tv MSNBC Live With Kate Snow MSNBC February 3, 2016 12:00pm-2:01pm PST
let's get out there. let's meet these people. good afternoon, everyone. i'm chris matthews with special coverage, again, live from manchester, new hampshire where the candidates are campaigning in the granite state. just six days until the new hampshire primary. hillary clinton and bernie sanders are going after each other in their first one on one debate. that's tomorrow night on msnbc at 9:00 eastern. their first head to head. it's also the last democratic debate before the primary here next tuesday. a new poll shows a 33-point lead for sanders here in new hampshire. let's watch. >> i'm going to be out here making my case, answering your
questions, doing everything i can to persuade you to come out and vote next tuesday. >> we want to win. you know what? then we're going to nevada, and we think we have a shot to win there. then we're going to south carolina, then we're going to wisconsin. every state is important. we're going all the way to the convention. we have the momentum. >> it sounded like howard dean in the old days. anyway, the same poll shows donald trump with a 24-point lead in new hampshire. rand paul, by the way, is the latest candidate to drop out of the race. he's out now. another republican thought to be on the edge of departure is rick santorum who may make his announcement sometime later this evening. meantime, ted cruz is about to hold an event, still basking in his iowa caucus win. >> i heard one comment after another after another, there is no way cruz can win, cruz can't win, cruz can't win, he's going
to lose. oddly enough, they also said some fellow named trump was going to win. >> it's a busy day. we've got a team of reporters in the field live from new hampshire to arkansas where trump is today. we're in arkansas following trump down there. why is he in little rock today when his future is here next tuesday? kerry? >> some suggested that while he admitted his ground game failed in iowa, this is a part of establishing that ground game. this was a last-minute change to come here to arkansas. they expect here at the state fairgrounds. you can see there is a large crowd of people here already four hours before he speaks or so, that he will likely have about 10,000 people here. we have a couple voters here. guys, come up here a second, let me talk to you. carl arrowhead -- >> arrowwood. >> arrowwood, sorry.
carl, first of all, your belief. did donald trump lose in iowa? >> no, he didn't lose. >> he didn't come in first. what happened? >> he didn't lose, let's put it that way. >> i love this guy. >> he's patient. i think he stands for something good. i think the people are going to like him in new hampshire. i think that he's going to make a difference in this -- in the white house. i think that he was -- i think he's running for a reason. i think he's running for the reason to change things. >> reporter: some of the folks who are here, i think jordan is one of them. jordan, come here for a second. jordan, your last name is? >> rivera. >> your family is originally from? >> mexico.
>> yet you're here supporting donald trump who said he wants to build a wall and send back those who are deported here illegally. how does that feel with your family heritage? >> it's a good thing he's going to build a wall. i feel like he's going to keep criminals out and terrorists who want to do our country wrong and coming to this country illegally. there should be legal channels which they should go through first. >> yes, for the same reason. we don't know who is coming across that border down there. the drug cartel, we could have even isis coming across that border down there and not even know it. >> reporter: so a lot of analysts have said that has something to do with the sense of fear in this country, and that donald trump is speaking to that. come back to that question which is, did donald trump win or did he actually lose in iowa? >> donald trump did not lose in iowa. the way the media is playing this, especially against rubio,
was like an old story i heard years ago about a car race, that the united states and russia was in a car race. the united states won, russia lost. and the way they played it is russia was second, and the united states came in next to last. that's about the way they're playing the rubio thing. >> reporter: so as you're standing here, you come out hours before donald trump comes here. he comes to arkansas when all eyes right now are on new hampshire. why are you here? why spend hours here? what is it about the donald trump campaign that draws you to come out here like this? >> well, i have grandkids, and i have kids myself, and i run a business, very successful, for 35 years. and i don't see any way, form or fashion what i see below me that my kids can accomplish what i did. a man like donald trump that has not only started in business,
although he did inherit money from his dad, he grew the business, and he managed to keep his made. donald trump is very efficient, and i think he'll cut the waste in washington. by just cutting the waste, it's going to cut our national debt tremendously, just cutting the national waste alone. >> reporter: thank you very much. you guys will go back to your positions in line. chris, there is line after line after line after line, and it goes over here, and it's beginning to build. like i said, they anticipate, and it's really hard to know the full count, but they anticipate here in the fate fairgrounds inside the coliseum, they may have 10,000 people here tonight for donald trump who has timed his speech of prime time views of the news viewers hitting it around 6:15 this evening. chris? >> kerry, that was great reporting. i wish all my colleagues of the
so fist cade brand would pay for aen aengs. >> great reporting. if that's an actual sampler of his support, we got a hell of a lot of information there. thank you very much. kerry sanders in little rock, arkansas with the trump campaign. they're still drawing big crowds there. digging deeper into the feud, donald trump and ted cruz who did beat him in iowa, their animosity appears to be escalating. trump accused him of stealing votes. cruz said, reality has hit the reality star. since iowa no one is talking about donald trump. that's why he's popping off on twitter. there are twitter addiction therapy groups, and he should check in with his local chapter.
cruz himself weighed in a short time ago, tweeting that donald trump was having a temper tantrum. rick tower, by the way, and on our show, national spokesman for the cruz campaign. you can play some defense or some offense. who put out that mailer and tried to scare people coming out the. >> we sent out that mailer and that mailer was molgded, especially, off the, that everyone up and down the ticket is an official benefiting from. >> why do you call him an official? >> i can show you a lot of mailers that get different attention. >> we get them about important,
or important social -- it's not a fraud. everything in the public mail the government is not -- four days ago i was in an override and the guy told me he was in a caucus. i said, if you were in a caucus, who would you caucus for? i spent the rest of the ride by trying to convince him. >> this is the way things are. let me ask you about this ben carson complaint that the word was put around by the cruz folks that he was out of the race. is it true? >> it was not true that he was out of the race. >> no, is it true you guys were putting the word out that he was. >> no. what we put out there was a report from cnn. chris moody put it out. >> ted cruz, two reporters in new hampshire?
here's senator cruz. >> he doesn't want to discuss that issue, he doesn't want to the. eng the people are interested in substance and record. >> he's calling you a cheater. he's calling you a fraud. does this cross the line for you? >> donald trump's snults get more and more hysterical than they're funny. i wake up every day and laugh at the latest thing donald has tweeted. because he's losing. we need someone with the judgment and temperament to keep this country safe. i don't know anyone who does this with his finger on the
bucket and nuke. that's not the temperament of a leader to keep this country safe. we need a president who will have the back of our fighting men and women, who will have their back and will be clear-i'd and focused on the anti-radical terrorist. the american people are not interested in the american slide show. caroline and katherine are better behaved than a presidential candidate who has to live with it each and every day when he loses. >> so who is the bigger hawk? your guy or marco rubio. i don't picture the president spending the day with his trigger on the finger. what's this finger on the button
about? >> it's all about temprament. when someone pops off on twit r twitter. the reason he lost it is because no one was talking about him. he just kind of faded away. he'll draw big crowds, he drew big crowds before, but it didn't seem to transfer into new votes. it's a fact that ted cruz has a position to have a strategy. >> absolutely, no doubt about it. we want one voting block and you have people who care about national security, pro gun, pro
growth, pro family. >> is there. >> they care about freedom, they care about their safety, they care about their enemies and dweegt is defeating isis. >> that's why he's talking about eminent domain. >> i saw his speech earlier today and it has not changed significantly. >> i think it's a smart move. by the way, tip o'neill, my old boss, they don't even like parks up here. they like private property. extreme statement from an old investor. nbc's gabe gutierrez is following the renewed. he joins us on the phone from the trail is it nobody 2? is that what you're gunning for
snr. >> they want to do as well as possible and many analysts are talking about that 3-2-1 strategy. the campaign right now, though, they're really trying to do downplay that. they're trying to keep the expectations low. a lot of people think he has to come in strong here, has to get second, and that's the pathway into south carolina and eventually the nomination. >> let's talk about the eastern conference, the moderate conference. he has to come in successful -- the other form of defense, is he defeating john kasich and chris christie? >> absolutely. christie took a whack at him yesterday calling him the boy in the bubble. yesterday jeb bush took out that full page ad in the paper. and marco rubio wouldn't take up those tactics.
i want to show you something from marco rubio. here's what he had to say. >> if there are policy decisions, we'll respect those in the most respectful way possible, but my goal is not only to win the nomination, but to bring the conservatives together. >> reporter: chris, what he's trying to do is trying to make himself a national candidate. he's talking about this being a three-course race between him and donald trump. if ethan thinks -- if you put him between those two, you don't have to be the person going up against hillary clinton and bernie sanders. >> he's the boy in the bubble,
he never really interacts. my contiguum would be, after watching it for many years, he doesn't seem spontaneous. >> that's the big knock on rubio, right? christie talked about that yesterday, that that was a pointed attack, and his response to that is he's just trying to get a message out there. of course, a lot of people were there. yes, he is too rehearsed, he's canned. he tried here at town hall to answer a few questions. that's something he's tried to overcome. >> one way to doed it. lets see if he can question and not the kwourter -- sometimes
it's evolved into, this is his message, this is his core message, this is what he wants voters to heed. still ahead, our all-star this hour, our. it's been proven to be somewhat unpredictable. >> i'm going to talk about what they prefer in the granite state. chuck todd and mary tomorrow night in new hampshire. the only time bernie says we'll be going head to head. you know what? because the only two guys in the campaign. back after the debate, we wrap up all of the action. was engineered...
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>> they're going to make their decision on their own, not really influenced by the crowd. >> i will decide when i cast my vote. >> i'm not looking for a handout, i don't want anything from government, and mi& i wana fellow neighbor to feel the same way. >> jennifer horne is republican committee chair up here in new hampshire. thank you for joining us. >> thank you for having me. >> give us a picture. you're living in heomaha right w or arizona somewhere, and you're trying to decide, who is going to be my next president? they're conservative, they're republican on your party's side,
but give me the distinctive characteristic of a republican up here. >> sure. whether you identify as republican or democrat, if you're in the state of new hampshire, you identify as independent. there is a real strong independent streak in our folks up here. they're very engaged. we have less than a small amount of independents, but that's why i think you see a large portion of our voters undecided so late in the game. >> you don't like lightweights up here. i mean, if you spot somebody that's a phony who is just got-looking or whatever, has the right pattern. . there's one in the race right now, but. you liked mccain, you liked
reagan, you liked eyisenhower going all the way back? >> it's one on one, you're expected to stand in that circle in the town hall and stay there until the last question is answered. they know a phony when they see o one. it's being eye to eye. we don't just want to see where you are on policy, we want to know where you are in your heart. >> by the way, let me ask you a really great psychobabble question. iowa is flat. you can see everywhere in iowa in one place. it's all right in front of you. look out there, there's the rest of iowa.
new hampshire has the range and mountains that you have. do you think that creates a different environment that you've got range and attitudes rather than just the state of iowa. >> i do think to -- >> if there's as much diversity in our voter as there is in our landscape. how do you like that? >> a poet and a politician. you know how to respond to me in my ways. still ahead, we're going to turn to the democrats.
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make sure the germs they bring home don't stick around. use clorox disinfecting products. because no one kills germs better than clorox. . today bernie sanders appeared on "morning joe" pushing back on criticism from the clinton campaign. let's listen to senator sanders now. >> tell me why it is utopian, tell me why it is impractical that the united states does what every other country on earth is doing, declaring medical insurance to all people. tell me why it is impractical, yeah, the rich should start paying their fair share of taxes. >> we're talking to national press secretary for secretary
clinton in the campaign. to me, you guys have a conundrum. sanders is saying a lot of nice things, a lot of idealistic things. yet if you challenge him the wrong way, you'll cashier those young people in november. how do you say he's being impractical and yet keep the idea of the young voter? >> i think there is a lot of ideal that senator sanders has provoked, and that's a good thing for the party. but what i think voters are putting a premium on this year, given the gridlock we continue to see in washington, given all the promise of president obama's election and then the realities that befell him, even as he was proposing very common sense, very well-supported ideas, he's had, on immigration, for instance, to go to executive actions in order to get things done on immigration. so i think the democratic voters who want to continue the change
in the progress that we're seeing under president obama from the next president, they're going to put a premium on articulating in fine detail how you're going to get it done. so i think when hillary clinton has a 40-year track record of actually getting results, sharing the same progressive values, talking tough on progressive values but actually twinning that with actual results, i think that counts for something. >> when senator sanders comes on and says, health care is a right, well, that means it's a red right as opposed to a blue right. a blue right is something government can't do to you. a red right is something that should be provided for. if you get in a car accident, the state, society, should get an ambulance there and get you to a hospital and get you the best possible treatment. we all believe in that as a principle. but health care for life, what funds it? medicare is working 50 years and
paying in. the same medicare for life is an insignificant statement. medicare means you pay for it in your working life, it comes back to you when you quit, right? what does medicare for life mean? you never work? when do you pay into the thing? i don't understand the system, entirely. >> interestingly, senator sanders calls this proposal medical for all, but it was not based on a medical style system at all. our point on both candidates in this race strongly support universal health care as a right for all americans. hillary clinton actually has the track record of building -- >> her mantra is let's build up a fund with taxes. >> we have wars and we have
deficits. that's why i don't know why hillary clinton doesn't just say, you can't have free education, you can't have education without big tax increases. >> i think we made some of those points. on health care, like i said, we both strongly support universal health care. you have to be directed about how you're going to achieve it. there's been a lot of scrutiny that people won't do better under his proposal. if you're on medicare now, if you're a working senior, you'll end up with a tax increase but not much improvement in terms of the care you provided. then on other issues as well, the tax plans -- we believe he should focus the tax increases on the wealthiest americans. he's asking for americans to pay more, too, when inequality is a big issue. >> do you think we should have hit this candidate in his bed instead of letting it rise this far?
he's a socialist, and i'm not knocking her for this, it's tra te strategic on her part -- he's a socialist and now he's using our party as a vehicle to win the presidency. he's not a democrat, never said he was. i'm a democratic, he's a socialist. draw a line in the sand and say, are you run ning on a socialist ticket or a democratic ticket? why don't you make it clear? no, your candidate will not say -- >> she has pointed out that she supports a free market economy -- >> not when i was talking to her. >> it's an a-c answer. by the way, you just answered it. >> to me, i think he pulled back on much of what defined his career the last few decades.
>> maybe that's why mclaren. >> bernie sanders talking about revolution, a socialist. they're going to use it already unless you confront it. >> senator mccat skill have said that, a lot of senators are worried about that. >> i know where i would like you to do it. pat tooey in pennsylvania. in pennsylvania? you'll kill your party with that stuff. take him on. take him on up here. billionaires, he says what he thinks. he's against the billionaires. you have to come out against the socialistsment thank you, brian fallon, for coming on. we'll be right back with our special coverage live from new
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we're back and now we have the head of the democratic party, raymond buckley, a nice irish american name. joining me right now is raymond buckley. thank you. this ticket up here, you got this incredible lead which they die for, they beg for, they tease a tremendous comeback by somebody. trump is up by 22, bernie sanders up by 33. you can just see that spread dying. don't voters look at those spreads and say, i can do something with that? >> new hampshire voters love to trip up. whatever it is that the national narrative is and that's been our history over 50 years. >> how about sununu from the other side, the republican governor saying, iowa picks kor corn, we pick presidents.
it's a great line. >> it's a great line and he's good with those one-liners. >> are you a democratic state? you're getting quiet. are you a socialist? >> am i personally a socialist? no. >> is your party up here socialist, the democratic party? bernie calls himself a socialist. he's never run as a democrat, and now he's using your ticket to get something. he's not a democrat, he never said he was. how can you let someone run who isn't even your party? >> he came and campaigned for senator hajim last year for trips for college campuses and things like that. up in vermont he goes to the democratic j.j. and events they have up there. we're all one big family. >> so you see him as a political ally rather than as a compatriot in the party. >> i think compatriot is pretty
good. he caucuses with us -- >> you got here thanks to the benefit of attrition. martin o'malley is a fine guy but he pulled out. others have pulled out before him. but now you've got a mon oro-mo here between hillary clinton and sanders tomorrow night. >> it will be fantastic theater. there's always a moment that happens and maybe it will happen during the debate. >> let's talk about one great moment. hillary clinton, the issue was, is she likeable enough? barack obama said likeable enough. that mattered, didn't it? >> it did. it did. >> a lot of women, especially. >> one line can bring it down up here. you're in a highly demanding state. thank you very much, raymond buckley, of the democratic party of new hampshire. remember, you can catch the
democratic debate right here tomorrow night at 9:00 p.m. eastern. ted cruz responding to donald trump's accusations of defrauding the electorate out of iowa. marco rubio will be fighting his rivals because he's looking a little too cute up there. stay with us. and it affects each and every one of us. microsoft created the digital crimes unit to fight cyber-crime. we use the microsoft cloud to visualize information so we can track down the criminals. when it comes to the cloud, trust and security are paramount. we're building what we learn back into the cloud to make people and organizations safer.
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first time since taking office, president obama did. he's calling the rhetoric inexcusable. here he is. >> recently we've heard inexcusable political rhetoric against muslim americans that has no place in our country. we're one american family, and when any part of our family starts to feel separate or second class or targeted, it tears at the very fabric of our nation. >> well, the president also had a closed door roundtable with 12 muslim american leaders. that's interesting. up next, we'll bring in our panel to focus on the republican fight behind trump and cruz. i call it the eastern conference. it's the establishment battling it out for third, or second, even, up here, so they can take on whichever one of these guys wins. why are you all here? to learn, right? so you can get a good job and you're not working for peanuts. well what if i told you that peanuts can work for you? while you guys are busy napping, peanuts are delivering 7 grams of protein
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the only one on the gop side, marco rubio is in the middle of all his rivals. he took out an open ad featuring a letter from eight republican lawmakers in florida slamming rubio from the lawmaker board. they told rubio to man up. >> the way he's being treated so far on the campaign trail by his own staff reminds me of the boy in the bubble. he never answers questions, he's very controlled, and the boy in the bubble has to get out of the bubble if he wants to be president of the united states. >> my favorite line of the campaign so far, the boy in the bubble about rubio. joining me right now are my adviser, he's boston globe political reporter. national political reporter for the boston globe. can't beat it. dana milbank and katie tur.
let's not talk to your guy for five seconds. >> thank you. >> this battle for third or second among the also guys, which is jeb bush has to do well to survive next tuesday, to sur to justify staying in the race. john kasich, i've known him forever. he's fighting like hell, he is the little engine up here. chris christie, this is his opportunity to knock off marco rubio. it's all zero sum. that's what makes it so great. >> i think it's great because they all know they have to knock marco off at this point. they smell blood in the water in some ways. marco did really well in iowa. they realize he has the momentum. in order for them to do anything, they have to tear him down. marco has the most to lose and he has the most to lose. they're all going to be going after him. that second place or even that third place title in this state, second place if cruz doesn't do as well will allow them to move
on. >> magic. if you can get close to trump up 30 something now, dana, that's huge headline. you would make the double headline, i think, it was trump, the other guy. >> oh, definitely. no, and i think marco is having a difficult time of it because he's being hit by all sides. what i was following -- >> because he's, what, a light weight? >> i was following him around. he's acting as if he's a light weight. >> why does he recite every answer? >> he says the same stump speech over and over again. the man won't mention donald trump's name. he's being so over managed and -- >> i think he should say the following is a recorded announcement. your guy was saying it beautifully, scott leehigh. he said new hampshire will see right through this guy. >> he is one of those candidates that after you see him over and over again. >> john edwards. >> it wares thin on people. that's why the boy in the bubble -- >> it is thin. >> the boy in the bubble thing i think hits people. that's a pretty goods punch back
because he is kind of in a bubble. it's hard to get to him. it's hard to get him off of his game. >> it just reminds me of somebody saying -- let christie speak for this. he looks like he's running for student council. he runs for student council to get into a good law school. it's always programmed this way. nobody runs against him. he gets elected, he gets the credential to apply to law school. who wins? he does. nobody else does. katie? >> i think his voting record is going to be a problem for him here. the voters out here like to see policy, they like to see experience, they like to see details. they like to see somebody they can trust. when i was speaking with some voters today, rand paul supporters in fact, they said the reason they wouldn't necessarily go to marco rubio is because he doesn't have that record. he hasn't shown up for votes. >> his problem balancing a checkbook. his financial chaos. >> i think that is definitely a problem for him. >> it may work for him even if he's canned and he has nothing to say. the republican establishment has been beaten down.
they need a winner here. when he comes out of iowa this strong, jeb can't do it, kasich is nowhere, christie isn't doing it. >> why do you think they went through iowa. i have a sense, this is cosmetic. he looks good. he's younger than anybody else. he has a nice way of speaking even if it is redundant. he's easy. he's not threatening. some of these guys like bernie, you have to believe in him to vote for him. he seems okay. >> well, rubio says this himself at his events. he says, i'm the guys the democrats don't want to run against. >> easy vote to vote for. >> right. to vote for, which is why the conservatives don't like him, because i think the moderates and the independents say, all right, he's not that bad. he's not as bad as cruz or trump. we can tolerate him. >> what is he? you're a reporter. can you tell what he is? he's a hawk. this guy wants to bomb every country in the middle east in order. >> he's a hawk. the immigration twist on him -- >> that's the part of like. the good immigration part. >> the pre-flip. i think that is a problem for
people in new hampshire is you see a guy who's not holding true to his principles. jeb bush, that's an opening. >> what are his principles? >> that's the problem. you don't exactly -- >> i thought the senate bill was a good bill. if you can stop the illegal hiring and deal with the people here favorably, humanely, that's a pretty good deal on a bipartisan country, two-party country. >> explanation is torture. essentially he was saying the same thing today when asked about people, illegals living legal -- lawfully now in the united states, not breaking the law. he said, we'll have to figure out something to do with them. he said, i'm not for blanket amnesty. so he's doing the little wink wink. >> you're good at this. deep in his soul, i mean, he comes -- his family comes from cuba. i'm not sure that determines anything. he does have some sympathy for an immigrant family. >> i don't want to look into his soul. what he did with that gang originally is what he believes and then the whole sky fell down.
>> i know, you're so right. >> start over. >> then donald trump took everybody to the right in this race with immigration. marco rubio in a lot of ways had no choice but to move over with him. >> you live up near here. which of the guys -- of the candidates will do a little better than expected? will christie's new jerseyisms sell up here? >> there's a point where it felt like it was selling. >> john kasich, sort of ethnic pull you up by your boot straps, regular, raised a catholic. i know all about that background. that's where i come from. is that going to sell? >> he does well. i think the person who will surprise may be jeb? >> why, yankees? >> yeah. >> how many yankees? no, really, his father won here and brother won here. >> they're coming down from ken know bunk port. >> you have the attitude i have. thank you for that. please don't come down this time. thank you from the globe, spotlight globe. may win the oscar. thank you. that's a wrap for this hour.
i'm chris matthews in new hampshire. brian williams picks up our coverage right now. don't forget, tune in tomorrow night. the big e, mano a mano even though it's hillary. big debate. rachel maddow and chuck todd will be moderating that. i'll be in the spin room for a very special edition of hardball both before and after the debate. it's time for your business entrepreneur of the week. rob created the swurfer that you can swing or stand on with a surfing like effect. he thought skating and surf shops would be along for the ride, but he found out the people who really wanted it were specialty toy stores. for more watch "your business" sunday mornings at 7:30 on msnbc. brought to you by american express forum. e orders were rus. e orders were rus. i could feel our deadlines racing towards us.
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♪ everything kids touch during cold and flu season sticks with them. make sure the germs they bring home don't stick around. use clorox disinfecting products. because no one kills germs better than clorox. senator sanders said maybe she's a progressive. >> i would love to have land's support. >> love him dearly and have great respect for senator paul. >> they said some fellow named trump. it's heating up in cold and
rainy new england. good day from new york for this hour, i'm brian williams. so much news. so much politics to bring you as we start here to give our manchester base staff a brief break. these are all the campaigns that have fanned out across the granite state. as we said, a lot going on to update you on. the republicans made some news this morning, specifically two dropouts of this race. ron paul announced today he is out and we are expecting to be covering rick santorum rumored to be -- excuse me, i said ron paul, it's rand paul obviously. rick santorum is reported to be suspending his campaign later today and throwing his support behind one of the other republicans. so we're waiting for that. and on the democratic side of the race, latest polls show it between a 31 and a 33 point race right now between the lead that
bernie sanders of the neighboring state of vermont has over hillary clinton, and all eyes are on that debate hall tomorrow night. their one and only face-to-face debate all the way through to the new hampshire primary next week. it will air 9:00 p.m. eastern time right here on msnbc as they put the finishing touches on the venue. but as we said, lots of news. today the democrats seemed to be debating the meaning of a progressive and who gets to wear that label. casey hunt covering sanders headquarters, kristen welker covering the clinton campaign. casey, we'll start with you. >> reporter: brian, good afternoon. we are in the manchester field office of the bernie sanders campaign, so this is where it all happens. the phone calls, the get out the vote efforts. if you'll indulge me, i want to take you over here.
old chipotle, staple of campaign food. here we have a lot of hand-made signs. it has a grassrootsy feel. one of my favorite notes here, mom is required to bring the get out the vote food on february 6th. the bernie volunteers clearly lip counting on having some lasagna from their family members. the broader point here, brian, as you say, this fight over who exactly can lay claim to the progressive mantle. take a listen to what bernie sanders had to say earlier today about this on cnn. >> what i said is simply repeating what she said. i believe if i'm not mistaken she was in the midwest and what she said is i am a moderate. most progressives historically were against the war in iraq. most progressives were against the so-called defense of marriage act way back in 1996. those are issues that, you know, secretary clinton has not been
all that progressive about. >> reporter: so that, of course, was a continue be u wags -- continuation of a question from me. hillary clinton hitting back causing this back and forth and ultimately resulting in something of a twitter spat. bernie sanders tweeting a series of things back at hillary clinton saying, she says a 40--year-old record of progressive results boil down to some days citing what sanders said originally. now he tweets, video of the question and answer from yesterday, then says, quote, you can be a moderate, you can be a progressive but you can't be both moderate and progressive citing some of clinton's comments earlier in her career where she talks about being a moderate, and it continues to go on. now, of course, the progressives are really what's driving the excitement over bernie sanders
at this point. the state of new hampshire very, very different over iowa where obviously sanders did come within points of beating hillary clinton, but the party here is very much driven by liberal activists and there's obviously an independence streak. bernie sanders and angus king from maine are both out of new england, and sanders territory here, while where we are in manchester are mixed. they're both fighting in a major population center, sanders strengths might be up in the north country of new hampshire and kea and keene to the west. those are the people that need to be excited for him. it was very clear today and yesterday that he really understands where his base is. clinton knows she has to win some of them over if she's going to close that gap, brian. >> we apologize for a rather lengthy satellite delay. this debate really did start
with the question you asked bernie sanders while we were on the air life yesterday, and, second, for our viewers who are watching us today who have perhaps been away from the daily grind of politics and are drawn to it, drawn to our coverage because of this political season but not familiar with the mass use of this term progressive, does it mean liberal? is it a hoped for new appalachian for the liberal wing of the party? how do you define it as a journalist? >> my sense of it, brian, from covering this is that it's a way of defining a set of values in a separate way from your political party. i think on the other side you have conservative versus republican. some define themselves by the party, others by their ideology. i would say it's similar on the other side. there's the democratic party and then there are, quote, unquote, progressive values.
the conversation particularly between bernie sanders and hillary clinton is around certain areas of that, whether it's trade, protectionism, whether it's marriage. you heard bernie sanders talk about the defense of marriage act which of course president clinton made law and which he at the time opposed. he was defending those values when it was politically unpopular making the argument that the clintons are part of essentially a party system that works in a certain way, compromises and they have adjusted themselves for political moments. you're seeing this on both sides of the political spectrum now, whether it's donald trump on the right or ted cruz on the right to a certain extent, even though he is in the senate he, of course, has not played by the rules of the senate. i don't think mitch mcconnell or any of the other leaders in the senate would say he has or over here on the democratic side where bernie sanders is talking
about political revolution. hillary clinton says i understand the system, i know how to get things done. bernie sanders says i know how to get it done. >> casey hunt, we're awfully happy to have her on the home team. casey, thanks. over to kristen welker we go from the point of view of the clinton campaign, the traveling clinton effort. kristen, here's what's interesting about this. as they both roared out of eye owe wa, i think most would have anticipated the clinton campaign would have gotten more aggressive on something like. this as they look at the field, a 33 point lead by sanders, that's 33 yards of running room that hillary clinton had to make this more competitive in new hampshire and here we are bogged down in a two-day debate over the meaning of a word and where she fits in. >> reporter: i think that's a great point, brian. look, you're hearing her draw sharper battle lines, not only on this point but a whole host of other issues. but to pick up on the conversation you were having with casey, i think secretary
clinton's ability to define herself as a progressive is critical, not necessarily because she's behind here in new hampshire but more broadly as she fights for the democratic nomination because as casey pointed out, there is a sector, a growing sector of the democratic party that does identify with these progressive values. so today she was answering that charge, that she's been inconsistent and she did it by laying out what she believes are examples of her progressive ideology. she went all the way back to when she was the first lady, when she fought to get health care for children. she talked about that speech that she gave in beijing on women's rights. take a listen to what she had to say earlier today in derry, new hampshire. >> we've been fighting the progressive fight and getting results for people for years so i hope we keep it on the issues because if it's about our records, hey, i'm going to win
by a landslide on tuesday. >> reporter: so that's her broader point, brian, that she is a progressive who likes to get things done. we keep hearing her make that argument. interestingly today, she also tried to draw sharp battle lines over the issue of guns. that is one of those rare issues where she is to the left of senator sanders where she can actually make the argument that she is the one standing up to the establishment, the nra, whereas, bernie sanders has had a checkered background in that regard. it's an acknowledgment by secretary clinton that she's failing to actually reach that sector of the democratic party. in terms of catching up here in new hampshire, her campaign officials say, look, it's been a tough slog. they've been trying to lower expectations for months here, brian, but i think if they can close the gap a little bit they're going to see that as closer to a victory. brian. >> our long-time white house correspondent, kristen welker on the clinton campaign today in new hampshire. kristen, thanks. as we said, all of this just
brings added attention to tomorrow night's debate. the only head-to-head debate prior to voters going to the polls in the first in the nation primary in new hampshire. tomorrow night's broadcast here at 9:00 p.m. it will be moderated by chuck todd and the woman who joins us by telephone right now, rachel maddow. rachel, i am sensing that you are sensing there this kind of heightened pressure going into tomorrow night, that there is -- there are genuine disagreements again flying around between these two campaigns. >> brian, you're exactly right, and there are genuine disagreements. and the thing that i'm sort of struck by, which keeps coming back to me as we're working on debate questions, coming up with strategy, thinking about what we're going to put to these candidates is that they have yet to be on a stage one on one just the two of them at the same time answering each other's charges and having these fights face to face. and we're seeing the tone get
sharper and sharper through the media of dueling campaign appearances, today in particular through the medium of twitter. but having them say these things to each other face to face as they're criticisms of each other are getting so much sharper, i think it's a really big question mark as to how they will comport themselves in that environment. i think they're both very civil, relatively gentile people. i have no idea how these charges are going to fly when they've got to stand next to each other and make them in person. >> rachel, as you know, the audience is also going to matter tomorrow night, both there in the hall, more broadly across the first in the nation primary state, and even more broadly than that, over our air waves being seen by a whole slew of potential voters in decision 2016. >> that's right. the iowa caucuses ending the way they did, with hillary clinton technically getting the victory but it basically for all intents and purposes being a tie, i do
think that sort of re-sets the democratic primary process a little bit. this is obviously not what anybody would have expected six months ago let alone a year ago, but it also, i think, has drawn so much attention to what a strong contender bernie sanders is that a lot of people are going to be looking at these two candidates basically for the first time. new hampshire voters are used to being very well-informed and very engaged in this stuff. i think a lot of them know more about what they're facing than the rest of the country, but i think iowa was a real shot across the bow for a country who might have thought this was going to be a core nation for hillary clinton and there was no real democratic contest. there is a real democratic contest and these candidates, i think they like each other but i think they disagree on a lot. this is a fight to define what it means to be a democrat after barack obama. i've got so many unanswered questions, and i think it's going to be a real surprise to see what comes of having the two of them on stage head to head for the first time. >> rachel, you're too polite to
put it this way but i will. take the last time you were together with the democratic candidates, the forum in south carolina. not only were they all separated but martin o'malley was still in the race. while he was polling at the end at 3 to 4%, he still got about 33% of the air time when the candidates got together. this is going to be, as i need not remind you or chuck, awfully intimate. >> yes. that's exactly right. it's going to be myself and chuck todd sitting right next to each other. it's going to be bernie sanders and hillary clinton on stage standing next to each other and that's it. and because it is just two people, because it isn't a larger group like the poor republican debate moderators have to contend with with that whole brady bunch that they've got up there, because it is just the two of them, this is -- there's a lot of leeway for them to talk to each ear. there's a lot of opportunity for them to mix it up. it's not like martin o'malley
was stopping that because of anything specific about his personality, it was just a three-way dynamic is different than a two-way dynamic. this is going to be a whole new thing that we have really never seen before. and so i'm -- you know, i just remember hillary clinton versus barack obama when it got down to the two of them in 2008 and how electric those debates were. the contrast between bernie sanders and hillary clinton is even stronger, and he's been in public office a lot longer and has done a lot more debates than barack obama had at this point in that analogous race. i think it's going to be sparky stuff. >> we will all be watching very carefully. i have the honor of hosting your pre-game show as it were tomorrow night, and we thank 1/2 of our moderating team, rachel maddow, for being with us by telephone today. it will be rachel and chuck todd tomorrow night, 9:00 p.m. eastern time. the only face-to-face debate these two candidates will have prior to folks in the granite
state going to the polls. let's bring in another duo, mark halpern and john heilman. they are co-hosts with all due respect bloomberg television productions that we're happy to say airs here on msnbc at 6:00 p.m. eastern time on msnbc. mark, starting with you, handicap this going in, what we know is going to be a fascinating dynamic, again, sadly without the o'malley factor. just two on two tomorrow night. >> i think you and rachel are exactly right. we don't know what the dynamic will be, but it will be very different. it comes on a day of extraordinary engagement between clinton and sanders. the winner of this primary, or if it's sanders the margin by which he wins will tell the tale. there are no contests until the week following the saturday after the primary. that is a very long stretch for the winner to bass being in success and for the loser to have no chance to come back with
a win. >> john? >> yeah, brian, i think that's right. look, i mean, you've seen -- there's been a calibration going on with the clinton campaign about how much they wanted to play to win here in new hampshire and how much they wanted to up the stakes of this race given bernie sander's pronounced lead. i believe over the course of the last 24 hours that decision has been made. it's been made in favor of the view of bill clinton who feels it's very important for him to narrow the margin or even try to stage a comeback victory in this state that has been so hospitable to the clintons over the many, many years. i think it's reflected in the way hillary clinton today has gone after bernie sanders with more aggression than she did yesterday, the way in which bernie sanders has fired back at her. this is now going to be a knock down drag out six days between now and next tuesday and i think that the debate on thursday night is going to be one of the main places in which we're going to see those fist a cuffs escalate in a way we haven't
seen escalate on the democratic side. >> mark, while it's clear that the democrats have provided the kinetic energy, the btus of the new hampshire race so far, let's turn the race a little bit to the republicans. specifically, if you get out of the top three, if you're not talking about cruz, trump, rubio, handicap for me where you think the rest of the field, who among the members of the rest of the field may stand the best chance that we haven't been thinking or talking about perhaps in new hampshire? >> well, that -- the kasich, bush, christie. all three of them can point to some things that suggest they will be the top finisher among the three of them and they hope ahead of both cruz and rubio. i just came from a rally with chris christie. he made it clear to me in an interview afterwards, he's not leaving anything on the floor. he's not leaving new hampshire without fighting. he called marco rubio the boy in the bubble. i think chris christie's counting on the debate on saturday to take down as many people as he can because he is
not a guy who will go quietly. he has a little bit of jersey in him and you know exactly what i mean by that. jeb bush is bringing his mother in. he's playing the bush card. he's trying to appeal to older women. we'll see if playing the bush card at the end allows him to recoup some of the damage that the bush brand has done to him and then there's john kasich who has quietly, quietly moved up. he has gotten newspaper endorsements that do matter in this state. he is not going negative. that may put him in a place to sneak up the middle. >> john, of those three, who do you think emerges? >> really hard to say, brian. i have to say it's not been a good state historically for bushes, that's one thing to say. i think i have a strange sense that maybe john kasich, who has had some momentum here of late, and who has been the differentiated candidate who's been, as mark suggested, the positive candidate, the candidate of hope. i think it might be that the
kasich surprise might be the most likely among those three on primary night to try to stand out and say, wow, we didn't see that coming. >> yeah, you're right. i think his earnestness is appreciated and well liked in new hampshire. gentlemen, always a pleasure to talk to you guys. we could fill the whole hour with our conversation. suffice to say, we'll be watching your broadcast tonight to halpern and heilman, thank you very much. we'll take a break. when we come back, more on the republicans, specifically jeb bush and what this race in new hampshire means to his remaining political fire wall. also, the big gun he's chosen to bring into new hampshire. that and more in new hampshire when we continue. it is no surprise that donald is throwing yet another temper tantrum or if you like another trumpertantrum. it seems his reaction is to throw a fit, engage in insults. i understand that donald finds it very hard to lose. incredible bladder protection from always discreet
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brian williams back here with you for the hour from new york. and let's try something we haven't in a long time, shall we? let's try to talk to hallie jackson with the traveling cruz campaign in goffstown, new hampshire, via iphone. who needs fancy dancy camera crews when we can try this. what could go wrong? >> i know. >> hallie, tell me where you are. >> reporter: so, listen, we are on the move, brian.
we're here with senator cruz's campaign bus. he just wrapped up a stop in goffstown. interestingly, this stop was significant as i dump you into his stop. the senator, as you see this, a breakdown of his campaign. he had some very, very harsh words to say about donald trump and this issue about trump's call to nullify essentially the election results. claiming cruz is a cheater and a fraud. i asked him about trump's tweets this morning and the comments about cruz's campaign. >> senator, a lot of attack he is calling you a cheater. he is calling you a fraud. does this cross the line for you? >> listen, donald's insults get more and more hysterical the more and more upset he gets, and that's fine. he can do that. i'm not going to respond in kind. >> do you think they're funny? >> i think they're very funny. i think donald -- i wake up
every day and laugh at the latest thing donald has tweeted because he's losing it. >> reporter: he's losing it. some strong words from senator cruz here. at one point he even compared trump's actions to those of his daughters. he is really ramping up we are seeing his line of attack against donald trump also adding that he will not let -- be letting any staffers go easy or scapegoating anybody because of the issue with ben carson. they shared that carson was heading to florida, not to new hampshire or south carolina after the iowa caucuses and failing to follow up that carson was not actually dropping out of the race. you can see the empty room here. 15 minutes ago, not even, this room was absolutely packed with people. you couldn't even move as ted cruz continues his retail stops here in new hampshire. brian? i guess it worked. you didn't lose the shot, right? >> we only lost you two times for a brief period. hallie jackson via iphone from
goffstown, new hampshire. now with an actual camera, camera crew in manchester, new hampshire, not so much a veteran correspondent of the trump campaign as much as she is a survisu survivor of it, she is a survivor. i want to play some sound from donald trump this morning talking about the lessons he has learned coming out of iowa. >> well, i think we could have used a better ground game, a term i wasn't even familiar with. when you hear ground game you say, what the hell is that? now i'm familiar with it. >> so, now he knows what a ground game is. second place finisher out of iowa sitting on a lead in new hampshire but, katie, as no one need tell you, we're going to see how this trump style goes over in new hampshire. he's starting on the attack against the number one finisher, ted cruz. >> he is starting on the attack,
again against cruz. there are a lot of people out there wondering why he is bothering. it seems like he's looking backwards instead of looking forwards. i think that's because this fight between ted cruz right now has gotten personal for donald trump. he doesn't like to lose. he doesn't take it well. we saw this exactly with megyn kelly when she pushed him. he has not let that go, so i think we will continue to see him hammering cruz in any way he possibly can. we haven't seen him yet really go on the offensive against marco rubio, senator rubio. we thought that we might see that more considering that rubio came so close to him in iowa and could pose a potential threat to him in new hampshire. right now he's leading by 24 points in the latest polling here, but we're wondering if he can main thain, if that polling is as reliable as it might seem at the moment. i can tell you when we go to his rallies in new hampshire they've generally been a little bit more raucous, a little more excited. the lines are stronger. people seem like they have stronger support for donald trump than they did in iowa. in terms of ground game here,
i've spoken to some gop sources who say they haven't really seen much of a ground game even though donald trump didn't really know what that was until recently according to him. until very recently here. right now i have spoken to the campaign themselves and they say they have seven phone banks in this state. they say they have volunteers who have made thousands of calls. other volunteers who have made thousands of door knocks, the get out the vote message here. what they've seen what happened in iowa and now know they need to get serious about this state because a loss here in new hampshire could really spell the end for donald trump. >> katie, what they're not doing with senator rubio, governor christie is kind of doing for them. his -- his comment yesterday calling rubio the boy in the bubble, meaning practiced, mechanized, studied campaign appearances, not a lot left to chance. that got through. that's something that's going to keep hammering. that will benefit anyone else
who's competing against marco rubio. >> reporter: marco rubio held a gaggle today. that was one of the knocks that chris christie leveled against him. he didn't talk to reporters that much. i have spoken to some voters out here and they do like marco rubio. the ones i've spoken to say they're worried about his record, his voting record. the proof that he's going to stand up for his actions. he hasn't shown up to vote. the establishment candidates realize in order to get out of this state and move on with their campaigns they need to tear down marco rubio. he is in some ways the establishment front-runner in this state so marco rubio has a target on his back. whether or not he's going to be able to defend himself, we're going to have to wait and see. the state votes on tuesday and it should be, in my opinion, even more interesting than iowa. >> katie tur from manchester, new hampshire. a lot of good stuff going by on trays as you were talking. forgive us for being distracted, katie. thanks. also strikes us for laypeople not in the business of
television, we should describe these terms. gaggle has nothing to do with waterfowl. it means a small group of usually the candidate and the journalists who cover him or her. when we come back, again, we've been promising you discussion of the others in this race. those still in, those who have dropped out and a concentration on the jeb bush campaign in new hampshire. that and more when we continue. ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪ ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪
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kate snow's been up there as part of our team talking to folks in manchester. hey, kate. >> reporter: hey, brian. we're at murphy's tap room here. we figured on a rainy, cold wednesday afternoon just about quitting time right now that we could find a few voters, and we have. i want to introduce you over here at the end of the bar to walt and nancy who have kindly agreed to answer just a couple of questions. it's walt and nancy genalski. walt, you were telling me that you supported obama. you voted for barack obama. >> yes. >> it sounds like you've gotten a little disheartened by him. now you're thinking about bernie sanders. >> yes, that's true. >> why? >> i like the things that he's saying. i like the -- i like his -- i like his stance on the economy and trying to do things for the middle class people. >> you guys are long-time new hampshire folks, right? >> yes. >> reporter: born and bred here?
nancy, you're a split couple. you're not with bernie sanders? >> no. >> reporter: who are you going for? >> hillary. >> reporter: why? >> i just think she's going to get more accomplished. >> reporter: you're worried -- does bernie sanders worry you that he says a lot of great things but he's not going to actually be able to -- >> i like him but i really don't think he has the same amount of experience to get it done. >> reporter: we have a debate tomorrow night. i hope you'll be watching tomorrow night between bernie sanders and hillary clinton. what do you want to hear them, walt, talk about? what would you be listening for? >> boy, that's a good question. i -- you know, they've been saying the same things over and over. i've listened to their -- i've listened to them both speak. i think they boldt have a lot of good things to say, i just -- i think for me, i just right now can't vote for hillary. i can't believe her. >> reporter: there's nothing she can say tomorrow night to change your mind? >> no. but if it comes to a general
election then i would vote for her. >> reporter: i'll let you get back to -- they're playing a trivia game, brian. i'm totally interrupting. drinking a couple beers, too. that's the story from up here. >> well, you have to do something on a rainy, cold day in manchester, new hampshire. kate snow, thanks. our thanks as well to walt and nancy. another break for us. our coverage of the politics of this day and this season right ahead. here's the jeb story. the jeb story is -- let's get this out of the way first. i'm a bush. and i'm proud of it. i love my mother, and she thinks i'm her favorite son. that's -- that's -- be good.
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in new hampshire. >> chris christie on marco rubio. one brief side note here. i don't know what it says about us that fully four of our correspondents today have reported from bars in new hampshire. i fear i know exactly what it says about us, and here's the fourth. gabe gutierrez who says he is covering marco rubio in new hampshire. his surroundings notwithstanding. gabe, i guess the question is, this is a -- this is day two of a two-day attack on rubio by chris christie. he's doing the bidding of a lot of other republicans in the field who can let chris christie do that, but when will we know if it's having an impact on the third place finisher in iowa? >> reporter: hey there, brian. we should know in the next few days. i swear to you that i am here reporting on the rubio campaign, but we just moved locations. he's had a series of town halls today. we were in laconia a short time ago. this is in dover. this is cara's irish pub. let me show you around as the
rubio advance team gets this event set up. voters we've been talking to today in new hampshire say there's some sort of excitement here with the rubio campaign, more so than they had before their strong finish in iowa, but the knock on the rubio campaign by the other so-called establishment candidates is that he's too scripted. so he's trying to be at these town halls to get that message across that he is best positioned to take on bernie sanders and hillary clinton. earlier today he spoke with reporters and we asked him about the attacks from the other candidates. here's what he had to say. >> senator, jeb bush took out a full page ad against you today. how -- do you expect to deliver a knockout blow against jeb bush here in new hampshire? >> i want to do as well as we possibly can in new hampshire. we're going to keep working hard. i'm not running against any of the other candidates in this case, i'm running for president. >> given he was your mentor, how much does that ad sting? >> i don't even -- i don't even know the ad you're referring to.
>> reporter: now chris christie, of course, called him the boy in the bubble, brian. you mentioned that christie took that swipe at him yesterday and has continued his attacks. rubio really has gone out of his way today to not answer those. he really has side stepped any questions about donald trump and the other candidates. >> gabe gutierrez in dover, new hampshire, with the traveling rubio campaign. gabe, thanks. let's go to kelly o'donnell now to talk about john kasich's effort in new hampshire. kelly's in manchester. kelly, kasich really has been the recipient of some very valuable newspaper endorsements. this will kind of be the test to see if they do, indeed, matter there. >> reporter: well, brian, i'm going to give you the deposition voice. you and i have done this before. i'm actually in a law firm conference room where there's a business town hall going on. governor kasich is behind me answering questions here so i'm going to try to keep it on the lower side and not to interrupt too much. yes, he has received prominent endorsements, although it's
questionable if those endorsements really touch republican voters when you consider "the new york times" and "the boston globe" are not papers that necessarily republicans would get their best advice from. i've been spending a lot of time with governor kasich and he is trying to make the case here in these final days in new hampshire, this is town hall number 95 for him. trying to get that sense of up close, personal, asking and answering of questions, the kind of thing he thinks he can do well. we had some time together today and he really gave me a sense of the stakes and what he faces and here's how he described them, brian. >> if i get smoked here, it's over. i mean, then i go home, but i don't think that's going to happen. and we are prepared to move very quickly. you've got to remember something, kelly. people didn't think i'd get in. they didn't think i'd raise the money. they didn't think i'd be able to debate. they didn't think i'd be able to make it to new hampshire. all of those things happened. i've always been underestimated and i've always ended up being that little engine that just
keeps on going. >> reporter: and he also tells me no hail mary's this week, he's just going to grind it out every day until tuesday and then he'll take the judgment of voters and have a sense of what comes next, but he's confident and it is a narrower lane of that sort of governor/executive experience, someone with a resume with a lot of accomplishments that he hopes will appeal to voters in a year when in many ways that has not been what voters are saying they want. so for john kasich, he's hoping the force of an ohio republican always important in the end total of electoral votes, that that will even get people to say he would be electable and he has experience. that's the experience he's saying here on the 18th floor. >> kelly, thank you very much for that report. we appreciate your audio sensitivity in the background. state of ohio has given the united states eight presidents. john kasich would like very much
to move that number ahead by one to nine. let's bring in michael steel, former state of maryland lieutenant governor, former head of the party, all around nice guy to talk about the jeb bush campaign, michael. the numbers just out show -- i have a bar graph here shows he spent $5200 per vote in iowa, the most of anyone, and of course got the least reaction, least bang for his buck. the other night during iowa i asked lawrence o'donnell on the air, what happened to jeb bush? he gave a one word answer, trump. my question to you, is it that simple? >> it is. it's actually i would give a one word and make it trump squared. i think he got it both barrels from donald trump right out of the gate, took him off his game, made him visibly uncomfortable on stage with him, dye min ni diminished his argument and it has been since that time that
jeb has tried to get his footing. i don't know. i guess the answer to the question of, you know, $5200 per voter in iowa is why? that is not a ground jeb bush had any footing on. this is the state he could begin to make that footing. certainly south carolina would be in play, even nevada. so there are a lot of things about the jeb bush campaign out of the gate that cause more questions for donors. certainly for the political establishment in washington who had great high hopes. marco rubio has now gun to fill that space and so the fight for a lot of these guys, certainly the governors, kasich, jeb and christie will be to take him down a notch. they have to prove and make the case that executive leadership in these times matter and that for some reason the idea that our first term inexperienced u.s. senator will be better than
the last in barack obama, that just is not the argument you want to allow marco to make. >> put another way, michael, is it just not his year? i mean, he is the establishment republican party, even friends of his admit though that trump's argument that he was low energy, that phrase just kind of remained with him like a brand. >> yeah, no. i think that's really what it kind of boils down to. maybe this is not the hour or the time, but the only person who can dissuade us of that idea is jeb. and he has to find the message here in new hampshire that kick starts this campaign in a way that pushes him past marco rubio. for everyone else other than trump and certainly for cruz, marco rubio cannot be allowed to come into second because it fits into the narrative that he set in motion coming out of iowa, that 3, 2, 1 strategy. hitting second here in new
hampshire basically knocks a hole into everybody else and then it really does effectively become a two-person race. now who that second person is, is it trump or cruz, that will be part of the battle. but for the governors, it could be a real problem. >> gop veteran michael steel, michael, thank you as always for coming on the air with us. >> you've got it. >> and mr. bush has decided to bring in his mom. barbara bush will be coming to campaign for two days for her son in new hampshire. another break. our coverage continues right after this. ♪ hi mom! hi! every mom is a coach... an artist... sometimes even a zoologist. every mom is a working mom... and it's working moms everywhere who inspired us to work harder. so we made our banquet meals even better. with mashed potatoes now made with real cream and chicken strips with 100% natural chicken breast.
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the argument is, look, you're behind here. i am. you're in your opponent's backyard. new hampshire always favors neighbors, which i think is neighborly. and, you know, maybe you should have just moved on to some of these other states where everybody says you've got big leads and all of that. i have to tell you, i just could not ever skip new hampshire. >> there you go. and more now about this contest between clinton and sanders. one of the great things about primary and caucus time is it's a lesson in geography, especially for those of us who
tend to get a little rusty. look at new hampshire. you've got canada to the north, maine to the east, they've got ocean front property along the atlantic for about 15 miles or so. you've got massachusetts to the south and there to the west, that's the problem for the clinton campaign because you've got the state of vermont. bernie sanders is one of two united states senators from vermont. steve kornacki is at the map with how this all impacts the clinton campaign. steve? >> reporter: brian, you hear it there from hillary clinton. bill clinton's been making this point. this is a big talking point for the clinton campaign. this has to do with setting expectations in new hampshire. they are losing. they want everybody to remember that bernie sanders is from next door in vermont. they want people to say, well, it's not really a fair fight. that's a big advantage. here's the thing, it's not nearly the advantage the clinton campaign is making it out to be. vermont over here, maine over here. the key though is massachusetts is right down here. so take these two counties. this is hillsboro, this is
rockingham. about half the population, about half the voters in new hampshire are right here. these are population rich areas that are very connected to boston. you've got route 93 that runs down, about a 45 minute drive from southern new hampshire. a lot of people work in massachusetts. here's the key, they get their television from boston, from massachusetts. so the advantage that's existed in the new hampshire primary for next door neighbor candidates that the clintons are talking about, that's really been a massachusetts advantage. it was michael dukakis, it was paul tsongas, john kerry. they're next door neighbors like bernie sanders, but they're from massachusetts where they were in the television market, they were on television for the people in the state for years. bernie sanders, by contrast, vermont, sure, burlington's basically up here. you're not getting burlington television all the way down here in southern new hampshire in the population rich areas of the state. there is an advantage to bernie
sanders coming from vermont and you see it right here, along the connecticut river, along the vermont border. they call some of this area vermont east. culturally it has a lot in common with vermont. bernie sanders probably does get an advantage there, but the key thing to remember is when bernie sanders got into this race, when you polled new hampshire, this was not an even race, this is not a race bernie sanders was leading. he was getting absolutely clobbered. that's not the thing you see when you have a built-in advantage. >> the interesting thing about the folks in southern new hampshire is a lot of them have fled north from the uncharitably described as taxachusetts. they are happy to be living in southern new hampshire as well. >> there are a lot of massachusetts ex-pats especially when you look in this tier, on the very southern border of new hampshire. a lot of people there. a lot of massachusetts roots. a lot of massachusetts ties there. >> steve kornacki at the board. a pleasure as always. thank you very much for the
explainer. of all places today with his name firmly in the news, at the top of the conversation politically, donald trump went to arkansas today. perhaps we can find out why from nbc's kerry sanders, who is covering him in arkansas today. kerry, i must say, this was a head scratcher today. >> reporter: it really was, and i think it caught a lot of people off guard, but not his supporters who are already filling up here in the coliseum at the state fairgrounds. they've come to hear donald trump. in part, those who are with the campaign are indicating this has as much to do with donald trump trying to now come up with a ground game in the southern states. as i make my way down here, we can actually talk to some of the voters here about, first of all, sir, did donald trump lose in iowa? >> i think he thinks he lost. i personally don't think he did
but -- >> because? >> i think he left the state too early probably. i really don't know. i don't know. >> reporter: he makes his way here to arkansas in the middle of what is a lot of attention on new hampshire. what does that do for you as a voter that he's coming here when super tuesday is still a little off? >> i don't think he's that worried about new hampshire and i appreciate him coming here because it doesn't happen often. >> reporter: so he comes here in a coliseum where there may be as many as 10,000 people, at least that's what it holds. you're 20 years old. probably the first time you've ever participated in something like this, correct? >> that's correct. >> reporter: why donald trump? >> i love how he's not afraid to stand up in for what he believes in and how he's not afraid to step on toe toss get the message out. that's what we need to hear. >> reporter: he comes to arkansas when there's so much at steak in new hampshire. what does that signal? >> to me it does signal that he cares about the state. he still wants to preach his
message. well, not preach, but he wants to tell it to us and tell us what he thinks to influence us to vote for him more so than a ted cruz or a rubio. >> reporter: thank you very much. brian, you know, these are just some of the voters here who gather. they're going to be here till donald trump begins speaking. we anticipate that the crowds that are coming here, you know, we're going to step in front of where sort of the media is. you're going to see a block here. you can see over here, this is the podium where donald trump will be getting up on stage talking to the crowd. the gallup poll that came out today is interesting because for the first time in eight years now we see that 20 states are either now solidly republican or leaning republican. that's the first time in eight years. there are only 14 states now that are democrat or leaning democrat. so it's interesting that he comes here at a time where obviously ted cruz and marco rubio will also be coming, but he comes early and his campaign thinks that a stop like this and
because he has a private plane and he can pretty much go wherever he wants, a stop like this will pay off. that's part of what they say is part of their long-term ground game that has been missing clearly in iowa. in fact, donald trump admitted it as much. brian. >> kerry sanders in the arena in arkansas today. yes, arkansas. that's where donald trump will be making his next public appearance, his next appearance during this campaign of decision 2016. that is going to do it for this hour of our coverage. a reminder about that item in the lower right-hand corner of your screen. tomorrow evening, why is this gathering important? it is the only head-to-head meeting. again, in a field without martin o'malley now, things get intimate. their only head-to-head debate prior to the voters in new hampshire going to the polls for the first in the nation primary. we will televise it live
tomorrow night, 9:00 p.m. eastern time on msnbc. it will be moderated by rachel maddow and chuck todd who happens to be the host of the next hour. it's "meet the press" mtp daily with chuck todd from new hampshire next. if it's wednesday, it's just over 24 hours until the first one-on-one debate in either party. clinton, sanders, six days until the new hampshire primary. just what's this fight really about? this is "mtb daily" and it starts right now. good evening from manchester, new hampshire on this first of many first in the nation special editions of "mtp daily" over the next week.