tv The Place for Politics 2016 MSNBC April 8, 2016 6:00am-7:01am PDT
e, everywhere. united states postal service priority: you and a good friday morning to you. i'm steve kornacki here in new york. topping our agenda this hour, the battle between hillary clinton and bernie sanders raging on, dueling interviews this morning on the "today" show and "morning joe." >> his response to me was a misrepresentation of what i've said. >> to say that i am running a vitriolic campaign -- >> why haven't you? >> and the backdrop for all of this democrats now worrying that their party's primary battle is taking a dangerous and divisive turn, one that could threaten their ability to unite and beat
t the republicans in the fall. also on the agenda this morning, the republican battle, crucial delegates slipping away from donald trump. he finds himself this morning once again outfoxed by rival ted cruz who is now nine for nine in a delegate battle that could be pivotal to whether trump can get to that magic number of 1,237 and that brings us to our third agenda item this morning. did donald trump finally just find an answer to his delegate problem? a campaign shake up to tell you about at trump headquarters, it shows that trump may finally be getting serious about the prospect of a contested convention, he is empowering a real pro to put together a real convention strategy if they get there. this is the surest sign yet that even trump now recognizes how badly he's being beaten at the delegate game and that growing possibility that he will fall short of 1,237. all of that and much more to tell you about and to talk about in the next hour, but we are going to go inn this hour with
the new interviews with bernie sanders and hillary clinton, both of them in the last couple of hours this morning after their back and forth over who is qualified to be president. first up, nbc's matt lauer catching up with hillary clinton at a diner in the bronx. >> when you looked at the calendar eight months ago and saw april 19th, could you have imagined back then that this would be anything but a finish line and it's kind of turned into a fire wall? >> you know, matt, i said from the very beginning this is going to be a tough contest all the way through and i did it because i remember '08, you know, i went the distance with then senator obama. and that's the way primaries develop. whoever it is that is going to, you know, make it through the preliminaries, the debates, the early contests, you're going to keep moving. and i said to everyone, you know, new york is going to be a place where i'm going to fight hard because i feel so strongly about it, but i never expected anything else. >> but it means so much more
right now because you have lost seven of the last eight contests and you can tell how much is at stake because the exchanges between you and senator sanders are heating up. you talked about him and someone asked you was he ready to be president, you said, i think he hadn't done his work home, i think he has been talking for more than a year about things he obviously hadn't really studied or understood. do you think in some ways that senator sanders proposed some things early in this campaign that he didn't think he would stick around long enough to actually have to defend? >> well, you will have to ask him, but what i was referring to there was the very long interview that he did with the new york daily news and i think a lot of people were quite taken aback that on key issues that he has been promoting during the entire campaign -- >> breaking up banks. >> breaking up banks, foreign policy issues, that he did have some questionable answers, and, look, that's fair game. i've been in the bright hot
spotlight for a long time, i understand how that works. but i feel good about where the campaign is. we have a big popular vote lead, about 2.5 million over senator sanders, we have a significant delegate lead and at the end of the day that's what's going to matter. >> he heard what you said, whether you intended it to be cutting or biting or not he said this about you in terms of whether you are qualified to be president. and i know you've heard this. i don't think you're qualified if you get $15 million from wall street sent through your super pac. now i'm paraphrasing. i don't think you're qualified if you voted for the disastrous war in iraq and if you support trade agreements that cost millions of jobs to americans. you don't have to read between the lines there. he said, came right out and said, he doesn't think you're qualified to be president. >> well, that will be up to the voters of new york and the other states that will be passing judge in the weeks ahead. i think it's kind of a silly statement, but he's free to say whatever he chooses.
>> is he qualified to be president? >> here is what i believe, i believe that voters will be looking at both of us, but i will take bernie sanders over donald trump or ted cruz anytime. they pose real threats to our values, to groups of americans, some very large groups like women, but so many people are hearing what's going on on the republican side and wondering what is this about? how can we tolerate it? >> i want to get to that but has senator sanders in your opinion said or done anything during the course of this campaign or during the course of his career in the senate that disqualifies him from being president of the united states? >> i never said that about him. >> i know. i'm asking. >> i know. i never said that about him. his response to me was a misrepresentation of what i've said, but also kind of a historic amnesia because on all of those issues he supported president obama, he supported joe biden as our vice presidential candidate, he
supported john kerry when he ran and each one of them has according to him not been qualified. but i think in the heat of the campaign people say lots of things. i want to stay focused on the issues. there are contrasts between us and i think that's fair game. >> all right. so that was hillary clinton with matt lauer on the "today" show again just in the last couple hours. here on msnbc's "morning joe" also this morning sanders responding to all the scrutiny he has received over the plan to break up the big banks, also the questions he has raised over clinton's qualifications to be president. this is what went down here. take a look. >> i think a lot of people turned heads a little bit with the daily news interview, the interview with the new york daily news, some answers they felt you came up short with especially on your main message i'm going to reask those questions. i am literally taking the daily news interview and borrowing from this great interview. by what authority and how would you go about breaking up the largest financial institutions in the country. >> all right.
are you ready for the answers. >> i'm ready. >> you do it in a couple of ways. one is you use section 121 of the dodd-frank legislation. number two, better and i would prefer it is passed by legislation. with my legislation, the legislation i've introduced says that the secretary of the treasury will have the authority to investigate and determine which banks pose systemic risk to our economy, i.e., if they are too big to fail they could bring down a significant part of the economy and then within a period of time the secretary can break them up. >> so let me ask you that. by definition i'm going to upset a lot of my friends, but bank of america. >> yes. >> jpmorgan. >> yeah. >> you can go down the list. citi. >> yeah. >> if any one of those banks went under tomorrow, i don't care what anybody says, we would be baling them out again. >> yes. >> i don't care what the legislation says.
>> that's right. >> you've been there. >> yep. >> i've been there. they stick a gun to your head and say you either vote yes or the entire economy collapses. >> dhas exactly -- >> why are we still in that position eight years after 2008. >> this guy gave a better answer than i did. >> why are we still in that position? it's maddening. >> by the way, joe, three out of the four largest banks in this country today are bigger than they were when we baled them out because they were too big to fail. >> right. >> so that's point number one, point number two is that when you have six financial institutions that today have assets of about -- equivalent to 58% of the gdp of this country they issue two-thirds of the credit cards and one-third of the mortgages. >> right. >> don't you think that's a hell of a lot of economic and political power. >> nobody is going to let them go under. >> we get attacked every single day, i've been talked a protector of the nra, the clinton campaign has said that i want to dis member american healthcare and leave people
without medicaid or medicare, that i am attacking planned parenthood when i think planned parenthood is one of the great organizations in this country. there was a head line in the washington post just the other day, quote, clinton questions whether sanders is qualified to be president. to say that, you know -- how often have i talked about hillary clinton's e-mails? have you heard me? not a word. how often have i talked about the clinton foundation's fundraising? have you heard me say one word about it during the campaign? to say that i am running a vitriolic campaign -- >> why haven't you? >> some of them are very good questions. >> they are, but i have tried to stay away from personal attacks. so when i get attacked for being unqualified and when i respond by saying, well, you know, hillary clinton voted for the war in iraq, she voted for all these dis ast rouls trade agreements, she's raising millions and millions of dollars from wall street and special interests, oh, my, isn't that a
vitriolic attack? i don't think so. >> so that was bernie sanders on "morning joe," again, just in the last couple hours and also quite a morning for mississippi and nbc in terms of presidential candidates. also bernie sanders was on the "today" show with savannah guthrie and she pressed him on that question of he said two days ago that hillary clinton wasn't qualified to be president, did he mean that or not? this was his answer. >> here is the truth, i've known hillary clinton for 25 years, i respect hillary clinton, we were colleagues in the senate and on her worst day she will be -- she would be an infinitely better position than either of the republican candidates. >> she's qualified? >> of course. >> bernie sanders saying of course hillary clinton is qualified. let's talk about all this with our panel this morning, kasie hunt has been following bernie sanders on the campaign trail and also political reporter and "usa today" washington bureau chief susan page. kasie, that clip we just played, bernie sanders started this whole thing two days ago by saying she is unqualified to be
president, he seemed to stand by that remark yesterday, now he seems to be saying something different. >> he seems to be taking it back entirely quite frankly. he has two big rallies later today in brooklyn whether or not that section that he had added to his stump speech about hillary clinton being qualified or not disappears. i mean, it seems to me that, you know, he had read this read line in the "washington post," interpreted it a certain way and gotten very angry about it. i think, you know, this he realized the backlash that was going to come at them and i think particularly there are a lot of critics who said -- who say, you know, this could be used against her in a general election. of course, if you're facing down ted cruz or donald trump i don't think bernie sanders wants to be the person that's handing this race over to the republicans. i think you're seeing a reflection of that, but i'm interested to see how he continues to proceed because it seems like a pretty abrupt reversal. >> he keeps mentioning and we heard it in the "morning joe" interview the head line. i'm wondering we just read the
headline and not the story because the story does not have any quotes from hillary clinton saying he is not qualified and she has not said he is not qualified. she didn't come to his defense and said he is qualified but she never said it. >> we are now to the point where bernie sanders has gone further than hillary clinton on outlining qualifications. he said, sure, she's qualified to be president. now i think maybe it's hillary clinton's turn to be asked again whether or not she thinks bernie sanders is qualified because while you're right she never said he is unqualified, she also has very carefully talked around and said, do you know what, i'm not going to judge it's up to the voters. >> enough to confuse at least one headline writer. susan page, let me ask you a bigger picture about the state of this democratic race right now because here we are in new york and there's polls showing it's tightening. hillary clinton still ahead here, used to be 20, 30 points now bernie sanders closed to to ten points. i saw a poll in california this morning that had bernie sanders within six points of her there, i saw him within six points in pennsylvania.
it is still very hard to see him catching her in that delegate count by the end of this i think this. it is not hard to see bernie sanders winning a bunch of states, maybe even big states down the stretch. what's going on here? this is not a democratic party that seems to want to end this and unite around hillary clinton. >> that's a big problem for hillary clinton. new york turns out to be a must win state for each of them. if bernie sanders could win new york, hillary clinton's home state, i think that disrupts the math. it doesn't change the math but i think it probably makes more democrats, including maybe some of the super delegates, a little nervous about what's going on with the person that they assume is going to be their nominee. but if hillary clinton can win big in new york, especially after bernie sanders makes such a big effort there, then i think that puts her kind of back on track. that reassures people that she could -- she's going to be a credible strong nominee in november for the party. so, you know, the next ten days are going to be really crucial and you are going to have that kind of new york battle, the politics that you don't see anyplace else in america.
>> that's right. we got that debate coming up clinton versus sanders that's a couple days away. do we have a sense -- i'm remembering back to when jesse jackson ran in 1988, he won a bunch of states, could not win the nomination, there was a famous cover of "time" magazine what does jessie want. do we have a sense if sanders falls short in this thing but comes in there with winning 20 states, winning 1,800 delegates what does he want to do with that? >> i've asked him that question directly a number of times, he gets quite irritated when you put that question to him because it includes the assumption that he's not going to win the nomination. we've heard a little bit of discussion about what those might be, whether it's planks in the platform, whether it's changing the super delegate structure of how nominees are selected however that's evolved because suddenly his advisors are talking about using super delegates to help him win the nomination. there's been back and forth there. i think campaign finance reform is something that's really central to bernie sanders, i think you can simply listen to his stump speech to get a sense of what the issues are that he
thinks are going to be really, really important. my question is a little bit different going into the convention which is to say first of all is he going to put up a fight on the floor or not, depending on how he's treated, but second of all is he going to be able to turn these tens of thousands of supporters, millions of supporters he has who have been willing to give him small amounts of money and use it for the democratic party or isn't he? i asked his wife jane who is a close political adviser in addition to being a spouse and surrogate for him about that and she said we're not sure. this isn't a monolithic group. we don't know if bernie sanders can take them and put them to use behind somebody else. i think a lot of it is going to depend on his willingness whether or not his heart is in it. if you look back not as far as jesse jackson but even to 2008 when you think about how barack obama and hillary clinton who was way more negative than this campaign has gotten part of how they ended up working so closely together was that she endorsed him, worked hard for him and
then obama welcomed her into the administration. so i think that this campaign still at a point where the personal acrimony is not so bad that something like that couldn't happen, but i do think right now they're pretty far apart. >> and so while we've had the headlines dominated here the last couple days with this question of qualified, unqualified, i think, susan, something else might have made more news last night, it was bill clinton, he was handling a black lives matter protesters at his event yesterday. i want to play this video, it's fascinating to watch and ask you about it. >> here is the thing, i like protesters, but the ones that won't let you answer are afraid of the truth. that's a simple rule. be afraid. be very, very afraid. here is what happened -- let's just tell the whole story. when i became president the headlines in the newspapers were full of -- now, wait a minute. i listened to you, you listen to me. do you know what else you don't want to hear?
because of that bill we had a 25 year low in crime, a 33 low in the murder rate -- year low murder rate and listen to this, because of that and the background check law we had a 46 year low in the deaths of people by gun violence and who do you think those lives were? that matter? whose lives were saved that matter? >> susan, he's talking about the 1994 crime bill that he had sort of tough on crime legislation he championed and signed as president and now a lot of the voters that his wife is really going after, really need for her campaign are upset about the 1994 crime bill and the legacy of that legislation. >> two things, one, i covered both of bill clinton's presidential campaigns that was the old bill clinton handling hecklers, being effective, having a bunch of numbers and policies at his fingertips.
that was reminiscent to see. the other thing that strikes me about bernie sanders, he doesn't want a repudiation of the obama years he want a repudiation of the clinton presidency and has pulled hillary clinton to the left on issues like the 1994 crime bill, the defensive marriage act, 1/2 at that and the value of free trade. i think that has been hard for bill clinton to hear. you ask what bernie sanders wants assuming he is not the nominee, i think he has already gotten a lot of it by affecting what it is democrats articulate that they stand for in 2016. >> all right. susan page, kasie hunt, thanks for joining us. appreciate it. >> thank you. coming up, the battle to win republican delegates in colorado. this is one of those stories that would ordinarily mean nothing. this year it could mean everything. ted cruz is 9 for 9 so far in securing that state's 37 delegates. it's a one of a kind electoral process out there. will it end up being a clean sweep for cruz at this weekend's colorado convention or could donald trump and kasich grab any
delegates. this is a key question when it comes to whether trump will hit that magic number or whether we will have an open convention in cleveland. up next jacob soboroff is going to break down exactly what happened in colorado last night and what it means to the big question of this campaign. ted... what are the chances? can you send a tow truck please? uh, the location? you're not going to believe this but it's um... it's in a tree. i wish i was joking, mate, but it's literally stuck in a tree. (car horn honking) a chainsaw? no, no, all we really need is a tow truck. day or night, geico's emergency roadside service is there for you. i've been blind since birth. i go through periods where it's hard to sleep at night, and stay awake during the da len about non-24 by calling 844-844-2424. or visit my24info.com. whewhat does it look like?ss, is it becoming a better professor
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a big blow last night to donald trump in a very obscure event. the setting, a district convention in the state of colorado where local republicans met to choose three delegates to the republican national convention. again, in any other year this would be the most boring and mundane event we would never be talking about it on national television, but this year is
different. donald trump is desperate for every delegate he can get. he's trying to hit that magic number of 1,237 and the stop trump forces are equally desperate to keep him from getting there and that makes every single delegate vitally important and it makes what happened in colorado last night and what happened in places like it all over the country a very big deal. there is no one better to take us through exactly what went down last night and exactly what it means for that big picture than the man we are calling msnbc's resident delegate hunter jacob soboroff. he is en route to colorado springs, looks like he is on safari there. jacob soboroff, three convention delegates at stake last night. tell us what happened and tell us what it means. >> no safari, just the beautiful colorado landscape. we're heading to colorado springs because today there is a
multi-district convention. congressional level convention to pick 12 for delegates out of the 27, so far ted cruz has cleaned up in this state, last night he picked up three more delegates. the scene was an unbelievable scene, 500 people at a congressional district level convention for something that in years past has not been on the national radar even one bit. i want to give you an idea of what it looked like there last night before i tell you about what happened there and what we expect today. take a look at this. >> what you're looking at right now is 54 different delegates that are going to come up and go one minute each. all of these people will go for one minute each in order to win one of six slots to the republican national convention, this is congressional district 7, the donald trump campaign has a slate with three folks on it, one of them is only on the ballot suggesting some disorganization zags and right here we have the ted cruz slate, there are six, three delegates, three alternates and everybody
is vying for that spot in cleveland this july. >> ultimately, steve, the folks that won those three slots were all stated ted cruz supporters, two of three of them, i think we have their names are actually unbound, they went into this process declaring that they weren't going to support anybody until they got to the convention and made up their mind. colorado is allowed to do that because in 2012 rick santorum won the colorado caucus and the party here was unhappy that those votes had to be finding votes to so they reversed the process and have unbound delegates in in state. why unbound delegates are so important and why we are tracking this so closely is because if donald trump falls short of 1,237 when he gets to the convention in cleveland this july those less than 200 unbound delegates regardless of the popular vote in any states, in fact, states where there are unbound delegates could push him over the edge and that's why some people are saying 20 million republicans have already voted for president and 200 people are going to decide this
is a little bit undemocratic, steve. >> jacob soboroff. if you are a political junky you have to love this. the names of a candidate's delegate in a congressional district in colorado are national news. that is the kind of year we're living in. jacob soboroff, we will be going to you a lot i'm sure in the coming months as we move toward potentially the first open convention we have seen in some of our lifetimes. as we are seeing in colorado cruz is doing his diligence to pick up every delegate he can get. there is a more pressing matter, though, and that brings us to what we're calling the most important number of the day and today that number is 95. 95 we will get it up there a second that is the number of delegates up for grabs 11 days from now when new york holds its presidential primary on the republican side. here is why that number is so important, we all know that donald trump was hurt by his loss in wisconsin, we all know what's going on in colorado to be hurting him, the talk louder than ever that we are indeed headed toward the open
convention, but hold on for a second because donald trump is the heavy favorite here in new york and that means he has a real chance to pick up most, maybe even all of those 95 delegates. if he can do that then all the talk of an open convention might end up being premature. let me show you what i mean. let's turn to the board here, new york 95 delegates up for grabs here. let's do the math for you, remember, 1,237. 1,237 is the magic number. if trump can hit that in the primary season this thing it all over, no open convention. where is he right now? 756. this is new york, how do they give the delegates out here? this state is divided into 27 congressional districts for every one of those districts you win you get three delegates. also if you win statewide you get 14. so donald trump right now is leading in most polls in the state with more than 50% of the vote. we don't know exactly how that breaks down by congressional district. the question for trump is if there hasn't been a lot of damage from wisconsin, if his
campaign doesn't suffer a lot of damage he really could get close to 95 delegates out of the state. let's say that happens, let's say he bounces back strong in new york on april 19th and he gets 89 of those delegates and comes to 850. let's say he leaves new york with 850 delegates, what would that mean? 850. let's take auto look what's next. look at this, this is natural trump territory, april 26th the northeast. now, this is very complicated in pennsylvania, only 17 delegates up for grabs in that primary but trump has a shot at those, he wins statewide to get them all, he could take most in maryland, delaware a winner take all, connect he could get a bundle of them rhode island is a little more complicated could get a lot out of there. bottom line, out of the northeast on the 26th if donald trump still strong up here he could easily get 100 delegates that would move the total to 950. remember 1,237 is where he's trying to get: this is what would be left after that, he would have 950 and he would have these states that you see shaded in here to get it.
could he get there? new jersey winner take all he's probably the favorite there, that would put him at 1001, west virginia looks like a natural trump state, a big win there, bump him up to 1030, go to indiana, this is a big wild card, tough to read indiana right now, could be a trump state, could make a strong case for cruz. let's say trump wins it, even if it's narrow trump is probably going to take at least 42 of those 57. where would that put him? that would put him at 1072. out west, let's take these states off the board for trump, they're winner take all, they look like cruz states, the rest of them, though, real opportunities for trump. new mexico let's say he takes half the delegates there, now he's sitting at 1084, california the polls show donald trump leading in california every congressional district you win out there you get three delegates you also get a few if you win statewide. let's say donald trump gets a nice win out of california, 120
delegates, where does that put him? he is now over 1200, 1204 and you would still have these two states up here, remember, he needs 1,237, you would have 72 up for grabs in pennsylvania and oregon, could he get 33 out of there? absolutely possible. so the pathway exists still for donald trump to clear 1,237, get a first ballot nomination. obviously some wild cards on the board, but the biggest wild card is the first one, it's new york, it's those 95 delegates. if there hasn't been much damage done to donald trump by the wisconsin loss, by all the headlines then he will get close to that 95 number and that could mean a big week coming for him in the northeast after that. again, all that could follow from that. remember that as we move forward. in order to get all this done for donald trump across 1,237, well, he is going to need to get his house in order internally and he made some moves yesterday, some campaign moves that could be hugely important down the line.
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a little more than three months to go now until the republican convention in cleveland and donald trump is reworking the structure of his campaign. it now seems that trump sees a contested convention, one where he is going to have to fight tooth in nail for every delegate as a possibility. a veteran strategist brought into his campaign ten days ago has been given an expanded role, paul manafort is in charge of the delegate strategy for trump, this dig nals that the campaign believes it could well fall short of 1,237, that magic number needed to win the nomination outright and could have to fight in cleveland. jacob rascon is outside the trump tower in new york. jacob, a shakeup of any kind is a big deal with any campaign but i guess with donald trump in the kind of small tight knit operation that he runs this is an even bigger deal.
>> reporter: right. and you heard it in in interview this morning, paul manafort talking about one of the big headlines which is he doesn't answer to cory lewandowski. he was asked who do you answer to and he says the boss only. it's interesting as well that he refers to the boss as donald of course we know that they have known each other since the 1980s and he talked about this strategy that delegate wrangling, he will also be in charge of overseeing the washington, d.c. office and congressional outreach. he talked about ted cruz's strategy as clever but said it will ultimately be meaning fls in his mind because he truly believes they will get to 1,237. here is what he said. >> this convention process will be over with sometime in june, probably june 7th, and it will be apparent to the world that trump is over the 1,237 number and at that point in time when it is apparent everything is going to come together. >> you think trump gets to 1,237? >> absolutely. >> before the convention? >> absolutely. >> why the confidence? >> because i know the rules.
>> reporter: and he acknowledged that they are losing in that game, but said that they are going to do some delegate stealing of their own over the next couple of weeks. we heard the campaign talk about hiring seasoned operatives over the next couple of weeks. that's pal manafort's job, that's their focus going forward. steve. >> all right. jacob rascon outside of trump tower here in new york. thanks for that. now with me on set senior reporter for "politico" new york ozzy painer, along with josh. josh, on this news within the trump campaign you heard jacob saying that manafort is going to answer directly to donald trump, not cory lewandowski the controversial campaign manager. is this a sign, republican leaders have been looking for signs that trump is professionalizing his operation. is this a sign that is happen. >> i think it is a sign for that and also a sign trump realizes he was leaving delegates on the table. we see colorado and cruz has an organization going in there and trump had no real organization, that was a missed opportunity. i think he's realized -- i don't
think he believes necessarily that he's heading to a contested convention but i think he realizes that's a risk. the other thing we need to remember is donald trump can win on the first ballot even if he doesn't have 1,237 delegates, if he goes in with 1200 delegates, there are a lot of unpledged delegates, pennsylvania will elect 51 unpledged delegates, the u.s. vir vin islands, guam. >> some of those delegates from pennsylvania are sending signals they will honor the statewide vote, right now they're saying they'd honor that. >> that's not a binding promise. you are going to need an operation if that's the case if trump is almost at 1,237 after june it's going to be the next two months being spent would go those delegates. trump needs to win on the first ballot in that situation pause his own pledged delegates can start falling away if you go to multiple ballots. a lot of those people who were elected from florida and are bound to vote for trump are not necessarily personally loyal to him. the needle he will have to thread is holding on to the people who are obligated by the
rules to vote for him on the first ballot plus finding a way to pick up 40 or whatever the number is that he needs out of that unpledged delegate pool. he needs to start planning for that now. trump likes to talk about himself as a dealmaker, that should be the sort of thing he is good at. if you imagine donald trump and ted cruz going and having to schmooze those unpledged delegates it's possible trump will come off as more personable and convincing. >> 95 delegates, trump to get the vie i don't know's share or he could get all of them. how strong is he in this state? he has never run for office but there is a home state advantage here. >> he is doing strong here, people know him and despite the fact what some independence and democrats think about him republicans know him. the thing about new york republicans is they have a history of preferring businessmen. michael bloomberg came in, no experience, he walked into city hall and people were trying to figure out who he was. the profile of a businessperson for new york republicans is very appeali appealing, i was talking to a
strategist yesterday who said if you put up a republican lawmaker, generic name versus almost any businessperson on the republican line that businessperson is going to have an appeal to those voters. they sort of like -- in and a lot of people look back, there was a businessman who ran for governor carl paladino who says a lot of the provocative outlandish things trump says and had a lot of appeal with new york republicans. >> he took large swaths of new york. he was doing so welcoming out of the primary that michael bloomberg was forced into action to endorse andrew cuomo early in order to blunt that momentum. paladino had a lot of problems, but he was a pre cursing to what you're seeing with donald trump. saying i'm a business guy, trust me. >> josh, i feel saying, too, the other thing in new york it's not can somebody beat trump it's who gets second. i think that's chi going forward because if kasich gets second
that could revive him in later contests he could play spoiler against cruz there. >> the way new york's delegate allocation rules if nobody gets to 50% when you look in the congressional district whoever comes first will get two delegates and second gets one. there is a cons request he thinks to finishing second or third. there is less competition between kasich and cruz than other states, if they keep trump under 50 the delegates will get split up. it's to keep trump under enough to win on the first ballot. he's hoping he and kasich combine for more than half the vote. after criticizing new york values ted cruz as we were just talking about he has a big uphill climb in this state. are there signs he could be giving up on a new york win. maybe there are. stay with us. this is humira. this is humira helping to relieve my pain and protect my joints from further damage. this is humira helping me reach for more.
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york city registered voters are republicans, though, i can tell you that. it may be nearly impossible for ted cruz to win the new york republican primary outright, he is up against a big home state advantage for donald trump, but if he can keep trump under 50% he may be able to pick off a handful of delegates, this is a point that cruz made during a stop in brooklyn yesterday. >> new york gets 95 delegates every congressional district gets to elect three delegates and so i'm here asking for your help. i'm here asking for you to reach out to your friends and neighbors, to pray and to speak and say, let's stand together because we're fighting district by district, delegate by delegate. >> ted cruz campaigning yesterday in brooklyn, let's he had a yam can a on there. we are already seeing signs that cruz may be moving on from the empire state, the "los angeles times" reporting he has two
rallies monday in california, that primary is not until the very last day of this process, june 7th, but could be key to stopping trump from hitting 1,237 the ma jake number. back in new york one reason cruz is having trouble gaining traction are those remarks he made about new york values. last night he again tried to explain what he means. >> you know, it's an amazing thing that the folks in the press love to go on and on about my making a comment about new york values. do you know who understands that? the people of new york. what that means is the policies of liberal democratic politicians have been hurting the people of new york for a long, long time. >> and nbc's hallie jackson has been following the cruz campaign all over the country and in that campaign has come to new york so here she is. >> hi. >> hallie, let me ask you he said that line months ago, ted cruz. >> back in january. >> does he regret it now? >> he doesn't. he says he doesn't, that's what he said last night, he said he absolutely does not regret it because he and his campaign
believes that people get what he's saying, the line they will use is maybe you guys in the media don't understand because obviously the media is part of the liberal democratic values that they're talking about in new york along with the entertainment world, et cetera, but they believe that conservatives in upstate new york and around the country understand that when we says new york values he's talking about manhattan, liberalism and he is standing by it as you heard. >> we were talking about he's going be to in california. >> yeah. >> coming up. there was a poll that came out in california yesterday, we were talking about this in the break, i think this is interesting, this is about stopping interest your honor from hitting 1,237. >> right. >> the poll says trump is leading in california. >> top line up by 7. >> you break it down by region you see something different. >> l.a. county cruz is doing well in some of these places he wasn't expected to do well. the campaign believes that they can pull delegates from trump in california which may be surprise to go some given that doesn't necessarily seem like a natural fit for cruz. again, to be able to keep it close, obviously the cruz campaign wants to win outright,
the math is very difficult, cruz needs 88% of the remaining delegates in order to lock up the nomination before july. his best shot is to head to a contested convention, if they can keep it to within a couple hundred delegates or less than that the unbound delegates come into play and that's the strategy that cruz and his campaign have been implementing. >> we know that john kasich has been a thorn in ted cruz's side, he wants the one-on-one. >> right. >> i see the threat, though, that i see is if kasich can beat out cruz for second here in new york and do that around the northeast, when you get to the later states like indiana that would make kasich more of a factor there which is not what cruz wants. >> no, because cruz for months has been saying he wants a one on one race between himself and donald trump. he does not have that. even though kasich may not be the one making the headlines, he is still a factor and playing kind of a spoiler. kasich's campaign has been saying once the race turns to
the northeast kasich will be able to play. it's not just about momentum, if cruz comes in behind kasich in new york, there are a lot of factors that play here, but it's moving forward into the calendar to see what kasich will do. the campaign only recently, fairly recently a few weeks ago started modeling out what would happen given some of these kasich predictions and where he might be in the case. they're taking him seriously, kasich's campaign he is also in new york, everybody is in new york competing here and trying to peel off as many delegates as he can. kasich's only hope is a con vested convention, he started to put in some delegate strategy in places like colorado, not as long as cruz has but trying to get in and be a factor there. >> kasich has eating his way through new york yesterday. >> i know. that italian hoagie -- >> giving me a lot of ideas. hallie jackson, thanks for joining us. coming up, john kasich from new york, that's part of his eating tour yesterday, he is on his way to connecticut, see what kind of food he hits up there. we will see if he gets any lunch in the nutmeg state today.
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remember this. couple days uz go, john kasich got in hot water when cameras found him in new york eating pe pizza with a fork. that's a big no-no. yesterday, the ohio governor made an attempt to save face with culinary minded new yorkers. he was in the little italy section of the bronx. arthur avenue, that's where that section of the bronx is called. kasich sat down at mike's deli for an afternoon abendanza, starting with a little spaghetti, he moves on to salami, hot pepper, and a provolone panini, which the founders named a jk in his honor. he was sent with a bag of leftovers and a few canollis. we'll look at kasich's road ahead today. he's in connecticut. if he wants italian food, he could see my aunt in waterbury. can he keep his campaign alive?
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well, donald trump and ted cruz may be dominated the headlines and the delegates in the race for the rnen nomination, but that is not deterring john kasich as all. he still has his eyes set on getting an open convention in july. in just about two hours, kasich is going to take his message to connecticut. he's going to have a town hall there. nbc's kelly o'donnell is le in fairfield, where that town hall will take place. that's in a congressional district where kasich probably has some hopes of doing well and peeling off a delegate or two. kelly,hat are we expecting from john kasich today? >> well, this is the incremental strategy where he's trying to get delegates, not talking about winning states at this point. and by doing that, he says that he can have a credible case to make at the convention. told me yesterday in that scrum of reporters next to the eating festival that you just showed a moment ago that he believes that not long ago, people sort of dismissed the idea of going to
the convention, and now, as the way things have unfolded, it seems more and more credible. he says that backs up his theory that he can work hard, state by state, connecticut votes april 26th. today, he'll be bringing his town hall message, uplifting to the voters and at the same time, willing to take shots at his competitors here. >> and we'll keep an eye on what he eats, too. kelly o'donnell in fairfield, connecticut. thank you for that. that's going to wrap up this hour on msnbc. i'm steve kornacki. jose diaz-balart picks up our coverage next. ♪ i built my business with passion. but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. i earn unlimited 2% cash back on everything i buy for my studio. ♪ and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... that's huge for my bottom line.
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