school basketball has gone to. good morning. nice to see you. we begin with some breaking news ni