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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  April 5, 2016 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT

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[cheers and applause] and our fundamental right to protect our families and our homes and our children. [cheers and applause] we'll see a president -- if you're joining us at the top of the hour we are listening to ted cruz, a victory speech tonight. it was projected earlier on this evening when all the votes are counted he be the victor in wisconsin. he enjoys a healthy margin over donald trump. >> instead of negotiating with terrorists, we'll rip to shreds this catostrophic iranian nuclear deal. [cheers and applause] we will defeat radical islamic terrorism and we will utterly destroy isis.
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[cheers and applause] we will have a president who keeps us safe. [cheers and applause] to the soldiers and sailors, the airmen and marines, to the police officers and firefighters and first responders who risk their lives every day to keep us safe, we will have a commander in chief who has your back. [cheers and applause] jobs, freedom and security, that's what this next election is all about.
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in 1980 millton and rose freedom wrote free to choice. they explained that the american free enterprise system has been the greatest engine for opportunity prosperity that the world has ever seen. too much government can stifle opportunity, but if we get washington out of the way there's no limit to what we can accomplish. [cheers and applause] it's what allowed my dad to escape cuba to come to america with nothing, washing dishes for 50 cents a day, to start a business and today to be a pastor. [cheers and applause] it's what allowed my
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irish-italian mom to be the first in her family to go to college, to smash glass ceilings by becoming a computer programmer. [cheers and applause] it's what allowed my wife heidi -- [cheers and applause] at victory headquarters tonight in wisconsin there is ted cruz with his wife heidi and there is a big victory by ted cruz over donald trump. let's go across town. chris matthews in milwaukee. >> we're talking double digit numbers. >> that's what i thought was gonna happen. the big margins that he would
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run up here in wisconsin. the only surprise is that the gender gap wasn't bigger. as soon as he decided to break bad on scott walker, basically i think that was -- >> walker's popular. >> he's popular here. he has an 80% approval rating among republicans. he had a bad week, but don't miss the fact that donald trump was about 30% -- 34% all along. he never moved up or down. he had a floor and ceiling. so what happened here was the coalescing around ted cruz which happened in impressive fashion. >> so trump's heavy campaigning here the last several days may have forestalled a much worse defeat. what was he trying to do? >> that's a good question, but it did not move the needle at all. i was talking to a number of republicans yesterday and they knew this was coming and they asked why is donald trump still predicting that he's going to win when pretty much knew it was going to be double digits.
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that's what donald trump does. if your brand is i'm a winner, that's all he knows. >> do some translating. there were clear call to arms. he went through the whole list tonight. >> right. >> explain to me. i'm a moderate liberal i guess. explain to me why common core seems to ring the bell with people. what is that all about because he made a point of that tonight. what's the evil of common core. >> that is not an issue that i personally have emphasized a lot. >> we keep hearing it. >> i think what it is it is the signal of the federal government trying to take over the schools, it's the obama administration -- >> what would the federal government do with the schools? >> you would be controlling the kir ruk lum. >> to what effect. >> one of my first books was dumbing down our kids.
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>> we have standards. >> i think what happened was there was just the sense this was more of the obama administration overreach and i think that became the hot button issue. >> wisconsin, heavy victory for cruz. can cruz win the nomination? >> yes. >> can he win it? >> yes. >> how does he win it. >> he can only win it at an open convention. every republican saw it as a path to an open convention. he's not going to get the 1237 votes, but this will effectively block donald trump from sealing this nomination. if he doesn't win on the first ballot he's not going to win the nomination. >> anything is possible. ted cruz wins the nomination on the third or fourth ballot. what do you do with the body. what do you do with trump? he's still there. >> this is part of the calculation of every republican that i've talked to here in wisconsin basically says ted cruz might not be the strongest
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candidate, but they know that donald trump would be unelectable. so there's the choice. it's one thing to lose the election, but another thing to lose your soul. donald trump is giving up too much. >> is it too hard to say you'd rather lose with cruz than win with trump. >> nobody thinks you can win with trump. everybody thinks it would be an absolute wipe-out throughout the ticket. that's not a choice. >> can he beat hillary in wisconsin. >> i think it's very hard. >> can he beat her in ohio or virginia. >> right now the big question was can you stop donald trump -- >> you're not so hopeful of cruz winning this thing. >> i'm not irrational about it, but we'll have a conservative candidate on the ballot. if donald trump was the nominee you have somebody who has abandoned almost every conservative principal. you would be tainted.
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i think it would taint the republican party for maybe a generation. i've spent 20 years telling guys like you we are not racist, we are not sexist. >> you're not for punishing the woman. >> no. here is the guy who is ever stereotype of liberals about conservatives and i think a lot of wisconsinans are going so now our image is going to be sacrificed to this guy. >> i see why you're good on the radio. this is very clear. i love that description of what the conservatives at the grassroots feel about trump. i thought it was interesting. >> thanks. if people are tuning in -- >> that was a great interview. >> you're hearing this phrase lose for cruz for the first time, it is the most cynical way of viewing politics, forgive the redundantsy because it may help races by running cruz for the presidency even though you yourself as a republican may
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find him unelectable, there goes lose with cruz. we can report the domain name is owned by nicole wallace. >> lose with cruz 2016. >> i did not -- i did not -- >> i bought the domain. >> my name has been invoked. >> you'll get your chance to defend your gifted receipt of the name after we hear from casie hunt who is in wyoming. remind our viewers why he's there on the night of the wisconsin primary. >> reporter: that's a very accurate description of how bernie sanders handles these events. largely stump speech. so we get a little bit on this wisconsin victory, but he is here in wyoming to show he's pushing forward. there's a caucus coming up here on saturday in wyoming for
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democrats, that's why they're here. we're still watching for that margin in wisconsin for this bernie sanders win there that we've projected. that's going to matter quite a bit for delegate allocation and it's going to tell us a lot about his potential prospects down the line. bernie sanders has been so insi insist ent he does have a path to victory. he gets irritated when you suggest that he doesn't. i talked to his wife today and she expressed some of that frustration to me as well. the reality is if you can't rack up a big margin in an open primary where he wins independents overwhelming in a place that has a wider electorate that has a lot of college kids, those young kids turn out for him, and has a history of progressivism, it's hard to see how he's going to turn out a big win in these other bigger states coming up,
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new york, new jersey, et cetera. that said they are planning a series of major events in new york city that are expected to draw tens of thousands of people to hillary clinton's adopted home turf. one is planned for washington square park. hillary clinton is going to have some rough optics as she fights with bernie sanders. >> the latest from the traveling sanders campaign. don't read too much into body language, personal appearance or lack thereof, but tonight donald trump is down, no scheduled events here in new york city. tonight, hillary clinton no scheduled events either. that means crystal is free to join us. what have you heard from the clinton effort. >> reporter: they said they are still processing these results. they don't have an official reaction yet. they want to see what the margins are ultimately once the
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final numbers come in, but this is not a surprise. they've been down playing expectations in wisconsin for weeks now expecting that this would not only be a loss, but potentially a larger loss, but this goes back to this issue we keep talking about math versus momentum. it's not clear that senator sanders is going to net a lot of delegates tonight, but he will get a lot of momentum heading into new york and that is why the clinton campaign has been all hands on deck here. hillary clinton was campaigning here today. she had a fundraiser here tonight. you can expect this pace to continue because new york is critical to her campaign. it has more than 200 delegates and it's also her adopted home turf. she served as senator here. expect her to campaign aggressively in the next few weeks because a loss would be devastating. now in terms of the spin that i think we're going to hear once the campaign officially responds, they're going to tout
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the fact that she still has a very large delegate lead and that in the coming contest they don't needily favor sanders. they are closed primaries whereas wisconsin is an open primary and that contributed to this win tonight. >> thanks. as part of a roundtable of our correspondents tonight andrea mitchell as we mentioned is also on hand. andrea, i'm thinking that this might be dubbed the metro card primary for new york. it's almost as if hillary clinton knew it would be coming back this way, thus the headquartering of her campaign in brooklyn. this metro card has come up in the campaign, a little thing, but in this strange year little things sometimes get big. bernie sanders mentioned you need a token to ride a subway. haven't used those for years and years. are we really looking at a big guy for new york there. show us your metro card.
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are we really looking for a big battle of new york? >> bernie sanders is claiming new york is his home, but it was his home many years ago before he became a resident of vermont and the mayor of vermont. it is a battle. you're going to have things like bernie sanders had 18,000 people in the south bronx the other day. that was an enormous rally. hillary clinton does not have those kinds of crowds. she was in brooklyn today. she's in the bronx tonight, dare i say it's what bobby kennedy used to say, it's riverdale. it was $10,000 a head and they had 60 people there. it's continuing her private fundraising which is what barack obama does and did, but bernie
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sanders is the only candidate in any of these campaigns who has been able to raise millions and millions of dollars, outraising hillary clinton for the last three months, doing it in march more than $44 million. doing it online with small donors. that's his calling card. so he doesn't have the metro card, he doesn't have the token, but he did make a number of what anyone would call missteps in this daily news editorial board and it's going to be on the front page. particularly in a question that he's answered -- often answers about his belief in immunity for gun manufacturers. that's his position. in this case he was asked by the daily news about it in the context of the sandy hook families who are suing for recommendies and relief and for damages. in that context with connecticut coming three weeks from now, that's a damaging answer. he also according to the clinton campaign he's been a single
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issue candidate. that's not true, but he certainly has made wall street a big issue. he couldn't answer how he would break up the banks and who has the authority to break up the banks so he's going to be answering questions about that to come. >> thank you. and now from the victor in wisconsin tonight, bernie sanders. ♪ i was told that there were about 5,000 people who participated in the last wyoming caucus. it looks like all of them are here tonight! thank you! [cheers and applause] thank you very much for coming out and let me remind everybody that we've got a really important caucus here on
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saturday. doors open at 9:00 a.m. let's be there. let's win in wyoming. [cheers and applause] i don't know if the audience here knows it -- i don't see any tvs here, but it has been projected, i think, by all of the networks that we won in wisconsin! [cheers and applause] bernie! bernie! bernie! bernie! bernie! bernie! bernie! bern bernie! >> now, let me -- let me say a
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word. well, maybe two words, i don't know, about what momentum is all about. momentum is starting this campaign 11 months ago and the media determining that we were a fringe candidacy. momentum is starting the campaign 60 to 70 points behind secretary clinton. momentum is that within the last couple of weeks there have been national polls which have had us 1 point up or 1 point down. [cheers and applause] momentum is that when you look at national polls or you look at statewide polls, we are defeating donald trump by very
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significant numbers. [cheers and applause] and in almost every instance in national polls and in state polls, our margin over trump is wider than is secretary clinton. [cheers and applause] with the victory in wisconsin tonight -- and let me take this opportunity to thank the people of wisconsin for their strong support. [cheers and applause] with our victory tonight in wisconsin, we have now won seven out of eight of the last caucuses and primaries. [cheers and applause]
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and we have won almost all of them with overwhelming land slide numbers. [cheers and applause] what momentum is about is that at a time in contemporary politics when every major candidate has a superpac, we have said no to the superpacs, said no to the billionaires who fund those superpacs. [cheers and applause] and what we have done is in an unprecedent unprecedented manor in american history we have up to this point in the campaign received over 6
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million individual campaign contributions. [cheers and applause] anyone here know what the average contribution is? >> $27. >> that's exactly right. smart crowd. $27. to paraphrase ab raw ham lincoln this is a campaign by the people, for the people and of the people. [cheers and applause] we have decided that we do not represent the billionaire class. we do not represent wall street or the drug companies or the
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fossil fuel industry. [cheers and applause] and we do not want their money. [cheers and applause] what momentum is about is my belief that if we wake up the american people and if working people and middle class people and senior citizens and young people begin to stand up, fight back and come out and vote in large numbers, there is nothing that we cannot accomplish. [cheers and applause]
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and what we have been seeing throughout this campaign is extraordinary voter turnouts in state after state after state. [cheers and applause] and i am particularly grateful and pleased that at a time when many of the pundits said, you know, those young people, they don't want to get involved in politics, they're not really concerned about the major issues facing our country, they're too busy with their video games or whatever, well you know what's happening? all over this country young people are standing up and they're saying you know what, we want to help determine the future of this country, which we are going to inherent. [cheers and applause]
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what momentum is about is that all across this country the american people are looking around them and they understand that real change in our country's history, whether it is the trade union movement, whether it is the civil rights movement, whether it is the women's movement, whether it is the gay rights movement -- [cheers and applause] -- they understand that real change never, ever takes place from the top on down. it always takes place from the bottom on up! [cheers and applause] and today from coast to coast and i have been from coast to
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coast -- i've been in california and main and all the states in between, and people are saying why is it in america we have grotesque levels of income and wealth inequality, why is it that the top 10% owns as much wealth as the bottom 90%? why is it that for the last 90 years the great middle class of this country has been shrinking and almost all new income and wealth is going to the top 1%? the american people are asking why is it that women go to work tomorrow and they're earning 79 cents on the dollar compared to men? [cheers and applause] people are asking how does it
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happen that the united states of america, our great nation, is the only major country on earth not to guarantee paid family and medical leave. [cheers and applause] there are women giving birth in w wyoming and wisconsin today, but they're gonna have to go back to work in two or three weeks because they don't have the income to take care of their family, which is why together we are going to pass three months paid family and medical leave. [cheers and applause] and the american people from co coast to coast, they're asking, yes the affordable care act has
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done a lot of very good things, thank you president obama for your leadership, but in terms of health care there is much, much more that has to be done. [cheers and applause] and the american people are asking why does it happen that every other major country on earth, united kingdom, france, germany, holland, canada, every major country on earth guarantees health care to all of their people as a right except the united states and together we're going to change that international embarrassment. [cheers and applause] and the american people are asking and young people are
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asking why is it that when we are living in an increasingly competitive global economy, why is that kids are graduating college, 30, 50, $70,000 in debt. [ boos ] and in some cases -- in some cases spending decades having to pay out -- pay off that debt. we should be rewarding people who get the education they need, not punishing them. [cheers and applause] and the american -- the american people are asking how does it happen when the scientists all
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over our country who study climate change and scientists all over the world are in virtual anonymous agreement that climate change is real, that it is caused by human activity, that it is already causing devastating problems in our country and around the world, how do we have a republican party that refuses to even acknowledge the reality of climate change? [cheers and applause] bernie! bernie! bernie! >> and the american people are asking how does it happen that we can spend trillions of dollars fighting a war in iraq
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that we never should have gotten in in the first place -- [cheers and applause] -- but that in flint, michigan and in cities all over this country our inner cities are crumbling, unemployment off the charts, health care system not accessible, kids dropping out of high school, too too many being arrested and sent to jail, how come we can rebuild the infrastructure of iraq and afghanistan, but we cannot rebuild our own crumbling infrastructu infrastructure? [cheers and applause]
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the american -- the american people are asking as they assemble all over this country, why can we not end a campaign finance system which is corrupt and which is undermining american democracy? [cheers and applaus [cheers and applause] democracy is not a complicated process. it means that you have a vote and you have a vote and you have a vote and majority wins. what democracy is not about is billionaires buying elections. [cheers and applause] and the american people are
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asking another very important and profound question and that question is how does it happen in the wealthiest nation in the history of the world that we have more people in jail than any other country on earth? [cheers and applause] and what the american people are saying is that now is the time to invest in our young people in terms of jobs and education, not jails and incarceration. [cheers and applause] and some of you have recently heard about the discovery in the revelations about the tax that is taking place in panama, which
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is one of the reasons that i oppose the free trade agreement with panama. [cheers and applause] one of the reasons i was on the floor of the senate talking exactly about what i feared would happen and that is wealthy people and large corporations figuring out ways to avoid paying their fair share of taxes. [cheers and applause] and what the american people are asking is at a time of massive income and wealth inequality, how does it happen that you have large profitable multi-national corporations, who in a given year pay zero, not a penny, in federal income taxes. [ boos ]
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>> now change, real change, comes about, whether it is fighting racism, worker explo exploitation, real change comes about when people stand up and say you know what, the status quo is not working, we can do better. [cheers and applause] yes we can! yes, we can! >> i can give you many examples, but let me give you the most contemporary example of what happens when people stand up and fight back. if we were here in this beautiful auditorium five years ago, not a long time from a historical perspective, and
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somebody jumped up and said i think a $7.25 federal wage is a starvation raise and it has to be raised to $15 an hour -- [cheers and applause] >> -- now somebody stood up five years ago and said that, the person next to them would have said you're nuts. 15 bucks an hour? you want to more than double the minimum wage. you're crazy. maybe, maybe, we get it up to eight, nine bucks an hour, but 15 bucks an hour? you're dreaming. too big. sound familiar? it is unrealistic. it can't be done. think smaller. but then what happened is fast food workers, people working at mcdonalds, people working at burger king and wendy's, they went out on strike and i was
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very pride to join with those workers in washington. [cheers and applause] and they went out and they said fellow americans, we can't live on $7.25 an hour. we can't live on eight bucks an hour. you have to raise the minimum wage to 15 bucks an hour. and they fought and they fought and then suddenly a few years ago seattle, washington, 15 bucks an hour. [cheers and applaus [cheers and applause] los angeles, san francisco, 15 bucks an hour. [cheers and applause] oregon, 15 bucks an hour! [cheers and applause] and in the last several weeks in both california and new york, governors signed legislation for 15 bucks an hour.
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[cheers and applaus [cheers and applause] what is my point? my point is that, yes, we can change the status quo when we think big and when we have a vision. [cheers and applause] now, i am -- i am not naive. i know the power of wall street and their endless supplies of money. i know that corporate america will shut down plants in america and move to mexico or china, if they can make another $5 in profit. i know that billionaires are funding candidates whose job it is to represent the wealthy and the powerful. i know about the corporate media that will give us all of the
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information we need, except what is most important for working families. [cheers and applause] i know about all of that, but this is what i also know. i know that what history is about is that when people stand up and they say the status quo is not acceptable, we will not have children working in factories, we will not have working people on the job who have no power over those jobs, we will not continue to have segregation or racism or bigotry, we will not have women unable to vote or go to the schools they want or do the work they want, we will pass gay marriage in 50 states in this country. [cheers and applause]
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so that is what i have learned from history is that when we are prepared to think big, when we are prepared to take on the agreed and recklessness of wall street, when we stand together and we don't allow the trumps of the world to divide us up, whether we were born in america or born abroad, whether we are muslim or jewish or christian -- [cheers and applause] -- when we stand together, whether we're gay or straight, male or female -- [cheers and applause] -- yes, we can create a government that represents all of us and not just a handful of
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wealthy campaign contributors. [cheers and applause] now, this campaign has won seven out of the last eight caucuses and primaries. [cheers and applause] with your help on saturday, we're gonna win here in wyoming. [cheers and applause] and then we are headed to new yo york. [cheers and applause] and i know a little bit about new york because i spent the first 18 years of my life in brookl brooklyn, new york. [cheers and applause] now, please keep this a secret.
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[ laughter ] >> do not tell secretary clinton because she's getting a little nervous and i don't want her to get more nervous, but i believe we have an excellent chance to win new york and a lot of delegates in that state. [cheers and applause] that is the topic that got us into the conversation and the speech by bernie sanders tonight in wyoming. a long way from new york, yes, but as you heard him say the campaign wings its way east shortly. for us we'll take a break. when we come back the statement the trump campaign has just put out tonight about their loss and the cruz victory in wisconsin.
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this is tonight's republican primary in wisconsin. the projected winner now hours ago ted cruz moving on to a big cushion of victory tonight. we're over the halfway mark in raw vote in. before the break i promised we would read you the statement just out from the trump campaign. we have it on a graphic. donald trump withstood the onslaught of the establishment again. lying ted cruz had the governor of wisconsin. many conservative talk radio show hosts and the entire party apparatus behind him. not only was he propelled by the
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anti-trump superpac, but he was coordinating with his own superpacs which is illegal, in parentheses who totally control him. ted cruz is worse than a puppet. he is a trojan horse being used by the party bosses attempting to steel the nomination from mr. trump. we have confidence mr. trump will win new york where he holds a substantial lead in the polls and beyond. mr. trump is the only candidate who can secure the delegates needed to win the republican nomination and ultimately defeat hillary clinton or whomever is the democratic nominee in order to here it comes, make america great again. that is the statement tonight. we have just learned that hugh hewitt is still on the satellite line from california where the lights never go on or off in the office building behind him. hugh, i'd love your response to
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the trump statement tonight and also to the coverage and the speeches you've secretly been listening in on. >> i think that statement substantially reduces the chances of a trump/cruz ticket. i also happen -- i listened to bernie's speech and i cannot wait for the rally at the farm. i am really looking forward to that when they get to new york. i listened to ted cruz's speech and i contrasted it to bernie sanders. cruz talked about the sisters of the poor and the constitutional amendment. donald trump can still win and hillary clinton can still lose, but i think if you look at the irish bookies in the morning they're going to say the odds are it will be a cruz/clinton race in the fall. that will be the starkest contrast since 1952.
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that will be a real choose not just between personalities, but ideas. they do not like ted cruz. that lose with cruz comes out of d.c. i don't doubt nicole has heard it from some republican pundits, but it will be clueless with clinton will be the reply because she has such a weak campaign. the story of the night isn't ted cruz's big win or bernie's long speech, it's that hillary is in disarr disarray. it's a campaign you have to look at and say are they in shock tonight, what are they going to do because they can't seem to get their act together because they ought to be walzing to a nomination. >> hugh, thanks. the conversation goes on. the wisconsin results should be noted from the clinton campaign was telegraphed by the
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clinton campaign in advance. they've also been trying to play down the importance of this. the sanders campaign and the clinton campaign are going to have different perspectives on how important this win is, but we can hear from the sanders campaign right now because i believe we are joined by jeff weaver, who is the bernie sanders campaign manager. mr. weaver, thank you so much for being with us. congratulations tonight. >> how are you doing? >> great. thank you. let me ask, you had been confident heading into wisconsin you spent a lot of money trying to win wisconsin, did a lot of rallies there. is the result that you're seeing thus far in terms of the margin basically in accord with your expectations. >> it's a little bit higher than our expectations. we're performing better than we did in our final polls. the senator when he goes to a state and talks to people face-to-face he moves a lot of voters very quickly at the end of an election.
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this is in line with what we've seen in other states where the senator actively campaigns within the last few days of the election. so we're very gratified about tonight. this makes seven states that the senator has won. it looks like he's one by a double digit margin in wisconsin. he won michigan. so he's winning in caucuses and primaries. there's a caucus in wyoming this weekend and we're on to new york. >> we heard the senator talking about the importance of that new york primary coming up. i have to ask you about the new york daily news. the headline is tough. bernie's sandy hook shame, defends gun makers. this is about the senator's long held position of the liability of gun makers and gun sellers to
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be sued by victims of gun violence. is this a big misunderstanding. is the daily news headline here accurate. what's the campaign's response to this? >> it's certainly not accurate. as you know senator sanders is co-sponsoring a bill that would narrow that legislation. as he's stated his concern about that legislation was about small stores in rural areas that support a hunting community. he does not support people engaged in reckless conduct that puts guns or ammunition in the hands of people that should not have it. he is in favor of making sure that anybody who is a bad actor is punished, but anybody who is not a bad actor should not be punished. this an issue that the senator likes to raise a lot.
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her current campaign takes money from the gun lobby. it's a little bit disengenius again. it's like wall street or the fossil fuel, they say one thing, but they're taking money with the other hand. >> let me passion back with you on that. this is no tt the clinton campaign. this is the new york daily news having a conversation with the senator. this is not an ambush by the clinton campaign. this is in response to him i think anybody would say fumbling that answer to the daily news in terms of whether or not the sandy hook families should be allowed to proceed with the lawsuits that they are in fact bringing against the people who they hold responsible for the deaths of their first graders. was the senator wrong in what he said to the daily news or was that his position that those lawsuits should not go forward? >> the position he has
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articulated is when a big store supplies ammunition or guns in a way that someone reasonably should know is not correct should be held accountable. he's sponsoring legislation to do that. obviously if they're bad actors they need to be cut off. >> jeff weaver, bernie sanders' campaign manager. this contest and the other contests are going to be fun to cover. we look forward to talking to you in the days ahead. thanks. >> thanks for having me. back we go to the republican side of the ledger. the gop race tonight and covering the cruz campaign, hailey hallie jackson standing
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by in milwaukee tonight. >> reporter: i'm here with one of ted cruz's spokesmen. we heard again and again from the governor and ted cruz is turning point. how do you see this victory in wisconsin as it propelz you moving into states where ted cruz doesn't look like such a natural fit, new york and pennsylvania? >> there's some important lessons to learn from the election results here tonight. three weeks ago we were down by 20 points and two weeks ago we were down by 10 points and a week ago things started to change and we started to move ahead and the reason why that happened is that voters in wisconsin got to know ted cruz. ted and heidi engaging people directly. when people got to know him, they embraced him and rejected donald trump. did shows when we engage those numbers turn around and we expect to see that in every state where we engage going forward. >> do you feel that the field is more difficult as you move forward. you look at new york and while
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aids are telling us there are maybe some districts where you can pick up delegates from trump, it may be difficult to get the victory you had here in wisconsin. >> people said that about senator cruz early on and then we won alaska and main which is as far as you get from texas. the reality is when people get to know ted cruz and people have gotten to know donald trump. as people have gotten to know ted cruz and donald trump they're embracing ted cruz and they're rejecting donald trump. >> reporter: my last kwquestion you were listening as brian was reading that statement from the trump campaign who he calls lying ted, saying that cruz is attempting to steel the nomination with the help of party bosses. how do you respond to a statement like that? >> desperate campaigns will do desperate things. donald trump said he would win
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tonight in wisconsin, he got smashed tonight wisconsin. when it comes to the record, while donald trump was busy funding members of the gang of eight, ted cruz was in washington, d.c. challenging the status quo and leadership on both parties. ted cruz represents real change while donald trump has been part of that washington car tel. >> hailly hallie jackson at the cruz headquarters. we'll be back as our coverage tonight continues.
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♪ at the top of another hour it's time to look at what is quickly becoming and has been all night a sizable ted cruz victory in wisconsin. now, politics being politics, they've already been some people saying, no, no, no, it's a trump loss in wisconsin, not a cruz victory. that check mark says projected winner so we'll go with that. ted cruz, 50% over 33% for trump with that percentage in and bernie sanders and

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